patches689:


[size=20pt]YOUR SOURCE SAYS NOTHING ABOUT HARPOON MISSILES!!!

LIAR!![/size]

[size=20pt]

Operator: Egypt

Number: 4

Cost: First two for 920 Euro Acquired: Approved in November 2011 and first expected to be delivered in 2016.

Country of origin: Germany Manufacturer: Howaldtswerke-Deutsche -

Armament: 8 x 21 inch torpedo tubes Missiles UGM-84 Harpoon SSM Torpedos 14 x Tigerfish torpedoes

http://militaryedge.org/armaments/type-209/

Now you are the big time serial liar !
.[/size]

Patchesagain:


The 20mm guns on the Drakensburg are manually operated.

This is fact, end of story.

Fact? How? Just because Patches says so? No ! Citation needed now !
.

FighterPilot:


You are late because SA will be building her own four stealth OPVs in the near future.

Maybe year 2050
.

agaugust:


[size=20pt]

Operator: Egypt Status:

On Order Number: 4 Names:

Cost: First two for 920 Euro Acquired: Approved in November 2011 and first expected to be delivered in 2016.

Country of origin: Germany Manufacturer: Howaldtswerke-Deutsche -

Armament: 8 x 21 inch torpedo tubes Missiles UGM-84 Harpoon SSM Torpedos 14 x Tigerfish torpedoes

http://militaryedge.org/armaments/type-209/

Now you are the big time serial liar !
.[/size]

No I am not

Your last citation said nothing about Harpoons

Post proper sources and we wont have to waste post after post

Anyway:

Status - On order
http://militaryedge.org/armaments/type-209/

And your source is some unknown trash site. Give us reputable citations.

Until delivered, SAN has the best Subs in Africa (So good that Egypt ordered the class of submarine that was developed for SAN)

Game over

FighterPilot:

Unfortunately you haven't done project management to understand that there are short and long term project in any organisation. Project Biro same as other long term projects in SAN only started as envisioned dream and now everything is starting to materials with companies already about to start the project. The project will be win-win project since it will as well boast the economy in the country.

SA is not in a hurry with the project, yet the project is becoming a reality. It is better that matter how long it takes we are finally heading somewhere and we will once more built our own ships.
Better late than never.
http://www.issafrica.org/iss-today/can-project-biro-help-africa-to-overcome-its-maritime-security-challenges

By the time you start building your {imaginary} IPVs and OPVs,we will be constructing destroyers and assembling an aircraft carrier.

agaugust:


[size=20pt]

Operator: Egypt Status:

On Order Number: 4 Names:

Cost: First two for 920 Euro Acquired: Approved in November 2011 and first expected to be delivered in 2016.

Country of origin: Germany Manufacturer: Howaldtswerke-Deutsche -

Armament: 8 x 21 inch torpedo tubes Missiles UGM-84 Harpoon SSM Torpedos 14 x Tigerfish torpedoes

http://militaryedge.org/armaments/type-209/

Now you are the big time serial liar !
.[/size]

On order!!!

agaugust:


Fact? How? Just because Patches says so? No ! Citation needed now !
.

Look at the name of the weapon: "20mm Oerlikon"

Look at the caption of the picture: "A Gunner operating a 20mm Oerlikon"
http://www.navy.mil.za/SANCareers/weapons_operator.htm

Look at the armament of the Drakensburg "4× Oerlikon 20 mm cannon"

Unless you are saying that ALL 20mm Oerlikon in service with the SAN are actually CIWS... which is fine by me

EVarn:
By the time you start building your {imaginary} IPVs and OPVs,we will be constructing destroyers and assembling an aircraft carrier.

you are going to be building destroyers and an aircraft carrier by 2020?

Wow

EVarn:
By the time you start building your {imaginary} IPVs and OPVs,we will be constructing destroyers and assembling an aircraft carrier.

Yes China will come and build them for you in 2050. China does not have money anymore to give loans for charity. They offered you loans to build you your first OPVs and I don't think they will ever offer you any loans anytime soon.

Meanwhile, our project of building our proudly made in SA OPVs is just on the door step to kick start. The shipyard is currently only busy renovating and extending their stores to be well equiped before the major project begins.


http://www.warshipsifr.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=147:china-boosts-its-global-reach-via-naval-diplomacy&catid=36:commentary&Itemid=65

Just a reminder about the allegations made by Nigerians about SAN fleet readyness:

There have been reports critical of the SAN’s operational readiness levels.

Of course, there is no way that all its vessels can be fully operational at the same time – naval vessels, like aircraft, have complex mainte-nance schedules involving a variety of different levels of maintenance. And crews need training – a vessel undertaking training duties is not operationally deployable.

In the past readiness, was, if anything, worse. In the 1970s, the SAN had, on paper, a fleet of three submarines, two destroyers, four frigates and three ocean patrol ships (comprising two obsolete frigates and one obsolete ocean minesweeper).

In reality, there were never more than two submarines, one destroyer and three frigates in service (and often there were only two frigates operational). Of the nine strike craft that formed the backbone of the surface force in the 1980s, 1990s and early 2000s, no more than six were ever in service at the same time.

Worldwide, an operational level of 50% – that is, half of the fleet is at sea or can put to sea for operational missions in a matter of days – is regarded as good for navies. Many navies do not achieve this level. Very, very few indeed exceed it. “

The SA Navy currently has two frigates available for operational contingencies,” he reports. “One frigate is deployed as part of the anti-piracy patrols in the Mozambique Channel whilst the other is scheduled to undertake an extensive west coast patrol with visits and exercises scheduled off Namibia, Angola, Nigeria and Senegal (where it will participate in the Sea Power for Africa Symposium [November 5 to 8, 2013]). A third frigate is available for training in Simon’s Town whilst the fourth is undergoing maintenance and repair. The SAS Amatola is due to conduct a refit which should commence early in the new year. The current frigate availability rate is as per the SA Navy ‘business plan’ and exceeds the international norm for operational availability.” As for the submarines, one is undergoing a major refit which will last until the middle of next year.

It is our preference that if you wish to share this article with others you should please use the following link:

http://www.engineeringnews.co.za/article/south-african-navy-mulls-future-requirements-as-fleet-remains-active-2013-10-04-1

Patchesagain:


No I am not

Your last citation said nothing about Harpoons

Post proper sources and we wont have to waste post after post

Anyway:

Status - On order
http://militaryedge.org/armaments/type-209/

Until delivered, SAN has the best Subs in Africa

(So good that Egypt ordered the class of submarine that was developed for SAN)

Game over

I quoted the dates and costs with the contract summary and that confirmed the Harpoon missiles from my first post, you denied it. You are a liar.

Did you post a proper source to show SAS Drakensberg 20mm cannon is only manually operated?

For the bolded parts, you lie again :

1. Today, best Submarine in Africa is year 2010 version Algerian Kilo Class 636M

2. Type 209 was NOT developed for SAN, they were developed for Germany and have existed since world war II, mumu !

http://www.militaryfactory.com/ships/detail.asp?ship_id=Type-209
.

Patchesagain:
Just a reminder about the allegations made by Nigerians about SAN fleet readyness:

There have been reports critical of the SAN’s operational readiness levels.

Of course, there is no way that all its vessels can be fully operational at the same time – naval vessels, like aircraft, have complex mainte-nance schedules involving a variety of different levels of maintenance. And crews need training – a vessel undertaking training duties is not operationally deployable.

In the past readiness, was, if anything, worse. In the 1970s, the SAN had, on paper, a fleet of three submarines, two destroyers, four frigates and three ocean patrol ships (comprising two obsolete frigates and one obsolete ocean minesweeper).

In reality, there were never more than two submarines, one destroyer and three frigates in service (and often there were only two frigates operational). Of the nine strike craft that formed the backbone of the surface force in the 1980s, 1990s and early 2000s, no more than six were ever in service at the same time.

Worldwide, an operational level of 50% – that is, half of the fleet is at sea or can put to sea for operational missions in a matter of days – is regarded as good for navies. Many navies do not achieve this level. Very, very few indeed exceed it. “

The SA Navy currently has two frigates available for operational contingencies,” he reports. “One frigate is deployed as part of the anti-piracy patrols in the Mozambique Channel whilst the other is scheduled to undertake an extensive west coast patrol with visits and exercises scheduled off Namibia, Angola, Nigeria and Senegal (where it will participate in the Sea Power for Africa Symposium [November 5 to 8, 2013]). A third frigate is available for training in Simon’s Town whilst the fourth is undergoing maintenance and repair. The SAS Amatola is due to conduct a refit which should commence early in the new year. The current frigate availability rate is as per the SA Navy ‘business plan’ and exceeds the international norm for operational availability.” As for the submarines, one is undergoing a major refit which will last until the middle of next year.

It is our preference that if you wish to share this article with others you should please use the following link:

http://www.engineeringnews.co.za/article/south-african-navy-mulls-future-requirements-as-fleet-remains-active-2013-10-04-1

[size=20]You killed them, I think we should now organise for their burial.[/size]

Patchesagain:
Just a reminder about the allegations made by Nigerians about SAN fleet readyness:

There have been reports critical of the SAN’s operational readiness levels.

Of course, there is no way that all its vessels can be fully operational at the same time – naval vessels, like aircraft, have complex mainte-nance schedules involving a variety of different levels of maintenance. And crews need training – a vessel undertaking training duties is not operationally deployable.

In the past readiness, was, if anything, worse. In the 1970s, the SAN had, on paper, a fleet of three submarines, two destroyers, four frigates and three ocean patrol ships (comprising two obsolete frigates and one obsolete ocean minesweeper).

In reality, there were never more than two submarines, one destroyer and three frigates in service (and often there were only two frigates operational). Of the nine strike craft that formed the backbone of the surface force in the 1980s, 1990s and early 2000s, no more than six were ever in service at the same time.

Worldwide, an operational level of 50% – that is, half of the fleet is at sea or can put to sea for operational missions in a matter of days – is regarded as good for navies. Many navies do not achieve this level. Very, very few indeed exceed it. “

The SA Navy currently has two frigates available for operational contingencies,” he reports. “One frigate is deployed as part of the anti-piracy patrols in the Mozambique Channel whilst the other is scheduled to undertake an extensive west coast patrol with visits and exercises scheduled off Namibia, Angola, Nigeria and Senegal (where it will participate in the Sea Power for Africa Symposium [November 5 to 8, 2013]). A third frigate is available for training in Simon’s Town whilst the fourth is undergoing maintenance and repair. The SAS Amatola is due to conduct a refit which should commence early in the new year. The current frigate availability rate is as per the SA Navy ‘business plan’ and exceeds the international norm for operational availability.” As for the submarines, one is undergoing a major refit which will last until the middle of next year.

It is our preference that if you wish to share this article with others you should please use the following link:

http://www.engineeringnews.co.za/article/south-african-navy-mulls-future-requirements-as-fleet-remains-active-2013-10-04-1

[size=16pt]Out-dated report year 2013.

Today year 2015, South Africa has ONLY 1 Frigate, 1 Submarine operational

The others are non-functional
.[/size]

agaugust:


I quoted the dates and costs with the contract summary and that confirmed the Harpoon missiles from my first post, you denied it. You are a liar.

Did you post a proper source to show SAS Drakensberg 20mm cannon is only manually operated?

For the bolded parts, you lie again :

1. Today, best Submarine in Africa is year 2010 version Algerian Kilo Class 636M

2. Type 209 was NOT developed for SAN, they were developed for Germany and have existed since world war II, mumu !

http://www.militaryfactory.com/ships/detail.asp?ship_id=Type-209
.

1. Citation needed for kilo class

2. I have posted the links many times, this is the last:

The Egyptian Government has signed an agreement with Germany for the procurement of two Howaldtswerke-Deutche Werft (HDW)-built SSK Manthatisi-class Type-209 submarines aimed at boosting its naval fleet capability, Egypt's Naval commander Osama Ahmed el-Gendy has announced.
http://www.naval-technology.com/news/newsgermany-deliver-two-type-209-submarines-egypt


SSK Manthatisi Class (Type 209/1400) Attack Submarine, South Africa
http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/sskmanthatisi/

The Type 209 family is divided into classes according to tonnage and capabilities. Manthatisi is the most modern of the biggest of the classes (at 1400 tonnes)

So, we can see:

- Egypt is ordering the Manthatisi-Class Type 209
- The Manthatisi-Class is named after the SAS Manthatisi and is a sub-class of the Type 209/1400

FighterPilot:



[size=16]You killed them, I think we should now organise for their burial.[/size]

[size=20pt]He posted a 2013 old report in 2015....out-dated wrong information. LOL.

He actually k.illed h.imself in suicide mode.

LOL[/size]

agaugust:


[size=16pt]Out-dated report year 2013.
Today year 2015, South Africa has ONLY 1 Frigate, 1 Submarine operational
The others are non-functional .[/size]

Give us any earlier news than that.

agaugust:



[size=16pt]Out-dated report year 2013.

Today year 2015, South Africa has ONLY 1 Frigate, 1 Submarine operational

The others are non-functional
.[/size]

Augustus

That 2013 report explains the operational model in which the SAN operates its frigates.

Currently 2 frigates are operational as well as 2 submarines.

The 3rd frigate is used for training, the 3rd sub and 4th frigate are in refit.

Fact, fact, fact.

agaugust:


[size=20pt]He posted a 2013 old report in 2015....out-dated wrong information. LOL.

He actually k.illed h.imself in suicide mode.

LOL[/size]

Shut up and give us any earlier news than that.

agaugust:


Quote where I said that. I said: "What if the plan is to build hull and tow it to Nigeria for completion? "

Now quote where I said F92 WILL be towed.

Did you fail English grammar in school? Englishman failed English language. LOL
.

"agaugust:


First, you need to show us the interior of the ship to proof your fairy tale that the ship is ready to sail. LOL.

You need to prove that all the control room is fully built and prove that the ship is sailing on it's own NOT TUGGED by another ship to Nigeria, prove it, since you are the captain of the F92 ship, and you are in charge of the imaginary control room fully built by you. LOL.

Show us the control room built and ready. LOL....I dare you to show us."

agaugust:


[size=20pt]He posted a 2013 old report in 2015....out-dated wrong information. LOL.

He actually k.illed h.imself in suicide mode.

LOL[/size]

You illiterate

You are unable to comprehend the most basic of sources

The source explains the designed usage of our fleet - a usage that the fleet has maintained.

The only times it failed to do so was when 2 subs were in dry-dock (after the crash) and most recently when the Amatola was undergoing sea-trials post refit and was thus not considered operationally ready.

Dude, I am starting to lose interest in this thread. This is becoming pointless.

Patchesagain:


So, we can see:

- Egypt is ordering the Manthatisi-Class Type 209
- The Manthatisi-Class is named after the SAS Manthatisi and is a sub-class of the Type 209/1400

Nope, Egypt is not buying your old type of submarine, they are buying the latest technology version of Type 209. South Africa got technology of 10 years ago, Egypt is advancing to year 2016 technology of new Type 209.

So you tell lies again, serial liar !

On 31 August 2012, the Egyptian Navy commander General Osama Ahmed stated that a contract has been signed with the German side to build two type 209 submarines for the Egyptian Navy including the latest technology this type has reached. The first vessel is scheduled to be delivered in 2016. Egypt is planning to exercise an option of the contract for another two type 209 submarines"


http://dmilt.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=9220:egypt-mod-intends-to-procurer-two-more-type-209-subs&catid=36:africa&Itemid=55
.

Patchesagain:


1. Citation needed for kilo class

1. Citation needed to prove your claim that South Africa has the best submarine in Africa, you made the claim first with no proof.

So prove it, compare your submarine with that of others and back it up with citations
.

agaugust:


Nope, Egypt is not buying your old type of submarine, they are buying the latest technology version of Type 209. South Africa got technology of 10 years ago, Egypt is advancing to year 2016 technology of new Type 209.

So you tell lies again, serial liar !

On 31 August 2012, the Egyptian Navy commander General Osama Ahmed stated that a contract has been signed with the German side to build two type 209 submarines for the Egyptian Navy including the latest technology this type has reached. The first vessel is scheduled to be delivered in 2016. Egypt is planning to exercise an option of the contract for another two type 209 submarines"


http://dmilt.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=9220:egypt-mod-intends-to-procurer-two-more-type-209-subs&catid=36:africa&Itemid=55
.

The Egyptian Government has signed an agreement with Germany for the procurement of two Howaldtswerke-Deutche Werft (HDW)-built SSK Manthatisi-class Type-209 submarines aimed at boosting its naval fleet capability, Egypt's Naval commander Osama Ahmed el-Gendy has announced.
http://www.naval-technology.com/news/newsgermany-deliver-two-type-209-submarines-egypt

The Manthatisi-class is the latest of the Type 209/1400 classes you chucklefuck

Get that into your goddamn head.

Patchesagain:
you are going to be building destroyers and an aircraft carrier by 2020?
Wow

I thought you once claimed that OPVs are for weak and small navies,Now when it comes to 'Project Biro',OPVs have suddenly become vessels of national prestige?.
You are going to build OPVs by 2018?
rather unbelievable.

EVarn:
I thought you once claimed that OPVs are for weak and small navies,Now when it comes to 'Project Biro',OPVs have suddenly become vessels of national prestige?.
You are going to build OPVs by 2018?
rather unbelievable.

OPV's are indeed just that

But we allready have frigates and submarines

Now we can focus on smaller support vessels

Patchesagain:


Look at the name of the weapon: "20mm Oerlikon"

Look at the caption of the picture: "A Gunner operating a 20mm Oerlikon"
http://www.navy.mil.za/SANCareers/weapons_operator.htm

Look at the armament of the Drakensburg "4× Oerlikon 20 mm cannon"

Unless you are saying that ALL 20mm Oerlikon in service with the SAN are actually CIWS... which is fine by me

Radar controls the 20mm cannon on Shaldag gunboat, does that make it a CIWS ?

Now your source DOES NOT say the gunner is on Drakensberg, I need proof of 20mm gun specs for SAS Drakensberg, prove to us that it is only manually controlled.....or you just made claims with ZERO proof ?

#Trapped
.

Patchesagain:


Augustus

That 2013 report explains the operational model in which the SAN operates its frigates.

Currently 2 frigates are operational as well as 2 submarines.

The 3rd frigate is used for training, the 3rd sub and 4th frigate are in refit.

Fact, fact, fact.

2015 citation needed
.

agaugust:



Radar controls the 20mm cannon on Shaldag gunboat, does that make it a CIWS ?

Now your source DOES NOT say the gunner is on Drakensberg, I need proof of 20mm gun specs for SAS Drakensberg, prove to us that it is only manually controlled.....or you just made claims with ZERO proof ?

#Trapped
.

Augustus

The 20mm on the Shaldag is listed as being the Typhoon Weapon System

The 20mm on the Drakensburg are listed as just 20mm Oerlekon

I am not wasting anymore time with this.

We all know that they are manually operated, I have shown you pictures as well.

If you want to argue for the sake of arguing, go ahead. I am not going to waste my time with pointless arguments.

agaugust:


2015 citation needed
.

No it isnt.

SAN is operating just as it always has.

If you wish to suggest that SAN operating guidlelines have changed - then you have to post a citation.

FighterPilot:

Yes China will come and build them for you in 2050. China does not have money anymore to give loans for charity. They offered you loans to build you your first OPVs and I don't think they will ever offer you any loans anytime soon.
Meanwhile, our project of building our proudly made in SA OPVs is just on the door step to kick start. The shipyard is currently only busy renovating and extending their stores to be well equiped before the major project begins.
http://www.warshipsifr.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=147:china-boosts-its-global-reach-via-naval-diplomacy&catid=36:commentary&Itemid=65

The idea that China is building all our vessels for us is an utterly ridiculous fallacy.Why,I can clearly remember that China is scrambling to acquire more vessels to safeguard its hold on the South-China sea and silk trade route,tell me,how can a country in such a dire need,leave its own problems to serve the interests of another country?.

EVarn:
The idea that China is building all our vessels for us is an utterly ridiculous fallacy.Why,I can clearly remember that China is scrambling to acquire more vessels to safeguard its hold on the South-China sea and silk trade route,tell me,how can a country in such a dire need,leave its own problems to serve the interests of another country?.

China is hardly "Scrambling" to build that class of vessel

They are "scrambling" to build destroyers and design a new cruiser, not sh1tty little gun-boats

EVarn:
I thought you once claimed that OPVs are for weak and small navies,Now when it comes to 'Project Biro',OPVs have suddenly become vessels of national prestige?.
You are going to build OPVs by 2018?
rather unbelievable.

The Southies envy Nigerian OPVs, imagine, our OPVs can sail around Africa without refueling, but expensive Frigates of Soweto CANNOT try it !
.