Jozzy4:


I gave you the RSV to let you realize that not only the NWT translates it as u think. that's the point and UV seen it


1 cor 11:3 is enough to let you know whose translation is correct.


really , the RSV translates Romans 9:5 wrongly but John 1:1 correctly abi ?

your hypocrisy stinks .

you are funny and again your thinking Is like that of a baby. Who used the RSV? Was it not you? I quoted John 1:1 to you in the RSV, which obviously you dont blv and yet you were quick to use the RSV to support your claim, that was the whole idea of me quoting John 1:1 from RSV. So who is the hypocrite here? RSV is wrong in translating that verse. Get it into that thick head of yours.

King James Bible Matt 16:27

For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

Jesus said He shall come as the Son of Man not as the Son of God. What do you understand by as the Son of Man? Here is the difference between Son of man and Son of God. Son of man = Human nature, Son of God= God's Nature. He will come not as God to judge man but as Man to judge mankind so that mankind will not have any excuse when being Judged by his fellow Man. He was born in the lowliest form, born in a place where animals sleep and feed, yes, born in a manger, don't be deceived by the movies, they don't get close to how that place was. It's a nasty place. Our Lord wasn't as handsome as the movies portray Him to be, He was not handsome outwardly, just like Isaiah said in Isaiah 53:2 and Christ was poor. He went through everything that any lowly man would go through, so that at the end no one will have an excuse when He comes to Judge us. He comes not as God to judge us but as Man to judge us.

He shall come In the Glory of His Father. God the Father says I share not my glory with anyone else. Isa 42:8

God is called the King of glory. Ps 24:8-10

Jesus is the Lord of Glory: 1con 2:8

If you still can't understand this then you are in deep confusion.

You keep on mentioning the samething over and over again,

My Father is greater than I: that is because Father is greater than Son in position and that is also because even though He (Jesus) was in the form of God He thought it not robbery to be equal with God....Phil 2:6

The Head of Christ is God: same principle. You lake the understanding when Christ is referred to us God or as Man. If you don't understand this simple logic, you can never understand the mysteries of the Trinity.

johnw74:


1. Lie Lie dolphinheart, you know I gave a link to it, brocab saw it and everyone else too, false jw dolphinheart cannot do anything other than lie.
2. Lie Lie dolphinheart, my post is following yours, go take a look, but you already know that, false jw dolphinheart just cannot help but lie.

I don't care about the rest of your post, I'm only interested in the part where you said god is a two headed god.
If you want to repost your post and my post that answers yours then do it, why you keep asking me, pretending like they don't exist?

false jw dolphinheart has now started page 100, of his preaching false jw lies, and also more lying and denying of what he knows he said
100 pages and no converts, but instead false jw's have shown many by their lies and false accusations etc, that they are indeed not God's people they do a great job here at Nairaland Forums, pity they don't go door to door like that, but that's the wolves in sheep clothing disguise.

You certainly did say God is a two headed god, just because you don't believe God and the Word is God doesn't alter that fact that you said it. And the Bible say's that God and the Word is God, and you can't wriggle out of that and twist things all around like you keep trying to do.
Go have a look at it again, you know where it is, here it is from me again:

Lie Lie dolphinheart said concerning God and the Word:


^^^
and that's a copy and paste from Lie Lie dolphinheart's post, isn't it false jw dolphinheart
(bolding mine for emphasis)



see more lies from the sect that is called jehovahs' witnesses at these sites:

http://jwfacts.com/

https://carm.org/jehovahs-witnesses

http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/jehovahs-witnesses-answered.htm

@ dolphinheart it is clear you said God is a two headed god, why do you deny it? Were you not the same person who wrote that? Or are we to assume dolphinheart is more than one person? You deny one thing which evidently you wrote. Or do we assume you don't really know what you are writing? Shame on you (both).

dolphinheart:

who is that?
Secondly is my statement "Idolatry includes the veneration, love, worship, adoration of an Idol sir, it's just not worship" wrong? I weep for u

it can also be a what!. A false god is a god which Godship is based on falsehood!.

please clarify your statement

nop
the true God is jehovah, the father, the source of all truth.

Joh 17:17Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth

Joh 4:23Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship THE FATHER with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him.

Ex 34:6Jehovah was passing before him and declaring: “Jehovah, Jehovah, a God merciful and compassionate, slow to anger and abundant in loyal love and truth,

Joh 17:3This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

1Jo 5:20But we know that the Son of God has come, and he has given us insight so that we may gain the knowledge of the one who is true. And we are in union with the one who is true, by means of his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and life everlasting.

is Jesus a true God or not
[

s]so why do you now try to differentiate it!
are you now saying that the earth and moons and stars are also called host of heaven?

thank God you now agree that angels are also called hosts of heaven howbeit the long time it took is unnecessary

nop, angels are called host of heaven, now do the isrea lites worship angels?, the answer is no , now are heavenly objects called the host of heaven, the answer is yes, therefore when the scriptures says the isrealities worship All THE HOSTS of heaven, why don't you think it includes the heavenly objects!?, expecially when those heavenly objects are mentioned in that verse!c you look up and see demons? no , you look up and see the heaven and it's hosts!
angels can be worshipped, but are the isrealites worshipping angels? no! so what is all the hosts of heaven that the isrealites worshipped?


nop, did not say that , just pointing you to what God warned the isrealites not to worship, he also pointed to where the things he wanted them not to worship where !
King James Version
De 4:19 And lest thou lift up thine eyes unto heaven, and when thou seest the sun, and the moon, and the stars, even all the host of heaven, shouldest be driven to worship them, and serve them, which the LORD thy God hath divided unto all nations under the whole heaven.
what did Jehovah say they see when they lift their eyes up to heaven? The sun moon and stars and all the host of heaven, if you look up to the heavens , do you not see this things?
Are those things demons? no!

apostle Paul disagrees with you that people who worship objects are not necessarily worshipping demons
I cor 19&20
19. What say I then? That the idol is anything, or that which is offered to idols is is anything?
20. But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifices, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils. Any sacrifice not offered to God is offered to demons and worship of host of heaven is equal to worshipping demons.

it is not good to be categorical , yes most idols are demon influenced either at the point of its creation or later, but not all objects worshipped or venerated are demon influenced.

at bold what do you mean @ coloured green. Paul said all idol worship is demon worship not most.@ coloured purple really? Not all idolatry is demon influenced? May God av mercy on you

and you could not point and quote the difference! typical.
Sir, it's either I swore or did not swear! which one is almost swearing again! are you now trying to accuse me based on probability? wow!
It is you that does not read my post, mostImes you have a premeditated idea about what I said and thus refuse to actually understand what I said. Therefore when you are asked to show evidence when you accuse me of saying something, you are always found wanting, unable to provide such evidence.

you can go and check your previous posts

did you find that order of peter knowing christ before paul in "Peter and Paul"? no , you found it in the other collation of other verses about Peter and Paul. do not say because a name is mentioned before other name means that name came first in relation to what the names are mentioned with.
I gave birth to James and John in my youth, it does not mean that James came before John, it just means that in my youth, I gave birth to both of them,

there is a reason why for example Paul mentioned man before woman. In the bible, there is order God and Christ, man and woman, heaven and earth.

look at scientific statements about the universe, the relationship between the moon, the earth and the sun and stars and other planets, could you think one will be fully created before the other?

you now turn to science for explanation. Do you think science agrees that things that exists were created from nothing?

The same principle can be applied to man and woman, if the scriptures had not explained them in detail, you would not have known which came first.

which principle? Look at it this way if man was not created first the bible could have said woman and man

t]your inability to answer this question shows how wrong your logic is
and the sun and stars are not part of heaven that was created in the beginning?

I refuse to use my logic to rearrange the bible. Read your bible very well, wat day were the sun moon or stars created?
14 And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so. 16 God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. 17 God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth, 18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day.

the isrealites worshipped All THE HOSTS of heaven, did they worship angels?,
yes I've heard about the queen of heaven.

I want to also believe you don't know demons are also angels



[

code]the word morning star, do you know where Jesus called himself such?

solite3, you deliberately removed or refused to respond to this:
1. you deliberately ommited this one , you sad: "is it the father that came to this earth."
I replied:
no, but someone has said Jesus is the father, do you know who said so? I bet you know, but you can't fit mention!

2. well everyone can see you could not respond or explain the scriptures quoted to to the scriptures, I'll just point it to you again:
Joh 17:26 you where afraid to quote and explain these verse, expecially the underlined
solite3, if you are a truth full person, pls explain the verse above!

you could also not respond to this :
did it say god exalted himself,? no!
did it say Jesus exalted himself ? no !
Did that verse imply that that the one who was exalted is same as one doing the exalting? no!
therefore , "God ", reffered to In those verses is not Jesus.!

Isa 52:13 Look! My servant will act with insight. He will be raised up high, He will be elevated and greatly exalted
Ac 2:32, 33

you are a bad person solite3, for this what God wanted with his name :
1Ki 8:60
Eze 36:23
Eze 39:7
[

you can't deny the fact that humans will also bear the title morning star. Can you?

From our conversions so far Jehovah witness are not Christians
They don't really know who they serve
Jesus said that he is the way, the truth and the life and that no man comes to the father but by him.
They don't know that the father was in Christ reconciling the word to him.
Let me tell you Jehovah witnesses that Jesus love you and died for you so that you will not die and go to hell.
There is freedom in Christ,
It is only by accepting Christ into your life that you will have eternal life.
Paul used to kill the Christians thinking he was serving God until he had an encounter with him
Until you know Jesus you have not know the true God.

brocab:
But the Scripture still says ESV Bible {1 John 5:20} And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know Him who is true; and we are in Him who is true; in His Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and everlasting life.
The KJ says this is the true God and eternal life.
NIV says He is the true God and eternal life.
NKJV say's this is the true God and eternal life.

1.)) I'm I contradicting what the scripture said ? no , I'm only explaining the scriptures to you. You have posted those scriptures , yet you refuse to explain it in its entirety
let's see if you can answer these questions(I know you will not, but will give you a chance to prove me wrong)
King James Version
1Jo 5:20And we know that the (1)Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know (2)him that is true, and we are in (3)him that is true, (4)even in (5)his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

now brocab, pls tell us:
1. who is "the son of God" in (1) above, coloured red
2. who is the "him" in (2) above, coloured blue
3. who is the "him" in (3) above , coloured red
4. what do you understand by the underlined "even I his son" in (4)
5. who is the "his " in 5 above , coloured blue.

PLS NOTE IF HE WILL ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS.

2.)) there where verses quoted to you from 1 John chapter 5, you where asked to give your explanations or views on them, but you refused to :

King James Version
1Jo 5:9If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.

King James Version
1Jo 5:11And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

King James Version
1Jo 5:20And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
no wonder you could not quote it from the KJV.

3.)) you where not able to respond to the views of scholars on the grammar:

[b]1. Many Trinitarians (including brocab)claim that the final sentence in the verse, “This is the true God,” refers to Jesus Christ, since the closest noun to “This” is “Jesus Christ.” However, since God and Jesus are both referred to in the first sentence of the verse, the final sentence can refer to either one of them. The word “this,” which begins the last sentence, is houtos, and a study of it will show that the context, not the closest noun or pronoun, must determine to whom “this” is referring. The Bible provides examples of this, and a good one is in Acts 7:18 and 19 ( KJV ):
“Till another king arose, which knew not Joseph. The same ( houtos) dealt subtilly with our kindred…, and evil entreated our fathers, so that they cast out their young children, to the end they might not live.” It is clear from this example that “the same” ( houtos ) cannot refer to Joseph, even though Joseph is the closest noun. It refers to the other king earlier in the verse, even though that evil king is not the closest noun.

If it were true that pronouns always referred to the closest noun, serious theological problems would result. An example is Acts 4:10 and 11:
“Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole. This [houtos ] is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner” ( KJV ). If “This” in the last sentence refers to the closest noun or pronoun, then the man who was healed is actually the stone rejected by the builders that has become the head of the corner, i.e., the Christ. Of course, that is not true.

An even more troublesome example for those not recognizing that the context, not noun and pronoun placement, is the most vital key in determining proper meaning, is 2 John 1:7: “For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist” ( KJV) . The structure of this verse closely parallels the structure of the verse we are studying. If one insists that the final phrase of 1 John 5:20 refers to Jesus because he is the closest associated noun, then that same person is going to be forced by his own logic to insist that Jesus Christ is a deceiver and an antichrist, which of course is absurd. Thus we conclude that, although the last phrase of 1 John 5:20 may refer to Jesus Christ, it can just as easily refer to God, who appears in the phrase “Son of God” and, via the possessive pronoun “his,” in the phrase “ his Son Jesus.” To which of the two it refers must be determined from studying the words in the verse and the remoter context.

And many authoritative scholars do not accept this Trinitarian view. Cambridge University scholar B. F. Westcott wrote: “The most natural reference [of the pronoun houʹtos ] is to the subject not locally nearest but dominant in the mind of the apostle.” Thus, the apostle John had in mind Jesus’ Father.

German theologian Erich Haupt wrote: “It has to be determined whether the [ houʹtos ] of the next proposition refers to the locally and immediately preceding subject . . . or to the more distant antecedent God. . . . A testimony to the one true God seems more in harmony with the final warning against idols than a demonstration of the divinity of Christ.”
[/b]

Neither could you respond to the explanations on the context:

[b]2. Once it is clear that the last sentence in the verse can refer to either Jesus or God, it must be determined which of the two it is describing. The context and remoter context will determine to whom the phrase “true God” applies.
The result of that examination is that the phrase “true God” is used four times in the Bible beside here: 2 Chronicles 15:3; Jeremiah 10:10; John 17:3 and 1 Thessalonians 1:9. In all four of these places, the “true God” refers to the Father and not the Son.

Especially relevant is John 17:3, which is Jesus’ prayer to God. In that prayer, Jesus calls God “the only true God.” These examples are made more powerful by the consideration that 1 John is a late epistle, and thus the readers of the Bible were already used to God being called the “true God.” Add to that the fact that John is the writer of both the Gospel of John and the Epistles of John, and he would be likely to use the phrase the same way. Thus, there is every reason to believe that the “true God” of 1 John 5:20 is the heavenly Father, and there is no precedent for believing that it refers to the Son.

3. From studying the immediate context, we learn that this very verse mentions “him that is true” two times, and both times it refers to the Father. Since the verse twice refers to the Father as “the one who is true,” that is a strong argument that “the true God” in the last part of the verse is the same being.

4. Not all Trinitarians believe that the last sentence in the verse refers to the Son. A study of commentators on the verse will show that a considerable number of Trinitarian scholars say that this phrase refers to the Father. Norton and Farley each give a list of suchscholars. In his commentary on 1 John, Lenski writes that although the official explanation of the Church is to make the sentence refer to the Son:

This exegesis of the church is now called a mistake by a number of commentators who believe in the full deity of Jesus as it is revealed in Scripture but feel convinced that this houtos clause speaks of the Father and not of His Son.[/b]

4.)) you vehemently refuse to see and ex ermine the scriptures quoted to you, which give further explanation on who the true god really is :

[b]King James Version
Joh 17:3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

1Co 8:6 there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him.

Isa 42:8I am Jehovah. That is my name; I give my glory to no one else, Nor my praise to graven images.

Ps 31:5 Into your hand I entrust my spirit. You have redeemed me, O Jehovah, the God of truth.

Lu 23:46 And Jesus called out with a loud voice and said: “Father, into your hands I entrust my spirit.” After he said this, he expired.

Ex 34:6Jehovah was passing before him and declaring: “Jehovah, Jehovah, a God merciful and compassionate, slow to anger and abundant in loyal love and truth,

Tit 1:1,2Paul, a slave of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ according to the faith of God’s chosen ones and the accurate knowledge of the truth that is according to godly devotion
2and is based on a hope of the everlasting life that God, who cannot lie, promised long ago;

Nu 23:19God is not a mere man who tells lies, Nor a son of man who changes his mind. When he says something, will he not do it? When he speaks, will he not carry it out?

King James Version
Joh 17:17Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.(jesus' own words)

King James Version
Joh 7:16Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.(jesus' own words)

ps 36:9 With you is the source of life;
By your light we can see light.

King James Version
Ro 6:23For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
1Jo 2:1, 2My little children, I am writing you these things so that you may not commit a sin. And yet, if anyone does commit a sin, we have a helper with the Father, Jesus Christ, a righteous one.2And he is a propitiatory sacrifice for our sins, yet not for ours only but also for the whole world’s.

Joh 5:26For just as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted also to the Son to have life in himself.
Joh 1:4by means of him was life, and the life was the light of men.

Significantly, the apostle Paul said that God is “the rewarder of those earnestly seeking him.” - Heb 11:6

God rewarded his Son by raising him from the dead, and the Father will give the reward of everlasting life to those who serve Him with all their heart.
King James Version
Ac 26:23That Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.
King James Version
2Co 1:9But we had the sentence of death in ourselves, that we should not trust in ourselves, but in God which raiseth the dead:[/b]

Hence, what conclusion should we come to? That Jehovah, and no one else, is “the true God and life everlasting.” He alone is worthy to receive exclusive worship from those whom he created.— rev 4:11

And how do we receive this eternal life, through Jesus and Jesus only can give us such a gift. {Romans 6:23, John 11:25}
And when does eternal life start, as soon as anyone have faith in Christ {John 3:36, John 5:24 John 6:47}
{ John 17:3} is an important message in this re-guard, as Jesus prays, Now this is eternal life, that they know you, the only true God and Jesus Christ whom you have sent, here Jesus equates "eternal life" and with a knowledge of God and of the Son, Their is no knowledge of God without the Son. {This is where you JW's make that large mistake every time you separate God from the Son}

you yourself has separated the person of Jesus from the person of God, Jesus has told us who the true god is, he said he is the father!. Jesus is not the father, they are different persons!
Read the verse again , it says" this means evaluating life, their gaining knowledge of you , THE ONLY TRUE GOD, and of the one who the true god SENT to earth, Jesus Christ.
This is in harmony with other parts of the scriptures :

[b]Lu 10:25-28Now look! a man versed in the Law stood up to test him and said: “Teacher, what do I need to do to inherit everlasting life?”26He said to him: “What is written in the Law? How do you read?”27In answer he said: “‘You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole strength and with your whole mind’ and ‘your neighbor as yourself.’”28He said to him: “You answered correctly; keep doing this and you will get life.”

1Jo 4:9,10 By this the love of God was revealed in our case, that God sent his only-begotten Son into the world so that we might gain life through him.
10The love is in this respect, not that we have loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as a propitiatory sacrifice for our sins.

Joh 3:16“ For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, so that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.

Ro 5:8But God recommends his own love to us in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Ro 8:32Since he did not even spare his own Son but handed him over for us all, will he not also, along with him, kindly give us all other things?

1Jo 5:11[u]And this is the witness, that God gave us everlasting life, and this life is in his Son.[/u][/b]

brocab, hope you read the verses above, that God give evaluating life through his son does not mean God is his son. The son is able to give evalasting life cus the father granted him authority to do so!.

Joh 5:26For just as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted also to the Son to have life in himself.

Brocab, read the scriptures and understand whO Christ is, and who god is :

Joh 5:20For the Father has affection for the Son and shows him all the things he himself does, and he will show him works greater than these, so that you may marvel.

Joh 5:30I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative. Just as I hear, I judge, and my judgment is righteous because I seek, not my own will, but the will of him who sent me.

Joh 5:37[u]And the Father who sent me[/u] has himself borne witness about me. You have neither heard his voice at any time nor seen his form,

Jehovah sent Jesus, he told Jesus what he is to tell mankind, pls listen to Jesus words brocab, and do not twist it to indirectly formulate your own theory :

De 18:15Jehovah your God will raise up for you from among your brothers a prophet like me. You must listen to him.

De 18:18I will raise up for them from the midst of their brothers a prophet like you, and I will put my words in his mouth, and he will speak to them all that I command him.

[b]Joh 17:8because I have given them the sayings that you gave me, and they have accepted them and have certainly come to know that I came as your representative, and they have believed that you sent me.

do not read only verse 8 alone, pls read the whole chapter of John 17. you will realise where the knowledge Jesus passed to his disciples came from.

And of course this is why you can't get your heads around about them both, they are not separated they are One. God couldn't do anything without His Son, nor the Son could do anything without the Father.

I have shown you why Jesus does not do anything without the father , he is loyal, always seeking to do the fathers will.
They are one, yes, one in unity and purpose, not one person!, same oneness a husband and wife are expected to have, same oneNess Christians are expected to have.

Joh 14:28You heard that I said to you, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would rejoice that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I am.

Mt 24:36“Concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the Son, but only the Father.

1Co 15:28But when all things will have been subjected to him, then the Son himself will also subject himself to the One who subjected all things to him, that God may be all things to everyone.

It doesn't take rocket science to work this out-every scripture that talks about His Father is talking about Him too.

falzzzz

No One is saved without the Christ-no one can go to the Father without Christ.
You JW's always try to separate Christ from His Father, if you believe the only way into heaven is separating Jesus from His Father-good luck with that.

don't get it twisted brocab, Jesus is the way to the father, Jesus is not the father!, you can get to the father through Jesus .
that the father sent Jesus does not mean the father is Jesus!

johnw74:



false jw dolphinheart repeats the same lies and confusion over and over again even though his lies have been adressed more than once.

Jehovah's Witnesses and Mental Health

In 1949 Dr. Pescor found that 8% of his
total examples of jw's were classified as
psychotic. This meams the level of
psychosis among witnesses is about 40
times higher than the rate for the popu-
lation as a whole.

read it here:

on jw mental health:
http://www.jwfacts.com/pdf/jws-mental-illness-john-stedman.pdf#page=1&zoom=auto

1, have you been able to post the full text of my post ? no!
2. have you been able to post the post where you responded to my explanation ? no

johnw74:



Lie Lie dolphinheart, I have never gone away from my true accusation that you called god a two headed God, not once, but you cannot help but lie in every post.


copied and pasted from false dolphinheart's post concerning God and the Word (bold is mine for emphasis)

look ! he has only been able to cut my post to the place where I said " your God is two persons in one, a two headed God!.
notice: he could not post the full text of the post cus it explains those words. He could not post my full posts in that thread cus he could not refute or respond to the scriptures posted there, hence he prefers to cut my post off, refusing to post it in full.

pls everyone , are these two sentences the same

1. you called god a two headed God,(this is his accusation)

2. " your God is two persons in one, a two headed God!."

the answer is No!
therefore johnw74, stop laying false accusation by twisting words, leave the words as they are!

The post, in which he had cut words off and other posts in that thread contain explanations as to the reason and meaning of those words above. He does not want you to see the full text, hence he will not post it!
Secondly , you will notice that he has refused to post his response to my explanation, he claimed he responded to my explanation but the post is nowhere to be found!

zodiakzax:
@ dolphinheart it is clear you said God is a two headed god, why do you deny it? Were you not the same person who wrote that? Or are we to assume dolphinheart is more than one person? You deny one thing which evidently you wrote. Or do we assume you don't really know what you are writing? Shame on you (both).

did I say God is a two headed God ? no
see his quote of my post again and see who I called a two person God!
pls if you are sincere, why don't you ask him to post the full text of my posts on these thread, the explanation and reason why I said those words are there why are you all afraid to post the full text of that post!
Secondly, you did not respond to my last post to you !, pls go back there and let's see your response .

The shame is on you who could not see the difference in the accusation and what I really wrote.
The bigger shame is on you who could not insist he post post the full text where my explanation is ! he is desperately tryING to give his own explanation to my words , but refuse go post my own explanation of my words! and you support that !

dolphinheart:


1, have you been able to post the full text of my post ? no!
2. have you been able to post the post where you responded to my explanation ? no

Lie Lie dolphinheart

I don't care about your full post, just where you called God a two headed god, nothing in your post changes that, if it did you would post your full post again instead of keep asking me to who isn't interisted in it.
And I'm not interisted in posting my posts again, you can copy and post them here if you think it helps you.

You are just trying to squirm out of your calling God a two headed god by all means of lying known to you.


All false jw dolphinheart knows is lies and he keeps repeating them over and over again
because they are all he has.

It is you who is not understanding the scripture-where about's in this scripture is Jesus separated from His Father?
The Father and the Son is the true God and eternal life. They were never separated-they could never do anything on their own accord, without each other. So explain Who was the Lord in the Old Testament, and who was the Lord Jesus in the New Testament.
Explain in the beginning God said Let Us make man in our own image-who was God talking too? And who is Us? And Our own image?
Please explain.
This is your problem, you believe Jesus can't be His Father-nor His Father to be a Spirit being over or in Jesus-you believe the Father and the Son are two separate people-If this is the case-where was the Father standing when Jesus had done all His miracles, Why weren't the Father walking with His Son on all accounts, and why didn't the Father come and talk directly with Jesus when Elijah and Moses had spoken to Him on the mount. Where was His Father then?
Please explain to us where was the Father when Jesus done all His works on Earth-The Mormon's believe God and Jesus are twins, So lets hear it from you, WHAT DO YOU SAY?
It seems you can only understand the natural things the world gives. And you can't understand the Spiritual things God gives.
You may also believe in your own self being, that most bibles has not the true text to the Word Of God, But the bibles don't preach that Jesus is the archangel Michael either, So please inform us viewers what part of the bible where it tells this story, And why add such rubbish to the scriptures when everyone knows God forbids such. The JW's had followed after the Seventh Day Adventist. Or did the Seventh Day Adventist follow after the JW's?

dolphinheart:

1.)) I'm I contradicting what the scripture said ? no , I'm only explaining the scriptures to you. You have posted those scriptures , yet you refuse to explain it in its entirety
let's see if you can answer these questions(I know you will not, but will give you a chance to prove me wrong)
King James Version
1Jo 5:20And we know that the (1)Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know (2)him that is true, and we are in (3)him that is true, (4)even in (5)his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

now brocab, pls tell us:
1. who is "the son of God" in (1) above, coloured red
2. who is the "him" in (2) above, coloured blue
3. who is the "him" in (3) above , coloured red
4. what do you understand by the underlined "even I his son" in (4)
5. who is the "his " in 5 above , coloured blue.

PLS NOTE IF HE WILL ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS.

2.)) there where verses quoted to you from 1 John chapter 5, you where asked to give your explanations or views on them, but you refused to :

King James Version
1Jo 5:9If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.

King James Version
1Jo 5:11And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

King James Version
1Jo 5:20And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
no wonder you could not quote it from the KJV.

3.)) you where not able to respond to the views of scholars on the grammar:

[b]1. Many Trinitarians (including brocab)claim that the final sentence in the verse, “This is the true God,” refers to Jesus Christ, since the closest noun to “This” is “Jesus Christ.” However, since God and Jesus are both referred to in the first sentence of the verse, the final sentence can refer to either one of them. The word “this,” which begins the last sentence, is houtos, and a study of it will show that the context, not the closest noun or pronoun, must determine to whom “this” is referring. The Bible provides examples of this, and a good one is in Acts 7:18 and 19 ( KJV ):
“Till another king arose, which knew not Joseph. The same ( houtos) dealt subtilly with our kindred…, and evil entreated our fathers, so that they cast out their young children, to the end they might not live.” It is clear from this example that “the same” ( houtos ) cannot refer to Joseph, even though Joseph is the closest noun. It refers to the other king earlier in the verse, even though that evil king is not the closest noun.

If it were true that pronouns always referred to the closest noun, serious theological problems would result. An example is Acts 4:10 and 11:
“Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole. This [houtos ] is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner” ( KJV ). If “This” in the last sentence refers to the closest noun or pronoun, then the man who was healed is actually the stone rejected by the builders that has become the head of the corner, i.e., the Christ. Of course, that is not true.

An even more troublesome example for those not recognizing that the context, not noun and pronoun placement, is the most vital key in determining proper meaning, is 2 John 1:7: “For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist” ( KJV) . The structure of this verse closely parallels the structure of the verse we are studying. If one insists that the final phrase of 1 John 5:20 refers to Jesus because he is the closest associated noun, then that same person is going to be forced by his own logic to insist that Jesus Christ is a deceiver and an antichrist, which of course is absurd. Thus we conclude that, although the last phrase of 1 John 5:20 may refer to Jesus Christ, it can just as easily refer to God, who appears in the phrase “Son of God” and, via the possessive pronoun “his,” in the phrase “ his Son Jesus.” To which of the two it refers must be determined from studying the words in the verse and the remoter context.

And many authoritative scholars do not accept this Trinitarian view. Cambridge University scholar B. F. Westcott wrote: “The most natural reference [of the pronoun houʹtos ] is to the subject not locally nearest but dominant in the mind of the apostle.” Thus, the apostle John had in mind Jesus’ Father.

German theologian Erich Haupt wrote: “It has to be determined whether the [ houʹtos ] of the next proposition refers to the locally and immediately preceding subject . . . or to the more distant antecedent God. . . . A testimony to the one true God seems more in harmony with the final warning against idols than a demonstration of the divinity of Christ.”
[/b]

Neither could you respond to the explanations on the context:

[b]2. Once it is clear that the last sentence in the verse can refer to either Jesus or God, it must be determined which of the two it is describing. The context and remoter context will determine to whom the phrase “true God” applies.
The result of that examination is that the phrase “true God” is used four times in the Bible beside here: 2 Chronicles 15:3; Jeremiah 10:10; John 17:3 and 1 Thessalonians 1:9. In all four of these places, the “true God” refers to the Father and not the Son.

Especially relevant is John 17:3, which is Jesus’ prayer to God. In that prayer, Jesus calls God “the only true God.” These examples are made more powerful by the consideration that 1 John is a late epistle, and thus the readers of the Bible were already used to God being called the “true God.” Add to that the fact that John is the writer of both the Gospel of John and the Epistles of John, and he would be likely to use the phrase the same way. Thus, there is every reason to believe that the “true God” of 1 John 5:20 is the heavenly Father, and there is no precedent for believing that it refers to the Son.

3. From studying the immediate context, we learn that this very verse mentions “him that is true” two times, and both times it refers to the Father. Since the verse twice refers to the Father as “the one who is true,” that is a strong argument that “the true God” in the last part of the verse is the same being.

4. Not all Trinitarians believe that the last sentence in the verse refers to the Son. A study of commentators on the verse will show that a considerable number of Trinitarian scholars say that this phrase refers to the Father. Norton and Farley each give a list of suchscholars. In his commentary on 1 John, Lenski writes that although the official explanation of the Church is to make the sentence refer to the Son:

This exegesis of the church is now called a mistake by a number of commentators who believe in the full deity of Jesus as it is revealed in Scripture but feel convinced that this houtos clause speaks of the Father and not of His Son.[/b]

4.)) you vehemently refuse to see and ex ermine the scriptures quoted to you, which give further explanation on who the true god really is :

[b]King James Version
Joh 17:3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

1Co 8:6 there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him.

Isa 42:8I am Jehovah. That is my name; I give my glory to no one else, Nor my praise to graven images.

Ps 31:5 Into your hand I entrust my spirit. You have redeemed me, O Jehovah, the God of truth.

Lu 23:46 And Jesus called out with a loud voice and said: “Father, into your hands I entrust my spirit.” After he said this, he expired.

Ex 34:6Jehovah was passing before him and declaring: “Jehovah, Jehovah, a God merciful and compassionate, slow to anger and abundant in loyal love and truth,

Tit 1:1,2Paul, a slave of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ according to the faith of God’s chosen ones and the accurate knowledge of the truth that is according to godly devotion
2and is based on a hope of the everlasting life that God, who cannot lie, promised long ago;

Nu 23:19God is not a mere man who tells lies, Nor a son of man who changes his mind. When he says something, will he not do it? When he speaks, will he not carry it out?

King James Version
Joh 17:17Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.(jesus' own words)

King James Version
Joh 7:16Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.(jesus' own words)

ps 36:9 With you is the source of life;
By your light we can see light.

King James Version
Ro 6:23For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
1Jo 2:1, 2My little children, I am writing you these things so that you may not commit a sin. And yet, if anyone does commit a sin, we have a helper with the Father, Jesus Christ, a righteous one.2And he is a propitiatory sacrifice for our sins, yet not for ours only but also for the whole world’s.

Joh 5:26For just as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted also to the Son to have life in himself.
Joh 1:4by means of him was life, and the life was the light of men.

Significantly, the apostle Paul said that God is “the rewarder of those earnestly seeking him.” - Heb 11:6

God rewarded his Son by raising him from the dead, and the Father will give the reward of everlasting life to those who serve Him with all their heart.
King James Version
Ac 26:23That Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.
King James Version
2Co 1:9But we had the sentence of death in ourselves, that we should not trust in ourselves, but in God which raiseth the dead:[/b]

Hence, what conclusion should we come to? That Jehovah, and no one else, is “the true God and life everlasting.” He alone is worthy to receive exclusive worship from those whom he created.— rev 4:11


you yourself has separated the person of Jesus from the person of God, Jesus has told us who the true god is, he said he is the father!. Jesus is not the father, they are different persons!
Read the verse again , it says" this means evaluating life, their gaining knowledge of you , THE ONLY TRUE GOD, and of the one who the true god SENT to earth, Jesus Christ.
This is in harmony with other parts of the scriptures :

[b]Lu 10:25-28Now look! a man versed in the Law stood up to test him and said: “Teacher, what do I need to do to inherit everlasting life?”26He said to him: “What is written in the Law? How do you read?”27In answer he said: “‘You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole strength and with your whole mind’ and ‘your neighbor as yourself.’”28He said to him: “You answered correctly; keep doing this and you will get life.”

1Jo 4:9,10 By this the love of God was revealed in our case, that God sent his only-begotten Son into the world so that we might gain life through him.
10The love is in this respect, not that we have loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as a propitiatory sacrifice for our sins.

Joh 3:16“ For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, so that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.

Ro 5:8But God recommends his own love to us in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Ro 8:32Since he did not even spare his own Son but handed him over for us all, will he not also, along with him, kindly give us all other things?

1Jo 5:11[u]And this is the witness, that God gave us everlasting life, and this life is in his Son.[/u][/b]

brocab, hope you read the verses above, that God give evaluating life through his son does not mean God is his son. The son is able to give evalasting life cus the father granted him authority to do so!.

Joh 5:26For just as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted also to the Son to have life in himself.

Brocab, read the scriptures and understand whO Christ is, and who god is :

Joh 5:20For the Father has affection for the Son and shows him all the things he himself does, and he will show him works greater than these, so that you may marvel.

Joh 5:30I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative. Just as I hear, I judge, and my judgment is righteous because I seek, not my own will, but the will of him who sent me.

Joh 5:37[u]And the Father who sent me[/u] has himself borne witness about me. You have neither heard his voice at any time nor seen his form,

Jehovah sent Jesus, he told Jesus what he is to tell mankind, pls listen to Jesus words brocab, and do not twist it to indirectly formulate your own theory :

De 18:15Jehovah your God will raise up for you from among your brothers a prophet like me. You must listen to him.

De 18:18I will raise up for them from the midst of their brothers a prophet like you, and I will put my words in his mouth, and he will speak to them all that I command him.

[b]Joh 17:8because I have given them the sayings that you gave me, and they have accepted them and have certainly come to know that I came as your representative, and they have believed that you sent me.

do not read only verse 8 alone, pls read the whole chapter of John 17. you will realise where the knowledge Jesus passed to his disciples came from.


I have shown you why Jesus does not do anything without the father , he is loyal, always seeking to do the fathers will.
They are one, yes, one in unity and purpose, not one person!, same oneness a husband and wife are expected to have, same oneNess Christians are expected to have.

Joh 14:28You heard that I said to you, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would rejoice that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I am.

Mt 24:36“Concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the Son, but only the Father.

1Co 15:28But when all things will have been subjected to him, then the Son himself will also subject himself to the One who subjected all things to him, that God may be all things to everyone.


falzzzz


don't get it twisted brocab, Jesus is the way to the father, Jesus is not the father!, you can get to the father through Jesus .
that the father sent Jesus does not mean the father is Jesus!

dolphinheart:


look ! he has only been able to cut my post to the place where I said " your God is two persons in one, a two headed God!.
notice: he could not post the full text of the post cus it explains those words. He could not post my full posts in that thread cus he could not refute or respond to the scriptures posted there, hence he prefers to cut my post off, refusing to post it in full.

pls everyone , are these two sentences the same

1. you called god a two headed God,(this is his accusation)

2. " your God is two persons in one, a two headed God!."

the answer is No!
therefore johnw74, stop laying false accusation by twisting words, leave the words as they are!

The post, in which he had cut words off and other posts in that thread contain explanations as to the reason and meaning of those words above. He does not want you to see the full text, hence he will not post it!
Secondly , you will notice that he has refused to post his response to my explanation, he claimed he responded to my explanation but the post is nowhere to be found!

Of course the same Lie Lies all over again from phony dolphinheart, at least now he is admitting that he said:
God is two persons in one!, a two headed God!.


And now he will start more lying - twisting to say he meant something else.


false jw dolphinheart keeps saying I never responded to his post, as if that matters, but I did.

where blaspheming dolphinheart said:
God is two persons in one!, a two headed God!.

I replied:

Of course dolphinheart is such a perverter of the truth, that he called the Christian God:
your God is two persons in one!, a two headed God

and again to your confused post I replied:

What absolute garbage and confusion fake jw talks.

and I did say you might not like my replies, but I did reply,
and yet false jw dolphinheart who loves to lie and twist and use all means of lying known,
keeps saying I did not reply to his explanation.
Truly, saying "What absolute garbage and confusion" is the best possible reply to your confused and blaspheming post.

Lie Lie dolphinheart

dolphinheart:


did I say God is a two headed God ? no
see his quote of my post again and see who I called a two person God!
pls if you are sincere, why don't you ask him to post the full text of my posts on these thread, the explanation and reason why I said those words are there why are you all afraid to post the full text of that post!
Secondly, you did not respond to my last post to you !, pls go back there and let's see your response .

The shame is on you who could not see the difference in the accusation and what I really wrote.
The bigger shame is on you who could not insist he post post the full text where my explanation is ! he is desperately tryING to give his own explanation to my words , but refuse go post my own explanation of my words! and you support that !

Lie Lie dolphinheart

zodiakzax knows that God and the Word is God. John 1:1

zodiakzax knows that you were referring to God and the Word when you said:

your God is two persons in one!, a two headed God!.

false jw dolphinheart couldn't tell the truth if his life depended on it
and it does.


Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

God and the Word is God

calling God and the Word "a two headed god"

is calling God "a two headed god"

Lie Lie dolphinheart

dolphinheart:


did I say God is a two headed God ? no
see his quote of my post again and see who I called a two person God!
pls if you are sincere, why don't you ask him to post the full text of my posts on these thread, the explanation and reason why I said those words are there why are you all afraid to post the full text of that post!
Secondly, you did not respond to my last post to you !, pls go back there and let's see your response .

The shame is on you who could not see the difference in the accusation and what I really wrote.
The bigger shame is on you who could not insist he post post the full text where my explanation is ! he is desperately tryING to give his own explanation to my words , but refuse go post my own explanation of my words! and you support that !

@bold, Ha ha, no end to phony jw dolphinheart lies, your words need no explanation,
concerning God and the Word Lie Lie said:

your God is two persons in one!, a two headed God!.

Lie Lie is the desperate one trying for post after post, page after page, day after day, to show that you didn't say what you said.


poor false jw dolphinheart, no one believes his much repeated lies

@red, Yes you did say, God is a two headed god, here it is again what Lie Lie dolphinheart said concerning God and the Word:

your God is two persons in one!, a two headed God!.

@blue, deceiving jw dolphinheart is now trying to change his claim from:

a "two headed god" to a "two person god", what a Lie Lie he is,
just another example of his twisting and squirming.

zodiakzax:
you are funny and again your thinking Is like that of a baby.
Who used the RSV? Was it not you?

Yes, to point out the silly part of your post accusing only the NWT of translating Romans 9:5 differently, whereas RSV and many others follow the NWT rendering.

[s] I quoted John 1:1 to you in the RSV, which obviously you dont blv and yet you were quick to use the RSV to support your claim, that was the whole idea of me quoting John 1:1 from RSV. So who is the hypocrite here? [/s]

this is out of the jurisdiction of this discussion. my reason for quoting u is to show u the fallacy of thinking only the NWT render Romans 9:5 differently

RSV is wrong in translating that verse. Get it into that thick head of yours.

lol, they are wrong but yours is right. oga , if Jesus is God OVER ALL , ALL , why is he then still subjected to his God ?

solite3:
please clarify your statement

PLUS PLS PLUS, SO LITE, I BEGGING YOU! DO NOT ADD TO MY WORDS WHEN QUOTING ME, DO NOT CHANGE MY WORDS WHEN QUOTING ME!.

you guys(though I still feel I talking to the same person using different monikers)have adopted the method of altering my words, pls stop it!
my words where : "Secondly is my statement "Idolatry includes the veneration, love, worship, adoration of an Idol sir, it's just not worship" wrong?"
these question YOU REFUSED TO ANSWER!, only for you to add to it and ask me to clarify it !
A false god is a god whose Godship is based on falsehood, there is no better way to clarify it!

is Jesus a true God or not

I've answered that question several times sir!

I do hope you agree with my statement and the underlined part ofor the scriptures I quoted, or do you have a contrary view?

" the true God is jehovah, the father, the source of all truth.
Joh 17:17Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth

Joh 4:23 Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship THE FATHER with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him.

Ex 34:6Jehovah was passing before him and declaring: “Jehovah, Jehovah, a God merciful and compassionate, slow to anger and abundant in loyal love and truth,

Joh 17:3This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

1Jo 5:20But we know that the Son of God has come, and he has given us insight so that we may gain the knowledge of the one who is true. And we are in union with the one who is true, by means of his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and life everlasting.

I have used the scriptures to identify the true god for you , do you accept my identification?

[ thank God you now agree that angels are also called hosts of heaven howbeit the long time it took is unnecessary

could you show one instance where I disagreed? or said no?

you earlier said :
" what I meant was that I never told you that moon, the stars and the sun are not hosts of heaven but that angels and demons are called hosts of heaven
I asked you: "are you now saying that the earth and moons and stars are also called host of heaven?"
this question YOU REFUSED to answer!

If these heavenly objects are called host of heaven why do you now strive to differenciate them when the scriptures mentioned some of these heavenly object alongside host of heaven.
King James Version
De 4:19And lest thou lift up thine eyes unto heaven,[u] and when thou seest [u]the sun, and the moon, and the stars, even all the host of heaven, shouldest be driven to worship them, and serve them, which the LORD thy God hath divided unto all nations under the whole heaven.

I've raised up some issues about this verse but you refused to respond
1.are the sun moon and stars in the heavens
2. are demons in the heavens
3. what had the Lord divided unto all the nation's under the whole heaven , the heavenly objects or the demons?

apostle Paul disagrees with you that people who worship objects are not necessarily worshipping demons
I cor 19&20
19. What say I then? That the idol is anything, or that which is offered to idols is is anything?
20. But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifices, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils. Any sacrifice not offered to God is offered to demons and worship of host of heaven is equal to worshipping demons.

first you should have told us the chapter , abi you no want make we read am ourselves?
Did you see Pauls answer to his question ? I'll read the question and answer out from some translations

[b]NIV
Do I mean then that food sacrificed to an idol is anything, or that an idol is anything? NO

New Living Translation
What am I trying to say? Am I saying that food offered to idols has some significance, or that idols are real gods? no

English Standard Version
What do I imply then? That food offered to idols is anything, or that an idol is anything? no

Berean Study Bible
Am I suggesting, then, that food sacrificed to an idol is anything, or that an idol is anything? no

New American Standard Bible
What do I mean then? That a thing sacrificed to idols is anything, or that an idol is anything? no

Holman Christian Standard Bible
What am I saying then? That food offered to idols is anything, or that an idol is anything? no

NET Bible
Am I saying that idols or food sacrificed to them amount to anything? no

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
What therefore do I say? Is an idol anything, or is the sacrifice of an idol anything? No!

New American Standard 1977
What do I mean then? That a thing sacrificed to idols is anything, or that an idol is anything? no

Weymouth New Testament
Do I mean that a thing sacrificed to an idol is what it claims to be, or that an idol is a real thing? no

Young's Literal Translation
what then do I say? that an idol is anything? or that a sacrifice offered to an idol is anything, no[/b]

Paul now said something about sacrifice, which you are quick to shift to worship.
If I make a picture or carved an image of something and decided to call it my god, it does not necessarily mean that that image represents a particular demon!

at bold what do you mean @ coloured green. Paul said all idol worship is demon worship not most.@ coloured purple really? Not all idolatry is demon influenced? May God av mercy on you[/b]

@ green, I said most idols are demon influenced either at the point of its creation or later!, I can worship an image now, thinking the image is my god, with no reference to any demon. my action is based on my knowledge , though limited.
pls show where paul said " all idol worship is demon worship".
@ purple, yes, some might be to your own wrong understanding of who to worship, or who you worship. Note too that not all objects used in worship is idolatry.

you can go and check your previous posts

you have proven me to be right again
whenever you are asked to show evidence when you accuse me of saying something, you are always found wanting, unable to provide such evidence.

there is a reason why for example Paul mentioned man before woman. In the bible, there is order God and Christ, man and woman, heaven and earth.

in both "god and Jesus", and "man and woman", the order is explained!
do not ascribe such order to heaven and earth when you where not given such explanation.
The scripture say "Paul and barnabas" several times, will you then conclude that Paul came before barnabas? do not conclude when you are not giving details.

you now turn to science for explanation. Do you think science agrees that things that exists were created from nothing?

did I say you should turn to science for explanation ? no , I said you should look at scientific statement about the universe, which ones? The ones that are proven with facts , the ones that talk about the relationship between the moon, the earth and sun and stars and other planets! do you think one will be fully created before the other?

which principle? Look at it this way if man was not created first the bible could have said woman and man

let's not deal in probability, the scriptures told us in detail who came first!

I refuse to use my logic to rearrange the bible. Read your bible very well, wat day were the sun moon or stars created?
14 And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so. 16 God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. 17 God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth, 18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day.

Look at the statement again, if you take it the way it is, it means god created the earth before creating the stars right?
Then this order (created by you is wrong)
King James Version
Re 10:6And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:

SO SOLITE, DONT CREATED AN ORDER WHERE YOU ARE NOT TOLD TO DO SO!

Secondly , concerning the sun and moon, pls tell us what the scriptures said happened on the first day!

I want to also believe you don't know demons are*(where) also angels

a simple question was asked , you refused to answer : the isrealites worshipped All THE HOSTS of heaven, did they worship angels?.

[ you can't deny the fact that humans will also bear the title morning star. Can you?

HOPE EVERYONE CAN SEE THAT HE COULD NOT REPLY TO THE PART WHERE I SHOWED HIM THAT HE LIED, I ONLY DID NOT SAY IT, I SHOWED IT WITH FACTS THAT EVERYONE CAN CROSS CHECK. WHAT DID SOLITE3 DO WHEN CONFRONTED WITH SUCH FACTS? HE CHOOSED TO CUT OFF, OMITT, REMOVE, REFUSED TO RESPOND TO SUCH FACTS.

He refused to respond to this too!

1. you deliberately ommited this one , you sad: "is it the father that came to this earth."
I replied:
no, but someone has said Jesus is the father, do you know who said so? I bet you know, but you can't fit mention!
2. well everyone can see you could not respond or explain the scriptures quoted to to the scriptures, I'll just point it to you again:
Joh 17:26 you where afraid to quote and explain these verse, expecially the underlined
solite3, if you are a truth full person, pls explain the verse above!
you could also not respond to this :
did it say god exalted himself,? no!
did it say Jesus exalted himself ? no !
Did that verse imply that that the one who was exalted is same as one doing the exalting? no!
therefore , "God ", reffered to In those verses is not Jesus.!
Isa 52:13 Look! My servant will act with insight. He will be raised up high, He will be elevated and greatly exalted
Ac 2:32, 33
you are a bad person solite3, for this what God wanted with his name :
1Ki 8:60
Eze 36:23
Eze 39:7

Jozzy4:


Yes, to point out the silly part of your post accusing only the NWT of translating Romans 9:5 differently, whereas RSV and many others follow the NWT rendering.



this is out of the jurisdiction of this discussion. my reason for quoting u is to show u the fallacy of thinking only the NWT render Romans 9:5 differently



lol, they are wrong but yours is right. oga , if Jesus is God OVER ALL , ALL , why is he then still subjected to his God ?

King James Bible Matt 16:27

For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

Jesus said He shall come as the Son of Man not as the Son of God. What do you understand by as the Son of Man? Here is the difference between Son of man and Son of God. Son of man = Human nature, Son of God= God's Nature. He will come not as God to judge man but as Man to judge mankind so that mankind will not have any excuse when being Judged by his fellow Man. He was born in the lowliest form, born in a place where animals sleep and feed, yes, born in a manger, don't be deceived by the movies, they don't get close to how that place was. It's a nasty place. Our Lord wasn't as handsome as the movies portray Him to be, He was not handsome outwardly, just like Isaiah said in Isaiah 53:2 and Christ was poor. He went through everything that any lowly man would go through, so that at the end no one will have an excuse when He comes to Judge us. He comes not as God to judge us but as Man to judge us.

He shall come In the Glory of His Father. God the Father says I share not my glory with anyone else. Isa 42:8

God is called the King of glory. Ps 24:8-10

Jesus is the Lord of Glory: 1con 2:8

If you still can't understand this then you are in deep confusion.

You keep on mentioning the samething over and over again,

My Father is greater than I: that is because Father is greater than Son in position and that is also because even though He (Jesus) was in the form of God He thought it not robbery to be equal with God....Phil 2:6

The Head of Christ is God: same principle.

Jesus will be subjected to God Same principle.

You lack the understanding when Christ is referred to us God or as Man. If you don't understand this simple logic, you can never understand the mysteries of the Trinity.

It appears false jw's believe anything Watchtower tells them.


www.nairaland.com/attachments/3905711_watchtowerheadquarters_jpeg570ef97d1b7b48c852acd4fb5bc57063


Find it here:
http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/jehovahs-witnesses-answered.htm

http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/jws.htm

Watchtower claims to be guided by Holy Angels and fallen angel who wants to get back into God's favour.

Watchtower is neither guided by God's Holy Spirit, who they don't believe is God,
nor are they guided by Holy angels, it is very possible though, by their false and non Bibical beliefs,
that they are guided by fallen angels.

Read this part, it is not to long, or read the whole article:

https://books.google.com.au/books?id=wmsdmva7u6kC&pg=PA71&lpg=PA71&dq=angels+come+to+watchtower+headquarters&source=bl&ots=A4YygNOguz&sig=V3ErQTtRgMsU5LO0g9-BDCm8Cpg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiP8PXKtM7NAhXMmpQKHePGBLcQ6AEITzAJ#v=onepage&q=angels%20come%20to%20watchtower%20headquarters&f=false

A snippet from the article:

The JW's systematically distort the Bible to make it fit their
preconceived beliefs....The NWT itself reflects this systematic
distortion in a vast number of texts relating to pratically every
area of Bibical doctrine.

Well done and well said-Isaiah is about Jesus being an out cast to the public-even to His own, don't we all feel this same way when speaking with the JW atheist, they believe we are the outcast of Christianity.
Only if they knew the truth, they would change like it is in a twinkle of an eye-their old self had past away, and the new self had now began.

zodiakzax:


King James Bible Matt 16:27

For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

Jesus said He shall come as the Son of Man not as the Son of God. What do you understand by as the Son of Man? Here is the difference between Son of man and Son of God. Son of man = Human nature, Son of God= God's Nature. He will come not as God to judge man but as Man to judge mankind so that mankind will not have any excuse when being Judged by his fellow Man. He was born in the lowliest form, born in a place where animals sleep and feed, yes, born in a manger, don't be deceived by the movies, they don't get close to how that place was. It's a nasty place. Our Lord wasn't as handsome as the movies portray Him to be, He was not handsome outwardly, just like Isaiah said in Isaiah 53:2 and Christ was poor. He went through everything that any lowly man would go through, so that at the end no one will have an excuse when He comes to Judge us. He comes not as God to judge us but as Man to judge us.

He shall come In the Glory of His Father. God the Father says I share not my glory with anyone else. Isa 42:8

God is called the King of glory. Ps 24:8-10

Jesus is the Lord of Glory: 1con 2:8

If you still can't understand this then you are in deep confusion.

You keep on mentioning the samething over and over again,

My Father is greater than I: that is because Father is greater than Son in position and that is also because even though He (Jesus) was in the form of God He thought it not robbery to be equal with God....Phil 2:6

The Head of Christ is God: same principle.

Jesus will be subjected to God Same principle.

You lack the understanding when Christ is referred to us God or as Man. If you don't understand this simple logic, you can never understand the mysteries of the Trinity.

brocab:
It is you who is not understanding the scripture-where about's in this scripture is Jesus separated from His Father?

the person of jesus is different from the person of the father! , here are just 3 of them

mark 13:32 “Concerning that day or the hour nobody knows, neither the angels in heaven nor the Son, but the Father.

Joh 14:28You heard that I said to you, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would rejoice that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I am.

Joh 20:17Jesus said to her: “Stop clinging to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’”

The Father and the Son is the true God and eternal life.

that's not what jesus told you,
jesus told you that the only true god is the father!

They were never separated-they could never do anything on their own accord,

thats not what the scriptures tell us.

without each other. So explain Who was the Lord in the Old Testament, and who was the Lord Jesus in the New Testament.
Explain in the beginning God said Let Us make man in our own image-who was God talking too? And who is Us? And Our own image?
Please explain.

you need to quote the verses you are referring to in the old and new testament first, then I will explain.
God was not talking to himself , at least that is certain. God was talking to his son, who he used in the creation works

Pr 8:30Then I was beside him as a master worker. I was the one he was especially fond of day by day; I rejoiced before him all the time;

1Co 8:6there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him.

This is your problem, you believe Jesus can't be His Father-nor His Father to be a Spirit being over or in Jesus-you believe the Father and the Son are two separate people-If this is the case-where was the Father standing when Jesus had done all His miracles, Why weren't the Father walking with His Son on all accounts, and why didn't the Father come and talk directly with Jesus when Elijah and Moses had spoken to Him on the mount. Where was His Father then?

the father was in heaven!
Read :
matt 7:21
matt 10: 32
matt 10: 33
matt 12 :50
matt 16 :17
and a whole bunch of other scriptures
Joh 14:12Most truly I say to you, whoever exercises faith in me will also do the works that I do; and he will do works greater than these, because I am going my way to the Father

Mt 6:9“You must pray, then, this way: “‘Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified.

abeg, which elijah and moses came to speak to jesus, are you talking about the vision?

Please explain to us where was the Father when Jesus done all His works on Earth-The Mormon's believe God and Jesus are twins, So lets hear it from you, WHAT DO YOU SAY?
It seems you can only understand the natural things the world gives. And you can't understand the Spiritual things God gives.

I've used the scripture to tell you where the father is!

Now let me ask you , can you explain this scripture ?
Da 7:13“I kept watching in the visions of the night, and look! with the clouds of the heavens, someone like a son of man was coming; and he gained access to the Ancient of Days, and they brought him up close before that One.

You may also believe in your own self being, that most bibles has not the true text to the Word Of God, But the bibles don't preach that Jesus is the archangel Michael either, So please inform us viewers what part of the bible where it tells this story, And why add such rubbish to the scriptures when everyone knows God forbids such. The JW's had followed after the Seventh Day Adventist. Or did the Seventh Day Adventist follow after the JW's?

diversionary tactics again, lets clear the issues on ground first , notice you have deliberately and totally deviated from the issues at hand :

you refused as expected to respond to this:

let's see if you can answer these questions(I know you will not, but will give you a chance to prove me wrong)
King James Version
1Jo 5:20And we know that the (1)Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know (2)him that is true, and we are in (3)him that is true, (4)even in (5)his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

now brocab, pls tell us:
1. who is "the son of God" in (1) above, coloured red
2. who is the "him" in (2) above, coloured blue
3. who is the "him" in (3) above , coloured red
4. what do you understand by the underlined "even I his son" in (4)
5. who is the "his " in 5 above , coloured blue.

PLS NOTE IF HE WILL ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS.

* no need to quote the numerous scriptures you have refused to respond to , even if I quote them to you again, you cannot respond to them!

zodiakzax:


King James Bible Matt 16:27

For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

Jesus said He shall come as the Son of Man not as the Son of God. What do you understand by as the Son of Man? Here is the difference between Son of man and Son of God. Son of man = Human nature, Son of God= God's Nature. He will come not as God to judge man but as Man to judge mankind so that mankind will not have any excuse when being Judged by his fellow Man. He was born in the lowliest form, born in a place where animals sleep and feed, yes, born in a manger, don't be deceived by the movies, they don't get close to how that place was. It's a nasty place. Our Lord wasn't as handsome as the movies portray Him to be, He was not handsome outwardly, just like Isaiah said in Isaiah 53:2 and Christ was poor. He went through everything that any lowly man would go through, so that at the end no one will have an excuse when He comes to Judge us. He comes not as God to judge us but as Man to judge us.

He shall come In the Glory of His Father. God the Father says I share not my glory with anyone else. Isa 42:8

God is called the King of glory. Ps 24:8-10

Jesus is the Lord of Glory: 1con 2:8

If you still can't understand this then you are in deep confusion.

You keep on mentioning the samething over and over again,

My Father is greater than I: that is because Father is greater than Son in position and that is also because even though He (Jesus) was in the form of God He thought it not robbery to be equal with God....Phil 2:6

The Head of Christ is God: same principle.

Jesus will be subjected to God Same principle.

You lack the understanding when Christ is referred to us God or as Man. If you don't understand this simple logic, you can never understand the mysteries of the Trinity.

the bolded truth is a disgrace to your God over all theory. can the God OVER ALL still be subjected ? simple logic is needed here , which u failed excellently

www.nairaland.com/attachments/3910343_jw1_jpege3a2ed0f2bb45accd6823ec61620ed9d


See here:
http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/jws.htm

Yes this scripture can only sound the way it is written, but what your problem is-you just don't see it the way it sounds.
You are to busy trying to separate the Father away from His Son-that you are not seeing the bigger picture what God had said about His Son.
Its the way the scriptures says it-that you are not understanding? {1 John 5:20} Even in His Son Jesus-this is the true God a eternal life.
If I was to see this verse as the world see's this verse-then I would see it the way you can see it, only by separating the Father from the Son.
But because I see it written the way God see's His Son-I can understand the Father when He wrote this verse-He is not separating Himself from His Son-matter of fact He is claiming He and His Son are all in One.
His seed is His Son's seed-both Father and Son are not separable. Even in His Son Jesus Christ-this is the true God and eternal life.
The Father Has just told me-Jesus is the true God just as the Father is the true God.
If I was speaking with the Father {who has a Fathers pride of course} then I can imagine how this would sound, the Fathers would say, My son has come, and has given us an understanding, that we may know Him, that everything My Son say's it's true.
{I would say to myself "wow this dad loves His son} And if I stood their long enough and listened to the Father, Then I would see it, the same as the Father had just told me-even in His Son-He believes He is the true God and eternal life, just like the Father is..
You need to ask yourself dolphinheart do you separate your Father, and separate yourself from your Mother" Or are you still connected with your fathers Seed, and your seed, and your Mothers seed?
Have you ever heard that when two people marry they become one person.{Mark 10:7-8} FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE UNITED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO WILL BECOME ONE FLESH, SO THEY ARE NO-LONGER TWO BUT ONE FLESH.
So does this mean? The Father and His Son are in a marriage type relationship becoming One person. So when the Father see's His Son, He can only see Him in the Likeness of Himself. So it's like looking into a mirror reflecting of each other, that they cannot be separable, even if they could, they can't. So if you believe the Mormons description-then you must believe Jesus and God are one the same.

dolphinheart:

the person of jesus is different from the person of the father! , here are just 3 of them

mark 13:32 “Concerning that day or the hour nobody knows, neither the angels in heaven nor the Son, but the Father.

Joh 14:28You heard that I said to you, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would rejoice that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I am.

Joh 20:17Jesus said to her: “Stop clinging to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’”


that's not what jesus told you,
jesus told you that the only true god is the father!


thats not what the scriptures tell us.


you need to quote the verses you are referring to in the old and new testament first, then I will explain.
God was not talking to himself , at least that is certain. God was talking to his son, who he used in the creation works

Pr 8:30Then I was beside him as a master worker. I was the one he was especially fond of day by day; I rejoiced before him all the time;

1Co 8:6there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him.




the father was in heaven!
Read :
matt 7:21
matt 10: 32
matt 10: 33
matt 12 :50
matt 16 :17
and a whole bunch of other scriptures
Joh 14:12Most truly I say to you, whoever exercises faith in me will also do the works that I do; and he will do works greater than these, because I am going my way to the Father

Mt 6:9“You must pray, then, this way: “‘Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified.

abeg, which elijah and moses came to speak to jesus, are you talking about the vision?


I've used the scripture to tell you where the father is!

Now let me ask you , can you explain this scripture ?
Da 7:13“I kept watching in the visions of the night, and look! with the clouds of the heavens, someone like a son of man was coming; and he gained access to the Ancient of Days, and they brought him up close before that One.



diversionary tactics again, lets clear the issues on ground first , notice you have deliberately and totally deviated from the issues at hand :

you refused as expected to respond to this:

let's see if you can answer these questions(I know you will not, but will give you a chance to prove me wrong)
King James Version
1Jo 5:20And we know that the (1)Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know (2)him that is true, and we are in (3)him that is true, (4)even in (5)his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

now brocab, pls tell us:
1. who is "the son of God" in (1) above, coloured red
2. who is the "him" in (2) above, coloured blue
3. who is the "him" in (3) above , coloured red
4. what do you understand by the underlined "even I his son" in (4)
5. who is the "his " in 5 above , coloured blue.

PLS NOTE IF HE WILL ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS.

* no need to quote the numerous scriptures you have refused to respond to , even if I quote them to you again, you cannot respond to them!

www.nairaland.com/attachments/3914813_humanityofchristdeityclick_jpeg7de7f0f23f16255029328765976913cd
http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/humanity-of-christ.htm

PLUS PLS PLUS, SO LITE, I BEGGING YOU! DO NOT 2 TO MY WORDS WHEN QUOTING ME, DO NOT CHANGE MY WORDS WHEN QUOTING ME!.

you guys(though I still feel I talking to the same person using different monikers)have adopted the method of altering my words, pls stop it!
my words where : "Secondly is my statement "Idolatry includes the veneration, love, worship, adoration of an Idol sir, it's just not worship" wrong?"
these question YOU REFUSED TO ANSWER!, only for you to add to it and ask me to clarify it !
A false god is a god whose Godship is based on falsehood, there is no better way to clarify it!

[/quote] your failure to clarify your point completely exposes your false man made teachings

I've answered that question several times sir!

I knew you would not be able to answer directly so that you don't get burnt

I do hope you agree with my statement and the underlined part ofor the scriptures I quoted, or do you have a contrary view?

" the true God is jehovah, the father, the source of all truth.
Joh 17:17Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth

Joh 4:23 Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship THE FATHER with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him.

Ex 34:6Jehovah was passing before him and declaring: “Jehovah, Jehovah, a God merciful and compassionate, slow to anger and abundant in loyal love and truth,

Joh 17:3This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

1Jo 5:20But we know that the Son of God has come, and he has given us insight so that we may gain the knowledge of the one who is true. And we are in union with the one who is true, by means of his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and life everlasting.

I have used the scriptures to identify the true god for you , do you accept my identification?

stop quoting what you hardly understand.
[

could[s] you show one instance where I disagreed? or said no?

you earlier said :
" what I meant was that I never told you that moon, the stars and the sun are not hosts of heaven but that angels and demons are called hosts of heaven
I asked you: "are you now saying that the earth and moons and stars are also called host of heaven?"
this question YOU REFUSED to answer!

[/s]my point has been clear although you tried to twist it. I showed you that all the gods of the heathen are demons from the bible but you kept on babbling

right]If these heavenly objects are called host of heaven why do you now strive to differenciate them when the scriptures mentioned some of these heavenly object alongside host of heaven.
King James Version
De 4:19And lest thou lift up thine eyes unto heaven,[u] and when thou seest [u]the sun, and the moon, and the stars, even all the host of heaven, shouldest be driven to worship them, and serve them, which the LORD thy God hath divided unto all nations under the whole heaven.[/quote

] moses and Paul made it clear that the gods of heathen are idols which are demons I bet you won' t get it

I've raised up some issues about this verse but you refused to respond
1.are the sun moon and stars in the heavens
2. are demons in the heavens
3. what had the Lord divided unto all the nation's under the whole heaven , the heavenly objects or the demons?

[/quote] I never told you sun moon and stars where demons but they are just a symbol of the hidden things. Idol worshippers make things that represent they worahp not because those things are demons but only a medium to reach the invisible same way the sun moon and stars where worshipped as a medium to the invisible host of heaven ( demons) why demons? because they they incite these things.
Ephesians 3:10
To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in the heavenly places might be know by the church the manifold wisdom of God.
Who are these principalities and powers
Ephesians 6:12
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
I bet your are confused by now.
Demons exists in this physical cosmos as stated here and these are the host of heaven that are divided to the nations I bet you don't know that sun moon and stars are only symbols.

[quote]
first you should have told us the chapter , abi you no want make we read am ourselves?
Did you see Pauls answer to his question ? I'll read the question and answer out from some translations

[b]NIV
Do I mean then that food sacrificed to an idol is anything, or that an idol is anything? NO

New Living Translation
What am I trying to say? Am I saying that food offered to idols has some significance, or that idols are real gods? no

English Standard Version
What do I imply then? That food offered to idols is anything, or that an idol is anything? no

Berean Study Bible
Am I suggesting, then, that food sacrificed to an idol is anything, or that an idol is anything? no

New American Standard Bible
What do I mean then? That a thing sacrificed to idols is anything, or that an idol is anything? no

Holman Christian Standard Bible
What am I saying then? That food offered to idols is anything, or that an idol is anything? no

NET Bible
Am I saying that idols or food sacrificed to them amount to anything? no

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
What therefore do I say? Is an idol anything, or is the sacrifice of an idol anything? No!

New American Standard 1977
What do I mean then? That a thing sacrificed to idols is anything, or that an idol is anything? no

Weymouth New Testament
Do I mean that a thing sacrificed to an idol is what it claims to be, or that an idol is a real thing? no

Young's Literal Translation
what then do I say? that an idol is anything? or that a sacrifice offered to an idol is anything, no[/b]

Paul now said something about sacrifice, which you are quick to shift to worship.
If I make a picture or carved an image of something and decided to call it my god, it does not necessarily mean that that image represents a particular demon!


@ green, I said most idols are demon influenced either at the point of its creation or later!, I can worship an image now, thinking the image is my god, with no reference to any demon. my action is based on my knowledge , though limited.
pls show where paul said " all idol worship is demon worship".

Paul is quite clear that an idol is only a representation of the reality. All idol worshipping is demon worshipping hmm Satan has chained you. If you worship anything apart from God you directly or indirectly worship the devil.

@ purple, yes, some might be to your own wrong understanding of who to worship, or who you worship. Note too that not all objects used in worship is idolatry.

watchtower is really a sodmic cult. Worship can be defined as any action, expression of love show to a particular deity this includes ceremonies. sacrifice to a god is part of worship.

HOPE EVERYONE CAN SEE THAT HE COULD NOT REPLY TO THE PART WHERE I SHOWED HIM THAT HE LIED, I ONLY DID NOT SAY IT, I SHOWED IT WITH FACTS THAT EVERYONE CAN CROSS CHECK. WHAT DID SOLITE3 DO WHEN CONFRONTED WITH SUCH FACTS? HE CHOOSED TO CUT OFF, OMITT, REMOVE, REFUSED TO RESPOND TO SUCH FACTS.

He refused to respond to this too!

1. you deliberately ommited this one , you sad: "is it the father that came to this earth."
I replied:
no, but someone has said Jesus is the father, do you know who said so? I bet you know, but you can't fit mention!
2. well everyone can see you could not respond or explain the scriptures quoted to to the scriptures, I'll just point it to you again:
Joh 17:26 you where afraid to quote and explain these verse, expecially the underlined
solite3, if you are a truth full person, pls explain the verse above!
you could also not respond to this :
did it say god exalted himself,? no!
did it say Jesus exalted himself ? no !
Did that verse imply that that the one who was exalted is same as one doing the exalting? no!
therefore , "God ", reffered to In those verses is not Jesus.!
Isa 52:13 Look! My servant will act with insight. He will be raised up high, He will be elevated and greatly exalted
Ac 2:32, 33
you are a bad person solite3, for this what God wanted with his name :
1Ki 8:60
Eze 36:23
Eze 39:7

john is right in calling you lie lie dolphinsheart.
My point are angels did not exist before heaven
When the bible mention host of heaven in genesis it includes angels
Sun moon and the stars were created on the fourth day( boldly written in the bible) now lie lie dolphins want to use science to discredit it. For your information science rely on fact presented to them by Nature
Science by available evidence says nothing can be made out of nothing but bible says God created all things out of absolutely nothing. So which will you follow.

brocab:
Yes this scripture can only sound the way it is written, but what your problem is-you just don't see it the way it sounds.
You are to busy trying to separate the Father away from His Son-that you are not seeing the bigger picture what God had said about His Son.

WHAT HAS THE FATHER SAID ABOUT HIS SON ? pls read the scriptures below :

Mt 17:5While he was still speaking, look! a bright cloud overshadowed them, and look! a voice out of the cloud said: “This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved. Listen to him.”

Isa 42:1[u]Look! My servant, whom I support! My chosen one, whom I have approved! I have put my spirit in him; He will bring justice to the nations.[/b]

do you remember what the angel told Mary ?
King James Version
Lu 1:32He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:

do you read what the apostle said :
2Pe 1:17, 18For he received from God the Father honor and glory when words such as these were conveyed to him by the magnificent glory: “This is my Son, my beloved, whom I myself have approved.”18Yes, these words we heard coming from heaven while we were with him in the holy mountain.

if God said you should listen to his son, why do you now refuse to do that when he said :
King James Version
Joh 20:17Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

Its the way the scriptures says it-that you are not understanding? {1 John 5:20} Even in His Son Jesus-this is the true God a eternal life.[/quo
If I was to see this verse as the world see's this verse-then I would see it the way you can see it, only by separating the Father from the Son.
But because I see it written the way God see's His Son-I can understand the Father when He wrote this verse-He is not separating Himself from His Son-matter of fact He is claiming He and His Son are all in One.

you will not quote the verse
you will not explain the verse in full
you cannot counter the explanation giving to you
neither can you answer this question being asked a third time :

let's see if you can answer these questions(I know you will not, but will give you a chance to prove me wrong)
King James Version
1Jo 5:20And we know that the (1)[color=red]Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know (2)him that is true, and we are in (3)him that is true, (4)even in (5)his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

now brocab, pls tell us:
1. who is "the son of God" in (1) above, coloured red
2. who is the "him" in (2) above, coloured blue
3. who is the "him" in (3) above , coloured red
4. what do you understand by the underlined "even I his son" in (4)
5. who is the "his " in 5 above , coloured blue.

PLS NOTE IF HE WILL ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS.

His seed is His Son's seed-both Father and Son are not separable. Even in His Son Jesus Christ-this is the true God and eternal life.[/color]

pls use the scriptures to explain the bolded above

The Father Has just told me-Jesus is the true God just as the Father is the true God.

continue!, when Jesus and the scriptures I've identified the true God, when Jesus has told you that only the father is the true god!

If I was speaking with the Father {who has a Fathers pride of course} then I can imagine how this would sound, the Fathers would say, My son has come, and has given us an understanding, that we may know Him, that everything My Son say's it's true.

unfortunately for you, because you refused to read that verse, you did not not understand what John has been saying from verse one.
I quoted some verses from that chapter, you could not read it, talk less of explaining it:

King James Version
1Jo 5:5Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

King James Version
1Jo 5:11And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

King James Version
1Jo 5:20And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

you can continue to follow your man made understandings, I've explained the grammar to you, I've shown you what scholars said. But you will not see it .

{I would say to myself "wow this dad loves His son} And if I stood their long enough and listened to the Father, Then I would see it, the same as the Father had just told me-even in His Son-He believes He is the true God and eternal life, just like the Father is..

can you see how silly your explanation is? Jesus himself has told you that the father is the only true god!

You need to ask yourself dolphinheart do you separate your Father, and separate yourself from your Mother" Or are you still connected with your fathers Seed, and your seed, and your Mothers seed?

is my father his seed? no
I'm my father's seed, does it mean I'm my father? no
me and my brothers and sisters are from the same seed? am I my brother and sister? no
brocab, that I'm connected to my father and mother and siblings, does not mean I'm same person with any or all of them!.
Jesus is a separate person from the most high!

Have you ever heard that when two people marry they become one person.{Mark 10:7-8} FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE UNITED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO WILL BECOME ONE FLESH, SO THEY ARE NO-LONGER TWO BUT ONE FLESH.

YOU CAN LIE ! , the bolded above , where did you see it in the verse you quoted?

So does this mean? The Father and His Son are in a marriage type relationship becoming One person.

no wonder you had to lie about marriage becoming one person, you wanted to use to support the second lie!, where did you read it that the son and father become one person !? brocab, stop creating false statements!

your statement "becoming one person exposes you further, pls tell us, are they two separate persons before becoming one person?

So when the Father see's His Son, He can only see Him in the Likeness of Himself. So it's like looking into a mirror reflecting of each other, that they cannot be separable, even if they could, they can't. So if you believe the Mormons description-then you must believe Jesus and God are one the same.

so when the son sees the father, he sees a mirror reflection of himself too abi? continue!

PLS NOTICE THAT HE HAS STILL REFUSED TO QUOTE AND RESPOND TO CERTAIN SCRIPTURES CUS THEY WILL NOT SUPPORT HIS FALSE, MAN MADE DERIVED, INDIRECT IDEALOGIES!

Now let me ask you , can you explain this scripture ?
Da 7:13“I kept watching in the visions of the night, and look! with the clouds of the heavens, someone like a son of man was coming; and he gained access to the Ancient of Days, and they brought him up close before that One.

Is their anyway dolphinheart you may shorten your pages-it is hard to keep up with all your demands, and everything you seem to rewrite, I have either answered them time and time over-do you actually read the answers?
I don't believe you are one person dolphinheart-is their a Mrs dolphinheart? All is their a Mr? You can't seem to keep up with the times, you write one thing on one page and deny it on the next page. Like the two headed God's you wrote and denied to John74.
Which of course your long pages are starting to bore me, it seems You aren't happy with the scriptures you had found to prove Jesus and His Father are separable, nor are you happy about giving anybody time to answer, I don't see these as so called questions, I see them as demands-Jesus said: by their fruit you will know them; you are quick when replying back, angry and frustrated, throwing in a little abuse towards me and of course my fellow Christians.
Mr dolphinheart, is this the right way to act towards other believers? Sorry Mr dolphinheart-their is nothing you have shared with me-nor had proven any of the truth about Christ.
Always changing the scriptures every time you rewrite or write a new page-doesn't make a difference. You need to come up with a different approach about the scriptures, your way isn't working, your fleshly method of trying to be convincing, really isn't enough to lead us away from the truth.
If you want me to keep up with the times-then it is best to shorten your pages, I haven't got all day trying to read your long and boring documentation. I don't need to write a long list of scriptures to prove to myself who God is to me.
All the bible's-ESPECIALLY the NWT Bible states God and Jesus are One the same, both are not separable, both need each other. But in your case you need the hole bible to prove God and Jesus are separable. Both are the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end-the first and the last. Both claim I was alive, and I was dead, and look I am alive forevermore. If this is classed as being separable, Then who's coming?
The seed theory just blew over you head. I was trying to give you an example, how the seeds work-but of course that was a waste of time, once again.

dolphinheart:

WHAT HAS THE FATHER SAID ABOUT HIS SON ? pls read the scriptures below :

Mt 17:5While he was still speaking, look! a bright cloud overshadowed them, and look! a voice out of the cloud said: “This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved. Listen to him.”

Isa 42:1[u]Look! My servant, whom I support! My chosen one, whom I have approved! I have put my spirit in him; He will bring justice to the nations.[/b]

do you remember what the angel told Mary ?
King James Version
Lu 1:32He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:

do you read what the apostle said :
2Pe 1:17, 18For he received from God the Father honor and glory when words such as these were conveyed to him by the magnificent glory: “This is my Son, my beloved, whom I myself have approved.”18Yes, these words we heard coming from heaven while we were with him in the holy mountain.

if God said you should listen to his son, why do you now refuse to do that when he said :
King James Version
Joh 20:17Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.


you will not quote the verse
you will not explain the verse in full
you cannot counter the explanation giving to you
neither can you answer this question being asked a third time :

let's see if you can answer these questions(I know you will not, but will give you a chance to prove me wrong)
King James Version
1Jo 5:20And we know that the (1)Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know (2)him that is true, and we are in (3)him that is true, (4)even in (5)his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

now brocab, pls tell us:
1. who is "the son of God" in (1) above, coloured red
2. who is the "him" in (2) above, coloured blue
3. who is the "him" in (3) above , coloured red
4. what do you understand by the underlined "even I his son" in (4)
5. who is the "his " in 5 above , coloured blue.

PLS NOTE IF HE WILL ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS.


pls use the scriptures to explain the bolded above


continue!, when Jesus and the scriptures I've identified the true God, when Jesus has told you that only the father is the true god!


unfortunately for you, because you refused to read that verse, you did not not understand what John has been saying from verse one.
I quoted some verses from that chapter, you could not read it, talk less of explaining it:

King James Version
1Jo 5:5Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

King James Version
1Jo 5:11And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

King James Version
1Jo 5:20And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

you can continue to follow your man made understandings, I've explained the grammar to you, I've shown you what scholars said. But you will not see it .


can you see how silly your explanation is? Jesus himself has told you that the father is the only true god!


is my father his seed? no
I'm my father's seed, does it mean I'm my father? no
me and my brothers and sisters are from the same seed? am I my brother and sister? no
brocab, that I'm connected to my father and mother and siblings, does not mean I'm same person with any or all of them!.
Jesus is a separate person from the most high!


YOU CAN LIE ! , the bolded above , where did you see it in the verse you quoted?



no wonder you had to lie about marriage becoming one person, you wanted to use to support the second lie!, where did you read it that the son and father become one person !? brocab, stop creating false statements!

your statement "becoming one person exposes you further, pls tell us, are they two separate persons before becoming one person?


so when the son sees the father, he sees a mirror reflection of himself too abi? continue!

PLS NOTICE THAT HE HAS STILL REFUSED TO QUOTE AND RESPOND TO CERTAIN SCRIPTURES CUS THEY WILL NOT SUPPORT HIS FALSE, MAN MADE DERIVED, INDIRECT IDEALOGIES!

Now let me ask you , can you explain this scripture ?
Da 7:13“I kept watching in the visions of the night, and look! with the clouds of the heavens, someone like a son of man was coming; and he gained access to the Ancient of Days, and they brought him up close before that One.

major466:
Unfortunately Jehovah's witness's core doctrine contradicts the doctrines of the bible.

[quote author=major466 post=39794903]Unfortunately Jehovah's witness's core doctrine contradicts the doctrines of the bible.[/quote

Hello just passing actually I like jehova witness but there z 1 thing that made change feeling about them it occured 1 day one of my fellow collegue in an NGO dat said there Is nothing like hell or heaven though I argue with him over that but we didn't agree on dat since then.pls can u shed more light on dat n y is it so thou I wud like you to chat me up on whatsapp but z ok if you spread the news here thank you

.

majorkosy

majorkosy:
[left][/left]

Good evening, Jehovah's Witnesses believe in hell [ Hebrew Sheol, Greek Hades ] also translated " Grave" in the King James Version ( Eccl 9:10).


and you said they dont belive in heaven, THATS WRONG , yes there is heaven ! the witnesses believe that. Matt 6:9