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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Islam for Muslims / Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam (19264 Views)
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Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by Empiree: 3:48pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
Mrolai, I don't think you should drag it to that level. Just stick to his subject matter. I hate to involve in a subject where both sects are actually guilty of the same crime. I told you before that sunni (minority) also guilty of "misyar" identical to muta marriage but it's basically practiced in Arabian peninsula. Unfortunately I can't defend baqir if you continue to bring this up because he started this unnecessary criticisms of the first 3 imams. I could engage him and trash everything in his op and subsequent posts but ain't get his time. |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by usermane(m): 3:56pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
@MrOlai remind me of pot calling kettle black. Your own Ahlu sunnah sect ordain sex slavery of female captives. According to your own tradition, Muhammad had concubines in addition to his numerous wives. Muhammad married and cohabited with a 9 year old according to your tradition. I can post the Hadith if you want me. The problem with you traditional Muslims is you don't know your religion, that is why you are quick to judge others. |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by MrOlai: 4:00pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
usermane: You are excused. 2 Likes |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by MrOlai: 4:03pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
Empiree: Empiree. You cannot be here and there at the same time. It's either you are in support of the companions(R.A) Albaqir is defaming or you are against them. Stand firm on what you believe! 3 Likes |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by HAkorehdeh(m): 4:35pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
usermane:The hadith? Post it here please! The thread i think is already contaminated. People know whose post to read, thank God MrSino is here too.. Some people ain't helping sha And the mods, Good job (ironically)! Lol |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by sino(m): 4:36pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
Assalam alaykum Mr Olai, please exercise patience and don't allow Shia actions and utterances get to you. There is always the time and place to defend the Sunnah to the best of our ability. And please for Allah's sake, delete offensive posts. Jazakumullahu khayran |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by AlBaqir(m): 4:36pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
Empiree: # Unnecessary thread indeed! # @underline Allahu Akbar. You never stop with your amusing comments. You ain't get his (Albaqir) time yet from the very first page till this, your comments filled up the spaces. Obviously you have nothing, absolutely nothing in your arsenal to rescue your darling Khalifah. Empiree pls stop making comment.... |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by MrOlai: 4:59pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
sino: Wa'alaykum Salam my Brother. This person (Albaqir) is very cunning. Imagine the deceptive title of the thread! When Maclatunji was still the moderator here, this same person (Albaqir) opened similar thread and he titled it "Cold Truth About Umar". He said all sorts of evils about Umar(R.A). Maclatunji(May Allah(SWT) continue to guide him) removed the hate thread in less than 24 hours. Sometimes, we shouldn't just keep quiet, at least, for the sake of innocent minds who are just trying to learn Islam, so that they won't be misled by these agents of shaytan! Imagine his statement on you here: "You just jump like "mountain goat" to attack.! Honestly, this got me cracking... 2 Likes |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by AlBaqir(m): 5:01pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
@ Sino, I forgot to add to my previous reply to your comment. # Your question about Mawla Ali (alaihim Salam), why upon his notable valour, was not able to confront the Khulafa of his time. While I would have love to answer, I am sorry bro that is totally out of the subject matter of this thread. You can never fool me again with your usual derailment. # As per this hadith you quoted: {It was narrated that Muhammad Bin Aqeel bin Abu Talib said: Ali made a Sermon to us and he said: O people, Who was the bravest amongst the people? We said: You O Ameer al Mumineen, He(Ali) said: Rather, it is Abu Bakr as- Siddeeq, because on the day of Badr, we built the hut for the Messenger of Allah(saw) then we said: “Who will stand with him so that none of the polytheists will get close to him?” No one stood with him except Abu Bakr, who stood with his sword unsheathed, guarding the Prophet; every time anyone got close to him, Abu Bakr struck him with his sword. I saw the Messenger of Allah(saw), when Quraysh caught hold of him at the Ka’bah and started shaking him and saying: “You are the one who made the gods into one God.” By Allah, no one got close to him except Abu Bakr and at that time Abu Bakr had two braids. He started poking this one and pushing that one, saying: ‘Woe to you! Would you kill a man because he says my Lord is Allah(swt) when he has brought you proof from your Lord?” One of Abu Bakr’s braids was cut off, and ‘Ali said to his companions: I adjure you by Allah, which of the two men was better, the believer of the family of Pharaoh or Abu Bakr?’ The people kept quiet, then ‘Ali said: ‘By Allah, a day in the life of Abu Bakr is better than the believer of the family of Pharaoh; that man conceded his faith, and Allah praised him, but Abu Bakr offered his life and his blood for the sake of Allah.(Al Mustadrak (3/67) He said SAHIH on the condition of Muslim and Imam al Thahabi Agreed with him.) [Ali bin Abi Talib, by Ali Muhammad Sallabi, vol 1, page 170]} I have tried my utmost best to locate it. Kindly post its Arabic text, and its full reference for its verification. Thanks man. |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by Empiree: 5:01pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
MrOlai:I dont think you get it. I have always stood firm supporting companions(RA). But what you brought up is not in line with that. I have confronted baqir in the past and called him misguided for calling the companions usurpers. But what you brought up is irrelevant to the borne of contention. Shia are basically muslims. Their hate for the companions does not make any less muslims. It would be wrong to castigate all of them. When it comes to some of their practices that are not islamic or wild doctrines, I simply against it. I can not defend Sunni for what you posted earlier which is what user.mane commented on. I think you should understand better than that. When it comes to this thread, I can never support albaqir. He knows that long ago. It is not about being here and there. Shia are muslims with some twisted ideology that dont impress me. On this thread, op is very wrong. I have said that it is mere hatred for the companions and it will never end until the return or Imam Mahdi or Isa Ibn Maryam(AS). |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by MrOlai: 5:13pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
Empiree: You've tried. I "dash" you 40%... |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by MrOlai: 5:15pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
AlBaqir: |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by AlBaqir(m): 5:17pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
MrOlai: # Kudos to your bro for remembering "Cold truth about Umar". Yeah it was deleted after 2days and several comments. And its a big shame that any contrary opinion is never allowed those days. # What is Albaqir's crime for Allah's sake? ALL the expositions are well documented in your prestigious books. Even if you want scan-pages on each of those ref, I will post them all. You should rather get angry and curse your Muhadiths and Aimma for keeping those documents. # Like I replied your champion, sino, who accused me of sidelining all ahadith in praises of Umar, the point is there are equally plentiful Sihahu ahadith that contradict those merits. That's what you don't want to be unveiled. In fact I am looking forward for a thread by anyone of you on the Merits of Umar. And those so-called merits shall be verify in line with the holy Quran and other sahih ahadith. # As per Albaqir referring to Sino "jumping like mountain goat"! This is a remarks Umar used to qualify himself and it is well documented as I have posted. Don't you like to share the same rremark with your Mawla? |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by usermane(m): 5:31pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
HAkorehdeh: OK but please give me time to rest. I will post them in a couple of hours. |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by sino(m): 5:32pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
MrOlai:AlBaqir must have seen me jumping like a mountain goat before making such comment, it doesn't bother me at all. Indeed we must not keep quiet when people with an agenda wants to tarnish the honor of the Prophet's companions, especially his closest and trusted ones such as Abu Bakr, Umar and Uthman (RA), but we must defend their honor by applying the Sunnah. If the Prophet (SAW) and ahl-l-bayt never spoke ill of these companions one wonders who these Shia are following with this their deep rooted hatred... May Allah guide us right ameen 3 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by AlBaqir(m): 5:49pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
Empiree: But you dare not call Imam Muslim who recorded what Albaqir recounted that Mawla Ali and al-Abbas call your 3 Khulafa, USURPER?! Empiree: Allahu akibar. Mufti Empiree. May Allah forgive you for that blatant lie. Shia hates the Munafiq among the companions just like Quran command. Allah even curse them so also we curse the Munafiqun. The righteous and steadfast among them are praised repeatedly and we can die in defending them. Empiree: Mufti of NL. What are those non-Islamic or wild doctrines? Educate me please or you ain't get the time. Imamah? Empiree: Have I ever sought your support on any of my thread? Yes when MrOlai made erratic comment and posts yet you hide your head. Can you even help yourself and your Sufi ideology? I have NEVER seen any comment of yours with explicit quotation of a single hadith with full text and reference. And you want to support? Empiree: # please fear Allah for using the word "companions". That's how you deceive yourself. # What do you know about Imam al-Mahdi [ajalalahu faraja'u sherifah]. |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by MrOlai: 5:53pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
sino: Amin my Brother. Thanks for the compliments. Jazakumullah khaeran. 1 Like |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by MrOlai: 6:17pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
AlBaqir: Empiree: @Empiree. You should now begin to see the true colour of your "friend" Albaqir. He's been moving along with you using his Taqiyya. A camelion would always remain camelion, even if it changes its colour a million times! Your Tom and Jerry relationship with him reminds me of Germany and Russia during the Second World War(WW2). It was when Adolf Hitler launched "Operation Babarosa" on Russia in the last minutes that Russia realised He had been allying himself with an enemy! A word is enough for the wise! 1 Like |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by Empiree: 7:07pm On Nov 15, 2015 |
^ I dont take that personal. See, this is what i am saying. This is fitna albaqir is causing here. Enough said now. Muslims dont act like this. I am not Sufi. I basically look into different literature and learn from them. And by sufism, am not even referring to sufi sect. Rather in the context of Quran itself, that is, Ihsan. Nothing more. But what you do here albaqir, you just open door widely for criticism of Shia and it innocent adherents. I have Shias around Sunni masjid i frequent and they dont in way startup conversations like yours. This is very unfortunate brother. Bro kazlaw also warned you earlier but you snubbed. Just because we dont want to engage you on this thread does not in anyway means we are weak. We eschewed for Islam's sake. I even posted video and videos' link, perchance, you would think twice but you went ahead anyway. If you feel like talking or opening a thread for any reason, wouldn't be better to keep silent rather startup sectarian strife?. I would disagree with mrolai that this is typical of Shia. It is just him(baqir and maybe some few others) and any muslim can act like that as well. In this day and age, the last thing we do is vilifying one another when we are at the center stage of every bad news. |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by Demmzy15(m): 2:43pm On Nov 16, 2015 |
sino: |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by sino(m): 3:05pm On Nov 16, 2015 |
AlBaqir:I'm sorry for the trouble bro, I guess the the first reference to Al Mustadrak might be a mistake by the original post i copied it from. It can be found in the book by Dr. Ali Muhammad Sallabi vol 1, page 221 (according to the scanned copy). I did my own search and found the narration first in As-Suyuti's Tarikh-l-khulafah and then Musnad Al-Bazaar of AbuBakr Ahmad bin 'Amr This is the chain and narration as found in Musnad Al-Bazzaar: [size=24pt]ـ حدثنا عبد الله بن أبي ثمامة الأنصاري قال حَدَّثَنَا الحسن بن عبد الله المقرئ العجلي قال حَدَّثَنَا حسان بن إبراهيم الكرماني قال حَدَّثَنَا إبراهيم بن محمد الصائغ عن محمد بن عقيلقال خطبنا علي بن أبي طالب رضي الله عنه فقال أيها الناس أخبروني من أشجع الناس ؟ فقالوا : أنت قال : أما إني ما بارزت أحدا إلا انتصفت منه و لكن اخبروني بأشجع الناس ؟ قالوا : لا نعلم فمن ؟ قال : أبو بكر إنه لما كان يوم بدر فجعلنا لرسول الله صلى الله عليه و سلم عريشا فقلنا : من يكون مع رسول الله صلى الله عليه و سلم لئلا يهوي إليه أحد من المشركين ؟ فو الله ما دنا منا أحد إلا أبو بكر شاهرا بالسيف على رأس رسول الله صلى الله عليه و سلم لا يهوي إليه أحد إلا هوى إليه فهو أشجع الناس قال علي رضي الله عنه : و لقد رأيت رسول الله صلى الله عليه و سلم و أخذته قريش فهذا يجبأه و هذا يتلتله و هم يقولون : أنت الذي جعلت الآلهة إلها واحدا ؟ قال : فو الله ما دنا منا أحد إلا أبو بكر يضرب هذا و يجبأ هذا و يتلتل هذا و هو يقول : ويلكم ! أتقتلون رجلا أن يقول ربي الله ثم رفع علي بردة كانت عليه فبكى حتى اخضلت لحيته ثم قال : أنشدكم الله أمؤمن آل فرعون خير أم أبو بكر ؟ فسكت القوم فقال : ألا تجيبونني ؟ فو الله لساعة من أبي بكر خير من ألف ساعة من مثل مؤمن آل فرعون ذاك رجل يكتم إيمانه و هذا رجل أعلن إيمانه [/size] |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by sino(m): 7:44pm On Nov 16, 2015 |
AlBaqir:Very well, Alhamdulilah for brothers around the world who had done research and pasted it on the internet for the world to learn the truth and propagate it. One of such website is "youpuncturedtheark", due to NL's rules I can't post the site here, but quotes in this my reply are from this site, which tackles AlBaqir's well known skepticism and doubts... I have quoted the above as a point of issue, let us see if true that Umar (RA) fled from battle... BATTLE OF KHANDAQ (AHZAB) My question to you AlBaqir is, Did UMAR (RA) FLED? The answer is NO! Again, Did any of the narration made mention of Umar (RA) as one of the munafiq?! Sometimes I wonder how you guys jump to conclusion, just because you hate Umar (RA) does not mean you should find every little thing to accuse him, and mind you, you have not answered my question in my initial post, DID UMAR NOT DIE A MUSLIM? The hadith of Aisha (RA) you quoted, did not have the word hiding, how come it is interpreted as such? If you have the Arabic narration with the word hiding, please produce it if you are truthful! I seriously look forward to reading it. BATTLE OF KHAYBAR AlBaqir:
I believe the other narrations in my initial post about the bravery of Umar (RA) especially the one narrated by Ali (RA) clearly removes attributing cowardice to Umar (RA), if you still insist with your prejudiced opinion, I'll tell you that the Prophet (SAW) would never make such a mistake, or do you want to say the Prophet (SAW) made a mistake by making Umar (RA) the Ameer of the first expedition?! and then still made him Ameer to another expedition after khaybar?! AlBaqir, DID THE PROPHET (SAW) MADE A MISTAKE IN MAKING UMAR (RA) THE AMEER OF THESE EXPEDITIONS?! I calmly await your response.... 4 Likes 2 Shares |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by sino(m): 8:03pm On Nov 16, 2015 |
BATTLE OF HUNAIN AlBaqir: Muhammad bin Ishaq, the Imam of Maghazi, narrates from ‘Aasim bin ‘Umar bin Qatadah from Abdur-Rahman bin Jabir bin ‘Abdullah from his father and in it he mentions those who remained with the Prophet (saw): Among his family members: 1. ‘Ali 2. Abu Sufyan bin Harith bin ‘Abdul Muttalib 3. Rabi’ah bin Harith bin ‘Abdul Muttalib 4. Fadhl bin ‘Abbas 5. ‘Abbas bin Abdul Muttalib Among others: 1. Abu Bakr 2. ‘Umar 3. Usamah bin Zaid 4. Ayman bin ‘Ubaid It was recorded by Ibn Hisham in Seerah (2/443), Ahmad bin Hanbal in Musnad (15027) and Al-Bayhaqi in Dalail an-Nubuwwah (5/126-127). Most of the authors on Seerah do mention it. At-Tirmidi narrated: After giving chain of narrator till Ibn Umar who said: I have seen on the day of Hunain two groups turned their backs and there was with the messenger of Allah (saw) 100 men. Ahmed and Al-Hakim narrated from hadeeths of Abdul Rahman bin Abdullah bin Masud from his father who said: “We were with the messenger of Allah (saw) on the day of Hunain when people deserted him, and those who stood firm where 80 men from Muhajirin and Al-Ansar.
Narrated Abu Qatada: We set out in the company of Allah’s Messenger (saw) on the day (of the battle) of Hunain. When we faced the enemy, the Muslims retreated and I saw a pagan throwing himself over a Muslim. I turned around and came upon him from behind and hit him on the shoulder with the sword He (i.e. the pagan) came towards me and seized me so violently that I felt as if it were death itself, but death overtook him and he released me. I followed `Umar bin Al Khattab and asked (him), “What is wrong with the people (fleeing)?” He replied, “This is the Will of Allah,” (Sahih al-Bukhari #3142) Sharh Muslim (by Imam Nawawi) قوله: (كانت للمسلمين جولة) بفتح الجيم أي انهزام وخيفة ذهبوا فيها، وهذا إنما كان في بعض الجيش. Imam Al-Nawawi commenting on this hadeeths said…that the retreat or defeat was in some of the army (not all). Sharh Bukhari (by Ibn Hajar) قوله: (فلما التقينا كانت للمسلمين جولة) بفتح الجيم وسكون الواو أي حركة فيها اختلاف، وقد أطلق في رواية الليث الآتية بعدها أنهم انهزموا، لكن بعد القصة التي ذكرها أبو قتادة، وقد تقدم في حديث البراء أن الجميع لم ينهزموا. Similar comment was also made by Ibn Hajr in his sharh Bukhari who said: ‘and it is mentioned in the narration of Al-Laith which will follow that they were defeated, but (the defeat was) after the story which Abu Qatada mentioned, and it has been preceded in the hadeeths of Al-Bar’a that all were not defeated Hadeeth and Books of Seerah explicitly state that Umar(ra) was among those who did not flee. (i). We read the SAHIH Hadith in “Musnad Ahmad” volume 23 page 274 Hadith #14731: فَانْطَلَقَ النَّاسُ إِلَّا أَنَّ مَعَ رَسُولِ اللهِ صَلَّىاللهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ رَهْطًا مِنَ الْمُهَاجِرِينَ وَالْأَنْصَارِ، وَأَهْلِ بَيْتِهِغَيْرَ كَثِيرٍ، ثَبَتَ مَعَهُ صَلَّى اللهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ أَبُو بَكْرٍ وَعُمَرُ،وَمِنْ أَهْلِ بَيْتِهِ، عَلِيُّ بْنُ أَبِي طَالِبٍ، وَالْعَبَّاسُ بْنُ عَبْدِ الْمُطَّلِبِ،وَابْنُهُ الْفَضْلُ بْنُ عَبَّاسٍ، وَأَبُو سُفْيَانَ بْنُ الْحَارِثِ، وَرَبِيعَةُبْنُ الْحَارِثِ، وَأَيْمَنُ بْنُ عُبَيْدٍ وَهُوَ ابْنُ أُمِّ أَيْمَنَ، وَأُسَامَةُبْنُ زَيْدٍ، قَالَ: وَرَجُلٌ مِنْ هَوَازِنَ عَلَى جَمَلٍ لَهُ أَحْمَرَ فِي يَدِهِرَايَةٌ لَهُ سَوْدَاءُ فِي رَأْسِ رُمْحٍ طَوِيلٍ لَهُ أَمَامَ النَّاسِ، وَهَوَازِنُخَلْفَهُ Ya’qoub narrated from his Father from Ibn Ishaq from ‘Assim ibn ‘Umar bin Qatada from ‘Abdul-Rahman ibn Jabir from Jabir ibn ‘Abdullah: The people retreated but the Prophet(saw) was accompanied by a group from the Mouhajirun and the Ansar and his Ahlul-Bayt, Those who held their ground and stayed with him were Abu Bakr an ‘Umar and from his Ahlul-Bayt ‘Ali ibn abi Talib and al-‘Abbas bin ‘Abdul-Mutallib and his son al-Fadl and Abu Suffiyan bin al-Harith and Raba’iyah bin al-Harith and Ayman bin ‘Ubeid and he is ibn Umm-Ayman and Usamah ibn Zaid, he said: and a Man from Hawzan (until the end of the narration). (ii). This is also mentioned in the book “Majma’a al-Zawaed” under “Kitab al-Maghazi wal Siyar” in the chapter “Ghazwat Hunein” Hadith # 10265: وعن جابر بن عبد الله قال : لما استقبلنا وادي حنين قال : انحدرنا في واد من أودية تهامة أجوف حطوط إنما ننحدر فيه انحدارا ، قال : وفي عماية الصبح ، وقد كان القوم قد كمنوا لنا في شعابه ، وفي أجنابه ، ومضائقه ، قد أجمعوا وتهيئوا وأعدوا قال : فوالله ما راعنا ونحن منحطون إلا الكتائب قد شدت علينا شدة رجل واحد ، وانهزم الناس راجعين فانشمروا لا يلوي أحد على أحد وانحاز رسول الله – صلى الله عليه وسلم – ذات اليمين ، ثم قال : ” إلي أيها الناس ، إلا أن مع رسول الله – صلى الله عليه وسلم – رهطا من المهاجرين والأنصار ، وأهل بيته غير كثير وفي من ثبت معه أبو بكر وعمر ، عليهما السلام ، ومن أهل بيته علي بن أبي طالب ، والعباس بن عبد المطلب ، وابنه الفضل بن عباس ، وأبو سفيان بن الحارث ، وربيعة بن الحارث ، وأيمن بن عبيد وهو ابن أم أيمن ، وأسامة بن زيد ، عليهما السلام قال : ورجل من هوازن على جمل له أحمر ، في يده راية له سوداء في رأس رمح له طويل أمام الناس وهوازن خلفه ، فإذا أدرك طعن برمحه ، فإذا فاته الناس رفع لمن وراءه فاتبعوه (iii). Al-Bidaya wal-Nihaya of Ibn Kathir: فلما رأى رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم أمر الناس ومعه رهط من أهل بيته: علي بن أبي طالب، وأبو سفيان ابن الحارث بن عبد المطلب، وأخوه ربيعة بن الحارث بن عبد المطلب، والفضل بن العباس، وقيل الفضيل بن أبي سفيان، وأيمن ابن أم أيمن، وأسامة بن زيد. ومن الناس من يزيد فيهم قثم بن العباس، ورهط من المهاجرين: منهم أبو بكر، وعمر، والعباس آخذ بحكمة بغلته البيضاء وهو عليها قد شجرها. It mentions the names of those who stood firm with prophet…(and group of Al-Ansar: Among them Abu Bakr, Umar and Abbas…) Similarly, we read in Tafsir Ibn Kathir: There remained between a hundred and eighty Companions with the Prophet . These included Abu Bakr, `Umar, Al-`Abbas, `Ali, Al-Fadl bin `Abbas, Abu Sufyan bin Al-Harith, Ayman the son of Umm Ayman and Usamah bin Zayd. (Tafsir Ibn Kathir) (iv). Al-Seerah Al-Nabawi of ibn Hisham: من ثبت معه صلى الله عليه وسلم : وفيمن ثبت معه من المهاجرين أبو بكر وعمر ، ومن أهل بيته علي بن أبي طالب والعباس بن عبدالمطلب ، وأبو سفيان بن الحارث ، وابنه ، والفضل بن العباس ، وربيعة بن الحارث ، وأسامة بن زيد ، وأيمن بن عبيد ، قتل يومئذ . Those who stood firm with the Messenger : And those who stood firm with him from among the Muhajirin were Abu Bakr and Umar, and from Ahlul Bayt Ali bin Abi Talib and Abbas bin Abdul Muttalib… (v). Tariq Al-Rusool Wal-Mulook of At-Tabari رواية الطبري في كتابه تاريخ الرسل والملوك التي ذكر فيها ثبات سيدنا ابوبكر وعمر وعلي رضي الله عنهما يوم حنين إلا أنه قد بقي مع رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم نفر من المهاجرين والأنصار وأهل بيته. وممن ثبت معه من المهاجرين أبو بكر، عمر، ومن أهل بيته علي بن أبي طالب، والعباس بن عبد المطلب، وأبنه الفضل، وأبو سفيان بن الحارث، At-Tabari narrated in his book Tariq Al-Rusool Wal-Mulook where he mentions the firmness of Abu Bakr, Umar and Ali (may Allah be pleased with them all) on the day of Al-Hunain. There remain with Messenger of Allah (saw) group of Muhajirin and Ansar and from his Ahlul Bait. And among those who stood firm from Al-Muhajirin were Abu Bakr, Umar and from his Ahlul Bayt Ali bin Abi Talib, Abbas bin Abdul Muttalib,… 2 Likes 2 Shares |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by Empiree: 8:15pm On Nov 16, 2015 |
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Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by Demmzy15(m): 11:05am On Nov 17, 2015 |
sino: 1 Like |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by AlBaqir(m): 4:19pm On Nov 17, 2015 |
@ Sino, First Issue # As per the Arabic text and full reference of the hadith I requested for, thanks though you cannot provide the full reference. The Arabic text and its sanad should help in locating and verifying the athar. However, the hadith only talks about Abu Bakr's feat at Badr, not Umar which is the primary discussion of this thread. In sha Allah after investigating the athar, I will make my final remarks on it and other evidences pertaining to Battle of Badr. So watch out. Second Issue: Battle of Uhud # I am happy there is no hiccups about Umar's (and his cohorts) great run away from the battlefield on the day of Uhud. And the fact that Allah forgave these runners and warned them never to repeat such cowardice put the Uhud's issue to rest. Other Battles # Now you've raised serious objections on the following: 1. BATTLE OF KHANDAQ * Your objections were: (i) Did Umar fled? (ii) Did he (Umar) died a Muslim? As per the second question, though it is irrelevant to this topic. All the same, I have answered you once that obviously Umar died a Muslim because there is no even fabricated athar that he renounced the Shahadat. What we question is his being a true believer (Mu'min) as Quran says: "The believers (al-Mu'minin) are only those who have believed in Allah and His Messenger, and do not doubt afterwards, and they do Jihad with their wealth and with their lives, fir the cause of Allah. They are the truthful ones." {surah al-Hujurat:15} Incidentally this Ayah was revealed after the treaty of al- Hudaybiyah and here's is an account of Umar's doubt: # Imam Ibn Hibban (d. 354H): Narrated from Miswar Ibn Mekhrama and Marwan who both said: "...Umar said: by God, I had never doubted since I embraced Islam except on that day [at Hudaybiyyah], so I went to the Messenger of Allah (saw) and said: 'Aren't you truly the Apostle of Allah?' The Prophet said, 'Yes, indeed!'. I said, 'Isn't our Cause just and the cause of the enemy unjust?' He said, 'Yes.' I said, 'Then why should we be humble in our religion?' He said, 'I am Allah's Apostle and I do not disobey Him, and He is my Helper.' I said, 'Didn't you tell us that we would go to the Ka`ba and perform Tawaf around it?' He said, 'Yes, but did I tell you that we would visit the Ka`ba this year?' I said, 'No.' He said, 'So you will visit it and perform Tawaf around it?'`Umar further said, "I went to Aboo Bakr and said, 'O Abu Bakr! Isn't he truly Allah's Prophet?' He replied, 'Yes.' I said, 'Then why should we be humble in our religion?' He said, 'Indeed, he is Allah's Apostle and he does not disobey his Lord, and He is his Helper... Allamah al-Albani comments: Sahih Sheik al-Arnaut also concur: It is sahih hadith Source: Sahih Ibn Hibban bi Tartib Ibn Balban (Beirut: Muasassat al-Risalah; 2nd edition, 1414H)[annotators: Muhammad Nasir al-Din al-Albani and Shu'ayb al-Arnaut], Vol. 11, Pg. 216, #4872. * Imam Bukhari and Muslim also document this hadith [or its similarities] in their sahihs. # As per the verse ["...and they do jihad with their wealth and with their lives, for the cause of Allah...] Imam Muslim records: Qutaibah Ibn Sa'id - Layth b. Sa'd and Muhammad b. Romh - AlLayth - Abi Zubair - Jabir who said: We were one thousand and four hundred on the Day of Hudaybiyah. We paid allegiance to him (the Prophet) and 'Umar was holding the latter's hand (when he was sitting) under the tree (called) Samura (to administer the oath to the companions). He said: We took oath to the effect that we would not flee, but we did not take oath to death. {Sahih Muslim vol.2, p.#900} Obviously all the ahadith of his merits can never stand the test of scrutiny as there are other ahadith (about him) that contradict those merits. So he died a Muslim. |
Re: Umar Ibn Al-khattab: His Contributions In The Battles Of Islam by AlBaqir(m): 4:31pm On Nov 17, 2015 |
# As per the first question: Did Umar fled [at the battle of Khandaq]? I never claimed he fled at Khandaq rather my claim was he (and his cohorts) hide himself in an unknown garden vicinity. Imam Ahmad documents: Abd Allah (b. Ahmad) - my father (Ahmad b. Hanbal) - Yazid - Muhammad b. Amr - his father - his grandfather 'Alqamah b. Waqqas - Umm al-Mu'minin Aisha: I went out on the day of al-Khandaq and stood behind the people. So, I heard footsteps coming from behind me. I turned around and saw Sa'd b. Mu'adh, and his nephew al-Harith b. Aws was carrying his armour....Sa'd passed by, singing a battle song.... Then I stood up and entered a garden. There was a small group of Muslims there, and Umar b. al-Khattab was amongst them and there was another man who was wearing a mask. 'Umar said: "What brought you here? I swear by my life and I swear by Allah, you are a reckless woman! What assures you against the occurrence of a disaster or capture?" He kept blaming me so much until I wished that the earth would split open for me so that I could enter into it. Then the (masked) man removed the mask from his face, and he was Talhah b. Ubayd Allah. So he said, "Woe to you, O Umar! You have said too much today! And where is the writhing movement or the flight except to Allah the Almighty?" REF: {Musnad (Cairo: Muasassat Qurtubah) [annotator: Shuaib al-Arnaut], vol.6, p.141, #25140} # Allamah al-Albani has copied the exact same narration in his Sahihah and states: Imam Ahmad (6/141-142) recorded it from Muhammad b. Amr - his father - Alqamah b. Waqqas - Aisha... I(Al-Albani) say: This chain is Hasan. Al-Haythami said in Majma al-Zawaid (6/128): "Ahmad recorded it and in the chain is Muhammad b. Amr b. Alqamah, and his hadith is Hasan, and the other narrators in the chain are trustworthy". Al-Hafiz also said in al-Fath (11/43): "And its chain is Hasan" {Silsilah al-Ahadith al-Sahihah (Riyadh: Maktabah al-Ma'arifah; 1st edition, 1415H), vol.1, p.143-145,#67} NB: The Arabic text as per your request - see attached pixes from Musnad Ahmad to Sahih Ibn Hibban. The question is: What was 'Umar and his fellow colleagues doing in a garden, hidden from view, while the Messenger of Allah and other Sahabah were actively in battle against the allied forces of the pagans? The people, as testified by Umm al-Mu'minin Aishah were at the warfront. She was standing behind the fighting soldiers. So, Umar and his small band were completely away from the front, at the back of everyone else. Was it a tactical land ambush by them? But, that was not possible! Firstly, it was a trench war. If anything, 'Umar and his colleagues should be standing with the Prophet at the front - by the trench - preventing the enemies of Allah from successfully crossing over. Secondly, the messenger did not permit any Sahabi to leave his presence, as reported by the Quran about the battle of Khandaq: "And when a party of them said: O people of Yasrib! there is no place to stand for you (here), therefore go back; and a party of them asked permission of the prophet, saying. Surely our houses are exposed; and they were not exposed; they only desired to fly away. And if an entry were made upon them from the outlying parts of it, then they were asked to wage war, they would certainly have done it, and they would not have stayed in it but a little while. And certainly they had made a covenant with Allah before, that) they would not turn (their) backs; and Allah's covenant shall be inquired of. Say: Flight shall not do you any good if you fly from death or slaughter, and in that case you will not be allowed to enjoy yourselves but a little. {surah Ahzab:13-16} The verses confirm that the enemy never breached the boarders of Madinah. They further established that the homes of the people of the city were safe. Of course, it was the battle of the Trench (Khandaq). All the fighting was supposed to be done at the trench, not within the boundaries of Madinah. Lastly, there is ZERO evidence of any deployment of anyone by the Prophet, during the battle, to mount any ambush in any garden in the city. As such, the presence of Umar and his colleagues in a safe garden had absolutely no military value or legitimacy. Moreover, one of them was masking his face to conceal his identity.
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