Splinz:


Mature and old harvest... immature harvest ni?

---

They claimed that they don't worship Mary but only honor her. And I asked: “Can we also say that those traditionalists bowing down to their own statues are also honoring their god and not worshiping them”? Now, if these people are called “idol worshipers”, then the Catholics are chiefs among them!

You see, Jael is actually the “most blessed of women (Judges 5:24)”, while Mary is “blessed among women”. Here's how the Bible describes her: “Blessed above women shall Jael the wife of Heber the Kenite be, blessed shall she be above women in the tent”.

According to this passage, Jael is even blessed more than Mary. But then, Catholics don't worship or honor her. Do you by any chance know the reason for this selective honor?

So, the blessedness of Jael dismisses any thought of giving special status to Mary! She was simply one of those blessed among women!

Was Mary in the tent?

Mcowubaba:


U guys pray the Rosary. Hail Mary full of Grace (that 1 no be adoration) blessed are you amongst women and blessed is the fruit of your womb Jesus
Holy Mary mother of God , Pray for Us sinners now and at the hour of our death (no be intercession be dis 1)

Catholics also Wear the scapular
Pray Hail holy queen and the memorare, if the contents of this prayers are not pure adoration, worship and praise, Nothing else in this world is!!!!

Catholics Have hundreds of Societies referencing Mary.
The construct very Expensive Mary's Sculptures, pictures, then start bowing down to it and praying in front of the Sculpture.

Mary was nobody, God, Jesus Christ was before Mary, what qualified Mary was Jesus Christ.
She was just favored, many women had her Qualities at the time of birth of Jesus, but as the Bible said, she was FAVORED .

Before Abraham, Jesus Christ was in existence, not to talk about Mary.

Throughout the old testament, all the prophets that talked about the coming of Christ, did not make any reference to Mary, the only said a VIRGIN will conceive,} it could have been any Virgin.
CATHOLICS reference the Mary aspects of Jesus Christ, more than Jesus Christ himself..

According her undue prayers.
All the things done in The Catholic Church are not in your so called Catechism, that small book.
Harvest and Barza dey Catechism
Catholics do almost 4 Harvests Childern, Tennager, Youth, Adult, Mature, Old Harvests
Where is it in the Catechism
All those unnecessary Fund raising, where is it in the Catechism
I knew a Reverend Father then, that always REQUEST A new car very 2 years, I have also seen 2 Reverend fathers struggle for Offering money (the both coordinated the Mass in a neutral ground) I guess all this things are in your Catechism and doctrine...

Oga go and sleep or rush to morning mass, I know it's early morning in Nigeria. .

Long story short. No Bishop or Pope told you he worships Mary. You're just concocting that from your little brain.

Why are you hell bent on forcing a deity on us?

Why dont you let us tell you the God we worship?

Look at the sheep without shepherd who just swallowed it because it seemed to be mocking Christ...

Even though its fake.

This is why Nigeria is a mess. People dont think.

Mcowubaba:

All this irrelevant arguments.
Where did I talk about Catechism

Catholics give Mary undeserved attention. Period!!!
You guys know where you got that Idealogy from, probably your founders, maybe the left it out of the written Catechism, but Catholics are indoctrinated to honor, praise and worship Mary, this is Public Knowledge with huge Empirical Evidence.

Many Churches, Catholic inclusive, don't always follow their doctrine/Catechism firmly.. There's always a deviation.
When people don't even follow the Bible firmly, is it Man made Catechism that the would follow

PS. I never said I know everything, I said I know ALMOST everything about CATHOLIC Church, I have been a member, a mass sever, a worker nd I have been to many Catholic formations in my life. My baptism, Holy Eucharist, Reconciliation, confirmation were all done in a Catholic church.

I have worked closely with over 5 Reverend fathers, uncountable Reverend brothers and sisters, 2 monsignors, 3 different Bishops before in both official and religious capacities..
So yes, I know about Catholic Church to an very large extent.
I doubt you even have such experience nd exposure in the Catholic, u probably have been a Church goer since birth, highest u belong to one society, probably St Vincent de Paul (begging around for money) or legion of Mary (better babes dey always dey that Society )
I maybe wrong about you though, u fit be Catechist or Seminarian

So, in a nutshell, you cant find where the Catechism teaches us to adore Mary. But all those Bishops, Cardinals and Popes you've met told you that they worship Mary? Can you prove that?

Ubenedictus:
actually, whenever i discuss with people even those who i know are lying i do due diligence. i read d article top to bottom and had a good laugh.

Lol...i read it too. It was hilarious. They even said Pope John X was made an Archbishop when he was 5 years old, and Doctoralien believes.

If he comes across a website that says Catholic Church increased the heat of the Sun, the mumu will believe, without thinking.

easymancfc:


Oh.. So you know everything.. Please give the Part of the Catechism where the Catholic Church teaches that its followers should ADORE MARY...
please I need the Paragraph number... am curious... prove it using the Catechism which contains all Catholic teachings

Me too. I'm waiting.

Ubenedictus:
no, he is saying the true church was the arians and that d council of nicea persecuted them.

The true Church was the arians that believed Jesus was not co-eternal with the Father?

Lol...these guys are just latching unto any anti-Catholic writing on the internet without even digesting them.

Ubenedictus:
Please where is the police report that shows alberto rivera was murder by the church.

or that is just one of the jack chic lies u believe. Do u also believe that the church has a big super computer that has d names of all protestants?

Lol...

...and that the Church created Communism, the Ku Klux Klan, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Mormonism, and Islam

Ubenedictus:
The orthodox christians actually broke away from catholicism in 1054-1600. They are the worst example you can give because orthodox also believe the roman church was began by st peter and st paul, with primacy, their doctrine are abt 90% similar to catholic. Infact the pope is going to egypt this year and the orthodox patriarch will be joining in the trip.

If the Orthodox account is correct, then Pope Francis is the 265th successor of St. Peter...That is proof that early Christians were Catholics.

Where will you turn now, shadeyinka?

We have shown a list of Popes from St. Peter, we have pointed out that Carthage 397 had 73 books, we have demonstrated that the 7 books could not have been added by Catholics in 1548 because the Orthodox Church also has them.

The only attempt to prove that early Christians werent Catholics is being lifted from imaginary sources.

Thats very telling.

Splinz:
Let me add some refreshing history to this thread; to all lovers of the truth.

Constantine and the Council of Nicea

In the early 300s, during the time of the most severe persecution against all professing Christians, the Roman armies proclaimed their favorite general, Constantine, as Caesar. He had claimed victory after defeating his rival, Maxentius, at the Battle of Milvian Bridge outside Rome. Prior to that battle, he was said to have had a vision of the first two letters of the name of “Christ” (in Greek, chi (X) and rho (P)) and heard a voice that told him, “By this sign you will conquer.” He felt that the meaning of the letters he had seen was unmistakably symbolic of Christ and thus, he was indebted to Christianity for his victory, in spite of being an established sun worshiper. Immediately upon becoming Emperor, he issued the Edict of Toleration, which gave Christianity legality in the empire. This ended the ten years of severe persecution against the true Church, but paved the way for false Christianity to rise to prominence in the empire (“The History of the Church of God,” Kelly, part 4).

Constantine recognized the benefit of aligning with the counterfeit movement—which called itself Christian. Not only was he indebted to this “power” which helped to establish him as Emperor, he saw this movement as a potential means of unifying the empire. Yet, the Christianity of the Western empire was significantly different from that in the east and from that of other sects in North Africa. Thus, Constantine took measures to “standardize” his newfound ally—Christianity (ibid.).

Constantine convened the ecumenical council of Nicea in AD 325 to resolve the doctrinal differences between the various Christian denominations. Before this time, he had already decreed that the day of the sun would be kept throughout the empire. This “day of the sun” was the pivotal point to unify various pagan sun-worshippers with those nominal “Christians” who already had accepted Sunday and had never observed the Sabbath anyway—except for the apostates who defected and joined them.

Thus, this entire episode was a marriage of convenience between Constantine and the Church at Rome. The council of Nicea, directed personally by Constantine, condemned the practice of true Christianity. All of the precepts of the emerging Church at Rome were now decreed as part of the state religion. As protector of this counterfeit Christianity, Constantine forced everyone, pagan or Christian, into either conformity or exile (ibid.).

With the enforcement of a false religion upon them, the true Church had no choice but to flee. This was the flight prophesied in Revelation 12:6: “And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.” According to the day-for-a-year principle (Numbers 14:34, Ezekiel 4:4-6), the Church was to be in the wilderness for 1,260 years from this landmark date of AD 325.

NOTE: This happened during the Smyrna Era of God's Church—the second era of God seventh Church eras (see Rev. 2 & 3)

Going by what you wrote, the true Church came back in 1585.

Where is it? It is invisible abi?

shadeyinka:


Their claim is that you Catholics broke away from them and became stronger

What is your claim?

DoctorAlien:


Judas was not converted in the heart, we know.

Peter later repented and never denied Jesus again. He also did not act like a pope over the church, nor was did he claim to be lord over the monarchs of the earth.

Paul killed Christians when he was still in Judaism. When he met Christ, he repented and never killed anyone again.

They were all sinners. Period.

DoctorAlien:


Malachi Martin didn't exist?

Mary Ann Collins didnt exist. Alberto Rivera was never a Jesuit Priest.

DoctorAlien:
Walter A. Elwell (editor), "Evangelical Dictionary of Theology" (Grand Rapids, Michigan: Baker Book House, 1984), page 141.

We all know how good the catholic church is at forgery. Indeed, Rome was called "the home forgery" during the dark ages. Moreover, stop deluding yourself: the Roman Catholic church did not produce the Bible. The Bible was written by holy men of GOD who were not Roman Catholics. They didn't pray to Mary, they didn't collect indulgences, they didn't institute any office of celibate priesthood filled with homosexual priests who keep on molesting children and women who come for confession, or unholy, corrupt, greedy and immoral popes.

But one of them (Judas) sold him for 30 silver pieces, one (Peter) denied him 3 times, one (Paul) killed many Christians, one (Thomas) doubted his resurrection, and all (12) struggled to be the greatest.

Who called Rome the home of forgery? Another of your imaginary ex-nuns?

DoctorAlien:


LOL. Says the person who believes in a church that is known for forgery and lies.

You only believe that because non-existent people 'said so.'

DoctorAlien:
It is common knowledge that even up till the time of Miltiades, nothing like a "pope" existed. Miltiades was only the Bishop of Rome but catholics now call him a pope.

Bishop Silvester was Miltiades' successor. Silvester was eager to have the Church be spread using Roman roads, Roman wealth, Roman law, Roman
power, and Roman military might. Constantine officially approved of Silvester as the successor of Miltiades. Then he had a coronation ceremony for Silvester and crowned him like a worldly prince. No bishop had ever been crowned before. (Malachi Martin, "The Decline and Fall of the Roman Church," pages 34-35).

This cannot be taken seriously by any right thinking person because the person you're quoting does not exist.

shadeyinka:


Back to the fondermental differences!

...I will build My church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it.

Was Peter the Peter the Rock upon which the foundation of the church is laid OR the confession of Peter( You are the Christ, the Son of the Living God)?

There is no church denomination in heaven we only have the Ekklesia (singular).
And there I rest my case.

You are still avoiding my questions.


So who started Christianity, and when did it start?

Oh! Only a relationship with the Father and 'Our Father' prayer.

So who built the Church?

Who started the idea of baptism, communion? Whose idea was it that one man -
Peter should feed the flock? Who chose 12 men and made them foundation for the kingdom?


When did this religious aspect start?

DoctorAlien:


For what it's worth, Mary Ann Collins could be a pen name. The person behind the name may have chosen not to reveal her true identity. We all know how the catholic church murdered Alberto Rivera(a former priest) after he left the catholic church and exposed them.

From one lie to the other. 'Ex-nun, Mary Ann Collins' never existed. Alberto Rivera was never a Jesuit Priest.

Your whole faith is built on sand by satan, the father of lies.

It's a pity.

shadeyinka:


Let the case rest!
I know your position, you know mine. A thousand argument will probably change nothing on both sides.

You have no argument, just random statements without evidence or backing.

Arguments are well thought out.

DoctorAlien:


Here is a true Roman Catholic who doesn't know jack about his church and what they can do. He gobbles down whatever he is fed by the priests.

Bro, the Roman Catholic church has forged many documents and writings, and edited countless others, simply to lend credence to whatever lies they've decided to teach their flock. The Catholic encyclopedia even admits these forgeries!

The Donation of Constantine is only one, and a good example, of such forgeries. You can read about the Donation of Constantine on Wikipedia.

Very funny, coming from one who started this thread with a forged article from "Ex-nun, Mary Ann Collins," who never existed.

You should bury your head in shame, but no, you're an antiCatholic protestant.

shadeyinka:


Your questions had been answered you are repeating the same thing

Pls show me where you answered them.

So who started Christianity, and when did it start?
Oh! Only a relationship with the Father and 'Our Father' prayer.

So who built the Church? Who started the idea of baptism, communion? Whose idea was it that one man -
Peter should feed the flock? Who chose 12 men and made them foundation for the kingdom?


When did this religious aspect start?

DoctorAlien:


Yes, there were no Popes before Constantine, a pagan, crowned Sylvester, and commanded other churches to become loyal to him.

Provide evidence.

shadeyinka:


You have the right to be biased.
But, I object.

You object without any evidence whatsoever.

shadeyinka:


I just wanted you to see that Catholics don't own the monopoly of church history.

The protestant churches may have split from the catholic churches, but it doesn't mean that the Church history started from Martin Luther, or even the Catholic church.

Since you are already distancing yourself from your post, I dont see any reason to engage it.

Do you still maintain that there were no Popes before 200AD?

shadeyinka:


Intersting read:
However, you always contrast Catholic vs Protestant and this prevent you from seeing that you did not invent history.

Permit me to paste this from Wikipedia:



So, you can see that your historical records could be biased.

Are the Orthodox Christians under the authority of the Pope?
If they are not Catholics, then your dispute should be with the Orthodox Christians.

Can i take your wikipedia post as your opinion?

Not that when i start scrutinizing it to disprove you, you'll then deny it.

shadeyinka:


Check historical records and jewish culture

It is you who has to prove your claims.

My historical records tell me that the Catholic Church started at pentecost.

shadeyinka:


In the real sense, Jesus didn't start Christianity: He was the nucleus/the focus of what is called Christianity.

So who started Christianity, and when did it start?

shadeyinka:


Apart from teaching the Believers a model prayer, Jesus didn't focus on religion: He focused on men having a relationship with the Father.

Oh! Only a relationship with the Father and 'Our Father' prayer.

So who built the Church? Who started the idea of baptism, communion? Whose idea was it that one man -
Peter should feed the flock? Who chose 12 men and made them foundation for the kingdom?

shadeyinka:

Christianity is the Religious aspect of the "Relationship" He paid the price for us to have.

When did this religious aspect start?

DoctorAlien:


The many churches in the parts of the then-known world had copies of one or more of the NT epistles, Gospels and maybe the book of Revelations. These books of the New Testament were generally held as Scripture then and were used by the churches. This was sixty years before the formation of the catholic church in 314 A.D. The catholic church simply gathered in the council of Carthage to agree that all those books were regarded as canon by concensus of use were canon.

Please mention just one of these your "many Churches" that existed before 314AD and provide evidence.

Also, where is your evidence of what you claimed happened at the Council of Carthage? Which books were agreed on at the council?

DoctorAlien:

The catholic church added apocrypha the Bible in the council of Trent(1548), simply because they seem to support their unbiblical practices.

Please provide evidence of this.

Again, the books were already in the bible at the Council of Carthage. If the books were added in 1548 by the Catholic Church, how come the Orthodox Church that had a Schism with the Catholic Church in 1054 have them in their Bible?

You're contradicting yourself simply because you're wrong.

PastorAIO:

Following your reasoning... Jesus didn't start Christianity. After all we know when it started. Christianity started in Antioch where the term was first coined.

Shadeyinka, according to your reasoning, would you agree that Jesus didnt start Christianity?

shadeyinka:


My point is really not about canonisation of the scriptures but against seeing Catholicism as the "Original" church. Like I said before, the issue is like:

Since you have suddenly bolted from DoctorAlien's concoction, let us wait for him to answer.

shadeyinka:


Catholic church started when a fusion of the State and the church commenced.

When was this?

shadeyinka:

Have you ever wondered why the Robes worn by the Catholic Priests didn't have any Jewish fashion style? It was influenced mainly by the Roman fashion.. No relic of how Pope Peter used to dress...

How do you know?

shadeyinka:

Catholic started when the church of Christ had a large influx of government money

When?

newbornmacho:

Blasphemy

Because you say so?

The Jews said so too...but they were the blasphemers.