The atheist points out the principle of the conservation of energy: that energy can be neither created nor destroyed, but only change forms (it can equally be said that “matter can be neither created nor destroyed…”).

using the conservation of energy to argue against the beginning of the universe reveals confusion about cosmology to begin with. Scientists can extrapolate back to the beginning of the big bang–which is the moment when both space and time came into existence, along with all of the material world. So we know scientifically that there was a moment when there was no matter at all. It was created, not out of other matter, but out of nothing. Here is the key to note: it is once the universe came into existence that the laws of nature came into effect–before the universe, there was nothing.

So if we use the conservation of energy... how did the matter that causes the big bang come in to existence?
How come we as human beings are so well constructed along with animals? Why when we are being formed from which ever bacteria you chose we are formed in male and female?

What kind of chance made us humans? With our eyes, legs, brain, heart, liver, or are they a wonderful construction of a supernatural being?

Don't conflate knowledge of the big bang with atheism. We don't understand everything about the big bang, but that doesn't mean that god did it. We thought the same thing about diseases 200 years ago.

Also I don't think that the human body is that well-constructed. We have plenty of flaws. We are simply the work of ongoing evolution.

onetrack:
Don't conflate knowledge of the big bang with atheism. We don't understand everything about the big bang, but that doesn't mean that god did it. We thought the same thing about diseases 200 years ago.

Also I don't think that the human body is that well-constructed. We have plenty of flaws. We are simply the work of ongoing evolution.

Its funny you are admitting that you don't understand what you use to belittle Christianity. And our body is well constructed... Every animal that chew have a teeth... Eyes eyes all those are well engineered to give us sense to experience our surrounding... All this did not come by chance.

benalvino1:


Its funny you are admitting that you don't understand what you use to belittle Christianity. And our body is well constructed... Every animal that chew have a teeth... Eyes eyes all those are well engineered to give us sense to experience our surrounding... All this did not come by chance.

Well, we know that Adam and Eve and the garden of Eden did not happen; we just don't know every detail about the big bang.

And yes, I would claim that the existence of life is due to chance. Our bodies don't adapt well to many situations. We are easy prey for many diseases and animals. We are just another part of the food chain.

onetrack:


Well, we know that Adam and Eve and the garden of Eden did not happen; we just don't know every detail about the big bang.

And yes, I would claim that the existence of life is due to chance. Our bodies don't adapt well to many situations. We are easy prey for many diseases and animals. We are just another part of the food chain.

Lets say Adam and eve did not happen, how did you know the big bang happened? What proof do you have? What kind of particles that cause the big bang? How did they collide? How big and small was the space? Where did all the gasses and chemical composition came from? All this you guys cant answer yet you know the universe started from the big bang.

Op, what is wrong with you?

How old are you first? This your nursery school reasoning.....

benalvino1:


Lets say Adam and eve did not happen, how did you know the big bang happened? What proof do you have? What kind of particles that cause the big bang? How did they collide? How big and small was the space? Where did all the gasses and chemical composition came from? All this you guys cant answer yet you know the universe started from the big bang.

They are still working on that. You need to ask someone with greater knowledge than I. In any case this has really nothing to do with the fact that I'm an atheist.

wiegraf:
Op, what is wrong with you?

How old are you first? This your nursery school reasoning.....

Conservation of energy is university level topic... Mainly in thermodynamics. Instead of you to address the problem you are saying am reason like a nursery school child.

onetrack:


They are still working on that. You need to ask someone with greater knowledge than I. In any case this has really nothing to do with the fact that I'm an atheist.

For how long? How will they get to the proof? They cant even travel past the moon

onetrack:
Don't conflate knowledge of the big bang with atheism. We don't understand everything about the big bang, but that doesn't mean that god did it. We thought the same thing about diseases 200 years ago.

Also I don't think that the human body is that well-constructed. We have plenty of flaws. We are simply the work of ongoing evolution.

Isaiah 45:9

"What sorrow awaits those who argue with their Creator. Does a clay pot argue with its maker? Does the clay dispute with the one who shapes it, saying, 'Stop, you're doing it wrong!' Does the pot exclaim, 'How clumsy can you be?'

Y'all want perfection but you don't want to work for it, LOL...Humans are still being schooled! Until we realize that righteousness brings peace and unrighteousness destruction, we will never be perfect....which is why we MUST pass the test to be promoted. So questioning the flaws of the flesh is folly because we MUST pass the test before we are reconfigured with perfection!

Perfection is the only thing that will bring peace and joy to the world...we lack that now, that is why our wisdom cannot bring us peace! You could still call it "evolution of consciousness" but the truth is, the whole process is being supervised by the giver of life....

onetrack:


They are still working on that. You need to ask someone with greater knowledge than I. In any case this has really nothing to do with the fact that I'm an atheist.

Working on what? Is that faith or what? You Nairaland atheists are unbelievably funny LOL Smh!

Do you think that human knowledge will bring peace and perfection to the world we live in? Our curiosity will only lead us to a miserable end and self destruction!

onetrack:
Don't conflate knowledge of the big bang with atheism. We don't understand everything about the big bang, but that doesn't mean that god did it. We thought the same thing about diseases 200 years ago.

Also I don't think that the human body is that well-constructed. We have plenty of flaws. We are simply the work of ongoing evolution.

onetrack:


Well, we know that Adam and Eve and the garden of Eden did not happen; we just don't know every detail about the big bang.

And yes, I would claim that the existence of life is due to chance. Our bodies don't adapt well to many situations. We are easy prey for many diseases and animals. We are just another part of the food chain.

Even your father Darwin was an agnostic, he couldn't prove the nonexistence of God.

benalvino1:
The atheist points out the principle of the conservation of energy: that energy can be neither created nor destroyed, but only change forms (it can equally be said that “matter can be neither created nor destroyed…”).

using the conservation of energy to argue against the beginning of the universe reveals confusion about cosmology to begin with. Scientists can extrapolate back to the beginning of the big bang–which is the moment when both space and time came into existence, along with all of the material world. So we know scientifically that there was a moment when there was no matter at all. It was created, not out of other matter, but out of nothing. Here is the key to note: it is once the universe came into existence that the laws of nature came into effect–before the universe, there was nothing.

So if we use the conservation of energy... how did the matter that causes the big bang come in to existence?
How come we as human beings are so well constructed along with animals? Why when we are being formed from which ever bacteria you chose we are formed in male and female?

What kind of chance made us humans? With our eyes, legs, brain, heart, liver, or are they a wonderful construction of a supernatural being?

You are also an atheist but you are ignorant of this fact. There is a very good chance your doctrine is wrong and Budha is the real God. Then you would be considered an atheist and guess who would be deemed stupid? You

It seems to me that no meaningful distinction exists between getting the God wrong but believing in something and getting the God wrong but not believing in anything.

If you understand while you dismiss other people's God, then you would understand why atheists dismiss yours.

onetrack:
Don't conflate knowledge of the big bang with atheism. We don't understand everything about the big bang, but that doesn't mean that god did it. We thought the same thing about diseases 200 years ago.

Also I don't think that the human body is that well-constructed. We have plenty of flaws. We are simply the work of ongoing evolution.

Cosmological evolution is quite different from biological evolution i.e. how our universe was formed and how we evolved are two completely different areas. When people talk about biological evolution; it's quite important to be very precise or to define what you are referring to.

For example, by biological evolution are you referring to Darwinism i.e. life evolved from simple forms like an amoeba to complex forms say a human being? Is that what you are referring to?

sufido123:


You are also an atheist but you are ignorant of this fact. There is a very good chance your doctrine is wrong and Budha is the real God. Then you would be considered an atheist and guess who would be deemed stupid? You

It seems to me that no meaningful distinction exists between getting the God wrong but believing in something and getting the God wrong but not believing in anything.

If you understand while you dismiss other people's God, then you would understand why atheists dismiss yours.

If I am an atheists how come am arguing against atheists? Atheists are suppose to be smart and its funny that you are not and don't even know what atheists means yet you want to be one. Christians don't dismiss other gods as non existing... They simply say they are false gods just like the bible says... I don't know where you are getting your info from.

onetrack:


And yes, I would claim that the existence of life is due to chance. Our bodies don't adapt well to many situations. We are easy prey for many diseases and animals. We are just another part of the food chain.

Really - are you saying the birth of a child is due by chance? What has diseases and being prey to animals have to do with the origin and evolution of life?

onetrack:


And yes, I would claim that the existence of life is due to chance. Our bodies don't adapt well to many situations. We are easy prey for many diseases and animals. We are just another part of the food chain.

Atheists are suppose to be smart... You lack the attributes of an atheists!!!!

sufido123:


You are also an atheist but you are ignorant of this fact. There is a very good chance your doctrine is wrong and Budha is the real God. Then you would be considered an atheist and guess who would be deemed stupid? You

It seems to me that no meaningful distinction exists between getting the God wrong but believing in something and getting the God wrong but not believing in anything.

If you understand while you dismiss other people's God, then you would understand why atheists dismiss yours.

Atheism is a belief system as well is it not? Your belief is that there is no God. How is that different from religions who believe in the universe itself? Besides, Buddah wasn't and isn't a god.

benalvino1:
The atheist points out the principle of the conservation of energy: that energy can be neither created nor destroyed, but only change forms (it can equally be said that “matter can be neither created nor destroyed…”).

using the conservation of energy to argue against the beginning of the universe reveals confusion about cosmology to begin with. Scientists can extrapolate back to the beginning of the big bang–which is the moment when both space and time came into existence, along with all of the material world. So we know scientifically that there was a moment when there was no matter at all. It was created, not out of other matter, but out of nothing. Here is the key to note: it is once the universe came into existence that the laws of nature came into effect–before the universe, there was nothing.

Extrapolation is crude guesswork.

Just imagine it. Even taking the reckoning of scientists that they currently have the means to access only 4% of the matter they think exists, and they only have experience of a fraction of its behaviour for 1 millionth of its existence, the idea that they can use this to extrapolate back to its origin is laughable.

benalvino1:
So if we use the conservation of energy... how did the matter that causes the big bang come in to existence?

"No matter" became "matter and antimatter" according to the theory. Hence we can still have conservation.

benalvino1:
How come we as human beings are so well constructed along with animals? Why when we are being formed from which ever bacteria you chose we are formed in male and female?

BOYOINGGGG!!

OP goes off on a tangent.

benalvino1:


Conservation of energy is university level topic... Mainly in thermodynamics. Instead of you to address the problem you are saying am reason like a nursery school child.

No, ser clown. Conservation of energy isn't the childish bit. Follow closely; it's your farcical reasoning that is nursery school level.

I hope that's clear?

So, how old are you?

I thought "stupidity" was censored on nairaland.

slyfox5555:


Atheism is a belief system as well is it not? Your belief is that there is no God. How is that different from religions who believe in the universe itself? Besides, Buddah wasn't and isn't a god.

Atheism is not a belief system as you stated. It is a state of unbelief. You dismiss Budha as God but get upset when someone else dismisses your own God. There is no evidence there is any God period.

You may claim that you believe there is God but mere belief is not evidence. Furthermore, belief is not a choice. It is either day or night. You cannot choose to believe that it is daytime at night. You would be deemed insane if you do won't you?

The few rational thinkers that have responded to you are really kind people...and i join their tribe this minute. Your reasoning is pedestrian and childish. I believe you need more science education as oppossed to the myths & legends of religion. Cheers!

benalvino1:


If I am an atheists how come am arguing against atheists? Atheists are suppose to be smart and its funny that you are not and don't even know what atheists means yet you want to be one. Christians don't dismiss other gods as non existing... They simply say they are false gods just like the bible says... I don't know where you are getting your info from.

So let me understand your smart as*s: when you say other Gods are false Gods it does not mean that you are dismissive of those Gods? Give me a break!

With you being smart then I'd rather be in my dumb cocoon. Unfortunately for you as smart as you claim to be, you do not understand my logic. Again, you need to understand that there are at least 10 million Gods in existence today. The odds of you getting it right is from 0 to 1:10 million. No body has any evidence of God or knows the real God. For you it is a leap of faith.

So if it turns out that Zeus is the right God and you are a follower of Yahweh or his alter ego Allah, you would be heading to purgatory because you would be considered an atheist since you do not believe in God. Whatever religious dogma you have right now does not guarantee that at the end if the day, you won't be deemed an atheist.

I have never claimed to be smart. In fact, all I know is that I know nothing, therefore I am willing to learn. The problem with those of you that claim to know, is that you only know ignorant theories and stories formulated by ancient goat herders that does not make sense.

sufido123:


So let me understand your smart as*s: when you say other Gods are false Gods it does not mean that you are dismissive of those Gods? Give me a break!

With you being smart then I'd rather be in my dumb cocoon. Unfortunately for you as smart as you claim to be, you do not understand my logic. Again, you need to understand that there are at least 10 million Gods in existence today. The odds of you getting it right is from 0 to 1:10 million. No body has any evidence of God or knows the real God. For you it is a leap of faith.

So if it turns out that Zeus is the right God and you are a follower of Yahweh or his alter ego Allah, you would be heading to purgatory because you would be considered an atheist since you do not believe in God. Whatever religious dogma you have right now does not guarantee that at the end if the day, you won't be deemed an atheist.

I have never claimed to be smart. In fact, all I know is that I know nothing, therefore I am willing to learn. The problem with those of you that claim to know, is that you only know ignorant theories and stories formulated by ancient goat herders that does not make sense.

One you calling someone atheists that believes in God shows you lack serious intellect...
Two again Christians knows their God is real, Muslims knows their god is real... let the real one come and judge which is what Christians are waiting for...

Am glad you don't claim to be smart... atheist believe in big bang and base their beliefs of science which explain conservation of energy... the question you wont answer is how 2 matters come into existence from nothing?

Instead of you to answer the question you are telling me about 10million gods... what has that got to do with the question I originally asked?
Lets say I agree with you for a moment. God does not exist... now tell me how that atom take form?

Oduduwaboy:
The few rational thinkers that have responded to you are really kind people...and i join their tribe this minute. Your reasoning is pedestrian and childish. I believe you need more science education as oppossed to the myths & legends of religion. Cheers!

how did this address the fact that energy formed out of nothing?

sufido123:


Atheism is not a belief system as you stated. It is a state of unbelief. You dismiss Budha as God but get upset when someone else dismisses your own God. There is no evidence there is any God period.

You may claim that you believe there is God but mere belief is not evidence. Furthermore, belief is not a choice. It is either day or night. You cannot choose to believe that it is daytime at night. You would be deemed insane if you do won't you?

so what facts do you base the big bang from? what evidence?
what and how do we become humans from bacteria?
where are the evidence?
how did evolution got us here?...

benalvino1:


One you calling someone atheists that believes in God shows you lack serious intellect...
Two again Christians knows their God is real, Muslims knows their god is real... let the real one come and judge which is what Christians are waiting for...

Am glad you don't claim to be smart... atheist believe in big bang and base their beliefs of science which explain conservation of energy... the question you wont answer is how 2d matters come into existence from nothing?

Instead of you to answer the question you are telling me about 10million gods... what has that got to do with the question I originally asked?
Lets say I agree with you for a moment. God does not exist... now tell me how that atom take form?

See, you calling people names shows that you are a classless act. Your claim that both Muslim God and Christian God are real tells me that you are intellectually challenged despite your claim of intellectual superiority. Both Allah and Yahweh's method of worship are antithetical so you've confirmed my hypothesis. If Allah is the correct God, you are doomed because you don't believe in God and you would be an atheist.

You are not even a Christian by the standard set by your God:

James 1:26 (KJV) If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.

You tell me how your God was created since you don't believe that atom created itself. If we extend your logic either atom existed in a vacuum or God did and I would rather believe that a rational God cannot exist in vacuum and believe that atom created itself. And with all the atrocities your God committed and inspired in the bible who needs a devil.

You christians then created imaginary devil to validate your phantom God when in actual fact Yahweh is the devil killing children, women and innocent people including 1 million Africans in one fell swoop according to your Bible. Check your thread and see how many people you have abused for opposing your views.

When I see someone as abusive as you are, off the bat, I know the person has nothing to offer but insults. I will not respond to any more of your insults.

lolz, atheists are very good at stylishly dodging questions that are against their beliefs.

Why is that atheists on nairaland can only argue against the "christian God"? They runaway from any argument that counters their beliefs in evolution and the big bang theory.

Why are atheists obsessed with the "christian God"?

sufido123:


See, you calling people names shows that you are a classless act. Your claim that both Muslim God and Christian God are real tells me that you are intellectually challenged despite your claim of intellectual superiority. Both Allah and Yahweh's method of worship are antithetical so you've confirmed my hypothesis. If Allah is the correct God, you are doomed because you don't believe in God and you would be an atheist.

You are not even a Christian by the standard set by your God:

James 1:26 (KJV) If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.

You tell me how your God was created since you don't believe that atom created itself. If we extend your logic either atom existed in a vacuum or God did and I would rather believe that a rational God cannot exist in vacuum and believe that atom created itself. And with all the atrocities your God committed and inspired in the bible who needs a devil.

You christians then created imaginary devil to validate your phantom God when in actual fact Yahweh is the devil killing children, women and innocent people including 1 million Africans in one fell swoop according to your Bible. Check your thread and see how many people you have abused for opposing your views.

When I see someone as abusive as you are, off the bat, I know the person has nothing to offer but insults. I will not respond to any more of your insults.

am calling people names? where? you and lies...

dude I claim there is God yes I don't or I can't prove it!
I don't care who is the correct god

the question is there and answer it, show me proof of big bang
show me proof of evolution
stop diverting

that is not the issue here... we from time says our belief is based on faith so I don't have to tell you anything...

you said yours is based of scientific facts so you tell me.

I have used conservation of energy I haven't even entered Newton laws of motion...
if everything continues to remain at rest... what force that is applied to the atom that made them move and collide?

michaelwestern:
lolz, atheists are very good at stylishly dodging questions that are against their beliefs.

Why is that atheists on nairaland can only argue against the "christian God"? They runaway from any argument that counters their beliefs in evolution and the big bang theory.

Why are atheists obsessed with the "christian God"?

case is I have faith which is religion
they have fact science
I don't have to proof anything
but instead of them to answer the question they are cursing and asking me to proof