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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Culture / How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages (1850 Views)
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How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by BlueIvy04: 12:54am On Nov 08, 2022 |
I was wondering to which degree the various edoid languages were mutually intelligible to each other. This including languages like Edo/Benin, Urhobo, Esan, Etsako/Afemai, Isoko, Ivbiosakon, Okpamheri etc. For example, can an Edo/Benin speaker understand an Urhobo speaker with 95% accuracy, 50% accuracy or 0% accuracy. |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by RedboneSmith(m): 6:56pm On Nov 08, 2022 |
A Benin speaker will not understand an Urhobo speaker and vice versa. I think some Isoko people might be able to understand some Urhobo speakers, but I am not sure. Even within Isoko and Urhobo, there are some dialect groups that cannot easily understand each other. 3 Likes |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by Lonthomas: 8:25am On Nov 10, 2022 |
Their languages are largely mutually intelligible thanks to their very recent development and those differences that do exist are minor compared to those you'd find in other Indo-European languages. https://www.imyccpay.com 2 Likes |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by AreaFada2: 1:18pm On Nov 10, 2022 |
It depends to some extent on current geographical proximity, how much a particular Edoid language has been influenced by non-Edoid languages around them, how long ago a language separated from the Ur-Edo language, how well the speaker of an Edoid language truly understands own Edoid language, etc. Naturally, an Esan person will understand Benin to a good level, an Isoko person will understand Urhobo to a decent level, etc. This is not too different from European languages. A Dutch person will understand German language to a good level but a German will understand Dutch much less. Swedes, Danes and Norwegians will learn German much more easily because German is still nearest to their Ur-Germanic language origins. A Spaniard will understand Italian to a good extent because Italian is closest to their common Latin language origin. A Romanian will understand French less than he will understand Italian, a Portuguese will understand Spanish than Romanian due to proximity to Spain, a Romanian will understand Italian better than Spanish due to Italian being still closer geographically and to Latin origin. Mutual intelligibility depends on many factors. In the same way, a Degema person in Rivers State will find Esan harder to understand than Benin language. As for the level to which people understand own language, if a Benin person doesn't know that Ekokodia is the original Benin name for Coco-nut, he won't recognise it when a Delta man says it. If he doesn't know that Osa means great ape, he won't recognise meaning of Osia when a Delta man says it, etc. My worry is that with fewer kids learning their mother tongue, it will affect all the languages in the Edoid group. 5 Likes |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by UGBE634: 9:01pm On Nov 10, 2022 |
AreaFada2:These are the yardsticks, the last one is a very strong factor too, And also I was able to decipher that written Urhobo is easier to digest than spoken Urhobo. There is one thread on nairaland I saw, I think it was about written Urhobo, I was able to decipher about 50% percent of what I read there. And also it depends largely on the clan, there are some clans in Urhobo, when they speak, I can almost hear a third or strongly a fourth of what they say. Lastly no matter how divergent a language group might be,there are sometimes, it would just be intelligible to all Edo groups across divides, e.g give me water, give me money and a bunch of others. There is no other way to say these things. 3 Likes |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by BlueIvy04: 7:33am On Nov 15, 2022 |
AreaFada2: Do you think a solution to this would be to make a standardised edoid language. Similar to how there are various Ijoid languages but they mostly use a standardised single language. Obviously I’m aware a lot of politics would be involved if such a task took place but think about it in a theoretical sense. 1 Like |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by Ologbo147: 1:50pm On Nov 15, 2022 |
BlueIvy04:as compared to the ijoid languages, it is super possible as Edoid languages have a degree of relativity among themselves when compared to the Ijaws 3 Likes |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by AreaFada2: 3:01am On Nov 16, 2022 |
BlueIvy04: You identified the main issue: Politics. It seems too late now. Any form of standardisation would have been a lot easier in the days of Mid-West or even Bendel. With Delta State, most people under 35 outside Edo State don't even know much about their Edoidness. Standardisation, if considered, would likely centre around Benin/Esan as closest to Ur-Edo language. That won't sit well with many others. Personally, I'd prefer that we preserve the various flavours and branches of Edo language as they are all very rich in cultural heritage in their own right. Various parts of Ur-Edo language are also preserved in these languages. For example, coco-nut is now mostly called ivin in Benin. A few decades back, elderly people still regularly called it "ekokodia". Urhobo and Isoko have retained kokodia by and large, Instead, we can develop a more common orthography (to the extent that it is possible) that allows these Edoid languages to be mutually learnt more easily. Stakeholders/traditional institutions/politicians can develop an Institute for Edo/Edoid Languages and Culture Research affiliated to AAU, DELSU and others. May be even Uniben. Unilag once had Edo programme long ago. Not sure of now. Uniport is another major school, that can be a part. Imagine a linguistics graduate who can then further study to read and write in Benin/Isoko, Esan/Urhobo, Urhobo/Benin/Degema, Afemai/Isoko/Urhobo and can teach these languages. The institute can promote research. Imagine Edoid language/culture festival every 2 years hosted by Edo or Delta or Rivers or Lagos to showcase the diversity of Edoid cultures. We can invite a guest state of the host's choice. Bayelsa, Ondo, Kogi, Benue, Anambra, Ekiti will be interested as guests. NOT just to dance, eat, drink and same in two years again. No. A festival with artistes, academics, students, seminars, educational opportunities, scholarships, developing Edoid books in STEM subjects, apps to learn these languages, etc. Approach companies to co-sponsor. So many possibilities. 4 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by AutomaticMotors: 5:48am On Nov 18, 2022 |
RedboneSmith: And who are you to speak on this?? Don't say what you don't know !! Stick to your lane!!! |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by AutomaticMotors: 5:52am On Nov 18, 2022 |
AreaFada2: You still remain a KING in this parts when it comes to Benin Kingdom/Edo affairs I have followed your posts over many years and I just want to say Thank You and please keep up the great work! |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by AutomaticMotors: 5:58am On Nov 18, 2022 |
AreaFada2: This is a very great idea, search Izoduwa on Facebook I believe you both are on the same path and are also ideologically like minded! You could pitch this idea to him. |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by RedboneSmith(m): 6:18am On Nov 18, 2022 |
AutomaticMotors:Oh please, shut your whole arsè up. If what I said was incorrect, then point out the inaccuracies and correct them. Otherwise, shut the fvck up. |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by AutomaticMotors: 7:31am On Nov 18, 2022 |
RedboneSmith: I don't have time to wallow in dirt with you!! It is what you have been known for since all the years you have spent wasting away on nairaland! Keep being the same non-entity year in year out when you are tired you would delete your account!! ![]() 1 Like |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by RedboneSmith(m): 1:02pm On Nov 18, 2022 |
AutomaticMotors: You don't have time to wallow in the dirt. Yet you have the time and the effrontery to come on a faceless forum and jump on my comment to tell me what posts I should and should not comment on, as the god, keeper and guardian of Nairaland that you are, abi? Onye ala. I am a nonentity but at least you know me. How else would you know I have been here for years? I on the other hand had no idea of your existence until you jumped on my comment seeking for attention this morning. I will also forget you the second I log off. But I apparently live rent-free in your head. Ukpana! 3 Likes |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by Probz(m): 10:32pm On Nov 18, 2022 |
AutomaticMotors: He’s a reliable cherub of Anioma-Nigeria and his username isn’t pure bait. Take the irony of your username and park well in a distant lane with no Internet. Don’t rush back in a hurry. |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by AutomaticMotors: 11:59pm On Nov 18, 2022 |
Probz: Redbonesmith Coming back with a leprosy striken alt just to prove my point right! ![]() ![]() ![]() 1 Like |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by AutomaticMotors: 12:21am On Nov 19, 2022 |
This is his Facebook account boss https://m.facebook.com/Marflem?eav=AfYKN4oissLAaGCnsFM-C1p7QXCfHJDnBPNm37Lh726vLSjp21LO2zUyB_mqRSSUDwo&paipv=0 @AreaFada |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by UGBE634: 4:07am On Nov 19, 2022 |
AreaFada2:Urhobo -gbu-nuwe-shut up Bini-gu-nue-shut up Urhobo -yanre-come Bini-laire-come Urhobo-inowota-i am asking you questions Bini-Inowota-i am asking you questions Urhobo-wekobokhian-weldone Bini-bokhian -welcome Urhobo-tewmanta- talk true Bini-tewmanta-talk true Urhobo-Wenowmen-it means are you asking me Bini-Uwenowmen,tu-nowmen-a'?-it means the same thing above Urhobo-yanre-bone-it means come this side, Bini-Laire vbo bona-It means the same thing in Benin Urhobo-vbiare-what did I do Benin-vbiaru-what did I do Urhobo-wa no-ask Benin-no -ask Urhobo- kemukemu nutarivbu miki ru-it means whatever you want me to do, I will do Benin-Kevbin kevbin nu ta nihu I gha ru-it means the same thing above Urhobo-we rhio oya-you don suffer Benin- Urhio oya ne-you don suffer Urhobo-wa ahian- make una dae go Benin-wa akhian-make una dae go Urhobo- Igbiyaja-prostitute Bini-Igbiyagia-prostitute urhobo- ighodo- compound Bini-Ighodo- can range from a compound to a place e.g vbu a ye vbi ighodo-na? meaning where are you in this place Urhobo-Dawmuen or Dawmen-it means to try something Bini-Dawmen or Dawmuenit means to try something- e.g ghe ghi Dawmuen- do not try it again Urhobo-Odafe- a big man, a wealthy man Bini- Odafen- Big man, Wealthy man Urhobo-Ogo- bottle Bini-ogo-bottle Urhobo-ovie-king Bini-Ogie-king Urhobo-Otota-a spokesperson Benin-we don't have that office, but it is what we can interprete efficiently (in pidgin, e means person wey dae bring talk, or person wey dae talk talk Urhobo-Aghogho-Joy Bini-Oghogho-Joy Urhobo-Amen-water Bini-Amen-water Urhobo-Igho-money Bini-Igho-money urhobo-akpo-life Bini-agbon-life Urhobo-wowo-i am sorry Bini-Lahor wowo -i am sorry Urhobo-ohu-vexation or anger Bini-ohu-vexation or anger Urhobo-Oji-thief Bini-Oji-thief Urhobo- otu- mate Bini-Otu- mate eg otu- ma khin a'? Meaning are we mate? Urhobo-Eriwmin-spirit Benin-Ehiwmin-spirit Urhobo-nerhun-pray Benin-nerhun-pray Suffice me to say that urhobo is a strong Edoid group that settled in between itsekiri(yoruboid)Ijaws(ijoid) ukwuani(igboid) these groups has managed to distort her intonation, accent and pronunciation, honestly it is because she is a large Edoid group, if she was small, she would have been swallowed. she has been able to largely maintain her foundation at the very least in terms of these words and a bunch of others, I watched few episodes and found this out although I know some already which I added to it. This was what I was able to draw from sokoh's comic urhobo movie from youtube called Oseghe, more might come, that is if I have the chance later to watch more episodes 6 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by AreaFada2: 2:33pm On Nov 19, 2022 |
UGBE634: @ UGBE634 Great that you have taken your time to compile the above. We need more of this about other Edoid languages. Comparing words and phrases in two or more languages: Afemai/Isoko, Degema/Benin, Esan/Ososo, Urhobo/Owan (Ora), etc. 4 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by Probz(m): 8:52pm On Nov 19, 2022 |
AutomaticMotors: RedboneSmith bounced back with an alter-ego just to do something he’s obviously perfectly-capable of doing (sticking up for himself)? You really are a demented little spanner. |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by RedboneSmith(m): 2:30am On Nov 20, 2022 |
Probz: People who maintain multiple accounts on this forum tend to think everyone does the same. With the way he is riled up by a simple non-aggressive contribution I made on mutual intelligibility across the Edoid lects, you can tell that we've clashed here before, where he was apparently using another account because I certainly don't remember this particular account. |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by UGBE634: 7:04am On Nov 20, 2022 |
AreaFada2:Sir! Anything for Edo, there is no other place we call home, it is good to know that we have brothers with similar tongue and it is beautiful exploring them. It has been my passion from day one. Knowing that we have brothers everywhere and elsewhere excites me. I love Edo so much, knowing that we have something similar to Edo excites me. It would be herculean to get detailed materials online for Ososo and Degema as these groups are small, they don't really have presence online. Someone might have to journey down to these places to carry out these research and comparison. And also I am doing it from a place of language of depth or the base as compared to the other language which seem to be furthest. I am not really rooted in other languages except Benin. Thanks for your commendation, you and physicsqed started it on here 4 Likes |
Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by Udazi: 3:38pm On Mar 10 |
BlueIvy04:in Peter Ekeh’s work, contesting the history of Benin in page 167 of an article in research in African literature, he described Esan and Benin as approximately mutually intelligible, Bradbury in page 14 of his book, “the Benin kingdom and the Edo speaking people of south western Nigeria” he stated and i quote “The dialects of Ishan and the southern parts of Ivbiosakon seem most closely akin to Edo proper, while mutual intelligibility with the latter diminishes towards the northern boundaries of Edo speaking territory”. If you check page 84, you will find out the ivbiosakon are the Owan people in the southern part of the ivbiosakon territory. The Owan people basically consist of Emai-Ora-Luleha dialect cluster. Buttressing Bradbury’s point above, Ben Ohiomamhe Elugbe in his work comparative Edoid: phonology and lexicon describes these languages or dialects (Bini,Esan,Owan) as “the languages of the central plain where there is relative homogeneity.” Bini, Esan, Owan, Ghotuo, Yekhee, Uneme make up the north-central Edoid group of languages. There are two sub-branches in this branch of north central Edoid. One branch is made up of Bini, Esan and Ora-Emai-Luleha dialects clusters which are regarded as the languages of the central plain where there is relative homogeneity. While the other sub-branch of North-central Edoid consists of Ghotuo, Yekhee, Uneme. What this means is that the closest Edoid language to Bini is Esan, then followed by Owan. What this portends is even though Etsako and Owan are both in Edo north. Owan would understand Benin better than Etsako. What this also portends for these languages is that even though Ghotuo or Otuo identify as Owan because of their proximity and cultural affinity to other traditional Owan groups like Ora-Emai-Luleha, the linguistic reality states that traditional Owan groups such as Ora-Emai-Luleha lean more linguistically to Benin and Esan than to Ghotuo or Otuo who they share the same ethnic umbrella with collectively as Owan.
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Re: How Mutually Intelligible Are The Various Edoid Languages by Udazi: 4:01pm On Mar 10 |
BlueIvy04: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOKsGupT2bY?si=chLJmPfOCYLWHJG7 This is Pedro obaseki’s take above on the linguistic relationship between Esan and Bini. Time stamp 8:30-9:20. This is an excerpt from Hans melzian dictionary below, it was published in 1937, she described Esan as a dialects of Bini. Frankly from 1-100, there is really no difference in numbers in Esan and Bini. Just that in Esan, numbers like 90 might be igbe yan iyene but with Bini it will be Ekigbe-iyisen. The meaning for both is 10+80 for the Esan and 100-10 for the Binis. But the wordings are intelligible to both groups In the international journal of language and linguistics, an article was written by Omozuwa victor Edosa and Ikhiwmin Gladys Amenze titled “Alternation of Lenis and Fortis consonants in Edo and Esan as indicators of a dynamic sound change in Edo” page 54 Okojie was quoted to have said “even among present day Esan generation, speaking Bini may be difficult, but it is unnecessary for an Esan to learn Bini before understanding it
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