Many times when walking down the street you may have been accosted by people from various Christian Churches of different denominations speaking to you about God's love with a popular phrase "God loves you", in retrospect and putting all emotional sentiments aside the "God's love" spoken about is somewhat ironical to the definition of love.
A very acceptable definition of someone you love is someone whom you wouldn't want to be hurt or hurt so why does god have a hell fire??
According to the Bible god loves everyone and would do anything to protect, provide and care for you as long as you accept him as your "lord and personal saviour" but wouldn't fail to send you to burn forever in never ending lake of fire if you don't accept him and even if you accept him and do everything for him you could still end up in perpetual pain and suffering forever if you tell a lie to save a teen from being lynched by a bloodthirsty mob by the time his "trumpet" sounds.
So is this love?

Firstson's Tales

FirstSon01:

A very acceptable definition of someone you love is someone whom you wouldn't want to be hurt or hurt so why does god have a hell fire??
According to the Bible god loves everyone and would do anything to protect, provide and care for you as long as you accept him as your "lord and personal saviour" but wouldn't fail to send you to burn forever in never ending lake of fire if you don't accept him and even if you accept him and do everything for him you could still end up in perpetual pain and suffering forever if you tell a lie to save a teen from being lynched by a bloodthirsty mob by the time his "trumpet" sounds.
So is this love?

Firstson's Tales

First, the Be-loved and Fore-Loved did not love Him back but rather disregarded Him and even grew to Hate Him and put Him Aside.

As if that is not bad enough the Fore-Loved even started doing all the things He Hated, even to the murder of himself and his fellow fore-loves!

As if this too is not bad enough, the Fore-loved refused to heed warnings but rather made himself an enemy of God even up to the point of Challenging Him

My brother, if this fore-loved was your wife or child would you still love her and them? Please do not Lie for Nairalands Romance and Family Section will Call you a Liar!

Secondly would you bless them or Curse them for the pain, patience, long endurance and suffering you got at their hands?

Or shall you not take Judgement from them?

And what you also do not know is that it is not Only God who they have offended that shall be taking judgement, but also All The Souls they have offended shall be also Asking for their own Judgement against them from The Judge!

And remember The Law is an eye for an eye, Good for Good, Pain for Pain, Suffering for Suffering, Evil for Evil!

FirstSon01:
Many times when walking down the street you may have been accosted by people from various Christian Churches of different denominations speaking to you about God's love with a popular phrase "God loves you", in retrospect and putting all emotional sentiments aside the "God's love" spoken about is somewhat ironical to the definition of love.
A very acceptable definition of someone you love is someone whom you wouldn't want to be hurt or hurt so why does god have a hell fire??
According to the Bible god loves everyone and would do anything to protect, provide and care for you as long as you accept him as your "lord and personal saviour" but wouldn't fail to send you to burn forever in never ending lake of fire if you don't accept him and even if you accept him and do everything for him you could still end up in perpetual pain and suffering forever if you tell a lie to save a teen from being lynched by a bloodthirsty mob by the time his "trumpet" sounds.
So is this love?

Firstson's Tales

The part in bold is not according to the Bible but according to your "special interpretation" of what is in fact written in the Bible. So, how you expect anyone to process that, bullsheet, of yours here as far as love is concerned?
Anyone who has ever read the Bible at least knows that God is love and His actions are all Love in action and Love should never be compared with Man's Man's Man's and ideas of Love. So , you failed when you believed it should.

Dtruthspeaker:


First, the Be-loved and Fore-Loved did not love Him back but rather disregarded Him and even grew to Hate Him and put Him Aside.

As if that is not bad enough the Fore-Loved even started doing all the things He Hated, even to the murder of himself and his fellow fore-loves!

As if this too is not bad enough, the Fore-loved refused to heed warnings but rather made himself an enemy of God even up to the point of Challenging Him

My brother, if this fore-loved was your wife or child would you still love her and them? Please do not Lie for Nairalands Romance and Family Section will Call you a Liar!

Secondly would you bless them or Curse them for the pain, patience, long endurance and suffering you got at their hands?

Or shall you not take Judgement from them?

I thought god taught us to forgive our enemies?
if yes why isn't he living by example?.

secondly on the issue of rejecting his love you'll agree that when a man goes searching for a wife he'll ask a few or a lot of girls out but not all will agree to him and some will outrightly reject him if he doesn't fit in their books of a proper husband so will he start killing those people for rejecting his love proposal??

Kobojunkie:
The part in bold is not according to the Bible but according to your "special interpretation" of what is in fact written in the Bible. So, how you expect anyone to process that, bullsheet, of yours here as far as love is concerned?
Anyone who has ever read the Bible at least knows that God is love and His actions are all Love in action and Love should never be compared with Man's Man's Man's and ideas of Love. So , you failed when you believed it should.

god told the Israelites to kill and forcefully take over the land of other countries (e.g. the jebusites) and enslave the survivors for life. would you say god loves the jebusites??

FirstSon01:

god told the Israelites to kill and forcefully take over the land of other countries (e.g. the jebusites) and enslave the survivors for life. would you say god loves the jebusites??

Like I already made it clear in my previous post, God is Love. Everything He does is love and as creator, His Love cannot be, in anyway or form, compared to the ideas and imagings of the created especially where love is concerned.

Kobojunkie:
Like I already made it clear in my previous post, God is Love. Everything He does is love and as creator, His Love cannot be, in anyway or form, compared to the ideas and imagings of the created especially where love is concerned.

so if I was god and I sent my followers to let's say kill and rape a 12 year old you would defend me same way??

FirstSon01:

so if I was god and I sent my followers to let's say kill and rape a 12 year old you would defend me same way??

Again...

Kobojunkie:
Like I already made it clear in my previous post, God is Love. Everything He does is love and as creator, His Love cannot be, in anyway or form, compared to the ideas and imagings of the created especially where love is concerned.

Kobojunkie:
Again...

you're not answering my questions directly but deflecting, so I'll ask again.

god could ask the Israelites to attack, main, cripple, kill, enslave and destroy the properties of people of other lands and forcibly take their lands from them but he loved those people??

FirstSon01:

I thought god taught us to forgive our enemies?
if yes why isn't he living by example?

There is A Time For Everything,
“A time to kill and a time to heal; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing; A time to love and a time to hate"

That is why one of the Bible's common word is "After the Passing of Time"

And He who is good knows that a person who does not want to be an enemy will take any opportunity to cease to be one, but if and where he refuses, He sees the set decision of such man and therefore, His Right to Act Arises

FirstSon01:

secondly on the issue of rejecting his love you'll agree that when a man goes searching for a wife he'll ask a few or a lot of girls out but not all will agree to him and some will outrightly reject him if he doesn't fit in their books of a proper husband so will he start killing those people for rejecting his love proposal??

He does not kill you for rejecting his love but he will kill you if after you have rejected his love and he has walked away from you, you still went on to hurt his mother, sister, brothers, attack his workers, spoil his work, tarnish his image, hurling Lies, curses and insults everywhere which is reported to him!

Dtruthspeaker:


There is A Time For Everything,
“A time to kill and a time to heal; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing; A time to love and a time to hate"

That is why one of the Bible's common word is "After the Passing of Time"

And He who is good knows that a person who does not want to be an enemy will take any opportunity to cease to be one, but if and where he refuses, He sees the set decision of such man and therefore, His Right to Act Arises



He does not kill you for rejecting his love but he will kill you if after you have rejected his love and he has walked away from you, you still went on to hurt his mother, sister, brothers, attack his workers, spoil his work, tarnish his image, hurling Lies, curses and insults everywhere which is reported to him!

so as I'm an atheist but I don't mock Christians but rather support them to practice their faith, speak up for them when they're oppressed then I won't go to hell??
or which other death are you talking about?

FirstSon01:

you're not answering my questions directly but deflecting, so I'll ask again.

god could ask the Israelites to attack, main, cripple, kill, enslave and destroy the properties of people of other lands and forcibly take their lands from them but he loved those people??

The problem is not that I did not answer your question but instead that you are having difficulty grasping the meaning in the answer given you.

FirstSon01:

so as I'm an atheist but I don't mock Christians but rather support them to practice their faith, speak up for them when they're oppressed then I won't go to hell??
or which other death are you talking about?

That is what Judgement Day is about, it is the Day Of Offences and Reward Good for Good, wickedness for wickedness!

It is the day all who have Offended shall stand Accused.

So thus, if you have lived your life Offending NO ONE, then No One shall Accuse you on that day. But this is not attainable by any soul, everyone Offends everyone and has so offended someone else.

This, this is where the True Christian has an Advantage for he learns the means and skills by which he avoids giving offence to anyone, and he is assisted by God towards remedying all his past offences!

Kobojunkie:
The problem is not that I did not answer your question but instead that you are having difficulty grasping the meaning in the answer given you.

now you've deciphered what's happening then answer me in clear terms, does he love them??

Dtruthspeaker:


That is what Judgement Day is about, it is the Day Of Offences and Reward Good for Good, wickedness for wickedness!

It is the day all who have Offended shall stand Accused.

So thus, if you have lived your life Offending NO ONE, then No One shall Accuse you on that day. But this is not attainable by any soul, everyone Offends everyone and has so offended someone else.

This, this is where the True Christian has an Advantage for he learns the means and skills by which he avoids giving offence to anyone, and he is assisted by God towards remedying all his past offences!

so I'm not going to hell...
thanks a lot for clarifying

FirstSon01:


so I'm not going to hell...
thanks a lot for clarifying

Only if you do not have Anyone including God to Accuse you of Having Committed An Offence!

FirstSon01:
now you've deciphered what's happening then answer me in clear terms, does he love them??

As I said...

Kobojunkie:
The part in bold is not according to the Bible but according to your "special interpretation" of what is in fact written in the Bible. So, how you expect anyone to process that, bullsheet, of yours here as far as love is concerned?
Anyone who has ever read the Bible at least knows that God is love and His actions are all Love in action and Love should never be compared with Man's Man's Man's and ideas of Love. So, you failed when you believed it should.

FirstSon01:
Many times when walking down the street you may have been accosted by people from various Christian Churches of different denominations speaking to you about God's love with a popular phrase "God loves you", in retrospect and putting all emotional sentiments aside the "God's love" spoken about is somewhat ironical to the definition of love.
A very acceptable definition of someone you love is someone whom you wouldn't want to be hurt or hurt so why does god have a hell fire??
According to the Bible god loves everyone and would do anything to protect, provide and care for you as long as you accept him as your "lord and personal saviour" but wouldn't fail to send you to burn forever in never ending lake of fire if you don't accept him and even if you accept him and do everything for him you could still end up in perpetual pain and suffering forever if you tell a lie to save a teen from being lynched by a bloodthirsty mob by the time his "trumpet" sounds.
So is this love?

Firstson's Tales

Hi again.

On your other thread, you asked why God sent His Son to die for human beings. I already offered an answer there. Here though, it seems harder to give you an answer that will not result in unpleasantness. Nonetheless, I'll try.

I'm not sure on what authority you define love as you do. People love their children and still discipline them when they misbehave in order to prevent them from falling into bad patterns of behavior that might destroy their lives later on. I wouldn't say that their love is a lie because of that, would you?

I wonder too if you would say that a soldier who puts his life on the line to kill people who are trying to either kill or enslave his compatriots is not loving because he kills these other people.

Therefore, I can't agree with your definition of love.

Why does God have a hell fire? Because He loves the creation that He made. Not everyone does. Some people want to destroy the beautiful creation that He made. Some people only know how to inflict suffering on themselves and everything around them. Why must God's love then force Him to let these people share eternity with others whom they will only continue to do harm to? What kind of love is that?

The Lake of Fire exists to separate those who hate God and His world from those who love Him and His world. That too is God's Love.

Ihedinobi3:


Hi again.

On your other thread, you asked why God sent His Son to die for human beings. I already offered an answer there. Here though, it seems harder to give you an answer that will not result in unpleasantness. Nonetheless, I'll try.

I'm not sure on what authority you define love as you do. People love their children and still discipline them when they misbehave in order to prevent them from falling into bad patterns of behavior that might destroy their lives later on. I wouldn't say that their love is a lie because of that, would you?

I wonder too if you would say that a soldier who puts his life on the line to kill people who are trying to either kill or enslave his compatriots is not loving because he kills these other people.

Therefore, I can't agree with your definition of love.

Why does God have a hell fire? Because He loves the creation that He made. Not everyone does. Some people want to destroy the beautiful creation that He made. Some people only know how to inflict suffering on themselves and everything around them. Why must God's love then force Him to let these people share eternity with others whom they will only continue to do harm to? What kind of love is that?

The Lake of Fire exists to separate those who hate God and His world from those who love Him and His world. That too is God's Love.

hi again ,
well this is logical to an extent but not so logical, you can't equate or quantify correcting a child (which some African parents do extremely though causing lifetime trauma on their kids) to lifetime torture.
what I'm asking is different from answer, I'm asking if god loves the jebusites that he told the Israelites to annihilate for their land?

FirstSon01:


hi again ,
well this is logical to an extent but not so logical, you can't equate or quantify correcting a child (which some African parents do extremely though causing lifetime trauma on their kids) to lifetime torture.
what I'm asking is different from answer, I'm asking if god loves the jebusites that he told the Israelites to annihilate for their land?

I'm not sure I see where the Jebusites showed up in your post. I'm only just seeing them here for the first time.

Also, I did not equate correcting a child to lifetime torture. I was only disagreeing with your definition of love. It is not God's love for unbelievers that sends them to the Lake of Fire. Rather, it is His Love for believers that sends unbelievers to the Lake of Fire.

His Love for unbelievers is what gives them every opportunity here in this life to avoid that fate.

Ihedinobi3:


I'm not sure I see where the Jebusites showed up in your post. I'm only just seeing them here for the first time.

Also, I did not equate correcting a child to lifetime torture. I was only disagreeing with your definition of love. It is not God's love for unbelievers that sends them to the Lake of Fire. Rather, it is His Love for believers that sends unbelievers to the Lake of Fire.

His Love for unbelievers is what gives them every opportunity here in this life to avoid that fate.

you equated raping a little girl to me not wanting to accept god's religion (or way of life if you may please)


and if he loves the unbelievers why doesn't he let them be?? I don't see why I should rot in hell forever even when I don't do anything bad or hurt anyone before but just because I chose to be atheist.

FirstSon01:


you equated raping a little girl to me not wanting to accept god's religion (or way of life if you may please)


and if he loves the unbelievers why doesn't he let them be?? I don't see why I should rot in hell forever even when I don't do anything bad or hurt anyone before but just because I chose to be atheist.

Please, try to avoid putting words in my mouth. As courteous as I want to be in order to have a decent conversation with you, I do take exception to false accusations among other bad behavior in conversation. As I always say, you don't have to believe anything I say, but you certainly shouldn't ascribe things to me that I didn't say.

I made clear before and in my most recent post what I was equating to what. If you disagree with my comparison, then point out why you do. That is all you need to do.

I have explained this question as clearly as I know how to. If something is still unclear to you in my answers, I will gladly try again. But I can't repeat myself forever. It won't do you or me any good. All I have said is that the Lake of Fire is exactly what you are asking for when you insist that God leave you to your own devices. The issue with that demand is that when you get it, it won't be everything you hoped that it would be.

Everything good is God's gift. He made it all. You did not. If you want it, then you need to be friends with Him. You can't rob Him of any of it. That is simply impossible. If you try to remove Him from any of it, you will end up with none of it. That is what the Lake of Fire means.

Well God is love as seen in Jesus. Jesus showed what love is by laying down his life for his friends and his nation and by a great extension the world. He laid down his life so his gospel can prevail.

Hellfire is gnashing of teeth and regret in the afterlife by those who cannot partake in the kingdom of God .

Every other thing you wrote about God threatening you to accept him or go to Hellfire are from your own imaginations. Hell is more like a state of corruption or death which you enter into naturally when you remain in sin.

Ihedinobi3:


Please, try to avoid putting words in my mouth. As courteous as I want to be in order to have a decent conversation with you, I do take exception to false accusations among other bad behavior in conversation. As I always say, you don't have to believe anything I say, but you certainly shouldn't ascribe things to me that I didn't say.

I made clear before and in my most recent post what I was equating to what. If you disagree with my comparison, then point out why you do. That is all you need to do.

I have explained this question as clearly as I know how to. If something is still unclear to you in my answers, I will gladly try again. But I can't repeat myself forever. It won't do you or me any good. All I have said is that the Lake of Fire is exactly what you are asking for when you insist that God leave you to your own devices. The issue with that demand is that when you get it, it won't be everything you hoped that it would be.

Everything good is God's gift. He made it all. You did not. If you want it, then you need to be friends with Him. You can't rob Him of any of it. That is simply impossible. If you try to remove Him from any of it, you will end up with none of it. That is what the Lake of Fire means.

@ your first sentence- I'm sorry if I misconstrued you

@ your last sentence- does that make hell a figurative expression??

and then when I mean to be left alone I meant on Earth and not forcibly taken to hell, secondly if god is omnipotent then he should have known right from time that I was going to deny him right?? why still create me to come suffer for what was going to happen nonetheless?

GeneralDae:
Well God is love as seen in Jesus. Jesus showed what love is by laying down his life for his friends and his nation and by a great extension the world. He laid down his life so his gospel can prevail.

Hellfire is gnashing of teeth and regret in the afterlife by those who cannot partake in the kingdom of God .

Every other thing you wrote about God threatening you to accept him or go to Hellfire are from your own imaginations. Hell is more like a state of corruption or death which you enter into naturally when you remain in sin.

no, that's wrong
your bible says if I fail to accept Christ as my lord and savior I'll go to hell wether or not I've been a good person on Earth.

secondly god created hell himself to send people who don't agree with him to.

Dtruthspeaker:


Only if you do not have Anyone including God to Accuse you of Having Committed An Offence!

so if no one accuses me of wrongdoing I'll go to heaven right??

FirstSon01:


so if no one accuses me of wrongdoing I'll go to heaven right??

You Already have A Continents Full of Accusers and an earthfull Full of Offences, so no if situation for you!

FirstSon01:


no, that's wrong
your bible says if I fail to accept Christ as my lord and savior I'll go to hell wether or not I've been a good person on Earth.

secondly god created hell himself to send people who don't agree with him to.

Where did the bible say that? can you quote it for me?

FirstSon01:


@ your first sentence- I'm sorry if I misconstrued you

@ your last sentence- does that make hell a figurative expression??

and then when I mean to be left alone I meant on Earth and not forcibly taken to hell, secondly if god is omnipotent then he should have known right from time that I was going to deny him right?? why still create me to come suffer for what was going to happen nonetheless?

The Lake of Fire is not figurative at all. I'm not sure why anything I said should give you the idea that it might be.

As for leaving you on Earth and not putting you in the Lake of Fire, the question again is "why?" The Earth belongs to God, not to you. So if you insist on being His enemy, why should He let you share it with Him and His family?

As for creating you knowing what you would choose, that was His prerogative as God, wasn't it? You get to decide for yourself what your relationship with God will be, but God gets to create whatever and whoever He wants. Do you wish to deny Him His right just because you want to assert yours? Does that make any sense to you?