Ibime:
Says the man who's been losing the same argument for the last two years!!!

which argument have i lost? you people are the losers in this argument - torres is still @ chelsea and the manager you fellate on regularly has been sacked - why? it's not even a secret roman sacked di matteo because he couldn't bring out the best in torres and hired a trusted hand in the management of torres! you must have failed logic in school!

This week, everybody sit behind the halfway line still isnt working for Torres.

listen to yourself - when did everyone sit behind torres? are you having those your nightmares again? you just make things up like a lunatic. it was on this thread we brought the torres escapades @ liverpool, it was on this thread i suggested torres needs to get his passes early.....it was on this thread i opined the team should be built around torres. the problem is torres does not fit the chelsea dna....it's a square peg in a round role. bring torres to the emirates, old trafford or white hart lane(3 teams who play expansive attacking football and torres would be scoring 30 goals per season easily)

According to them, the only thing that works for Torres is sit behind the half-way line and play 50 yard balls that would put him clear. Thats a job for Sunday Oliseh, the King of 50-yard through passes ala Tunisia 94'!!

obese mumu.....
is that how united get the best of hernandez? look at the gifs again, you pillock. they weren't even counter attacks but smart build up(especially the scholesy 40 yard pass) see how van persie sucked out his marker to the half way line with hernandez running into that space....:all those things are football intelligence......something you would never see @ chelsea and they want torres to score like falcao - na yam?

Funny enuff I remember Mata hitting Torres from open play in the game against Norwich

But seriously how do you pass to a statue of liberty like Torres? This is a ninja that lacks the pace to beat his marker,strength and stamina to hold them off

920mins with no league goal!! That's a whooping 15hrs plus. Unbelievable

Dozens of pages and scores of gifs later, Torres is still a dud.
I will take Emile Heskey over him, at least we can play route one football when things get tough.
Hell I will take Pink Boot wearing Nicolas Bendtner.

Ibime: I think the "flurry of passes" Daniel Sturridge received in 15 minutes against West Brom have already proved who is not making the run.

What 'flurry of passes' was evident in the near 60 minutes Torres wasn't on the pitch against Juve?

A-40:
Funny enuff I remember Mata hitting Torres from open play in the game against Norwich

This is part of the problem - if your rack your brains you might remember one pass, or two passes. Are y'all expecting 100% or even 50% chance conversion from Torres? Is that what other strikers produce?

erm this euro 2012 golden boot thing that coogar mouths every now and then, is it the same 3 goal golden boot or another one?

LWTMB!!!

anyway i think we can now safely conclude from the various "submissions" made on here that MAZACA are crap and have failed miserably in their singular duty to assist torres.

so can we then dispose of them and go get the type of "intelligent" midfielders that can supply the hernandesque passes that will enable the 50 million not go to waste?


we have sha tried 3 coaches now, we tried lampard, no dice, we have tried mazaca, same thing.

therefore lets get other capable midfielders.

pls recommend. and other coaches too in case this one cannot do the job

Torres FC

debosky:
What 'flurry of passes' was evident in the near 60 minutes Torres wasn't on the pitch against Juve?

against juve and city, chelsea did not create any meaningful chance - they were that poor but some goblins expect torres to fashion out a chance all by himself and score.

This is part of the problem - if your rack your brains you might remember one pass, or two passes. Are y'all expecting 100% or even 50% chance conversion from Torres? Is that what other strikers produce?

that's really the problem with chelsea.....
they create 2 chances in 90 mins for torres with none of them a clear cut chance and they expect torres to score. it's a shame liverpool with their crap midfield creates a dozen chances for suarez to score every match day! suarez can score a hatrick in a match and still squander 6 chances.....

4llerbuntu: erm this euro 2012 golden boot thing that coogar mouths every now and then, is it the same 3 goal golden boot or another one?
LWTMB!!!

that competition also had gomez, zlatan, ronaldo, benzema, balotelli, di natale, etc - why didn't these strikers score more than 3 goals? torres played far less minutes than these predators and yet still beat them to the golden boot? can you explain that?

anyway i think we can now safely conclude from the various "submissions" made on here that MAZACA are crap and have failed miserably in their singular duty to assist torres.

they are not crap!
MAZACAR is still young and they are coachable. di matteo was the fool who couldn't work out how to bring the best out of torres....there's no reason one of those 3 midfielders shouldn't be hitting a long pass to torres to surprise torres' markers.....

so can we then dispose of them and go get the type of "intelligent" midfielders that can supply the hernandesque passes that will enable the 50 million not go to waste?

MAZACAR haven't even reached their peak yet and you want them disposed - really?

we have sha tried 3 coaches now, we tried lampard, no dice, we have tried mazaca, same thing. therefore lets get other capable midfielders.

there's no doubt lampard of 2003-2009 would have done wonders for torres but the dude has lost his vision now. he's old, offers nothing defensively or offensively. with proper coaching and drilling, MAZACAR can be drilled into making the long pass more often than their tippy-tappy football skills.

pls recommend. and other coaches too in case this one cannot do the job
Torres FC

nothing to recommend.....the present personnel can work wonders and i know fat spanish waiter knows what to do!

The first chance Sturridge missed against west broom was a long raking pass from Mata. How come Mata can't deliver those when Torres is on the field

That's because Sturridge was making the right run which Torres doesn't make

debosky: If crosses are being pinged into the box with no strikers there, or balls being passed with no-one making the runs, it is very apparent and we can blame the striker for failing to make runs as required. You'll often hear commentators saying 'why was there no one in the box?' or 'someone should be making those runs'. How often is that heard in Chelski games?

You can't even see the passes being made, leading you to question whether those players understand what their striker

This is so stupid that even by your standards its disturbing.

A striker is not in position to receive the pass but the midfielder should still go ahead and play it to prove a point. Does that make any sense

So if Torres is in an offside position Mata should still pass the Ball to him in the position

debosky:

What 'flurry of passes' was evident in the near 60 minutes Torres wasn't on the pitch ?

Mention the name of the striker on the field at that time mumu natu

dayokanu: The first chance Sturridge missed against west broom was a long raking pass from Mata. How come Mata can't deliver those when Torres is on the field

That's because Sturridge was making the right run which Torres doesn't make

can we see a clip of this "tale by moonlight"??

dayokanu:

Mention the name of the striker on the field at that time mumu natu

So the absence of a player tagged 'striker' is what prevented Chelski players from supplying the 'flurry of passes'?

So even when he's off the pitch, Torres is causing players to run offside, and take up positions where they cannot receive the ball?

Torres must be a god.

coogar:

can we see a clip of this "tale by moonlight"??

I dont know how to get gifs. But it was a chance between 77th abd 80min which the Brom keeper saved. Look at the range of the pass from Mata to him and how Sturridge he pulled away to receive the ball

debosky:

So the absence of a player tagged 'striker' is what prevented Chelski players from supplying the 'flurry of passes'?

So even when he's off the pitch, Torres is causing players to run offside, and take up positions where they cannot receive the ball?

Torres must be a god.

I dont know how I can teach you football again. It cant be surprising anymore since you want midfielders to hit passes into open space just to prove that Torres is not making runs. Even by folahans standard thats stupid. Its stupidd Like "edoyad stupid"

Back to your senseless post here, Common sense dictates that the personnel on the field would determine the mode of play, E.g Vs Juve what would be the use of aerial balls when everyone upfront is less than 6ft contesting against Chiellini? In such games it would be useless for Cech to punt.

There was no striker on the field and the plan was to sit back and counter with short passes. If Chelsea short men upfront were more clinical they could have scored a couple With HAZARD and OSCAR missing decent chances

dayokanu:

I dont know how I can teach you football again. It cant be surprising anymore since you want midfielders to hit passes into open space just to prove that Torres is not making runs. Even by folahans standard thats stupid. Its stupidd Like "edoyad stupid"

Yawn - so even when Torres wasn't on the pitch, MAZACAR couldn't make runs for themselves and produce the alleged 'flurry of passes'? Shebi Torres is the problem?

There was no striker on the field and the plan was to sit back and counter with short passes. If Chelsea short men upfront were more clinical they could have scored a couple With HAZARD and OSCAR missing decent chances

I see - so there were only 'a couple' of chances created (2 shots on goal)? Again I ask, why didn't they create a 'flurry of chances' since the single impediment called Torres was absent? Is there a law that says 'short passes' cannot create goals?

Two shots on goal in an entire game, Torres only coming on in the 71st minute and he is the problem.

debosky:

Yawn - so even when Torres wasn't on the pitch, MAZACAR couldn't make runs for themselves and produce the alleged 'flurry of passes'? Shebi Torres is the problem?

Torres is the problem because Torres is the striker the person who should receive passes

I see - so there were only 'a couple' of chances created (2 shots on goal)? Again I ask, why didn't they create a 'flurry of chances' since the single impediment called Torres was absent? Is there a law that says 'short passes' cannot create goals?

Two shots on goal in an entire game, Torres only coming on in the 71st minute and he is the problem.

This is taking daft to a new low. How many chances do you expect Chelsea to create vs Juventus in Turin?

How many chances did Chelsea of Last season create against Bayern in Munich, or against Barcelona in Nou Camp where they played a similar tactic to the one deployed in Turin

Turin is one of the toughest destinations in Europe. A team that won Serie A unbeaten, An Italian team? The Italian Champion? The best Italian team currently you are expecting 15 clear chances on their goal? If I need to be telling you that then really HOW LOW CAN WE GO?

dayokanu:
This is taking daft to a new low. How many chances do you expect Chelsea to create vs Juventus in Turin?

How many chances did Chelsea of Last season create against Bayern in Munich, or against Barcelona in Nou Camp where they played a similar tactic to the one deployed in Turin

Chelski with 10 men against Barcelona in Catalonia - 7 shots on goal.

Hot Fufu for brains.

So Juve is the only team Chelsea has played this season?

Ibime: So Juve is the only team Chelsea has played this season?

No, but since we are all convinced Torres is the cause, let's examine games where Torres was absent no?

It's all well and good jizzing over MAZACAR when Torres is occupying CBs, making runs that frees up space for them to score, but let's evaluate them in his absence too.

debosky:

No, but since we are all convinced Torres is the cause, let's examine games where Torres was absent no?

Hehehe. . . why didnt you ask to see the flurry of passes when Sturridge was on the pitch against West Brom.

Or how about Manure League Cup game?

We all saw it.

You are expecting to see flurry of passes away at Juve with midfielders deputising for Torres.

You know the right parameters for judgement but your dishonesty has veered you toward Juve.

At least thats more honest than those asking us for GIFS of Mata playing the ball to nobody just to prove Torres isnt making the run.

Ibime:

Hehehe. . . why didnt you ask to see the flurry of passes when Sturridge was on the pitch against West Brom.

Or how about Manure League Cup game?

We all saw it.

You are expecting to see flurry of passes away at Juve with midfielders deputising for Torres.

You know the right parameters for judgement but your dishonesty has veered you toward Juve.

At least thats more honest than those asking us for GIFS of Mata playing the ball to nobody just to prove Torres isnt making the run.

People want to see evudence of midfielders making passes into open space just to prove that Torres wasnt making the run.

Juan Mata that made 35 assists in his last 3 seasons in the La Liga now doesnt know how to assist players at Chelsea

Last season he had 13 assists in the league this season he already has 6 and not midway yet despite him missing a few games at the beginning.

The same Juan Mata who has excelled playing behind David Villa and Soldado but when it comes to Torres everyone stopped knowing how to play

Lampard that was a ball of fire stopped knowing how to play, Mata that was assisting and still assiting in bucketloads stopped that, Oscar Hazard that is assisting in bucketloads stopped doing that.

ALL THESE WHEN THEY STARTED PLAYING WITH TORRES

Ibime:

Hehehe. . . why didnt you ask to see the flurry of passes when Sturridge was on the pitch against West Brom.

We all saw it.

You are expecting to see flurry of passes away at Juve with midfielders deputising for Torres.

Why not? Shebi MAZACAR are the bees knees?

You know the right parameters for judgement but your dishonesty has veered you toward Juve.

No dishonesty mate - Juve is the most recent piece of evidence that can be assessed for the effect of Torres' absence no?

Even if we consider the so called 15 mins of 'flurry of passes' in addition to Juve - in BOTH cases Chelski did not score. Yet Torres is the singular problem.

dayokanu:

People want to see evudence of midfielders making passes into open space just to prove that Torres wasnt making the run.

Juan Mata that made 35 assists in his last 3 seasons at Valencia now doesnt know how to assist players at Chelsea

Last season he had 13 assists in the league this season he already has 6 and not midway yet despite him missing a few games at the beginning.

The same Juan Mata who has excelled playing behind David Villa and Soldado but when it comes to Torres everyone stopped knowing how to play

Lampard that was a ball of fire stopped knowing how to play, Mata that was assisting and still assiting in bucketloads stopped that, Oscar Hazard that is assisting in bucketloads stopped doing that.

ALL THESE WHEN THEY STARTED PLAYING WITH TORRES

What are you talking about 13 this, 13 that.

Mata assisted 26 times last season in all comps, none for Torres.

nateevs: This is the part that irks me. It is insufficient to argue that just by playing Mata behind Torres, he will get supply. Yes Coogar and I argued that playing craftier players behind Torres "is capable of creating chances", it still all relies on the method of build up which is the core of the discussion.

If Ronaldinho plays behind Torres but the method of attack is phased and slow then we are back to square one. So instead of just assuming that our suggestions have not works, you should instead analyse if by playing MaZaCar behind Torres, the passes have really come in numbers.

So now its insufficient to play MATA behind Torres? The Mata that you advocated for last season suddenly became the problem now. Mata suddenly forgot how to play with Torres like you said he was doing last season At least the posts below all wont lie

The same persons who posted this last Spring

nateevs:
The midfield revolution I have been preaching for ages is finally about to happen next season.
Just sit back and watch Torres next season.

nateevs: Juan Mata. What a player!

coogar: i have always known torres is dynamite. thank feck for mata.
villas-boas biggest error was not playing mata behind torres.

Ibime:

What are you talking about 13 this, 13 that.

Mata assisted 26 times last season in all comps, none for Torres.

I was being League specific, All competition would seem like an overkill

nateevs:
You are ignoring the more important question, Was the pass made? There lies the crux of the argument. If a flurry of passes in anticipation of a Torres move happen time and again, it will be clear for everyone to see. Infact, Ibime will not need to post a still image to try to force an explanation, there will be live feeds.

Now post a gif of a flurry of passes towards Torres that continually eludes a proper Torres move. Only then can you match up with the incisive analysis that Coogar puts forward.

I hope you realize how stupidd this request is? You expect Mata to make a pass to Torres running in the opposite direction or putting his hands on his waist JUST TO PROVE Torres is a waste?

lemme ask you if you are a midfielder and the striker isnt making the run you would just lump the ball and show the fans that Torres is the problem? Or if your striker is offside you would still make the pass and be ruled offside just to prove what point?

Weren't you guys the same ones who posted earlier that If Torres is the problem Let the others do the scoring

Other have done their part and atimes they need Torres to do his part which he is failing miserably at

dayokanu:
lemme ask you if you are a midfielder and the striker isnt making the run you would just lump the ball and show the fans that Torres is the problem? Or if your striker is offside you would still make the pass and be ruled offside just to prove what point?

It happens all the time - Just last week a Real player made a run for Ronaldo, only for Ronaldo to tamely shoot instead of crossing. That player could've said 'I know CR9 won't pass', but he still made a run to make it obvious. Ibime mentioned it on this same thread.

Players cross balls into where they expect strikers to play - they gesticulate, the point at where runs are expected. You're now saying this is something that's never happened before?

How did Arsenal fans know Mumubayor was shyte at beating the offside trap? The countless times you could point at where he'd be blatantly offside/mistiming his runs.

Yet with Torres we should just take your word for it.

debosky:


This is part of the problem - if your rack your brains you might remember one pass, or two passes. Are y'all expecting 100% or even 50% chance conversion from Torres? Is that what other strikers produce?

Naaah that was me just hinting that Torres has been assisted by Mata from open play. Hazard has done so too.
I just want to rubbish the notion that Hazard and Mata are conspiring to starve Torres of goals. These guys are not selfish players as their records show. At the mo methinks the MAZACAR train is on E. And maybe these players need to find a way to recharge their batteries! With the way they started its no suprise they've burned out a bit

Back to Torres I think the biggest thing everyone is leaving out especially the pro-Torres camp is the fact that this dude is simply not the player he was at Liverpool (could it be he moved to the wrong club? Could it be his rash of injuries in the 09-10 season? Could it be his loss of confidence? Could it be that he has simply refused to adapt to his new environment)
Lethal acceleration missing,Killer first touch missing, let's face it this goes beyond Mata,Hazard,Oscar. Torres has regressed!

A-40:
Back to Torres I think the biggest thing everyone is leaving out especially the pro-Torres camp is the fact that this dude is simply not the player he was at Liverpool (could it be he moved to the wrong club? Could it be his rash of injuries in the 09-10 season? Could it be his loss of confidence? Could it be that he has simply refused to adapt to his new environment)
Lethal acceleration missing,Killer first touch missing, let's face it this goes beyond Mata,Hazard,Oscar. Torres has regressed!

Nooo lailai. Its everyones fault.

Once he got to Chelsea Lampard, Anelka all stopped working. Once hazard, Mata and oscar got to play with Torres they conspired to be selfish and deny Torres passes.

The coach in Spain in Villas absence would rather play without a striker than Play Torres.

Even in the last 2 years, Xavi and iniesta too have been conspiring to feed only David Villa with passes and ignore Torres or what explains that Villa despite copping several injuries in the last 2 yrs has scored more than double of Torres goals in the NT

@ A-40

I'm not one of those who deny Torres has regressed. BUT, I do feel the current side ins't playing to his strengths enough.

Torres is a shadow of himself.

He is dead

He is finished

His movements off the ball are poor, and he looks unispired with the ball at his feet.

He is also clearly suffering from confidence issues, and if the Chelsea back room staff keep sending him out each week, he is going to need a pyschologist soon...

It says a lot that that utterly disgusting stutteridge is looking a lot sharper than Fernando these days...

El Nino? more like El Nina..

debosky: @ A-40

I'm not one of those who deny Torres has regressed. BUT, I do feel the current side ins't playing to his strengths enough.

The Chelsea of lampard, Malouda and Anelka werent playing to his strenght

The Chelsea of MAZACAR weren't playing to his strength

The Spain of Xavi, iniesta and Busquets weren't playing to his strength

Vicente Del Bosque 2 time CL winner, World Champion, European Champion wasn't playing to his strength

Carlo Ancelotti 2 time European Champion wasn't playing to his strength

AVB Europa Cup winner wasn't playing to his strength

Roberto Di Matteo Champions league winning coach wasn't playing to his strength

Roy Hodgson wasn't playing to his strength

[size=18pt]Which kain Mighty Igor strength is this that no one understands[/size]

dayokanu:

People want to see evudence of midfielders making passes into open space just to prove that Torres wasnt making the run.

Juan Mata that made 35 assists in his last 3 seasons in the La Liga now doesnt know how to assist players at Chelsea

Last season he had 13 assists in the league this season he already has 6 and not midway yet despite him missing a few games at the beginning.

The same Juan Mata who has excelled playing behind David Villa and Soldado but when it comes to Torres everyone stopped knowing how to play

Lampard that was a ball of fire stopped knowing how to play, Mata that was assisting and still assiting in bucketloads stopped that, Oscar Hazard that is assisting in bucketloads stopped doing that.

ALL THESE WHEN THEY STARTED PLAYING WITH TORRES

dayokanu musta been born a tool.....

whatever mata achieved in la liga is irrelevant
he's now @ chelsea where the style of play is vastly different. just because a player made 20,000 assists in la liga does not mean he would replicate the same in the premier league! kezman was lethal in eredivisie - how did he fare @ chelsea? when you continue to make daft analogies, i would continue to treat you like an obnoxious swine!

mata's 13 league assists last season are also irrelevant in this argument because torres scored from some of them and far majority of them are from set pieces.....on top of my head, i remember the only goal torres scored last season against man utd, it was a long pass from anelka - torres made the run behind united defence, got himself one on one against de gea and finished exquisitely - only a plonker like dayokanu can say torres does not make runs to receive long passes.....just admit the current set up don't have a clue yet to play to the strengths of torres....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EY-FUfHUbiE&sns=em

@ 5.45

and these are all the goals he scored last season(including internationals) - surprise surprise, 90% of the goals torres scored for spain were as a result of early pass hat set him through on goal and yet some idiotic troglodytes like dayo, ibime and other herbivores claim xavi and iniesta have no clue on how to play to the strengths of torres...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6Vk-lrQJi0

ibime and the rest of the anti-torres crew, over to you........