Marjoribanks:
Defending from who? Flair from who?

Modric, Ronaldo and Messi have won the Ballon in the last 20 years. Players in their 30s!

Where are those 20 something players with flair and good defending?

TheGoodJoe:


Funny this is coming from Bielsa. One of those who perfected the art of defending with a hard press.

I said technical players is not what is causing less flair in football but how good defending is today.

Bielsa is one of those that caused it. Slacken how tight defending is and you will see flair in the game return.

Napoleon55:

Yeah tell that to these guys.

Napoleon55:

Cannavaro won ballon d'or as a defender,
I don't even know if a any defender can make top 10 today talkless of top 5.
Maybe Rudiger can make top 15

TheGoodJoe:


They will be marked out. Football today is highly complex. I like these guys passionately but the fact is that the physicality in today's game is very high. These guys were not even soundly fit. Except Rivaldo.

Napoleon55:

I just wanted u to know that u are absolutely wrong if u think that your defenders of today will mark out these guys for 90 minutes.

TheGoodJoe:


I don't even see Canavaro as a brilliant player. He just defended. Today we see defenders doing far more. Defending, moving more in build up plays, excelling in short and long passes. Going to midfield and dribbling. Playing comfortably on a high line. I don't see Canavaro a better footballer than even John Stones.

TheGoodJoe:
I have been that voice crying in the wilderness.

TheGoodJoe:


I said they will. Why do you think Ronaldinho was first kicked out of Barcelona by Pep Guardiola? He was not going to work with the system or against it.

You can't waste time with ball. That is what the space and time theory is all about.

Napoleon55:

He was not brilliant because he didn't play under Pep Guardiola, and that he belonged to older generation

TheGoodJoe:


I said they will. Why do you think Ronaldinho was first kicked out of Barcelona by Pep Guardiola? He was not going to work with the system or against it.

You can't waste time with ball. That is what the space and time theory is all about.

Odunayaw:
So because he wasn't going to work with the system means he is lesser than those who could abi

Ronaldinho et al aren't fit or physically strong? I no de surprised

Napoleon55:

When Ronaldinho were succeeding with the other coaches, where was Guardiola?
If Pep had issue with Ronaldinho, that was his problem, not whether Ronaldinho is capable of working with any system or not.

If Messi were not emerging as an exceptional player,do u think he would have been kicked out like that by Pep?

TheGoodJoe:


My point is simple. Canavaro just defended. There was little flair to his game. Today, we have defenders that are good on dribbling, passing and moving. They still defend tight and recover to cover gaps.

TheGoodJoe:


I don't even see Canavaro as a brilliant player. He just defended. Today we see defenders doing far more. Defending, moving more in build up plays, excelling in short and long passes. Going to midfield and dribbling. Playing comfortably on a high line. I don't see Canavaro a better footballer than even John Stones.

TheGoodJoe:
Exactly what I have been saying.

TheGoodJoe:
I have been that voice crying in the wilderness.

TheGoodJoe:


When Ronaldinho was succeeding, it was before the changes we are seeing today. The philosophy Guardiola brought required intensity of the ball, and quick thinking with the ball. Getting the ball moving. Ronaldinho was not built for that.

Finally, Messi was a perfect fit for the system of Pep. He was built for it and there was no way he would have been kicked out.

Finito.

Odunayaw:
You posted something shitting on your bias

You saw "scripted" and it still flew over your head...as usual

charlesemeka85:
I believe this. Even the likes of Zizou, Dinho, Aimar, Riquelme,Baggio etc would hv suffered greatly if they played in this era

Napoleon55:

I was implying that he kicked out Ronaldinho out because he saw an alternative with an emerging talent in Messi, not that is not possible for Ronaldinho to work with his system successfully

TheGoodJoe:


It did not fly over my head. It is one of the reasons I posted it. The demand for tactical strictness today makes it difficult for players with flair to easily shine.

Marjoribanks:
Kane, Watkins, Halaand, Guirasy, Martinez etc are scoring 20 to 30+ goals in a defensive solid generation! Is this a joke? lol

TheGoodJoe:


The discussion is creativity and flair. Not scoring goals.

Napoleon55:

These guys are geniuses,they world have find a way to play the game effortless in such a way it would wow u.

TheGoodJoe:


Don't miss my point. I am not saying Ronaldinho won't be good. He will be a bright talent. But, won't operate on that stellar level as he did in the past. The space will limit that.

TheGoodJoe:


It did not fly over my head. It is one of the reasons I posted it. The demand for tactical strictness today makes it difficult for players with flair to easily shine.

TheGoodJoe:


The discussion is creativity and flair. Not scoring goals.

TheGoodJoe:


That would be true if they played the same position. Ronaldinho played with Messi under Rijkaard. So it was not a case of emerging talent. Tactically it was not going to fly. Ronaldinho's style of play would not have fit into the kind of possessive control Pep aimed for.

Napoleon55:

Maybe he has become more robotic for one reason or another,maybe he has lost form or following instructions,I don't know.

But he has the talent of the old,that's what I was just trying to convey.

TheGoodJoe:


Funny this is coming from Bielsa. One of those who perfected the art of defending with a hard press.

I said technical players is not what is causing less flair in football but how good defending is today.

Bielsa is one of those that caused it. Slacken how tight defending is and you will see flair in the game return.