Christistruth03:


So you don't have any History until the white man says so

History is not about skin colour, it is about eyewitness written records. Our ancestors and yours couldn't write, so use your brain and arrive to your conclusion.

It is not about the Europeans of today, but about the records written by those who witnessed our ancestors and wrote down their encounter with our ancestors (their skin colour and origin are irrelevant). Your incompetent brain still doesn't understand this after more than ten years of getting free education from me.

Ghostwon8222:

History is not about skin colour, it is about eyewitness written records. Our ancestors and yours couldn't write, so use your brain and arrive to your conclusion.

It is not about the Europeans of today, but about the records written by the Europeans who witnessed our ancestors. Your incompetent brain still doesn't understand this after more than ten years of getting free education from me.

Just show us the Oba of Benins Lands
in Lagos make we hear word

Abule Egba and all Eastern Lagos still belongs to the Egbas and the Ijebus

Christistruth03:


Just show us the Oba of Benins Lands
in Lagos make we hear word

Abule Egba and all Eastern Lagos still belongs to the Egbas and the Ijebus

Are you so blind that you couldn't see the map ?
You are the type who just like to debate the same thing over and over.

Ok, I now recall what I read about the Egbas some time ago:

1) Abeokuta was created around 1830
2) the people who created Abeokuta were former slaves.

There you have it, there goes your claim of egbas owning and conquering Lagos. You were only telling yet an other lie.

Ghostwon8222:

Are you so blind that you couldn't see the map ?
You are the type who just like to debate the same thing over and over.

Show us Oba of Benins Land that he owns in Lagos today as a result of your claimed Conquest

The Egbas still have Abule Egba to show for the Ota War
The Ijebu still hold onto all of Eastern Lagos
Where are the Oba of Benins Lands in Lagos

Even the Palace of the Oba of Lagos sits on Aromire’s an Awori man’ s Land

Madam Tinubu who was an Egba Woman and the Iyalode of Egbaland owned 4 Square miles of Central Lagos
It is on record that Herbert Macauley surveyed it for her

where are Oba Of Benins Lands in Lagos ?

@christistruth03,
The debate has already been settled, as usual you lack sufficient intellect to understand this.

1) the jebus were vassals of Benin
2) the egbas were slaves who established their kingdom in 1830
3) a map of West Africa from 1600-1699 clearly shows Lagos and it's environs as being part of Benin empire:
https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b8595583b.r=Benin%20royaume?rk=107296;4#
4) I rest my case

Ghostwon8222:
Ok, I now recall what I read about the Egbas some time ago:

1) Abeokuta was created around 1830
2) the people who created Abeokuta were former slaves.

There you have it, there goes your claim of egbas owning and conquering Lagos. You were only telling yet an other lie.

The Egba People have existed since the 12 th Century they lived in dispersed villages before they founded Abeokuta as their main Town as a place of refuge from Slave Traders
The Egbas lived in About 153 Villages before then


Anyway not to digress kindly show us the Oba of Benins Lands in Lagos

Ghostwon8222:
@christistruth03,
The debate has already been settled, as usual you lack sufficient intellect to understand this.

1) the jebus were vassals of Benin
2) the egbas were slaves who established their kingdom in 1830
3) a map of West Africa from 1600-1699 clearly shows Lagos and it's environs as being part of Benin empire:
https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b8595583b.r=Benin%20royaume?rk=107296;4#
4) I rest my case

I accept your admission of defeat

You agree that Oba of Benin has no Land in Lagos

Christistruth03:



The Egba People have existed since the 12 th Century they lived in dispersed villages before they founded Abeokuta as their main Town because of their Slave Trade
The Egbas lived in About 153 Villages before then

Again, you make claims.
For your information, you need to back up your claims.
There is no written record of the region which dates back to the 12th century AD, so making claims about that period of time is just an other of your unprovable claims.
As it is on documents about Abeokuta, it was established by former slaves (the egbas). All you said is myth at best.

Ghostwon8222:

Again, you make claims.
For your information, you need to back up your claims.
There is no written record of the region which dates back to the 12th century AD, so making claims about that period of time is just an other of your unprovable claims.
As it is on documents about Abeokuta, it was established by former slaves (the egbas). All you said is myth at best.

In other words your own Ancestors from whom you descended didn’t exist in the 12th Century because there were no written records to prove or confirm their existence

Therefore according to you they didn’t exist

Do you now see why I didn’t want to waste time arguing with you

Christistruth03:



I accept your admission of defeat

You agree that Oba of Benin has no Land in Lagos

"Defeat", I didn't know we were in a fight.
1) as it has been advised, do not debate a fool, I should follow that advise and stop debating you.
2) you clearly don't follow rules of logic
3) you debate against proven facts
4) you lie compulsively and call yourself christistruth 😅

Ghostwon8222:

"Defeat", I didn't know we were in a fight.
1) as it has been advised, do not debate a fool, I should follow that advise and stop debating you.
2) you clearly don't follow rules of logic
3) you debate against proven facts
4) you lie compulsively and call yourself christistruth 😅

To be honest with you defeat is too Harsh

I accept your admission that Oba of Benin had no Lands he conquered and took over in Lagos

Do you know why

Because the Oba of Lagos was a Merchant Prince of the Slave. Markets who

Represented the Oba of Benin

because the Portuguese Slave Merchants were his Business Partners

He was the Babaloja of the Lagos Island Slave Markets and the Port of Lagos Island
(Not Ebutte Metta o !
Na Awori king Oloto of Oto and Egbas get that one )

Christistruth03:



In other words your own Ancestors didn’t exist then because there were no written records to prove or confirm their existence

Therefore according to you they didn’t exist

1) your reformulation of my statement is inaccurate.
2) everybody who exists today has ancestors whom have successively (generation by generation) lived through thousands of years
3) the form of the ancestor is what this is about
4) for example, the theory of evolution tells us that we humans have some ancestors who weren't humans
5) the fact your ancestors existed, doesn't mean they had the identity which you have given yourself today !
6) your ancestors might have been slaves (the egba ancestors), they might have come from different unrelated kingdoms, they might have just been unorganised people (Igbos), they might have been subjects of a now extinct and much larger entity.
7) saying the egbas have existed since the 12th century AD, is an unprovable statement since no written record of the region dates back to that era. The ancestors of the egbas existed, yes ! Where they were in that era is unknown, what they were called in that era is also unknown. What we know is that they created their kingdom in 1830 and that prior to that, they were slaves.


Do you need me to teach you some more obvious things ?

Do not debate fools.
I can't continue talking to people who ignore logic, it is an exercise in futility.
@christistruth03, you can continue your ranting, I'm done debating fools with the hope of teaching them something.

Ghostwon8222:
Do not debate fools.
I can't continue talking to people who ignore logic, it is an exercise in futility.
@christistruth03, you can continue your ranting, I'm done debating fools with the hope of teaching them something.

There is much more

I was only being gentle with you

Because I realise that others will read these Posts to Educate themselves

And we must relate to each other kindly and wisely

in order to build a great Nation of kind and wise leaders for Posterity

The Alaafin of Oyo Controlled. the Slave Ports of Badagry and Porto Novo

Do you see that the Ijebu kingdom was controlling Lagos in that Map and was a Buffer Between

Oyo and Benin Kingdoms

The History there is huge

That buffer between the Oyo and Benin Kingdoms was the Ooni of Ife’’s Handwork and included Ife itself

It was the Ooni of Ife that Engineered that Peace Agreement for his sons and

To keep the Peace between the Alaafin of Oyo and the Oba of Benin who were both his Sons

There was another buffer zone in the Ijesha Area

The one in the North was at the Otun Ekiti Kingdom

To people reading this, the map posted by @christistruth03 above is fake.
Yet again @christistruth03 continues to lie.
I shared an authentic map earlier with the link to the website hosting it:
https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b8595583b.r=Benin

Also, Oyo never had access to the sea, oyo never conquered Dahomey

Ghostwon8222:
To people reading this, the map posted by @christistruth03 above is fake.
Yet again @christistruth03 continues to lie.
I shared an authentic map earlier with the link to the website hosting it:
https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b8595583b.r=Benin

Also, Oyo never had access to the sea, oyo never conquered Dahomey

If you refuse to be humble you will never learn

Document below is from
Sir alfred moloney
British Colonial Governor of Lagos 1890
Confirming that Lagos is Yorubaland and that Oyo Once Ruled over Benin
and to the Sea, the Eguns are a Brother Clan of the Ewe of Dahomey ,Oyo was their Overlord over all Egun and Ewe People from Badagry to Ghana

Including Allada Cotonou Whydah
Most of Dahomey and Togo and the East of the Volta River in Ghana

Alaafin Oranmiyan was the first Alaafin that was overlord over Benin ,

Till today Alaafin of Oyo is still the Sovereign Overlord of the Oba of Porto Novo

Porto Novo is still on the Coast

Do you know that even Contonou was under Alaafin

Till today they still speak Yoruba in Contonou

Christistruth03:



If you refuse to be humble you will never learn

Document below is from
Sir alfred moloney
British Colonial Governor of Lagos 1890
Confirming that Lagos is Yorubaland and that Oyo Once Ruled over Benin
and to the Sea, the Eguns are a Brother Clan of the Ewe of Dahomey ,Oyo was their Overlord over all Egun and Ewe People from Badagry to Ghana

Including Allada Cotonou Whydah
Most of Dahomey and Togo and the East of the Volta River in Ghana

Alaafin Oranmiyan was the first Alaafin that was overlord over Benin ,

1) "Oyos" or "iyos" are actually ijo
2) the governor can't possibly be talking about a thing which wasn't noticed since the 1400's and just magically came to his knowledge in 1890, and again "oyos or iyos" are ijo, and they were pirates as seen in previous precolonial documents.
3) you are such a fool, also the expression of the governor "ruling to the sea" is not a familiar expression today, so it is hard to know what he actually meant, but my guess is that he was talking about the exploits of ijo pirates in the coasts.
4) I notice how you act as if the governor never mentioned that a lot of the people in Lagos were from Dahomey...why bother with facts...

Christistruth03,

I had said it many times that it is a waste of time arguing with these usurpers of Yoruba glories.

But that was the mistake we made in the past when Pro. Ade Ajayi ignored them despite Prof. Peter Ekeh, an Urhobo dismantling their bogus claims.

It was a Yoruba Oba of Bini who felt disrespected in classification among his brothers at Ife meeting that gave live to their adsorbed claims. He even labeled the foremost Edo historian as having Yoruba mother, a lie!

If they were looking for Ekhalehan or whatever, they know where he was at Ugoton but would not dare face his protectors there. Ife was where they placed him. Imagine a Yoruba Oba of Bini trying to disparage a full Edo historian with Yoruba mother!

The guy you are arguing with never believed accurate history can come out of Africa. He is so ignorant, he does not know who taught the Europeans how to read and write or where alphabet or pictorial writings started. So anything not told or written by Europeans does not exist.

The same Europeans that whitewashed African history, paint Egypt white and Mesopotamia the sole creation of whites before 15 Century classification into colors to divide serfs, workers and freed slaves.

But for the laborious and selfless re-discovery of Anta Diop and many others, these Bini or Edo usurpers would be glad being fed in Exhibition cages all over Europe and Americas.

Thanks for taking the time to educate us.

Christistruth03:



In other words your own Ancestors from whom you descended didn’t exist in the 12th Century because there were no written records to prove or confirm their existence

Therefore according to you they didn’t exist

Do you now see why I didn’t want to waste time arguing with you

What you just said might be the most twisted statement which. I have ever heard.

1) there is nobody on earth whom is more Edo than the Oba of Benin, indeed unlike most Nigerians, the Oba of Benin's ancestors were witnessed by Europeans in the 1400's. And the Oba was already sitting on his imperial throne in his capital (Benin city). His vassal (Olu of Warri) was actually the first to meet the Europeans, but sent them to the emperor from whom the Olu derived his authority.
2) ogiamen is a well known imposter and traitor, indeed the ogimens collaborated with the British during the 1897 war between Benin and Britain which resulted in the looting and burning of Benin city. One of the very few houses in Benin city which didn't get burnt by the British was that of their ogiamen collaborators.
3) ogiamen has clearly alligned himself with Yoruba supremacists who claim the Oba of Benin is a Yoruba. The Yoruba supremacists boost the ogiamen claim and the ogiamen boosts the Yoruba supremacist claim.
4) our ancestors couldn't read or write and had no access to papers and pens, so how in god's name was any treaty signed between us?
5) it is only people with very poor education who can actually believe that the Oba of Benin could be anything other than an Edo, does your ancestry go back 600 years ? Well, only the Oba of Benin and perhaps two other monarchs in Nigeria have an ancestry which goes back 600 years. So it is foolish for you to claim "Oba of Benin is Yoruba". His ancestry of more than 600 years clearly says he is the most Edo man on earth.
6) how far does the Oni of Ife's ancestry go ?
7) how far does your ancestry go ?
8 ) you don't even know your true origin nor that of the Oni of ife (slave descendent, Sudanese migrant, indigenous local...), what is known, however, is the origin of the Oba of Benin, and it is Benin empire, in the capital of the empire.

The one thing with the yorubs fanatics on nairaland is that you can't debate them because they ignore logic and facts. You only spend your time proving them wrong and they still bring up the same disproved claims and reopen the same settled debates. It is a non ending cycle.
You have to just basically dedicate your life to talking to them.

Do not debate fools.

Again, oranmiyan, oduduwa, igodimogodo, ogiso are fairytales! They never existed.

Ghostwon8222:

1) "Oyos" or "iyos" are actually ijo
2) the governor can't possibly be talking about a thing which wasn't noticed since the 1400's and just magically came to his knowledge in 1890, and again "oyos or iyos" are ijo, and they were pirates as seen in previous precolonial documents.
3) you are such a fool, also the expression of the governor "leading to the sea" is not a familiar expression today, so it is hard to know what he actually meant, but my guess is that he was talking about the exploits of ijo pirates in the coasts.
4) I notice how you act as if the governor never mentioned that a lot of the people in Lagos were from Dahomey...why bother with facts...

No ,
the Ijaw were not the Owners of Alorie ( Ilorin )which was invaded by the Fulani as clearly stated by the British Colonial Governor of Lagos
The Ijaw never ruled over Dahomey like the Oyo did

King Ghezo of Dahomey spent his youth being raised by the Alaafin of Oyo as a Hostage Prince
When his father the then King of Dahomey tried to misbehave

The king of Dahomey used to control almost all the Sea Ports east of Lagos

But after he misbehaved the Alaafin of Oyo took Badagry and Porto Novo off him permanently

Can you name a single battle the Ijaw ever fought with the Fulani?

None

Their paths never crossed

Ghostwon8222:

"Defeat", I didn't know we were in a fight.
1) as it has been advised, do not debate a fool, I should follow that advise and stop debating you.
2) you clearly don't follow rules of logic
3) you debate against proven facts
4) you lie compulsively and call yourself christistruth 😅

My brother stop debating him, he is one that likes holding on to arguments that makes him feel good even when they are not correct. How can Alaafin Oranmiyan be an overlord over Benin when he ruled in a period when Oyo was a minuscule kingdom. Oyo only became an empire in 1680 long after the death of Alaafin Oranmiyan and 240 years after Benin herself became one, yet he will not let go of that line of thought, he seem to be a joke. Ask him for lettered proof as it pertains to the Alaafin as an overlord over Benin, he will drop the claim. He wants everyone to believe the figment of his imaginations

Christistruth03:



No the Ijaw were not the Owners of Alorie ( Ilorin )which was invaded by the Fulani as clearly stated by the British Colonial Governor of Lagos

Can you name a single battle the Ijaw ever fought with the Fulani?

None

Their paths never crossed

The paper which you are quoting doesn't say that the "Oyos or Iyos" lived in illorin.
You have reading disabilities.
Once again, "ruling to the sea over Benin and Ewe" doesn't mean what you think, and "Oyos or Iyos" are ijo.

Also, the precolonial documents of the era described by the governor of Lagos in 1890 show the map below.
The map was made between 1600 and 1699.
I don't fully know what the governor meant, but I have documents of the era which he describes and which he didn't witness. And those documents show sovereign Benin empire.
I know logic ain't your thing.

Ologbo147:
My brother stop debating him, he is one that likes holding on to arguments that makes him feel good even when they are not correct. How can Alaafin Oranmiyan be an overlord over Benin when he ruled in a period when Oyo was a minuscule kingdom. Oyo only became an empire in 1680 long after the death of Alaafin Oranmiyan and 240 years after Benin herself became one, yet he will not let go of that line of thought, he seem to be a joke. Ask him for lettered proof as it pertains to the Alaafin as an overlord over Benin, he will drop the claim. He wants everyone to believe the figment of his imaginations

Alafin oranmiyan actually never existed.
Yoruba who talk about history are often times very clueless about the very meaning of history.They believe it is a story we just agree upon today.

I love this. There is now a fight between Edo and Ogiso, Bini ruler of the sky 😂😀

Ogiso were collaborators with Yoruba and British.

Abeg, this is now comical. Laff wan kill me.

googi:
I love this. There is now a fight between Edo and Ogiso, Bini ruler of the sky 😂😀

Ogiso were collaborators with Yoruba and British.

Abeg, this is now comical. Laff wan kill me.

1) show me a text written by a person who witnessed an ogiso
2) curing you from your lack of sense will be difficult
3) the earliest records of west Africa date back to the 1400's and they mention the Oba of Benin ruling an empire and leaving in his capital city of Benin.
4) therefor any eyewitness to an ogiso (if any such thing ever existed) must have lived more than 600 years ago, and before the first written records of the region.
5) so if there was ever any such thing as ogiso, how did it filter through more than 600 years of nobody mentioning it, right up to you ? And tell me just how it is even possible (if ogisos ever existed) to locate their descendents (no written record again), I guess it is all magical.
6) fools always think they are geniuses.

Ghostwon8222:
The one thing with the yorubs fanatics on nairaland is that you can't debate them because they ignore logic and facts. You only spend your time proving them wrong and they still bring up the same disproved claims and reopen the same settled debates. It is a non ending cycle.
You have to just basically dedicate your life to talking to them.

Do not debate fools.

Again, oranmiyan, oduduwa, igodimogodo, ogiso are fairytales! They never existed.

In other Words you are now Claiming that the Oba of Benin was lying when he
declared at 12 Minutes in the video below that Oranmiyan was the first Oba of Benin
after the Ogiso dynasty ended


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0mHzeQSlH8

The Oba of Benin is not a historian, nor a time traveler, he's an emperor. So I fail to see the relevance of bringing the Oba of Benin into this.
Oh, it is about emotional blackmail...ok.
When you've got no logic and no argument and you are a fool, try your luck at emotional blackmail.

Ghostwon8222:
The Oba of Benin is not a historian, nor a time traveler, he's an emperor. So I fail to see the relevance of bringing the Oba of Benin into this.
Oh, it is about emotional blackmail...ok

Do you know the wonderful thing about God Almighty’s Truth

It Conquers lies all the time


So are you now saying that the Oba of Benin was lying when he said Oranmiyan was the first Oba of Benin after the Ogiso dynasty
Please don’t digress

Christistruth03:


Do you know the wonderful thing about God Almighty’s Truth

It Conquers lies all the time


So are you now saying that the Oba of Benin was lying when he said Oranmiyan was the first Oba of Benin after the Ogiso dynasty
Please don’t digress

It seems to me that I already answered:

Ghostwon8222:
The Oba of Benin is not a historian, nor a time traveler, he's an emperor. So I fail to see the relevance of bringing the Oba of Benin into this.
Oh, it is about emotional blackmail...ok.
When you've got no logic and no argument and you are a fool, try your luck at emotional blackmail.

You like to keep flogging a dead horse.