A40:
I personally don't care if a woman I'm marrying was chaste before we met. It will not make her a better wife or mother

Actually, unless she has had a a total change of mindset & heart, it almost certainly will.


Per the ongoing theme about older women schooling younger ones you are discussing with Timbuktou; outside of close-knit blood/familial relationships, it simply won't work.

Women are generally too competitive. Competing for - the best – men, and status. And most have an almost embedded sense of where they are placed and the implacable desire to one-upwomanship” others. It’s women who shame the most, and generally disparage others for their looks bodies etc.

It even works in reverse; not only will they try to out-compete, the will work assiduously to pull others down to their level or status. A woman divorces, she will campaign for divorce, she’s a single mum, will describe single-mums as hot cakes. If she sleeps around, she will sell it as freedom/liberating. If she’s ina bad marriage , she will proffer advice likely to harm or crash others.

And they rarely admit mistakes, either rationalising them as good/learning experiences, outright lying to themselves and everyone else, or placing blame elsewhere if it’s undeniable.

T'was ever thus.


TV

TV01:

I thought your mantra was a persons first responsibility is to make themselves happy? On that basis, if "bleeping girls" - before they marry another girl - makes them happy, your pronouncement here is contradictory.

I am not the one propagating chastity here.

And nice shaming effort, but it never works against confident men. E get as e be !


TV

I wouldn't shame people for having s.ex. On the contrary! I would rather congratulate them for having fun. I was just suggesting a solution for those concerned with moral decadence. I am not one of them.

TV01 as we know him. Always trying to shame women but not the ones who, according to him, should be in power and thus carry the responsibility in the first place.

Mindfulness:


I am not the one propagating chastity here.

Exactly, why castigate what you yourself propagate? Selfish interest first, making oneself happy as a prime directive and self love. If bleeping girls gives them "the feeling", what's your beef?

Even if they demur to marry the very same girls they bleeped, or outright disparage them? Surely all the girls have to do is "heal" and become "emotionally healthy", no other fallout right?

You sound undeniably pained !


TV

^{Tell us Mindfulness, if you subscribe to sex before marriage, what specific age or point should it be allowed?}

Mindfulness:
TV01 as we know him. Always trying to shame women but not the ones who, according to him, should be in power and thus carry the responsibility in the first place.

Me shame? Shaming is a womans job !

I exhort men to wield their authority equitably and effectively, and to take ownership and responsibility for their actions. Feminists want the authority of men without the resposibility and sacrifice. Fine, have your unfettered liberty and sexual freedom, but don't come whining when it explodes in your face - y'all can't handle it


TV

TV01:

Exactly, why castigate what you yourself propagate? Selfish interest first, making oneself happy as a prime directive and self love. If bleeping girls gives them "the feeling", what's your beef?

Even if they demur to marry the very same girls they bleeped, or outright disparage them? Surely all the girls have to do is "heal" and become "emotionally healthy", no other fallout right?

You sound undeniably pained !


TV

^{Tell us Mindfulness, if you subscribe to sex before marriage, what specific age or point should it be allowed?}

Who told you I castigate anyone? I am not against premarital sex, never have been and never will be.

Those who have a problem with premarital s.ex should abstain. Problem solved. You don't have to wait for others to solve your problems. Life can be so simple.


It is not for you or me to decide when it should be allowed.

TV01:

Me shame? Shaming is a womans job !

I exhort men to wield their authority equitably and effectively, and to take ownership and responsibility for their actions. Feminists want the authority of men without the resposibility and sacrifice. Fine, have your unfettered liberty and sexual freedom, but don't come whining when it explodes in your face - y'all can't handle it

TV

I have unfettered liberty and sexual freedom whether you like it or not and I have been enjoying it very much.

I don't need your consent, support or help. I am very fine.

Shame me.

TV01:

Actually, unless she has had a a total change of mindset & heart, it almost certainly will.

I frankly do not see the connection. Its hard to tell me that would make you a better partner, planner and mother just because you happened to be a virgin before marriage. I no believe that one rara

TV01:

Per the ongoing theme about older women schooling younger ones you are discussing with Timbuktou; outside of close-knit blood/familial relationships, it simply won't work.

Women are generally too competitive. Competing for - the best – men, and status. And most have an almost embedded sense of where they are placed and the implacable desire to one-upwomanship” others. It’s women who shame the most, and generally disparage others for their looks bodies etc.

It even works in reverse; not only will they try to out-compete, the will work assiduously to pull others down to their level or status. A woman divorces, she will campaign for divorce, she’s a single mum, will describe single-mums as hot cakes. If she sleeps around, she will sell it as freedom/liberating. If she’s ina bad marriage , she will proffer advice likely to harm or crash others.

And they rarely admit mistakes, either rationalising them as good/learning experiences, outright lying to themselves and everyone else, or placing blame elsewhere if it’s undeniable.

T'was ever thus.
TV

And this is why these things go on unabated. You have hit the nail on the head really. I've read a lot of mostly reactive posts with people mostly treating the symptoms not the disease

Mindfulness:
It is not for you or me to decide when it should be allowed.

So how is your alleging statutory rape in this latest case not hypocritical?


TV

Mindfulness:


I have unfettered liberty and sexual freedom whether you like it or not and I have been enjoying it very much.

I don't need your consent, support or help. I am very fine.

Shame me.

Lol. Don't mind TV, s€x is a basic and primal human need. Everyone should have a choice and deal with the consequences afterwards. Indulging in it or holding body should not define a woman. In the same vein a woman shouldn't knowingly get into relations where that independence is compromised and then hold the man responsible for her actions or inactions

Mindfulness:


Who told you I castigate anyone? I am not against premarital sex, never have been and never will be.

Those who have a problem with premarital s.ex should abstain. Problem solved. You don't have to wait for others to solve your problems. Life can be so simple.


It is not for you or me to decide when it should be allowed.

At bolded, are u advocating no-minimum age before sex

A40:

I frankly do not see the connection. Its hard to tell me that would make you a better partner, planner and mother just because you happened to be a virgin before marriage. I no believe that one rara

It's not merely a moral belief, it's documented fact. Women with anything than 0-2 sexual partners before marriage are more likely to express dissatisfaction with their marriages along a range of indicators - All Things Being Equal. Is she's stretched she'll kvetch !

And there are a whole host of other possible issues, fertility etc, simply making it a much riskier exercise.

ATBE being key; not saying a proud stubborn virgin will be better than a properly reformed "bad girl".


TV

A40:

I agree to an extent in the sense that it would be less of a mistake if they were the ones calling the shots and in control of the situation, however I feel like a lot of them usually wish they made better choices, aimoye awon tan ti je wan lobo jibiti (apologies if you don't understand yoruba) do they genuinely not want the ones behind them to not make the same mistakes that they did and maintain a perceived higher moral ground than them.
I personally don't care if a woman I'm marrying was chaste before we met. It will not make her a better wife or mother

The second part of your post I concur with and believe women should go into a relationship with a level of responsibility, certain things you simply shouldn't accept from any man. You enable him by not finding your square root and turnaround to label men monsters. Smh

See this story for example, why and to what end did she expect a relationship with a 25 year old dude to lead to? Assuming she wanted a chaste relationship what would have been the odds of that happening with someone who probably has 10yrs plus experience of watching mojo and has a list of things he wants to do before he dies. A girl cannot date someone at that point and expect things to end well

I'd rather people shifted focus to the truly vulnerable ones. Not that Suga person

Lol. My Yoruba is good. However, I'm of the opinion that most of those who lost out in the jibiti are grooming their younger ones and daughters to be better players of the game, and by better players I mean sharper opportunists. World events happen simultaneously and at the same time we live our lives. So, when when an unsuspecting female is being scammed, when she could have saved herself for marriage, the sêxual revolution is going telling her it's perfectly ok to carry on on that path. Before you know it she's 21 with a body count of 12. The only kind of advice any of them have is of the opportunistic variety. How to spot the players from the Magas and such; the ones worth giving it up for so you get something when/if it ends.

Per chastity, I used to have that same reasoning but i learned the very hard way that it does matter. We have to look no further than the recent thread where a woman wants to divorce her husband of less than a year because he has idolised her. He's showing her too much love and it's iritated her to the point where she's conemplated divorce. But she's been with other men and he's had no such corresponding experience. The idea is innocence. Now, compare with the woman who's husband complaining her husbnad would rather be everywhere but with her. There's a reason why women never forget their first loves and the men who deflowered them. It's not a myth, there actually is a bond that comes with deflowering and even the act of sex itself; an experience and bond that can only be obliterated by a far far more phenomenal experience such as the one in this Sugabelly saga. I doubt she remembers the day she first had sex. Audu done reformat her harddrive, RAM and OS. Another advantage to having a chaste woman is to avoid harbouring damaged women like this one. I pity the man who ends up paying her bride price. And be under no illusions, it will be paid; by some "enlightened" fool who can see past her past. A past that will even set the tone for their relationship.

This is not to say being chaste confers superior mothering or wifely skills, but it goes a long way in how the woman avails herself in the home or, at least, it used to.

Abeg, pardon my ramblings. It's a really broad subject.

TV01:

Actually, unless she has had a a total change of mindset & heart, it almost certainly will.


Per the ongoing theme about older women schooling younger ones you are discussing with Timbuktou; outside of close-knit blood/familial relationships, it simply won't work.

Women are generally too competitive. Competing for - the best – men, and status. And most have an almost embedded sense of where they are placed and the implacable desire to one-upwomanship” others. It’s women who shame the most, and generally disparage others for their looks bodies etc.

It even works in reverse; not only will they try to out-compete, the will work assiduously to pull others down to their level or status. A woman divorces, she will campaign for divorce, she’s a single mum, will describe single-mums as hot cakes. If she sleeps around, she will sell it as freedom/liberating. If she’s ina bad marriage , she will proffer advice likely to harm or crash others.

And they rarely admit mistakes, either rationalising them as good/learning experiences, outright lying to themselves and everyone else, or placing blame elsewhere if it’s undeniable.

T'was ever thus.


TV

Looool

TV, you are not nice

Mindfulness:
If you guys have a problem with s.ex before marriage, then lead by example and stop blee.ping girls before you marry them. Or were you all virgins before you got married? Moral decadence? I guess you are all innocent.

Women determine who has sex, otherwise it's rapè. If women refuse to have sêx men will not suddenly become gay. Men are having it because you women are giving it up.

A40:

Lol. Don't mind TV, s€x is a basic and primal human need. Everyone should have a choice and deal with the consequences afterwards. Indulging in it or holding body should not define a woman. In the same vein a woman shouldn't knowingly get into relations where that independence is compromised and then hold the man responsible for her actions or inactions

There's a reason people married at younger ages in younger generations. Think of the recent hypocritic public outcry against Emir Sanusi by women who had been having sêx at 13 years old sef. Marriage is a good place to sate that primal need.

Kimoni:


Looool

TV, you are not nice

...neither am I a liar !


TV

TV01:



So how is your alleging statutory rape in this latest case not hypocritical?


TV

By law.

A40:

Lol. Don't mind TV, s€x is a basic and primal human need. Everyone should have a choice and deal with the consequences afterwards. Indulging in it or holding body should not define a woman. In the same vein a woman shouldn't knowingly get into relations where that independence is compromised and then hold the man responsible for her actions or inactions

Of course it is a very natural human need and anyone who wants to shame me for having a lib.ido, can go ahead and do it if it helps them.

I have absolutely no regrets. I have enjoyed myself and I will do as pleases me. It is my body and it is my life and I will have as much fun as possible and more.

TV01:

...neither am I a liar !

TV

but you can be much nicer naa

While I won't dispute the truth in your post, I am not too sure a general statement like that can represent the norm. I think we are way better than that.

Timbuktou:
Women determine who has sex, otherwise it's rapè. If women refuse to have sêx men will not suddenly become gay. Men are having it because you women are giving it up.

Women force men into having s.ex. Men are poor, helpless victims who can't say no. It is all a woman's fault. If not for the women, you wouldn't do it.


Why would a woman refuse to have s.ex?

A40:

Lol. Don't mind TV, s€x is a basic and primal human need.

First, that is simply not true, the human race might not survive without it, but people will !
And it's not for "all of life"; not before puberty, or long after middle-age for most. If it was, we'd have to give it to babies.

There is a best/aspirational setting for sexual congress - that is marriage. Earlier would help.

A40:
Everyone should have a choice and deal with the consequences afterwards.

I have no problem with this at an individual level, but a free-for all at a societal level will not end well.

A40:
Indulging in it or holding body should not define a woman.

No, it won't define a woman, but it will certainly influence her as a wife - every man would take care to be considered about his own wife.

A40:
In the same vein a woman shouldn't knowingly get into relations where that independence is compromised and then hold the man responsible for her actions or inactions

You're having a laugh aren't you? Women are never responsible. They are vulnerable, naive, immature, victims ati be be lo....but never, ever resposible.


TV

TV01:

First, that is simply not true, the human race might not survive without it, but people will !
And it's not for "all of life"; not before puberty, or long after middle-age for most. If it was, we'd have to give it to babies.

There is a best/aspirational setting for sexual congress - that is marriage. Earlier would help.


I have no problem with this at an individual level, but a free-for all at a societal level will not end well.


No, it won't define a woman, but it will certainly influence her as a wife - every man would take care to be considered about his own wife.

You're having a laugh aren't you? Women are never responsible. They are vulnerable, naive, immature, victims ati be be lo....but never, ever resposible.


TV

@bold

Timbuktou has just claimed men are.

Mindfulness:


Of course it is a very natural human need and anyone who wants to shame me for having a lib.ido, can go ahead and do it if it helps them.

I have absolutely no regrets. I have enjoyed myself and I will do as pleases me. It is my body and it is my life and I will have as much fun as possible and more.

...all things are allowed but not all things are profitable...

TV01:

It's not merely a moral belief, it's documented fact. Women with anything than 0-2 sexual partners before marriage are more likely to express dissatisfaction with their marriages along a range of indicators - All Things Being Equal. Is she's stretched she'll kvetch !

And there are a whole host of other possible issues, fertility etc, simply making it a much riskier exercise.

ATBE being key; not saying a proud stubborn virgin will be better than a properly reformed "bad girl".
TV

Documented by whom? Its not an exact science. A lot factors can lead to dissatisfaction in marriage and it goes beyond a woman's chastity before marriage.
There are risks involved I agree but there are a lot of other things that could also mess with your health in today's world anyway

Mindfulness:


By law.

Cop out...baba nla one sef

Who makes the law? Plus, even in countries with different state laws, there is not agreement.

I asked you pointedly what you thought it should be? Please give a straight answer for once.


TV

Kimoni:


...all things are allowed but not all things are profitable...

It is not quite true. Not everything is allowed and what is profitable for me, is for me to decide.

Mindfulness:


Women force men into having s.ex. Men are poor, helpless victims who can't say no. It is all a woman's fault. If not for the women, you wouldn't do it.


Why would a woman refuse to have s.ex?

Men are hunters. Which means they'll crave and solicit sêx till yhe end of time. There's a reason why men initiate the date and propose marriage and not women. It used to be that a man would make plans to marry a woman if he so badly wanted to lay her. Thats hownmuch value sex had. But since the days of sexual liberation, female objectification and sexual commodification, having sex with yous is less valuable than going to the loo. Theres a reason why women were categorised into sluts and angels.

This generation has chosen sluttery. No wahala. Men will treat you appropriately.

Mindfulness:


@bold

Timbuktou has just claimed men are.

I believe Tim stated that women are the gatekeepers, no tthat they could force anyone through.

Integrity or we'll revoke your invite !


TV

TV01:

Cop out...baba nla one sef

Who makes the law? Plus, even in countries with different state laws, there is not agreement.

I asked you pointedly what you thought it should be? Please give a straight answer for once.

TV

There is no straight answer to this question. Everyone matures differently and everyone is ready at a different age.

Kimoni:


but you can be much nicer naa

While I won't dispute the truth in your post, I am not too sure a general statement like that can represent the norm. I think we are way better than that.

I'm not saying it's all, or the norm in the extreme, but there are few women of truly noble character - likewise for men. But I speak as a man to other men. No offence.


TV

TV01:

I believe Tim stated that women are the gatekeepers, no tthat they could force anyone through.

Integrity or we'll revoke your invite !

TV

He wants women to be the gatekeepers because men are not able to abstain without women forcing them to.
In other words, men are unable to take responsibility for the morality they so desire.

Mindfulness:


It is not quite true. Not everything is allowed and what is profitable for me, is for me to decide.

Very true...you are allowed to do anything, we all have that Godgiven freewill right? And how you use it is totally your prerogative. But then every action comes with consequences - good and bad, and often times, we do not determine those consequences, which is why everything might not be profitable on the long run.