patches689:


You dont even have the decency to wait for me to post my findings on this forum?

My sincere apologies. I had no idea you had already began posting them in the photo thread.

By all means continue. I got the Info from this thread.

http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/leo1s-russian-military-news-pictures-thread.243988/page-101

Henry120:
The kurganets IFV is my favourite. It looks like a more modernised Puma IFV.

How can you modernize what is allready a modern IFV?

It looks like a Puma because the Puma inspired the Russians.

Just like how the Boomerang looks like it was inspired by the VCBI

And, no doubt, chinese bloggers will accuse the Russians of copying their Type 99 hull (without the wheel arches) while the Polish will accuse them of stealing the turret concept from their PL-01 (i suspect the Armatas turret is unmanned)

Everyone is copying everyone these days, whether intentionally or not.

Henry120:


My sincere apologies. I had no idea you had already began posting them in the photo thread.

By all means continue. I got the Info from this thread.

http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/leo1s-russian-military-news-pictures-thread.243988/page-101

No matter

It seems we both have access to the same images. Seems fair that each of us got to post it first on one of the two forums

agaugust:


Does America have 2,000 F-35 jets in service to replace F-16 and F-15 ? You smoke rat poison Monday morning?

The F-35 will replace them.

agaugust:

Show us 14 Gripens in the air .

Show us 8 F-7 in the air.

patches689:


How can you modernize what is allready a modern IFV?

It looks like a Puma because the Puma inspired the Russians.

Just like how the Boomerang looks like it was inspired by the VCBI

And, no doubt, chinese bloggers will accuse the Russians of copying their Type 99 hull (without the wheel arches) while the Polish will accuse them of stealing the turret concept from their PL-01 (i suspect the Armatas turret is unmanned)

Everyone is copying everyone these days, whether intentionally or not.

- whatever you mean by this your comment. Very absurd. It looks like a modern, more advanced and up-graded Puma.

- the boomerang looks very western, same as the T-14 and Kurganets.

Haven now actually compared, the Boomerang looks a lot like the VBCI.

- LOL, "have the chinese now replaced Russians in Russia?". The Russians in their defence would, ours have 7 wheels, while yours is 6.

The T-14's hull is very similar to that of the type-99


- The T-14 has a 32 round auto-loader. F**k the poles, the PL01 is still concept, not actually real. So that really can't lay claims to it.

- Everybody is copying everybody these days, and it is very intentional.

MikeCZAR:
I read the turret is unmanned.

I hope the capsule the crews fight in can withstand blasts.

Western spies are probably working over hours to figure its armour

- it is.

- there's been a lot of talk about that armoured capsule. I just hope it turns out to be as good as it's been touted.

Henry120:


- whatever you mean by this your comment. Very absurd. It looks like a modern, more advanced and up-graded Puma.

- the boomerang looks very western, same as the T-14 and Kurganets.

Haven now actually compared, the Boomerang looks a lot like the VBCI.

- LOL, "have the chinese now replaced Russians in Russia?". The Russians in their defence would, ours have 7 wheels, while yours is 6.

The T-14's hull is very similar to that of the type-99


- The T-14 has a 32 round auto-loader. F**k the poles, the PL01 is still concept, not actually real. So that really can't lay claims to it.

- Everybody is copying everybody these days, and it is very intentional.

Actually, the concept of the PL turret is pretty unique in that it allows the use of an autoloader as well as a ready-round container in a very small turret, normally if you have an autoloader you have a huge turret if you store ready-rounds in the turret (leclerc)... its why the T-72 stores its rounds in a carousal.

Puma is as advanced as it gets, Kurganets is just a BMP-T with a troop compartment. Difference will be in armor, the Russians have gone big in the armor of their IFV... allmost Namer big. But again, we have to wait to see more concrete information on all of them.

TBH, the only one that interests me is the Boomerang, as that is the only one that would ever be applicable to an African military.

MikeCZAR:
Show us 8 F-7 in the air.

Why? The 11 F-7 operational status was never in doubt and never in storage.....unlike the Gripen with half fleet frozen grounded

jln115:


You have yet to show us a source that NAF has more than 3 F-7s operational, I on the other hand have provided a source that SAAF has 14 Gripens operational at any given time, so yes its common sens

14 Gripens with 9 pilots.....18 crew....9 pilots 9 navigators.

F-7 jets were NEVER in storage or short of pilots anytime. Common sense.

So no need to look for all 11 F-7 jets flying in the air at the same time. Common sense.

patches689:


What Gripens are in storage?

Show us more than 3 F7 in the air.

Show us 26 Gripens in the air !

I see you admit that fake story of F-7 jets in storage or having shortage of pilots is another South African fabricated idea

None of you guys has ever found a source to prove that comedian claim that you pulled out of your b.ums

CASE CLOSED !

[size=13pt]

patches689:


Are you saying that source is an official SAAF website?

jln115:


Dude, nobody said its peddling false information, in fact I quite like that site

Nice, you AGREE the site is CORRECT ....NO MOKOPA ever ordered....not in service.

Thanks for your surrender, we love it !
.[/size]

jln115:

Ok so lets get this clear... you agree we have 14 Gripen pilots?

Nope, you have 18 crew for 14 Gripens.....9 pilots 9 navigators
.

patches689:


F-35 orders are constantly growing. Its never been "hanging in the balance".

It currently is...

"Some international partners the United States had counted on to buy the fighter are reconsidering their participation in the project, citing high costs. It’s time to cancel, or at the very least drastically scale down, the F-35 project and shift the funds to deal with the strategic realities America faces."

http://nationalinterest.org/feature/americas-f-35-coming-crash-landing-11332

Henry120:
If the fight between Floyd "money" Mayweather and Manny "Pacman" paciqauo is the Fight the world has been waiting for......... the Russian Armata class vehicle is the class of vehicles the world has been waiting for.


The Russians have finally unveiled their new range of armoured vehicles built on the brand new Armata chassis. By all means, the Russians did not dissapoint.

1) T-14 Tank

2) Armata Heavy IFV

3) Kurganets IFV

4) Boomerang APC

Wow.....Do you have enough info on the specx of these monsters to determine if the US has anything in like class or better sir?

patches689:


Actually, the concept of the PL turret is pretty unique in that it allows the use of an autoloader as well as a ready-round container in a very small turret, normally if you have an autoloader you have a huge turret if you store ready-rounds in the turret (leclerc)... its why the T-72 stores its rounds in a carousal.

Puma is as advanced as it gets, Kurganets is just a BMP-T with a troop compartment. Difference will be in armor, the Russians have gone big in the armor of their IFV... allmost Namer big. But again, we have to wait to see more concrete information on all of them.

TBH, the only one that interests me is the Boomerang, as that is the only one that would ever be applicable to an African military.

They've gone bigger than Namer!! I mean, look at the size of that thing

I already see commercial success written all over the T-14, Kurganets and boomerang in Africa.

T-14

Lots of units would be snapped up by Egypt to most likely replace their older Abrams Tanks in front-line service.

Algeria would also procure them in huge numbers in at-least a 13- 15 years. The Algerians only just ordered 200+ more T-90 tanks.

Angola, in my opinion would be the first African export customer for the T-14 Tank in Africa. They seem poised for it.

Uganda, would probably be the 4th customer of the T-14 in Africa.

In 5th, the Russians would be betting big on a stable Libya. A stable Libya presents a massive opportunity for T-14 sales in Africa.


Kurganets

This heavy APC holds a lot of promise for sales in Africa. I expect the usual suspects to feature nicely with the Algerians leading the pack. Algeria sure as day light would purchase the Kurganets in good reasonable numbers. They would most likely be Africa's first user.

Morocco/ Egypt are tied for number 2. The morrocans would purchase them in good numbers to deal with the insurgency in the south of their country and in response to possible Algerian T-14s( Morocco would get an American Tank).

Egypt surely would get them also.

Angola would the Africa's 4th recipient.

* A stable Libya would be 5th.


Boomerang

The Boomerang would see massive commercial success around the world, and Africa would definitely not be left out. Some countries on the continent would buy in huge numbers, others in "1 or 2s". However it would be widely used.

Most Africans would prefer a 30mm turret.

A stable Libya would be the first country to import the boomerang into military service.

In second would be Algeria, as expected. The Algerians would import large numbers to complement it's Fauch APC's or gradually faze out it's fauch in military service.

In 3rd place, would most likely be Nigeria. Nigeria has a good history of using Soviet BTR's, so I expect that relationship would continue with the Boomerang APC.

In 4th place, Angola. Angola with it's strong communist ties, would continue it's relationship with the Russians in a Boomerang, as long as Oil prices stay stable. So it's either the boomerang or the kurganets for the Angolans if oil prices are low.

5th Place, Uganda.




This in my opinion, is how the Armata and boomerang would do in Africa.

fydence:
Wow.....Do you have enough info on the specx of these monsters to determine if the US has anything in like class or better sir?

Nothing extensive at the moment on any of them.


However, what is currently known about the T-14, it out-classes what the U.S currently has in service. It completely and utterly has no equal in the U.S military.

The T-14 Heavy IFV also has no match in U.S military service. Again it out-matches anything the U.S can throw at it.



The U.S had their "ground combat infantry fighting vehicle program", however it seems the program has been cancelled.

The German puma used to be the world's best IFV, until the Kurganets showed up. Now, there is a new kid on the block. The Americans did not even have the world's 4th best IFV, so absolutely no competition in the round.


The Boomerang is an everyday 8x8. It more like the French VBCI, but I suspect it's more heavily armoured. The Americans have similar systems already in service. The mowag they call the Stryker is one example.

agaugust:


Why? The 11 F-7 operational status was never in doubt and never in storage.....unlike the Gripen with half fleet frozen grounded





14 Gripens with 9 pilots.....18 crew....9 pilots 9 navigators.

F-7 jets were NEVER in storage or short of pilots anytime. Common sense.

So no need to look for all 11 F-7 jets flying in the air at the same time. Common sense.



Show us 26 Gripens in the air !

I see you admit that fake story of F-7 jets in storage or having shortage of pilots is another South African fabricated idea

None of you guys has ever found a source to prove that comedian claim that you pulled out of your b.ums

CASE CLOSED !

Gripen fleet was never grounded or frozen

14 Gripen are operational - meaning a minumum of 14 pilots

Nigerian airforce is world renowned for having most of its aircraft grounded through lack of maintenance and funds. Show us more than 3 F7 in the air

agaugust:
[size=13pt]



Nice, you AGREE the site is CORRECT ....NO MOKOPA ever ordered....not in service.

Thanks for your surrender, we love it !
.[/size]

Are you saying that is the official SAAF website?

Pictoral evidence proves SAAF has them

agaugust:


Nope, you have 18 crew for 14 Gripens.....9 pilots 9 navigators
.

Says who?

agaugust:


It currently is...

"Some international partners the United States had counted on to buy the fighter are reconsidering their participation in the project, citing high costs. It’s time to cancel, or at the very least drastically scale down, the F-35 project and shift the funds to deal with the strategic realities America faces."

http://nationalinterest.org/feature/americas-f-35-coming-crash-landing-11332

Unknown artical from unknown source providing nothing but opinion

Meanwhile, in reality,

South Korea to sign deal this month to buy 40 F-35 jets for $7 billion
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/24/us-southkorea-airforce-orders-idUSKCN0HJ0P620140924

Britain orders more F-35s as part of biggest-ever defence project
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/industry/defence/11193756/Britain-orders-more-F-35s-as-part-of-biggest-ever-defence-project.html

Australia’s new Liberal Party government has announced that they’ll buy up to 58 F-35s, raising the RAAF’s approved fleet size to the 72 aircraft mentioned in the Labor Party’s May 2013 White Paper
http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/australia-raises-their-f-35-commitment-023629/

And that excludes the multitude of other buyers.

F35 has been golden since day one... a project that has 3000 planned orders before it even gets in the air is a safe bet.

Henry120:


They've gone bigger than Namer!! I mean, look at the size of that thing

I already see commercial success written all over the T-14, Kurganets and boomerang in Africa.

T-14

Lots of units would be snapped up by Egypt to most likely replace their older Abrams Tanks in front-line service.

Algeria would also procure them in huge numbers in at-least a 13- 15 years. The Algerians only just ordered 200+ more T-90 tanks.

Angola, in my opinion would be the first African export customer for the T-14 Tank in Africa. They seem poised for it.

Uganda, would probably be the 4th customer of the T-14 in Africa.

In 5th, the Russians would be betting big on a stable Libya. A stable Libya presents a massive opportunity for T-14 sales in Africa.


Kurganets

This heavy APC holds a lot of promise for sales in Africa. I expect the usual suspects to feature nicely with the Algerians leading the pack. Algeria sure as day light would purchase the Kurganets in good reasonable numbers. They would most likely be Africa's first user.

Morocco/ Egypt are tied for number 2. The morrocans would purchase them in good numbers to deal with the insurgency in the south of their country and in response to possible Algerian T-14s( Morocco would get an American Tank).

Egypt surely would get them also.

Angola would the Africa's 4th recipient.

* A stable Libya would be 5th.


Boomerang

The Boomerang would see massive commercial success around the world, and Africa would definitely not be left out. Some countries on the continent would buy in huge numbers, others in "1 or 2s". However it would be widely used.

Most Africans would prefer a 30mm turret.

A stable Libya would be the first country to import the boomerang into military service.

In second would be Algeria, as expected. The Algerians would import large numbers to complement it's Fauch APC's or gradually faze out it's fauch in military service.

In 3rd place, would most likely be Nigeria. Nigeria has a good history of using Soviet BTR's, so I expect that relationship would continue with the Boomerang APC.

In 4th place, Angola. Angola with it's strong communist ties, would continue it's relationship with the Russians in a Boomerang, as long as Oil prices stay stable. So it's either the boomerang or the kurganets for the Angolans if oil prices are low.

5th Place, Uganda.




This in my opinion, is how the Armata and boomerang would do in Africa.

Heavy tracked IFV's have no place in Africa.

Remeber what a certain mercenary said about African countries being too focused on cloning European ones?

T-14 is will only be of limited use in the African battle-space... same with the Kurganets

When I said what I said, I wasnt thinking about sales, I was thinking about usefulness.

Henry120:


Nothing extensive at the moment on any of them.


However, what is currently known about the T-14, it out-classes what the U.S currently has in service. It completely and utterly has no equal in the U.S military.

The T-14 Heavy IFV also has no match in U.S military service. Again it out-matches anything the U.S can throw at it.



The U.S had their "ground combat infantry fighting vehicle program", however it seems the program has been cancelled.

The German puma used to be the world's best IFV, until the Kurganets showed up. Now, there is a new kid on the block. The Americans did not even have the world's 4th best IFV, so absolutely no competition in the round.


The Boomerang is an everyday 8x8. It more like the French VBCI, but I suspect it's more heavily armoured. The Americans have similar systems already in service. The mowag they call the Stryker is one example.

Where are you getting this nonsense from?

There are no known details or specifications for these vehicles for you to base this opinion on.

Just FYI... enthusiasts have allready pointed out that the Armata is roughly 40% bigger than a T-90... and that the Russians dont have some magical new engine to power that behemoth... its going to be slow and awkward

patches689:


Where are you getting this nonsense from?

There are no known details or specifications for these vehicles for you to base this opinion on.

Just FYI... enthusiasts have allready pointed out that the Armata is roughly 40% bigger than a T-90... and that the Russians dont have some magical new engine to power that behemoth... its going to be slow and awkward

Of-course, the Armata is bigger than the T-90. Says who......... did they know what was been built until it aspects were eventually released?

Snippets of the T-14 have always been released un-officially. Hence we know the T-14 has an auto-loader, crew capsule, has anti-ATGM missiles, can be used to shot down Helicopters, etc etc

patches689:


Heavy tracked IFV's have no place in Africa.

Remeber what a certain mercenary said about African countries being too focused on cloning European ones?

T-14 is will only be of limited use in the African battle-space... same with the Kurganets

When I said what I said, I wasnt thinking about sales, I was thinking about usefulness.

Terrains differ from country to country. I made my submission based on countries who would most like field them in active duty.

I also said the boomerang would be widely used across the continent, as expected.

Henry120:


Of-course, the Armata is bigger than the T-90. Says who......... did they know what was been built until it aspects were eventually released?

Snippets of the T-14 have always been released un-officially. Hence we know the T-14 has an auto-loader, crew capsule, has anti-ATGM missiles, can be used to shot down Helicopters, etc etc

They have seen pictures and footage from the parade preparations for weeks now.

Auto-loader is old news, been around since the 1970's.

Crew-capsule is nothing special.

Anti-ATGM is not impressive, every major country has a system that is in the porcess of being introduced, hell even South Africa has a system. Whether or not the Russian system is actually operational is the question

K2 Black Panther, Type 10 can do the same.

Fact is, there is not enough info on the tanks to make any such claims yet.

As it stands, the title for best tank in the world is shared by the K2 Black Panther, Leo2 Revolution and Chally 2

Henry120:


Terrains differ from country to country. I made my submission based on countries who would most like field them in active duty.

I also said the boomerang would be widely used across the continent, as expected.

Problem is, the Russians are going to be focusing so hard on their own production that orders are going to be very hard to get.

The T-14 is going to replace 2,225 T-72s, 1,400 T80s... so for a long time allmost all production cabailities the russians have will be dedicated to the feilding of significant numbers of the T-14.

Same with the Kurgnets - it will have to replace 2509 BMP-1 and BMP-2.

While the Boomerang, the most promising in terms of how well it can sell, has the biggest production, and wheeled APC's are where the Russians have their most obsolete equipment and they are the systems that see the most use - 2 725 units.

agaugust:


Nope, you have 18 crew for 14 Gripens.....9 pilots 9 navigators
.

So are the other 5 Gripens flying themselves?

agaugust:
[size=13pt]



Nice, you AGREE the site is CORRECT ....NO MOKOPA ever ordered....not in service.

Thanks for your surrender, we love it !
.[/size]

Why don't you quote the rest of my post village idi0t, specifically the part were I said the site is outdated!

agaugust:
[size=13pt]



Nice, you AGREE the site is CORRECT ....NO MOKOPA ever ordered....not in service.

Thanks for your surrender, we love it !
.[/size]

Unofficial SAAF website owned by Mr somebody we don't know. Chief, Mokopa is developed by a company owned by SANDF and in extension, South African government.

Go and read defence act to understand that all the denel weapons are owned by SANDF.

agaugust:


Why? The 11 F-7 operational status was never in doubt and never in storage.....unlike the Gripen with half fleet frozen grounded





14 Gripens with 9 pilots.....18 crew....9 pilots 9 navigators.

F-7 jets were NEVER in storage or short of pilots anytime. Common sense.

So no need to look for all 11 F-7 jets flying in the air at the same time. Common sense.



Show us 26 Gripens in the air !

I see you admit that fake story of F-7 jets in storage or having shortage of pilots is another South African fabricated idea

None of you guys has ever found a source to prove that comedian claim that you pulled out of your b.ums

CASE CLOSED !

So your saying we have 5 Gripen UAVs? Seeing that we have only 9 pilots for 14 operational Gripens:

And again I have not seen a photo or a source of more than 3 F-7 pilots, thus until proven otherwise, NAF only has 3 F-7 pilos.

CASE CLOSED!

Rooivalk gunship
http://www.aircraft.co.za/Encyclopedia/D/459.php

More links for the russia mbt,IFV & APC unveiling ...
1; http://rt.com/news/255445-armata-russian-tank-unveiled/ 2; http://rt.com/news/251641-armata-first-tank-photo/ 3;www.deagel.com/news/Russian-Ministry-of-Defense-Unveils-Armata-Boomerang-and-Kurganets-Armored-Vehicles_n000013894.aspx. 4;www.janes.com/article/50896/new-russian-heavy-armour-breaks-cover 5 http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armata_Universal_Combat_Platform.

agaugust:


Why? The 11 F-7 operational status was never in doubt and never in storage.....unlike the Gripen with half fleet frozen grounded





14 Gripens with 9 pilots.....18 crew....9 pilots 9 navigators.

F-7 jets were NEVER in storage or short of pilots anytime. Common sense.

So no need to look for all 11 F-7 jets flying in the air at the same time. Common sense.



Show us 26 Gripens in the air !

I see you admit that fake story of F-7 jets in storage or having shortage of pilots is another South African fabricated idea

None of you guys has ever found a source to prove that comedian claim that you pulled out of your b.ums

CASE CLOSED !

Show us 7 F-7s in the air Augubugubu!