This is the question from a christian:

I have a question regarding marriage and the wives of Muhammad. Why is it that, if Islam only permits up to four wives, and even then does not encourage it, Muhammad took nine wives? Also, one of his wives was only seven years old when he married her, and nine when he consummated the marriage, according to your Web site. This seems to me akin to child molestation! Also, one of his children was not from one of his wives, but from one of his “right-hand possessions” to quote your own Web site. Why is a woman called a possession? Is this a concubine? Why did he have intercourse outside of wedlock? Weren’t nine women enough for him? Muhammad’s own lifestyle seems to contradict the very teachings Islam claims regarding marriage and women.

Answer follows:

Salam Amy,

Thank you for the ongoing dialogue with our page. We enjoy bouncing ideas back and forth with you, as it seems you’re researching Islam diligently.

Women are often brought into the picture when discussing Islam because their status—if not studied thoroughly and objectively—is severely misunderstood. Under those inaccurate assumptions, Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) is often accused of practicing and encouraging unjust treatment of women, while the truth is actually the opposite—as I hope you will see after reading this answer.

I’m encouraged by your thoughtful, questioning nature to attempt to crystallize the true picture of this great man. Let’s take an objective peek into his life, to examine whether or not Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) is that repelling womanizer. But first let’s go a little further back in history to look at the domestic lives of other prophets preceding Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) and what their Scriptures tell us about their stance towards the polygamy issue:

Other Prophets Practiced Polygamy

The fact that only Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) is accused of polygamy is rather surprising, since this is a privilege enjoyed by prophets before him. Their wives and concubines came in great numbers, too! The Torah, the Bible, and the Quran tell of some of them; the rest are not mentioned so we don’t know, but among the ones who were polygamous we can count Prophets Ibrahim (Abraham), Ya`qub (Jacob), Dawud (David), and Sulayman (Solomon). The Scriptures talk of polygamy as a “favor” bestowed upon them from the Lord.

First Kings 11:1-3 indicates that King Solomon had 700 hundred wives and 300 hundred concubines! In sealing treaties in ancient days, it was customary for a lesser king to give his daughter in marriage to the greater king. Every time a new treaty was sealed, Solomon ended up with yet another wife. These wives were considered “tokens of friendship” and “sealed” the relationship between the two kings. (Reasoning from the Scriptures on 1 Kings)

Scripture indicates that David also acquired wives and concubines, David’s blessings, including his wives, were given to him as a result of God’s favor (2 Sam. 5:12-13; 12:8; D & C 132:39). Scriptural records say that the Lord did command some of his ancient saints to practice plural marriage. Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob—among others (D & C 132)—conformed to this ennobling and exalting principle; the whole history of ancient Israel was one in which plurality of wives was a divinely accepted and approved order of matrimony. Those who entered this order at the Lord’s command, and who kept the laws and conditions appertaining to it, have gained for themselves eternal exaltation in the highest heaven of the celestial world. ( Mormon Doctrine of Plural Marriage p. 578)

Islam Didn’t Invent Polygamy but Only Regulated It—in Favor of Women!

From the above accounts, we can clearly see that Prophets—including Muhammad—were allowed to be more polygamous than their followers, not just for carnal reasons, but for political and religious reasons pertaining to their call. Consequently, it is groundless to wonder why Muslims can’t marry 12 wives like their prophet, just as it is groundless to wonder why Jews and Christians can’t marry 700 like theirs! Islam didn’t invent polygamy; Islam only made polygamy more humane, instituting equal rights for all wives. And even so, Muslim women are not forced to accept this and may put a condition against it in their marriage contract.



The Quran Is the Only Holy Book That Actually Says “Marry Only One”

Images of “sheikhs with harems” are not consistent with Islam, as, in fact, the general rule in Islam is monogamy not polygamy. the Quran says what means:

{Marry women of your choice, two, or three, or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then only one.} (An-Nisaa’ 3:3)

Polygamy in Islam is not recommended; it is only permitted under certain guidelines. Permission to practice polygamy is not associated with mere satisfaction of passion. It is, rather, associated with compassion toward widows and orphans.

Before the Quran was revealed, there was no upper limit for polygamy, and many men had more than four wives. Islam put an upper limit of four wives, permitting a man to marry more than once, only on the condition that he deal justly with all of them. Yet the same verse points out:
{Ye are never able to be fair and just as between women} (Al-Nisaa’ 3:129)

Therefore polygamy is not a rule but an exception.

Why Is the Exception of Polygamy Allowed in Islam?

The exception is made for many reasons, but let’s note only one here, addressing your concern that Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) “had intercourse outside of wedlock.”

In Western society, it is common for a man to have mistresses or multiple extra-marital affairs. Women in this case are degraded to mere sex objects with absolutely no rights; they’re usually on the losing end of such liaisons. The same society, however, cannot accept a man having more than one wife so that women can retain their lawful rights and lead an honorable, dignified, and respectable life.

If every adult American man married only one woman, there would still be more than 25 million women in the United States who would not be able to get husbands, at least considering that—according to latest statistics—10 percent of the American population is gay! That’s close to 30 million people!

Thus the only option for a woman who cannot find a husband is either to marry a married man or to become “public property.” Islam gives women the honorable position by permitting the first option and disallowing the second. At least one of the reasons Islam has permitted limited polygamy is to protect the modesty of women!


Islam’s Straightforward Approach in Problem Solving

In Islam, problems are supposed to be faced and solved—not ignored! So, rather than requiring hypocritical compliance, Islam provides legitimate and clean solutions to the problems of individuals and societies. There is no doubt that the second wife legally married and treated kindly is better off than a mistress without any legal rights. Through practical example, Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) as the guide of Muslims has set the applicable rules for this aspect of human relations in order not to leave anything for speculation.

Stages of the Prophet’s (peace and blessings be upon him) Married Life

First, let’s remember that Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) led a life supported only by the bare minimum of necessities. His wives were not idly wasting away the hours in a luxurious harem but led a life of labor and sacrifice, while he was mostly busy away from home overseeing his numerous duties as a Prophet. So, obviously, lust was not a factor, as he wasn’t even at home most of the time. Further, most of his marriages occurred at an age when lust is not a major factor in any man’s life:

1. He remained single until age 25.

2. From age 25 to 50 he was faithful to only one wife, Khadijah, who bore all his children except one. She was 15 years older than him, with children from two previous marriages. She was his greatest ally when he received the Call at age 40 until she died when he was 50 years old. He remained in love with her until he died and often talked of his life with her with great nostalgia.

3. Between ages 50 and 52 he remained unmarried and mourning his late beloved wife. He lived alone with his daughters.

4. Between ages 53 and 60 he married all his other wives for many noble reasons detailed below. It’s unimaginable for a man to suddenly turn lustful at this age, especially as he was constantly traveling, with bloodthirsty enemies on his heels.

5. At age 60, Allah revealed to him verse preventing him from marrying any more until he died, which was at age 63. The Quran says what means:

{It is not lawful for you (to marry other) women after this, nor to change them for other wives.} (Al-Ahzab 33:52)

Reasons for the Prophet’s Marriages

We can categorize all his marriages under two aspects of his personality:

- Muhammad the man who needed a loving wife, children, and a stable home, so he married Khadijah and remained with only her for 20 years until she died.

- Muhammad the Prophet who married the other wives for reasons pertaining to his duty to deliver the Message to the world. Those particular women were carefully selected, not just haphazardly “acquired” for carnal reasons, as suggested. Here are some of the reasons for which Muhammad married:

1. To pass on Islam to the next generations as a practical legacy
Prophet Muhammad is the only prophet without any privacy, and with a meticulously preserved tradition in speech and actions in all minute details of his public and private life. Preserved in the sharp minds of his wives and his Companions, those narrations comprise the “daily life manual” for Muslims to follow until the end of time. The fact that Islam was spread on the shoulders of women and preserved in their hearts is a great honor to the females of this Ummah. The books of authentic Hadith attribute more than 3,000 narrations and Prophetic traditions to his wives alone.

2. To cement the relations of the budding nation
In a tribal society, it was customary to seal treaties through marrying into tribes. Muhammad’s closest Companions later became the four caliphs who led Islam at the critical stage after his death. Two of them were the fathers of his wives `A’ishah (daughter of Abu Bakr) and Hafsa (daughter of `Umar); the other two married his daughters (`Uthman married Ruqayyah and Zaynab in succession, and `Ali married Fatimah).

3. To teach Muslims compassion with women
He taught them to be compassionate not just to the young and beautiful maidens, but more so to the weak and destitute widows, divorcees, orphans, and elderly women. Islam teaches that women are to be respected, protected, and cared for by their men folk. They’re not to be cast out to face a harsh life alone while able men around them just pity them and do nothing to help, or worse, use their weakness to take them as mistresses!

4. To offer a practical role model to Muslims until the end of time
Although many believing women often approached Muhammad offering him themselves in marriage, he politely turned down their offers. Most of his wives after the death of Khadijah were old, devoid of beauty, and previously married, except `A’ishah, who was the only young virgin. He married from other nations and religions; some were the daughters of his worst enemies, and his marriage to one woman won all her people into Islam. Regardless of his neutral feelings towards many of them, he was a model example of equal justice and kindness to them all, and he would never discriminate among them.

Who Were the Prophet’s Wives?

Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) married 12 wives in his life. When he died he had 9 wives. They have a very special status in the hearts of Muslims as the “Mothers of the Believers,” as the Quran instructs, and they are the source of a great amount of wisdom which they learned while living close to such a great man. Perhaps you’d like to research a bit to find their beautiful stories, so here are their names: Khadijah bint Khuwaylid, Sawdah bint Zam’ah, `A’ishah bint Abi Bakr, Hafsah bint `Umar ibn Al-Khattab, Zaynab bint Khuzaymah, Umm Salama, Zaynab bint Jahsh, Juwayriah bint Al-Harith, Umm Habibah, Safiyah bint Huyay ibn Akhtab, Maymunah bint Al-Harith, Maria the Copt.

Can We Consider His Marriage to `A’ishah a Case of Child Molestation?

To answer your speculation, let’s continue our objective trip into the past. Obviously, when traveling back in time 1400 years to examine a lifestyle we never witnessed, it is unfair to apply our present day standards, so let’s listen to the experts. Authentic historical records prove that the social traditions of the time and place—regardless of religion—considered Arab females as women as soon as their menstrual cycles began. The custom was to give daughters in marriage at that age. This was practiced by all dwellers in Arabia before Islam: pagans, disbelievers, Jews, and others. It’s a fact that female menstruation in hot climates starts much earlier than in cold climates, so females in Arabia matured as early as 8 or 9; they also aged earlier than other women.

It’s a neglected fact that before she was married to Muhammad, `A’ishah had been engaged to a disbeliever, Jubair ibn Mus’ab ibn Ady. Her fiancé broke the engagement on the basis of religious difference. So her father, Abu Bakr, agreed to give her hand in marriage to the Prophet.



The Great Wisdom in Selecting `A’ishah in Particular as a Young Wife

`A’ishah (may Allah be pleased with her) came from a house famous for learning and memorizing great quantities of knowledge; her father was a live encyclopedia of Arab tribal pedigrees and poetry. She inherited his ability, and in her young, intelligent, receptive mind, she preserved a precious portion of Islam she learned during seven years of marriage, for 47 years after the death of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) and she taught thousands of men worldwide their religion as she had learned it firsthand from the Prophet. To our present day, she is considered among the most prominent Islamic scholars, and she holds extremely high esteem in the hearts of all Muslims as such and as “the beloved of the Prophet,” who often mentioned her as the human he loved the most on the face of this earth. With her, he built a model Muslim home for Muslims to strive to imitate forever.

Was Maria the Copt a Slave, a Concubine, or a Wife of the Prophet?

Slavery already existed long before Islam. It was a system whereby a human captured in wars or kidnapped could be sold as a “possession.” That term applied to both sexes, not to women only. In some cultures slaves were considered subhuman and treated brutally. In Europe, for example, Romans threw Christian slaves to the lions while the public cheered; female slaves were thought to have no souls and were tortured mercilessly; slaves lived in degrading conditions; both sexes were forced to offer sexual favors to their masters; and as “possessions” they had no choice, no will, and no rights.

Islam recognized the human rights of slaves and encouraged Muslims to set slaves free. Islam prohibited adultery and homosexuality, and prevented forcing female slaves into sexual acts against their will. Islam encouraged educating them, setting them free, then legally marrying them and giving them their moral and financial rights. The reward for this—as mentioned in Prophetic Hadith—is eternal residence in Paradise.

Maria (may Allah be pleased with her) was not a concubine; she was a slave owned by Egypt’s Christian governor, who offered her and her sister Serine—among other presents—as a “gift of good will” to the Prophet in reply to his envoys inviting him to Islam. On her way from Egypt to Madinah, she was curious to learn about “her new master” and listened to his Companions talk about him. As a result, she became Muslim before meeting Muhammad. Scholars’ opinions vary of her status afterwards; here is the opinion I support:

One of the prominent Al-Azhar scholars, Sheikh Abdul Majid Subh, states:

“Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him), instead of taking concubines, entered into lawful marriages based on reason and wisdom. Maria the Copt was given to him as a present, but rather than taking her as a concubine, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) married her, thus elevating her status by marriage.”

Women’s Rights in Islam Surpass Modern Systems

If women in the Muslim World today don’t have their rights, it is not because Islam didn’t give them rights. Alien traditions have overshadowed the teachings of Islam, either through ignorance or the impact of colonialism. Most of the so-called modern reforms in the status of women appeared after the West abandoned religion for secularism. Those in the West who claim to follow the Judeo-Christian tradition really follow the values of Western liberalism.

In England and America less than fifty years ago, a woman could not buy a house or car without the co-signature of a male “guardian”! In Contrast, Islamic Law guaranteed rights to women over 1400 years ago that were unheard of in the West until the 1900s.

Numerous verses of the Quran state that men and women are equal in the site of Allah; the only thing that distinguishes people in His site is their level of God-consciousness.

Islam teaches that a woman is a full person under the law, and is the spiritual equal of a male. Women have the right to own property, to operate a business, and to receive equal pay for equal work. Women are allowed total control of their wealth. They cannot be married against their will, and they are allowed to keep their own name when married. They have the right to inherit property and to have their marriage dissolved in the case of neglect or mistreatment. Islam does not consider woman an “evil temptress,” and thus does not blame woman for Original Sin (a doctrine that Islam rejects). Women in Islam participate in all forms of worship that men participate in.

Prophet Muhammad’s mission stopped many of the horrible practices against women that were present in the society of his time. He actually harnessed the unrestricted polygamy of the Arabs of the time, and put many laws in place to protect the well-being of women. In his Farewell Sermon just weeks before his death, he summarized the teachings of Islam to the believers in a final farewell. His last words were “Be kind to women!”

Thank you and please keep in touch.

By Sahar El-Nadi

May Allah increase your knowledge.

jazakumulahu khaira

Very nice article.

You raised several points that I am compelled to respond to. The reason I am responding is because you didn't follow up with any Quranic reference or an authentic Hadith to backup your points. For example, you said:

If women in the Muslim World today don’t have their rights, it is not because Islam didn’t give them rights. Alien traditions have overshadowed the teachings of Islam, either through ignorance or the impact of colonialism. Most of the so-called modern reforms in the status of women appeared after the West abandoned religion for secularism. Those in the West who claim to follow the Judeo-Christian tradition really follow the values of Western liberalism

Western values and liberalism doesn't extend to countries under Sharia law i.e Saudi Arabia and Iran practices Sharia and Islam before America or Europe as we know it existed. The last time I checked, Sharia law is the governing law in these lands. As you know in Islam, a woman can't leave the house without the permission or her husband (if she has one), her father or her brothers. A woman testimony in Islam is worth less than that of a man by Islamic jurisprudence Surah 2:282. Even when it comes to inheritance, the Quran favors the male over the female (I may not know why it did so) but it certainly doesn't over the female the same equal terms it offers the male. So, to say otherwise is an exaggeration on your part.

In England and America less than fifty years ago, a woman could not buy a house or car without the co-signature of a male "guardian"! In Contrast, Islamic Law guaranteed rights to women over 1400 years ago that were unheard of in the West until the 1900s.

Women couldn't vote in these countries as well but they weren't because of religious reasons. That is why there is a separation of church and state in the West. The society evolves and decides that such privileges should be given to all people irrespective of their sex. That is what a pluralistic society is all about - it includes everyone. Islam has some work to do in this regard.

Numerous verses of the Quran state that men and women are equal in the site of Allah; the only thing that distinguishes people in His site is their level of God-consciousness

Equality before God and the law should be the same whether you are a man or a woman; that is what equality is all about. In Surah 2:228, the Quran teaches that men are above women. In Western Liberalism, men are not above women, men are equal to women in all aspects. The difference between individuals is their pursuit of happiness but they are the same under the law.

Islam teaches that a woman is a full person under the law, and is the spiritual equal of a male. Women have the right to own property, to operate a business, and to receive equal pay for equal work. Women are allowed total control of their wealth. They cannot be married against their will, and they are allowed to keep their own name when married. They have the right to inherit property and to have their marriage dissolved in the case of neglect or mistreatment. Islam does not consider woman an “evil temptress,” and thus does not blame woman for Original Sin (a doctrine that Islam rejects). Women in Islam participate in all forms of worship that men participate in.

I am not debating that women don't have "some" rights in Islam. The issue here is that women is Islam don't have the same rights accorded to men in Islam. The equality laws in Islam are dualistic and not pluralistic. You have one set of laws for men in certain instances and different set of laws for women.

Prophet Muhammad’s mission stopped many of the horrible practices against women that were present in the society of his time. He actually harnessed the unrestricted polygamy of the Arabs of the time, and put many laws in place to protect the well-being of women. In his Farewell Sermon just weeks before his death, he summarized the teachings of Islam to the believers in a final farewell. His last words were “Be kind to women!”

He did say women were unintelligent and lacking in knowledge

Bukhari (6:301)

. Her are the words of Aisha:

Muslim (4:1039) - "A'isha said [to Muhammad]: 'You have made us equal to the dogs and the asses'" These are the words of Muhammad's favorite wife, complaining of the role assigned to women under Islam

There is a lot I can say but I will leave it here for now. I think Islam has contributed some positive values women play under Islamic law but there are ugly history that we have running through the pages of the Quran and Hadith. Over-looking them or playing pretend doesn't help the dialog

As-salamu alaykum

alexis:
Very nice article.

You raised several points that I am compelled to respond to. The reason I am responding is because you didn't follow up with any Quranic reference or an authentic Hadith to backup your points. For example, you said:

Actually I don't want to answer you because of the fact that you are only trying to taint and blackmail Islam and by that you result only in looking for any blackmailing sites to copy from.
But you did not know that this affects you negatively as follows:
You spread lies and woe on to the liars and their helpers
You will only increase in hatred against your fellow human being unlawfully
You will always be a seconded because you will not even bother to research the truth just copy and paste
May Allah guide you to the right path!

alexis:
Western values and liberalism doesn't extend to countries under Sharia law i.e Saudi Arabia and Iran practices Sharia and Islam before America or Europe as we know it existed. The last time I checked, Sharia law is the governing law in these lands. As you know in Islam, a woman can't leave the house without the permission or her husband (if she has one), her father or her brothers. A woman testimony in Islam is worth less than that of a man by Islamic jurisprudence Surah 2:282. Even when it comes to inheritance, the Quran favors the male over the female (I may not know why it did so) but it certainly doesn't over the female the same equal terms it offers the male. So, to say otherwise is an exaggeration on your part.

Here, you raised about 4 issues:
1- Women liberation
2- Women travelling without their husband
3- Women testimony
4- Inheritance

LIBERATION
You want to advertise a product just expose a woman's unclothedness even if the product has nothing to do with women
A woman can chose to marry another woman or her animal
Women are free to dress the way they choose even nakedly
Your wife can go anywhere she likes even without your permission etc.
These are what you called liberation?
Did you bother to read history on pre-Islamic era? Let me give you just two
a) Islam corrected the impression of burying female child(read how)
b) Islam corrected the impression of making women dancing nakedly(read history) in public which today you people are now calling back to

WOMEN TRAVELLING WITHOUT HUSBAND/MUHARAM (those that can't marry them)
Islam protects women in various ways and one of those ways is that it forbade women to travel without their husband or those that cannot marry them among males (their family).
A right thinking fellow will know that women are not created to have strength as equal as that of men, so in case of any harms, the man will protect her. If the man is not her husband or that cannot marry her is to accomplish her, the safety of the woman is not guaranteed. There might be sexual harassment and the likes or can you rape your sister?

WOMEN TESTIMONY
This is a portion of the verse you quoted:
(And get two witnesses out of your own men. And if there are not two men (available), then a man and two women, such as you agree for witnesses, so that if one of them (two women) errs, the other can remind her. And the witnesses should not refuse when they are called (for evidence).)
Can you now see that your copy paste only makes you "do as they said." The reason is widely stated but people like you will never comprehend because that is how you have been programmed directly or indirectly.

INHERITANCE
In your village, who provide for the family inter of spending? Please don't tell me you share it between you and your wife even if that is what you practice because it is a shame on any man with that orientation.
The inheritance in Islam is not just because one is a male child and the other one is a female child. Let me give simple assignment and it will show you what exactly Islam aims on the issue of inheritance

A man brought three (3) oranges for his three (3) children, so this man is thinking on how to share it among them. Please advise him

alexis:
Women couldn't vote in these countries as well but they weren't because of religious reasons. That is why there is a separation of church and state in the West. The society evolves and decides that such privileges should be given to all people irrespective of their sex. That is what a pluralistic society is all about - it includes everyone. Islam has some work to do in this regard.

You can save yourself this headache, Islam did not in any way give priority for voting be it a man or woman, we have our own way of government and you cannot tell me to leave the teaching of Islam and adopt man made law. But at that, those countries you mentioned know the importance of protecting the dignity of women and they did not allow them to vote in case there might be commotion. Did you know how you do it in Nigeria? What happen when thugs disrupt voting exercise!!!!

alexis:
Equality before God and the law should be the same whether you are a man or a woman; that is what equality is all about. In Surah 2:228, the Quran teaches that men are above women. In Western Liberalism, men are not above women, men are equal to women in all aspects. The difference between individuals is their pursuit of happiness but they are the same under the law.

I am not arguing this with you!!!!
Yes, in the western world why will man only marry woman? A woman can also marry another woman now.
Another question:
WHO IS THE HEAD OF THE FAMILY? Maybe you need to go back to your social studies. lol

alexis:
Islam teaches that a woman is a full person under the law, and is the spiritual equal of a male. Women have the right to own property, to operate a business, and to receive equal pay for equal work. Women are allowed total control of their wealth. They cannot be married against their will, and they are allowed to keep their own name when married. They have the right to inherit property and to have their marriage dissolved in the case of neglect or mistreatment. Islam does not consider woman an “evil temptress,” and thus does not blame woman for Original Sin (a doctrine that Islam rejects). Women in Islam participate in all forms of worship that men participate in.

I am not debating that women don't have "some" rights in Islam. The issue here is that women is Islam don't have the same rights accorded to men in Islam. The equality laws in Islam are dualistic and not pluralistic. You have one set of laws for men in certain instances and different set of laws for women.

If you did not understand something, you just ask rather than having a conclusion!!!

alexis:
He did say women were unintelligent and lacking in knowledge

Sahih Bukhari 1:6:301
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri: Once Allah's Apostle went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) o 'Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, "O women! Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women)." They asked, "Why is it so, O Allah's Apostle ?" He replied, "You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you." The women asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?" He said, "Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?" They replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her intelligence. Isn't it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?" The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her religion."
Please if you don't know about Islam, don't quote Islam
The prophet has explained what he meant by the deficiency in their intelligent not the one you stated or aimed. Try to digest the hadith
If you want to understand more, let your mother leave with your wife for just a year or less, you will understand more of women's intelligent

alexis:
. Her are the words of Aisha:

Muslim (4:1039) - "A'isha said [to Muhammad]: 'You have made us equal to the dogs and the asses'" These are the words of Muhammad's favorite wife, complaining of the role assigned to women under Islam

There is a lot I can say but I will leave it here for now. I think Islam has contributed some positive values women play under Islamic law but there are ugly history that we have running through the pages of the Quran and Hadith. Over-looking them or playing pretend doesn't help the dialog

As-salamu alaykum

Can you see the cancer copy paste have caused to you? Did you notice the red color? You will never check and research what you read on blackmailing site all you know is that did the information blackmail Islam then you take it.
The hadith is as follows

Book 004, Number 1038:
Masruq reported: It was mentioned before 'A'isha that prayer is invalidated (in case of passing) of a dog, an ass and a woman (before the worshipper, when he is not screened). Upon this 'A'isha said: You likened us to the asses and the dogs. By Allah I saw the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) saying prayer while I lay on the bedstead interposing between him and the Qibla. When I felt the need, I did not like to wit to front (of the Holy Prophet) and perturb the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) and quietly moved out from under its (i. e. of the bedstead) legs.
________________________________________
Book 004, Number 1039:
Al-Aswad reported that 'A'isha said: You have made us equal to the dogs and the asses, whereas I lay on the bedstead and the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) came there and stood in the middle of the bedstead and said prayer. I did not like to take off the quilt from me (in that state), so I moved away quietly from the front legs of the bedstead and thus came out of the quilt.
Sahih Bukhari 1:9:493
Narrated 'Aisha: The things which annual prayer were mentioned before me (and those were): a dog, a donkey and a woman. I said, "You have compared us (women) to donkeys and dogs. By Allah! I saw the Prophet praying while I used to lie in (my) bed between him and the Qibla. Whenever I was in need of something, I disliked to sit and trouble the Prophet. So, I would slip away by the side of his feet."
Imagine the incident occure after the death of the prophet when some people were trying to equate women to donkeys and dogs because when those animals pass in front of a man praying, it annuls the prayer and she explain to them that she use to sleep in front of the prophet's prayer and nothing happen to the prophet's prayer. She mentioned this to clarify the matter
I hope you will understand this because there is nothing for you to gain in giving helping hands to blackmailing Islam.
Whether you like it or not, Islam will prevail because it is the acceptable religion by the uncreated creator (ALLAH)
(32. They want to extinguish Allah's Light with their mouths, but Allah will not allow except that His Light should be perfected even though the disbelievers hate (it).) (33. It is He Who has sent His Messenger with guidance and the religion of truth, to make it superior over all religions even though the idolators hate (it).)

Actually I don't want to answer you because of the fact that you are only trying to taint and blackmail Islam and by that you result only in looking for any blackmailing sites to copy from.
But you did not know that this affects you negatively as follows:
You spread lies and woe on to the liars and their helpers
You will only increase in hatred against your fellow human being unlawfully
You will always be a seconded because you will not even bother to research the truth just copy and paste
May Allah guide you to the right path!

I find it difficult dealing with people who based their religion on their feelings. If you don't want to answer me, sit down and keep quiet. If you want to counter what I have said, respond with the appropriate references. You lack of initiative to show any authoritative references makes you suspect.

LIBERATION
You want to advertise a product just expose a woman's unclothedness even if the product has nothing to do with women
A woman can chose to marry another woman or her animal
Women are free to dress the way they choose even nakedly
Your wife can go anywhere she likes even without your permission etc.
These are what you called liberation?

Liberation means freedom, the freedom to choose what you want to do. The issue here is not what people decide to do with their freedom but the fact that they are free under the law. So, stop confusing the the expression of freedom as the same with the right of freedom. You are arguing off-point.

Did you bother to read history on pre-Islamic era? Let me give you just two
a) Islam corrected the impression of burying female child(read how)
b) Islam corrected the impression of making women dancing nakedly(read history) in public which today you people are now calling back to

Yet Islam encourages Muslim men to

1. Beat their wives: Surah 4:34; Surah 38:44. In Western society, husbands don't beat their wives. If a woman respects you, she will stay with you.
2. Mohammad punched Aisha in the chest: This is an authoritative Hadith from Sahih Muslim Book 004, Number 2127. Later you will claim that I don't know what I am talking about. The funny thing is that these are Islamic sources stating these things and not any other 3rd party.
3. It is true at one point that Mohammed said muslim men shouldn't beat their wives but he changed this stance when the men started complaining. Here is an authoritative reference from Abu Dawud (2141)

I can go on and on. I will not even mention honor killings of women by Muslim men or the marriage of young girls to fully grown men. Yet you will claim Islam liberation is superior to Western values. I think you are some kind of medication because you are not in touch with the real world when it comes to this matter

WOMEN TRAVELLING WITHOUT HUSBAND/MUHARAM (those that can't marry them)
Islam protects women in various ways and one of those ways is that it forbade women to travel without their husband or those that cannot marry them among males (their family).
A right thinking fellow will know that women are not created to have strength as equal as that of men, so in case of any harms, the man will protect her. If the man is not her husband or that cannot marry her is to accomplish her, the safety of the woman is not guaranteed. There might be sexual harassment and the likes or can you rape your sister?

Oh shut up - this is some of the blind ignorant religious rant that pisses me off. So a woman going to the market to buy food needs the strength of her Islamic husband. Or when she is taking her kids to school, she needs the strong arms of her husband to protect her abi? Or if she has to travel to work and be in an airplane? Her husband will enter the plane to protect her abi? These cheap excuses is why women in the Islamic world are leaving Islam and coming to the West so they can escape such prisons you call "security". Women are capable of protecting themselves, where they can't; the civil authority can step in but don't use this weak argument to support the Islamic subjugation of women; it shows you are still living in the 7th century.

WOMEN TESTIMONY
This is a portion of the verse you quoted:
(And get two witnesses out of your own men. And if there are not two men (available), then a man and two women, such as you agree for witnesses, so that if one of them (two women) errs, the other can remind her. And the witnesses should not refuse when they are called (for evidence).)
Can you now see that your copy paste only makes you "do as they said." The reason is widely stated but people like you will never comprehend because that is how you have been programmed directly or indirectly.

Bros, you didn't address the question. The fact is that a woman testimony is not enough as compared to a man's testimony under Islamic jurisprudence. The verse is quite clear but you want to show the climax of your ignorance and blindness; be it as it may - I will indulge you.

1. A woman inheritance is worth half of a man: Surah 4:11; 4:176. Please refute the claim that the inheritance of a man is greater than that of a man just for the fact that she is a woman. Sexism is established in Islam automatically. In the West, all people irrespective of their sex are equal under the law. Can you please reconcile Islam position on this. You haven't done justice to this case in Islam, you have so far ignored it

INHERITANCE

In your village, who provide for the family inter of spending? Please don't tell me you share it between you and your wife even if that is what you practice because it is a shame on any man with that orientation.

It might be a shame in your upbringing but not in mine. My wife works not because I can't take care of her but because she loves what she does and as a good husband; I support her. Her wages bring another source of income to the house-hold that we both build together. Again, the emphasis here is a team. Allowing your wife to be free to work doesn't take away your man-hood; perhaps it does in Islam or in your Islam but not in my world.

The inheritance in Islam is not just because one is a male child and the other one is a female child. Let me give simple assignment and it will show you what exactly Islam aims on the issue of inheritance. A man brought three (3) oranges for his three (3) children, so this man is thinking on how to share it among them. Please advise him

You are a BIG liar; please explain Surah 4:11; 4:176 then. After that, I will address your example.

You can save yourself this headache, Islam did not in any way give priority for voting be it a man or woman, we have our own way of government and you cannot tell me to leave the teaching of Islam and adopt man made law. But at that, those countries you mentioned know the importance of protecting the dignity of women and they did not allow them to vote in case there might be commotion. Did you know how you do it in Nigeria? What happen when thugs disrupt voting exercise!!!!

That is the problem isn't it - Muslims think their law is superior to others. That is why we can't reconcile Sharia with our constitution Oga. Beating of wives in Islam is somehow superior to not beating your wives. Only such logic is permissible in Islam and not in the free world. That is why women in Islam are leaving such ideas and bondage and coming to the West to live their lives as they see fit and not under the forceful control of any system; whether it was written by a 7th century god or an illiterate prophet. Secondly, sharia if sharia applied to only muslims, then I don't think there will be a problem but sharia gives one set of laws to muslims and another set of laws to non-muslims. For Islamic ignorants like you, that is proper because "Mohammad said so"

I am not arguing this with you!!!!
Yes, in the western world why will man only marry woman? A woman can also marry another woman now.
Another question:
WHO IS THE HEAD OF THE FAMILY? Maybe you need to go back to your social studies. lol

Thanks for conceding, at least you were honest about it. Another thing you don't know if that there is a huge division in the West when it comes to gay marriage. The facts are simple - America is evenly divided regarding gay marriage where up to 60% of people don't support it. There are many Western countries where gay marriage is not permissible. The fact here is simple, if a woman wants to marry another woman or a man wants to marry another man - the laws of the land allows them whether you or I agree with it or not. Most importantly, gays sexual preference is none of my business - the fact is that in the West, their sexual expression is protected as it should be. We don't kill gay people here like you do in Islamic countries. Gays in Islam run here to the West to seek refuge and sanctuary. They have the right to life even if you don't agree with their life-style

If you did not understand something, you just ask rather than having a conclusion!!!

Oh boy - sit down and park jare. Have you been reading with your eyes closed?

Sahih Bukhari 1:6:301
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri: Once Allah's Apostle went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) o 'Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, "O women! Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women)." They asked, "Why is it so, O Allah's Apostle ?" He replied, "You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you." The women asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?" He said, "Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?" They replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her intelligence. Isn't it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?" The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her religion."
Please if you don't know about Islam, don't quote Islam
The prophet has explained what he meant by the deficiency in their intelligent not the one you stated or aimed. Try to digest the hadith
If you want to understand more, let your mother leave with your wife for just a year or less, you will understand more of women's intelligent


Can you see the cancer copy paste have caused to you? Did you notice the red color? You will never check and research what you read on blackmailing site all you know is that did the information blackmail Islam then you take it.
The hadith is as follows

Book 004, Number 1038:
Masruq reported: It was mentioned before 'A'isha that prayer is invalidated (in case of passing) of a dog, an ass and a woman (before the worshipper, when he is not screened). Upon this 'A'isha said: You likened us to the asses and the dogs. By Allah I saw the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) saying prayer while I lay on the bedstead interposing between him and the Qibla. When I felt the need, I did not like to wit to front (of the Holy Prophet) and perturb the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) and quietly moved out from under its (i. e. of the bedstead) legs.
________________________________________
Book 004, Number 1039:
Al-Aswad reported that 'A'isha said: You have made us equal to the dogs and the asses, whereas I lay on the bedstead and the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) came there and stood in the middle of the bedstead and said prayer. I did not like to take off the quilt from me (in that state), so I moved away quietly from the front legs of the bedstead and thus came out of the quilt.
Sahih Bukhari 1:9:493
Narrated 'Aisha: The things which annual prayer were mentioned before me (and those were): a dog, a donkey and a woman. I said, "You have compared us (women) to donkeys and dogs. By Allah! I saw the Prophet praying while I used to lie in (my) bed between him and the Qibla. Whenever I was in need of something, I disliked to sit and trouble the Prophet. So, I would slip away by the side of his feet."
Imagine the incident occure after the death of the prophet when some people were trying to equate women to donkeys and dogs because when those animals pass in front of a man praying, it annuls the prayer and she explain to them that she use to sleep in front of the prophet's prayer and nothing happen to the prophet's prayer. She mentioned this to clarify the matter
I hope you will understand this because there is nothing for you to gain in giving helping hands to blackmailing Islam.
Whether you like it or not, Islam will prevail because it is the acceptable religion by the uncreated creator (ALLAH)
(32. They want to extinguish Allah's Light with their mouths, but Allah will not allow except that His Light should be perfected even though the disbelievers hate (it).) (33. It is He Who has sent His Messenger with guidance and the religion of truth, to make it superior over all religions even though the idolators hate (it).)

All these to prove what? I stated the Hadith where Mohammed hit Aisha in the chest and it hurt her. Are you denying that?

alexis:


I find it difficult dealing with people who based their religion on their feelings. If you don't want to answer me, sit down and keep quiet. If you want to counter what I have said, respond with the appropriate references. You lack of initiative to show any authoritative references makes you suspect.



Liberation means freedom, the freedom to choose what you want to do. The issue here is not what people decide to do with their freedom but the fact that they are free under the law. So, stop confusing the the expression of freedom as the same with the right of freedom. You are arguing off-point.



Yet Islam encourages Muslim men to

1. Beat their wives: Surah 4:34; Surah 38:44. In Western society, husbands don't beat their wives. If a woman respects you, she will stay with you.
2. Mohammad punched Aisha in the chest: This is an authoritative Hadith from Sahih Muslim Book 004, Number 2127. Later you will claim that I don't know what I am talking about. The funny thing is that these are Islamic sources stating these things and not any other 3rd party.
3. It is true at one point that Mohammed said muslim men shouldn't beat their wives but he changed this stance when the men started complaining. Here is an authoritative reference from Abu Dawud (2141)

I can go on and on. I will not even mention honor killings of women by Muslim men or the marriage of young girls to fully grown men. Yet you will claim Islam liberation is superior to Western values. I think you are some kind of medication because you are not in touch with the real world when it comes to this matter



Oh shut up - this is some of the blind ignorant religious rant that pisses me off. So a woman going to the market to buy food needs the strength of her Islamic husband. Or when she is taking her kids to school, she needs the strong arms of her husband to protect her abi? Or if she has to travel to work and be in an airplane? Her husband will enter the plane to protect her abi? These cheap excuses is why women in the Islamic world are leaving Islam and coming to the West so they can escape such prisons you call "security". Women are capable of protecting themselves, where they can't; the civil authority can step in but don't use this weak argument to support the Islamic subjugation of women; it shows you are still living in the 7th century.



Bros, you didn't address the question. The fact is that a woman testimony is not enough as compared to a man's testimony under Islamic jurisprudence. The verse is quite clear but you want to show the climax of your ignorance and blindness; be it as it may - I will indulge you.

1. A woman inheritance is worth half of a man: Surah 4:11; 4:176. Please refute the claim that the inheritance of a man is greater than that of a man just for the fact that she is a woman. Sexism is established in Islam automatically. In the West, all people irrespective of their sex are equal under the law. Can you please reconcile Islam position on this. You haven't done justice to this case in Islam, you have so far ignored it



It might be a shame in your upbringing but not in mine. My wife works not because I can't take care of her but because she loves what she does and as a good husband; I support her. Her wages bring another source of income to the house-hold that we both build together. Again, the emphasis here is a team. Allowing your wife to be free to work doesn't take away your man-hood; perhaps it does in Islam or in your Islam but not in my world.



You are a BIG liar; please explain Surah 4:11; 4:176 then. After that, I will address your example.




That is the problem isn't it - Muslims think their law is superior to others. That is why we can't reconcile Sharia with our constitution Oga. Beating of wives in Islam is somehow superior to not beating your wives. Only such logic is permissible in Islam and not in the free world. That is why women in Islam are leaving such ideas and bondage and coming to the West to live their lives as they see fit and not under the forceful control of any system; whether it was written by a 7th century god or an illiterate prophet. Secondly, sharia if sharia applied to only muslims, then I don't think there will be a problem but sharia gives one set of laws to muslims and another set of laws to non-muslims. For Islamic ignorants like you, that is proper because "Mohammad said so"



Thanks for conceding, at least you were honest about it. Another thing you don't know if that there is a huge division in the West when it comes to gay marriage. The facts are simple - America is evenly divided regarding gay marriage where up to 60% of people don't support it. There are many Western countries where gay marriage is not permissible. The fact here is simple, if a woman wants to marry another woman or a man wants to marry another man - the laws of the land allows them whether you or I agree with it or not. Most importantly, gays sexual preference is none of my business - the fact is that in the West, their sexual expression is protected as it should be. We don't kill gay people here like you do in Islamic countries. Gays in Islam run here to the West to seek refuge and sanctuary. They have the right to life even if you don't agree with their life-style



Oh boy - sit down and park jare. Have you been reading with your eyes closed?




All these to prove what? I stated the Hadith where Mohammed hit Aisha in the chest and it hurt her. Are you denying that?

This your response only expose how your shallow thinking and reasoning is and I will make it clear to you
For example:
If you meet a man with your wife on your bed in your bedroom, am sure you will switch on the fan so that they can enjoy more

In such scenario, average man will result to beaten up the wife mercilessly but because of this human nature, Islam deals with this situation and further explain gives limitation to how you beat her if you chose to
Question: When a christian man beats his wife, is it Islam that that also tells him to beat her?

Please you need to know the difference between encouragement and allowed I think this is where your problem lies
With regards to other issues you raised, well I say say that; what you have under your nose is more than the mouth therefore look beyond your nose you will see more

You can watch this video and share from this woman's brain
http://www.onislam.net/english/component/jvideodirect/?v=vCO0Qhr0q2Wh1

yazach

This your response only expose how your shallow thinking and reasoning is and I will make it clear to you
For example:
If you meet a man with your wife on your bed in your bedroom, am sure you will switch on the fan so that they can enjoy more

That is irrelevant to the topic at had. Since you are unable to intellectually respond to me, you are running with your tail between your legs in another direction

In such scenario, average man will result to beaten up the wife mercilessly but because of this human nature, Islam deals with this situation and further explain gives limitation to how you beat her if you chose to
Question: When a christian man beats his wife, is it Islam that that also tells him to beat her?

You are not doing justice to the issue. In Islam, when a woman commits adultery, she is to be stoned. So, clearly the beating of the wife in Islam is not when she cheats. You are inserting an alternative into the text and it's very clear to see your dishonesty. Your grasp of the subject matter alarms me and shows your command of Islamic theology - it's sad, very sad. You probably have to go and learn more about Islamic theology and it's application

Please you need to know the difference between encouragement and allowed I think this is where your problem lies
With regards to other issues you raised, well I say say that; what you have under your nose is more than the mouth therefore look beyond your nose you will see more

Another ignorant reference that is not related to the topic at hand. You have refused to engage me intellectually within the confines of Islamic sources i.e. the Quran and Hadiths. All I can suggest now is you stop embarrassing yourself and do more research. Be honest with yourself and let Allah guide you to be honest.

alexis:
yazach



That is irrelevant to the topic at had. Since you are unable to intellectually respond to me, you are running with your tail between your legs in another direction



You are not doing justice to the issue. In Islam, when a woman commits adultery, she is to be stoned. So, clearly the beating of the wife in Islam is not when she cheats. You are inserting an alternative into the text and it's very clear to see your dishonesty. Your grasp of the subject matter alarms me and shows your command of Islamic theology - it's sad, very sad. You probably have to go and learn more about Islamic theology and it's application



Another ignorant reference that is not related to the topic at hand. You have refused to engage me intellectually within the confines of Islamic sources i.e. the Quran and Hadiths. All I can suggest now is you stop embarrassing yourself and do more research. Be honest with yourself and let Allah guide you to be honest.

Don't tell me the video did not solve your problem

This one should

https://www.nairaland.com/2291292/rebutals-library-solution-recycled-topics

yazach:

Don't tell me the video did not solve your problem

This one should

https://www.nairaland.com/2291292/rebutals-library-solution-recycled-topics

People don't post videos when they engage others in an intellectual dialog. I can do the same but that wouldn't do justice to the discussion. From jump-start, you were never objective. To you Islam is perfect; to me God Almighty is perfect - a big difference! History and evidence shows that my position is more objective.

Whenever you decide to engage me constructively and objectively; we can have an honest discussion. Until then may Allah bless you because you seem to think that I am not a Muslim

alexis:


People don't post videos when they engage others in an intellectual dialog. I can do the same but that wouldn't do justice to the discussion. From jump-start, you were never objective. To you Islam is perfect; to me God Almighty is perfect - a big difference! History and evidence shows that my position is more objective.

Whenever you decide to engage me constructively and objectively; we can have an honest discussion. Until then may Allah bless you because you seem to think that I am not a Muslim

Did you regard your response as intellectual You are too funny

yazach:



Did you regard your response as intellectual You are too funny

You seem to be the only one laughing. I wonder what the joke is about

alexis:


You seem to be the only one laughing. I wonder what the joke is about

The joke is about the cancer you are developing because you want to blackmail Islam

yazach:


The joke is about the cancer you are developing because you want to blackmail Islam

Stop hiding behind accusations Bros. In debates, you don't play a child. You have open honest discussions. Something it appears you have a hard time doing

This is the problem with muslims. Stick to the question at hand. Did you have to give references to abraham, king sololom etc??

Mohammed was your highest prophet. Jesus is our GOD in human form. Compare both of them. Notwithstanding, you need not even comapre, just go straight to the answer. You always seek new ways to conceal the evil deeds of your prophet, hence you're blinded from the truth.

Mohammed married an underaged child Aisha, and had carnal knowledge of her. That is pedophilia. He married 9 wives, but commanded you lots to marry 4. Why did he go against his own teaching? That's exactly the question you're meant to answer, not beat around the bush and not bring Abraham into the topic. Why did he still have concubines? That's what you're meant to answer.

@ alexis are you a muslim?

trapQ:
[s]This is the problem with muslims. Stick to the question at hand. Did you have to give references to abraham, king sololom etc??

Mohammed was your highest prophet. Jesus is our GOD in human form. Compare both of them. Notwithstanding, you need not even comapre, just go straight to the answer. You always seek new ways to conceal the evil deeds of your prophet, hence you're blinded from the truth.

Mohammed married an underaged child Aisha, and had carnal knowledge of her. That is pedophilia. He married 9 wives, but commanded you lots to marry 4. Why did he go against his own teaching? That's exactly the question you're meant to answer, not beat around the bush and not bring Abraham into the topic. Why did he still have concubines? That's what you're meant to answer.[/s]

If you can post here, you can either be a hypocrite, sinner and liar
You are ranting and spewing rubbish dude?

You're the bigger hypocrite because we are sinners living under the grace of the most high GOD.

Secondly, I'm not a dude, and I'm not ranting. Only stating the evil deeds of your pedophile who can't keep to his own commandments.

yazach:


If you can post here, you can either be a hypocrite, sinner and liar
You are ranting and spewing rubbish dude?

trapQ:
You're the bigger hypocrite because we are sinners living under the grace of the most high GOD.

Secondly, I'm not a dude, and I'm not ranting. [s]Only stating the evil deeds of your pedophile who can't keep to his own commandments. [/s]

Did you know what you deny and accept before you can post here is that not enough for you to be a hypocrite

Don't forget that marry was married to a 90 years old man at age 12

yazach:


Did you know what you deny and accept before you can post here is that not enough for you to be a hypocrite

Don't forget that marry was married to a 90 years old man at age 12

I have a simple test for you - can you show us in the Bible where it made claims that Mary was 12 and Joseph 90?

alexis:


I have a simple test for you - can you show us in the Bible where it made claims that Mary was 12 and Joseph 90?

Ordinary church goer christian like you will not know

yazach:


Ordinary church goer christian like you will not know

And "scholars" like you who make such claims but can't reference it or state it's source shows how desperate you are. It's true that Mohammad married a 6 year old child - that is from Islamic theology and the Hadith; that was the custom then and in many parts of the world. He slept with the girl when she was 9 years old; now that is a disturbing fact. Other cultures didn't sleep with their kids at such a young age; it was prevalent in the Arab culture which Mohammad came from. In your mind, that is somehow justifiable and instead of you to honestly address such practice; you will ignore it and run in another direction claiming Mary was 12 and Joseph was 90. The Bible is the authoritative source for Christians, every "Church goer" knows that.

I will make it simple, here is the hadith confirming how old Aisha was when she was married and when Mohammad slept with her:

Sahih Bukhari Volume 7, Book 62, Number 64
Narrated 'Aisha:
that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old, and then she remained with him for nine years (i.e., till his death).

Which of God's holy prophets do you see marrying children? While you are at it, please do justice by showing us from the Bible or even your Quran where it claimed that Mary was 12 and Joseph was 90