Teebest82:
A friend of mine had a twin baby last week,a boy and a girl,his parents want him to also circumcise the girl twin and he refused,they said it's in their culture to circumcise a girl child,just want to seek your opinion about this because i can't allow that to happen to my girl child,and those that support it,what's its purpose.Also heard some countries don't circumcise their male children,that looks akward to me.What's your opinion about all this.

let me guess mmmm ur friend is from benin ryt?

kandiikane:
Wait this is on front page? Lol, Crackhus, unquote Me.

Is this shyness I sense? Lol, which one do you need me to unquote?

coogar:


stop misinforming the public....
the risks attached to female circumcision is the same as that of male circumcision. how can you tell that it's worse for the women? if it's worse for the women, does that necessarily make it ok for the men? should both men & women not get protection from archaic traditional practises?

then you spoke about VVF - that only tells me you are a media sheep. VVF is a poverty disease. where there are adequate health care, VVF is non-existent. UK/USA have the worst teenage pregnancy statistics in the world, none of their girls have a single case of VVF.



the exegesis of traditional practises isn't the crux of the matter here, what i highlighted is the hypocrisy that protects the girl child & neglects the boy child. if you are going to argue against FGM, you have to argue against MGM as well. after all said & done, you folks would turn around and demand gender equality. where's the equality in your argument?

I have restructured my original post in order to avoid confusion, as I can see it can be misinterpreted to mean I was in support of FGM or MGM which I am not
my point is FGM is worse than male circumcision! but that does not mean either are acceptable.

I am also not a media sheep thank you very much, I am an informed professional.

VVF is also associated with FGM not just childbirth in sexually immature females because of scarring and reduction in the introitus in the most radical practices of FGM seen in some cultures such as in the Somalians.

So what has poverty got to do with 'enforced mutilation'? It is not just poverty and I can sense we are on the same page in that respect but I will add in the western world, yes there is teenage pregnancy but as you know they have their babies in better equipped and staffed hospitals and so have access to better healthcare. A 10-12 year old child having a baby in sub-saharan Africa is not the same as an older teenager, lets say for arguments sake 15-18, in the western world having a baby.
So it's not a black and white argument and a teenager in the western world for one will be larger, more sexually mature and better nourished than one living in subsaharan Africa. They also have a higher rate of CS deliveries due to their smaller size which the African teenagers would not have access to so there are possible explanations for the lower rate of VVF. Birth trauma does exist in the western world but it is properly managed in most cases and is not a big problem and I should know because I see the longer term complications of birth trauma in my clinic.

The main point I am trying to make is that FGM has a serious impact on the quality of life of those who have undergone the procedure.

Thank you

NJF

coogar:


if the twin boy is getting circümcised according to his culture then why should the twin girl get any special treatment? the same argument exists for both genders. just as FGM reduces pleasure in women, it does the same to men.

just like baby girls are at risk of getting infected through crude tools, baby boys are at risk too. both genders go through days of pain as well. so don't argue for one gender & neglect the other. we either agree circumcision is bad for all humans or good for all humans.

if you guys don't like being circumcised,you can start a movement To abolish the practice you know?
Don't be getting in our way when we are doing our own thang.

crackhaus:

Is this shyness I sense? Lol, which one do you need me to unquote?

not shyness oo but there are a lot of bytches in the form of the male gender. The first one where I answered your question.

naijafresh:

I have restructured my original post in order to avoid confusion, as I can see it can be misinterpreted to mean I was in support of FGM which i am not FGM is worse than male circumcision!

no mutiliation is worse than the other. mutiliation is mutiliation. this is like saying normal rapë is worse than digital räpe. abeg - rapê is râpe - don't add degrees to it.

I am also not a media sheep thank you very much, I am an informed professional.

an informed professional trained by the west & brainwashed to believe traditional african practises are evil.

VVF is also associated with FGM not just childbirth in sexually immature females because of scarring and reduction in the introitus in the most radical practices of FGM seen in some cultures such as in the Somalians.

the VVF is as a result of poverty not because of the FGM itself. if FGM is legal in western countries, there wouldn't be a risk of VVF. it's up to the government to improve the quality of the ante/post-natal treatments. stop using VVF propaganda to scare people - it's a poverty disease.

So what has poverty got to do with 'enforced mutilation'? In the western world, yes there is teenage pregnancy but they have their babies in better equipped and staffed hospitals and so have access to better healthcare.

and it didn't occur to you that better equipped and better healthcare is as a result of no poverty? yet you ask how poverty is connected to mutiliation? so how come this enforced mutiliation don't apply to male babies? you mean male babies can make decisions of MGM for themselves and this is why their mothers mutiliate them?

A 10-12 year old child having a baby in subsaharan Africa is not the same as an older teenager, lets say for arguments sake 15-18, in the western world having a baby.

ladies & gentlemen, the first case of inferiority complex on this forum has been unearthed.

Its not a black and white argument and a teenager in the western world for one will be larger, more sexually mature and better nourished than one living in subsaharan Africa. They also have a higher rate of CS deliveries due to their smaller size which the African teenagers would not have access to so there are possible explanations for the lower rate of VVF. Birth trauma does exist in the western world but it is properly managed in most cases and is not a big problem and I should know because I see the longer term complications of birth trauma in my clinic.

forget lower rate - VVF does not exist at all in developed countries and their children get pregnant like pigs. that effectively nullifies your point - poverty is the reason there's incidence of VVF in africa, the practise has nothing to do with it.

cococandy:
if you guys don't like being circumcised,you can start a movement To abolish the practice you know?
Don't be getting in our way when we are doing our own thang.

i was expecting such rejoinder.
you have told us you are a feminist & yet you would willingly give up your son to be mutiliated, diced & tortured in the name of MGM while you keep your daughters in a locker.

gender equality? yeah right!

kandiikane:

not shyness oo but there are a lot of bytches in the form of the male gender. The first one where I answered your question.

Done, check to see if it's better that way.

Absolutely

coogar:


i was expecting such rejoinder.
you have told us you are a feminist & yet you would willingly give up your son to be mutiliated, diced & tortured in the name of MGM while you keep your daughters in a locker.

gender equality? yeah right!

cococandy:
Absolutely

nice!!
so don't argue when people tell you to your face that feminism is a fraud.

it's one thing to acknowledge the fraud & enjoy the ride AND it's another thing to pretend there's no gender bias in the movement.

Nonso23:

When you go about abusing male children you mean??

we have to coin a name for that ö....

son abusers

Nonso23:


When you go about abusing male children you mean??

coogar:


nice!!
so don't argue when people tell you to your face that feminism is a fraud.

it's one thing to acknowledge the fraud & enjoy the ride AND it's another thing to pretend there's no gender bias in the movement.



we have to coin a name for that ö....

son abusers

i don't see anyone stopping from not circumcising your sons. You can start the movement. I will support you from afar . But my sons will be circumcised

cococandy:
i don't see anyone stopping from not circumcising your sons. You can start the movement. I will support you from afar . But my sons will be circumcised

chief priestess of son abusers.

i hail thee!!!

coogar:


chief priestess of son abusers.

i hail thee!!!

that's all you can do about it

Nonso23:

cococandy:
that's all you can do about it

what else can i do than to pull your legs? you sef, look am with your ada owerri eyeballs:

male genital mutiliation - accepted
female genitäl mutiliation - child abuse.

can you explain the logic behind this?

coogar :


male genital mutiliation - accepted
female genitäl mutiliation - child abuse

that is absolutely true

cococandy:
that is absolutely true

explain the logic, ada owerri.

coogar:


what else can i do than to pull your legs? you sef, look am with your ada owerri eyeballs:

male genital mutiliation - accepted
female genitäl mutiliation - child abuse.

can you explain the logic behind this?

lemme explain it, God made a mistake in the male genitals hence the correction/ mutilation. .but He didn't in the female genitals, hence the reason why it shouldn't be mutilated...hypocrite much? Yes...this is why the laws of men is nothing but a farce.

sarutobie:

lemme explain it, God made a mistake in the male genitals hence the correction/ mutilation. .but He didn't in the female genitals, hence the reason why it shouldn't be mutilated...hypocrite much? Yes...this is why the laws of men is nothing but a farce.

i like your sarcasm.

cococandy should copy your answer before you remove it.

coogar:


explain the logic, ada owerri.

the consequences for men are not the same for women.
For men circumcision is done for good reasons such as sexuall health improvement.etc
I've even heard of uncircumcised men who complain of plain when trying to pull back the foreskin.
Circumcision Is definitely in the best interest of men.


For women it is done for restrictive purposes such as making sure she doesn't develop good sexual appetite in other to propagate 'chastity'
(Even though it is not yet established that it actually works)
The reasons for practice alone is enough to make no self respecting mother want her baby girl circumsize.

That is damn disrespectful and demeaning.

Are we saying that circumcision of males should also be stopped?
That will be difficult due to the religious background of male circumcision.

What is the argument for female circumcision?
Is there any religious background to FGM? or is it just indigenous traditional beliefs regarding female chastity? or the I was circumcised so you shall be circumcised attitude?

If it is deeply rooted in society how do we tackle this? support and monitor it ie performed in clinics under aseptic conditions rather than with a rusty old bleeding in a dirty room or ban it all together? Educate the public? or just wait for it to die out like some other practices

I personally feel FGM is more of an issue and we should devise a plan for dealing with the issue.

Constructive arguments and criticisms please, personal attacks are a disease in Nigerian forums, i just ignore them

cococandy:

the consequences for men are not the same for women. For men circumcision is done for good reasons such as sexuall health improvement.etc

same can be argued for women. a female muslim scholar actually argued women that are uncircumcised have the tendencies to smell down there. so this point is moot!

I've even heard of uncircumcised men who complain of plain when trying to pull back the foreskin. Circumcision Is definitely in the best interest of men.

that's a lie!
where's that pain when they are having sex or you think the foreskin doesn't draw back during the friction that exists during intercöurse?

For women it is done for restrictive purposes such as making sure she doesn't develop good sexual appetite in other to propagate 'chastity'
(Even though it is not yet established that it actually works)

by the same token, this point can be argued for the men too. uncircumcised men enjoy sëx 50% more. so why don't men say they were cut to reduce the sensation they should naturally get from sėx or touching?

The reasons for practice alone is enough to make no self respecting mother want her baby girl circumsize. That is damn disrespectful and demeaning.

like i said, if uncircumcised males enjoy sėx more than the other divide, could it not be argued that male circumcision is also strictly for restrictive purposes?

coogar:


and uncircumcised väginas aren't ugly?
the last one i saw when i was dating this jamaican chic in college - she looked like she had her own pënis down there. the clït was longer than my middle finger.....and it had several lines too, like a pleated skirt.

I had a friend with one of those, her innards poked way out of her outers. Not attractive at all.


@crackhaus, yep thanks

Uncircumcised men enjoy sex more?
Bollocks.

I don't even believe uncircumsized females enjoy sex more. Some women have clitoraal orgasmss while some have G-sspot orgasmss ,so it is a school of thought that is not totally proven behind reasonable doubt.
My argument against FGM is not based on that unproven hypothesis but based on the reasons why it is done.
Remove that reason and you will see that it a totally unnecessary practice.
Say no to demeaning and disrespectful practices.


If circumsizing boys was bad,why do some young men go by themselves to get circumsized in their adulthood?

Anyway
If you believe MGM is disrespectful to men, get in line with us and start your Campaign now

To answer your question,you and I know that men are not circumsized to reduce their sexxual appetite.

coogar:


same can be argued for women. a female muslim scholar actually argued women that are uncircumcised have the tendencies to smell down there. so this point is moot!



that's a lie!
where's that pain when they are having sex or you think the foreskin doesn't draw back during the friction that exists during intercöurse?



by the same token, this point can be argued for the men too. uncircumcised men enjoy sëx 50% more. so why don't men say they were cut to reduce the sensation they should naturally get from sėx or touching?



like i said, if uncircumcised males enjoy sėx more than the other divide, could it not be argued that male circumcision is strictly for restrictive purposes?

naijafresh:
Are we saying that circumcision of males should also be stopped? That will be difficult due to the religious background of male circumcision.

difficult? was it not you that told us some traditions should be abandoned for our sanity? why is abolishing the rubbing of cow-dung on umbilical cord very easy to accomplish but eradication of male circumcision would be difficult?

What is the argument for female circumcision?
Is there any religious background to FGM? or is it just indigenous traditional beliefs regarding female chastity? or the I was circumcised so you shall be circumcised attitude?

what we are saying is don't neglect one at the expense of the other. if there's really an equality in genders then what's good for the goose should also suit the gander.

If it is deeply rooted in society how do we tackle this? support and monitor it ie performed in clinics under aseptic conditions rather than with a rusty old bleeding in a dirty room or ban it all together? Educate the public? or just wait for it to die out like some other practices

both practises should either be completely eradicated or stay. dropping one & keeping the other is not fairness. baby boys also feel some pain too & they didn't give consent to the mothers that gave them away to be abused.

I personally feel FGM is more of an issue and we should devise a plan for dealing with the issue.

why ain't i surprised that you would choose a bigger evil in a practise that abuse male & female children?

Constructive arguments and criticisms please, personal attacks are a disease in Nigerian forums, i just ignore them

this is no personal attack....
when people reluctantly apply logic in their comments, personal attacks might ensue. you said up there that FGM is more of a worry to you because....

•you don't think boys suffer untold pain
•you don't think boys bleed out during the ish
•you don't think boys enjoy sėx less after.
•you will rather see a boy cry
• and so on & forth....

So G-sspot = centre of gravity on nairaland

I cannot laugh

coogar:

by the same token, this point can be argued for the men too. uncircumcised men enjoy sëx 50% more. so why don't men say they were cut to reduce the sensation they should naturally get from sėx or touching?

Men don't usually assume the victim stance, obviously...but should you tell a woman that she always wants to be seen as a victim, it becomes chauvinism.