Lazyyouth4u:


What if war happens? What if a military government comes in and refuses to honour the bonds? What if hyperinflation happens like what happened in Zim?

If war happens u invest in war bonds na if a military govt refuses to honour the bonds, thats bad news for the country

With hyperinflation, you would have seen the signs in economic indicators which qould give u time to adjust. Govt ceasing ur land is instant with little time to adjust.

But as u said each asset class has its benefits and demerits

OgogoroFreak:
I know this is difficult for you to understand which is the exact reason I said, YOU DON'T THINK DEEP ENOUGH.

What has this got to do with inflation? I don’t blame you sha. All the ashawo house calculation don dagbaru your brain

Lazyyouth4u:


What has this got to do with inflation? I don’t blame you sha. All the ashawo house calculation don dagbaru your brain

your 90k in tbills is guaranteed after one year.

I converted my Naira to USD last year at the rate of 360 to invest in us equity but today after one year, what ever USD left in my US investment would be converted to Naira at the rate of 495.

These compound interest calculations are giving me orgasms o but how does one achieve it with stocks? I currently never sell any of my stocks but I would like to know how one can leverage compound returns on equities apart from re-investing dividends which I already do.

This bonds seem like an alternate asset I should consider sha because to be honest na proper Island wey I for like to do real estate in Lagos, but my money no reach to buy lands for there

OgogoroFreak:
your 90k in tbills is guaranteed after one year.

I converted my Naira to USD last year at the rate of 360 but today after one year, what ever USD left in my US investment would be converted to Naira at the rate of 495.

Oga, what I was doing there was to show that you will not always beat investing in Naira instruments when you buy US equities. There are situations where someone with Naira t bills will come out tops due to the volatility of the US equities market. Never did I say Naira investments were better.

I know you are just trying to get back at me because I pointed out your stupid audio lamba of making 1 million dollars from bitc0ins but you are not even sharp enough to do that well

Also emmanuelewumi and Lazyyouth, these bonds is there a way to buy them remotely or you gat go bank physically?

For me, ease of management is as important as fund performance

Lazyyouth4u:


And then at the end of the 30 year tenor, the bond investor gets his 100m while the real estate investor sells his house/land for 1 billion

If the bond investor want to diversify into real estate, he will make N100 million in 5 years which he can use to buy a property. In 30 years time he will get his capital and a house.

How about that

Tobex4realTobex234:
These compound interest calculations are giving me orgasms o but how does one achieve it with stocks? I currently never sell any of my stocks but I would like to know how one can leverage compound returns on equities apart from re-investing dividends which I already do.

This bonds seem like an alternate asset I should consider sha because to be honest na proper Island wey I for like to do real estate in Lagos, but my money no reach to buy lands for there

You compound by buying dips and DCA

emmanuelewumi:



If the bond investor want to diversify into real estate, he will make N100 million in 5 years which he can use to buy a property. In 30 years time he will get his capital and a house.

How about that

The real estate investor will collect his rents and buy bonds and in 30 years, he will have two houses and a bond instrument

To be honest, I never said one was better. Both have pros and cons and it’s up to the investor to pick the one that suits him or her better.

You now get the general idea with the slight clarification below in the second paragraph.

ojesymsym:
Oh I see what you mean. On the bond side using the 15% lot, at the end of the 20th year, the 1M will have yielded 1M + 12.2993M. - Correct

Then the coupons or interest themselves would yield another 1.8M if it is invested in other instruments that are able to also provide same investment interest rate.
Not quite. The 1.8M is compounded interest of the coupon payment interest by the 20th year

But it is almost impossible to reinvest your bond interest within the bond itself, or am I missing something?

skydiver01:
You now get the general idea with the slight clarification below in the second paragraph.

Not quite. The 1.8M is compounded interest of the coupon payment interest by the 20th year

Lazyyouth4u:


The real estate investor will collect his rents and buy bonds and in 30 years, he will have two houses and a bond instrument

To be honest, I never said one was better. Both have pros and cons and it’s up to the investor to pick the one that suits him or her better.

His rent of about 12 years will get N140 million, while coupon of about 12 years compounded @ 15% would have produced N460 million.

ojesymsym:
But it is almost impossible to reinvest your bond interest within the bond itself, or am I missing something?

Secondary market. These are the offers sent to me this morning

Compound interest seems unbelievable until you see the chart. Even small 10k per year when compounded at 10% ror 30 years, you will be shocked at the returns when you run the calculation.

Tobex4realTobex234:
These compound interest calculations are giving me orgasms o but how does one achieve it with stocks? I currently never sell any of my stocks but I would like to know how one can leverage compound returns on equities apart from re-investing dividends which I already do.

This bonds seem like an alternate asset I should consider sha because to be honest na proper Island wey I for like to do real estate in Lagos, but my money no reach to buy lands for there

emmanuelewumi:


Which of the assets are you looking at? You can only have a bubble after a prolonged bull.

The bull has passed in rental income.

The bull may still be existent in Lagos and Abuja and few highbrow areas along major roads per city.

Any little drive into an untarred road, your property sheds value.

Okay. Which goes back to how I understood his case study the first time. You now have to manually reinvest the bond returns annually.

emmanuelewumi:



Secondary market. These are the offers sent to me this morning

emmanuelewumi:



I am very sorry, I apologise on his behalf.

You are trying hard not to hurt this your boyfriend lazyyouth with the truth, apologising to a boy because of a continuous e-banters, you guys are just the e-version of some jobless people that engage in endless blabbering at the junctions with the newspapers vendors.

All these real estate arguments. There was a time I could swear that building a house was one of the best investments. I have since changed that position.

The rent our tenants in our home town pays for their apartment cannot pay the rent in a city like Lagos, Ph or Abuja. That is if they even agree to pay on time.

Those who I personally think make money in real estate are those who buy old houses in good locations, destroy those houses, build modern houses, sell the houses at around 40% interest and then look for the next house to recycle the process. All these tenant rent wahala, house maintenance will not make anyone rich if you ask me.

I also noticed that I have never seen a form where landlord is an option as part of the list of available occupations, I wonder why.

emmanuelewumi:



His rent of about 12 years will get N140 million, while coupon of about 12 years compounded @ 15% would have produced N460 million.

After 12 years, the Oga with the house may just be able to sell it for 500m with the way inflation is going. Then he will have 640m in his account

The Oga with the bond will probably sell the bond at a discount and maybe get 80m for the bond (and this is generous). In his account, he will have 540m

Another con for bonds is that you have to hold it till maturity if you want to get the full benefits. Make mistake and sell it before maturity when interest rates are high and you will have to sell it at a discount.

Brainbox0806:


You are trying hard not to hurt this your boyfriend lazyyouth with the truth, apologising to a boy because of a continuous e-banters, you guys are just the e-version of some jobless people that engage in endless blabbering at the junctions with the newspapers vendors.

Talk true. No lie. If you see job you go dey drive Uber? No be joblessness make you go borrow money to buy car so that your poor children no go starve?

At least we are not out in the sun driving Uber and taking insults from Lasma and riders to feed our hungry families.

If you were not a bitter and frustrated soul, you would learn a thing or two from the debate.

Lazyyouth4u:


Oga, what I was doing there was to show that you will not always beat investing in Naira instruments when you buy US equities. There are situations where someone with Naira t bills will come out tops due to the volatility of the US equities market. Never did I say Naira investments were better.

I know you are just trying to get back at me because I pointed out your stupid audio lamba of making 1 million dollars from bitc0ins but you are not even sharp enough to do that well

Lmao!

You think I take vituperations and bile especially from an online entity seriously? I even forgot you made such statement. I say what I have to say. You believe? Fine. You don't believe? Fine. Either ways, we move regardless. It doesn't change a thing.

Life is a journey and an investment portfolio that will be useful in future takes time to build. The beauty of this thread, I feel, is how over the years it has grown from being a TBill only discussion thread to one encompassing and discussing all or most asset classes (Nigerian shares, US shares, FX, real estate, REITs, Eurobonds etc etc). They all have an underlying theme. They are income generating and encourage us all to invest during our active years to make all our lives more comfortable in future in whichever way we choose to live our lives (long life allowing of course). I am not suggesting one does not live as comfortably as one can today or during our active lives, I am merely pointing out that it gladdens me to see how this thread has over the years made more people become aware of some of the benefits of investing.

The above said, the healthy discussions over different investing strategies (short-term, mid or long-term) are great although I do think it can all be had without insulting anyone with the exception of great sarcasm. I find great sarcasm healthy for the soul just as laughter is.

OgogoroFreak:
Lmao!

You think I take vituperations and Bile especially from an online entity seriously? I even forgot you made such statement. I say what I have to say. You believe? Fine. You don't believe? Fine. Both ways, we move regardless. It doesn't change a thing.

Deep down in your mind of minds, you know the truth. That’s all I will say

Alright, gentlemen. Since one is reinvesting the coupons to compound what stops the other from reinvesting the rents to compound too especially since coupons are not automatically reinvested?

Lazyyouth4u:


People that bought houses 30 years ago in decent locations are selling them for much more than 10x purchase price today. The house doesn’t even have to be in good condition.

Go and learn about inflation and do your damn homework before trying to get into discussions that are way above what your brain can take.

Anybody who owns a rental property knows you are off point.

Lazyyouth4u:


Deep down in your mind of minds, you know the truth. That’s all I will say

Sure I did know the truth that YOU DON'T THINK DEEP ENOUGH.

I only pity those who would take any investment stuff you said seriously and acted on it.

400billionman:


Anybody who owns a rental property knows you are off point.

Oh I’m talking off point when I say people that bought properties 30 years ago are selling them for more than 10x?

Someone that bought a house for way less than a million Naira in Ikeja, Surulere or Yaba in 1990 is not selling that house for anything less than 20m today. I am not guessing. I know this for a fact.

otomatic:
Alright, gentlemen. Since one is reinvesting the coupons to compound what stops the other from reinvesting the rents to compound too especially since coupons are not automatically reinvested?

The difference is the amount to reinvest, one will have N5 million and the other will have N14 million.


It will take one about 5 years to get his capital back through cash flow reinvestment, while it will take the other 14 years or 12 years assuming rent increased annually at 5%

Lazyyouth4u:


Talk true. If you see better job you go dey drive Uber? No be joblessness make you go borrow money to buy car so that your poor children no go starve?

.

Na small pikin dey worry you, your emptiness can't be measured by the size of your accounts, you are just a young dum.b broke high-school boy.

emmanuelewumi:



The difference is the amount to reinvest, one will have N5 million and the other will have N14 million.


It will take one about 5 years to get his capital back through cash flow reinvestment, while it will take the other 14 years or 12 years assuming rent increased annually at 5%

I don’t mean to overflog this issue but the same inflation that will allow you to keep reinvesting your coupons at 15% will also make the house’s value to keep rising and that is the koko for anyone that owns any decent ‘real’ asset in times of inflation.

Seriously, instead of being happy about government borrowing all this money and keeping rates high, I would be more worried about government’s ability to pay the interest and principal when the time comes. And what my bond principal repayment can purchase in 30 years

If government decides to print money to meet these obligations ehn...

emmanuelewumi:



Secondary market. These are the offers sent to me this morning

What is the minimum capital for this bond ?

Does it pay interest in monthly advance or annual advance ?

400billionman:


What is the minimum capital for this bond ?

Does it pay interest in monthly advance or annual advance ?

In the primary market, you will need N50 million.

In the secondary market, you will need about 100k, if you buy through Stanbic IBTC Bank others will require between N1 million and N20 million