Dtruthspeaker:


See, another CHANGE OF POST all because you want to avoid The Truth I have laid before you.

The question was "Which Spirit does God have, that He would give, when He gives? Is it an Unholy one?" Now you have Changed it to "WHY The Holy Spirit was given" which no one asked!

You do not have any valid way to go!

Lol...I was only telling u wat happened after the fall of man that corrupted his holiness and sanctity of his sport
Or
What do u think is the Consequence of the fall of man in Genesis 3 to his spirit?

Be true to urself...u don't av to admit it...but go and reread our chat and think deeply about it with the scriptures beside u

immaculatesense:

Now u said...every man created have the holy spirit at creation...

There is no Re-argument after a debate is concluded! It's Res judicata!

immaculatesense:

Lol...I was only telling u wat happened

It was completely unnecessary, Stick to the issue of the debate without deviation and departures. That's how debates work!

Dtruthspeaker:


See, another CHANGE OF POST all because you want to avoid The Truth I have laid before you.

The question was "Which Spirit does God have, that He would give, when He gives? Is it an Unholy one?" Now you have Changed it to "WHY The Holy Spirit was given" which no one asked!

You do not have any valid way to go!

I only explained the fall of man to u and wat led to his corruption...that av an adverse consequence on his spirit...
Or
What do u think is the Consequence of the fall of man in Genesis 3 to his spirit?
Lol...pls take heed to my advice...u may disclaim it on this forum and I accept for reasons best known to u...but wen it's u alone...work on them and u see a better u

Dtruthspeaker:


There is no Re-argument after a debate is concluded! It's Res judicata!

Lol...I gat u...but I understand...
U are great bro...I love u brother

immaculatesense:

I only explained the fall of man to u and wat led to his corruption...

You did not need to! IT WAS NOT THE ISSUE OF THE DEBATE. Learn to Stick to the issue of the debate without deviation and departures. That's how debates work

Open a fresh thread on any issue you wish to debate with me. That's how it works!

Dtruthspeaker:


The spirit of your words says kobojunkie must change by fire and by force. See it

"It is our duty and Joy to keep teaching and praying for them...no soul MUST be lost...even Paul can be saved...him and many more others will come to the light of the truth...WE DONT GIVE UP

Lol...the MUST I used was more of Faith rather than Force...I believewith God all things are possible...not only for Kobojunkie but for all...I love everyone and if it's is possible for me...I would want everyone to be a partaker of the life to come...but who am I...I can only wish and do the best I can both in teaching and in prayer.
Stay alert

Dtruthspeaker:


You did not need to! IT WAS NOT THE ISSUE OF THE DEBATE. Learn to Stick to the issue of the debate without deviation and departures. That's how debates work

Open a fresh thread on any issue you wish to debate with me. That's how it works!

Lol...I know u would wanna run...u didn't tie all the loose ends in ur comment...
Did we receive the holy spirit at Creation or at Salvation?

But u don't need to answer cos any answer u give will contradict one of ur stand or comment u just made...so don't answer...I will save u dat...but please I beseech u to take not of the glitches I mentioned...that's all

immaculatesense:

Lol...I know u would wanna run...u didn't tie all the loose ends in ur comment...

An issue ends when you run to a fresh issue.

Which is why I said raise a new thread if you think you have a valid claim. We would put it down one issue at a time. No new issues, no departure from issue, no invalid arguments, no twistings and bendings and unlawful colourations, no Lies and of course no fallacies.

Dtruthspeaker:


An issue ends when you run to a fresh issue.

Which is why I said raise a new thread if you think you have a valid claim. We would put it down one issue at a time. No new issues, no departure from issue, no invalid arguments, no twistings and bendings and unlawful colourations, no Lies and of course no fallacies.

I don't really like creating thread...I rather I comment...maybe u can mention me on a thread...maybe

From the question you asked, I perceive your from a denomination that believes one has to be born again for a while and fully sanctified, before they can receive the infilling of the Holy Spirit.

Mind you, when a man gets born again, he receives the Person of the Holy Spirit or the indwelling presence in his spirit. (Roms 8:9,11,16)

When a man is filled with the Holy Spirit, he receives the power of the Holy Spirit for service. Acts 1:8

Now this empowerment or infilling is a continuous thing. You can and should get filled continuously till you get to overflowing. Then the Holy Spirit will flow through you to others. This is your responsibility. Acts 4:8,31. Eph 5:18-20

Now to your question, HOW LONG SHOULD ONE WAIT?
Well one thing you have to do is search the scripture whenever you're taught anything from anyone including an Angel or the Lord if he appears to you because he always speak in accordance with his word. If it's not in line with the word, then you have to question the source.

IMMEDIATELY ONE IS BORN AGAIN HE CAN RECEIVE THE INFILLING OF THE HOLY SPIRIT.
He doesnt have to go through any process, he need not beg or cry because just like salvation, the Holy Spirit is a free gift. As a matter of fact the infilling is one of the riches of salvation.

Take a look at Cornelius household. Acts 10 they received the same day they believed.

Look at the Samaritans they received immediately they got born again Acts 8. now some of these people practiced magic, they had unclean spirits, but they received the Holy Spirit immediately the believed.

And lastly in Acts 19 Paul met some of John's followers and asked them if they have received or have been filled with the Holy Spirit but they were amazed, having never heard of any Holy Spirit. But after praying they received.

You don't have to wait, or cry to receive. It is yours. Now for you to be filled, get some one who is filled already with the evidence of speaking in tongues to lay hand's on you or you can just ask in faith believing, and you will receive.

Hallelujah.

Dangerousboy:


Mind you, when a man gets born again, he receives the Person of the Holy Spirit or the indwelling presence in his spirit. (Roms 8:9,11,16)

When a man is filled with the Holy Spirit, he receives the power of the Holy Spirit for service. Acts 1:8

Now this empowerment or infilling is a continuous thing. You can and should get filled continuously till you get to overflowing. Then the Holy Spirit will flow through you to others. This is your responsibility. Acts 4:8,31. Eph 5:18-20

Hallelujah.

Amen! You already have the Holy Spirit within you anyways when you get saved, so why would he hesitate to fill you in the baptism of the Spirit too?

Dtruthspeaker:


Oh Sweet! Someone Sees! All the things and more I wish to say but could not. Eg what if He goes awhoring whilst in Jerusalem, shall he receive it?

No!

No sir, you are adding to that scripture. First off no Christian goes "awhoring".

Second, Jesus command is as simple as it gets. Wait in Jerusalem is wait in Jerusalem; why must we feel the need to add to Jesus' own words, as tho they're not sufficient by themselves?!

Wait in Jerusalem, simple! No more, no less! Jesus' word is Jesus' word! That's all!

Dtruthspeaker:


Like the Day of Pentecost, there is an external change when The Holy Spirit Comes.

I was talking about FEELING something to determine if you have answers to prayers! This is alien to scripture. You DO NOT place emphasis on FEELINGS AT ALL!

One more time, we walk by faith not by feelings or sight!

When you pray for healing, you believe you are healed THE MOMENT YOUR PRAY regardless of whether there is an external manifestation of healing or not. That's the way to receive your healing. Now of course, that faith will eventually produce an external manifestation, which can be immediate or which can be after some time, it'll certainly do so eventually. But that's not what you look for to determine if you've received healing from God! What you look to is, again FAITH!

It is the same with receiving the Spirit. You must NEVER judge with feelings or anything else. Now of course, that faith will ultimately produce some external manifestation for sure, as long as you remain in it, but again, what you look to to determine if you've received is, one more time, FAITH!

We walk by faith not by experiences!

Yes, faith WILL produce experiences, but they aren't what we look to...

Tongues of fire came upon the disciples in Jerusalem, but nowhere else. One person's experiences will vary from another. But one thing remains through it all: FAITH!

WE WALK BY FAITH NOT BY SIGHT!

Dtruthspeaker:


3 or 4 years back he even moved from being slightly pro-God to full blown Anti-God and supported all the works of atheists, with many asking him are you an atheist or something.

Then when he saw God overcoming their arguments he then transformed to the rubbish we see today.

He is definitely still suffering from the mental imbalance he once confessed that he was afflicted with.

That is the story of kobojunkie over the period of time I have seen.

It's a sad story. See how readily i took apart his beliefs and showed it up for the nonsense (stuff that doesn't make sense) that it is. Asking questions he dare cannot answer. But tomorrow will still persist in this foolishness.

I usually do not speak in this way. But I've not seen stuff like this all my life. Quite sad

immaculatesense:

Dear Mikee19
What I told u about the Trinity is the truth about the Trinity...it is real but it had not been taught the way it should...every point I ever make on any topic are Yeah and Amen cos I don't think...I let the Bible still...

It is the truth as far as you know, and you don't know it all. Be humble in what you know. You have only seen arguments from jw doctrine and from others who cannot properly teach what God's word says about it. But like I said i have a thread coming soon..

I will show why some scriptures you've used are improperly used. Then you will see it is really you saying this, not those scriptures. I'll do so in that thread

immaculatesense although I'm trying very hard to not derail this thread since I'll still create that thread, I'll just point out two errors here:

Let's say there are two persons, one holding a gold wristwatch and another just looking at the same gold wristwatch. Both do not consider that wristwatch "something to be grasped" despite the fact that one is already holding on to it and the second is just looking at it in his front. Here's what this means for both parties:

The first person who doesn't consider the wristwatch "something to be grasped", but who somehow was already holding on to it at first (without thinking), can easily let go of it. It's not that important to him. He can just let it go as despite holding it in the first place he doesn't consider it "something to be grasped"

The second person who is just staring at it without yet holding it may never decide to hold it at all since he doesn't consider it "something to be grasped"! In fact he may even mistakenly touch it without knowing. But once he realizes he's touching it, what he doesn't consider "something to be grasped", he can again readily let go of it.

What am I driving at?

You're using that scripture to show Jesus was never equal to God. It DOES NOT say so at all!

All it says is just that he didn't consider equality with God "something to be grasped"!

Now he may or may not have been equal with God before this, but the scripture is silent on it as it isn't its point. The point is simply what Jesus thought about equality with God, not whether he was equal with God or not. He didn't think it was something important enough "to be grasped"!

Now if he was already equal with God at this time, him not considering equality with God as "something to be grasped" simply would mean that it meant nothing to him, and he could readily let it go! Again, "considering" means "thinking", and that scripture began by admonishing that you have the same "mind" or mindset that Jesus had! It's all about mindset, what Jesus mindset about equality with God was, not whether he was at the time equal with God or not! His mindset was that "this isn't something important enough to be grasped". If he was equal with God and then had this mindset, it just means he can let it go without thinking about it!

On the contrary if he was not equal with God, it'll mean that he wouldn't want to by force BECOME equal with God.

One more time, this scripture is only talking about Christ's mindset, not whether he was equal with God or not! Which is why it is translated differently depending on the bias of the translator:

Phi 2:6 NWT who, although he was existing in God's form, gave no consideration to a seizure, namely, that he should be equal to God.

Phil 2:6 CEV Christ was truly God. But he did not try to remain equal with God.

So you see it proves nothing, but merely confirms the bias a person already has.

Secondly, I think you may be conflating authority over a person with greatness
over them. A man has authority over his wife and she is to submit to him. A man, however, IS NOT greater than his wife! They are equal before God as BEINGS! This is also the relationship the Bible uses in describing God the Father and Christ. Christ submits to the Father's authority, but it's co-equal with him as BEINGS

Lastly, Jesus wasn't mentioned in that proverbs 8 passage. You know that passage refers to "wisdom", even using a female noun form "she calls out" (read the entire thing). Plus the book itself is called "proverbs" = "figure of speech"! But i will show much more thoroughly in my thread at the time that CANNOT represent Jesus!

Mikee19:


It is the truth as far as you know, and you don't know it all. Be humble in what you know. You have only seen arguments from jw doctrine and from others who cannot properly teach what God's word says about it. But like I said i have a thread coming soon..

I will show why some scriptures you've used are improperly used. Then you will see it is really you saying this, not those scriptures. I'll do so in that thread

Dear Mikee19
I will be happy wen u create the thread...please Mention me wen u create the thread...thank u...
I don't do denomination...and I don't compare and contrast doctrine...if I don't like a denomination...dat doesn't mean if dey say some thing that I right I shud negate because I don't like Dem...u av seen me counter Dem on most issues...and on the Trinity...they are not total right and not totally wrong...the Pentecostal also are not totally wrong and not totally right...I also showed u from the scriptures...how it is and how it should be taught.
You said humility... humility cannot be shown in words or action... humility is a result of the heart...that is where Pride and Humility reside and it is only God that knows...av u ever wondered why Pride and Humility was never listed as part of the Fruits of the flesh and spirit respectively...?

Mikee19:
immaculatesense although I'm trying very hard to not derail this thread since I'll still create that thread, I'll just point out two errors here:

Let's say there are two persons, one holding a gold wristwatch and another just looking at the same gold wristwatch. Both do not consider that wristwatch "something to be grasped" despite the fact that one is already holding on to it and the second is just looking at it in his front. Here's what this means for both parties:

The first person who doesn't consider the wristwatch "something to be grasped", but who somehow was already holding on to it at first (without thinking), can easily let go of it. It's not that important to him. He can just let it go as despite holding it in the first place he doesn't consider it "something to be grasped"

The second person who is just staring at it without yet holding it may never decide to hold it at all since he doesn't consider it "something to be grasped"! In fact he may even mistakenly touch it without knowing. But once he realizes he's touching it, what he doesn't consider "something to be grasped", he can again readily let go of it.

What am I driving at?

You're using that scripture to show Jesus was never equal to God. It DOES NOT say so at all!

All it says is just that he didn't consider equality with God "something to be grasped"!

Now he may or may not have been equal with God before this, but the scripture is silent on it as it isn't its point. The point is simply what Jesus thought about equality with God, not whether he was equal with God or not. He didn't think it was something important enough "to be grasped"!

Now if he was already equal with God at this time, him not considering equality with God as "something to be grasped" simply would mean that it meant nothing to him, and he could readily let it go! Again, "considering" means "thinking", and that scripture began by admonishing that you have the same "mind" or mindset that Jesus had! It's all about mindset, what Jesus mindset about equality with God was, not whether he was at the time equal with God or not! His mindset was that "this isn't something important enough to be grasped". If he was equal with God and then had this mindset, it just means he can let it go without thinking about it!

On the contrary if he was not equal with God, it'll mean that he wouldn't want to by force BECOME equal with God.

One more time, this scripture is only talking about Christ's mindset, not whether he was equal with God or not! Which is why it is translated differently depending on the bias of the translator:

Phi 2:6 NWT who, although he was existing in God's form, gave no consideration to a seizure, namely, that he should be equal to God.

Phil 2:6 CEV Christ was truly God. But he did not try to remain equal with God.

So you see it proves nothing, but merely confirms the bias a person already has.

Secondly, I think you may be conflating authority over a person with greatness
over them. A man has authority over his wife and she is to submit to him. A man, however, IS NOT greater than his wife! They are equal before God as BEINGS! This is also the relationship the Bible uses in describing God the Father and Christ. Christ submits to the Father's authority, but it's co-equal with him as BEINGS

Lastly, Jesus wasn't mentioned in that proverbs 8 passage. You know that passage refers to "wisdom", even using a female noun form "she calls out" (read the entire thing). Plus the book itself is called "proverbs" = "figure of speech"! But i will show much more thoroughly in my thread at the time that CANNOT represent Jesus!

Dear Mikee19
I mistakenly close tab and I av written alot down on ur mention but it's all gone...I can restart I av gone far and I can't be rewriting and it hurts...but u still av alot to learn on how to relate scriptures especially the old testament to the new and how to find Christ in the Old testament...
But the bottom line is Jesus is the Wisdom of God according to 1 Corinthians 1:24
[24]But to those called by God to salvation, both Jews and Gentiles, Christ is the power of God and the WISDOM of God.

2) It hurts i my hand had to quit paid...I wrote extensively...

Christ was God...he let go of that privilege to save mankind (word became flesh) since u can't separate man from his word...the word of man is the man and enjoy every privilege with the man...so,Christ enjoy that privilege in God of being equated to God...but he had to let go instead of clinging to it. Now that the salvation mission is halfway done...he is sitting (waiting) at the right hand of God(is he still not equal with God as of now since the mission is still ongoing) Matthew 22:44
[44]‘The lord said to my Lord,
Sit in the place of honor at my right hand
    until I humble your enemies beneath your feet.’

When the salvation mission his over and the Judgement has bn passed on mankind (those who refused the salvation of God) that is when 1 Corinthians 15:28 will be fulfilled and Christ will return to being in his initial position of being equal with God.
That was why Jesus told his disciples that one that great day...they will ask no questions because they will know that he is in the Father.

Just quote me wen u create that new thread
God bless you sir

immaculatesense:

Dear Mikee19
I mistakenly close tab and I av written alot down on ur mention but it's all gone...I can restart I av gone far and I can't be rewriting and it hurts...

Oops, sorry. That usually feels terrible

immaculatesense:
but u still av alot to learn on how to relate scriptures especially the old testament to the new and how to find Christ in the Old testament...

immaculatesense:
But the bottom line is Jesus is the Wisdom of God according to 1 Corinthians 1:24

I'll show why this isn't so

immaculatesense:
Christ was God...he let go of that privilege to save mankind (word became flesh) since u can't separate man from his word...the word of man is the man and enjoy every privilege with the man...so,Christ enjoy that privilege in God of being equated to God...but he had to let go instead of clinging to it. Now that the salvation mission is halfway done...he is sitting (waiting) at the right hand of God(is he still not equal with God as of now since the mission is still ongoing) Matthew 22:44
[44]‘The lord said to my Lord,
Sit in the place of honor at my right hand
    until I humble your enemies beneath your feet.’

When the salvation mission his over and the Judgement has bn passed on mankind (those who refused the salvation of God) that is when 1 Corinthians 15:28 will be fulfilled and Christ will return to being in his initial position of being equal with God.
That was why Jesus told his disciples that one that great day...they will ask no questions because they will know that he is in the Father.

Actually sef we don't have much disagreement points, and much of that new thread wouldn't be for you. From what i can see it's just 1)creation of Jesus (really unscriptural) and 2) Authority over doesn't equal being greater than. All else is in order. But I'll quote you anyways. God bless you too

Mikee19:


It's a sad story. See how readily i took apart his beliefs and showed it up for the nonsense (stuff that doesn't make sense) that it is. Asking questions he dare cannot answer. But tomorrow will still persist in this foolishness.

I usually do not speak in this way. But I've not seen stuff like this all my life. Quite sad

That is why I call him insane!

Mikee19:
...You do not place emphasis on feelings at all!

At least you admit the use of feelings even if it is not to be solely relied upon to which I said nothing to that effect.

Mikee19:
.
One more time, we walk by faith not by feelings or sight!

Respectfully, you guys have not yet figured out what faith truly is, and therefore you suffer through the hardship of maintaining what you all think that faith is. until you get weak.

Lo, those who now called themselves atheist today also went through your same process, hearing the same things that you know and coming to the same conclusion you have, yet because of the wrongness of it, they decided not to deceive themselves no further as they gave up.

You may not give up as easily as they did but you would not let the Truth in that your lives have not truly far improved since you did your thing, after all the time you have taken running on this erroneous road away from God!

And you guys will not listen until you are exhausted.

Mikee19:


No sir, you are adding to that scripture. First off no Christian goes "awhoring".

You are Avoiding the question

If any of them had gone to cool off with one babe while waiting in Jerusalem, will they receive The Holy Spirit?

immaculatesense:

I don't really like creating thread...I rather I comment...maybe u can mention me on a thread...maybe

Ok

Dtruthspeaker:


At least you admit the use of feelings even if it is not to be solely relied upon to which I said nothing to that effect.



Respectfully, you guys have not yet figured out what faith truly is, and therefore you suffer through the hardship of maintaining what you all think that faith is. until you get weak.

Well I don't ever want to figure out what faith is. All I need to do is follow the prescription of Jesus when I pray:

NKJV Mr 11:22,24: "²² So Jesus answered and said to them, “Have faith in God. … ²⁴ Therefore I say to you, whatever things you ask when you pray, believe that you receive them, and you will have them."

Jesus himself defines having faith in God by the application in prayer as whenever I pray I am to believe I HAVE ALREADY RECEIVED AT THAT VERY MOMENT (the moment I pray!). That is when I get to have them!

I don't need to be a genius. I just have to believe Jesus. You don't, but that's fine too. All i say is what he said, simple. You don't believe his word is enough and doesn't work that way and you're right. I believe it is enough and works that way and I'm also right. According to our faith it will be done unto us! (Mat 9:29)

Dtruthspeaker:


You are Avoiding the question

If any of them had gone to cool off with one babe while waiting in Jerusalem, will they receive The Holy Spirit?

Let me respond to it this way, applying it to this day and age.

Now the Spirit has already been given. If a believer falls into fornication and comes out, 30 seconds after asking God to forgive him of this sin then prays to receive the Holy Spirit he will SURELY RECEIVE if he's got faith that God forgave him and he'll receive !

See this has been said before. EVERY BELIEVER ALREADY HAS THE HOLY SPIRIT WITHIN HIM. I mean, EVERYONE! No matter who he is!

NKJV Ro 8:9: "⁹ But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His."

To be a Christian it is only possible because he has the Holy Spirit in the first place!

Maybe you can help by explaining why that same "extremely Holy Spirit" that felt it ok to dwell in this person in the first place when he got saved cannot do so again in this second one? Is it not the one same Holy Spirit? Why? What's wrong all of a sudden? Help me get this pls! (Let me see this in your response)

On the other hand, we can only receive answers to prayers because of Jesus Christ ALONE, not our own righteousness or Holy living. Jesus ALONE qualifies us to get God's blessings not anything we do. if we ever get to feel we should receive from God because of our holy living, we MOST CERTAINLY won't receive from God.

I read of a woman who was complaining to her pastor that she always lives a holy life yet doesn't receive from God the same way another church member does who can't be bothered to be dedicated as she. Well that other one usually repents when she sinned the many times she always use to sin, but this one who didn't sin as much always felt she DESERVED the blessings from God because of her holy living!

See, absolutely NOBODY deserves ANYTHING from God no matter how they live! Only one thing qualifies them to receive from God: JESUS!

That's what "in Jesus' name" means!

When you go to somebody in my name it means you're going in my authority. He giving you something in my name means him giving it to you as though you were me, and NOT you! He is responding to you as if you were me! And you will get what RIGHTFULLY BELONGS TO ME because you're coming in my name, not what you deserve!

When we pray "in Jesus' name", we are approaching the Father as though we are Jesus. We are going in Jesus' authority. God is seeing Jesus NOT us when we approach him in Jesus' name. And we will get what legally belongs to Jesus because of that, NOT WHAT WE DESERVE!

If you've sinned all you need do is repent in that place of prayer. Go in Jesus name, and you will receive what belongs to Jesus. You will get it in Jesus name!

Once you believe your heart that Jesus is the son of God and that he died for your sins and resurrected for your justification, the next thing will be to confess him (Jesus) as the Lord of your life. Once you do that, meaning it with all your heart, the holy spirit will make your body his house. Romans 8:8-10.

infini771:
Once you believe your heart that Jesus is the son of God and that he died for your sins and resurrected for your justification, the next thing will be to confess him (Jesus) as the Lord of your life. Once you do that, meaning it with all your heart, the holy spirit will make your body his house. Romans 8:8-10.

According to Jesus Christ , that process takes you living your life in continuous submission and obedience of His teachings(and commandments) aka attaining holiness so you first need to become a holy/acceptable vessel worthy of God's own holy spirit to dwell in - John 8 vs 31 - 35, John 14 vs 15 - 25 & John 15 vs 7 - 14. . There are approximately 100 commandments contained in God's Gospel, Jesus Christ, and to know the Truth means to put them into obedience. This does not happen once but over time....

Kobojunkie:
According to Jesus Christ , that process takes you living your life in continuous submission and obedience of His teachings(and commandments) aka attaining holiness so you first need to become a holy/acceptable vessel worthy of God's own holy spirit to dwell in - John 8 vs 31 - 35, John 14 vs 15 - 25 & John 15 vs 7 - 14. . There are approximately 100 commandments contained in God's Gospel, Jesus Christ, and to know the Truth means to put them into obedience. This does not happen once but over time....

the hundred commandments has shortened or summarised into two, love your neighbor as yourself and love God with all your heart.

infini771:
the hundred commandments has shortened or summarised into two, love your neighbor as yourself and love God with all your heart.

First of all, "Love your neighbor as you love yourself"- Leviticus 19 vs 9 - 18 - , and "Love the Lord God with all your heart, mind, body and soul" - Deuteronomy 6 vs 5 - where commandments given by God to those of His Old Covenant Law of Moses i.e. the Constitution God gave to the Nation of Israel, and for that very reason you were informed, even by the Pharisees, that those two commandments resolved the Old Law, the National Constitution of Israel, and the Prophets. Those commandments were not given by Jesus Christ to His own disciples though.

Second, Jesus Christ never shortened any of His commandments. It is the very same set of commandments which He taught to His disciples, the Gospel, that Jesus Christ then sent them out to teach those in the World..

Mikee19:


Oops, sorry. That usually feels terrible







I'll show why this isn't so



Actually sef we don't have much disagreement points, and much of that new thread wouldn't be for you. From what i can see it's just 1)creation of Jesus (really unscriptural) and 2) Authority over doesn't equal being greater than. All else is in order. But I'll quote you anyways. God bless you too

Smile...I understand u perfectly well and I was once like dat...and u not understanding my Creation point is a misinterpretation of my intention...that doesn't mean I underate Christ or depict his image...no...
1) Jesus said it himself in Proverbs 8 that he was FORMED (though he was living in God but his activeness has a beginning...just like man and his word but wen a man his born...he comes out and den he make sound(word)...but the fact is there was a man before his word though equality is there but we all agree that there cannot be a word without it source(man) ...so also there cannot be a son without a parent...there cannot be Son(Christ/Word) without the Father(yhwh).

2)Jesus himself said in John 14 that the Father is greater than the son...
Please can u explain what Jesus meant in the two passages

Matthew 24:36
[36]“However, no one knows the day or hour when these things will happen, not even the angels in heaven or THE SON HIMSELF. ONLY THE FATHER KNOWS.

And
Matthew 20:23
[23]Jesus told them, “You will indeed drink from my bitter cup. But I HAVE NO RIGHT to say who will sit on my right or my left. My Father has prepared those places for the ones he has chosen.”

immaculatesense:

Smile...I understand u perfectly well and I was once like dat...and u not understanding my Creation point is a misinterpretation of my intention...that doesn't mean I underate Christ or depict his image...no...
1) Jesus said it himself in Proverbs 8 that he was FORMED (though he was living in God but his activeness has a beginning...just like man and his word but wen a man his born...he comes out and den he make sound(word)...but the fact is there was a man before his word though equality is there but we all agree that there cannot be a word without it source(man) ...so also there cannot be a son without a parent...there cannot be Son(Christ/Word) without the Father(yhwh).

2)Jesus himself said in John 14 that the Father is greater than the son...
Please can u explain what Jesus meant in the two passages

Matthew 24:36
[36]“However, no one knows the day or hour when these things will happen, not even the angels in heaven or THE SON HIMSELF. ONLY THE FATHER KNOWS.

And
Matthew 20:23
[23]Jesus told them, “You will indeed drink from my bitter cup. But I HAVE NO RIGHT to say who will sit on my right or my left. My Father has prepared those places for the ones he has chosen.”

1) Again proverbs 8 IS NOT Jesus, but I'll show this better then

2) One more time, yes Jesus was less than the Father ON EARTH as the first passage you referenced! Anything other that is now authority (no more greatness over) but again you keep counting the authority one has over another (like a man with his wife) as the fact that he's greater. I have said that this isn't the same thing

It seems you're trying to make me answer this issue right now and are impatient with these continued responses. I have said it over and over again in this forum that that thread is coming! Don't worry I'll be MUCH more detailed there! That's the reason we're having this discussion over and over. I'll be perfectly detailed there, pls wait for it!

Again, it's not that I cannot respond more convincingly than this. I know these scriptures. I can address them even much better. pls wait