pansophist:


Please give just one example to your claims.

killsmith:

And you aware China has begun seizing national assets of countries unable to payback debts?

killsmith:

China is no different from the west. Just a different specie of vulture.

That is not true. The history says it all. It was not China that plundered, and still plunders, the DRC for donkey years. It was not China that butchered the Himba tribe in Namibia, the first genocide committed on an ethnic group/race. That was where the Germans learnt work before the Holocaust. What about apartheid, was China involved? When China was constructing rails in Tanzania even when she lacked the expertise as she did today, where was the West? Na China enslaved blacks go America, Brazil, Caribbeans?

killsmith:

And you aware China has begun seizing national assets of countries unable to payback debts?

QueenNyakim:


Oh, shut the f.ck up.

You have to bring up ancient history from a hundred to hundreds of years ago to think you have a point? Nations change, and what Western Europe and America were back then aren't the same Western Europe and America they are today. Granted America not so much considering they have destabilized the Middle East but that was due to their Right Wing government that pulled US into a forever war after the bombing of the Twin Towers trade centre but that is besides the point. Same goes for China pre and post-Maoism cultural revolution that destroyed their own culture, values, and morals. They are not the same China as they were back then.

I dont like the West either especially when they threaten to sanction us when we dont accept their shit or come to give us lectures rather than invest but,

Yet you want to sing Kumbaya with these animals?

I am so glad more and more of us Africans are waking up to this shit. China is a racist, totalitarian, unbreathable shithole. You couldn't pay me any amount to live in an anti-freedom country like that. You don’t any right in their country but when they come to Africa our thieves who call themselves our leaders will hype them up and give them our biggest contracts to handle all the while they treat Africans like shit in their country.

China is a racist, totalitarian, unbreathable shithole. You couldn't pay me any amount to live in an anti-freedom country like that.

Gerrard59:
So, the article has statements by US officials about how they are apprehensive that China is partnering with sovereign countries in building much needed infrastructure and trade deals. The US is not interested in doing the same. Let it be stated that the US has been behind literally all the coups throughout Latin America with nothing to show it for ordinary people. China steps in to TRADE, not BULLY or COERCE these countries, aka a Win-Win relationship. What happens? The US is angry. Let it be stated here that the US has over 1000 military bases across the world, but China has only one, which is at Djibouti to thwart sea pirates' activities. The US, Japan, South Korea and a host of EU countries also have bases there as well.

Economic prosperity is the best antidote to your poor neighbours barging into your house uninvited. Your neighbours will not come to your house when they are as prosperous as you are. Even if you offer them free pass entry, most will not be interested in visiting you because they are doing well economically. Currently, the US faces a major migrant crisis from many Latin American countries. The question is: as a major economic superpower and political bloc throughout the hemisphere, why has the US not invested across South America so that ordinary people benefit and never try to enter the US illegally? Japan, South Korea and now China do this across South East Asia. In return, South East Asians don't attempt illegal migration because economic opportunities exist in their countries, which are the fruits of wealthy East Asian countries' investments. Why should a Thai come to Japan to work in automobile factories when there are Toyota factories across Thailand? Why should an Indonesian attempt to enter South Korea illegally when Korean ditto Chinese companies are investing like hungry lions across the archipelago?

Now, China does the same in South America strictly for economic purposes rather than military. If the Chinese wanted to step up a military base, they would have done it near the country and on the soil of a South East Asian nation. Rather, the Phillippines got a military base from the US, while Malaysia got a $10BN investment from Geely Motors. But but but, one random QueenNyakim says neither Malays nor Indonesians should dance kumbaya with the Chinese, but with folks who will promote LGTV activities rather than trade.

Again, for discerning readers, review this article and judge for yourselves. Who would you rather associate with, the folk who tell you to say no to finance and expertise for needed infrastructure WITHOUT offering an alternative or the one who is deeply interested in how you uplift yourself via trade and investment?

Article (free-to-read): https://archive.md/m0XfA

Gerrard59:

Trust me, no one is begging you to live in China. [b]I personally like it when people lampoon a place while I generate economic opportunities there. I prefer less competition. Just as the Nigerians in the US/UK/Canada dissuade those at home from relocating so they get all the benefits themselves, so do I. Lastly, as a black African, supposedly, terming China a sh!thole is an aberration. Learn to have some shame, at least publicly or pretend to have.[[/b]

Gerrard59:
I stumbled upon a letter by a Latin American who is a researcher at Boston University addressing an article by the Financial Times (FT) about how the Chinese are "controlling" Latin America's infrastructure. There is nothing that the man stated that I have not raised on this thread. How can you say we should not trade with the Chinese because of security concerns? Meanwhile, you never bothered to do the same. Why should we say no to China's money and expertise when we don't have the finances or technical know-how to develop needed infrastructure which would benefit our people? It sounds absurd and reeks of infantilization.

I will drop some screenshots of the letter and access to the article, which is free-to-read so that discerning readers can judge for themselves whether China is as bad as they and one random QueenNyakim claim.

letter: https://archive.md/39fOA

seguno2:


What do you think about the fact that Americans helped the Chinese and South Koreans develop their economies, and even the Japanese after defeating them in WWII, but they didn’t help their Latin American neighbours as well as us Africans?

Gerrard59:

For Africa, my theory is that should black African countries get wealthy, like China, Germany, Japan (for the most populous ones), and Malaysia, Singapore, South Korea, Norway, and Sweden for the less populous ones, blacks will avenge the racial dehumanisation committed by whites against them. They will likely team up with already established wealthy blacks in the US to challenge the so-called Liberal Order. Some might remain allies vassals just like Japan (upon the atomic bombs dropped on her soil), but others will challenge or openly question Western countries' policies towards blacks in places like Haiti, Guyana and Brazil.

Wealth gives power, and with it, hitherto poorer countries will begin to defend their kith elsewhere. For instance, Biden offered Kenya financial resources to restore order in Haiti (a court in Nairobi has ordered the operation to stop tho). If Kenya was as rich as South Korea or Nigeria as Germany, none will need the money or go-ahead from the Americans before offering succour to our kith faraway. Normal normal, a Surinamese or Haitian suppose apply to jobs in Nigeria/Kenya/DRC without hassles. That is what white South Africans do, wake up one morning and apply to European firms, boom, dem don get work. The same support the West lends to their kin in Southern Africa or India to Maldives/Madagascar or Spain to folks in South America. In another instance, some Chinese Singaporeans are proud of how Mainland China is now powerful. Yet another instance, the Japanese government created a special migration scheme for 4th generation Japanese in Brazil - they get an express route to naturalisation or permanent residency status if they wish. Thousands of Japanese moved to Brazil in the early 20th century in search of work when the Brazilians ran out of workers to man fields. Today, Brazil has the highest number of Japanese outside Japan.

Else, I don't see why Western governments and businesses will advocate for south east Asia whereas Africa is nearby, where labour costs are the lowest globally. English, French and to an extent Dutch and German are spoken by the natives. It is geographically closer. Senegal is closer to manufacture goods than Vietnam and export to Germany. One might say skills - but the Chinese were aided by the West to produce goods, ditto the Thais by the Japanese. To learn no be the problem. Did you offer them the opportunity to learn, and they refused to? Another one is remote jobs. You carry remote jobs go India and Phillippines, but West Africa is closer, and the rest of the continent shares the same timezone as Europe. Tomorrow, you begin dey complain about illegal migration because they want to search for a better life. Where else would they barge into if not the closest wealthy neighbour they can see? Na China or Japan dem go enter illegally?

As for South America, no idea.

pansophist:
@QueenNyakim,
Your insult would have been justified if at least, you were correct in your assertions. Also, pasting Western links, which is biased in its very existence doesn't give credence to your write-up.

Western oppression of Africans and by extension, the global south is not a long time ago, it is happening now, will continue into the future, and part of your everyday life.

I don't think I should go about writing how you breathe in western hegemony daily, merely reading this post from page one should make it clear. But no, it is not long ago, or hundreds of years, ago. It just evolved.

seguno2:


Many thanks for your reply.
I wonder why the Chinese are not also using us Africans as their cheap labour factories, now that they are wealthy and wage rates are very high?

Gerrard59:

They are. Most new factories opened across the continent are manned/founded by Indians, Lebanese and recently, Chinese. Chinese were involved in Ethiopia. However, with the civil war that happened, I don't know how far. Just like other investors, the Chinese need a sense of safety to protect their investments. In Ogun state and Lekki Free Trade Zone, na Chinese dey there. The Lekki Port was partly financed by the Chinese. Why Netherlands and Germany no put money inside? Tomorrow, if the German chancellor cautions Africa in doing business with the Chinese, does that make sense?

For instance, in solid minerals, the Chinese are all over. When I mentioned negotiations, e get why. In Indonesia, the politicians introduced a law mandating mining firms to process the minerals in the country before export. The EU sued Indonesia at the WTO. Meanwhile, Chinese investors opened factories. Enact the same law in Nigeria, and they (the Chinese) will open factories. They are that pragmatic. Seeing how China got entrenched, Korean investors followed and did the same. Knowing that others have ploughed so much in factories, Ford partnered with Chinese miners to plough $4.5BN into a new processing facility. If the Chinese had not invested and rather bullied or threatened Indonesia, others would not have followed. The EU won at the WTO, and Indonesia has appealed. One of the senior politicians to Joko, the president, echoed similar words as the South American researcher at Boston University. But but but one random QueenNyakim believes the Chinese are evil. Evil people dey create jobs for other people?

No idea about your other questions.

olutund:


Good day sir pansophist

I noticed youve been silent on the isreali-palestine matter.

intentional right?

pansophist:


I like to know about a particular issue before having an opinion on it. So yes, my silence was intentional.

pansophist:
BRICS have done it again, the fight to throw off the dollar and SWIFT has received another blow. BRIC pay has been launched.

Brics-pay.com

seguno2:


What do you think about the fact that Americans helped the Chinese and South Koreans develop their economies, and even the Japanese after defeating them in WWII, but they didn’t help their Latin American neighbours as well as us Africans?

seguno2:


Many thanks for your reply.
I wonder why the Chinese are not also using us Africans as their cheap labour factories, now that they are wealthy and wage rates are very high?

Do you think it’s because we are needlessly antagonistic to our benefactors, such that we reference and revere empty comrades like Julius Malema, Robert Mugabe, Thomas Sankara, Patrice Lumumba etc

Do we have any record of the Chinese, South Koreans or even the Japanese being equally antagonistic when they were still in need of assistance from the West?

QueenNyakim:

budaatum:
Basically, US must pay higher interest to borrow to spend.

https://wolfstreet.com/2023/10/20/why-longer-dated-treasury-yields-spiked-its-not-magic-yield-solves-all-demand-problems/

pansophist:
BRICS have done it again, the fight to throw off the dollar and SWIFT has received another blow. BRIC pay has been launched.

Brics-pay.com

fredwill1357:
Cc: Gerr.ard59. Some people on quora say America invested in China to use its cheap lab our to manufacture low tier goods for America consumption, while American industries focus on the high tier goods. Remember it's not America that is teaching China high tech.

America helped South Korea to make it better than North Korea and show the world that Communism or socialism doesn't work.
America perhaps helped Japan, to make itself appear better before the world after the genocide in Japan. I think their theory makes sense.
I do not consider America evil or a bad country though, maybe more of a necessary evil. The devil you know is better than the angel you don't know.

Without America, terrorists, dark dictators, extremist religions and countries might be running the world. Perhaps it is time for a new world order, let's see. PS: America has done some good things.

Gerrard59:


It is why, apart from the Philippines, the region's leaders are careful if not, the US does not mind going to war all in a bid to contain China, thereby destroying their region. After all, US politicians have publicly stated they don't mind destroying Taiwan's semiconductors' facilities so they don't end up in the hands of China.

pansophist:


America is building four new bases in the Philippines

https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/philippines-reveals-locations-4-new-strategic-sites-us-military-pact-2023-04-03/

And the location of three of those four bases is located on the island of Luzon, which is not far from Taiwan. The US is really preparing for hot chaos in Asia,

I am not sure why China is not responding preemptively. China is way way too patient for my liking. I only hope the US does not smuggle nuclear weapons there, just as they did in the Cuban crisis.

On a common sense note, it baffles me that there are leaders like Bongbog. What motivates such men? Is money/bribe/ or Western acceptance enough to sacrifice good, for evil? sigh.

Gerrard59:


I have wanted to ask you the same. Their responses are slow, not hard enough and they appear weak atimes. I can understand tact and not be hasty to reply, but it has gotten too far. On the other hand, what do you think of the constant missing persons in high-ranking positions. Today, army chief loss, another day, a senior minister don kpeme. Then a former prime minister kpai as well. Before you know wetin, one billionaire don carry declared missing tag. What is going on?

pansophist:


China is the only civilization in modern times that grew from the ashes without invading, occupying, or stealing other country's resources. That title is something very precious and the foundation of Chinese diplomatic rise.

, Exim bank versus IMF, the list goes on. China is on a mission to dethrone the US as the world hegemon, and they will do it by not been aggressors, that's The Anglos hallmark.