malvisguy212:
you said christmas was a pagan festival, right ? Will the early church leader celebrate christmas if it is a pagan ritual ? What evidence do you have that this church leader wanted to incorporate christmas with peganism ? I believe they were only influence with the date setting and not the manner of celebration.

I have said already so many times on this thread that the Church leaders never celebrated Christmas.

They rejected every pagan festival. The early Church leaders were mostly Jews who would never celebrate any pagan festival or even acknowledge it. They only celebrated the feasts of God. Pentecost, Trumpets, Jubilee, Passovers, etc. The people that celebrated Christmas were the catholic church from constatine and these people hunted and persecuted the early church vigorously

Yes, it is scriptural to honour ur dad, mum, nd d elders in ur vicinity. Since it is in ur doctrine, it MUST be scriptural. From my view, u re just a "follow-follow". Meanwhile, Esther must be honoured too cos she prevented d annihilation of d Jews.

linusbnn:



Must it be scriptural to honour some1?. I fear u sha. Honour is given to whom it's due and we studied the life of mary from when she accepted to be the mother of jesus,to the way of the cross and till the death of christ. She deserves our honour and we gave it to her. Even the mother of john the baptist honoured her and her visit to her home.

rev2214:

Yes not ordinary woman, like our Abrvaham, Issac and Jacob.
Yes living being pleading. Maybe you mean intercession.
What we are saying is don't place an idol before you.
I hope you will get more understanding in JESUS name, Amen

I mean intercession when I say plead. The main focus is how to make heaven and enjoy everlasting glory. God help us all. Amen

linusbnn:


The mother of Jesus Christ is Mary.

First and foremost, Mary's motherhood ended the day she died. There is nothing like motherhood in heaven. Only idol worship proclaim such. I have already shown you scriptures where God frowned at such doctrine and worship. Jesus said clearly that in heaven, there is neither male nor female. So the suggestion that Jesus still has a mother is both false and ridiculous

malvisguy212:
@. I agree with everything you said except christmas, the day of christ birth may be unknown, but First, a person who was born on February 29 (leap year) only celebrate his birthday after 4 years, is it sinful to chose another day to celebrate it ? Or if your birthday fall on saturday (saturn) will you celebrate it ? In 1 corinthians 8 paul is saying we should not in anyway aknowlegde this pagan gods exist.

This is where we get is wrong. Jesus only made reference to the remembrance of His death, which is more important than His birth. So, why mark His birth?

linusbnn:


I mean intercession when I say plead. The main focus is how to make heaven and enjoy everlasting glory. God help us all. Amen

Talking about making Heaven. There is only one way an that is through Christ. Mary cannot intercede for to make heaven. So you are even contradicting your belief.

Read John 14:6

That awkward moment when you're reading this comment to find an awkward moment but there isn't any, and still you're reading this comment and you're starting to realise it says nothing important and you just wasted a couple of seconds of your life but you're still reading and you don't even know why. That's awkward... You should give me a like for wasting your time.

This is for those who claim to be celebrating their Christ on same day the Romans celebrate their sun God!

snailspeed:


First, there is nothing like spiritual leaders in Christianity that we are supposed to run to. Those are terms used to create false foundations for false doctrines. Church leaders are administrators, not people who are closer to God more than the rest of us. Many of them might actually be very far from God like we see today and like Jesus acknowledged inthe book of Revelation

Church leaders/administrators are not righteous by their names title or positions. They are just men like everyone one else. They have no special rigtheous status befoe God and God does not regard their prayers more than anyone else. Of course, they have taught you in your denomination to believe otherwise so they can enslave you

Please i'm not enslaved nd my church does not push pple into be enslaved. In james,cannot Remb the chapter say, "is any1 sick,let him visit the priest so oil will be poured on him". I said except otherwise in my last write up, nd it means except you have proves that these religious leaders are not righteous. Please Read James 5:13-18. Thank you.

linusbnn:



I said why should jesus take total possession of mary if he has other brothers?. John 19:27 say "Then he said to his disciple she is your mother and from that time,the disciple (JOHN) took her to live in his house"

This is funny. And how did He do that? On several occasions that Mary came close to Jesus, she was denied. Perhaps the teachers who teach the "honouring of Mary" kept that part from followers of their faith. Jesus never went about with Mary, Joseph's wife each time He preached the Gospel.

Flav:


Talking about making Heaven. There is only one way an that is through Christ. Mary cannot intercede for to make heaven. So you are even contradicting your belief.

Read John 14:6

Bros abeg follow your belief. Mary can intercede for me and my household

The commandment to tithe, or contribute a tenth of one’s belongings, was part of the Law given to the ancient nation of Israel. However, the Bible makes it clear that this Law—including the “commandment to collect tithes”—does not apply to Christians.—Hebrews 7:5, 18; Colossians 2:13, 14.

Rather than giving required tithes and offerings, Jehovah’s Witnesses imitate the early Christians and support their ministry in two ways: by performing their personal ministerial work without pay and by making voluntary donations.

We thus follow the Bible’s direction to Christians: “Let each one do just as he has resolved in his heart, not grudgingly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.”—2 Corinthians 9:7.

Ops you are so on point with special reference to marriage. I have often maintain that we have:
1. Traditional marriage
2. Court marriage
What is called "church marriage" is actually western marriage. Done according to their culture, adopted by African Churches as church marriage.

My question is:
1. Why will the church insist that a couple must do traditional marriage before they can conduct the so called "wedding"?

Well as the traditional and court marriage only operate with your consent without any other reference to any form of marriage?

snailspeed:


First and foremost, Mary's motherhood ended the day she died. There is nothing like motherhood in heaven. Only idol worship proclaim such. I have already shown you scriptures where God frowned at such doctrine and worship. Jesus said clearly that in heaven, there is neither male nor female. So the suggestion that Jesus still has a mother is both false and ridiculous

Ok. Thank you. The bible does not change,it is the same ages past and ages to come. The bible said mary will conceive and bear a son and his name will be Jesus Christ.

linusbnn:



Must it be scriptural to honour some1?. I fear u sha. Honour is given to whom it's due and we studied the life of mary from when she accepted to be the mother of jesus,to the way of the cross and till the death of christ. She deserves our honour and we gave it to her. Even the mother of john the baptist honoured her and her visit to her home.

As far as it's a Biblical figure you worship, other than Christ, you should be able to give us Scriptural backings to prove your points, perhaps cause us to turn and start worshipping it too.

linusbnn:



Ok. Thank you. The bible does not change,it is the same ages past and ages to come. The bible said mary will conceive and bear a son and his name will be Jesus Christ.

So God started or came into being the day Mary gave birth?

thesicilian:
On the issue of tithes, a lot of people might disagree with you as you have already anticipated.
First tithing did not begin with Jacob, it began with Abraham, when he gave tithes to Melchizedek the priest of the Most High. (Genesis 14:20)
And we're somewhat bound to follow the acts of our great patriarch if we are to enjoy his blessings as ''seeds of Abram''

But the new testament views on tithing are issues of continuing research to me, one would think that for such an important issue as tithing (as our pastors make it out to be), the New Testament Bible would be pretty clear on its stand but this is not the case

u just said wat is in my mind....

No Tithing for Christians. At no time were first-century Christians commanded to pay tithes. The primary purpose of the tithing arrangement under the Law had been to support Israel’s temple and priesthood; consequently the obligation to pay tithes would cease when that Mosaic Law covenant came to an end as fulfilled, through Christ’s death on the torture stake. (Eph 2:15; Col 2:13, 14) It is true that Levitical priests continued serving at the temple in Jerusalem until it was destroyed in 70 C.E., but Christians from and after 33 C.E. became part of a new spiritual priesthood that was not supported by tithes.—Ro 6:14; Heb 7:12; 1Pe 2:9.

As Christians, they were encouraged to give support to the Christian ministry both by their own ministerial activity and by material contributions. Instead of giving fixed, specified amounts to defray congregational expenses, they were to contribute “according to what a person has,” giving “as he has resolved in his heart, not grudgingly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.” (2Co 8:12; 9:7) They were encouraged to follow the principle: “Let the older men who preside in a fine way be reckoned worthy of double honor, especially those who work hard in speaking and teaching. For the scripture says: ‘You must not muzzle a bull when it threshes out the grain’; also: ‘The workman is worthy of his wages.’” (1Ti 5:17, 18) However, the apostle Paul set an example in seeking to avoid bringing an undue financial burden on the congregation.—Ac 18:3; 1Th 2:9.

effty:
Yes, it is scriptural to honour ur dad, mum, nd d elders in ur vicinity. Since it is in ur doctrine, it MUST be scriptural. From my view, u re just a "follow-follow". Meanwhile, Esther must be honoured too cos she prevented d annihilation of d Jews.

You are a leader I knw and maybe that is why you see the word HONOUR as a mighty word. Some pple honour Esther becos they see her as a woman of virtue and that is why they will alwz talk of her story.

Sanchez01:

As far as it's a Biblical figure you worship, other than Christ, you should be able to give us Scriptural backings to prove your points, perhaps cause us to turn and start worshipping it too.

My name is Linus and you say it's Philip, maybe you are right. I'm telling you we honour mary and you say we worship her,so you are right. Cheers

linusbnn:


Bros abeg follow your belief. Mary can intercede for me and my household

To go to Heaven? Where is that written in the Bible that Mary will intercede for you to go to heaven.

“You are to conceive in your womb and bear a son, and you must name him Jesus. He will be great and will be called Son of the Most High. . . . And so the child will be holy and will be called Son of God.”—Italics ours; Luke 1:31-35, The New Jerusalem Bible.

That passage of Scripture clearly states that Mary was the mother of the “Son of God,” not of God himself. Could she have carried within her the One whom ‘the heavens themselves cannot contain’? (1 Kings 8:27) She never made such a claim. It is the teaching about the Trinity that has sown confusion over the identity of Mary. By proclaiming her Theotokos (a Greek word meaning “God-bearer”), or “Mother of God,” the Council of Ephesus, in 431 C.E., set the stage for Mary worship. The city of Ephesus where this church council was held had for centuries been at the heart of idol worship celebrating the fertility goddess Artemis.

So it was that many aspects of the worship of the image of Artemis that “fell from heaven,” such as processions, were integrated into Mary worship. (Acts 19:35) Another practice that crept into Christian teaching was the use of images of Mary and others in worship.

Compare these Bible verses: Matthew 13:53-56; Mark 3:31-35; Luke 11:27, 28

linusbnn:



Please i'm not enslaved nd my church does not push pple into be enslaved. In james,cannot Remb the chapter say, "is any1 sick,let him visit the priest so oil will be poured on him". I said except otherwise in my last write up, nd it means except you have proves that these religious leaders are not righteous. Please Read James 5:13-18. Thank you.

James 5:14King James Version (KJV)

14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:

First he said elders of the church, not priest or pastor. Notice he said elders not elder? So he wasnt referring to one person. He was referring to a group of people who he later described as those who have learnt the scriptures and grown and therefore had better understanding. He wasnt talking about someone who was given a certificate by a seminary.

Secondly, where did he say that the elders of the church are more special or their prayers were more answerable than prayers from others? Jesus said to us to ask and ye shall receive. All through scriptures, we are told to ask, not tell someone to ask for us. But then, if you belong to a local congregation, there is nothing wrong for your fellow brethren or local leaders to come together to pray for you or with you. Jesus clearly told us that where two or three of us are gathered, he His there. He also told us that if two of you shall agree concerning anything, it shall be done for you. This has nothing to do with some men being special before God.

James said clearly that "the prayer of faith shall heal the sick" He didnt say the prayer of the priest or pastor but the prayer of faith

Should You Pray to the Virgin Mary?
MARY is a familiar figure to most people who know anything about Christianity. The Scriptures relate that Almighty God particularly blessed this young woman by choosing her to be the mother of Jesus. Jesus’ birth was unique in that Mary was a virgin when she conceived him. Certain churches of Christendom have long reserved a special veneration for Mary. In 431 C.E., the Council of Ephesus proclaimed her “Mother of God,” and today many people are taught to pray to her.*

Sincere worshippers know that they must address their prayers to the right person. What does the Bible teach in this regard? Should Christians pray to the Virgin Mary?

“Teach Us How to Pray”

The Gospel account of Luke records that one of Jesus’ disciples requested of him: “Lord, teach us how to pray.” In response, Jesus began: “Whenever you pray, say, ‘Father, let your name be sanctified.’” During his Sermon on the Mount, Jesus likewise instructed his followers to pray: “Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified.”—Luke 11:1, 2; Matthew 6:9.

The first thing we learn, then, is that prayer, or worshipful address, should be directed to Jesus’ Father, who is Jehovah. Nowhere does the Bible authorize us to pray to anyone else. This is appropriate since, as Moses was told when he received the Ten Commandments, Jehovah is “a God exacting exclusive devotion.”—Exodus 20:5.

What About the Rosary?

Many who pray to Mary have been taught that blessings can be gained by the repetition of set formulas—prayers such as the Hail Mary, Our Father, and others. For Catholics, “the most widespread form of Marian devotion [that is, devotion to Mary] is without doubt the rosary,” says the book Symbols of Catholicism. The rosary is a religious exercise in honor of the Virgin Mary. The term also refers to the string of beads used to count prayers. “Five sets of ten beads, separated by an individual bead,” explains the same book, “are an invitation to fifty recitations of ‘Hail Mary’, five of ‘Our Father’, and five of ‘Glory be to the Father.’” Does God listen with favor to the devout recitation of the rosary?

Again, the instructions that Jesus gave to his disciples provide us with an authoritative answer. “When praying, do not say the same things over and over again, just as the people of the nations do,” he said, “for they imagine they will get a hearing for their use of many words.” (Matthew 6:7) So Jesus specifically told his followers to avoid repeating set formulas in their prayers.

‘But didn’t Jesus teach his disciples to repeat the Our Father, which is part of the rosary?’ someone may ask. It is to be acknowledged that Jesus provided a model prayer, which has come to be known as the Our Father, or the Lord’s Prayer. We should note, however, that he did so immediately after giving the above warning against saying “the same things over and over again.” That Jesus did not intend for the model prayer to be repeated by rote is also evident from differences in his expressions in the two recorded instances in which he taught his disciples to pray. (Matthew 6:9-15; Luke 11:2-4) The ideas Jesus expressed on those occasions were similar, but his words were not the same. This leads us to the conclusion that Jesus was simply providing models or examples of how his followers can pray and of what they can appropriately pray for. Most important, his words indicated who should be the recipient of prayer.

Respect for Mary

The fact that the Scriptures do not teach Christians to pray to Mary in no way implies a lack of respect for the role she played in the outworking of God’s purposes. The blessings that come through her Son will be to the eternal benefit of all obedient mankind. “All generations will pronounce me happy,” Mary herself stated. And her cousin Elizabeth said that Mary was “blessed . . . among women.” Indeed, she was. It was a wonderful privilege for Mary to be chosen to bear the Messiah.—Luke 1:42, 48, 49.

However, Mary is not the only woman whom the Scriptures call blessed. Because of the actions that Jael took for the benefit of the ancient nation of Israel, she too was said to have been “most blessed among women.” (Judges 5:24) Faithful Jael, Mary, and many other godly women mentioned in the Bible are certainly worthy of our imitation—but not of our veneration.

Mary was a faithful follower of Jesus. She was present on various occasions during his earthly ministry and also at his death. After Jesus’ resurrection she was “persisting in prayer” with Jesus’ brothers. This gives us reason to believe that along with them she too was anointed with holy spirit at Pentecost 33 C.E. and thus shared the hope of being part of the bride class that will reign in heaven with Christ.—Matthew 19:28; Acts 1:14; 2:1-4; Revelation 21:2, 9.

None of this, though, authorizes us to pray to Mary. Heartfelt prayer is an essential part of worship, and Christians are encouraged to “persevere in prayer.” (Romans 12:12) However, all such worshipful devotion should be directed to Jehovah alone, through Jesus Christ.—Matthew 4:10; 1 Timothy 2:5.

[Footnote]

The idea that Mary is the mother of God is based on the unscriptural Trinity doctrine, which says that Jesus is God.

History of Christmas customs
Celebrating Jesus’ birthday: “The early Christians did not celebrate [Jesus’] birth because they considered the celebration of anyone’s birth to be a pagan custom.”—The World Book Encyclopedia.
December 25: There is no proof that Jesus was born on that date. Church leaders likely chose this date to coincide with pagan festivals held on or around the winter solstice.
Gift-giving, feasting, partying: The Encyclopedia Americana says: “Saturnalia, a Roman feast celebrated in mid-December, provided the model for many of the merry-making customs of Christmas. From this celebration, for example, were derived the elaborate feasting, the giving of gifts, and the burning of candles.” The Encyclopædia Britannica notes that “all work and business were suspended” during Saturnalia.
Christmas lights: According to The Encyclopedia of Religion, Europeans decorated their homes “with lights and evergreens of all kinds” to celebrate the winter solstice and to combat evil spirits.
Mistletoe, holly: “The Druids ascribed magical properties to the mistletoe in particular. The evergreen holly was worshiped as a promise of the sun’s return.”—The Encyclopedia Americana.
Christmas tree: “Tree worship, common among the pagan Europeans, survived after their conversion to Christianity.” One of the ways in which tree worship survived is in the custom of “placing a Yule tree at an entrance or inside the house in the midwinter holidays.”—Encyclopædia Britannica.

if you have conscience,, do what's good ..sometimes the bible contradicts

Sanchez01:


This is funny. And how did He do that? On several occasions that Mary came close to Jesus, she was denied. Perhaps the teachers who teach the "honouring of Mary" kept that part from followers of their faith. Jesus never went about with Mary, Joseph's wife each time He preached the Gospel.

Why did jesus ask John to take care of mary when he was dieing? Since she had other children,she would have been given to the other children instead. Please bible is not novel

Lateralmaths:


and if we are to tithe as Abraham did, then everyone one should tithe once in a lifetime on spoils of war only.

Hahahahaha... which war?

What Does Santa Claus Have to Do With Jesus and His Birth?

The custom: In many lands, Santa Claus is viewed as the one who brings children gifts.* Children often write to Santa, asking for presents, which, according to tradition, elves help him to make at his North Pole headquarters.

Its roots: According to the popular view, the Santa Claus myth owes its origin to Saint Nicholas, Archbishop of Myra in Asia Minor, now Turkey. “Virtually everything written about St. Nicholas is based on legends,” says The Christmas Encyclopedia. The designation “Santa Claus” may owe its origin to the word Sinterklaas, a corruption of the Dutch terms for “Saint Nicholas.” Historically and Biblically, Santa Claus has nothing in common with Jesus Christ.

What the Bible says: “Now that you have put away falsehood, speak truth each one of you with his neighbor.” Our closest ‘neighbors’ are our family members. (Ephesians 4:25) The Bible also says that we should “love truth,” “speaking the truth in [our] heart.” (Zechariah 8:19; Psalm 15:2) True, telling children that Santa (or the Christ child) is the bearer of presents at Christmas may seem to be innocent fun, but is it right or wise to deceive little children, even if one’s intentions are not bad? Do you not find it ironic that an occasion that is supposedly meant to honor Jesus becomes a time to deceive children?

How Does God View Christmas Gift-Giving and Merrymaking?

The custom: Christmas giving is unusual in that it largely involves an exchange of gifts, and the Christmas season is marked by partying, feasting, and drinking.

Its roots: Ancient Roman Saturnalian festivities began on December 17 and concluded on the 24th, when gifts were exchanged. Homes and streets were noisy with banqueting, heavy drinking, and riotous behavior. The Saturnalia was followed by an event celebrating the first day of January. This was also observed by a festival, usually lasting about three days. The Saturnalia and the first day of January likely formed one festive occasion.

What the Bible says: Joy and generosity characterize true worship. “Be joyful, you righteous ones; and cry out joyfully,” the Bible says. (Psalm 32:11) Such joy is often associated with generosity. (Proverbs 11:25) “There is more happiness in giving than there is in receiving,” said Jesus Christ. (Acts 20:35) He also said: “Practice giving,” or make it a regular part of your life.—Luke 6:38.

Such giving has little in common with ritualized giving or giving that is compelled, perhaps by social custom. Describing the true spirit of generosity, the Bible states: “Each person should give as he has decided for himself; there should be no reluctance, no sense of compulsion; God loves a cheerful giver.” (2 Corinthians 9:7, The New English Bible) Those who heed these excellent Bible principles give because their generous heart impels them to do so, which can be at any time of the year. To be sure, this kind of giving has God’s blessing, and it is never burdensome.

A Counterfeit!

When examined in the light of the Bible, virtually every facet of Christmas is either pagan in origin or a distortion of the Bible accounts. Hence, Christmas customs are Christian in name only. How did this come about? Centuries after the death of Christ, many false teachers arose, just as the Bible had foretold. (2 Timothy 4:3, 4) Those unprincipled men were more interested in making Christianity fashionable to the pagan masses than they were in teaching truth. Hence, they gradually adopted popular pagan religious festivals and labeled them “Christian.”

Such “false teachers,” the Bible warned, “will exploit you with counterfeit words. But as for them, the judgment from of old is not moving slowly, and the destruction of them is not slumbering.” (2 Peter 2:1-3) Jehovah’s Witnesses take those words seriously—as they do the entire Bible, which they view as the written Word of God. (2 Timothy 3:16) Hence, they reject false religious customs or celebrations. Has this stand deprived them of happiness? On the contrary! As we shall now see, they know from experience that Bible truth is liberating!

snailspeed:


James 5:14King James Version (KJV)

14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:

First he said elders of the church, not priest or pastor. Notice he said elders not elder? So he wasnt referring to one person. He was referring to a group of people who he later described as those who have learnt the scriptures and grown and therefore had better understanding. He wasnt talking about someone who was given a certificate by a seminary.

Secondly, where did he say that the elders of the church are more special or their prayers were more answerable than prayers from others? Jesus said to us to ask and ye shall receive. All through scriptures, we are told to ask, not tell someone to ask for us. But then, if you belong to a local congregation, there is nothing wrong for your fellow brethren or local leaders to come together to pray for you or with you. Jesus clearly told us that where two or three of us are gathered, he His there. He also told us that if two of you shall agree concerning anything, it shall be done for you. This has nothing to do with some men being special before God.

James said clearly that "the prayer of faith shall heal the sick" He didnt say the prayer of the priest or pastor but the prayer of faith

Read to the end of that james verse and stop dragging me back

bnovative:


Luke 11:42 - But woe unto you,
Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and
rue and all manner of herbs, and
pass over judgment and the love
of God: these ought ye to have
done, and not to leave the other
undone.

NIV
“Woe to you Pharisees, because you
give God a tenth of your mint, rue and all
other kinds of garden herbs, but you
neglect justice and the love of God. You
should have practiced the latter without
leaving the former undone.
TLB

“But woe to you Pharisees! For though
you are careful to tithe even the smallest
part of your income, you completely
forget about justice and the love of God.
You should tithe, yes, but you should not
leave these other things undone.

A new angle to the argument I must say. But an argument can also be made that Jesus Christ here was talking to the Pharisees (Old Testament), and not his disciples(we Christians).
I think this requires looking into.

paechocs:
if you have conscience,, do what's good ..sometimes the bible contradicts

The bible never contradicts. What contradicts are the doctrines and narratives that have been taught for centuries as truth. If you want to understand the bible, start from Genesis. Understand the laws of God and the place of Israel and the prophecies of Christ. By the time you get to the new testament, you will

1. Realise our its all tied together
2. See the whole process flow
3. Realise that many doctrines today are trash and not founded on scriptures