donjazet:


We have seen these type of scenarios before.
Patrick bamford was the best player in the championship 2/3 seasons ago, he scored about 28 goals but when he was loaned to a premiere league club, what happened
Till now he has been unable to push for a starting berth at Burnley..
So its not about shining in league3.
Its about being able to adapt quickly.

kokaneprodigy:

You really hit the nail on the head.

I've always been reserved when pple dwell on transfers and undermine training and playing with a system that will bring the best out of the players. It's a shame fans and even so called professional pundits/journalists now dwell so much on the former.

United for example has been very active if not the most active when it comes to transfers in the last couple of years yet struggling to play to the satisfaction of its fans.

For a football manager the ability to identify what player works in your system and how to get the best out of what u have is paramount. Ozil if placed in MOU team at Chelsea or the current United will flop cos this is a manager that lays more emphasis on physicality and strong ability to be defensive than some sleek passing ability.

Torres' career hit a very deep trough at Chelsea bt we can all see what he's doing @ atletico, Di Maria under Van Gaal almost looked like an amateur. My point is it's not all abt big names.

What has happened to player development thru trainings and creating a system that works for u. This Hazard y'all keep criticising is one talented player that just needs a system to thrive in.

patrickmuf:
If Conte could get the best out of that Italy team at the Euros, then it is not out of place to be optimistic in Chelsea's case.
I also support the school of thought that he is more of a coach who rather than play, prefers to stop the opponent from playing and for a club like Chelsea, I don't know how much time his past achievements can buy him...

donjazet:


We have seen these type of scenarios before.
Patrick bamford was the best player in the championship 2/3 seasons ago, he scored about 28 goals but when he was loaned to a premiere league club, what happened
Till now he has been unable to push for a starting berth at Burnley..
So its not about shining in league3.
Its about being able to adapt quickly.

Nihilist:


Did Conte really get the best out of that Italy team?
That's debatable.

What's on record though is that unfancied teams, like Wales and Portugal managed by unfancied managers outshone Italy and Conte by a considerable margin.

Ofcourse the tournament format had a part to play in Portugals victory but I don't know if we can be absolutely certain that Conte got the best out of that Italian squad.

Nihilist:


Indeed.

I believe that the best managers create tactics around the players they have, and then fine tune it by adding one or two new players at a time- eg Ferguson, Ancelotti and so on.

We've been hearing that we dont have the players for this formation or that formation, but surely there must be a formation that works for these guys.

What's annoying is that despite Conte's defensive approach, we're still leaking goals like no man's business. If we're not going to keep clean sheets anyway, why doesnt setup to outscore opponents instead? We have a very decent attacking force afterall.

That's why I'm not convinced that the players are entirely to blame here. It's not enough to point to success in a league where players from winning eleven era on PS1 are still running around in FIFA 17 on ps4.

Nihilist:

Bar one or two players, the overwhelming majority of the players you mentioned were at the same clubs last season.

So what's changed?

Pep went to City and has completely ignored defending and focused on attack. Wenger is now playing Sanchez up front, which has allowed Walcott back into the team with devastating effect.
Klopp's system was already looking like bearing dividends having appeared in two finals last season, and with one or two additions to the squad, has crafted a tsystem so deadly that their best striker can't even make the first 11.

Good players are great to have, but a great system makes average players look great. Compare sterling of last season to this season. Look at what's happening at Spurs. Lamela, Son, Dembele, Sissoko. These are all players that were suffering stagnation in their careers until they met Pochettino.

Greatihex:
even if i should agree with you, what stopped conte from getting the kind of players he wants during the summer transfer window?

nateevs:


You talk like you became a Chelsea fan 2 weeks ago. Are you seriously asking this question? Did you not follow the summer transfer activities?

AdisaOwala:


His Ultra-defensive & Highly Cautious Approach you mean?

During his stint at Juve (and even with the Azzuris), his obsession with the 3-5-2 formation and the kinda players he used literally sums up his " Coaching philosophy" - Conte seems to be the kinda manager that thrives best where there isn't too much pressure to succeed (and impress if need be).

Nihilist:


Good morning Egbon nateevs.

Happy Sunday and Eku Independence.

With all due respect, I feel that your post up there has actually undermined your argument rather than strengthened it.

Liverpool, Arsenal and Man City have largely unchanged squads to last season but the results couldn't be anymore different.

Liverpool that finished in 8th place last season are now mountinh a title charge. City that barely managed to get into 4th place last season are looking nigh on unstoppable now. Arsenal that capitulated their title challenge in such spectacular manner are playing like men on a mission.

Bar one or two players, the overwhelming majority of the players you mentioned were at the same clubs last season.

So what's changed?

Pep went to City and has completely ignored defending and focused on attack. Wenger is now playing Sanchez up front, which has allowed Walcott back into the team with devastating effect.
Klopp's system was already looking like bearing dividends having appeared in two finals last season, and with one or two additions to the squad, has crafted a tsystem so deadly that their best striker can't even make the first 11.

Good players are great to have, but a great system makes average players look great. Compare sterling of last season to this season. Look at what's happening at Spurs. Lamela, Son, Dembele, Sissoko. These are all players that were suffering stagnation in their careers until they met Pochettino.

So yeah we might have some crap players. But I have not seen anything from Conte to suggest that he has the ability to get the best out of these guys.

That's where I'm coming from.

Griffon:
Phuck this talk, you don't expect a manager to perform with a bunch of fagged out legs and couple of panic buys.

How do you expect tactics to bell you out when the system isn't right?

No matter how good you are as a manager, if the players at your disposal aren't just good enough, your tactics are there to beautify the bull crap you've been handed.

I asserted before the season started that we needed two CMs, two defs and a forward. How many ninjas did we end up with?

Conte even had to express his discontentment at some point, that was how bad it was. Let's not all act like we are in possession of short memories buds.

This man wanted Koulibaly but was given Luiz in return. This man wanted Candreva, Ricardo Rodriguez et al but got either uber-crap or nada in return.

Now how do you expect a mansion that was built on a fvcked up foundation to stand? Tell me how? My best guess is miracle, one factor we must heavily rely on this season.

Nateevs

Arsenal has changed their system this season bro. Even Arsenal fans will tell you that.Did you see what they to us? When have you seeen Arsenal boys playing like they just got hooked up with Walter White?

Klopp had an immediate effect on Liverpool bro. Do you remember there Europa cup run? Do you remember their rounds against Dortmund?

Pep completely destroys your argument. He went to the place where the 10 players he wanted were in place and was working wonders. Yet Pellegrini had those same Guys and couldn't do the same magic? How come? I can guarantee you that if Klopp came to the bridge this very second, you will see an immediate difference.

Like I said earlier, I'm happy to be proved wrong and ofcourse I want what's best for the team. I really don't think that Conte is tactical enough to get the best of our boys.

nateevs:


It doesn't matter. What matters is that it is the same Manager implementing any change. The Manager, who has been there for years, would be in a great position to assess that the players can adapt to this change. And this is the most important point. The manager did not go on a senseless tactical change. He knew his players would adapt to the change - which is the same as having the players for the change.





Nobody cares about the cup run. What effect did he have in the league? We are comparing immediate effects with Conte's right? So the League is the benchmark. And no, he did not have any meaningful effect on the League. There were a few English fans already thinking he was a flash in the pan.






You keep missing the point. If Klopp comes to Chelsea and it so happens that we have the players to execute his system, then it will work. Otherwise, it wouldn't. End of.

To the other point of Pep/Pellegrini, let's not reduce the complicacy of football to mere ABCs. Pep is arguably the best Manager in the world. Are we arguing if Conte & Pellegrini are as good as Pep? That at the same time does not mean the best Manager in the world does not require a certain class of resources to help his vision. This is heavily documented.


Can you use your logic to explain why Jose Mourinho has not had an immediate effect at United?






Please elucidate, what exactly is 'the best of our boys'?

Rocktastic:
anybody seeing the city game?!
wetin dey happen?

Klopp made not one but two finals in a season he did not start, and with players he did not buy. Is that enough proof of a man who was able to hit the ground running?

Pellegrini flopped with the same players that Pep is using to shine. Even in a vacuum, that suggests that Pep is a better tactician than Pellegrini.

I'm not sure if you read Sinizia's post earlier. Right now Jose does not appear to know what he is doing and it is showing on the pitch. He has already said that he is trying to implement a different system at Manyoo to what he did with us when we played very defensively.

He came out early to say that he identified the 4 players he needed for his system, and he bought all of them. Yet the team looks disjointed and dull. Only this Thursday, he was saying how 'confused' Pogba was because they prepared for one tactics and Zorhya came and played another type of ball.

This does not sound like someone who even knows what he's doing yet, so ofcourse I'm not surprised that his team are struggling a bit.

The best from our boys is a title win or top 4 place. These boys have done both within the last 3 years. I hope you haven't forgotten.

Ibime:
My people, come celebrate with your boy. My wife just dropped this little girl earlier this morning

Ibime:
My people, come celebrate with your boy. My wife just dropped this little girl earlier this morning

Ibime:
My people, come celebrate with your boy. My wife just dropped this little girl earlier this morning

patrickmuf:
The other clubs refused to deal as simple as that and Chelsea weren't willing to force their hands as was the case with Man Utd.

Ibime:
My people, come celebrate with your boy. My wife just dropped this little girl earlier this morning

Nateevs who made the league the benchmark for Liverpool?
Anyway...

Liverpool had only made top 4 once and often finished between 6th and 8the place in the 7 years preceeding Klopps arrival, so in terms of league finish Klopp was on par for the course in his first season.

Liverpool had not made it past semifinal in Europa in 6 years before Klopp and mostly struggled to get past group stages. Klopp got to the final in his first season with Liverpool.

I don't think it should even up for debate that Klopp immediately improved Liverpool. I remember when the time they beat us 3-1 within weeks of his arrival. I think 2 weeks if his arrival

Conte and Jose are pretty much thr same thing now - tactically clueless. I don't know why you think I'm making excuses for Jose but I assure you that I am not.

If Conte makes top 4, that's all well and good. That is thr minimum I expect of this squad. I just don't think he can deliver...

Ishilove:

Congrats. God has done it and put all those who laughed at you to shame.

Your joy will continue to be full while shame will follow like a shadow, all those whoever mocked you.

Congrats once again. I rejoice with you!!!

Ibime:
Thanks. It's not that serious though cos I was never trying for a baby as my wife was still going through some professional exams. Those mocking were just doing the usual Nairaland jokery-pokery, not knowing what's going on.
The 2nd month after we started trying, I scored. Simple as that.

raumdeuter:




Nihilist you don see Kingsley Coman wife? the boy wey dem born when I dey write WAEC. Money good sha.