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Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ - Religion (2) - Nairaland

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Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Janosky: 10:21pm On Oct 13, 2022
NNTR:


God is formless. As God is a Spirit, it means that has no physical form. However God does have masculine and feminine distinctive personalities plus characteristics associated with human beings (i.e. man and woman)

Janosky, beloved, before you step on my "God is formless" banana skin comment and get to slip on it, let me make myself clearer with the comment, by adding to it, that, God is shapeless and formless like water. When you pour water in a cup, it becomes the cup. When you pour water in a bottle, it becomes the bottle. When you pour water in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. When you pour water into a drum, it becomes the drum of water. That is why when Moses asked God who should he say sent him, if asked by the Israelites, (i.e. Moses was asking for God's personal name) God said to him: say I AM I AM sent you.

I AM I AM, in that narrative, is a descriptor, that means: 'I shall be that I shall be', also means, 'whatever it is necessary for God to be, that, God will be'.

God willl be a pillar of cloud in the day and become a pillar of fire to give the Israelites light at night while travelling in the wilderness enrolee to the Promised Land. So moving forward, God is formless, yet God can take on any form. I know it sounds like an oxymoron thing to say it that way, but God, though, truly is formless, can manifest Himself in any form, just as, He took on form, in that Nebuchadnezzar fiery furnace situation and et cetera

Greek John 4:24," the God is a spirit."
Greek John 5:37 "The Father who sent me..... His form you have never seen and His voice you have never heard".

The God of the holy scriptures is NOT formless.
John 4:24 & John 5:37, His form is spirit, (invisible God) never seen by man at any time"

JWs stick with Jesus doctrine @John 4 24 and 5:37.
Isaiah 6:8 Yahweh ha Elohim the God says :
"Whom shall I send?"

"Who will go for us? (His Council of holy Ones"(Psalm 89:5-7).
John 3:16, John 7:16= Isaiah 6:8 & John 5:37, According to Jesus Christ,did his Father, Yahweh Almighty come to the earth in human form?
No,in capital letters!

Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Janosky: 10:30pm On Oct 13, 2022
NNTR:
1.) When you speak or talk, where does your word(s) come from?
2.) Who does your word(s) represent?
3.) What is the origin of the words you speak, the words you utter?

Whether scam or not scam, I dont lose sleep over Trinity. To each their own because one has the freedom to limit God to trinity or not limit God to trinity.

Absolutely 150% correct, albeit, unfortunately, the Greek word, 'morphē', hasn't an English exact equivalent, what the word conveys in that Philippians 2:6 context, is Jesus already existed in the form of God, as in meaning, the character of God (i.e. having all the the mental and moral qualities that are distinctive to God or what God is known for)

John 14:12-18
'12I assure you and most solemnly say to you,
anyone who believes in Me [as Savior] will also do the things that I do;
and he will do even greater things than these [in extent and outreach], because I am going to the Father.
13And I will do whatever you ask in My name [as My representative], this I will do,
so that the Father may be glorified and celebrated in the Son.
14If you ask Me anything in My name [as My representative], I will do it.
15“If you [really] love Me, you will keep and obey My commandments.
16And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper (Comforter, Advocate, Intercessor--Counselor, Strengthener, Standby), to be with you forever--
17the Spirit of Truth, whom the world cannot receive [and take to its heart] because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He (the Holy Spirit) remains with you continually and will be in you.
18“I will not leave you as orphans [comfortless, bereaved, and helpless]; I will come [back] to you'

Absolutely 150% correct, as sons are subservient to the Father.
1.) Arent you subject to your father?
2.) Arent you obedient to your father?
3.) Why would you think that Jesus should be exempted from this rule?
4.) Why would you think that Jesus should be a law on to Himself, hmm?
5.) How do you reconcile John 14:16 (i.e. I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper) and John 14:18 (i.e. I will not leave you as orphans [comfortless, bereaved, and helpless]; I will come [back] to you), as in, who is that in John 14:16 and John 14:18?

Anyway, the word “greater” spoken of in John 14:28, is describing role, as in the function played in formulating the salvation, redemption and reconciliation plan and is not talking about essence or importance.

The Son ran an errand for the Father, carried out the wishes, the intent, the plan et cetera of the Father and went back to give the Father the update

Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.
To the bolded,is it obvious to you that Jesus is not the God (his Father) in person rather Jesus is a god by nature, attributes ?
The son having the attributes/nature of his Father. (John 10:34-36 & Psalms 82:6)
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by NNTR: 10:45pm On Oct 13, 2022
Janosky:
Romans 11:35-36, Jesus Christ came through his Father.
Did you come through your parents?
I came through my parents alright, but certainly didnt come the same way Isaac was born, neither not the same way Jesus was born.

The circumstances that surrounded Isaac's and Jesus' births were unique, their kind of births never got repeated again, simply on the basis that they were one-off births. They came about in a special and unique way, sort of means

Janosky:
Psalms 90:2, shey you understand?
Before the mountains were born Or You gave birth to the earth and the world, Even from everlasting to everlasting, You are God.
Yahweh the God "birth the earth and born the mountains.
Did Yahweh the God birth the earth/mountains and beget Jesus?
Let me reference your statement:
"the only begotten" phrase, means the only person uniquely gotten (i.e. born) this way."
That is Jesus Christ, the only person Yahweh beget.

Yahweh birth the earth/mountains.
Therefore, Yahweh the God beget Jesus.
The God Yahweh made the Universe (& other heavenly sons) through His only begotten son Jesus, Hebrew 1:2.
Absolutely 150% correct that YHWH aka Yahweh, aka Jehovah, God became the Father of Jesus.

Also absolutely 150% correct that YHWH aka Yahweh, aka Jehovah, God made the Universe & other heavenly sons (i.e. sun moon and stars or the Milky Way) through His only begotten son Jesus, who at the time is the Word.

Jesus, meaning Salvation comes from God, or God saves, as the Word, created the heavens and the earth (i.e. Psalms 33:6 - By the word, the heavens were made)

I've been known to birth ideas, that became baby projects for me.

Now answer this please easy, simple, direct, straightforward questions.

1.) At what point in time, did your Janosky Snr became a father?
2.) At what point in time, did you Janosky became a father?
3.) If not yet a father, then at what point in time, do you Janosky reckon you will become a father?
4.) What is absolutely necessary to qualify you to rightfully be called a father?

Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by NNTR: 11:02pm On Oct 13, 2022
Janosky:
Greek John 4:24," the God is a spirit."
Greek John 5:37 "The Father who sent me..... His form you have never seen and His voice you have never heard".

The God of the holy scriptures is NOT formless.
John 4:24 & John 5:37, His form is spirit, (invisible God) never seen by man at any time"

JWs stick with Jesus doctrine @John 4 24 and 5:37.
Isaiah 6:8 Yahweh ha Elohim the God says :
"Whom shall I send?"

"Who will go for us? (His Council of holy Ones"(Psalm 89:5-7).
John 3:16, John 7:16= Isaiah 6:8 & John 5:37, According to Jesus Christ, did his Father, Yahweh Almighty come to the earth in human form?
No, in capital letters!
Yahweh Almighty, right from garden of Eden, all manners of Angel of the Lord, from Sodom and Gomorrah, under the oak in Ophrah with Gideon, Manoah, Zechariah et cetera has been coming down to the earth, at various passages of time

The only way anyone can see and know how God looks like, is by seeing and looking at Jesus, as once you see Jesus, its the Father you've then seen (i.e. John 14:9)

Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by NNTR: 11:02pm On Oct 13, 2022
Janosky:
To the bolded, is it obvious to you that Jesus is not the God (his Father) in person rather Jesus is a god by nature, attributes ?
The son having the attributes/nature of his Father. (John 10:34-36 & Psalms 82:6)
1.) Why should it be impossible for Jesus to be God?
2.) Are you saying that it impossible for Jesus to be God?
3.) Are you saying that God hasn't the power to project Himself out to become Jesus?
4.) Are you saying that God, at any particular time, hasn't the capability to concurrently exist in heaven and on earth?

Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.

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Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Janosky: 11:28pm On Oct 13, 2022
NNTR:
1.) Why should it be impossible for Jesus to be God?
2.) Are you saying that it impossible for Jesus to be God?
3.) Are you saying that God hasn't the power to project Himself out to become Jesus?
4.) Are you saying that God, at any particular time, hasn't the capability to concurrently exist in heaven and on earth?

Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.
1. Matthew 27:46 & Revelation 3:12 , Jesus Christ said: "my God,my God,why have you forsaken me"?
Did God forsake himself?
2. I repeat question 1.
3. John 20:17 , Revelation 3:12 & John 5:37, According to Jesus Christ.

Do you agree with Jesus Christ statements
@John 20:17 , Revelation 3:12 & John 5:37?
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Janosky: 11:34pm On Oct 13, 2022
NNTR:
Yahweh Almighty, right from garden of Eden, all manners of Angel of the Lord, from Sodom and Gomorrah, under the oak in Ophrah with Gideon, Manoah, Zechariah et cetera has been coming down to the earth, at various passages of time

The only way anyone can see and know how God looks like, is by seeing and looking at Jesus, as once you see Jesus, its the Father you've then seen (i.e. John 14:9)

Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.
John 17:18,God his Father sent Jesus to preach to NNTR. When NNTR sees ,has NNTR seen Almighty?

John 17:18,When Jesus sent NNTR to preach to Janosky,has Janosky seen God?

Oga, your claim is not true, according to John 17:18, the statement of Jesus Christ.
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by NNTR: 9:27am On Oct 14, 2022
Janosky:
1. Matthew 27:46 & Revelation 3:12 , Jesus Christ said: "my God, my God, why have you forsaken me"?
Pfft, smh. You really think and believe that forsaken was what was in Matthew 27:46, hmm?. If you think and believe that, then hmm, have my sympathies for the ignorance of not knowing the reality of the true meaning and correct translation of that word.

Let me clear you with this, for your information, which is, ‘father..why have you forsaken me’ sic is incorrectly translated and so thereforem saying, it is a mistranslation.

Now watch this. David, at Psalm 22:1, said 'lama azabtani' (i.e. why have you forsaken me?) while Jesus, at Matthew 27:46 or Mark 15:34, said 'lama sabachthani' (i.e sacrificed me for this) as the suffix “thani” means: 'you do this to me' and 'zabach' with a short definition, alludes to slaughter(s) for sacrifice.

One of Jesus' last seven spoken words while He hung on the cross dying was 'My God, My God, this is what I died for' or ' ... I am slaughtered for sacrifice'

Here's a brief bird's-eye view lowdown about "nashatani" and "sabachthani"

"Nashatani" and "sabachthani" are both Aramaic. "Nashatani" is the Aramaic word, for the Hebrew word, "azabtani", where in Psalms 22:1, it is correctly translated, as the English word "forsaken." However it is worth noting, that, Jesus deliberating DID NOT quote Psalms 22:1 verbatim, blindly or directly but He consciously changed or switched language and used the Aramaic word "sabachthani", so as to make the distinction from the Aramaic "nashatani"

Now Janosky beloved, here to the interesting part, which is, if Jesus had wanted to say He was forsaken by God, then Jesus would have used "nashatani" and not "sabachthani" but Jesus, called His Father, My God, instead of My Father, simply, because He was paraphrasing the beginning of Psalm 22 (i.e. Psalm 22:1) just like He paraphrased the end of Psalm 22 (i.e Psalm 22:31) too.

Janosky:
Did God forsake himself?
On the backdrop of the above so far covered, of course not. Of course God did not forsake Himself, but rather God sacrificed Himself. Jesus is the sacrificial Lamb of God. Similar way Isaac, the only begotten son of Abram was to be a sacrifice before he was timely substituted by the ram provided by God

Janosky:
2. I repeat question 1.
3. John 20:17 , Revelation 3:12 & John 5:37, According to Jesus Christ.
Exodus 33:20
'But He said,
“You cannot see My face;
for no man shall see Me, and live.”'

1 Timothy 6:16
Only God lives forever!
And He lives in light that no one can come near.
No human has ever seen God or ever can see Him.
God will be honored, and his power will last forever. Amen.

If you like, repeat question 1 until your face turns blue, the fact, truth and reality as you see, at least from Exodus 33:20 and 1 Timothy 6:16, that God lives in unapproachable light, that no human being can approach. He lives in light that no one can come near, and so no human has ever seen God or ever can see Him. This is the reason why the closest than anyone can see God is by seeing Jesus, because once you see Jesus, you by de facto, have seen God.

Do you want or need to know how God looks like, then humbly look at Jesus, to see how God looks like beloved, my dear friend brother Janosky.

Janosky:
Do you agree with Jesus Christ statements
@John 20:17 , Revelation 3:12 & John 5:37?
I vehemently agree with all Jesus Christ' statements, whether here on this thread, whether elsewhere.

I eat, drink, walk, talk, sleep and wake up to Jesus Christ' statements. I loved to death each and every of Jesus Christ' statements.

Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by NNTR: 9:27am On Oct 14, 2022
Janosky:
John 17:18,God his Father sent Jesus to preach to NNTR. When NNTR sees, has NNTR seen Almighty?
Yes NNTR, has seen Almighty

Janosky:
John 17:18, When Jesus sent NNTR to preach to Janosky, has Janosky seen God?
NNTR cant speak for Janosky, nor vouch for Janosky whether Janosky has seen God.

Whenever NNTR speaks, people see and know that NNTR's word(s) comes from NNTR

Janosky:
Oga, your claim is not true, according to John 17:18, the statement of Jesus Christ.
John 17:18
'Just as You commissioned and sent Me into the world,
I also have commissioned and sent them (believers) into the world.'

Of course, God commissioned Himself and sent Himself into the world in the person of Jesus Christ, who interestingly, is God Incarnate, meaning God taking on a human being body, thats to say, Jesus is, God personified.

Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Mikee19(m): 6:57pm On Oct 14, 2022
MaxInDHouse:


YES many will become his brother by FAITH but i'm talking about his brothers before the creation of earth!

smileysmiley
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Kobojunkie: 7:16pm On Oct 14, 2022
Tochj:
Jesus is the first Born son of God Those who believe in him are his Brothers in the kingdom of his father,"John 1:12"
How do they become His brothers in the Kingdom of His Father? undecided

Also by becoming His brothers, do they also become His equals? undecided
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Mikee19(m): 7:26pm On Oct 14, 2022
MaxInDHouse:


God created only one creature (Jesus) who later created all other things following God's orders, that's what only begotten means!

cheesycheesy
2 ppl liked it. Not a sinlge sripture backing it up saying "he is only begotten because he is only created..." Observe that the only true support for "begotten = created" is the watchtower

1 Like

Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Tochj(m): 8:06pm On Oct 14, 2022
[quoqte author=Kobojunkie post=117563070] How do they become His brothers in the Kingdom of His Father? undecided

Also by becoming His brothers, do they also becwwß ftome His equals? undecided[/quote]
Jesus christ himself called us brothers not right too.
Rr rrrrsee christians are yet to grasp the benefits of confessing and bel
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Mikee19(m): 8:26pm On Oct 14, 2022
MaxInDHouse:


Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature. Colossians 1:15

There's no firstborn that's not a part of those been born just as a first child remains one of the children meaning he also came through the same process! wink

i love this! smiley

Means an ant is born of God too, as it "came through the same process" cheesy

As is a goat. And a stone. Following the same logic, all of these are children of God cheesy
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by MaxInDHouse(m): 8:55pm On Oct 14, 2022
Mikee19:

i love this! smiley
Means an ant is born of God too, as it "came through the same process" cheesy
As is a goat. And a stone. Following the same logic, all of these are children of God cheesy


Before the mountains were born or you brought forth the whole world, from everlasting to everlasting you are God. Psalms 90:2 NIV


Before the mountains were born Or you brought forth the earth and the productive land, From everlasting to everlasting, you are God. Psalms 90:2 NWT

Please who is the father who born mountains? smiley

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Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by MaxInDHouse(m): 8:57pm On Oct 14, 2022
Mikee19:


cheesycheesy
2 ppl liked it. Not a sinlge sripture backing it up saying "he is only begotten because he is only created..." Observe that the only true support for "begotten = created" is the watchtower

Just as nobody can quote any verse that says otherwise regarding the word begotten! wink
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Mikee19(m): 9:03pm On Oct 14, 2022
MaxInDHouse:


Just as nobody can quote any verse that says otherwise regarding the word begotten! wink

oh I certainly can. And I will...

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Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Mikee19(m): 9:07pm On Oct 14, 2022
MaxInDHouse:



Before the mountains were born or you brought forth the whole world, from everlasting to everlasting you are God. Psalms 90:2 NIV


Before the mountains were born Or you brought forth the earth and the productive land, From everlasting to everlasting, you are God. Psalms 90:2 NWT

Please who is the father who born mountains? smiley


lol mountain is a child of God. Na your own God born goat too? cheesy

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Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by MaxInDHouse(m): 9:13pm On Oct 14, 2022
Mikee19:

oh I certainly can. And I will...
Your type just run along there's nothing you know other than trying to chat with a JW so you're welcome.

Mikee19:

lol mountain is a child of God. Na your own God born goat too? cheesy
God refers to all creatures as His children He is the source of all lives no be sexual reproduction we dey talk nah who bring them come! wink

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Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Mikee19(m): 10:11pm On Oct 14, 2022
MaxInDHouse:

God refers to all creatures as His children...

I'll really love to see where God calls a stone and a goat his children. This sounds strange to me, certainly not my own God

Mountains being "born" was of course figurative, which is why u had to quote the NIV

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Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by MaxInDHouse(m): 5:34am On Oct 15, 2022
Mikee19:

I'll really love to see where God calls a stone and a goat his children. This sounds strange to me, certainly not my own God Mountains being "born" was of course figurative, which is why u had to quote the NIV
When God call any creature His children it's a figurative speech as well God is a spirit who has no physical shape you can describe so all creatures are His handiwork so Jesus who is the firstborn of all creations simply means the first creature God created.
Note that the scriptures did not say the firstborn of all humans rather all creations so whether living or nonliving all are God's creation and Jesus is the firstborn!
I never accepted you as a worshiper of my God for once so you and i aren't on the same page! wink

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Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by Mikee19(m): 5:49am On Oct 15, 2022
MaxInDHouse:

When God call any creature His children it's a figurative speech as well

Where? Just show me where! Did he say mountain is his child? Or goat? Or ant? Where in ur bible did he say they are his children? Not in one scrpture does God say this! If it were true u would be able to see scripture littered everywhere with God saying "My child, snake", "my child, stone", everywhere! U wont have to look for just one obscure scipture in the whole bible to try prove your point for something God always does. By the mouth of 2 or 3 witnesses every word is established. Way too weak to stand up in a court of law
Re: Yahushua Is Begotten And Not Created Son Of יהוה‎ by MaxInDHouse(m): 6:11am On Oct 15, 2022
Mikee19:

Where? Just show me where! Did he say mountain is his child? Or goat? Or ant? Where in ur bible did he say they are his children? Not in one scrpture does God say this! If it were true u would be able to see scripture littered everywhere with God saying "My child, snake", "my child, stone", everywhere! U wont have to look for just one obscure scipture in the whole bible to try prove your point for something God always does. By the mouth of 2 or 3 witnesses every word is established. Way too weak to stand up in a court of law

Don't digress too far, try to settle issues one after the other. This is what I told you:

MaxInDHouse:

Just as nobody can quote any verse that says otherwise regarding the word begotten! wink

The word BEGOTTEN remains undefined in the Bible and that's what you promised to quote a verse that tells specifically the meaning of that word "BEGOTTEN"

Mikee19:

oh I certainly can. And I will...

So go straight to the quotation i'm not ready for your hide and seek, God is the father of all creations and Jesus is the firstborn {Colossians 1:15} i won't go far with you on that because you're not ready to learn, i would have taught you how things like telephone, television, internet, automobiles and so many other inventions of man are God's CHILDREN.
YES! He gave birth to all these things but since you're not teachable i'll keep that for humble ones.
So provide the quotation that specifically defines that word BEGOTTEN! wink

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