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5,000,000 Jews And The God :is The Israelites God Powerless / Since Jehovah's Witnesses Are Not Christians..what Do We Call Them? / The Mistake Of Israel/israelites Versus The Mistake Of The Church/christians (2) (3) (4)
Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Uchesis: 3:57pm On Mar 17 |
The Israelites don't believe in Christ. They don't acknowledge him as their Saviour Why is it so? . Is there something they know that we don't? 3 Likes |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Kobojunkie: 4:03pm On Mar 17 |
Uchesis:The religion of Christianity has absolutely nothing to do with the God of Israel or His Son, Jesus Christ. It only deals with the mentioning of his name but none of the substance of His Word and Truth, His Law. |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Uchesis: 4:12pm On Mar 17 |
Kobojunkie:You don't get it. Majority of Israelis practice Judaism, even though Christ was from there (Nazareth). But are the israelis not suppose to be more Christian than us? |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Kobojunkie: 4:16pm On Mar 17 |
Uchesis:God of Israel disavowed the religion of Judaism, yet those who you know as Israelites today continue to cling to that same religion. Does that make them people who are close to their God or His Truth? Christianity is a religion modeled after the religion of Judaism — the original lie. Why would Israelites be expected to abandon their original lie for a copy of the same lie? |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by 123yes(m): 4:30pm On Mar 17 |
In the Talmud the Jewish Bible they removed some chapters of the book of Isaiah that talk conspicuously about the savior Jesus Christ was removed. Up till now they are waiting for the savior that is why they go to pray at the waliwall of Jerusalem every Friday to pray to God to send the savior and restore the children of Israel. Isaiah is the man the Jews respect so much. It was when the original scrolls of the Bible was discovered by archologist that they discovered the manipulation of the book of Isaiah by Talmud. |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Kobojunkie: 4:34pm On Mar 17 |
123yes:How do you know this? Where are the chapters that were taken out now? |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Beautifulday: 9:08pm On Mar 17 |
Uchesis: Jesus was not a Christian but a Jew. So how would a Jew want to be a Christian? Christianity is for gentiles not Jews. The promise is for the Jews. Jesus brought the gentiles into the covenant of the Jews through Christianity. |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Uchesis: 9:39pm On Mar 17 |
Beautifulday:Maybe you see yourself as a gentile but i'm not. . I'm none of the above 2 Likes |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Beautifulday: 10:14pm On Mar 17 |
Uchesis: Who is a gentile and who are? |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Beautifulday: 10:18pm On Mar 17 |
Jesus death doesn't save the Jew from anything. It is the gentiles it gave access to become children of God. This is possible because Jesus came through the Jewish bloodline. Jews are children of God through Gods covenant with Abraham. They are not children of God because they obey the ten commandments. In fact, before the ten commandments came. They have been children of God. It is ignorance and over Sabi they make people go to preach to the Jews. |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by 123yes(m): 10:32pm On Mar 17 |
Kobojunkie:am I your teacher? Go and do research |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Kobojunkie: 10:34pm On Mar 17 |
123yes:You are the one who made a bold claim against the Talmud, yet you do not expect to be required to provide proof of claims made. |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Beautifulday: 10:45pm On Mar 17 |
Jesus didn't practice Christianity but Judaism. Jesus never told the Jews he was the son of God sent to save them. Jewish salvation is different from gentiles salvation. Why gentiles are praying to be saved from satan, Jews are praying to be save from men. |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by MrPresident1: 11:03pm On Mar 17 |
Uchesis: The Israelites believe in Jesus. It is the Israelis that do not believe in Jesus; they have forever rejected the law of God and were the first nation upon the earth to battle against the Lord and his word and his anointed at Rephidim, and they have lived in this rebellion forever Any regathering of Israel before Christ returns is a fake regathering, and your Israelis can never never accept the Law and Word of God Judaism is not in the Bible. Judaism is actually Babylonian religion and its holy book is the Babylonian Talmud and never the Torah. 1 Like |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by FxMasterz: 5:59am On Mar 18 |
Beautifulday: Absolutely Wrong! You're the one who's ignorant. Jesus Christ is the mediator of the New Covenant which God has set for the whole world including the Jews. The old covenant is abolished. God is no longer in Judaism. That's why the temple cloth tore into two the very night Christ hung on the cross. The disciples of Christ who preached the gospel to us were all Christian Jews. The apostles were Christian Jews. There are still Christian Jews in Jewry today. The Israelites rejected Christianity because they were blinded. The blinding of Israel has been prophesied. This is necessary in order that the crucifixion of Christ may take place. If Israel wasn't blinded, nobody would shout "crucify Him" unto Pilate. There would be no propitiation of sin. Christ's mission as lamb of God that takes away the sins of the world wouldn't have been fulfilled. But there comes a time when Israel would return to God through Christ. The prophecy for that is also future. Zechariah 12:10 “And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and pleas for mercy, so that, when they look on me, on him whom they have pierced, they shall mourn for him, as one mourns for an only child, and weep bitterly over him, as one weeps over a firstborn." Note, Jesus is the One whom they pierced. Israel would return to God in the latter days. They are expecting a physical Messiah who would rule the whole world from Jerusalem. They were disappointed because Jesus didn't fulfil this expectation. Their expectation is absolutely correct but that's going to happen in Christ's second coming. First, Christ has to reconcile the whole unto Himself as He is doing today. His work is first spiritual (Christianity), afterwards, He'll do the physical manifestation. The Jews missed the spiritual but they'll not miss the physical. Christ's death saves everyone, including the Jews. CC: Uchesis 3 Likes 2 Shares |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Maximus692(m): 7:20am On Mar 18 |
Uchesis: The scriptures say Christ (Messiah) will conquer all the kingdoms (government) of the world and establish his own which will last forever {Isaiah 9:6-7 compare to Daniel 2:44} but then the same scriptures say the Christ (Messiah) will be killed at his youthful age {Daniel 9:26} and he will surrender himself like a sacrificial lamb! Isaiah 53:1-12 Note that Isaiah said the Messiah will be executed along with criminals {Isaiah 53:12} all these his disciples noticed and recorded but their rulers back then hated Jesus till death because his presence and teachings is killing their political ambitions! John 11:48 That's why they started attacking his disciples and telling them to forget about whatever happened to Jesus of Nazareth! Act 4:18; 5:28 God bless you and may you have PEACE! |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Beautifulday: 6:38pm On Mar 18 |
FxMasterz: The Jews aren't children of God through Jesus death and resurrection only gentiles are. If Jesus didn't come through the children of God the Israelites, the gentiles cannot be children of God through him. |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by FxMasterz: 6:55pm On Mar 18 |
Beautifulday: That's not correct! The Jews themselves don't regard themselves as children of God. They see it as blasphemy for anyone to be called a child of God. To them, such a claim is worthy of the death penalty. In John 10:29-35, Jesus said: "My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand. 30 I and My Father are one.” 31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone Him. 32 Jesus answered them, “Many good works I have shown you from My Father. For which of those works do you stone Me?” 33 The Jews answered Him, saying, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God.” The Jews wanted to stone Jesus because He referred to God as His Father. It is through Jesus that we all became children of God, including the Jews. The condition for becoming a child of God is just to simply believe that Christ died and rose again. John 1:12 "But to all who believed him and accepted him, he gave the right to become children of God." Both Jews and Gentiles are among the "All" that must believe in Christ to have the right to become the children of God. 4 Likes |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Beautifulday: 7:46pm On Mar 18 |
FxMasterz: That is a good one. That is not the sense I am referring to. I mean, no other tribe or human worship Jehovah as God except Israel. Jesus gave the gentiles the opportunity and access to be able to worship God. Without Jesus, the gentiles cannot worship or be linked to God. But God chose Israel to be his people. He hasn't at anytime gone back on that choice that Israel should be looking for another means to get back to God. |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by FxMasterz: 8:13pm On Mar 18 |
Beautifulday: God has gone back on that choice. The physical Israel was a shadow of the real Israel - the church. God decided to use physical Israel as a specimen to demonstrate His love and judgements in physical terms. There was nothing special about them. Deuteronomy 9:6 "Therefore understand that the LORD your God is not giving you this good land to possess because of your righteousness, for you are a stiff-necked people." Deuteronomy 7:6-8 “For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth. The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people: But because the LORD loved you, and because he would keep the oath which he had sworn unto your fathers, hath the LORD brought you out with a mighty hand, and redeemed you out of the house of bondmen, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.” All through Israel's old testament history, God was teaching us physically who He is and what He wanted His children to be. We get to know the character of God through God's dealings with Israel. And once that was accomplished, God decided to abolish the Old Covenant and Establish a new one which would incorporate the whole world and Israel. Anyone, including the Jew is expected to have a stake in the new covenant. God does not love only Israel "For God so love the whole world.." And now that God is done with physically demonstrating Himself, He shifted His attention to the whole whole, breaking the middle wall of partition that was once wedged between Israel and the rest of the world, to make both Jews and Gentiles one entity in Christ Jesus. "For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God." - Romans 2:28-29 The spiritual Israel is the real Israel which the physical Israel foreshadowed. 3 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Beautifulday: 8:48pm On Mar 18 |
FxMasterz: The last scripture you quoted said, "But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God." Why should he be a Jew? When God met Abraham and wanted to make Israel his people he said," You also said God has gone back on his choice of Israel. Omo! This actually makes God but a liar and a covenant breaker. Abraham didn't look for God. God looked for him. Israel never looked for God, God looked for them. God doesn't love them because of anything but because he choose them. The same applies to christians. Israel and the gentiles doesn't have the same covenant. The covenant Israel have with God was seal with Abraham. God because the God of any seed of Abraham at circumcision. The covenant of the gentiles with God is seal with Jesus. God becomes the God of any gentile who believes in the Jesus and his savior. Jesus will have to come again to Israel to save them. But he will never come again to save the gentiles. |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by FxMasterz: 9:22pm On Mar 18 |
Beautifulday: Please read my post again and allow the Holy Spirit to guide your thoughts. You can see that you said so much but you have no scriptural backing for anything you said. Those are your own personal thoughts. They're not the thoughts of God. Who did you think Jesus was talking to when He said: "I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am he, you will indeed die in your sins.” - John 8:24. The Jews of course. It was the Jews He was also addressing in John 5'24: “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life." Jesus clearly told Jews who their real father is for rejecting Him: "For you are the children of your father the devil, and you love to do the evil things he does. He was a murderer from the beginning." - John 8:44 Jesus clearly told them they're of their father the devil. They're not children of God. Anyone who rejects Jesus is not a child of God, including the Jews. Jesus said to the religious leaders of the Jews: "If you were blind, you would have no sin. But since you say, 'We see,' your sin remains." John 9:41 For everyone who belongs to Jesus, the scriptures say: "And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise." Meanwhile , in John 8:39, Christ clearly told the Jews that they're not the children of Abraham. "They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham." But for anyone who is in Christ, the scriptures say again: "And you, dear brothers and sisters, are children of the promise, just like Isaac." - Galatians 4:28 2 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Veecruz: 10:10pm On Mar 18 |
Uchesis: God Himself, Who directly walked with them and they saw His Works and even ate in His Presence, they.hated, denied, resisted Him and they never acknowledged Him, nor His Messengers, so, how would they.acknowledge His Son, Jesus Christ? |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Veecruz: 10:26pm On Mar 18 |
Beautifulday: Read your bible well, the disciples , who were jews were called Christians and they were the first to be so tagged. 1 Like |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Veecruz: 10:35pm On Mar 18 |
Uchesis: Juadaism is Judah-ism which is the practice of abominations, so, Isreal is exactly the same people who left Egypt and annoyed God all the way, doing everything God hated and hath Commanded them not to do. So, it is very understandable why Isrealis are anti God and not Christians. 1 Kings 14:22 “And Judah did evil in the sight of the LORD, and they provoked him to jealousy with their sins which they had committed, above all that their fathers had done. For they also built them high places, and images, and groves, on every high hill, and under every green tree. And there were also sodomites in the land: and they did according to all the abominations of the nations which the LORD cast out before the children of Israel.” |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Veecruz: 10:58pm On Mar 18 |
FxMasterz: You are absolutely.wrong here. I have reasonably proven it to you several times until.you had no valid counter.that The old Covenant runs forever. And that since the jews left Egypt they did everything to get God to leave them alone which surely includes the putting aside of the covenant. But the prophets and then finally Christ, tried bringing it back which is why Christ Said Mark 7:8-9 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do. And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition. So, you are very wrong to say that the old covenant was abolished. And the curtain of the temple was supposed to tear for how can our God, our Creator, die and then it would be quiet and nothing remarkable and memorable? Impossible! See all the noise made when Queen Elizabeth died, is it now when God was murdered when He came visiting? You should have expected that it can never be quiet. Exactly, how His next visit will be! |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by FxMasterz: 4:35am On Mar 19 |
Veecruz: First of, where did you ever prove to me that the old testament runs forever? You and I have never had any discussion before. This would be our first discussion ever. If you think otherwise, bring proof. You can never prove to anyone that the old covenant runs forever because there's no scriptural backing for such an erroneous claim. Now, let me engage you with scriptures. The Old Testament does not run forever, that is why it became old, obsolete - no longer in use. It was replaced by the New. Note that the Old Testament was still running when God said to the people of Israel in Jeremiah 32:40: "I will make an everlasting covenant with them: I will never stop doing good to them, and I will inspire them to fear me, so that they will never turn away from me." Notice that in the above scripture, God promised the people of Israel a future covenant which is everlasting. They were at that time already in the old covenant. God was telling them indirectly that the current covenant they had with Him was a temporal covenant. There's an everlasting covenant slated for the future. In Jeremiah 31:31, God spoke more about this everlasting covenant slated for the future, which was fulfilled in Christ: The days are coming,” declares the LORD, “when I will make a New Covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah." The New Covenant is the everlasting covenant. Not the Old. There's no need to argue unnecessarily on this. If you ever proved to anyone on this platform that the Old Testament was not abolished, you were probably arguing with someone who lacked the basic knowledge of scripture. The scripture explicitly declares that the Old Testament has been abolished. I'll bring you a few scriptures: Hebrews 8:13 "In that He says, "A New Covenant, " He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away. The old testament that is made obsolete by the declaration of the future new testament was already prepared to be vanished away by the declaration. Hebrews. 8:6-7 "But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, inasmuch as He is also Mediator of a better covenant, which was established on better promises. For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second." Galatians 3:24-25 "Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor ." Now, do not think that the 10 commandments are no longer active because of the abrogation of the old testament. The 10 commandments are encapsulated in the Royal Law - the law of love. To love God and to love one's neighbors. The difference between the Old Testament and the New is that the Old Testament was written on tables of stone. The New testament was written in our hearts. The yearly blood of animals was needed as propitiation for sins in the old testament. In the new testament, the blood of Jesus is an everlasting sacrifice. We live under grace and not under the law in the new covenant. We do God's will by the grace of God - doing His will as part of our new nature, not by observing commandments. God Himself does His commandments through us by the Holy Ghost whom He has given unto us. Philippians 2:13 For God is working in you, giving you the desire and the power to do what pleases him." This is grace. John 1:16 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ. 3 Likes |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Maximus692(m): 7:32am On Mar 19 |
Beautifulday: Jesus never practiced Judaism because that's not the religion Moses handed over the Israel, Judaism came as a result of Jews being in exile under the Cheldians (Babylonians) so by the time they return home what Moses gave them was lost as different schools of thought sprang up with contradicting teachings and conflicting doctrines all claiming worshipers of the same God. That's why first century Judaists had serious issues with Jesus of Nazareth because he kept pointing out the things they are doing which has polluted the pure worship Moses handed over to their ancestors. That's why they killed Jesus if he was practicing Judaism they wouldn't have hated him but as he kept pointing out the wrong in Judaism they connived with the Roman governor to get rid of Jesus. The group name "CHRISTIANS" came through the mouth of Judaists living in Antioch they hated the disciples of Jesus so much that they wish them evil always so when they called them Christians what they had in mind is that each of them will live a miserable life and die like their leader who claimed to be the Christ. The first name given to Jesus' disciples is "those belonging to the way" {Act 9:2} because their leader claimed he is "THE WAY" John 14:6 From Abel to John the baptist none is qualified for everlasting life yet because the one and only role model given to mankind is the Christ who is Jesus {John 3:16} so after resurrection these faithful people must learn how to be like Jesus in thought, word and action before they can be granted Visa to everlasting life that's why Jesus told John in the Bible book of Revelations that the rest of mankind considered as dead while still living never gained life until the 1,000 years of Christ reign is over {Revelations 20:5} that's why Jesus told his listeners that nobody born of women is greater than John from Abel's day but the least among those who accepted Christ's teachings is greater than John! Matthew 11:11-12 So if any Jew fails to become one of Jesus' disciples not even the Mosaic laws can save him because God already told them through Moses that the laws given was to lead them to the person who will teach them how to gain everlasting life {Deuteronomy 18:18} therefore whoever among them fail to accept Jesus' teachings has derailed and the wrath of God is upon him! Deuteronomy 18:19 God bless you and may you have PEACE! |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Veecruz: 7:35am On Mar 19 |
FxMasterz: And the same Jeremiah told us what the New Everlasting Covenant was. Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. 34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more. And It is after this The LORD, came as the Man called Jesus Christ, to do all that was Written and Prophecied. So, you can see the New Covenant was an Addition and not a taking away exactly how "a woman shall compass a man" was a new thing. It did not remove anything in the old. And all the passages of Hebrews 8 and Galatians 3 and Phillipians you quoted are all acknowleding The Visitation of The LORD, as prophecied by Jeremiah in Chapter 31:34 34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more. |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by FxMasterz: 10:44am On Mar 19 |
Veecruz: If you read my reply to you , you'll remember I said the Old Covenant was written on Tables of stone, but the New Covenant is written in our hearts. This is exactly established by the Jeremiah 31:33 that you quoted. Rather than invalidate my position, your response validates it. It proves that there's a new covenant established on better promises. Jesus is the Mediator of this New Covenant. It is an everlasting covenant. Hebrews 12:22-23 "But you have come to Mount Zion, to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem. You have come to thousands upon thousands of angels in joyful assembly, to the church of the firstborn, whose names are written in heaven. You have come to God, the Judge of all, to the spirits of the righteous made perfect, to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel." The Everlasting New Covenant which was promised in Jeremiah was fulfilled in Jesus. There'll be no other covenant after this covenant. This covenant is the real covenant God initially intended to make with man. The Old Testament was a shadow. The Lambs and Bullocks that were sacrificed foreshadowed the real Lamb, Jesus, who takes away the sins of the whole world. John 1:29 "Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world." The dead High Priest Aaron and his levitical priesthood foreshadowed Jesus who is our eternal, and never dying High Priest: "Therefore, since we have a Great High Priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess." -Hebrews 4:14 - 15. It is said of Jesus: "For it is declared: “You are a Priest forever, in the order of Melchizedek.” -Hebrews 7:7 Jesus, the High Priest of the New Covenant is a Forever High Priest because the Covenant of His Priesthood, the New Covenant is a Forever Covenant. The children of Israel who worshipped God in the Old Covenant foreshadowed the Church of God who worship God in the New. "This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:" - Acts 7:38 The church in the wilderness is replaced by the New Testament Church which Jesus purchased with His blood. Finally, the scriptures reaffirm that the New Covenant which we are in, is the Everlasting Covenant: "Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that Great Shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the Everlasting Covenant, make you perfect in every good work to do His will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in His sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever." - Hebrews 13:20. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by Veecruz: 12:53pm On Mar 19 |
FxMasterz: Is it not the old covenant Laws which was on tables of stone that is being transferred and transplanted into our hearts to continue there? Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. |
Re: Why Are The Israelites Not Christians? by FxMasterz: 12:59pm On Mar 19 |
Veecruz: There's the law of the covenant. The law is the law, and the covenant is the covenant. The law is not the covenant and the covenant is not the law. The old covenant consists of the law, the prophets, the ordinances and the tokens of the covenant. The law alone does not make the covenant. Luke 16:16 “The Law and the Prophets were proclaimed until John. Since that time, the good news of the kingdom of God is being preached, and everyone is forcing into it." 1 Like |
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