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Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Judas1X: 5:27pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:Sometimes I wonder if you set out to deliberately embarrass yourself . Go back and read: I said you're hurling SHIT insults all over the thread. It's the only thing you can bring up as a comeback. Shit this, shit that. I got you talking about SHIT so much that the thread nearly caught up in flames due to the corrossive amount of SHIT that's flying out of your mouth. You're obviously scrubbing at the barrel of your diss-drum. I feel pity for you. Weak watery words with no sting. A so-called lawyer, and you're still getting beaten up online like a market thief! See how I have knifed you and spilled your guts all over the floors of Nairaland. Looooolz......what a waste of male headcount |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Judas1X: 5:31pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:Because you provided nothing sensible to respond to!! |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Dtruthspeaker: 5:40pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Judas1X: put your phone down on the table and see whether you are not omniscient, omnipresent and omnipotent to it! Omniscient. Surely, you know your phone greatly better than your phone as you have already confessed. hahaha Omnipresent The phone may be able to see everything on the table but you are present both around and beyond your table and you see everything around the phone at the same time hahaha Omnipotent. You already know that can improve or destroy your phone in any way and manner you desire and there is nothing your phone can do about that. so you see over your phone, you are exactly like God is to us! hahahaha hahahaha Now you see, you still do not have any valid counter since I dropped this answer since 2019. hahahaha hahahaha Looooser! hahahaha hahahaha |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Judas1X: 7:31pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:Issokay. Just give up. I've given you enough chances to redeem yourself. One would think that by now, you'd have realized the inanity of your analogies. But no problemo, it's always my pleasure to school deranged numbskulls like you. Now let's look at your analogy using logical syllogism: P1: Humans are like a phone. P2: A phone must have a creator. C: Human beings, being like a phone, must have a maker creator. Your false analogy can be shown by a reduction to the absurd, highlighting the many differences between human beings and a phone. Similar absurdities can be built from almost every other characteristic of human beings or phones: P1: Human beings are like a phone. P2: A human being can excrete waste from his body in the form of sweat, excreta, urine etc. C: The phone, being like a human being, can excrete waste from his body in the form of sweat, excreta, urine etc. There are problems "disguised" in the assumptions of your trite analogy. A phone bears little resemblance to a human being, just like you bear little resemblance to an all-knowing, all-powerful deity, therefore your piece of shit analogy is already invalidated in step 1. Due to the fact that you're a pathetic shit-for-brains pansy with needle-eye vision, you view the apparent complexity of a phone and assume that it must be designed and that it's appearance of design can be compared to trees and people and entire world . You're repeating same dumb arguments like your unwashed boxers. Bwahahahahaaaa. You found the wrong customer. Eat your salty chicken but keep a straight face for the onlookers. This is how you die silently and miserably. You're a Lawyer and your long term goal is to destroy your credibility on the internet . Well I will teach you a lesson. Your comrades are witnessing your mental deficit in action. Your brain can't even stretch beyond 2cm The reason you keep hiding behind meaningless analogies is because you have NO ACTUAL EVIDENCE to support your claim that a god exists. Thus, you cling to stupid equivocations validate your outlandish fantasies, thinking it is valid, whereas the truth is you've got nothing . Your dumb and uninformed analogies only work if one assumes what one is attempting to prove: in this case, that human beings and trees are so much like a phone or a car, it necessarily must have had a creator. The claim "A is similar to B" always lacks some measure of definition outside the confines of geometry. This lack of definition describes the extent that such a claim is a weak hypothesis. You have no answers. You have no evidence. You have nothing to substantiate your claims. Just meaningless regurgitation of old creationist fables. You're a cheap pretender, as empty as a drunk's glass . Sorry for expecting so much from you. Damaged human leftover 3 Likes |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by chryssanthe(f): 7:43pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Lawag3:Stop bullshitting How do you know what your god wants? |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by chryssanthe(f): 7:49pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Endtimer:This little gem of yours is so full of bullshit, i dont even know where to start. So i wont. |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Near1: 8:01pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Endtimer: [Citation needed] If we all began to live without belief in God as a result of some impossible scientific discovery, it would ultimately destroy society or lead back to religion. The reason for this is because atheists take for granted the religious pillars all civilized societies are built on; the concept of morality and legislation for instance go hand in hand. Rather than reorder society after the eradication of religion, atheists would need to continue pretending as though religion still had moral force in society; until someone asks: “why can’t I just do whatever I want”. In the end we’ll arrive at a religious society because atheistic society is unsustainable and humans are incurably religious. Your unspoken, and clearly unquestioned, premise here is that religion provides the only solid basis for the social contract. n a personal, rather than sociological, level religion provides purpose for living. Atheism doesn’t. On atheism, suicide is not morally abhorrent. Western nations are beginning to witness the effects of unbelief as their citizens increasingly end their own lives. Let me ask you a question: would it make any difference if you were going to kill yourself today or tomorrow? On atheism, it certainly wouldn’t. On atheism, the fact that we are going to die one day is enough motivation for us to end our lives at once. Anything is enough motivation for us to end our lives. Why are you worried about what others do with their lives? And do you have reputable sources to back up this claim of yours? I do not look to my atheism for any reason to live, because it is not any sort of guiding set of principles for me. It is merely a statement of one belief which I don't hold. I find the meaning for my life myself. I get that you and many other religious folk do not understand this because y'all apparently need to be told why your own lives are important. Thankfully, I'm not that blind. I can find my own purpose for myself. Religions or gods need not apply. Contrary to what many atheists believe, increasing secularism negatively correlates with happiness in society. While happiness isn’t the point of life, it is worth noting that the decline of religion has been accompanied by increased depression in the west. Is this correlation or causation? Note that none of the above is meant to validate the authenticity of religion. Instead it is to conceptualize the faithless society posited in the op. If so, it's a shallow and unconvincing attempt. You should think more about this. 6 Likes |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Lawag3: 8:02pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
chryssanthe: You have a conscience to guide you, you can also study the bible |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Near1: 8:12pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
efficiencie: These questions have been raised and adequately disarmed many times over, some in this thread: https://www.nairaland.com/7320593/religion-101-exam You can try to read and address the answers given in that thread and show that, you're not simply regurgitating the tired collection of ignorant theist chestnuts which ignorant theists are wont to repeat because their intentions are not honest and they are simply arrogantly trying to piss into the gale force wind of historically given answers without actually considering them because they don't care. Your questions have been asked and answered in thread I linked you to. Prove to me that you're looking for honest discussion and you're not just a dishonest person acting in bad faith. 4 Likes |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Near1: 8:18pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
triplechoice: Why do you insist that meaning should be handed down to you from on high? You don't seem to understand that people can define the meaning of their own lives for themselves, without being told what to value by someone else. Sure, to a goldfish, the only part of the world that matters is his goldfish bowl. But I can assure you that there's a world of thought and meaning far and wide outside the goldfish bowl you live in. 2 Likes |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Tamaratonye1(f): 8:34pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Lawag3:"The Way" to what? Badagry? San Jose? Peckham? All religions and their "holy" books claim that their specific deity is the true one/ones. What makes your god and its book special and true, unlike all others? Except for the fact that you just happened to have been born in a Christian society and thus, grew up with this specific "holy" book? Or do you think that if you'd been born in Saudi Arabia, to muslim parents, you would still be a Christian? Or are those specific words, combined, some sort of magic? It doesn't say abracadabra in the bible. Look it up and tell me what you find. The muslim "holy" literature claims that there is no god but Allah and Mohammed is his prophet; and that he is, among 99 things, The Beneficent, The Merciful, The Most Sacred, The Source of Peace, The Flawless, The Infuser of Faith, The Preserver of Safety, The Subtle One, The Most Gentle. Me, I vastly prefer "the most gentle one" over the "way, the light and the truth"? Why should I choose your word salads and not the islamic one? Or hindu one? 2 Likes |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by MaxInDHouse(m): 8:36pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
TheDictatorNd:The Bible is incomplete without the 27 books written by the first century Christians! So if anyone tells you he believes in the Bible but he's not a Christian tell him/her that he/she is lying because the Christians took up the Hebrew scriptures and began quoting verses pointing to what God said about them in the books the Jews are carrying about. Till today the Jews have failed to produce any group practicing what their God foretold will be done during the last days, in fact they're expecting another Messiah (Christ) claiming Jesus who founded Christianity is not their own Messiah. Well let's wait and see if they can ever produce the fruit of faith expected of the worshipers of the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob! Matthew 21:43; 23:37-38 1 Like |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Tamaratonye1(f): 8:40pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
triplechoice:(my bold) Please provide evidence. 1 Like |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Tamaratonye1(f): 8:47pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Endtimer:Please give some examples of how science is bringing us closer to belief in the supernatural otherwise it's just a baseless assertion. Are you perhaps referring to the LHC and discovery of the Higgs Boson particle? If so it's a very big stretch to describe the discovery of a particle in such a way. I would argue the reverse, for example; neuroscience and MRI technology is now sufficiently advanced for us to be able to observe interactions between the brain, senses and a soul even if the soul itself is undetectable, yet scientists have never observed this even when specifically looking for it. In the entirety of human history not one single supernatural event has ever been definitively proven genuine so I fail to see how science is moving us closer and closer to to belief in the supernatural, were it so I guarantee the press would be getting very excited, indeed it would be the greatest news story in history yet all I hear are crickets chirping. |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Lawag3: 8:51pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Tamaratonye1: I'm a Christian so I talk to you from the perspective of the bible. The bible is a very special book it's a book for all time you hardly see people condemning the morals of the bible or Jesus the bible has been know as the book that contains the future wether past or present hundreds of years before Cyrus was born the bible prophecies about him calling him by name the bible prophecies about the three world empires namely the Babylonians Greeks and Rome it prophecies about Alexander the great it told of of things to come If I were to explain this it will be too lengthy Among all other religious figures Jesus tomb is the only one that's empty because he died and rose again . If you are going to read all I type tell me to explain in detail. I really appreciate your open mind . |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Tamaratonye1(f): 8:59pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Endtimer: 5 Likes 2 Shares
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Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Dtruthspeaker: 9:43pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Judas1X: You have still not given any tangible counter! All you have done is to have fled from my answer, then come back to completely present your insanity, saying "P2: A human being can excrete waste from his body in the form of sweat, excreta, urine etc. C: The phone, being like a human being, can excrete waste from his body in the form of sweat, excreta, urine etc." (WHICH THIS THREAD CLEARLY PROVES IS NOT MY STATEMENT AT ALL) [/b] .And in the end asides your mad rambling howls you said no thing! No thing at all except to show that you are the mayor of insanity central city . |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Dtruthspeaker: 9:49pm On Sep 16, 2022 |
Tamaratonye1: This guy has already shown that your guy is a liar https://www.nairaland.com/7333476/illinois-passes-purge-law-crime#116691628 paradiseVirgin: |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Judas1X: 12:06am On Sep 17, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:Keep wailing. Your troubles have only just begun. Counters upon counters have been presented to your stupid and juvenile arguments and anyone with half a brain can see that you clearly have no knowledge of apologetics, nor do you have any knowledge of logical fallacies and where they apply or do not apply. You have the brain power of a sedated fish. All you have done is to have fled from my answerYour answer was tackled and proven to be the product of a 2 bit per second processing speed brain. Your stupidity has been exposed repeatedly. It's over for you, DMumuSpeaker. If I were you I will look for the babalawo who swapped your brain with that of mountain goat. Washed out imbecilic dweeb that specializes in dodging questions and twisting facts is now complaining I didn't answer his questions . Your stupidity still needs professional management. Where is your answer to these questions, DMumuSpeaker? 1. Can you define creation and tell us why you think the Earth was created? 2. How was the Earth created? What are the nitty gritty, the gbo gbo nishe processes involved, hmm? 3. Why do you think you can explain complexity, by postulating something more complex in its place and declaring it needs no explanation? 4. How do you recognize DESIGN? Where is the NON-DESIGNED THING we can contrast the universe against? What is the point of a car or a phone, if the animals and trees are designed as well? Shouldn't the phone or car be evidence that the trees and animals are not designed? 5. If we have to accept the claim that universe was made or designed, then which of the countless creator gods should we attribute this so-called creation to? After pointing out which god, please provide clear evidence of it's existence 6. Can we safely conclude that the creator is unintelligent and/or incompetent due to the existence of birth defects, as well as defects in human anatomy and physiology? 7. If you believe that everything that exists has a creator, then how do you explain RETROCAUSILTY aka Backwards Causation? You didn't even make an effort to answer any of these. Instead you went ahead to make spurious analogies and equivocations that have been discombobulated again and again and again. If I hear you rap about avoiding questions again, I'll scalp you so brutally your paternal obscurity will be clearer. You easily pass as someone whose formal education was either interrupted or home schooled. You're barely as educated as a rural fishmonger. , then come back to completely present your insanity, saying "P2: A human being can excrete waste from his body in the form of sweat, excreta, urine etc.Hahahahahahahaaaa. More display of stupidity from DMumuSpeaker. Is this man not truly a Mumu speaker? Sonmvayina come and see your guy o. Hahahahahahahaha Your answers were addressed and dismantled with cold hard logic, not the meaningless jargon and equivocations that dilettantes like you are accustomed to. That's why you couldn't hack it . You couldn't see the woods for the trees. My job here is not to convince you of anything. I'm not here to make you change your mind. I'm just using you as a first class exhibition to demonstrate to impressionable and honest readers the damage that religion does to the brains. That's why I love engaging with you. You constantly and unwittingly expose the dangerous side effects of religious brainwashing. You are impervious to logic, impervious to common sense, impervious to facts, impervious to anything that doesn't tally with your worldview. You are DOGMA and BIGOTRY walking in the human flesh. Thanks for constantly reminding us you're just another unevolved human travesty with no reasoning skills to justify any education you might have had . Everything goes for you as long as it leads to your god. Your background wasn't just marked with material poverty, it was also enveloped in intellectual destitution. Unlimited idiot. And in the end asides your mad rambling howls you said no thing! No thing at all except to show that you are the mayor of insanity central city .I've already told you not to overwork your pint-sized brain. It has been continually established in all our encounters that you are brain-dead chimpanzee trying to make a name for himself on online forum. You're one of the shortcomings of the internet becoming mainstream. And Nairaland has been the worse for it. Stop the charade, DMumuSpeaker You're looking stupider than you began. 1 Like |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Judas1X: 12:50am On Sep 17, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:This is another instance of you blindly lunging towards a post. Actually your quote doesn't debunk the picture at all. The author said, "The fact that these people think that if they didn't have this person watching over them that they would go on killing, raping rampages is the most self-demeaning thing I can imagine". The author is simply asserting that you don't need a god to be moral. Fact is all human beings make their ethical decisions based on reason, empathy and a concern for human beings and other sentient beings. Also people commit acts that are deemed immoral or unethical irrespective of their religious inclinations. The gospel truth is that believing in god doesn't automatically make you more "moral" than your fellow man. Statistics have even shown that majority of prison inmates are religious adherents . If you truly think believing in god is the reason why you don't rape your brother's wife, or kill your co-workers in the office, then I guess that explains your passive-aggressive tendencies and your crippling psychosis. Unfortunately for you, you can't keeping using Nairaland for therapy 2 Likes |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Judas1X: 1:07am On Sep 17, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:Does it not bother you how much of a loser your god is? Why do people consistently reject him? Why is he such an loser in the eyes of his creation? - Satan (and a large group of other angels) in heaven with god, knew 1st hand of how "awesome" god was... and rejected him. - All of the descendants of Adam & Eve at the time of the flood, who presumably must have at least have heard of him... must have also rejected god. - All the descendants of Noah, who you'd think would've told people how really, really, really important it was not to piss off Yahweh... and most of the people of the earth obviously STILL rejected him , otherwise you wouldn't have all those other non-Jewish peoples of the world, that the Jews had to fight with these many thousands of years. And at the end of it all, god still wipes out almost everybody AGAIN at the rapture cause most of the world still rejects him. The only thing the bible seems to prove is what a monument failure of a deity he is... He's the DIVINE LOSER, his is the most supreme example of INSANITY (doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results), the most powerful & perfect harbinger of FAILURE Kwaaaaaaaaakwaaaaaakwaaaa 6 Likes |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by midnight378: 1:25am On Sep 17, 2022 |
efficiencie: yeah... why don't you explain your morality to us, huh? Deuteronomy 7 |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by FemiAjani(m): 1:36am On Sep 17, 2022 |
efficiencie: As far as morality goes, you can thank evolution for that. We are social animals, and our societies benefit when people respect each other's life and property. It's inborn -- we are actually programmed to be good, as opposed to the opinion the christian religion holds, that we are born evil. There are exceptions, such as some types of severely disordered people. Evolution is not random, what works gets passed down. Order doesn't require intelligence; it occurs naturally as each type of life evolves to fit in its niche. I don't know where matter, space and time originate, but I am sure we will have a proper answer eventually. Science is working on it. Not everything has to have an immediate answer, it took us many centuries to learn as much as we know now. |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Near1: 1:53am On Sep 17, 2022 |
If religion cures nihilism why are the vast majority of prison convicts religious? If atheism causes nihilism why are we apparently underrepresented in that unhappy demographic? Oh, that's right. We don't need a god to give us meaning or morality. 2 Likes |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Endtimer: 2:06am On Sep 17, 2022 |
Tamaratonye1: |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Endtimer: 2:11am On Sep 17, 2022 |
Tamaratonye1: I’m not impressed. I was talking about the Big Bang and Darwinian evolution. I find it laughable that an adult would insinuate that neuroscience could discover evidence of the soul in the brain. That’s the most ludicrous thing I’ve read this year. You also claim that no supernatural event has been proven genuine. I’m curious as to how you arrived at this assessment. You state point blank what you’ll have to backup. If you need explanations as to how the Big Bang and evolution supports theism, I’ll tell you that it’s because they suspiciously involve an intelligent first cause. I’ll explain further if you require it. |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by midnight378: 2:14am On Sep 17, 2022 |
Endtimer: Totally false. I sure hope you're not speaking of the Big Bang Theory, and how that theory was hijacked by Christian apologists, and MISREPRESENTED as supporting Christian beliefs. If not what are you talking about ? The other tings that come to mind are Relativity and Uncertainty. They in no way support religionists, and in fact they do support the concept that ultimate reality is not what it appears on first look to be, and is NOT what appears to human minds to be "intuitively logical". 1 Like |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Endtimer: 2:18am On Sep 17, 2022 |
I should note that, as this is your space, it is to be expected that I’ll receive lots of feedback. I anticipate that this may be overwhelming and I’ll focus on the answers I deem most important such as those from the writer of the op and any other well argued posts. I can only respond to the properly structured arguments as I have limited time to spend on this. |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by midnight378: 2:25am On Sep 17, 2022 |
Endtimer: First you said "people" then you changed "people" to "one rule breaker. How do you know about the one rule breaker ? Let's see the study and the data ? Oh wait, you have no data, and no study. You made it all up. Your assertions about what happens in the absence of religion are already proven false. In Northern Europe, in countries with less and less religion, crime and evil are no worse than they were under religion. You don't scare me. You think you can scare people into religion ? LOL. 3 Likes |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by midnight378: 2:31am On Sep 17, 2022 |
Endtimer: Don't worry about it sweetie... you got nothing we haven't heard a million times before.... |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Endtimer: 2:36am On Sep 17, 2022 |
Near1: This answer is particularly easy to debunk. On first reading it I assumed you made a few points. Now I believe otherwise. I’ll address it backwards: - Yes, increased unbelief is correlated with decreased rates of personal fulfillment. We are all aware that the west is experiencing reduced religious involvement. Cursory internet searches will furnish you with associated data on decreased personal happiness. Your question is therefore pointless. Whether it is directly caused by or just happens to coincide with is beside the point. - Your point about finding your own purpose is subjective and ultimately inconsequential. The purpose you pick for yourself only has no actual value. You might as well decide to become a superhero tomorrow. The value is subjective and not ultimate. On theism, it is believed that ultimate value can only be given if a thing has a purpose for which it is created. On atheism life is the result of mindless chance irrespective of the illusion of purpose with which you preoccupy yourself. Such a life has no ultimate value; only one that you make up as you go. Further, this means that the atheist has no qualms against suicide. Life is random and valueless. In fact, all forms of crime lose their moral reprehensibility. To prevent this would require collective delusion. The atheist society would require that it’s members all believe something that isn’t true for the sake of living together. Everyone would have to believe certain things are good and others bad just so that they can coexist. - Lastly, religion does provide the only consistent basis for society. That is to say, religious societies operate based on what coheres with reality whereas atheist societies depend on consensus. They decide what is reality and act as though this delusion is correct. This is exceedingly clear when it comes to morality and legislation which are inextricable. |
Re: Honest Question To The Christians by Endtimer: 2:43am On Sep 17, 2022 |
midnight378: I’ll address this one post as it makes a point. Your hero Nietzsche addresses this in Beyond Good and Evil. Your view of man is corrupted by millennia of good religion, leading you to falsely conclude that this is our natural state. You mention Europe; the continent responsible for spreading religion around the world. They have hardly had enough time to fully divorce themselves from religion. Look instead at the soviets and the Chinese; both prominent communists and vehemently opposed to theistic faith. They have collectively killed millions for abhorrent reasons. Today, however, we see religion rear its head in these places once more. Think of atheism as a break for religion during a boxing match. It isn’t our natural state. It isn’t healthy and we don’t stay there for long. I should also add that I’m not here to proselytize. I don’t care what happens to you and I have no intention of converting you. I’m not idealistic enough to imagine I could change deeply held beliefs so easily. I’m here to test my ideas till I get bored or am convinced of their infallibility. You’re here for your own reasons. Do not get that confused. I’ll address other serious concerns when I return. |
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