Angolan's SU-30 is not a threat to SA



http://www.africandefence.net/angolas-su-30ks-are-not-a-serious-threat-to-the-south-african-air-force/

mzilakazi:
Angolan's SU-30 is not a threat to SA



http://www.africandefence.net/angolas-su-30ks-are-not-a-serious-threat-to-the-south-african-air-force/

Your SA military experts at home in Pretoria say you are wrong


"A brief assessment points out the Gripen is faster but has less firepower while the Su-30K is more powerful and can carry more weapons. The Sukhoi also has better weapons systems while South Africa’s Gripens are hamstrung in this department by budgetary constraints (at present they are only fitted with visual range IRIS-T air-to-air missiles for aerial combat)."

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=39861

SAAF is dead like Mandela is dead

agaugust:


Southern Angola is closer to SA than Nigeria.

Angola is equal distance between Nigeria and South Africa.

The SADC defense pact is between South Africa and Angola, so SANDF Navy should have been patrolling and controlling all SADC oceans with your blue water navy so called....your navy is only good in photography, they cannot catch pirates, not even one pirate in 5 years
.

Northern Angola is close to Nigeria. And that's where the ship was attacked.

How many pirate attacks have been reported in the Gulf of Guinea this year?


SA navy has a huge area to patrol all the way to the country's Prince Edward islands.

agaugust:


Prove it.

Show us flight endurance hours of SAAF Hawks and Gripens for a 9,000 km round trip non-stop
.

Proven.

Next!

agaugust:

Nigeria has 55 jets.

Which aren't that capable.

agaugust:

Yes, you cannot fly 9,000 km with 1,000 km fuel

with aerial refuelling you can!

overhypedsteve:
must you throw insults at him. How does that make you better civilised. Have you never being a party to a civilised debate?

Lately there has been a massive pouring in of people whom have nothing military related to contribute to this thread.

lezz:
That's another way of saying NO

Uhm....No

jln115:

Uhm....No

The affirmation of a fact is complete negation/denial of the postulation in question.

lezz:
The affirmation of a fact is complete negation/denial of the postulation in question.

Wrong again!

SAAF Gripen vs Su-30 theoretical air to air battle:


the lack of a BVR missile is temporary and can be rectified quickly if the need were there by acquiring MBDA Meteors and giving the SAAF pilots needed refresher training

So, let’s walk through a possible scenario in which four SAAF Gripens have to come up against four Angolan Su-30Ks for some reason. Let’s assume equal starting altitudes, a hostile situation allowing a first-shoot ROE and equivalent closing distance. We’ll also assume no ground radars, though those would play a factor in a real situation.

The first thing the SAAF would do is send a single Gripen D up near its service ceiling behind the lines, with its radar on full power and the picture being data-linked to the four Gripen Cs in the advance flight. The SAAF Gripens might fly in a wide formation of two each, providing good separation for their EW sensors and the ability to initiate a pincer movement if necessary. The SAAF pilots will constantly adjust positioning to ensure that they’re not outpacing the Gripen D in the AEW role and moving outside its protective radar umbrella.

Angola’s Su-30Ks carry the relatively old NIIP N001 Myech radar, which features an older conventional mechanically-steered cassegrain antenna and few of the electronic niceties that came in later variants. As a result of its age and widespread use, the radar has been quite well-studied and its capabilities are known. For one, it can detect a 1 m² – 3 m² target at between 80 km – 100 km depending on flight profile and when at full power. The Gripen C has a frontal ideal RCS of 0.1 m², going higher depending on angle, so let’s call it 0.5 m² to be fair and to account for marketing exaggerations. Simplifying things a lot, that would drop the Su-30K detection range down to 40 km – 50 km at best and the tracking range down to somewhere around 15 km – 20 km.

Note too that the Swedes have been developing and customising the Gripen’s systems to handle new-generation Sukhois and MiGs from the start, as a result of which there is serious capability in the onboard EW systems and radar.

The Gripen’s PS-05/A, on the other hand, which in this scenario is up at 50 000ft, is said to be able to acquire a Su-30K-sized aircraft at 120km and track it for a firing solution not much later. And the moment the Su-30Ks appear on that radar, the information is immediately sent to the four Gripen Cs flying ahead allowing them to use it to launch Meteor or Marlin missiles. As they’d be about 60 km away from the Flankers and out of detection range and don’t turn on their radars the entire time they won’t be seen until missile release.

In other words, given current capabilities plus the acquisition of a BVR missile, the Su-30K pilots would get missile launch warnings before they could see a single one of the launch aircraft. They’d be able to detect the Gripen D in the AEW role, but it would be too far away to do anything about and the Meteor has a good probability of kill for a long-range missile. Splash four Flankers.

This is without the PS-05/A Mk4 and Mk5 upgrades, which double detection and acquisition range. It also ignores the use of the Gripen EW system to jam the N001, which it’s quite effective at as the N001 does not have spectacular peak transmitting power.


The Su-30K also has some performance advantages over the Gripen in a close-in dogfight, but those too are mitigated by the Gripen’s carriage of the IRIS-T or A-Darter high off-boresight missiles and Cobra HMDS which allow pilots to fire missiles at targets in any direction, including directly behind their aircraft.

In sum, this acquisition is not the threat it initially appears to be. Nor do the Angolans intend it to be that, as they seem to want to use their Su-30Ks the same way they’ve used their Su-27s, for their ability to cover vast distances and mount long-range airstrikes in Angola. No doubt they find this discussion bemusing.

http://www.africandefence.net/angolas-su-30ks-are-not-a-serious-threat-to-the-south-african-air-force/

lol,nothing like nairaland to give you pre-bedtime amusement. black jesus!,foreign affairs section has gone to hell.

agaugust:


Your SA military experts at home in Pretoria say you are wrong


"A brief assessment points out the Gripen is faster but has less firepower while the Su-30K is more powerful and can carry more weapons. The Sukhoi also has better weapons systems while South Africa’s Gripens are hamstrung in this department by budgetary constraints (at present they are only fitted with visual range IRIS-T air-to-air missiles for aerial combat)."

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=39861

SAAF is dead like Mandela is dead

If they are dead

Then your airforce is dead and buried

Angolans can reach you too

jln115:
In other words, given current capabilities plus the acquisition of a BVR missile, the Su-30K pilots would get missile launch warnings before they could see a single one of the launch aircraft. They’d be able to detect the Gripen D in the AEW role, but it would be too far away to do anything about and the Meteor has a good probability of kill for a long-range missile. Splash four Flankers.

This is without the PS-05/A Mk4 and Mk5 upgrades, which double detection and acquisition range. It also ignores the use of the Gripen EW system to jam the N001, which it’s quite effective at as the N001 does not have spectacular peak transmitting power.


The Su-30K also has some performance advantages over the Gripen in a close-in dogfight, but those too are mitigated by the Gripen’s carriage of the IRIS-T or A-Darter high off-boresight missiles and Cobra HMDS which allow pilots to fire missiles at targets in any direction, including directly behind their aircraft.

In sum, this acquisition is not the threat it initially appears to be. Nor do the Angolans intend it to be that, as they seem to want to use their Su-30Ks the same way they’ve used their Su-27s, for their ability to cover vast distances and mount long-range airstrikes in Angola. No doubt they find this discussion bemusing.

http://www.africandefence.net/angolas-su-30ks-are-not-a-serious-threat-to-the-south-african-air-force/

bleeping awesome post

15/10 - you exeed all expectations

jln115:

Wrong again!

Wrong in what, exactly?

patches689:


If they are dead

Then your airforce is dead and buried

Angolans can reach you too

Lmao

SOUTH AFRICAN GRIPEN IN ACTION

SANDF

SANDF

agaugust:


Your SA military experts at home in Pretoria say you are wrong


"A brief assessment points out the Gripen is faster but has less firepower while the Su-30K is more powerful and can carry more weapons. The Sukhoi also has better weapons systems while South Africa’s Gripens are hamstrung in this department by budgetary constraints (at present they are only fitted with visual range IRIS-T air-to-air missiles for aerial combat)."

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=39861

SAAF is dead like Mandela is dead

DARREN IS EQUALLY AN EXPERT. HAVE YOU LOOKED ON THAT?

mzilakazi:



Anything Nigerian is Igbo to me. Bwahahaha....

RIDICULOUSLY SENSELESS....,,
just like saying,,

ANYTHING SOUTH AFRICAN IS WHITE TO ME....

jln115:
SAAF Gripen vs Su-30 theoretical air to air battle:


the lack of a BVR missile is temporary and can be rectified quickly if the need were there by acquiring MBDA Meteors and giving the SAAF pilots needed refresher training

So, let’s walk through a possible scenario in which four SAAF Gripens have to come up against four Angolan Su-30Ks for some reason. Let’s assume equal starting altitudes, a hostile situation allowing a first-shoot ROE and equivalent closing distance. We’ll also assume no ground radars, though those would play a factor in a real situation.

The first thing the SAAF would do is send a single Gripen D up near its service ceiling behind the lines, with its radar on full power and the picture being data-linked to the four Gripen Cs in the advance flight. The SAAF Gripens might fly in a wide formation of two each, providing good separation for their EW sensors and the ability to initiate a pincer movement if necessary. The SAAF pilots will constantly adjust positioning to ensure that they’re not outpacing the Gripen D in the AEW role and moving outside its protective radar umbrella.

have you seen the troll augubugubu's post on the site?

MikeCZAR:
have you seen the troll augubugubu's post on the site?

This was Darren Olivier's reply to him. I wonder what Darren would say for SAAF Gripens vs NAF F7's

ssaengine:


This was Darren Olivier's reply to him. I wonder what Darren would say for SAAF Gripens vs NAF F7's

Augubug is a clown

Trying to argue with actual analysts and researchers

What a joke

http://itweb.co.za/mobilesite/defenceweb/home/item_id-39901/

"The SA Air Force has, according to Gauteng Afrikaans daily Beeld, sent a pair each of Gripen and Hawk jets to Botswana for the exercise along with two Agusta A-109 light utility helicopters, an Oryx medium transport helicopter and a C-130BZ transport aircraft.

It appears South Africa's Gripen jets will be reconnaissance platforms providing information on scenarios developed specifically for Blue Okavango.

Blue Okavango is scheduled to take place between 11 and 31 July with the main portions between 20 and 25 July. Some 887 personnel are expected to be involved in the exercise."


Train as you fight...

ssaengine:
http://itweb.co.za/mobilesite/defenceweb/home/item_id-39901/

"The SA Air Force has, according to Gauteng Afrikaans daily Beeld, sent a pair each of Gripen and Hawk jets to Botswana for the exercise along with two Agusta A-109 light utility helicopters, an Oryx medium transport helicopter and a C-130BZ transport aircraft.

It appears South Africa's Gripen jets will be reconnaissance platforms providing information on scenarios developed specifically for Blue Okavango.

Blue Okavango is scheduled to take place between 11 and 31 July with the main portions between 20 and 25 July. Some 887 personnel are expected to be involved in the exercise."


Train as you fight...

SAAF doesn't have fuel?

Patchesagain:

Augubug is a clown
Trying to argue with actual analysts and researchers
What a joke

He'll be chewed in SA sites.

MikeCZAR:
have you seen the troll augubugubu's post on the site?

Hahah No not yet!! Will check now!!

ssaengine:


This was Darren Olivier's reply to him. I wonder what Darren would say for SAAF Gripens vs NAF F7's

Both NAF and SAAF have no BVR missiles, so what will he say? I just picked holes in his writing and he has admitted errors he made.

Patchesagain:


Augubug is a clown

Trying to argue with actual analysts and researchers

What a joke

Bwahahaha

I made all those researchers to eat their words and eat the humble pie !

See how Darren quickly agreed with me when I knocked out his first point about Angolan pilots skill level, if I did not challenge him, he was already deceiving people, now go back and see how people responded to my comment and agreed with me, Darren had no choice than to immediately withdraw his words and say he does not actually know Angola pilot's capability and he quickly added that yes he is aware of some very good Angolan jet pilots.....so he knwe, why did he not say say and give Angola credit until I forces him to do so ?

I also corrected him on A-Darter missile range of 19 km NOT 20 km, he agreed with me.....he was posting rubbish until I corrected him.

Well, he has met a Nigerian military researcher, and I am going to make him sweat like a new yam goat, I am going back to demol.ish all his other claims that have no single proof, he is a military speculator NOT a researcher, he has no facts and figures, he is writing personal opinion.

Also, I am going back to defence web to demolish there, I hope Helmod Heitman will be willing to talk to me.....Time to show Naija skills !
.

agaugust:


Both NAF and SAAF have no BVR missiles, so what will he say? I just picked holes in his writing and he has admitted errors he made.



Bwahahaha

I made all those researchers to eat their words and eat the humble pie !

See how Darren quickly agreed with me when I knocked out his first point about Angolan pilots skill level, if I did not challenge him, he was already deceiving people, now go back and see how people responded to my comment and agreed with me, Darren had no choice than to immediately withdraw his words and say he does not actually know Angola pilot's capability and he quickly added that yes he is aware of some very good Angolan jet pilots.....so he knwe, why did he not say say and give Angola credit until I forces him to do so ?

I also corrected him on A-Darter missile range of 19 km NOT 20 km, he agreed with me.....he was posting rubbish until I corrected him.

Well, he has met a Nigerian military researcher, and I am going to make him sweat like a new yam goat, I am going back to demol.ish all his other claims that have no single proof, he is a military speculator NOT a researcher, he has no facts and figures, he is writing personal opinion.

Also, I am going back to defence web to demolish there, I hope Helmod Heitman will be willing to talk to me.....Time to show Naija skills !
.

Please don't forget to tell him that SAAF Gripens (infact all Gripens) will fall out of the sky when performing basic combat maneuvers like you have claimed here. You know this, and he doesn't. Some extra ammunition for you to use against him.

#TeamAugustine