AUCHI POLYTECHNIC VS OBAFEMI AWOLOWO UNIVERSITY



[size=14pt]WELCOME![/size]

We are now in the quarter stage finals of NISD, third edition.

Thus far, for me, it has been quite an enlightening ride, and I trust it has been that and much more for you.

This edition started with 25 schools contending, and then it moved all the way down to 16 schools (elimination stage) and now, we have 8 schools standing tall for the quarter finals -- this stage will in turn also pave way to 4 schools for the next stage of the competition.

If you ask me what I think about the competition at this point, I'll say, indeed, as the race gets more interesting and competitive towards the finals, we are getting closer to having our winner emerge, but, which of these citadels will it be? All I see is each team stepping their game up towards outdoing the other at every stage of this competition, hence making it quite difficult to hatch a guess, well, a good fighting spirit they all exhibit I must say.


But no hard feelings debaters, I mean we love you all but a winner has got to emerge.


That said, let us now proceed to the battle of the day.


[size=14pt]Yes,


it is


The Quarter Finals' Second Battle![/size]





All debaters, judges and coordinators should kindly take note that the debate rules, procedures and modalities still stands, do well to abide by them.



Thank you.

[size=18pt]Equating HND with BSC: A panacea to Technological Advancement/ Innovative ideas.
[/size]


Support

[img]http://www.nairaland.com/attachments/1403632_oau-logo_jpegfd792ca2348535d7a50271d82c1b576d[/img]



Obafemi Awolowo University – Popularly known as "Great Ife" is a Federal Government owned and operated Nigerian university. The university is in the ancient city of Ile-Ife, Osun State, Nigeria. The university was founded in 1961 and classes commenced in October 1962 as the University of Ife by the regional government of Western Nigeria, led by late chief Samuel Ladoke Akintola, and was renamed Obafemi Awolowo University on 12th May 1987 in honour of Chief Obafemi Awolowo (1909–1987), first premier of the Western Region of Nigeria, whose brainchild the university was.

Her Vice Chancellor is Professor Idowu Bamitale Omole.

OAU Motto - For Learning and Culture

Let me now present to you the Great Ife's representative.

► Emaculate99
► OAUTemitayo
► Doskit
► Abeos
► CroSStodds
► Microflux
► Miracy




Opposing.

AUCHI POLYTHECNIC





font=Georgia] Auchi Polytechnic was founded in 1964, first, as a technical college which was a gift of the British government to the then Midwestern Region. The extant law establishing it assigned to the institution the task of producing well trained and highly skilled middle level manpower for the national economy in the areas of Engineering, Applied Sciences and Technology, Environmental Studies, Management Studies and Art and Industrial Design. In 1994, the Federal Government took over the Polytechnic from the Edo State Government.

Rector: Dr (Mrs) Philipa O. Idogho and the institution slogan - Hands and Brain for Development[/font]












► Joejonah
► ehisdan

Date: 5th March 2016

Time: 7pm




I remain Luxanne, the coordinator for this team.

And the judges with me are,

Obinoscopy

Ishilove

Xynerise




I greet you Sirs

DEBATE RULES

Kindly read.

1.) The recommended font size is the default size (size 8.) and the colour is the default colour (black).

2.) The essay should be in maximum of 1000 words.

3.) The use of SMS language and abbreviations are strictly forbidden.

4.) All materials used should be properly referenced at the end of the essay.

5.) All essays must be submitted on the stipulated date and time.

6.) Sole representatives are not allowed during the competition, both representatives must be present.

7.) All representatives are to engage in rebuttals and give answers to questions raised by the judges and the audience.

8.) Word counts should be strictly adhered to. http://www.wordcounttool.com/

9.) Mindless lifting is outrightly discouraged

10.) Defaulters will be penalized when caught

PROCEDURES

6:55 -- Debaters (Ehisdan, Joejonah, Emaculate99, OAUTemitayo ) and judges (Obinoscopy Ishilove, Xynerise ) registers presence

7:00 – The Chairman, Lalasticlala declares the debate open

7:00 - 7:30 -- Debaters post their arguments within 30 minutes, maximum word limit is 1000

7:30 – 8:30pm – Rebuttals - A debater takes on his opponent’s view, puncturing his or her points - This the debater does by quoting the said comment and then countering it with his or her own views.

8:20 – 8:40pm – Judges post questions to debaters either on what the debater has posited or revolving around the debate topic, albeit, this is not compulsory, it is acceptable for a judge not to have questions for the debaters... Judges with questions should please be specific as to which debater they are posting their questions to. E.g “Mr X, could you expatiate what you meant by subsidy? or ...., kindly give examples to your claim that the removal of fuel subsidy is justified.

8:40 – 9:00pm – Debaters respond to questions raised by judges

9:00 – 9:20pm – Two questions will be entertained from the audience i.e. viewers and this will be based on ‘fastest fingers’. After the 2 questions, other questions will be attended to after the debate or perhaps, if the debater is free during the debate to respond to them, he or she can do so, however, points will not be awarded after the 2 questions.

9:20 – 9:30pm – Debaters respond to audience questions and concludes their arguments. Debaters who were not asked any questions can still conclude his/her arguments during this time.

9:30 – 9:40pm – Judges compile their scores and mail to coordinators with a copy to Nairalandinterschooldebate@gmail.com

9:40 – 10:00pm - Coordinators announce results, after which the thread will be thrown open for regular Nairaland discussions.

DEBATE MODALITIES

5 points to be awarded to each criteria.

1. Presentation (opening, flow, paragraphs, grammar, punctuations, word count, closing,)

2. Logic of arguments

3. Strength of facts, examples, cases.

4. Persuasiveness

5. Demonstration of knowledge and understanding of the subject

6. Rebuttals and response to questions raised by the judges and the audience.

Fynestboi:

To join the munificent in ensuring the participant instigation, kindly send a mail to.. nairalandinterschooldebate@gmail.com.

Simply put, we need sponsors for the debate.


THANKS..

Please while the debate is going on, only the contestants, coordinators, Chairman and Supermods (if need be) can post.




Let us all kindly comply, as defaulters might attract a 3 hours ban (duration of the debate).




You can however comment simultaneously at the planning thread.


https://www.nairaland.com/2446965/nairaland-interschool-debate-chatroom-third/40




Thank you.

It is going down today.....

Ehisdan, Joejonah, Emaculate99, OAUTemitayo ) and judges (Obinoscopy Ishilove, Xynerise )

Obafemi Awolowo University will be arguing that Equating HND with BSC will go a long way in bringing in new innovative ideas and an advancement in technology which will spur Technological growth and reduce to many importation of our electronics...

Fynestboi:
Obafemi Awolowo University will be arguing that Equating HND with BSC will go a long way in bringing in new innovative ideas and an advancement in technology which will spur Technological growth and reduce to many importation of our electronics...

While Auchi Polytechnic will argue against equating HND with BSC with their premises....

hmmmm.. *grabs seat*

Emaculate99
OAUTemitayo
Doskit
Abeos
CroSStodds
Microflux
Miracy

These are d baddest

#Fattkay

The dichotomy between bachelor degree (B.Sc) and higher national diploma (HND) has always leave us with bitter emotions, pity and sympathy. This had constantly clouded our sense of judgement that we no longer see through the transparent glasses of reality. The question remains should duck now be classified with fishes because it can swim?

On this note, I register my greetings to the owner of this educative forum, Mr seun osewa, our unbaised judges, super moderators and moderators, co-debaters, and all nairalanders reading from home.

I am joejonah by moniker the first representative of Auchi polytechnic auchi. I wrote to register my stance that “equating B. Sc with HND: a panacea to Technological Advancement and innovative ideas”. I stand vehemently against the motion with the following reasons.

It is imperative to acquit ourselves with the unfamiliar terms in the topic of discuss. B. Sc: is an acronym for bachelor degree in science, it has its equivalent as B. A, B. Ed, Offered to art courses and education courses respectively. They are seen as undergraduate degree awarded for completed courses that generally last 3-5 years.
HND: An acronym for higher national diploma describes a semi-vocational / semi-proffesional qualifications, which can be used to gain entry into universities at an advanced level and is considered equivalent to the second year of a three years University degree courses. In Scotland, it is quite common for those who have achieved a HND to add to their qualification by progressing to other levels such as professional qualification or degree (B.Sc).
Panace: this is seen as something that will solve all problems (Oxford dictionary). Or something that will make everything about a situation better (Merriam Webster dictionary).

It is very important that we look out for the differences and similarities between BSC and HND, both in quality and purpose before thinking of equating them. In Nigeria, B.Sc and it's equivalent are awarded by the University only and these universities are accredited, monitored and assessed by National University commission (NUC). While HND on the other hand are awarded by the polytechnic only and these polytechnics are monitored, accredited, and assessed by National Board of technical education (NBTE). These two bodies are guided by different rules. They offer both the content of the courses, it's debth, area to be covered and qualifications of lecturers to handle these courses and this assessment are widely different from the one offered by (NBTE) offering assessment to the polytechnic because they act independently. With this one can deduce that an electrical engineering graduate from the University is different from those in the polytechnic as the former is exposed to a wider coverage of his field. That is to say the former was taught all that the later knew, and we can't say it's vice versa because NBTE is restricted by law not to offer equivalent courses NUC will accredited for the universities.


It is a popular saying that “no education can rise above the quality of its teachers”. Now taking the banner to the quality and quantity of lecturers found in both institutions. It is a known fact that it has been established that the minimum requirements for someone to qualify to lecture bsc undergraduate is a Ph.D, and this is the highest qualification found in the polytechnic and most of the lecturer with this degree in the polytechnic are considered as administrative officers and they hardly lecture. So the people training our HND holders are their colleagues(HND holders), B. SC, MSc holders and we can't undermine the place of time based experience, exposure, research work which the professors in the University has to the unqualified teaching staff found in the polytechnic.

On how students are absorbed into B. Sc and HND program a great difference is also observed. In the University the introduction of post- UME Screening has effectively put paid to issue of admission racketting and reduced incidence of examination malpractice and cultism. There is evidence that show that products of post UME have shown and demonstrated remarkable commitment in their studies than pre-post UME students. It should be noted that while universities are taking these steps, polytechnic are lagging behind, offering mass-admission to low quality reluctant, unpersistent students who can't take the pain of scoring 200 aggregate in JAMB, only for them to be churned out the same way they were absorbed.


From the above analysis it could be seen that the difference between HND and B.Sc are so wide that if attempt are made to join both, educational system in Nigeria will crash. Students will no longer take jamb seriously, Greater population of our youths will now be trained by low quality teachers with ill facilities, in tertiary education as many will resort to polytechnic education because of its mode of entry, and it's less rigorous process of training. Theoretical thinking and vast exposure which lead to technological advancement and great innovative ideas will be lacking in them.

Conclusively, the need for holistic re-orientation, re-engineering, and re-branding of the polytechnic education cannot be overemphasized. The graduates here are not only derailed, but are also described as lacking in quality, low in perception and unfit in skills. Employers complain that they are poorly prepared for work. In many cases, employers compensate for this by employing them with less pay or even leave them out in recruitment process in worst cases. Considering this experiences and the number of years that students spend in this institutions to be poorly cooked, leave people to argue that all polytechnic be upgraded to B. Tech. On this note I quickly add that the topic and truth should be upgrading HND to B. Tech: a panacea to Technological development and innovative ideas. Thanks for reading through.

Reference
Merriam Webster dictionary.

Oxford dictionary (7th edition).

booked. cc OAUtemitayo

Good evening all.

Let us now proceed


7:00 – The Chairman, Lalasticlala declares the debate open

Team OAU, be prepared to post your arguments in 2 minutes.

Thank you.

Ehisdan, Joejonah, Emaculate99, OAUTemitayo

Let's roll

On behalf of the chairman I guess he is busy. I hereby declare the debate open...

Kindly proceed.

Emaculate99, OAUTemitayo

That was a quick one Joejonah.

Well, since Team OAU is taking their time, your team mate can also post his arguments.

Thank you.

Ehisdan, Joejonah, Emaculate99, OAUTemitayo

EQUATING HND WITH BSC: A PANACEA TO TECHNOLOGICAL ADVANCEMENT / INNOVATIVE IDEAS

NAME: Emaculate Ife representing OAU,

Position: Support.

My brother got a call to help a friend get a job for his niece. Upon seeing her CV, he found out that she is an HND holder. It is however a policy in his company to employ BSc only. He felt bad for this girl because she opted in for polytechnic education due to her family’s financial constraint. She now sells foodstuff in the market due to the employment discrimination in the country.

Constitutionally, equality is a necessary principle which cannot be extinguished by the same law that prescribes it unless it is a “utopian fantasy whose hopeless pursuit” would lead to “tyranny.” It is no news that the discrimination between BSc and HND holders is becoming worse each day as companies prefer BSc to HND even if the latter is more skilled than the former. They believe in certification as against the equal employment opportunity advocated by the constitution of Nigeria. But what will happen if skilled graduates are shut from employment as a result of certification? Technological advancement or technological adversity? You choose.

Moreover, is certificate the basis of innovative idea or improvement in technology? It is barbaric to put HND below BSc because of a mere certificate. Innovative idea is a no respecter of certificate. Anyone can have innovative idea that can move the country forward technologically. If certificate is the basis of innovative idea, there should be no Microsoft and Nairaland today. You know both founders are dropped out, right?

Furthermore, the core policy of Nigeria of evolving into a technological based country is on the ruin as the discrimination against HND holders has continue to wear an ugly look. It is no news that findings have proved that some polytechnic students are in some cases far better than their university counterparts on the field (Sammyscholar, a representative of Polytechnic of Ibadan, is a perfect example). If this is the case, why do the government and private individual put BSC holders ahead of HND holders without recourse to their skills and ability? Is that not a poison to the realisation of the nation’s technological development? Someone like Sammyscholar would be deprived a job because a company’s policy cannot employ a HND holder when in the real sense, if he should be given an equal opportunity to compete with the graduates, he will compete with them favourably.

In addition to that, the HND holders upon getting job are treated with ultimate distaste and inequality as regard to the salary grade level (HND: GL 07 & BSc: GL 08); security personnel: BSc (commissioned) while HND (non-commissioned); promotion of the BSc is unlimited while the peak promotion for HND is GL 12. HND holders are mostly kept as slave workers as against the status of BSc holders. This is evidently shown in Banking/ financial sector where HND holders are treated cheaply because of their degree. Can any innovative idea come out from someone who has been battered psychologically with the ugly treatment he is going through? I doubt it.

Come to think of it, international companies in the country and companies in advanced countries have no time for certificate discrimination. Their employment is based on meritocracy and not mediocrity as the case is in Nigeria. This is a reason for their technological advancement. If Nigeria wants to advance, it must take a clue from this set of people.

Nigeria is so much interested in curbing criminal activities and unemployment; yet it operates in such a way that criminal activities and unemployment rate will escalate. Giving out policies that do not allow for the employment of HND or making them a second class employees will not only make them indulge in criminal activities, it will also increase the unemployment rate in the country. And this will not avail them opportunity to give out their well-thought ideas which can help move the country forward technologically. This will also reduce the pressure mount on universities for admission.

Polytechnic students are mainly trained to be practically relevant in their field. They are trained on how to do things in their field, while university students are trained to research into why something is done in a field. Ideally, the two are to work hand in hand for the development of the society as “practice without theory is blind and theory without practice is sterile.” Giving prominence to theory means that no productive idea will materialise, however, putting both practice and theory together will advance Nigeria creatively and technologically. Theory and Practice can only work together if both of them are given equal recognition.

Can someone who has passion for Art class be forced into science class and cope well and vice-versa? How do you want graduates to cope when in the real sense they were forced into university because of the discrimination and mentality of the citizenry? Someone who has passion for polytechnic can only cope and deliver better if schooled in a polytechnic. This is the case in other advanced countries but it is not the same in Nigeria as polytechnic materials are forced into universities as a result of the discrimination in the labour market.

Taking cognisance of the aforementioned and the current situation in Nigeria, I believe you will throw your full support behind me that equating BSc with HND will bring about technological advancement in the country.

REFERENCE:

BSc vs HND in Nigeria
www.uniuyoinfo.com/bsc-vs-hnd-in-nigeria/

A perspective on the discrimination against Nigerian HND holders by Christian Dimkpa
www.gamji.com/article5000/news5935.htm

Aregebsola Denies HND holders recruitment into Osun civil service
www.infomationng.com/2012/12/aregbesola-denies-hnd-holders-recruitment-into-osun-civil-service.htm

Ending BSc and HND dichotomy
www.thenationonlineng.net/ending-bsc-and-hnd-dichotomy/

HND and BSc discrimination, part of Nigerian’s major problem
www.nigeriamasterweb.com/Masterweb/MasterwebMobileNews.php?rss_id=OTM=

1999 constitution of Nigeria, 2011 as amended

Equating HND with B. SC: a panacea of technological advancement/innovative idea

The war of equating hnd with b. SC has been on the field for decades. It has been become and object of concern not only to the students but also the government. This cause the Senate in 2014 to pass a bill on equating higher national diploma (hnd) and University degree (b. Sc) though nothing was heard of it thereafter.

On this note I table my greetings to the owner of nairaland, the moderators, panel of judges, the coordinator, my fellow debaters and everyone viewing this tread as member or as a guest.

My name is Ehisdan, the second writer representing Auchi polytechnic Auchi on the notion "Equating hnd with b.sc: a panacea of technological advancement/innovative idea". I hereby write in opposition of the notion.

Before pinning down my points let me quickly bring to our understanding the meaning of some words or acronyms in the context.
Panacea: according to the Oxford dictionary means something that will solve all problems of a particular situation. On the other other hand "a remedy".
University: An institution at the highest level of education where you can study for a degree or do research.
Polytechnic: a college for higher education, especially in scientific and technical subjects.
Equating: making something the same.
B. Sc: a first university degree in a science subject.
HND: Higher National Diploma.

Equating hnd with b. Sc: a remedy for technological advancements/innovation is an aberration.
Technological advancements/innovative idea is not institution dependent and if so, equating hnd with b. Sc is never the solution. B. Sc is a degree gotten from the University which is the highest institution and hnd degree on the other hand is gotten from the polytechnic which is a higher institution. Though polytechnic is tag with technical and science study, university still have an upper hand over it. A person with b. Sc is assume to have acquired all the educational acquittances of furthering his education to a masters level while a hnd degree holder will have to undergo PGD program before having an access to acquirinug a masters degree. This means that there is a vacuum that has been filled by b. Sc degree which hnd degree need to fill before crossing the bridge to masters degree. The words Highest and Higher as used respectively has even justified the fact that equating hnd with b.sc is An error.

University is technically above polytechnic
I have never seen any jambite who ignored university and filled polytechnic Just because he/she want to be technically sound or advance technologically. Rather he/she will have to choose university which is the highest institution to to obtain or acquire his/her dream. Technologically universities are more equipped compared to polytechnics, the level of acquisition of knowledge is higher than that of the polytechnic, in the sense that the lecturers in the University are vast in knowledge and most of them has attain the highest level of education (professors).

Equating hnd with b.sc will not make any change to technology
HND is a degree as well B.SC they have no additional support to technology/innovative idea of a country. There are so many people out there who does not have the opportunity to be in the four walls of higher institution but are technologically sound and can even lecture a b.sc and hnd degree holder what can not be acquired in higher institution.

The level of B.sc degree and HND degree acquisition
These two degrees are of great difference. The highest years of study on normal ground in the polytechnic is five years, but in the University depending on the course of study is seven years. How then can you equate five to seven?. In polytechnic hnd degree can easily be gotten than getting a b.sc in the University. In the polytechnic a student can easily buy his/her way to top bland acquire the result but in the University the case is reverse, in the sense that most of the lecturers are professors, doctors and PhD who has there image to protect and will not want anything to bring them down. While in the polytechnic most of the lecturers are hnd holders, b.sc and PhD holder can easily collect money from students give them what they want.

Conclusively
The panacea to technological advancement/innovation is not equating hnd to b.sc rather self development and government policy on technology.

Team OAU please.

Emaculate99, OAUTemitayo

Equating HND with BSC: A panacea to Technological Advancement/ Innovative ideas.
Position: Support
Oautemitayo Representing OAU.

All protocols duly observed.
The discrimination against HND holders in the public service and business establishments across the country is not only a disservice to the mission for the technological development of this nation, it is an injustice being meted on innocent graduates of polytechnics.
HND which stands for higher national diploma is a graduate certificate awarded to individuals who have successfully completed a four year study and an extra year of industrial training and was actually meant for the provision of middle-level technical manpower for the technical and engineering sector of the economy.
The disparity in the ranking of HND and degree if critically examined is one of the factors militating against the advancement of technology in Nigeria.
Nigerian education curriculum as we all know is modelled after the British system. In Britain, an HND is a two year programme and is considered as equivalent to the second year of a three year degree programme. But unlike the British HND which is a two year programme, Nigerian HND is a five year programme requiring two years of studying for OND, one year of industrial training and another two years for the HND programme itself. If HND holders in Britain a developed country spend just two years in getting their certificates and are still given the chance of spending just two extra years to get a full fledged Bachelor's degree making a total of just four years used for getting a degree certificate, why should Nigerian HND holders who have to spend five solid years in getting their certificates not accorded the same status as people who will spend just four years in getting their certificates?
If degree holders are better than HND holders why are major establishments in the industrial and technical sector advertising vacancies and accepting applications from both HND and degree holders for same positions? The fact that major establishments including government institutions normally accept applications from the holders of HND certificates for same positions degree holders are applying for is a conscious acceptance of the fact that the former are capable of excelling on same level with degree holders. If they can do the same thing perfectly why then should there be a ranking that put the degree holders at an advantage over the HND holders?
The argument of some people that it is students with poor academic ability that usually opt for polytechnic education because they don't have high scores in JAMB like their counterparts in the universities holds no water and cannot stand both logical and scientific test when one put into consideration the fact that HND holders normally undertake practical industrial training popularly called IT and this has bridged the gap between the two set of graduates.
It is rather unfortunate that some students are allowed to use pre-degree a one year preparatory course as entrance requirement into Nigerian universities to make up for their failure to meet the same entrance cut off marks that polytechnic students are accused of not meeting but the extra one year HND holders use for industrial training is not considered when they are being ranked.
Considering the alarming rate of examination malpractice in Nigeria where there are special centers for JAMB where students are deliberately aided in cheating, shouldn't we even ponder on the theory that polytechnic students could be the ones who are getting their really deserved scores because they cannot cut corners like the ironically smart ones in the Universities?

The disparity in the grading of this two certificates have turned majority of HND holders into poorly motivated workers in the country as a result of the injustice in the working environment they found themselves. This has led to HND holder withholding innovative ideas that could advance the fortunes of the country since they have the feeling that they are not accorded same respect their degree counterparts are getting. This has proven to be a major cause of animosity in business and government establishments.
This animosity has in turn led to lack of unity, cohesion and unity at the establishments thereby creating a working environment unsuitable for producing technological innovations and products.
HND holders have proven themselves in different positions as capable graduates of equal intellectual ability with their university counterparts.
What can a bachelor degree holder in mechanical engineering do that an HND holder in mechanical engineering cannot do? Nothing speaking from past and recent happenings. We have heard of polytechnic students designing various technological products of high value just like their university counterparts.
Several panels set up in the past by the federal government on the HND/Degree dichotomy have recommended the upgrading of the HND to same status with the degree yet successive administrations refuse to yield to the crying of equity and justice.
The failure of university graduates to take Nigeria out of its technological backwardness is an indication that the current system of rating them above their HND colleagues have turned them into graduates without competition which should have been the motivation to drive them towards entrepreneurship initiatives which will in turn lead to technological products being developed by both HND and degree holders as a result of tough competition to outperform the other.
Government should as a matter of urgency do the needful by equating HND with Degree through appropriate legislations that must be enforced both in the public and private establishments across the country.
Conclusively, it is my opinion that equating HND with degree will give HND holders a sense of belonging and turn graduates of polytechnics and universities into dynamic competitors in the mission to advance our technology sector.

References:
What is HND?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Higher_National_Diploma
Panel recommends removal of HND, first degree disparity/Dichotomy
www.nigeriaschool.com.ng/asup-strike-panel-recommends-removal-of-hnd-first-degree-disparity/
Panel recommends suspension of HND, first degree disparity
naija247news.com/2014/07/panel-recommends-suspension-of-hnd-first-degree-disparity/
HND discrimination bill narrowly scales second reading in Senate
www.premiumtimesng.com/news/top-news/169916-hnd-discrimination-bill-narrowly-scales-second-reading-in-senate.html
ABOUT PRE-DEGREE PROGRAMME IN NIGERIAN UNIVERSITIES
eduregard.com/about-pre-degree-programme-in-nigerian-universities/
Poly students design electric water treatment plant

nigeria.shafaqna.com/EN/NG/1949706

luxanne:
Team OAU please.

Emaculate99, OAUTemitayo

Please, my co-debater is having issues with his internet connection.

And your team mate?

@ Emaculate99

luxanne:
And your team mate?
@ Emaculate99

I mean team mate

OK, all arguments posted.

The rebuttals stage can now begin.

Thank you.

Ehisdan, Joejonah, Emaculate99, OAUTemitayo

Joejonah:
The dichotomy between bachelor degree (B.Sc) and higher national diploma (HND) has always leave us with bitter emotions, pity and sympathy. This had constantly clouded our sense of judgement that we no longer see through the transparent glasses of reality. The question remains should duck now be classified with fishes because it can swim?

On this note, I register my greetings to the owner of this educative forum, Mr seun osewa, our unbaised judges, super moderators and moderators, co-debaters, and all nairalanders reading from home.

I am joejonah by moniker the first representative of Auchi polytechnic auchi. I wrote to register my stance that “equating B. Sc with HND: a panacea to Technological Advancement and innovative ideas”. I stand vehemently against the motion with the following reasons.

It is imperative to acquit ourselves with the unfamiliar terms in the topic of discuss. B. Sc: is an acronym for bachelor degree in science, it has its equivalent as B. A, B. Ed, Offered to art courses and education courses respectively. They are seen as undergraduate degree awarded for completed courses that generally last 3-5 years.
HND: An acronym for higher national diploma describes a semi-vocational / semi-proffesional qualifications, which can be used to gain entry into universities at an advanced level and is considered equivalent to the second year of a three years University degree courses. In Scotland, it is quite common for those who have achieved a HND to add to their qualification by progressing to other levels such as professional qualification or degree (B.Sc).
Panace: this is seen as something that will solve all problems (Oxford dictionary). Or something that will make everything about a situation better (Merriam Webster dictionary).

It is very important that we look out for the differences and similarities between BSC and HND, both in quality and purpose before thinking of equating them. In Nigeria, B.Sc and it's equivalent are awarded by the University only and these universities are accredited, monitored and assessed by National University commission (NUC). While HND on the other hand are awarded by the polytechnic only and these polytechnics are monitored, accredited, and assessed by National Board of technical education (NBTE). These two bodies are guided by different rules. They offer both the content of the courses, it's debth, area to be covered and qualifications of lecturers to handle these courses and this assessment are widely different from the one offered by (NBTE) offering assessment to the polytechnic because they act independently. With this one can deduce that an electrical engineering graduate from the University is different from those in the polytechnic as the former is exposed to a wider coverage of his field. That is to say the former was taught all that the later knew, and we can't say it's vice versa because NBTE is restricted by law not to offer equivalent courses NUC will accredited for the universities.


It is a popular saying that “no education can rise above the quality of its teachers”. Now taking the banner to the quality and quantity of lecturers found in both institutions. It is a known fact that it has been established that the minimum requirements for someone to qualify to lecture bsc undergraduate is a Ph.D, and this is the highest qualification found in the polytechnic and most of the lecturer with this degree in the polytechnic are considered as administrative officers and they hardly lecture. So the people training our HND holders are their colleagues(HND holders), B. SC, MSc holders and we can't undermine the place of time based experience, exposure, research work which the professors in the University has to the unqualified teaching staff found in the polytechnic.

On how students are absorbed into B. Sc and HND program a great difference is also observed. In the University the introduction of post- UME Screening has effectively put paid to issue of admission racketting and reduced incidence of examination malpractice and cultism. There is evidence that show that products of post UME have shown and demonstrated remarkable commitment in their studies than pre-post UME students. It should be noted that while universities are taking these steps, polytechnic are lagging behind, offering mass-admission to low quality reluctant, unpersistent students who can't take the pain of scoring 200 aggregate in JAMB, only for them to be churned out the same way they were absorbed.


From the above analysis it could be seen that the difference between HND and B.Sc are so wide that if attempt are made to join both, educational system in Nigeria will crash. Students will no longer take jamb seriously, Greater population of our youths will now be trained by low quality teachers with ill facilities, in tertiary education as many will resort to polytechnic education because of its mode of entry, and it's less rigorous process of training. Theoretical thinking and vast exposure which lead to technological advancement and great innovative ideas will be lacking in them.

Conclusively, the need for holistic re-orientation, re-engineering, and re-branding of the polytechnic education cannot be overemphasized. The graduates here are not only derailed, but are also described as lacking in quality, low in perception and unfit in skills. Employers complain that they are poorly prepared for work. In many cases, employers compensate for this by employing them with less pay or even leave them out in recruitment process in worst cases. Considering this experiences and the number of years that students spend in this institutions to be poorly cooked, leave people to argue that all polytechnic be upgraded to B. Tech. On this note I quickly add that the topic and truth should be upgrading HND to B. Tech: a panacea to Technological development and innovative ideas. Thanks for reading through.

Reference
Merriam Webster dictionary.

Oxford dictionary (7th edition).

You are wrong on the notion that no student can rise above the knowledge of his teacher. Bill gates have proved it that somebody who dropped out of school as a result of not being able to meet the examination demands set by his teacher can still be better than his teacher in same field.

ehisdan:
Equating HND with B. SC: a panacea of technological advancement/innovative idea

The war of equating hnd with b. SC has been on the field for decades. It has been become and object of concern not only to the students but also the government. This cause the Senate in 2014 to pass a bill on equating higher national diploma (hnd) and University degree (b. Sc) though nothing was heard of it thereafter.

On this note I table my greetings to the owner of nairaland, the moderators, panel of judges, the coordinator, my fellow debaters and everyone viewing this tread as member or as a guest.

My name is Ehisdan, the second writer representing Auchi polytechnic Auchi on the notion "Equating hnd with b.sc: a panacea of technological advancement/innovative idea". I hereby write in opposition of the notion.

Before pinning down my points let me quickly bring to our understanding the meaning of some words or acronyms in the context.
Panacea: according to the Oxford dictionary means something that will solve all problems of a particular situation. On the other other hand "a remedy".
University: An institution at the highest level of education where you can study for a degree or do research.
Polytechnic: a college for higher education, especially in scientific and technical subjects.
Equating: making something the same.
B. Sc: a first university degree in a science subject.
HND: Higher National Diploma.

Equating hnd with b. Sc: a remedy for technological advancements/innovation is an aberration.
Technological advancements/innovative idea is not institution dependent and if so, equating hnd with b. Sc is never the solution. B. Sc is a degree gotten from the University which is the highest institution and hnd degree on the other hand is gotten from the polytechnic which is a higher institution. Though polytechnic is tag with technical and science study, university still have an upper hand over it. A person with b. Sc is assume to have acquired all the educational acquittances of furthering his education to a masters level while a hnd degree holder will have to undergo PGD program before having an access to acquirinug a masters degree. This means that there is a vacuum that has been filled by b. Sc degree which hnd degree need to fill before crossing the bridge to masters degree. The words Highest and Higher as used respectively has even justified the fact that equating hnd with b.sc is An error.

University is technically above polytechnic
I have never seen any jambite who ignored university and filled polytechnic Just because he/she want to be technically sound or advance technologically. Rather he/she will have to choose university which is the highest institution to to obtain or acquire his/her dream. Technologically universities are more equipped compared to polytechnics, the level of acquisition of knowledge is higher than that of the polytechnic, in the sense that the lecturers in the University are vast in knowledge and most of them has attain the highest level of education (professors).

Equating hnd with b.sc will not make any change to technology
HND is a degree as well B.SC they have no additional support to technology/innovative idea of a country. There are so many people out there who does not have the opportunity to be in the four walls of higher institution but are technologically sound and can even lecture a b.sc and hnd degree holder what can not be acquired in higher institution.

The level of B.sc degree and HND degree acquisition
These two degrees are of great difference. The highest years of study on normal ground in the polytechnic is five years, but in the University depending on the course of study is seven years. How then can you equate five to seven?. In polytechnic hnd degree can easily be gotten than getting a b.sc in the University. In the polytechnic a student can easily buy his/her way to top bland acquire the result but in the University the case is reverse, in the sense that most of the lecturers are professors, doctors and PhD who has there image to protect and will not want anything to bring them down. While in the polytechnic most of the lecturers are hnd holders, b.sc and PhD holder can easily collect money from students give them what they want.

Conclusively
The panacea to technological advancement/innovation is not equating hnd to b.sc rather self development and government policy on technology.

Your argument that university degree requires seven years is very wrong.
There is no university degree in Nigeria that requires seven years of study. Not even medicine which is six years. Other ranges from four to five years.
The fact that you don't know the duration of time for getting a degree shows clearly that you are out of touch with reality in the university system
Luxane. Modified