soye3:
Acts 2:6-11. did u also read op that each one in that room HEARD what the disciples said and even mentioned the tongues they were speaking in specifically? Now, to show that everyone there understood what they were saying, they made 2 things clearer when they recognised them as being GALILEANS but were speaking what everyone UNDERSTOOD in his/ her own language because they stated what they heard as being ' the magnificent things of God. This simply means that the tongues being reffered to here is simply LANGUAGES and not things only ONE person CLAIMS to understand.

1cor 14:5-13. If you can read further down you will notice that this same place you quoted clearly states that whoever speaks in 'a tongue' should interprete. verse 9 says you are speaking to the air if no one understands what you are saying. verse 10says there are many kinds of speech or tongues in the world and yet NO ONE is without meaning. how many of those who speak in tongues today interprete or give meaning to what they are saying. they rather make their followers believe that they are interacting with God.

in verse 18, he made it clear that he spoke in more tongues than the others. were these qorda abstract words. he said further that its supposed to be for the building up of the members of the congregation who have not become believers. so the words would be clear to them. please, jow many people do you build up when people DO NOT even know what you are doing?

soye3:
well i do not think we are quarelling. i am stating facts, after having paid attention to YOUR details. 1Cor14:5 you must interprete what you are saying to the congregation if you really understand yourself or else :15 says do it in your mind. is this in your bible. if you insist on shouting out the abstract, then interprete.

1Cor14:27,28 says there should be an interpreter or else u should keep silent and speak to urself and to God. so if you think you have the spirit of speaking in tongues which is clearly languages and d congregation camnot be upbuilt by it because you do not have an interpreter and cannot forge out an interpretation, then speak to urself and let God be the ULTIMATE JUDGE.


what is the REAL PURPOSE of speaking in tongues/ languages. do not forget that the bible says if everyone in the congregation speaks in tongues that its useless, except it is to upbuild those who are not believers. how many unbelievers understand ur language wen u speak it?

:15 says do it in your mind.

what is the REAL PURPOSE of speaking in tongues/ languages. do not forget that the bible says if everyone in the congregation speaks in tongues that its useless, except it is to upbuild those who are not believers

sportsmaster:

I would have preferred if this was a 1 on 1 conversation..I cannot totally express all that i want to by typing..
If there is still anything unclear..just kindly ask..
Let me know the things You disagree with so that we can look at it together..its is platform for learning..Sorry i sounded rude the other time@SOYE3

sportsmaster:

u still dont understand the 1cor14..lemme do a breakdown for U.
From 1cor1-4..Paul laid a foundation/premise abt tongues speaking and interpretation..from verse 5-40 is abt conduct in the church..if u read 1cor14:40."let everything be done decently and in order"...
1cor14:5-means when u speak with tongues in the church i.e lets say u are addressing the church and you are speaking with tongues,that would not edify the church,it is only when u interprete that the church will receive edification....

where does 1cor14vs15 says do it in your mind..1Cor14:15-"what is it then?I will pray with the spirit,and i will pray with the understanding(the understanding in this context means interpretation)"
1cor14:27-28 never said there must be an interpreter,it says "IF there be no interpreter"...notice the word "IF"
..
The bible never said that if the whole church speaks in tongues its useless.
1cor14:22--Tongues are for a SIGN(not edification)to them that believe-not(unbelievers)..tongues are signs for unbelievers.
1cor14:23-24..i want u to read that personally..and pay attention to details every single word matters....
1cor 12:7-"the manifestation of the spirit is given to every man"..this simply means every man can FUNCTION IN/MANIFEST all the gifts of the spirit...
Every christian can function in all the gifts of the spirit..
Anybody (christians) that can speak with tongues and cannot interprete yet needs a sound teaching abt tongues and interpretation,he/shde needs to be taught...
SELAH

Joagbaje:


Beautiful response. There's difference between praying in tongues to God to edify oneself and "speaking in tongues for the hearing of brethren especially in prophecy . One is talking to God , the other is talking to people . That's the foundation that many people are missing

soye3:
its just so crystal clear in the scriptures. there should be no speaking in tongues if NO ONE ELSE understands what you are saying because the words from the mouth of the person doing that are just empty and meaningless and the man doing that KNOWS it.

The scriptures say when they were filled with the spirit, they spoke in tongues . Languages understood by everyone there and that resulted in a very serious decision- they were moved to be baptised. if they didnt understand, how could they have made such a weighty decision?

Besides, the disciples didnt need anyone to TEACH THEM how to speak in tongues or how to interprete.

That should make each and every christian think - What moves the speaking in tongues in people today?

do they REALLY know the meaning of what they are saying or are just short of words?

why does speaking in tongues need to be learnt?

vooks:
And it is rather clear that whether praying/speaking, if the others don't understand it, you should keep quiet
1 Corinthians 14:16 New King James Version (NKJV)
16 Otherwise, if you bless with the spirit, how will he who occupies the place of the uninformed say “Amen” at your giving of thanks, since he does not understand what you say?
1 Corinthians 14:1 6Amplified Bible (AMP)
16 Otherwise, if you bless and render thanks with [your] spirit [[a]thoroughly aroused by the Holy Spirit], how can anyone in the position of an outsider or he who is not gifted with [interpreting of unknown] tongues, say the Amen to your thanksgiving, since he does not know what you are saying?

This is the MOST ignored bit by the Pentecostals and they move heavens defending their ignorance instead of submitting to the counsel of the Spirit

Joagbaje:


That is only applicable when you're speaking in tongues for others to hear for . For example you're praying for me or on my behalf I need to hear what you're saying . It's a prayer of agreement . It's a corporate thing. But when you're talking to God as an individual , there's no need for interpretation. You're edifying yourself . Each person can talk to God alone. So the rule is: if you want to pray for us or pray on our behalf ,carry us in understating . Or pray to God alone without us.

1 Corinthians 14:28
But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

So he is allowed to edify himself and talk to God in tongues without interpretation. Hope you get the point . When we all pray in tongues . We are praying individually . But If one person must pray on our behalf he must speak what we can agree with

vooks:
1 Corinthians 14:27 King James Version (KJV)
27 If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret.

Pastor,
Please note the immediate preceding verse. It talks of SPEAKING which you insist is different from PRAYING in tongues. But in verse 28 you have just quoted, the tongue speaker minus interpreter is asked to zip it and to speak to himself and God. Now,speaking to God would mean praying.

This establishes a few things;
1. SPEAKING and PRAYING in tongues is an artificial distinction that's not warranted by the scriptures as they are used interchangeably here
2. Whatever (speaking/praying) has no interpretation should be kept private as it is of no benefit to nobody in the congregation.

Later Paul says;
1 Cor 14:23 (KJV) If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?

It don't appear logical that Paul approves public praying in tongues without interpretation yet censures speaking in tongues publicly minus interpretation. Here is why; an unbeliever/unlearned in a congregation of uninterpreted tongues, praying/speaking would think you are mad. They would not make no distinction. They would think you are mad because whatever you are vocalizing is gibberish. Unless you mean, they would be excited that you are praying in unintelligible language but put off if you were praying instead of speaking.

Joagbaje:


I've explained this severally on this forum. There are different used of "tongues " it's either in prayer or giving a message . The part you quoted is not about individual prayer but prophesying in tongues . If you give messages to a sinner in tongue, thats madness ! But when you give him message fom God in his understanding he is edified.

1 Corinthians 14:24-25 (KJV Strong's)
But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all: And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest; and so falling down on his face he will worship God, and report that God is in you of a truth.

Note he didn't say "praying in tongues" but speaking

soye3:
the truth, staring us right there in the face and we keep turning its interpretation to suit us? no need really. some things in the bible are just so crystal but no, we ignore and continue headlong. that to me is not humility to the inspired word of God and not constructive.
I sincerely believe this issue has been thoroughly thrashed, if not before, then now, once and for all.

soye3:
the truth, staring us right there in the face and we keep turning its interpretation to suit us? no need really. some things in the bible are just so crystal but no, we ignore and continue headlong. that to me is not humility to the inspired word of God and not constructive.
I sincerely believe this issue has been thoroughly thrashed, if not before, then now, once and for all.

soye3:
the truth, staring us right there in the face and we keep turning its interpretation to suit us? no need really. some things in the bible are just so crystal but no, we ignore and continue headlong. that to me is not humility to the inspired word of God and not constructive.
I sincerely believe this issue has been thoroughly thrashed, if not before, then now, once and for all.

soye3:
Lest I forget, CURSED be the day i decide to remove and replace meanings of the inspired utterances.

ENJOY the circles because that's what this is. Dancing in Circles, saying the same things and changing them all over.
NO USE REALLY.

sportsmaster:
.

You dont pay attention to details.
Mark16:16-17...
1cor14:2..he that speaketh in tongue speaks nt unto men bt unto God..(is this in ur bible?)
1cor14:4-"he that speaks in tongue edifies himself,he that prophesies edifies the church(is this in ur bible?)"
1cor14:26.."when we are gathered together,every one has a psalm,doctrine,tongue,revelation,intepretation"
1cor14:39-"wherefore brethen,covet to prophesy and FORBID NOT TO SPEAK WITH TONGUES".
SELAH

Joagbaje:
Final note .
There's difference between the gift of diversity of tongues and praying in tongues . One is for people hearing the other is between you and God . Not every christian has the gift of diversity of tongues but every christian ought to be able to pray in tongues

Speaking in tongues is used in different ways . In preaching in prophecy and in prayer to God . Speaking in tongues is used generally or interchangeably but if we study in context it's easy to know what aspect is being addressed in a passage

sportsmaster:
lemme address something u Got totally off point@SOYE3..
Acts 2:5-12...
The pentecost is a Jewish custome whereby all the Jew scattered abroad would meet together in one place..if U read abt Isreal history u will see that as of that time..the jews were scattered abroad..but on the day of pentecost..they were gathered in the same place..when they all spoke with tongues..surely there must have been an interpretation for them to have understood every man in thier own dialect.. because Paul wrote in 1cor14:2-"he who speaks in tongues speaks not unto men but to God,FOR NO MAN UNDERSTANDS HIM,"...
So if there was no interpretation of tongues on the day of pentecost,there is no way anyone could have understood all that they were saying..
SELAH

vooks:
You are so wrong
Supposing you receive the gift of tongues and you start praying in Chinese, Mandarin. A Chinese next to you would understand you perfectly not because they have a supernatural gift of interpretation but because you are praying in their language.

Interpretation of tongues is necessary only when NOBODY in the congregation understands whatever is being said. This is quite possible seeing we have over 3500 know human languages and may be a 1000 or more that have gone extinct. If you spoke in the language of angels, something Paul alludes to its possibility,then no man under the earth would understand you. Here, you would need the gift of interpretation.

On Pentecost, the devout diasporas Jews understood the tongues not supernaturally but because the gift flowed in their languages.

It is important to understand that TONGUES mean LANGUAGES. The gift simply enables you to utter words in a language you have never learnt. So technically, an Englishman can't receive the gift of tongues where he speaks in English. Your mind does not understand because you have never learnt the language.