Maynman:


My friend, Mention the “many good books” that you believe and base your life on?
Were these “good books” also edited, forged and corrected as the centuries goes by?
Were these “good books” complied from unknown sources by unknown authors?

I can't stop laughing.

Good bye friend.

Maynman:


How do you demonstrate to your kids that you serve a living god called yahweh, by quoting random books with UNKNOWN AUTHORS?

Yahweh worshipper, I base my life on myself, I’m not that miserable to be basing my life on jewish deity and their books with UNKNOWN AUTHORS.

You're very humorous. Lol.

Demonstrate by quoting books? Hahahaha.

Thanks for your time.

How come your mouth is no more rushing?

My friend, Mention the “many good books” that you believe and base your life on?
Were these “good books” also edited, forged and corrected as the centuries goes by?
Were these “good books” complied from unknown sources by unknown authors?

FxMasterz:


I can't stop laughing.

Good bye friend.

Stop lying to promote your deity
You’ve been indoctrinated with making claims with no evidence to back it up.

Goodbye liar.

Fxmasterz, And you are very obedient just like a sheep lol

FxMasterz:


You're very humorous. Lol.

Demonstrate by quoting books? Hahahaha.

Thanks for your time.

Theist, it seems your jewish deity doesn’t exist outside those forged books with UNKNOWN AUTHORS.
You were crying because of israelite god bwahahahah


Stop lying to promote your deity, have a nice day, my obedient friend

Maynman:
How come your mouth is no more rushing?

My friend, Mention the “many good books” that you believe and base your life on?
Were these “good books” also edited, forged and corrected as the centuries goes by?
Were these “good books” complied from unknown sources by unknown authors?


Stop lying to promote your deity
You’ve been indoctrinated with making claims with no evidence to back it up.

Goodbye liar.

Mtcheww

FxMasterz:


Mtcheww

Yahweh worshipper, Stop lying to promote your jewish deity bwahahahah

Maynman:


Yahweh worshipper, Stop lying to promote your jewish deity bwahahahah

Mtcheww

Have you stopped laughing? I’m very humorous, remember

FxMasterz:


Mtcheww

Yahweh worshipper, Stop lying to promote your jewish deity bwahahahah

Maynman:
Have you stopped laughing? I’m very humorous, remember


Yahweh worshipper, Stop lying to promote your jewish deity bwahahahah

Mtcheww.

FxMasterz:


Mtcheww.

Yahweh worshipper, Stop lying to promote your jewish deity bwahahahah

Maynman:


Yahweh worshipper, Stop lying to promote your jewish deity bwahahahah

Mtcheww

FxMasterz:


Mtcheww

Yahweh worshipper, Stop lying to promote your jewish deity bwahahahah

Maynman:
Exactly like smelling john momma, here is what you are worth jewish slave:
Wakanda 5:5— as bitter as bitter leaf, your life will be much bitter, you’ll have no reason to LAUGH, your live will be full of sorrow like a prisoner on death row.
No wonder you are an illiterate, this emoji means laughing,

oh so dum mayan maam

of course that emoji means laughing and so does this: bwahahahah
and you post them when what you say isn't even funny, that's what makes you
a laughing fool:

Ecclesiastes 7:6
For as the crackling of thorns under a pot, so is the laughter of the fool

u so dum, aren't you, don't understand anything

Maynman:
Slave you are mentally ill, aren’t you johnny, son of a smelling mum
You have so much resentment and pain because I don’t believe in your jewish fairy tale, and you’re repeatedly quoting dumb stuffs you read in a FORGED BOOK with UNKNOWN AUTHORS, you are as useless as your crazy homophile FATHER. Like Yahweh like johnw47

Ecclesiastes 7:6
For as the crackling of thorns under a pot, so is the laughter of the fool

mary mam u so so so dum, of course


lost blaspheming sewer mouth:

Rev_20:15  And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire

Exactly like smelling john maam , here is what you are worth jewish slave:
Wakanda 5:5— as bitter as bitter leaf, your life will be much bitter, you’ll have no reason to LAUGH, your live will be full of sorrow like a prisoner on death row.

No wonder you are an illiterate, this emoji means laughing, is that how you laugh at home?

johnw47:




oh so dum mayan maam

of course that emoji means laughing and so does this: bwahahahah
and you post them when what you say isn't even funny, that's what makes you
a laughing fool:

Ecclesiastes 7:6
For as the crackling of thorns under a pot, so is the laughter of the fool

u so dum, aren't you, don't understand anything



Ecclesiastes 7:6
For as the crackling of thorns under a pot, so is the laughter of the fool

u so so so dum, of course

lost blaspheming sewer mouth:

Rev_20:15  And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire

Wakanda 5:5— as bitter as bitter leaf, your life will be much bitter, you’ll have no reason to LAUGH, your live will be full of sorrow like a prisoner on death row.
No wonder you are an illiterate, this emoji cheesy means laughing,

You are a mentally Ill illiterate basing your miserable and rotten life on random books with UNKNOWN AUTHORS.

Maynman:
Exactly like smelling john maam , here is what you are worth jewish slave:
Wakanda 5:5— as bitter as bitter leaf, your life will be much bitter, you’ll have no reason to LAUGH, your live will be full of sorrow like a prisoner on death row.
No wonder you are an illiterate, this emoji means laughing, is that how you laugh at home?
Wakanda 5:5— as bitter as bitter leaf, your life will be much bitter, you’ll have no reason to LAUGH, your live will be full of sorrow like a prisoner on death row.
No wonder you are an illiterate, this emoji cheesy means laughing,
You are a mentally Ill illiterate basing your miserable and rotten life on random books with UNKNOWN AUTHORS.

as dum as they come mayan momma, that's why you are a laughing fool:

Ecclesiastes 7:6
For as the crackling of thorns under a pot, so is the laughter of the fool

johnw47:


as dum as they come mayan momma:

Ecclesiastes 7:6
For as the crackling of thorns under a pot, so is the laughter of the fool

As smelling and stinking as they come John momma, that’s why you are a bitter illiterate.

Wakanda 5:5— as bitter as bitter leaf, your life will be much more bitter, you’ll have no reason to LAUGH, your live will be full of sorrow.

TenQ:
Sorry to hear that you were banned. It may be because of the NL spam bots and not necessarily because someone Reported you.

Any ways, It is good to note that my objective here is NOT to win arguments (I am not a lawyer). My objective is to simply make Muslims who care for the TRUTH to ASK QUESTIONS which ordinarily they would not have asked.

How come the CLAIMS of Islam or Muslims usually cannot stand scrutiny?
If there was just one ERROR or CONTRADICTION in the Qur'an, would it still remain the book of Allah?
If I lived my life exactly as Prophet Mohammad, would I be among the best of people to live with?
How come Islamic translations of Arabic into English cannot be trusted (Either for the Qur'an, the Hadiths or the Tafsirs)?

If Allah is enough to defend himself,
Who are those Protecting Allah and his Messanger?
Are these people after the TRUTH or they just want to WIN?

Are you LegalWolf for the TRUTH or for a WIN?

I almost recited the Shahada in my 200Levels at the University because I read almost every book of Ahmed Deedat. However, I decided to read the Qur'an from cover to cover before officially sealing the conversion. I didn't go too far before seeing errors, contradictions and other signposts of danger. I could understand if the Qur'an contradicted the new testment, but I COULDN'T understand how the Qur'an will ALSO contradict the OLD testament.

I had to slow down to comprehend both Islam, Judaism and Christianity. Not too long after, I had the opportunity to read some hadiths in the library (My state library had a huge collection of them). The Hadiths killed everything that remained in Islam for me. I rededicated my life to Christ after this and had made it a mission to help Muslims ASK QUESTIONS!

Religion is EVERYTHING men DO as their ATTEMPT to please the Creator God!

Unfortunately, God can only be pleased IF you DO Religion according to His DIRECTIVE.

Till today, Muslims have not been able to tell me what Atonement means and why it was important in the Religion of Abraham and Moses! Maybe you'll be an exception!

Readers will only hear the absolute, undiluted and exposed truth of Islam from an ex muslim or someone like TenQ, who almost got proselytised to Islam (i.e. almost converted to Islam), and not from muslim posters like AntiChristian, LegalWolf et cetera

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

Maynman:

As smelling and stinking as they come John momma, that’s why you are a bitter illiterate.
Wakanda 5:5— as bitter as bitter leaf, your life will be much more bitter, you’ll have no reason to LAUGH, your live will be full of sorrow.

no, i will be full of joy like now, oh dum lost one

but as for you you:
Rev_20:15  And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire


see you later when i will yet again show you up for being a laughing fool and as dum as they come,
oh great big know nothing

johnw47:


no, i will be full of joy like now, oh dum lost one

but as for you you:
Rev_20:15  And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire


see you later when i will yet again show you up for being a laughing fool and as dum as they come,
oh great big know nothing

Worthless slaves like you deserve no happiness, this is what you are worth.
Wakanda 5:5— as bitter as bitter leaf, your life will be much more bitter, you’ll have no reason to LAUGH, your live will be full of sorrow.

This are the books you are basing your rotten and miserable life on, a bitter illiterate that has nothing to be happy about and a brainwashed sheep suffering from amnesia like your FATHER
This is how and your momma laugh at home

Me being disappointed is an understatement with respect to what you've called a rebuttal. A lawyer should be able to do much better. It is like you didn't look at my posts nor its pitch before responding. But, let me break it down for you

LegalWolf:


Loooool, it's quite unfortunate that I don't know how to clearly segregate post on Nairaland so I can respond exactly in the same format you did. But to avoid confusion. I will respond to your rebuttals in paragraphs.

REBUTTAL 1

To start with. You made allegations which I rebutted by explaining that the Gospel was not revealed to Jesus as the Quran clearly stated. That explanation has not been contradicted as we speak. SHOULD I TAKE THAT AS AN ADMISSION ?
a. You said and I quote
'Can you find me Islamic/Muslim Sources that EMPHATICALLY DENY that Muhammad is Prophesied by Jesus from the book of John. Failure to find examples is a prove that you lie with your answer"

Looool, your attempt to spin logic will fail. You are the one alleging that Islamic Sources claims the prophet is prophesied in the Book of John not me. So it is you to prove that no islamic source emphatically deny that.... Telling me to look for sources to back up your allegation is, with due respect, nonsensical. It adds nothing to my line of argument.

b. You cited Q7: 157 and alleged '...Mohammed's name is found written in the books of the Jews and Christians" Is that what the verse said? You have been the one copying translated verses in your previous posts, why don't you copy and paste a translated verse then let's discuss your version.

Perhaps, the question should have been - how many books do the Christians have to start with? [b] Or put it differently, [b] is the NT as a compedium or specifically the Book of John as an independent canon been the traditional rendition of the Bible from time immemorial? [b] Or are you trying to tell me than 1800 years ago, when the Bible is mentioned, [b] what comes to mind is the 27 canon compedium that we have today??

c. See my comments above. Christians are not even united in what book constitutes the bible to start with!!!!!!!!! Some canons deemed aprocryphal in protestant churches are canonical by the Catholic. So if you cannot even agree on, and unsure of, the most fundamental book of your religion, why claim that the Prophet is not referenced by the Injil... and which gospel are we talking about?

Your last two comments - the same way you cite the Quran as evidence acceptable to me is the same way that they cite the Bible as evidence acceptable to you.

Let me start with the silliest reponse youy made.
You said: "To start with. You made allegations which I rebutted by explaining that the Gospel was not revealed to Jesus as the Quran clearly stated. That explanation has not been contradicted as we speak. SHOULD I TAKE THAT AS AN ADMISSION ?"
My response: Actually, Allah told me that my name TenQ is written in one of the chapters of the Quran as one of the most dangerous antagonist to Mohammed. I believe you must have read about it because Jubril actually came to my room and squeezed me three times before relaying the words of Allah. Can you check carefully for my name BUT if you can't find it, that would be a confirmation that the Quran you have now is a FAKE Quran. The Uthmanic Quran definitely has TenQ written in one of the chapters.
Can you see your logic?

My Questions:
1. Can you find me Islamic/Muslim Sources that EMPHATICALLY DENY that Muhammad is Prophesied by Jesus from the book of John. Failure to find examples is a prove that you lie with your answer.
2. Allah says in the Quran that Mohammed's name is found written in the books of the Jews and Christians (Quran 7:157)
a. Is this a TRUE or FALSE statement by Allah?
b. If the above is TRUE, LegalWolf, where can the reference to Mohammed be found in the books of the Christians?
c. If the Mohammed is NOT Referenced by the books of the Christians, did Allah tell a lie?


You said: "But for the sake of this argument, I will agree that some Muslims have tried to prove that who Jesus was referring to that would come after him was the prophet. "
Meaning that many Muslims are EXCEPTIONS (and that includes you) to trying to find the Prophesied Muhammad in the book of John.

I gave a challenge:
1. Can you find me Islamic/Muslim Sources that EMPHATICALLY DENY that Muhammad is Prophesied by Jesus from the book of John. Failure to find examples is a prove that you tell a lie with your answer.

You know the answer, there is NONE!
The implication: Why do Muslims look for a prophecy in a book that is NOT DEVINE!

I then followed up with a PERSONAL Question to You LegalWolf
2. Allah says in the Quran that Mohammed's name is found written in the books of the Jews and Christians (Quran 7:157)
a. Is this a TRUE or FALSE statement by Allah?
b. If the above is TRUE, LegalWolf, where can the reference to Mohammed be found in the books of the Christians?
c. If the Mohammed is NOT Referenced by the books of the Christians, did Allah tell a lie?

You will observe that you couldn't answer the questions.

I cited Quran 7:157 just to remind you of where Allah told you Muslims that the Books of the Jews and Christians wrote about Mohammed. I thereby followed up with three Questions 2a, 2b and 2c about YOUR position. Did you appropriately respond to the questions?

My SECOND Inquisition:
Did Allah implores Muslims to believe in the scriptures revealed before the Qur'an ?
Al-Baqarah 2:4
وَٱلَّذِينَ يُؤْمِنُونَ بِمَآ أُنزِلَ إِلَيْكَ وَمَآ أُنزِلَ مِن قَبْلِكَ وَبِٱلْءَاخِرَةِ هُمْ يُوقِنُونَ
Surat-ul Baqara (2):136
Say ye: "We believe in God, and the revelation given to us, and to Abraham, Ismail, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, and that given to Moses and Jesus, and that given to (all) the prophets from their Lord; We make no difference between one and another of them.

Surat-ul Baqara (2):285
The Apostle (prophet) believeth in what hath been revealed to him from his Lord, as do the men of faith. Each one (of them) believeth in God, His angels, His books, and His apostles.

Surat-un Nisaa (4):136
O ye who believe! Believe in God, and His apostle, and the scripture which He sent to His apostle, and the scripture which He sent to those before (him). Any who denieth God, His angels, His Books, His apostles, and the Day of Judgment hath gone far, far astray.

All you needed to do was to affirm or deny whether you are more knowledgeable than your Allah who says
i. he makes no distinction between the books nor the messengers
ii. You will recall that Allah refers to ALL the messengers prior to Mohammed and their books

LegalWolf:

REBUTTAL TWO

All your explanation here is hogwash and yhwh's wahala. Since you are the one making the Quran as our basis for the Bible, bring evidence that the current NT was revealed to Jesus or any of the alleged disciples is a prophet according to the Quran u cited. In the absence of that, you have no case!

1. Can you prove that the Scriptures Allah was referring to in the Quran had gone into extinction or Allah believed that the books were still with the Jews and Christians?
2. If the books were lost, why would Allah himself give the title "People of the Book" to Jews and Christians?

The same evidence that Jesus was given the Injeel or the New Testament is that My name TenQ is found in the original Quran, if you cant find it, it means your Quran is corrupted! LOL!

My THIRD Inquisition:
3. Did your prophet Muhammad make judgement of stoning an adulteress by asking the Jews to refer to the Torah (remember when a Jew covered the word stoning in the Torah...LOL!)?

There you went COMPLETLY at tangent even when I gave you EVIDENCE of Mohammed making Life/Death Judgement on a woman caught in adultery. Is the Hadith fabricated as usual (as Muslims are the biggest liars ever amongst human beings on earth)?

LegalWolf:

REBUTTAL THREE.
Still off-point. Are you confusing the topic of abrogation with the question of the NT being a dubiously forged propaganda book?

If modern day Muslims like you claim that the Books of the Jews/the Old Testament were corrupted, it seems your prophet thinks otherwise.

The Hadith again (in case you never came across it)
Sahih Muslim 1699a :Book 29, Hadith 40
Abdullah b. 'Umar reported that a Jew and a Jewess were brought to Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) who had committed adultery. Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) came to the Jews and said:

What do you find in Torah for one who commits adultery? They said: We darken their faces and make them ride on the donkey with their faces turned to the opposite direction (and their backs touching each other), and then they are taken round (the city). He said: Bring Torah if you are truthful. They brought it and recited it until when they came to the verse pertaining to stoning, the person who was reading placed his hand on the verse pertaining to stoning, and read (only that which was) between his hands and what was subsequent to that. Abdullah b. Salim who was at that time with the Messenger of Allah (ﷺ) said: Command him (the reciter) to lift his hand. He lifted it and there was, underneath that, the verse pertaining to stoning. Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) pronounced judgment about both of them and they were stoned. Abdullah b. 'Umar said: I was one of those who stoned them, and I saw him (the Jew) protecting her (the Jewess) with his body.


1. Would you support the Motion that Mohammed was wrong in citing Judgement from a book that is corrupt?

Maynman:

Worthless slaves like you deserve no happiness, this is what you are worth.
Wakanda 5:5— as bitter as bitter leaf, your life will be much more bitter, you’ll have no reason to LAUGH, your live will be full of sorrow.
This are the books you are basing your rotten and miserable life on, a bitter illiterate that has nothing to be happy about and a brainwashed sheep suffering from amnesia like your FATHER
This is how and your momma laugh at home

Ecclesiastes 7:6
For as the crackling of thorns under a pot, so is the laughter of the fool


poor tormented, hateful, angry, lost dum dum,

Rev_20:15  And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire

TenQ:
Me being disappointed is an understatement with respect to what you've called a rebuttal. A lawyer should be able to do much better. It is like you didn't look at my posts nor its pitch before responding. But, let me break it down for you


Let me start with the silliest reponse youy made.
You said: "To start with. You made allegations which I rebutted by explaining that the Gospel was not revealed to Jesus as the Quran clearly stated. That explanation has not been contradicted as we speak. SHOULD I TAKE THAT AS AN ADMISSION ?"
My response: Actually, Allah told me that my name TenQ is written in one of the chapters of the Quran as one of the most dangerous antagonist to Mohammed. I believe you must have read about it because Jubril actually came to my room and squeezed me three times before relaying the words of Allah. Can you check carefully for my name BUT if you can't find it, that would be a confirmation that the Quran you have now is a FAKE Quran. The Uthmanic Quran definitely has TenQ written in one of the chapters.
Can you see your logic?

My Questions:
1. Can you find me Islamic/Muslim Sources that EMPHATICALLY DENY that Muhammad is Prophesied by Jesus from the book of John. Failure to find examples is a prove that you lie with your answer.
2. Allah says in the Quran that Mohammed's name is found written in the books of the Jews and Christians (Quran 7:157)
a. Is this a TRUE or FALSE statement by Allah?
b. If the above is TRUE, LegalWolf, where can the reference to Mohammed be found in the books of the Christians?
c. If the Mohammed is NOT Referenced by the books of the Christians, did Allah tell a lie?


You said: "But for the sake of this argument, I will agree that some Muslims have tried to prove that who Jesus was referring to that would come after him was the prophet. "
Meaning that many Muslims are EXCEPTIONS (and that includes you) to trying to find the Prophesied Muhammad in the book of John.

I gave a challenge:
1. Can you find me Islamic/Muslim Sources that EMPHATICALLY DENY that Muhammad is Prophesied by Jesus from the book of John. Failure to find examples is a prove that you tell a lie with your answer.

You know the answer, there is NONE!
The implication: Why do Muslims look for a prophecy in a book that is NOT DEVINE!

I then followed up with a PERSONAL Question to You LegalWolf
2. Allah says in the Quran that Mohammed's name is found written in the books of the Jews and Christians (Quran 7:157)
a. Is this a TRUE or FALSE statement by Allah?
b. If the above is TRUE, LegalWolf, where can the reference to Mohammed be found in the books of the Christians?
c. If the Mohammed is NOT Referenced by the books of the Christians, did Allah tell a lie?

You will observe that you couldn't answer the questions.

I cited Quran 7:157 just to remind you of where Allah told you Muslims that the Books of the Jews and Christians wrote about Mohammed. I thereby followed up with three Questions 2a, 2b and 2c about YOUR position. Did you appropriately respond to the questions?

My SECOND Inquisition:
Did Allah implores Muslims to believe in the scriptures revealed before the Qur'an ?
Al-Baqarah 2:4
وَٱلَّذِينَ يُؤْمِنُونَ بِمَآ أُنزِلَ إِلَيْكَ وَمَآ أُنزِلَ مِن قَبْلِكَ وَبِٱلْءَاخِرَةِ هُمْ يُوقِنُونَ
Surat-ul Baqara (2):136
Say ye: "We believe in God, and the revelation given to us, and to Abraham, Ismail, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, and that given to Moses and Jesus, and that given to (all) the prophets from their Lord; We make no difference between one and another of them.

Surat-ul Baqara (2):285
The Apostle (prophet) believeth in what hath been revealed to him from his Lord, as do the men of faith. Each one (of them) believeth in God, His angels, His books, and His apostles.

Surat-un Nisaa (4):136
O ye who believe! Believe in God, and His apostle, and the scripture which He sent to His apostle, and the scripture which He sent to those before (him). Any who denieth God, His angels, His Books, His apostles, and the Day of Judgment hath gone far, far astray.

All you needed to do was to affirm or deny whether you are more knowledgeable than your Allah who says
i. he makes no distinction between the books nor the messengers
ii. You will recall that Allah refers to ALL the messengers prior to Mohammed and their books





1. Can you prove that the Scriptures Allah was referring to in the Quran had gone into extinction or Allah believed that the books were still with the Jews and Christians?
2. If the books were lost, why would Allah himself give the title "People of the Book" to Jews and Christians?

The same evidence that Jesus was given the Injeel or the New Testament is that My name TenQ is found in the original Quran, if you cant find it, it means your Quran is corrupted! LOL!

My THIRD Inquisition:
3. Did your prophet Muhammad make judgement of stoning an adulteress by asking the Jews to refer to the Torah (remember when a Jew covered the word stoning in the Torah...LOL!)?

There you went COMPLETLY at tangent even when I gave you EVIDENCE of Mohammed making Life/Death Judgement on a woman caught in adultery. Is the Hadith fabricated as usual (as Muslims are the biggest liars ever amongst human beings on earth)?


If modern day Muslims like you claim that the Books of the Jews/the Old Testament were corrupted, it seems your prophet thinks otherwise.

The Hadith again (in case you never came across it)
Sahih Muslim 1699a :Book 29, Hadith 40
Abdullah b. 'Umar reported that a Jew and a Jewess were brought to Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) who had committed adultery. Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) came to the Jews and said:

What do you find in Torah for one who commits adultery? They said: We darken their faces and make them ride on the donkey with their faces turned to the opposite direction (and their backs touching each other), and then they are taken round (the city). He said: Bring Torah if you are truthful. They brought it and recited it until when they came to the verse pertaining to stoning, the person who was reading placed his hand on the verse pertaining to stoning, and read (only that which was) between his hands and what was subsequent to that. Abdullah b. Salim who was at that time with the Messenger of Allah (ﷺ) said: Command him (the reciter) to lift his hand. He lifted it and there was, underneath that, the verse pertaining to stoning. Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) pronounced judgment about both of them and they were stoned. Abdullah b. 'Umar said: I was one of those who stoned them, and I saw him (the Jew) protecting her (the Jewess) with his body.


1. Would you support the Motion that Mohammed was wrong in citing Judgement from a book that is corrupt?

You cannot be smart by half:

QUESTION ONE

Your follow-up question is:

Actually, Allah told me that my name TenQ is written in one of the chapters of the Quran as one of the most dangerous antagonist to Mohammed. I believe you must have read about it because Jubril actually came to my room and squeezed me three times before relaying the words of Allah. Can you check carefully for my name BUT if you can't find it, that would be a confirmation that the Quran you have now is a FAKE Quran. The Uthmanic Quran definitely has TenQ written in one of the chapters.
Can you see your logic?

My response: Your argument relies on two faulty premises:

- That the name TenQ is in an alleged scripture is a proof in itself that the scripture is authentic
- That there is only one scripture everyone recognizes.

In short, your argument would be on solid ground if there is ONLY ONE rendition of that scripture in question. For example, there is no dispute as to when the Torah is mentioned, this is the exact book we are referring to . Everyone is clear on that as far as I can remember. Whether you are a Sephardi, Ashkenazi, Mizrahi etc', there is just one Torah. For Muslims, whether you are a Sunni, Shia, Ibadi, Quranist, just name it, reference to Quran as a scripture is universally accepted. We know exactly which book you are referring to!

But is that the case for Christianity? Are you telling me that when the word gospel is mentioned (which is the direct translation of Injil), this is the book we are talking about? Is it John, or Mark, or Revelation, or Pauline Epistles, or Acts ... which exactly are we talking about? Or is any of the 7 additional gospels in the Catholic Bible ? Or other books deemed aprocryphal by Protestants but used in Greek Orthodox. Which one exactly?

Quran 7:157 that you cited as a reminder is no proof actually to support your case and your personal challenge is not even a challenge to start with. I should look for proof in the book of Christians? THE QUESTION I KEEP ASKING WHICH YOU HAVE DELIBERATELY REFUSED TO ANSWER is; exactly which Christian are we talking about and which of their books are we talking about ?? Is it Catholic and their Bible? Protestant and their Bible? Greek Orthodox? Nestorian ? Which exactly? [/b] Or are you trying to tell me like that like Jews and Muslims, ALL Christians use just one Bible/gospel?

QUESTION TWO
1. Can you prove that the Scriptures Allah was referring to in the Quran had gone into extinction or Allah believed that the books were still with the Jews and Christians?
2. If the books were lost, why would Allah himself give the title "People of the Book" to Jews and Christians?

Can I proof that the Book Allah was referring to as gone into extinction? Just to be sure, what type of proof are you expecting me to bring? Is it papyrus roll or parchment you want me to find? What exact form of evidence do you want so let us start there. And on 2, this is funny. But just to avoid the allegation that I don't answer your questions, they are called people of the book because Moses and Jesus were given scriptures! Any question?

QUESTION THREE

Again, I see no proof in your evidence that supports the NT has the word of God. Remember, the overall goal of this exercise is not the Torah but the NT because you claim that that is a scripture Allah enjoined Muslims to believe. The focus my good friend is the New Testament.

Apart from that, from a moral perspective and not a religious one, that is a testament of the Prophet being an excellent human being and leader. He judged a Jew according to his own books/scriptures/laws and not the Quran. Logically speaking, is that not sensible to you?

As you say, there you have your answers!

BACK TO THE MAIN QUESTION, IS THE BOOK OF JOHN THE PRODUCT OF AN INTELLIGENT BEING?

NNTR:
Readers will only hear the absolute, undiluted and exposed truth of Islam from an ex muslim or someone like TenQ, who almost got proselytised to Islam (i.e. almost converted to Islam), and not from muslim posters like AntiChristian, LegalWolf et cetera

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

What exactly is your point NNTR? I avoided giving you detailed response because I notice you have nothing of substance to say but just unintelligent mumbles and rants. Calm down and tell me what exactly what is your point and what you want.... are you hungry?

TenQ:
Me being disappointed is an understatement with respect to what you've called a rebuttal. A lawyer should be able to do much better. It is like you didn't look at my posts nor its pitch before responding. But, let me break it down for you


Let me start with the silliest reponse youy made.
You said: "To start with. You made allegations which I rebutted by explaining that the Gospel was not revealed to Jesus as the Quran clearly stated. That explanation has not been contradicted as we speak. SHOULD I TAKE THAT AS AN ADMISSION ?"
My response: Actually, Allah told me that my name TenQ is written in one of the chapters of the Quran as one of the most dangerous antagonist to Mohammed. I believe you must have read about it because Jubril actually came to my room and squeezed me three times before relaying the words of Allah. Can you check carefully for my name BUT if you can't find it, that would be a confirmation that the Quran you have now is a FAKE Quran. The Uthmanic Quran definitely has TenQ written in one of the chapters.
Can you see your logic?

My Questions:
1. Can you find me Islamic/Muslim Sources that EMPHATICALLY DENY that Muhammad is Prophesied by Jesus from the book of John. Failure to find examples is a prove that you lie with your answer.
2. Allah says in the Quran that Mohammed's name is found written in the books of the Jews and Christians (Quran 7:157)
a. Is this a TRUE or FALSE statement by Allah?
b. If the above is TRUE, LegalWolf, where can the reference to Mohammed be found in the books of the Christians?
c. If the Mohammed is NOT Referenced by the books of the Christians, did Allah tell a lie?


You said: "But for the sake of this argument, I will agree that some Muslims have tried to prove that who Jesus was referring to that would come after him was the prophet. "
Meaning that many Muslims are EXCEPTIONS (and that includes you) to trying to find the Prophesied Muhammad in the book of John.

I gave a challenge:
1. Can you find me Islamic/Muslim Sources that EMPHATICALLY DENY that Muhammad is Prophesied by Jesus from the book of John. Failure to find examples is a prove that you tell a lie with your answer.

You know the answer, there is NONE!
The implication: Why do Muslims look for a prophecy in a book that is NOT DEVINE!

I then followed up with a PERSONAL Question to You LegalWolf
2. Allah says in the Quran that Mohammed's name is found written in the books of the Jews and Christians (Quran 7:157)
a. Is this a TRUE or FALSE statement by Allah?
b. If the above is TRUE, LegalWolf, where can the reference to Mohammed be found in the books of the Christians?
c. If the Mohammed is NOT Referenced by the books of the Christians, did Allah tell a lie?

You will observe that you couldn't answer the questions.

I cited Quran 7:157 just to remind you of where Allah told you Muslims that the Books of the Jews and Christians wrote about Mohammed. I thereby followed up with three Questions 2a, 2b and 2c about YOUR position. Did you appropriately respond to the questions?

My SECOND Inquisition:
Did Allah implores Muslims to believe in the scriptures revealed before the Qur'an ?
Al-Baqarah 2:4
وَٱلَّذِينَ يُؤْمِنُونَ بِمَآ أُنزِلَ إِلَيْكَ وَمَآ أُنزِلَ مِن قَبْلِكَ وَبِٱلْءَاخِرَةِ هُمْ يُوقِنُونَ
Surat-ul Baqara (2):136
Say ye: "We believe in God, and the revelation given to us, and to Abraham, Ismail, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, and that given to Moses and Jesus, and that given to (all) the prophets from their Lord; We make no difference between one and another of them.

Surat-ul Baqara (2):285
The Apostle (prophet) believeth in what hath been revealed to him from his Lord, as do the men of faith. Each one (of them) believeth in God, His angels, His books, and His apostles.

Surat-un Nisaa (4):136
O ye who believe! Believe in God, and His apostle, and the scripture which He sent to His apostle, and the scripture which He sent to those before (him). Any who denieth God, His angels, His Books, His apostles, and the Day of Judgment hath gone far, far astray.

All you needed to do was to affirm or deny whether you are more knowledgeable than your Allah who says
i. he makes no distinction between the books nor the messengers
ii. You will recall that Allah refers to ALL the messengers prior to Mohammed and their books





1. Can you prove that the Scriptures Allah was referring to in the Quran had gone into extinction or Allah believed that the books were still with the Jews and Christians?
2. If the books were lost, why would Allah himself give the title "People of the Book" to Jews and Christians?

The same evidence that Jesus was given the Injeel or the New Testament is that My name TenQ is found in the original Quran, if you cant find it, it means your Quran is corrupted! LOL!

My THIRD Inquisition:
3. Did your prophet Muhammad make judgement of stoning an adulteress by asking the Jews to refer to the Torah (remember when a Jew covered the word stoning in the Torah...LOL!)?

There you went COMPLETLY at tangent even when I gave you EVIDENCE of Mohammed making Life/Death Judgement on a woman caught in adultery. Is the Hadith fabricated as usual (as Muslims are the biggest liars ever amongst human beings on earth)?


If modern day Muslims like you claim that the Books of the Jews/the Old Testament were corrupted, it seems your prophet thinks otherwise.

The Hadith again (in case you never came across it)
Sahih Muslim 1699a :Book 29, Hadith 40
Abdullah b. 'Umar reported that a Jew and a Jewess were brought to Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) who had committed adultery. Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) came to the Jews and said:

What do you find in Torah for one who commits adultery? They said: We darken their faces and make them ride on the donkey with their faces turned to the opposite direction (and their backs touching each other), and then they are taken round (the city). He said: Bring Torah if you are truthful. They brought it and recited it until when they came to the verse pertaining to stoning, the person who was reading placed his hand on the verse pertaining to stoning, and read (only that which was) between his hands and what was subsequent to that. Abdullah b. Salim who was at that time with the Messenger of Allah (ﷺ) said: Command him (the reciter) to lift his hand. He lifted it and there was, underneath that, the verse pertaining to stoning. Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) pronounced judgment about both of them and they were stoned. Abdullah b. 'Umar said: I was one of those who stoned them, and I saw him (the Jew) protecting her (the Jewess) with his body.


1. Would you support the Motion that Mohammed was wrong in citing Judgement from a book that is corrupt?

Hey TenQ

This is actually a rejoinder to my previous post and you can treat both as a single post (and I apologize I mentioned you twice). I woke up quiet early this morning to deal with some office work in preparation for a trial. Depending on when the case is called, I may not have time to respond on time to your question (although I may be in court and still checking Nairaland... particularly I always await your response . It is a past time for me).

I just did a quick search on my Quran and it would seem to me that OUR ALMIGHTY Allah (the most glorified, the most high) only used the reference 'maktooban indahum fi taura wal-injil' in that Quran 7:157 alone. Roughly translating the first section of that verse, is '... the illiterate prophet whom they find written (not named as that has a different meaning. As you can tell, maktooban is derived from the verb Maktoob which literally means 'write') in the Taura and Injil with them . Again, the key point here is WITH THEM!!!!!!!!!!!! TenQ in case you cannot read well, the emphasis is THE TAORAH AND INJIL WITH THEM .

Now, as you have cited severally, the Quran often referenced the Taorah and Injil as a book revealed to Moses and Jesus respectively. You have previously provided the reference but should I cite more? Almost every single time that the Taurah and Injil is mentioned, it is in the context of books either sent or revealed to the respective prophet. So how come this is different?

The only logical proposition this verse can support is that God is telling people like you TenQ that even the book with you, the unlettered prophet is written (about). I want to use direct literal translation as possible as I understand the problem of language quite clearly (remember, the hoax called NT is in Greek not Aramaic or Hebrew ). The emphasis is in the book with you and NOT the book I revealed to Jesus with you? If that were the case, that would have undoubtedly made your case. But this Q5;157 in no way lends credence to the assertion that the book with you is the book the Almighty revealed to Jesus . This is dumb logic TenQ and I expect you to be smarter than that..

Based on the above, Muslims are logically correct to cite the book of John (as a dubious book with Christians) that Prophet is written/mentioned. But we cannot accept the proposition that this book of John or any of the gospel is the one revealed by Allah to Jesus.

JUDGE

'Counsel TenQ, do you have any objection to either the premise or conclusion LegalWolf drew in the above'?

Catch you later !

LegalWolf:


You cannot be smart by half:

QUESTION ONE

Your follow-up question is:

Actually, Allah told me that my name TenQ is written in one of the chapters of the Quran as one of the most dangerous antagonist to Mohammed. I believe you must have read about it because Jubril actually came to my room and squeezed me three times before relaying the words of Allah. Can you check carefully for my name BUT if you can't find it, that would be a confirmation that the Quran you have now is a FAKE Quran. The Uthmanic Quran definitely has TenQ written in one of the chapters.
Can you see your logic?

My response: Your argument relies on two faulty premises:

- That the name TenQ is in an alleged scripture is a proof in itself that the scripture is authentic
- That there is only one scripture everyone recognizes.

In short, your argument would be on solid ground if there is ONLY ONE rendition of that scripture in question. For example, there is no dispute as to when the Torah is mentioned, this is the exact book we are referring to . Everyone is clear on that as far as I can remember. Whether you are a Sephardi, Ashkenazi, Mizrahi etc', there is just one Torah. For Muslims, whether you are a Sunni, Shia, Ibadi, Quranist, just name it, reference to Quran as a scripture is universally accepted. We know exactly which book you are referring to!

But is that the case for Christianity? Are you telling me that when the word gospel is mentioned (which is the direct translation of Injil), this is the book we are talking about? Is it John, or Mark, or Revelation, or Pauline Epistles, or Acts ... which exactly are we talking about? Or is any of the 7 additional gospels in the Catholic Bible ? Or other books deemed aprocryphal by Protestants but used in Greek Orthodox. Which one exactly?

Quran 7:157 that you cited as a reminder is no proof actually to support your case and your personal challenge is not even a challenge to start with. I should look for proof in the book of Christians? THE QUESTION I KEEP ASKING WHICH YOU HAVE DELIBERATELY REFUSED TO ANSWER is; exactly which Christian are we talking about and which of their books are we talking about ?? Is it Catholic and their Bible? Protestant and their Bible? Greek Orthodox? Nestorian ? Which exactly? [/b] Or are you trying to tell me like that like Jews and Muslims, ALL Christians use just one Bible/gospel?

First, all the questions you missed
1. I gave a challenge:
Can you find me Islamic/Muslim Sources that EMPHATICALLY DENY that Muhammad is Prophesied by Jesus from the book of John. Failure to find examples is a prove that you tell a lie with your answer.
2. I then followed up with a PERSONAL Question to You LegalWolf
Allah says in the Quran that Mohammed's name is found written in the books of the Jews and Christians (Quran 7:157)
a. Is this a TRUE or FALSE statement by Allah?
b. If the above is TRUE, LegalWolf, where can the reference to Mohammed be found in the books of the Christians?
c. If the Mohammed is NOT Referenced by the books of the Christians, did Allah tell a lie?

Just a reminder. Now back to your weak rebuttal!

I made a claim: that Allah told me that my name is written in the Uthmanic Quran AND that IF you can't find it, your present Qur'an is FAKE

You now created TWO FALSE assumptions (which I never did) that
- That the name TenQ is in an alleged scripture is a proof in itself that the scripture is authentic
- That there is only one scripture everyone recognizes.
Corrections:
1. The Alleged Scripture is the Uthmanic Qur'an which according to YOU Muslims is AUTHENTIC!
2. Are their many Qur'ans?
Here are my assumptions:
1. That because I claim that Allah said that my name is in the Uthmanic Qur'an, then my claim must be true!
2. That if you Muslims cannot find my name written in the Qur'an according toy claim, then it's a SUFFICIENT Proof that your present Qur'an is corrupted!
Compare with the parallel narration in Islam:
1. That because Mohammad claimed that Allah said that his name is in the the Books of the Jews and the Christians, then his claim must be true!
2. That if we Christians cannot find Mohammed's name written in the Scriptures according to Mohammed's claim, then it's a SUFFICIENT Proof that our present Scripture is corrupted!
You can now rephrase your argument appropriately to refute my claim.

By the way:
1. Is the Torah just one BOOK or a compilation of Books?
2. What does the word Injeel mean? Is it a book or a compilation of books?
Please cite references

LegalWolf:

QUESTION TWO
1. Can you prove that the Scriptures Allah was referring to in the Quran had gone into extinction or Allah believed that the books were still with the Jews and Christians?
2. If the books were lost, why would Allah himself give the title "People of the Book" to Jews and Christians?

Can I proof that the Book Allah was referring to as gone into extinction? Just to be sure, what type of proof are you expecting me to bring? Is it papyrus roll or parchment you want me to find? What exact form of evidence do you want so let us start there. And on 2, this is funny. But just to avoid the allegation that I don't answer your questions, they are called people of the book because Moses and Jesus were given scriptures! Any question?

My Questions again:
1. Can you prove that the Scriptures Allah was referring to in the Quran had gone into extinction or Allah believed that the books were still with the Jews and Christians?
2. If the books were lost, why would Allah himself give the title "People of the Book" to Jews and Christians?
All I need is your Islamic Evidence either by Allah or by Mohammed that the scriptures referred to in the Qur'an are gone extinct! QED!
Otherwise, you are making up your own conjectures!
Does LegalWolf words override those of Allah and his Messanger!?

Did I not give you several Quranic verses where Allah spoke so clearly about the revealed books!?

All you needed to do was to affirm or deny whether you are more knowledgeable than your Allah who says
i. he makes no distinction between the books nor the messengers
ii. You will recall that Allah refers to ALL the messengers prior to Mohammed and their books

LegalWolf:

QUESTION THREE

Again, I see no proof in your evidence that supports the NT has the word of God. Remember, the overall goal of this exercise is not the Torah but the NT because you claim that that is a scripture Allah enjoined Muslims to believe. The focus my good friend is the New Testament.

Apart from that, from a moral perspective and not a religious one, that is a testament of the Prophet being an excellent human being and leader. He judged a Jew according to his own books/scriptures/laws and not the Quran. Logically speaking, is that not sensible to you?

As you say, there you have your answers!

BACK TO THE MAIN QUESTION, IS THE BOOK OF JOHN THE PRODUCT OF AN INTELLIGENT BEING?

Barrister LegalWolf, I summoned YOUR prophet as an example of the best of the Muslims who judged from the Torah (as one of the scriptures you claim is corrupted). If Mohammed referred to such books, who are you to refute his evidence?
My THIRD Inquisition:
3. Did your prophet Muhammad make judgement of stoning an adulteress by asking the Jews to refer to the Torah (remember when a Jew covered the word stoning in the Torah...LOL!)?


Analogy:
You claim a particular N1000 note is fake BUT we have evidence that the CBN governor spent the same money! Was it an error on his part?

I ruled,
1. Would you support the Motion that Mohammed was wrong in citing Judgement from a book that is corrupt?



THE SECOND PART OF YOUR REBUTTAL

You said:

LegalWolf:


Hey TenQ

This is actually a rejoinder to my previous post and you can treat both as a single post (and I apologize I mentioned you twice). I woke up quiet early this morning to deal with some office work in preparation for a trial. Depending on when the case is called, I may not have time to respond on time to your question (although I may be in court and still checking Nairaland... particularly I always await your response . It is a past time for me).

I just did a quick search on my Quran and it would seem to me that OUR ALMIGHTY Allah (the most glorified, the most high) only used the reference 'maktooban indahum fi taura wal-injil' in that Quran 7:157 alone. Roughly translating the first section of that verse, is '... the illiterate prophet whom they find written (not named as that has a different meaning. As you can tell, maktooban is derived from the verb Maktoob which literally means 'write') in the Taura and Injil with them . Again, the key point here is WITH THEM!!!!!!!!!!!! TenQ in case you cannot read well, the emphasis is THE TAORAH AND INJIL WITH THEM .

Now, as you have cited severally, the Quran often referenced the Taorah and Injil as a book revealed to Moses and Jesus respectively. You have previously provided the reference but should I cite more? Almost every single time that the Taurah and Injil is mentioned, it is in the context of books either sent or revealed to the respective prophet. So how come this is different?

The only logical proposition this verse can support is that God is telling people like you TenQ that even the book with you, the unlettered prophet is written (about). I want to use direct literal translation as possible as I understand the problem of language quite clearly (remember, the hoax called NT is in Greek not Aramaic or Hebrew ). The emphasis is in the book with you and NOT the book I revealed to Jesus with you? If that were the case, that would have undoubtedly made your case. But this Q5;157 in no way lends credence to the assertion that the book with you is the book the Almighty revealed to Jesus . This is dumb logic TenQ and I expect you to be smarter than that..

Based on the above, Muslims are logically correct to cite the book of John (as a dubious book with Christians) that Prophet is written/mentioned. But we cannot accept the proposition that this book of John or any of the gospel is the one revealed by Allah to Jesus.

JUDGE

'Counsel TenQ, do you have any objection to either the premise or conclusion LegalWolf drew in the above'?

Catch you later !

I still WONDER how you could not see that you have roped in YOURSELF!
1. Who is the "Unlettered Prophet"? Is it not Mohammed!?
2. You now went into a terribly weak argument of "exact quotation " (I pray I would never have to call you as a lawyer to defend my case: it's an automatic loss)

whom they find written (not named as that has a different meaning. As you can tell,

So, how was the Unlettered Prophet got written but not named in the scriptures of the Jews and Christians BUT we know that he is Mohammed!?
3. Your point about Qur'an 5:157 actually is a FINAL PROVE that lends credence that; As of the Time of Mohammed, the SCRIPTURES of the Jews and Christians were RELIABLE enough for Allah to reference!

If it was not reliable, why Allah tell Mohammed to Consult with the people of the book to confirm the revelation of the Qur'an .


Check the attached:
Is Allah not asking the Jews and the Christians to check and find about the Unlettered prophet who is found written in the SCRIPTURES WITH THEM? Allah also says in the books with them are the GUIDANCE of wrong and right.

At least we have EVIDENCE for Allah that as of the time of Mohammed, the Jews and Christians their SCRIPTURE that contained reference to the Unlettered prophet.


Summary:
Evidence for the Reliability of the

1. Muslims have been found to search specifically for Reference to Mohammed specifically from the book of John
2. Allah attests to the Scripture WITH the Jews and Christians
3. Mohammed made Judgement with the books of the Jews with respect to Stoning the Adulterers!

Thank you!

johnw47:


Ecclesiastes 7:6
For as the crackling of thorns under a pot, so is the laughter of the fool


poor tormented, hateful, angry, lost dum dum,

Rev_20:15  And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire

Wakanda 5:5— as bitter as bitter leaf, your life will be much more bitter, you’ll have no reason to LAUGH, your live will be full of sorrow.

Worthless slave with no value, full of pain and bitterness and na that pain go kill you and your FATHER


Is this how john smelling momma laugh at home

TenQ:


First, all the questions you missed
1. I gave a challenge:
Can you find me Islamic/Muslim Sources that EMPHATICALLY DENY that Muhammad is Prophesied by Jesus from the book of John. Failure to find examples is a prove that you tell a lie with your answer.
2. I then followed up with a PERSONAL Question to You LegalWolf
Allah says in the Quran that Mohammed's name is found written in the books of the Jews and Christians (Quran 7:157)
a. Is this a TRUE or FALSE statement by Allah?
b. If the above is TRUE, LegalWolf, where can the reference to Mohammed be found in the books of the Christians?
c. If the Mohammed is NOT Referenced by the books of the Christians, did Allah tell a lie?

Just a reminder. Now back to your weak rebuttal!

I made a claim: that Allah told me that my name is written in the Uthmanic Quran AND that IF you can't find it, your present Qur'an is FAKE

You now created TWO FALSE assumptions (which I never did) that
- That the name TenQ is in an alleged scripture is a proof in itself that the scripture is authentic
- That there is only one scripture everyone recognizes.
Corrections:
1. The Alleged Scripture is the Uthmanic Qur'an which according to YOU Muslims is AUTHENTIC!
2. Are their many Qur'ans?
Here are my assumptions:
1. That because I claim that Allah said that my name is in the Uthmanic Qur'an, then my claim must be true!
2. That if you Muslims cannot find my name written in the Qur'an according toy claim, then it's a SUFFICIENT Proof that your present Qur'an is corrupted!
Compare with the parallel narration in Islam:
1. That because Mohammad claimed that Allah said that his name is in the the Books of the Jews and the Christians, then his claim must be true!
2. That if we Christians cannot find Mohammed's name written in the Scriptures according to Mohammed's claim, then it's a SUFFICIENT Proof that our present Scripture is corrupted!
You can now rephrase your argument appropriately to refute my claim.

By the way:
1. Is the Torah just one BOOK or a compilation of Books?
2. What does the word Injeel mean? Is it a book or a compilation of books?
Please cite references



My Questions again:
1. Can you prove that the Scriptures Allah was referring to in the Quran had gone into extinction or Allah believed that the books were still with the Jews and Christians?
2. If the books were lost, why would Allah himself give the title "People of the Book" to Jews and Christians?
All I need is your Islamic Evidence either by Allah or by Mohammed that the scriptures referred to in the Qur'an are gone extinct! QED!
Otherwise, you are making up your own conjectures!
Does LegalWolf words override those of Allah and his Messanger!?

Did I not give you several Quranic verses where Allah spoke so clearly about the revealed books!?

All you needed to do was to affirm or deny whether you are more knowledgeable than your Allah who says
i. he makes no distinction between the books nor the messengers
ii. You will recall that Allah refers to ALL the messengers prior to Mohammed and their books




Barrister LegalWolf, I summoned YOUR prophet as an example of the best of the Muslims who judged from the Torah (as one of the scriptures you claim is corrupted). If Mohammed referred to such books, who are you to refute his evidence?
My THIRD Inquisition:
3. Did your prophet Muhammad make judgement of stoning an adulteress by asking the Jews to refer to the Torah (remember when a Jew covered the word stoning in the Torah...LOL!)?


Analogy:
You claim a particular N1000 note is fake BUT we have evidence that the CBN governor spent the same money! Was it an error on his part?

I ruled,
1. Would you support the Motion that Mohammed was wrong in citing Judgement from a book that is corrupt?



THE SECOND PART OF YOUR REBUTTAL

You said:



I still WONDER how you could not see that you have roped in YOURSELF!
1. Who is the "Unlettered Prophet"? Is it not Mohammed!?
2. You now went into a terribly weak argument of "exact quotation " (I pray I would never have to call you as a lawyer to defend my case: it's an automatic loss)


So, how was the Unlettered Prophet got written but not named in the scriptures of the Jews and Christians BUT we know that he is Mohammed!?
3. Your point about Qur'an 5:157 actually is a FINAL PROVE that lends credence that; As of the Time of Mohammed, the SCRIPTURES of the Jews and Christians were RELIABLE enough for Allah to reference!

If it was not reliable, why Allah tell Mohammed to Consult with the people of the book to confirm the revelation of the Qur'an .


Check the attached:
Is Allah not asking the Jews and the Christians to check and find about the Unlettered prophet who is found written in the SCRIPTURES WITH THEM? Allah also says in the books with them are the GUIDANCE of wrong and right.

At least we have EVIDENCE for Allah that as of the time of Mohammed, the Jews and Christians their SCRIPTURE that contained reference to the Unlettered prophet.


Summary:
Evidence for the Reliability of the

1. Muslims have been found to search specifically for Reference to Mohammed specifically from the book of John
2. Allah attests to the Scripture WITH the Jews and Christians
3. Mohammed made Judgement with the books of the Jews with respect to Stoning the Adulterers!

Thank you!

Hey TenQ

Matter was adjourned and got back earlier than I thought.

You are quite funny and your attempt to stretch logic to the limit does not make sense. Let me recap the main points of the conversation so we don't get points muddled up:

- The sole question in dispute is whether the Book of John is book of divine creation or any of the books of the New Testament.

- To prove this, you framed your question as whether Allah enjoined Muslims to believe in the scriptures revealed before the Quran. To this I answered Yes. So this line of argument is not in contention.

- Now, you have gone ahead to approximate the book of John to revealed scripture before the Quran. To this, I have given credible evidence which you admit that clearly show that the book of John and NO BOOK OF THE NEW TESTAMENT WAS REVEALED TO THE JESUS . I say you admit this because you clearly stated that Christians in no way ever insinuated that book of John was revealed to Jesus. Or is that not correct?

- In other words, the Book of John ≠Revealed Books according to the Quran The above ideally closes that line of argument .

- A new line of argument was made around Quran 7:157. The substance of your point is that God made reference to the Gospel with the Christians and as such, he finds it reliable;

- This is dumb logic. Perhaps to put in better perspective, and situate it in the context of your argument, Did Allah tell Muslims to believe in the Injil he revealed/Sent to the Christians or the Injil with the Christians

- If you find one single piece of evidence from the Quran where Allah enjoins Muslims to believe in the Gospel with the Christains. My argument is deflated and you have your day. All other fishing around expedition you are doing would not save you. The question in the penultimate paragraph is a yes or no answer please

LegalWolf:
What exactly is your point NNTR?

You wont see the point even if the point perches on the tip end of your nose

LegalWolf:
I avoided giving you detailed response because I notice you have nothing of substance to say but just unintelligent mumbles and rants.

Trust me you are nowhere near up to the task of giving a slightest cogent response

You're incapable of giving you a detailed response(s), even if your life depends on it. I have you sort for breakfast, spit out the hairs and use your bones as toothpicks

LegalWolf:
Calm down ...

'Calm down' is one of my middle names

LegalWolf:
... and tell me what is your point

The point being that the Quran has its own fair share of warts and all, even piggybacked on the Bible. You live in a glass house so dont throw stones.

LegalWolf:
... and what you want....

OK, try this for size.
Share in a short succinct way, what Islam has on the table as offers, matching or equal to the following:
1.) the gift of salvation,
2.) the plan of redemption,
3.) reconciliation and
4.) atonement

LegalWolf:
... are you hungry?

Are you doing hand-outs then because the flood has severely damaged properties in Kogi State and has unarguably not only rendered people homeless but hungry too

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

LegalWolf:


Hey TenQ

Matter was adjourned and got back earlier than I thought.

You are quite funny and your attempt to stretch logic to the limit does not make sense. Let me recap the main points of the conversation so we don't get points muddled up:

When you totally deliberately ignore answering Questions, where do you think it will lead you?

LegalWolf:


- The sole question in dispute is whether the Book of John is book of divine creation or any of the books of the New Testament.

- To prove this, you framed your question as whether Allah enjoined Muslims to believe in the scriptures revealed before the Quran. To this I answered Yes. So this line of argument is not in contention.

- Now, you have gone ahead to approximate the book of John to revealed scripture before the Quran. To this, I have given credible evidence which you admit that clearly show that the book of John and NO BOOK OF THE NEW TESTAMENT WAS REVEALED TO THE JESUS . I say you admit this because you clearly stated that Christians in no way ever insinuated that book of John was revealed to Jesus. Or is that not correct?

- In other words, the Book of John ≠Revealed Books according to the Quran The above ideally closes that line of argument .

- A new line of argument was made around Quran 7:157. The substance of your point is that God made reference to the Gospel with the Christians and as such, he finds it reliable;

- This is dumb logic. Perhaps to put in better perspective, and situate it in the context of your argument, Did Allah tell Muslims to believe in the Injil he revealed/Sent to the Christians or the Injil with the Christians

- If you find one single piece of evidence from the Quran where Allah enjoins Muslims to believe in the Gospel with the Christains. My argument is deflated and you have your day. All other fishing around expedition you are doing would not save you. The question in the penultimate paragraph is a yes or no answer please

I think I can comfortably close my case with you.

Your aim was to find out whether the Book of John is book of divine creation or any of the books of the New Testament.

I showed /presented three WITNESSES
1. MUSLIM APOLOGISTS:
The number one source of information to confirm that Mohammeds was mentioned in the books of the Christians is SPECIFICALLY the Book of John.
I even dared you to find just ONE Islamic source that deny this. All the personal questions I asked you concerning this you DELIBERATELY avoided answering.

Conclusion:
If the book of John was not of Devine origin, why are Muslims looking for Prophecies about Mohammed in it. Why not find Mohammed in Shakespeare's books?

2. ALLAH as SECOND WITNESS:
-Allah himself said he makes no distinction between the books of the Jews and the Christians.
-Allah affirmed that at least as of the time of Mohammed, the books were with the Jews and the Christians. The books were within their hands
-Allah implored Mohammed to consult with the people of the book concerning revelations of the Qur'an.
-Allah calls Jews and Christians people of the BOOK (singular), meaning that their books were unique to them which would not have been if the books were lost.

3. MOHAMMED as the WITNESS:
I showed you that Mohammed made life and death judgement with the Torah (as part of the books of the Christians). He shouldn't do that if he considered the Torah as corrupted!


Since you have no meaningful response to all these, the case is closed. It is a pity that even Allah seem not to know that the Torah is a library of FIVE separate books.

What is the name of the book given to Suleiman?

SMH!

TenQ:

When you totally deliberately ignore answering Questions, where do you think it will lead you?



I think I can comfortably close my case with you.

Your aim was to find out whether the Book of John is book of divine creation or any of the books of the New Testament.

I showed /presented three WITNESSES
1. MUSLIM APOLOGISTS:
The number one source of information to confirm that Mohammeds was mentioned in the books of the Christians is SPECIFICALLY the Book of John.
I even dared you to find just ONE Islamic source that deny this. All the personal questions I asked you concerning this you DELIBERATELY avoided answering.

Conclusion:
If the book of John was not of Devine origin, why are Muslims looking for Prophecies about Mohammed in it. Why not find Mohammed in Shakespeare's books?

2. ALLAH as SECOND WITNESS:
-Allah himself said he makes no distinction between the books of the Jews and the Christians.
-Allah affirmed that at least as of the time of Mohammed, the books were with the Jews and the Christians. The books were within their hands
-Allah implored Mohammed to consult with the people of the book concerning revelations of the Qur'an.
-Allah calls Jews and Christians people of the BOOK (singular), meaning that their books were unique to them which would not have been if the books were lost.

3. MOHAMMED as the WITNESS:
I showed you that Mohammed made life and death judgement with the Torah (as part of the books of the Christians). He shouldn't do that if he considered the Torah as corrupted!


Since you have no meaningful response to all these, the case is closed. It is a pity that even Allah seem not to know that the Torah is a library of FIVE separate books.

What is the name of the book given to Suleiman?

SMH!

Okay, I think I have tried to explain this to you as logically as possible but you keep clutching on to straws. It has been said that the best way to explain things to kids is through analogy. Therefore, let me start again with a simple question and an analogy.

Again, remember the context in which our engagement ensued - to find out whether the book of john is a product of divine creation. If I understand you correctly, you claim SPECIFICALLY that Since Q7:157 says that that the Prophet was mentioned in the gospel with the Bible. [Premise 1] and that [the book of John is the only one that Muslims cite as mentioning the Prophet [Premise 2], Therefore, the book of John is a divine book. [Conclusion]

In other words, since the Book of John is the ONLY book that Muslims look to which mentioned the prophet, therefore it must be the product of divine. Suppose I cite evidence of a gospel outside the 27 canon (which your church deems apocryphal but apparently in existence before 600 A.D) which Muslims have looked up to as 'evidence of the gospel in which the unlettered prophet was mentioned', WOULD YOU ON THE SAME LOGIC ACCEPT THAT GOSPEL AS A WORD OF GOD ??

LegalWolf:


Okay, I think I have tried to explain this to you as logically as possible but you keep clutching on to straws. It has been said that the best way to explain things to kids is through analogy. Therefore, let me start again with a simple question and an analogy.

Again, remember the context in which our engagement ensued - to find out whether the book of john is a product of divine creation. If I understand you correctly, you claim SPECIFICALLY that Since Q7:157 says that that the Prophet was mentioned in the gospel with the Bible. [Premise 1] and that [the book of John is the only one that Muslims cite as mentioning the Prophet [Premise 2], Therefore, the book of John is a divine book. [Conclusion]

In other words, since the Book of John is the ONLY book that Muslims look to which mentioned the prophet, therefore it must be the product of divine. Suppose I cite evidence of a gospel outside the 27 canon (which your church deems apocryphal but apparently in existence before 600 A.D) which Muslims have looked up to as 'evidence of the gospel in which the unlettered prophet was mentioned', WOULD YOU ON THE SAME LOGIC ACCEPT THAT GOSPEL AS A WORD OF GOD ??

Read my lips, Qur'an 7:157 is NOT directly about the book of John. Qur'an 7:157 is about the books of the Jews and the Christians.

Is the book of John part of the books of the Christians?

The Question is
1. What name does the Qur'an give to the books of Moses? Is it a single book? NO!
It is a Library of FIVE books.
2. What name does the Qur'an give to the books of the Christians? Injeel! But the Injeel is ALL the books of the Christians!

The fact that Mohammed is ignorant of the fact that the books of the Christians is a collection of Books just as he did not know that the Torah is a collection of FIVE books is the problem of you Muslims.

TenQ:

Read my lips, Qur'an 7:157 is NOT directly about the book of John. Qur'an 7:157 is about the books of the Jews and the Christians.

Is the book of John part of the books of the Christians?

The Question is
1. What name does the Qur'an give to the books of Moses? Is it a single book? NO!
It is a Library of FIVE books.
2. What name does the Qur'an give to the books of the Christians? Injeel! But the Injeel is ALL the books of the Christians!

The fact that Mohammed is ignorant of the fact that the books of the Christians is a collection of Books just as he did not know that the Torah is a collection of FIVE books is the problem of you Muslims.

All you said does not still answer the very simple question I asked which I paraphrase below:

'Suppose I cite evidence of a gospel outside the 27 canon which Muslims have looked up to as 'evidence of the gospel in which the unlettered prophet was mentioned', WOULD YOU ON THE SAME LOGIC ACCEPT THAT GOSPEL AS A WORD OF GOD

Remember, my good friend TenQ, that this is your claim:
1. Quran 7:157 says the unlettered prophet is mentioned in the Gospel. (Premise 1)
2. You Claim that Muslims look up to the book of John as evidence that the Prophet was mentioned in the Gospel (Premise 2)
3. Therefore, the Book of John is a creation of a divine being (Conclusion).

It goes without saying that If there is another gospel which Muslims look up to as evidence that the Prophet was mentioned in it, that Gospel should also qualify as a word of God. This is me simply restating your logic. So to ask again, BASED ON YOUR LOGIC AND PREMISE stated above, ARE YOU PREPARED TO ALSO ACCEPT AN APOCRYPAL GOSPEL WHICH FULFILS YOUR SECOND PREMISE AS A BOOK OF GOD'?