sonmvayina:


Lol....very laughable.

Who is arguing with you. Like I said earlier why would a 10 years old be arguing with a400 level chemistry student about air.. you are arguing a woman just magically missed her period without the input of a man. I am pointing to you that the story falls under mythology.. you are still insisting it was foretold. You keep quoting passages that do not relate to your point. But max must be max. He must always find a way to convince himself ...

To your tent oh Israel.

Well i'm from Abéòkúta, Ògùn State, Nigeria in Africa not Israel!

MaxInDHouse:

The truth is the Jews never accepted any incumbent prophet until he is long gone.

When a person claims GOD spoke to them the Jews don't just fall for such like Christains do.
1. How did the Jews know Moses is a true Prophet of GOD:
Exodus 19:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever. And Moses told the words of the people unto the LORD.

Notice here that the people all heard GOD speaking to Moses. This is why the Jews believe Moses is a true prophet of GOD.

So if the Jews did not believe the other prophets after Moses that just come and say to them God spoke to them, then the Jews have a very valid reason not to believe the other prophets till their prophecies have come to pass.

The jews don't believe in personal revelation....

MindHacker9000:

Notice here that the people all heard GOD speaking to Moses. This is why the Jews believe Moses is a true prophet of GOD.

[url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Exodus%2024%3A1-3&version=NIV&interface=amp]These people[/url]? Nice try!

budaatum:

[url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Exodus%2024%3A1-3&version=NIV&interface=amp]These people[/url]? Nice try!

Nice try to twist this!

Does Exodus 19:9 not come before Exodus 24:1-3

Exodus 19:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever. And Moses told the words of the people unto the LORD.

So from this event the people were sure Moses is a true prophet of GOD to this day

MindHacker9000:


Nice try to twist this!

Does Exodus 19:9 not come before Exodus 24:1-3

Exodus 19:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever. And Moses told the words of the people unto the LORD.

So from this event the people were sure Moses was a true prophet of GOD to this day

So people saw "a thick clowd" and claimed they saw God and you believe them?

Don't you think Moses did a lot more than that they had seen that could have been enough for them to think he might be a prophet?

Nee testament is not scriptures.....budaatum, take note..

budaatum:

So people saw "a thick clowd" and claimed they saw God and you believe them?
Don't you think Moses did a lot more than that they had seen that could have been enough for them to think he might be a prophet?

Another nice try to twist the verse again!

Notice that GOD said: "I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever."
God did not say that the people may see HIM.

Exodus 19:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever. And Moses told the words of the people unto the LORD.

MindHacker9000:


Another nice try to twist the verse again!

Notice that GOD said: "I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever."
God did not say that the people may see HIM.

The people did not hear God. It was Moses, we read, who told them what God commanded him to tell them:

So Moses went back and summoned the elders of the people and set before them all the words the Lord had commanded him to speak. Exodus 19:7

Then the people saw a dense cloud and believed him.

9 The Lord said to Moses, “I am going to come to you in a dense cloud, so that the people will hear me speaking with you and will always put their trust in you.” Then Moses told the Lord what the people had said.

At no time did the people see or hear God except that which Moses told them.

25 So Moses went down to the people and told them.

budaatum:

The people did not hear God. It was Moses, we read, who told them what God commanded him to tell them:
So Moses went back and summoned the elders of the people and set before them all the words the Lord had commanded him to speak. Exodus 19:7
Then the people saw a dense cloud and believed him.
9 The Lord said to Moses, “I am going to come to you in a dense cloud, so that the people will hear me speaking with you and will always put their trust in you.” Then Moses told the Lord what the people had said.
At no time did the people see or hear God except that which Moses told them.
25 So Moses went down to the people and told them.

If you read further on to Exodus 20:18-19 & 22 you'll find that the people saw GOD talking to Moses and GOD also confirmed this in verse 22 "Then the Lord said to Moses, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel: ‘You have seen that I have talked with you from heaven"

Exodus 20:18-19 & 22
18 "Now all the people witnessed the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking; and when the people saw it, they trembled and stood afar off. 19 Then they said to Moses, “You speak with us, and we will hear; but let not God speak with us,"
22 Then the Lord said to Moses, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel: ‘You have seen that I have talked with you from heaven

MindHacker9000:
Exodus 20:18 & 22
18 "Now all the people witnessed the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking; and when the people saw it, they trembled and stood afar off. 19 Then they said to Moses, “You speak with us, and we will hear; but let not God speak with us,"
22 Then the Lord said to Moses, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel: ‘You have seen that I have talked with you from heaven

Hack what you read please.

Are you suggesting the language of God that was very distinct when we read Moses heard God was, "the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking" that the people saw?

Apart from the fact that they obviously did not hear nor see any God (except perhaps for Ogun the God of Thunder), do you seriously believe evidence provided by those who "trembled and stood afar off"?

Sonmvayina, can you see even God coming from what you call "pagan" as opposed to what I'd call the religion of understanding what you read?

MindHacker9000:


When a person claims GOD spoke to them the Jews don't just fall for such like Christains do.
1. How did the Jews know Moses is a true Prophet of GOD:
Exodus 19:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever. And Moses told the words of the people unto the LORD.

Notice here that the people all heard GOD speaking to Moses. This is why the Jews believe Moses is a true prophet of GOD.

So if the Jews did not believe the other prophets after Moses that just come and say to them God spoke to them, then the Jews have a very valid reason not to believe the other prophets till their prophecies have come to pass.

My guy, there was nothing like Jews during the time of Moses!
It was a nation of twelve tribes:
Reuben
Simeon
Levi
Judah
Zebulun
Issachar
Dan
Gad
Asher
Naphtali
Joseph
Benjamin
It was 400 years after this people travelled to Egypt that their God decided to free them from slavery under the world power of that time (Egypt)
No god has ever done such a thing in the history of mankind. All the gods known back then only use humans to conquer in order to secure more slaves (worshipers)
But the God of Israel came from nowhere and demanded that the world's most powerful nation of the time release the slave that's been serving them for close to 400 years!
That's why this God said:

Jehovah then said to Moses: “See, I have made you like God to Pharʹaoh, and Aaron your own brother will become your prophet" Exodus 7:1
This God said He is making Moses like God to Pharaoh who was also revered as God in his day!
This God used Moses to perform many mighty works yet the stiff-necked people (Israelites) rebelled against Moses all through. Only few ones among them believed Moses that's why their God said all those above 20 years of age will not step their foot on the land He promised them! Numbers 32:11
It was because Moses gave them laws, instructed them to kill whoever fails to live by it, went up to the mountain, died there, never returned to them and nobody knew where he was buried till today.
That why all later generations began to acknowledge Moses as the greatest of all prophets in the history of their nation.
The twelve tribes splitter into two nations, ten tribes separated from the twelve and formed another nation in the northern part of Israel, this is the nation later known to as "Samaritans" while the other two ruling tribes who wanted to remain loyal to their rulers (Judah and Benjamin) were referred to as "Jews", the Levites who serves in the temple at Jerusalem had no choice so they remained with the ruling tribes in Jerusalem.
That's how three tribes became what we now know as JEWS. No man from those ten tribes will ever agree to be called a Jew because they don't belong to the southern kingdom of three tribes!
So don't deceive yourself majority of the Israelites never believe any incumbent prophet of the true God not even Moses during his life time!

budaatum:


Hack what you read please.

Are you suggesting the language of God that was very distinct when we read Moses heard God was, "the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking" that the people saw?

Apart from the fact that they obviously did not hear nor see any God (except perhaps for Ogun the God of Thunder), do you seriously believe evidence provided by those who "trembled and stood afar off"?

Sonmvayina, can you see even God coming from what you call "pagan" as opposed to what I'd call the religion of understanding what you read?

I clearly understand, but I sincerely doubt you do.

We are not present when does things or events occurred. All we try to do is to make sense of context.

Which I have always advocated, hence I opened the thread " the letter killeth" but people like MaxInDHouse and Co will want to try and interprete them literally ....and even you sometimes..

sonmvayina:


I clearly understand, but I sincerely doubt you do.

We are not present when does things or events occurred. All we try to do is to make sense of context.

That context will include the minds of those who "trembled and stood afar off" when they heard "the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking", and the minds of those who wrote the story, and the minds of those who now read it and claim they heard God, along with just about every major thought on the book and the written word throughout the history of time, and our collective context, and our individual personal contexts too plus some.

Its not like your context is my context (perhaps due to different schooling, upbringing, effort, capability, interests, resources, time, location, etc), and we obviously do not place the words we've been using in the same context, as you must have noticed.

That's why I like Jesus by the way. He is written to have said, "love your God", which many do claim they do, then he added, "love your neighbour", which most think they do though they don't bother with their neighbours context.

I'm glad we are evolving in our understanding of the Prophet Einstein's Relativity.

budaatum:


That context will include the minds of those who "trembled and stood afar off" when they heard "the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking", and the minds of those who wrote the story, and the minds of those who now read it and claim they heard God, along with just about every major thought on the book and the written word throughout the history of time, and our collective context, and our individual personal contexts too plus some.

Its not like your context is my context (perhaps due to different schooling, upbringing, effort, capability, interests, resources, time, location, etc), and we obviously do not place the words we've been using in the same context, as you must have noticed.

That's why I like Jesus by the way. He is written to have said, "love your God", which many do claim they do, then he added, "love your neighbour", which most think they do though they don't bother with their neighbours context.

I'm glad we are evolving in our understanding of the Prophet Einstein's Relativity

How old are you? Please oblige me..

Just give me a range

sonmvayina:


How old are you? Please oblige me..

Just give me a range

Why? Would what I write change meaning by my age or will it make you regard more what I write, neither which I desire as I'd rather you maintain your objectivity?

How old are you?

budaatum:


Why? Would what I write change meaning by my age or will it make you regard more what I write, neither which I desire as I'd rather you maintain your objectivity?

How old are you?

It's rude to answer a question with a question ...

I don't want actual age...just give me a range of 5 years....

You write and reason like a teenager....I might be wrong.

budaatum:


That context will include the minds of those who "trembled and stood afar off" when they heard "the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking", and the minds of those who wrote the story, and the minds of those who now read it and claim they heard God, along with just about every major thought on the book and the written word throughout the history of time, and our collective context, and our individual personal contexts too plus some.

Its not like your context is my context (perhaps due to different schooling, upbringing, effort, capability, interests, resources, time, location, etc), and we obviously do not place the words we've been using in the same context, as you must have noticed.

That's why I like Jesus by the way. He is written to have said, "love your God", which many do claim they do, then he added, "love your neighbour", which most think they do though they don't bother with their neighbours context.

I'm glad we are evolving in our understanding of the Prophet Einstein's Relativity.

Einstein didn't see your watchamacallit use of words such that the person who hears you has to wonder what your ambition is whenever you say whatever you say.......it would have been worth it if you were rather concerned with stating your position or lack of anything to say concerning certain things only instead of using words like someone that is hell-bent on screwing someone's mind till it becomes irreparably screwed up...







Wetin remain?

sonmvayina:


It's rude to answer a question with a question ...

Glad to see you didn't answer my question with a question then.

sonmvayina:
I don't want actual age...just give me a range of 5 years....

You write and reason like a teenager....I might be wrong.

Then let buda be considered a teenager by you. buda will live.

HellVictorinho3:
Wetin remain?

Merry Christmas

Saw this while bringing up scriptures to back up my post but my view has now shifted to a mixture of both New and Old Testament as GOD is very merciful in the New Testament.

budaatum:

That context will include the minds of those who "trembled and stood afar off" when they heard "the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking", and the minds of those who wrote the story, and the minds of those who now read it and claim they heard God, along with just about every major thought on the book and the written word throughout the history of time, and our collective context, and our individual personal contexts too plus some.

When you see Moses standing and talking to GOD inside "the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking" you won't need me to convince you that GOD is the one speaking to Moses

MindHacker9000:


When you see Moses standing and talking to GOD inside "the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking" you won't need me to convince you that GOD is the one speaking to Moses

Unfortunately for me, all I currently have is a book so I better open my eyes when reading it.

MindHacker9000:
Saw this while bringing up scriptures to back up my post but my view has now shifted to a mixture of both New and Old Testament as GOD is very merciful in the New Testament.

You hacked your mind. Praise God!

What you posted shows those people would have trembled and covered their eyes and ears to God if God but spoke or appeared before them. I mean, hear them,

18 When the people saw the thunder and lightning and heard the trumpet and saw the mountain in smoke, they trembled with fear. They stayed at a distance 19 and said to Moses, “Speak to us yourself and we will listen. But do not have God speak to us or we will die.”

See below those who dared to see God. Or rather, those God is written to have had mercy on to allow God to be seen.

budaatum:


Merry Christmas

Support my rap ambition with the amount you can afford



If you can't, don't respond to my word.





2 lines

I know the whole Jesus Messiah story is not real, but if it were real. There was nothing like a virgin birth.

Mary got fuçked by another man and placed the pregnancy on poor Joseph. If only paternity testing was available

MindHacker9000:

When you see Moses standing and talking to GOD inside "the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking" you won't need me to convince you that GOD is the one speaking to Moses

This is exactly what atheists are demanding!
They want God to repeat the miracles they're reading in the Bible before they can BELIEVE (TRUST) in His words.
Well God will not always treat people of all different generations the same way for them to continue believing (trusting) His words.
The word BELIEVE connotes TRUST so God will not continue doing the same thing. WHY?
Because we are intelligent beings who often put trust in what we have seen, heard or read.
Most of the things people believe today are things they heard or read yet they're so much attached to it.
The last time someone insisted that he can't believe a virgin birth because it's impossible, sounds logical right? But the same person wants to argue that God spoke to Moses in the burning bush of green leaves unaffected, turned sticks to snakes, turned a river as big as Nile to blood, made the first born in all Egypt die and spoke to Moses on a mountain that's tearing apart while Moses is standing there and the Israelites were watching from a distance!
The truth of the matter is that majority of humans are FAITHLESS so they only choose what they want to trust in the public but in the secret they will turn they backs.
God is the Supreme Being so the only evidence of God's existence is the group or organization of people practicing what He said that's why God kept correcting the Israelites using many signs for them to BELIEVE (TRUST) in His words then He (God) will present this organized and orderly people as His WITNESSES before anyone as proof of His Godship!

“You are my witnesses,” declares Jehovah, “Yes, my servant whom I have chosen, So that you may know and have faith in me And understand that I am the same One. Before me no God was formed, And after me there has been none. I—I am Jehovah, and besides me there is no savior.” “I am the One who declared and saved and made known When there was no foreign god among you. So you are my witnesses,” declares Jehovah, “and I am God. Isaiah 43:10-12

The point of emphasis here is God presented His organized people before the whole world as the evidence of His Godship.
But Satan is so smart that he keeps promoting rebellion against this order. How? You will think atheists are wrong for not believing God but all those dismissing the idea of ORGANIZED people practicing what their God says in an ORDERLY manner are ATHEISTS. Whatever makes you feel there's no need for people to be taught what they should do as sacred service to God makes you an atheist. But Jesus has given us a wonderful counsel so that we can see their foolishness.
The same sonmvayina who keeps arguing about Christianity wants to prove that the Babylonian Talmud (which the God of Israel detests) is OK. He wants everyone to believe in the Torah that was a Covenant between the God of Israel and His people!
Did the God of Israel send His people out to go and preach the Torah to people of all nations? NO!
The one and only reason why i am putting trust in that God today is Jesus of Nazareth who sent his disciples out to go preaching and teaching people globally. Matthew 28:18-20
So if sonmvayina says Jesus is a myth then there's no way he can convince someone like me that Moses or anything else written in a book is real. That's why i said i'm from Abéòkúta, Ògùn State, Nigeria in Africa i have no business with the God of Israel unless you show me where that same God ordered His people (Israelites) to go and teach people of all nations the Torah!

sonmvayina:


Lol....very laughable.

Who is arguing with you. Like I said earlier why would a 10 years old be arguing with a400 level chemistry student about air.. you are arguing a woman just magically missed her period without the input of a man. I am pointing to you that the story falls under mythology.. you are still insisting it was foretold. You keep quoting passages that do not relate to your point. But max must be max. He must always find a way to convince himself ...

To your tent oh Israel.

Mary was sexually assaulted

sonmvayina:

The deep anxiety of Christians is often revealed in their desperation to convince themselves they aren’t just new-fangled pagans who stole everything from other religions. The virgin birth is a classic example and the fact-challenged ill-logic of trying to deny.

Other pagan deities were also born miraculously of virgins, making the birth of Jesus nothing new in the history of world religions. Horus, Osirus, Mithras, Dionysus, Krishna, and others all fit this description. In fact, as it is often claimed, there are also heroes and historical figures like Ion, Romulus, Asclepius, and Alexander the Great who were believed to be the generation of gods and virgin women.

Or Joseph might just be the father..

Naahhh, it's all roman/Greek mythology..

Before you conclude try to know the timeline of all this people you mentioned. Did they come after Jesus or bf. then you would know who copied who.

budaatum:

Unfortunately for me, all I currently have is a book so I better open my eyes when reading it.

Fortunately all the people saw GOD talking to Moses so the Jews are sure till today that God spoke to Moses as they have continued to pass this great event on from generation to generation. This is the reason the Jews cannot be deceived by the virgin birth and the resurrection.

If the virgin conception and the resurrection had happened inside "the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking" and all the people of Israel saw it including all the Romans occupying Israel at the time, then surely there will be no doubts in their minds then and till now that the virgin birth and the resurrection did take place.

MaxInDHouse:

This is exactly what atheists are demanding!

And this demand is not too much for them to ask for. In 334 BC, Alexander the great, King of Macedonia, began one of the greatest military campaigns in history against the superpower of the age - the Persian Empire. No European today will doubt this greatest military campaigns 334 years before the birth of Jesus, because alot of people were involved just as no Jew today will doubt that God sopke to Moses bacause all the People saw "the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking"

Without such great events seen by all the people, how do you tell if you are not being deceived by a magician?

MrCEO69:


Before you conclude try to know the timeline of all this people you mentioned. Did they come after Jesus or bf. then you would know who copied who.

Are you for real...?