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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma (14598 Views)
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Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by chryssanthe(f): 12:25am On Oct 09, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:And here, ladies and gentlemen, you have the argument of: "God is good, you are evil. Stfu!". This time without any further backup. He not even tried to argue why his good is good. Just some baseless claims. As i predicted, he didnt even try to rehabilitate his gods untenable position. His approach is to tear the opponents position down, by poisoning the well. No attempt of rational discourse, just baseless claims. How very pathetic! chryssanthe: 1 Like |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 4:38am On Oct 09, 2022 |
chryssanthe: Back up is not given to things that are commonly seen and known, even if you ignore that knowledge. chryssanthe: As I have always said, atheists are blind and almost never see what is in front of them, especially criminal atheists |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Judas1X: 5:35am On Oct 09, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:If it was commonly seen and known, then arguments about its existence wouldn't exist. Unless you can prove me wrong by showing me anywhere you see people arguing about the existence of the sun? Again this is an excuse to cover that fact that YOU HAVE NOTHING TO SHOW WHEN PRESSED FOR EVIDENCE OF THE BULLSHIT YOU BELIEVE IN As I have always said, atheists are blind and almost never see what is in front of them, especially criminal atheistsAnother pretence you use to desperately shield your deluded imaginations from reality |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 5:36am On Oct 09, 2022 |
AuthenticKing: As reported. Where it is also a situation of the Bible simple giving it's own report of the statutus quo like a new newspaper, joining the other newspapers to give reports of events. And the Bible is a compilation of reports which could also have come earlier than the Hammurabi and co, especially as Ur, the city Ur Nammu appropriated to himself, is also captured in the Bible and put in a position where we see that it is what we would call an early period. But, the Bible went further back than It and Ur-Nammu, which the records also confirm that all the places and societies we call countries and states today all started with people coming together and claiming the land they see under their feet, as the Bible had reported. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.encyclopedia.com/history/asia-and-africa/ancient-history-middle-east/ur&ved=2ahUKEwic3dT7otL6AhUSWBoKHWquDjYQFnoECCwQAQ&usg=AOvVaw2fLTOPTkQWPPCJy3N5SsEm So, you see the Bible still leads in history and Natural Law history and in man manufacturing their own law (legal) history. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 5:52am On Oct 09, 2022 |
Judas1X: No recent example here in nairaland so here is one. A fully loaded bus printed G.A.M.seen along Lagos-Ibadan express way. And someone's says that bus reminds me of Warri, hmm yummy. I won go Warri. Then one idiot would then ask how you take know say that bus dey go Warri? . |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Judas1X: 6:07am On Oct 09, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:What is this trash? I asked where you've seen people arguing about the sun and look at your response. Is this not "Change Of Post™", hmmmm? You're out of touch with reality 1 Like |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 6:10am On Oct 09, 2022 |
Judas1X: And I did more than show you what I saw! I showed you the case I saw. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Judas1X: 6:16am On Oct 09, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:Everybody can now see that you cannot read. Hahahahahaha . Abeg what was the question again? The world bears me witness to your intellectual handicap Judas1X: |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 6:23am On Oct 09, 2022 |
Judas1X: And your word doth bear me witness that I did verily answer you. "If it was commonly seen and known, then arguments about its existence wouldn't exist. Unless you can prove me wrong by showing me anywhere you see people arguing about the existence of "commonly seen and known," (like) the sun? And the bus bearing G.A.M is as the sun. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Judas1X: 6:33am On Oct 09, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker: First of all. Don't ever edit my posts in your miserable life. I never used a simile in my post. I was specific about the existence of the sun. Look at you twisting my words to create a different question for yourself. Second, your post was about disagreements about where the bus was headed, not the existence of the bus (object) So we've established that you also don't know the meaning of "obvious" . It is obvious that the vehicle is a bus. What is not obvious is where it's headed. You may speculate based on certain things, but you can't know for certain I wish you would pay for the free tuition I give you. At least I'm giving you what your benighted parents failed to give you Look how disorganized and bereft of reasoning your posts are. It mirrors your life and background. You were raised in conditions lower than a cattle breeding ground. But the true tragedy is that you're a brainless, classless liar without the slightest amount of grace. 1 Like |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 6:38am On Oct 09, 2022 |
AuthenticKing: The issue is the history of Law morality and we have both arrived at the place where man is seen to have made law (legal) for the first time. And we see that Law was still above man even before he made his legal. So man, creating legal is now no longer in issue. And it is now time to look at records which goes beyond this point, which is where the Bible and God takes lead. So, you are free to bring any good evidence which we can reasonably examine together, in comparison to the Bible. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 7:05am On Oct 09, 2022 |
Judas1X: First, every one can see that I edited it to show the direction of my mind, since of course, you did not know what I have in mind when I made my statements but I'll try to avoid amending your posts. Judas1X: It is not reasonable for you to be specific as to the sun as the sun is not the only thing in existence in which people may or may not even argue about. Therefore, I am free to use other things in existence to make my point. Judas1X: My post was about the existence of the agglomerates of fact that G.A.M means a bus going to or coming from Warri. (Object) Judas1X: Portharcourt-Lagos Road travellers know that G.A.M is obvious. But there is always one fellow traveller who opens his mouth in his lack of knowing to say things he should not say because he does not know. Which is the point I was making! |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 7:17am On Oct 09, 2022 |
AuthenticKing: Now you are repeating yourself, means you can not counter. AuthenticKing: Immaterial as long as this now shows that you have no reasonable counter. AuthenticKing: Go look again I only curse people who curse God. But if the issue stays on a matter of position, I simply make my point and leave. Only returning to point out flaws and errors in their further argument if necessary. And I am happy you used "1 +1 =2 all over the world" exactly as I said Law aka Morals is all over the world and some of your people disagreed, and I answered them, and not a single curse was there, even when some insulted me.(and you did not tell them that it is wrong to insult me o) |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by orisa37: 7:29am On Oct 09, 2022 |
The Earth is opposed to Heaven. Humans are generally ignorant about the affairs of THE GRAND ORDER DOMINION. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by orisa37: 7:34am On Oct 09, 2022 |
GOD IS AWARE. AND FOR THAT REASON JESUS IS COMING BACK. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Nobody: 2:08pm On Oct 09, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:Giving it's own report of the status quo by copying and editing to suit its goal Dtruthspeaker: This doesn't prove anything sir. You know what it proves? That Christianity is a very successful business, it's a successful business in the sense that it plagiarises, studies history, incorporating events that occurred, editing them successfully to suit its goal. Man manufactured your book, man manufactured the books that existed before it. Your book is a product of selectively copied stuffs from the books that existed before it. I don't want to repeat this again. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Nobody: 2:12pm On Oct 09, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker: Man made laws to be above the people, it was man that gave that power to the laws. The gods including your God were used as tools by man to give power to the law. It's evident in all codes and laws that existed before and after the Bible. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Nobody: 2:32pm On Oct 09, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:You made a baseless statement, insinuating that your Bible coming after those is an evidence that your Bible is worth considering and then I was trying to let you know that your Bible is a successful copycat. If you can't understand that, then it's up to you. Dtruthspeaker:Your comment there was not worth countering, you made a very baseless assumption and so I dismissed it because the evidence shows something very different. Dtruthspeaker: Here is an example of you insulting people who don't agree with you. Now what is the meaning of this nonsense you wrote below? Dtruthspeaker:You always love to insult those who don't agree with you on your claim that your God is all good and superior and it's overwhelmingly very sad! You did the same to the creator of this thread. You always do the same to many others. And why do you find the need to defend an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent being who has the power to destroy those who curse him? Why not let the dude do his thing and simply stick to make rational arguments to defend your claim? Dtruthspeaker:1+1 = 2 remains the same all over the world and it's unchanging but morals are subjective and changing according to time, place and culture so you see it's not absolute. Of course, they do insult you because you rub your beliefs on them without any evidence. I know it's wrong to insult you (just like it is for you to insult and curse them!) |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Endtimer: 3:04pm On Oct 09, 2022 |
Wilgrea7: A few glancing blows as I am otherwise preoccupied. This bit is an obviously disingenuous red herring. You purport to address the moral argument which presupposes God's existence and quickly tell us to prove God's existence. You've defeated your own point by making it clear that objective morals do exist in the theistic faiths, so you've adjusted to arguing which set of morals should be considered objective. The argument is about morality and not the existence of God and is completely sound on its own. If you wish to address God's existence and why we are Christians rather than Muslims or Jews, go ahead a create a post to discuss it, but do not pretend that this is a challenge to the moral argument. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Endtimer: 3:26pm On Oct 09, 2022 |
Wilgrea7: The above is hardly representative of theistic consensus. You still think God just decides arbitrarily to do X or Y. It isn't God's definition of right and wrong; those are just words created to describe God's characteristics and their antithesis respectively. Also your argument's appeal is essentially ethical (ironic for someone trying to establish moral subjectivity). You must be aware that what the bacteria in the toilet feel has no bearing on moral objectivity. Therefore, you are trying to make us feel sorry for them rather than address the philosophical underpinnings of the moral argument. The last sentence makes sense. As someone must have already pointed out to you, the answer is: you don't. You have free will to do as you wish, however, you may find that lifelong marriage will fulfill you and that homosexuality will give you diseases; this isn't a form of the prosperity gospel (check out my post on antinomianism for more on that) but it is true in several instances. The reason for this is that: - You are made in God's image and your nature and mine are corrupted versions of His own. Living like He does therefore strangely provides otherworldly fulfillment. - God is not only omnibenevolent but omniscient. His knowledge of everything means that we have good reason to trust and emulate Him. - This is what you want to hear, so I'll be direct: failure to live like God will result in damnation. This and the two above are some reasons to live like God. This is from the top of my-tired-head so I expect to do a lot of qualifying and explaining when I get back. 1 Like |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Judas1X: 11:16pm On Oct 09, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:SMH. Hahahahahaha . The Internet can give low lives and nit wits an opportunity of admittance into the auditorium of great scholars, but it will not hide their manuscripts of poor mental acceleration and intellectual incompatibility. You are just giving shallow excuses to cover up your obvious dyslexia and attention deficit . Your blathering ripostes can only be from someone who came armed only with bigotry and hubris to an intellectual discuss. The question was pitch perfect clear. Not only did you avoid answering it directly, you constructed a false analogy that doesn't properly represent my original question. Note that I will continue to point out your dumb equivocations no matter how many times you try to pull them. Your mental imbalance is at a crossroad; tinkered by the bipolar permutations of the spirits of your ancestors and the pressures of a modern society. Fair enough. However, you still failed to present a proper example in your response, which leads me to conclude that you didn't even understand the question. The worst part isn't even your lack of understanding, it's how you deceive yourself into thinking you're making any sense in your trite posts Please look up the meaning of the term "Obvious" My post was about the existence of the agglomerates of fact that G.A.M means a bus going to or coming from Warri. (Object)An argument about the existence of such a bus would be closer to my question and not where the bus is headed. No one can reasonably claim that said bus doesn't exist cause all I'd have to do is show it to them 1 Like |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 6:19am On Oct 10, 2022 |
AuthenticKing: Which is why you are not able to answer for it is simply like a new newspaper flying today and still giving everyone the same news that is also contained in other older newspapers only with more news which the other papers do not have, is still valid. Which is my point AuthenticKing: You did not. But it is for the users and judges to decide. AuthenticKing: You guys need to understand that there is a distinction between the expression of an observable conduct, which may be unpleasant in the view of the person being complained of from an untrue and disrespectful statement. What I said there is mere description of what I see and I know everyone too can see the same thing just like seeing a man putting rice in his nostrils. There isn't any one who would not say that, "that man must be mad because he puts rice in his nose". This cannot be reasonably said to be an insult, especially in defamation (Law against insults) this is not one. AuthenticKing: Morals has not changed it is the people who have changed in becoming more and more disobedient to morals. AuthenticKing: It is even you people who come here to impose your anti-Godness on us as it says in the header "Religion: Share your faith and belief in God or higher powers here" So, this section is for us and we are allowed to hold and maintain our beliefs So it is you anti-religious people who are coming to impose your beliefs on us and then unreasonable taking offence over our matters whereas, we are in our land and our proper place. Atheist should not come here or in the alternative they should go straight to their territory "the non Christian chatbox" The matters about Bible and God is not for them and we all know it and can work with that if the atheists leave us alone. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Tamaratonye1(f): 6:38am On Oct 10, 2022 |
Wilgrea7: Endtimer:No. Wilgrea7 is correct. There is nothing objective about morals if they come from a god's opinion of what is right or wrong. Truly objective morals would require the god itself to adhere to them - for instance, the god of Christianity would be guilty of violating its own commandment against adultery by impregnating the betrothed Mary. FYI, this was never a debate about whether or not a god exists. When we criticize religious morality the god is simply there as a placeholder, a hypothetical with the subtext "If god X exists..." Endtimer: Endtimer:Smh, lmfao, didn't know god was alive - so others could live like "he" does): If "he's" alive "he" excretes waste. I suppose that's what these kinds of your excretions into these threads are - "his" excrement. Pretty filthy, lol Endtimer:I won't be holding my breath to read something of substance, rather than more ignorant ass twaddle from you "when you get back", Endtimer. You've shown quite clearly that when you have no answer you just pretend the questions weren't asked. You're as dishonest as the day is long, lol 2 Likes |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 6:45am On Oct 10, 2022 |
AuthenticKing: Now you are being unreasonable for I clearly asked that "before the people of Ur-Nammu and Hammurabi made legal was The Law not already there? Was stealing, Lying, Adultery, Murder etc not already in force? And of course you know the Answer is "yes, they were there", which is why you refused to answer the question but rather chose to dodge it, as is your right. So right now, you refuse to be reasonable because of the devastation you would feel from accepting the Truth that God is Real and the Bible is very Right after all, as is your right to choose. For every reasonable person already automatically knows that no baby can bring the law and if a baby, then his parents were under Law. And the record already shows that Ur and Hammurabi were formed by people who moved to the area and settled there. And those original settlers were under The Law that they did not make. No legal and No Code then! But I respect your right to refuse to accept The Truth, which is what makes the religious and the atheist incompatible and it is best that the 2 sides do not meet so as to prevent trespass against each other. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 7:04am On Oct 10, 2022 |
AuthenticKing: See it? You have now insulted the Bible by making a false accusation, yet you complain I insult when it is always you people who start the insults. You see it now! So also is the reports of those Hammurabi/Ur things where everything and everyone has conveniently disappeared, so that we can not confirm if what they reported is True. (Exactly how Lies Are and it is unbelievable how you people believe in something which does not exist) So definitely, their reports are suited and edited to ensure people become atheist. Unlike the Bible, Isreal, Ishmael, Rome, Egypt is here for everyone to see! AuthenticKing: It's already proven what it proves and not whatever you choose to say. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Near1: 10:27am On Oct 10, 2022 |
Endtimer: Just one question if I may. Why MUST God exist? |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Silverseed: 11:21am On Oct 10, 2022 |
Endtimer: For context for my questions below, you might want to know something about my views. I don’t believe in the reality or existence of anything that anyone can imagine or describe as a creator of the universe. I think that there is some good advice in Christian scriptures, but I don’t see any reason to think that Christians practice any of it better than other people do. In fact I’ve been thinking that Christian doctrines, Christian proselytizing, and Christian politics are and always have been hiding that advice from people and repelling them away from it. In some of your posts, it looked to me like you were saying that the world is better with Christianity than it would be without it. Am I understanding that correctly? In some others, it looked to me like you were saying that it’s better to use the way God lives as moral standard, than any other standard that anyone could propose. Am I understanding that correctly? Is that your definition of Christianity? Living the way God lives? I’m also wondering what you mean by “the way God lives”? How can we know anything about the way God lives? (later) Are you arguing against people denouncing Christianity and/or God beliefs? (later) Something else you might want to know about my views is that I think that the best way to live in the time of Jesus was the way he taught people to live. I'm not sure if that applies to our time or not. |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 12:03pm On Oct 10, 2022 |
Near1: As the Camry to Mr Toyoda and as as your phone to you, so also doth man to His Maker, Whom we call God! It's as simple as that! |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by Dtruthspeaker: 12:11pm On Oct 10, 2022 |
Silverseed: No different from refusing to travel with God is Good Motors. You have a right to use any of the other available options of travel eg "I hate God motors, or "I use my leg travel company" or "Juju Express" etc. The real-eyeity is that which ever vehicle you choose for traveling this life is your own suffer or enjoyment story. Na only Advice the Bible dey advice. No be by force say make you listen! |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by chryssanthe(f): 3:56pm On Oct 10, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker:What a bunch of rubbish! You've been so indoctrinated and brainwashed in religious dogma and threats of hell that you can't even see the horrors of what you believe. It's astonishing!! We have all shown you example after example of biblical genocide, rape, god sanctioned slavery, child murder, god's ethnic cleansing rampages and religious extortion and you blindly wave it aside because it's threatens your worldview just a little too much! Keep sweeping it under the rug, honey, where it's safe from your thoughts because its the only possible way you can keep believing this crap. Wow! You fell out of the tree of life and hit all the branches on the way down. Hahaha! You don't deserve anybody's time. You bald faced liar! 2 Likes |
Re: The Existence Of A God Does NOT Solve The Moral Dilemma by chryssanthe(f): 4:03pm On Oct 10, 2022 |
Dtruthspeaker: Read it and weep! 1 Samuel 6:19He tried to protect the arc, and was punished for it. Nice capricious deity you gots yourself. You just tell yourself any lie you want! The only thing you've proven is that you have a very very poor command of English, and that you make assertions which are false and unsupported! You claimed the Twelve tablets were the first human legal system, and you were 100% wrong. Did you have the integrity to stand corrected? No. Your pride cometh before your fall. You made all kinds of judgements, which you were told not to do. You tell yourself you are a Christian but you are not. You're nothing but a pathetic ignorant liar and hypocrite! 1 Like 1 Share |
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