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Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 11:03am On Jan 16, 2017 |
SHOULD TRUE CHRISTIANS CELEBRATE BIRTHDAYS, CHRISTMAS: SHOULD THEY HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH PAGANISM? NOTE TO READERS: What is here presented is based on the personal opinion and conviction of the writer. The conclusion drawn is based on my experience, interaction, observations and reading outside the publications of the Watchtower Organization. I have been a member of the Religious Organization of Jehovah’s Witnesses for more than 20 years, and if this debate for/against Christmas/Birthday was held years ago, I would vehemently argue against birthday/Christmas celebration. This could only have been as a result of having one source of information without the opportunity to have a different view of matters. However, when I decided to investigate the teachings I held for many years, I came to one conclusion, ‘listening to one side of the story can only lead to a narrow view of life, things and definitely, a narrow conclusion’. If you are a Jehovah’s witness going through this, though against your training, I pray and wish you go through this with an open mind, for you can never tell what you will learn and how much you can discover. Jehovah’s witnesses, (claim to be True Christians) do not celebrate birthdays or Christmas. The argument given for not celebrating birthdays and Christmas, are slightly different but basically the same. They are • Pagan origin • Not celebrated by Jew/early Christians, nor did Jesus command his disciples to celebrate them • Day of death better than birth – undue honor (idolizing oneself) • People died at the two birthdays mentioned in the Bible More recently, the argument against Birthday/Christmas is more of pagan origin, the early Christians not celebrating them. This article is in response to post appearing in Nairaland front page on the 25th of December, 2016. Here are the links to the two post: 1. https://www.nairaland.com/3537790/origin-christmas-santa-claus-christmas 2. https://www.nairaland.com/3538010/why-dont-jehovahs-witnesses-celebrate Both post is obviously from Jehovah’s witnesses, as their religion is strictly against the celebration of birthdays and Christmas. However, what is not said is that Jehovah’s Witnesses celebrated Christmas and birthday up until 1927 and 1950, respectively. So, if celebrations don’t make one a ‘true Christian’ and worthy of God’s disfavor and destruction in Armageddon, one wonders if the older witnesses that died before these period, with their pagan celebration of Christmas and birthday will ever make it? After all, they were never ‘true Christians’, they practiced Idolatry, unless it had to be explained away that the light was getting brighter. If Birthday/Christmas is idolatry, then Idolatry is idolatry and God has never condoned idolatory. NOTE: It is not just Jehovah’s witnesses that do not celebrate Christmas, birthdays. Religious Organization, like Continued Christian Church of God (CCOG), Seventh-day Adventists, Christadelphian (left to individual conscience, but not organizationally), Worldwide church of God etc. frown upon Christmas, birthday and some other celebrations done today. This religious organization all have the same root as Jehovah’s Witnesses, all started in the 1800s, preach narrow salvation for its members only, shun its former member (exception is Seventh-Day Adventist) etc. I will be approaching this topic from the birthday point of view, since basically, they are both the same. The argument used by Jehovah’s witnesses (‘True Christians’) against the celebration of both are basically the same. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 11:03am On Jan 16, 2017 |
I will be approaching this topic from the birthday point of view, since basically, they are both the same. The argument used by Jehovah’s witnesses (‘True Christians’) against the celebration of both are basically the same. There is an indebt research on birthday on this link, it covers the origin, the views of ancient Jews, how birthday eventually had its inroads into Christianity, why Jesus birthday was never celebrated or known, nor any of the ancient Jews were never known and a lot more. If you want to know much about birthday celebration, the article covers it. However, I will try to highlight the main point of the article below. Reason 1: Birthdays celebrated had a bad reputation, bad things happened and were never done by worshipers of God. Example Pharoah killed chief of baker, Harod killed John Note: This was a case of Negative perception. Reason 2: From Jewish Historian Josephus, the law did not permit (not God’s law, for God never gave any law on it, but the rabbinic laws). However, you will remember Jesus was not really happy about most of the rabbinic laws existing in his days, for these laws did produce worshipers and religious leaders that were strictly unmerciful, unloving, unjustice, but became a burdensome yoke. Note: Since nearly all of the first Christians were Jewish, this may explain why the celebration of Jesus' birth would not be consistent with that early custom Reason 3: Birthdays were never Jewish customs and traditions, they never really knew their date of birth, though they knew other dates and celebrated it, like Passover, festival of booths. Reason 4: Passages of the Old testament, they Jews tended to looked at in order to arrive at their conclusions about birthday: • Ge 40:20-22- Pharaoh’s birthday, chief of the baker hanged • Deut 18:10-12 – laws against practices like witchcraft, soothsayer, spell, Spiritism, communicating with dead • Job 3:1-5 - Job curses day of his birth (Did the Jews really had access to Job’s account? That is a subject for another day as it is not stated in the bible) • Je 20:14-18 – Jeremiah causes the say of his birth Note: The holy bible never said these scriptures influence believes and custom. The scriptures never mentioned why they never recorded/knew their date of birth let alone celebrate it Reason 5: Hebrew calendar makes it difficult to calculate one’s birthday. Days of one’s birth cannot fall on the same date year to year. It probably occurs ones in say 20 years. Reason 6: Circumcision on the eight day (Ge 17:12) may have been to take emphasis away from the date of birth to other events as important. It is important to note that in modern day Judaism, while many modern rabbis still do not endorse the celebration of birthdays, some do. However, it appears that some believe that there is stronger support in both their traditions and writings to not celebrate them. From the above, the Jews never celebrated birthdays, they never placed importance to it, they could never calculate their days of birth yearly as their calendar didn’t allow for it. There was never a law from God against birthday celebration, though God gave them many laws, but it appears their custom of not celebrating birthday had more to do with the negative perception. Secondly, there is no scriptural record that the events of Job’s live and his children were known to the Jews. None. Job was never of the Jewish origin, no connection with the Jews. The ‘day’ in Jo 1:13, referred to, by many as a birthday celebration by Job’s sons is not explicit. It is not conclusive if Job’s children were indeed celebrating birthday or not. If they did, it could have been possible as they never practice the Jewish custom or tradition, neither did they have the Jewish laws. You may have to dip a little deeper about Job, he may have been Pre-Abrahamic. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 11:03am On Jan 16, 2017 |
CHRISMAS IS SOMEWHAT LINKED TO BIRTHDAY, FOR IT IS A CELEBRATION OF THE BIRTH OF JESUS Many Christians and non-Christians, celebrate Christmas/birthday. As can be seen above, though God never gave a law regarding the celebration of birthdays, the Jew never did. The Jewish custom was against it, date of birth was not known to Jew (neither to early Christians since a greater number of them were Jewish), they probably had a negative view of birthdays (again, the Scripture is silent on this), birthdays of individuals could not be known from their calendar, as can be simply be done today. Since birthdays were never celebrated, birth of Christ, Christmas could never have been celebrated by the early Christians as majority of them were Jews, even the Church of Rome realizes that it is not likely that the first century Christians could have celebrated it. Furthermore, the observance of Christmas is difficult to track to 2nd century Christians, because there is no evidence that anyone kept Christmas that early. What is known, however, is that early Christians kept Passover, Pentecost, and other days considered to be of 'Jewish origin.' THE OTHER SIDE OF THE STORY NEVER CONSIDERED BY WATCHTOWER Without considering both sides of the story regarding these celebrations, it is difficult to get a balanced view of it. Let’s try to have an objective, balance view of both sides of the story. In all my years being a Jehovah’s Witness, the only side of the story that has been presented concerning Christmas and birthday is what has been presented by the articles above, posted on the front page 2 days ago, it is always about origin, negative event that occurred and early Christians not celebrating. No attempt was made to examine why God never gave a law forbidding such practices, even while he gave series of laws covering many aspects of the Jewish worshippers lives and sometimes, law covering event or practices of non Jewish worshippers. Let’s also see what the bible can reveal, which is never considered when doctrine of birthday/Christmas celebrations, is considered or taught to Jehovah’s Witnesses As has already been known, Christmas and birthday were never celebrated by early Christians, birthday were never celebrated by the Jews or the early Christians, not because God law forbade it, but because of mostly negative views and custom they had about those events. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 11:04am On Jan 16, 2017 |
PERSPECTIVE OF THE BIBLE SCRIPTURES CONSIDERATION 1: LuKE 2:10-14 - Angels celebrated the birth of Jesus and announced to the world. SCRIPTURES CONSIDERATION 2: 2 CorInthians 3:17 – “Now Jehovah is the Spirit, and where the spirit of Jehovah is, there is freedom.” REMARK: Christian freedom is an intrinsic part of true worship, it a freedom from all sort of law keeping. It reflects where God’s spirit operates freely, where Christians are allowed to follow the detect of their conscience, especially in cases where God’s word does not give a clear direction. Such Christians takes the words of Ro 14:5,6, 10 very seriously. The freedom which God’s Son gave us is for the very purpose that we may express our faith and love to the fullest degree, free from restraints which men, not God, would impose on us. Any willing forfeiture of that freedom inevitably means a sacrifice of truth. For those who would impose such restrictions do so, not by truth, but by error. SCRIPTURES CONSIDERATION 3: Romans 14:5,6, 10 “One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. He who regards one day as special, does so to the Lord… But why do you judge your brother? Or why do you also look down on your brother? For we shall all stand before the judgment seat of God?” REMARK: Paul gave strong counsel against judging other based on our weak faith. He does not criticize Christians that celebrate a particular day as special, but does condemn those that are judgmental. One man considers one day to be more special than another, while the other considers everyday the same. Each man has to be fully convinced in his own heart and mind, that is the beauty of christian freedom, the freedom Jesus brought from all sort of law keeping, the freedom from binding others conscience in matters God has not made any ruling nor demanded. SCRIPTURES CONSIDERATION 4: Romans 7:7 - Really, I would not have come to know sin had it not been for the Law. For example, I would not have known covetousness if the Law had not said: “You must not covet.” REMARK: Law identify what sin is, without law, there is no sin. God gave Israel more than 600 laws, (laws not just for practices happening in Israel, but those of other nations as a strong warning for the Israelite), but no mention of birthday, though it was a common practice among surrounding nations. SCRIPTURES CONSIDERATION 5: Ecclesiastes 7:1- “A name is better than good oil, and the day of death than the day of one’s being born.” REMARK: The day of Jesus’ death was as good as the day of his birth. His birth brought hope of salvation for mankind and his sacrificial death made possible for mankind to have a relationship with God without the burden of the law of Moses. “Everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life”- John 3:16 SCRIPTURES CONSIDERATION 6: Acts 20:35- “There is more happiness in giving than there is in receiving.” REMARK: While it is strictly true that giving not be limited a certain time of the year, but an all year activities, but factually, most giving occurs on certain occasion. A typical Jehovah’s witness offers special gift in special occasion, like wedding anniversary, celebrations and others. Birthday celebration and Christmas offers opportunity to offer gift. However, does it mean that the celebrant limit their giving to a certain period of the year alone? I believe the answer to the question is negative. However, like in wedding, birthday/Christmas is one of those special occasions where giving is practiced. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by Nobody: 11:07am On Jan 16, 2017 |
Help me ask them |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 11:24am On Jan 16, 2017 |
CUSTOMS AND TRADITIONS PRACTICED TODAY BY JEHOVAH’S WITNESSES THAT ARE ROOTED IN PAGANISM A lot of Christian, including Jehovah’s witnesses practice activities today with links to paganism, activities not practiced by the ancient nation of Israel/early Christians. Let’s consider some of these: Event/Custom/Tradition 1: Sunday as day of worship: Christians worships in Sunday, rooted in paganism (Mithraism), introduced in 325 A.D, the council of Nicea, decided Sunday to be a day of worship and Passover was to be observed on Sunday. Does the watchtower know this? Reasoning on the Scriptures, p. 346 says “The retention of the old Pagan name of 'Dies Solis,' or 'Sunday,' for the weekly Christian festival, is, in great measure owing to the union of the Pagan and [so-called] Christians sentiment with which the first day of the week was recommended by Constantine [in an edict in 321 C.E.] to his subjects, Pagan and Christian alike, as the ‘venerable day of the Sun.’...It was his mode of harmonizing the discordant religions of the Empire under one common instruction"” REMARK: Religions group like COG keep their religious service on Saturday, not Sunday. Event/Custom/Tradition 2: Calendar: Today, ‘true Christians’ use the Gregorian calendar, with its months and days not minding its origin and their link to pagan deities. Example: Days: Sunday: “Sun Day” – celebrate the sun god, Ra, Helios, Apollo, Ogmios, Mithrias or the sun goddess, Phoebe. Monday:“Moon Day” - Monday was named in honor of the Assyrian goddess, Selene, Luna and Mani Months: January is named after the pagan god, Janus, the two-faced Roman “god of doorways” March is named after Mars, the god of war April for the fertility goddess Aprodite Does these prevent Jehovah’s witnesses from using this names, days and months for their service? Today, we employ this names, at times naming our sons or daughter without the slightest thought of their “pagan” origin. Actually, most people are totally unaware of their pagan source. REMARK: It is worthy to mention that the watchtower introduced the “Calendar of Jehovah God” in 1903. The Golden Age, 1935, Mar 13 p. 358 (Now called Awake) said “The Devil, of course, was the one who induced the ancestors of the present generation to name all the days of the week after heathen gods and goddesses” Proving impractical, this concept did not last long and Witnesses continue to use the pagan Gregorian calendar. See below for the calender Event/Custom/Tradition 3: Wedding rings are jewelry worn by the groom/bride adopted from paganism by the Catholic Church. Exchange of wedding rings form an intrinsic part of marriage today. Jehovah’s witnesses practice this every time they have wedding. Concerning wedding rings, the watchtower publications say: What has religion done for mankind 1951, p. 276,277 quotes a catholic cardinal Newman as saying that, along with such things as “the use of temples…incense, candle…the ring in marriage…are all of pagan origin, and sanctified by their adoption into the church” Watchtower 2007 Feb 15 p.30 "Moreover, the wedding ring at one time had religious significance. Yet, most people today do not know that, considering a wedding ring a mere evidence that someone is married." Watchtower 1972 January 15 p.63 Questions from Readers "Even if it were a fact that pagans first used wedding rings, would that rule such out for Christians? Not necessarily. Many of today's articles of clothing and aspects of life originated in pagan lands… Really, the question is not so much whether wedding rings were first used by pagans but whether they were originally used as part of false religious practices and still retain such religious significance." REMARK: The same is not asked about Christmas or birthday celebration. Even if it were used as part of false religious practices and some such religious significance, the question is, does it still have such religious significance today? Event/Custom/Tradition 4: Pinjata - The origin of the Piñata is Chinese. It was used to celebrate the coming of spring. The original & traditional Piñata has seven points symbolizing the seven deadly sins: envy, sloth, gluttony, greed, lust, anger/wrath, and pride. The Piñata is traditionally shaped like a seven-pointed star which represents the devil and the seven deadly sins, while the contents are the goods or blessings he is withholding. Striking the devil with faith, symbolized by being blindfolded, releases the blessings. Regarding Pinjata, Awake! 2003 Sep 22 pp.23-24 "We found that for many people in Mexico, the piñata has lost its religious significance and is considered by most to be just harmless fun…When considering whether to include a pinjata at a social gathering, Christians should be sensitive to the consciences of others. (1 Corinthians 10:31-33) A main concern is, not what the practice meant hundreds of years ago, but how it is viewed today in your area. Understandably, opinions may vary from one place to another. Hence, it is wise to avoid turning such matters into big issues." REMARK: With arguments from paganism being an illogical stance, the Watchtower is plagued with a contradictory stance on pagan practices, at times admitting the meaning of a practice to pagans in the past is not of importance today. One cannot help but noticed the double standard employed by practicer of ‘True Christianity’ today. Event/Custom/Tradition 5: The Internet and Computer. The internet and computer is a tool that has had much force for good, at the same time, it also has a much a force for bad. Pornography, dark web, hackers, satanic website etc. are all embedded in the internet. The internet is sometimes considered, "A Child of the Cold War" or "The Cold War's Baby." However, the computer and internet has it origin in from the war front and was produced mainly for the purpose of supporting war. One of the reasons given for a Jehovah's Witnesses not to be part of Red cross society is that it was born in the time of war (irrespective of its humanitarian aid and assistance) REMARK: The watchtower today used these resources extensively, irrespective of its origin/potential dangers associated with it. Infact, the watchtower today uses the best technology available, even-though when these technological innovations started some hundred years ago, they claimed that they fulfilled bible prophecies as signs of the last days. Event/Custom/Tradition 6: Disfellowshing/Shunning: Jehovah’s witnesses practice shunning today, a type of shunning that requires treating someone as dead, all sort of communication is severed, not just in religious setting, but all settings involving life. When someone is disfellowship or leaves the watchtower organization, even if for disagreeing with the watchtower doctrines, he is shunned. However, prior to the watchtower introducing the practice of disfellowshing/shunning, the watchtower use to teach and knew the practice to be of pagan origin. See the Awake, 1947, page 27. REMARK: Dis-fellowship, disassociation both are similar, carries the same penalty-shunning, the victim considered as dead. Today, both terms are replaced by “He/she is no longer one of Jehovah’s witnesses” Event/Custom/Tradition 7: Honeymoon: Honeymoon practiced by Jehovah’s witnesses today has its root in paganism. It was an accepted practice in Babylon 4000 years ago, that for a month after wedding, the bride’s father would supply his son-in-law with all the mead he could drink. Mead is a honey bear and because their calendar was lunar based, this period was called the honey month, which is today known as the honey moon. Event/Custom/Tradition 8: Buildings for Christian worship: The Christian Greek scriptures or the new testament records the early Christians meeting in homes and in the temple. (Acts 2:46; 5:42; Ro 16:5; 1 Co 16:19) Neither Jesus nor the Apostles encourage Christians to have a separate building for worship. In John 4:21-24, Jesus declared that a time was coming were worship of God was not to be tied to any particular location or building, sacred service to God was to be about the whole Christian way of life, in spirit and truth. For the first few hundred years, building for Christian worship were very rare. It was not until Constantine and his succeeding Roman Emperors made Christianity the official religion of the Roman Empire that Christians began building temples. In some instances, Christians, with the aid of Roman soldiers, took over pagan temples and “Christianized” them into churches. The idea of building for Christian worship created multiple problems. First, people began to think of church building as “sacred space.” Giving rise to a separation of what goes on inside a church building and what happens outside it. Secondly, some people lost the idea of God’s omnipresence, worshiping God “in spirit and truth”, that sacred service involves his/her whole Christian life, not just the narrow view of some activities like meetings, church work, preaching etc. REMARK Jerusalem was going to experience its worst tribulation (great tribulation) ever experienced as prophesied by Jesus. It would have made sense as they would not have to waste their time in buildings that would certainly be destroyed when Jerusalem and its temple was going down. Since the bible does not instruct Christians to have a building for Christian worship (Church Buildings/kingdom Halls/Assemble Halls), does it mean it is wrong to have one? The fact that the bible does not command something does not mean the Bible is opposed to that something. Neither the fact that Christians started having buildings for worship when Constantine made Christianity an official religion, thereby having some pagan relationship makes it wrong for Christians today to have a befitting place of worship. Event/Custom/Tradition 9: Names with pagan origin: Most Jehovah’s Witnesses today bear names today after pagan gods. Here are some of the names. Monday- the Moon day, named after the goddess of the moon Friday – the day in honor of the Norse goddess Frigg Saturday – named in honor of Saturn Sunday – the Sun day, named after a pagan roman holiday, the say of god May – named after the Greek goddess of the spring August (Augusta) – named after Augustus Caesar, a pagan worshiper June – name after Juno, protector and special counselor of the roman state and queen of the gods, daughter of Saturn, sister(also wife) of the chief god Jupiter Holda – named after Goddess of winter, weather, textile and fertility REMARK The point is not the name or where they are taken from. Jehovah’s witnesses bear this names proudly, though this names are after pagan gods. In reality, it does not matter, as this event took place hundreds of years ago. Some of those witnesses arguing so vehemently against Christmas/birthday are named after pagan gods or their local traditional gods. So, why should one make an issue over origins of events that matters not to people today and using that as evident of superior righteousness? ![]() |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by BlackDBagba: 11:30am On Jan 16, 2017 |
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Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 12:37pm On Jan 16, 2017 |
As can be seen above, if we were to look into history, origin of practices, names, celebrations and events we have today, virtually all aspect of a Christian life is surrounded by practices that didn’t have either a Jewish/Christian origin. Most of what we have today was largely influence by the country in power, pagan countries and the civilization that followed. Jews didn’t wear shirt and tie, neither did they were suit. If the pagan nations around the Jew/first century Christians wore shirt, tie and suit, and probably used them for temple worship, the wearing of suit, ties and shirt would be presented negatively, and probably banned among Jehovah’s witnesses today. While placing intense emphasis on the “pagan origin” factor, the Watch Tower organization simply glosses over this in other areas. This create a double standard leading to the hypocritical life of Jehovah’s witnesses. If, for instance, a horrible event occurs in the churches around them, they will use that as a preaching point, an opportunities to proclaim their way of worship to be true, while the other church way of worship is false, satanic. However, if same occurs within their mist, this event will be shrouded in secrecy, not worthy to be talked among Jehovah’s witnesses, in the name of not bringing shame on ‘Jehovah’s organization’. A typical example is the way watchtower hides their legal tussle of their mishandling and covering of child abuse cases happening in many parts of the world, not even worthy of mentioned in their legal section of the JW.org website. In some legal case, the watchtower had to blatantly lie in court in order to shield their governing body from appearing in court, but could uploads a video of Russian Authorities Fabricating evidence against Witnesses. This is simply hypocrisy. While writing an article on the use of wedding rings, the watchtower rightly stated: “the wedding ring at one time had religious significance. Yet, most people today do not know that, considering a wedding ring a mere evidence that someone is married.” - Watchtower 2007 Feb 15 p.30 It also rightly said: “Many of today's articles of clothing and aspects of life originated in pagan lands… Really, the question is not so much whether wedding rings were first used by pagans but whether they were originally used as part of false religious practices and still retain such religious significance.” - Watchtower 1972 January 15 p.63 Questions from Readers Question: How many people today attach Paganic significance to birthday/Christmas Celebration? Question: Does birthday/Christmas celebration still maintain such religious significance today? I believe an honest answer to the questions above is obvious. Many celebrating Christmas and birthday today have no idea what the practice meant hundreds of years ago, neither does it matter to them. As I observe, most celebrating use this events as an opportunity to praise God (unless to Jehovah’s Witnesses, they are not praising God but god), not some deity. The watchtower organization, with their control on the loves of more 8 million Jehovah’s Witnesses can use even the shallowest of reasoning to forbid any practice they want, even with little or no scriptural ground. As long as the organization says it, Jehovah’s Witnesses believe it as coming from God's mouth. A typical example of how this can be done is in the article, “Are Cats for Christians”, (See http://www.jwfiles.com/wt_ex_jw_corner/cats.htm). Purely fictional, but it is a great way to show Watchtower approach to rule making to forbid anything. The reasoning can go this way: • Were worshipped as gods in Egypt • Are never spoken of favorably in the Bible • Are never listed as being owned by righteous men of old • Are unclean animals, by the definition given to Noah 1 Like |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 12:37pm On Jan 16, 2017 |
CONCLUSION Perception: Positive or Negative perception can play a major role on how we view event around us, whether we choose to participate in an event or not. Let me give 3 real life example. Example 1: I know of a man that has never wore a Jean. His perception has always been, Jean is mostly used by tout and criminals, in an event where policemen need to effect an arrest, they would most certainly arrest a man wearing Jean, than a person with normal corporate wears. I grew with that perception, never thought of Jean wears in good light, I can remember repeating same line of reasoning to friends. Example 2: Secondly, I knew of a late Jehovah’s Witness sister that never eat meats. She grew up with the perception that lowly people, servant girls cannot eat meats, that meat is meant for big men and women. Why? She happened to be a servant girl for an unkind woman. She will serve the woman, prepare everything for her, fish, meats and other things for preparing a nice, delicious meal. However, when the meal is finished, the woman will then give them things to use in preparing meal for the servants and meat was never included. So, she grew with the negative impression and when she was later blessed her with a good husband, nice children, houses…she still never would eat meat, because of the negative impressions she had about meat. However, it wouldn’t stop her from preparing delicious meal for her children, visitors and others where meat was included. But she would not eat the meat. Example 3: Or a situation where a woman has been married for several years without the fruit of the womb. Then, God bless her with a son, the birthday of her Son being the greatest and happiest her life. As written in page 277 of In Search of Christian Freedom, “One of my wife’s sisters has a son, an only child conceived fairly late in the marriage and born with a heart defect. The parents were warned that he might not live beyond the age of two, but surgery performed when he reached that age corrected the problem. As the mother said, “Some people celebrate wedding anniversaries, but to my husband and me the day that our son was born is more precious to our memory even than the day of our wedding.” On that day in each year that passes, she remembers the day as certainly worth celebrating. Can she not celebrate this day, giving glory and praises to God simply because some people thousands of years ago, she does not know and frankly does not matter to her celebrated their birthday and kill someone? As can been observed, the Jews not celebrating birthday was simply a case of perception, not because God forbade it. The early Christian were mostly Jews, having Jewish custom and therefore would not celebrate birthday. Many today have one or two things they abstain from, simply because of perception, not because it is morally wrong. Pagan Origin If we are to go into origin of all that happens around us today, then we will really be out of this world in the name of practicing ‘True Christianity’. God’s law given to the Israelite never forbade birthday celebration in a time the Israelite had moral codes governing almost all aspect of their lives. Surely, Jehovah, the all wise creator could have given such if celebration of birthday was offensive to him. Or did Jehovah forget? The watchtower places emphasis on the “pagan origin” factor on certain celebrations while glossing over this factors in other areas, such as wedding rings, anniversaries, Pinjatas and names. They also present a negative one-sided view of considerations on birthday/Christmas. This simple amount to double, hypocritical standard. Bad Event Occurring in Birthday and Idolizing Oneself One of watchtower’s core argument against birth celebration is based on the principle of guilty by association - that because only Pharaoh and Herod are mentioned in Scripture as celebrating birthdays, and because these were wicked men, therefore the celebration of a birthday is necessarily wicked also. This is certainly a forced conclusion. If, as an illustration, the Scriptures held no reference to marriage feasts other than marriage feasts held by two pagans or non-Christians (perhaps even with some coincidental drunkenness or immorality occurring)—would that make marriage feasts something wrong, unfit for Christians? The Watch Tower employs quotations about the absence of birthday celebrations by Jews or by professed Christians in early centuries. Is that really a substantial reason for taking a rigid stand? Did the Jews or the professed Christians in early centuries celebrate wedding anniversaries? Would the fact that they did not rule out our doing so today? Jehovah’s Witnesses in many countries regularly do celebrate wedding anniversaries. The idea advanced that birthday celebrations are intrinsically an ‘idolizing’ of the person is an unrealistic categorization. Couples who celebrate a wedding anniversary are not idolizing themselves nor idolizing their marriage. Like so many other things, it is the way in which things are done, the spirit shown, and this can vary widely. Nowhere in the Scriptures is there any indication of God’s disapproval of birthday celebrations per se. The watchtower is silent in that respect, neither is it mentioned when arguing for or against birthday. It is a case of men presuming to know God’s thinking and making judgments and rulings that God himself has not made. I do not celebrate birthday, yet I now recognized that an exaggerated importance has been attached to them, with celebration or non-celebration being viewed as evidence of superior righteousness, determining whether one is a practicer of true worship or not. In all this, I am not advocating these celebrations. I had never celebrated, and may never. I had a negative perception built into me as I grew up a Jehovah's Witness. I simply believe that, viewed calmly and factually, they are matters of minor significance, matters that should be left to the consciences of fellow believers, never warranting the sense of superior righteousness produced by Jehovah's Witness abstention, and certainly never justifying the double standard it has produced in the lives of Jehovah’s witnesses. Contributing Sources for Further Reading: 1. http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/birthdays.php 2. http://www.cogwriter.com/birthdays.htm 3. In Search of Christian Freedom, pages 274-276 {Download PDF with this link https://www.google.com.ng/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjxysjvrrfRAhXCLMAKHZKwBWoQFggYMAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fchretien.et.homo.free.fr%2Ffichiers%2Frl_rf_2002_en.pdf&usg=AFQjCNGmz_RsULtFUWOtMSMTcKfoKGe-Ng&sig2=kTL6Do0QsfXESWTwMkbmsQ&bvm=bv.143423383,d.d24} 1 Like |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 10:07am On Jan 17, 2017 |
This post will help many have a good response to Jehovah's Witnesses, as they try to show superior righteousness and try to make others feel guilty for a celebration that God himself never forbade. It is also meant to educate Witnesses, as they will have to avoid anything paganic, since our everyday life is filled with it, that is if they really want to practice "True Christianity", the way the Jews practice. I am tagging a lot of people since this may never make front page. Try to be patient while reading it, it may be enlightened, as they almost everything around is paganic. OAM4J, Browsenigeria, urCreator, zees, zarakay, enedoboy, hisholar2, veekid, MPVGoddess, Sunnah1, Atiku2019, chuch69, EdoNation, MrIcredible, ajebuter, oluwamile, monemsis, Memphis357, Aniedi30, efilefun, ajalawole, davide470, Candycrusher, emsheddy, Chillext, degemstone, psalmskiddy, Aniedi30, vboss, VictorRomanov, rickyrex, Draei, martineverest, kingdaro, martineverest, Polyestar, Debbime, shammah1, JeffreyJamez, Debbime, gagewonda, sabi99, maximunimpact, femi4, nathan5050, stancod, driy65, gagewonda, careytommy7, princetom1, davide470, Johnsown1, klax, Kassidy90, omonnakoda, careytommy7, darediamond, timecapsule, 1coinNaija, Eddodoh, Abbeytoy, rottennaija, JusticeSeeker, PappiSnow, opethom, ActivJJJ, Mavrick2012, casttlebarbz, Lilimax, Onechancearmy, wellmax, opethom, AyamConfidence, ddaammyy |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by martineverest(m): 10:50am On Jan 17, 2017 |
good points made ChristianFreedo: |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by Nobody: 6:47pm On Jan 17, 2017 |
I believe you've made a nice argument here. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by olaolaking: 6:16am On Jan 23, 2017 |
ChristianFreedo:Call the elders in your congregation and table your arguement before them. At least, let them know your view and opinion. You cant be hiding and claim you are preaching to them.Nobody recognizes an unseen face. Are you an hypocrites? |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 6:42am On Jan 23, 2017 |
olaolaking: You mean call them and get yourself kicked out and shunned for disagreeing with watchtower line of reasoning? Nice try, but I think I'll pass |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by olaolaking: 6:49am On Jan 23, 2017 |
ChristianFreedo:What business do you have with them? Are you for real? You claim they are set of wrong people and you still belong to them. Is that how God should be served? You mean you agree with them even though you know they are wrong? worshipping God in disguise? |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 10:00am On Jan 23, 2017 |
olaolaking: Ok. Let's Just cut to the chase. Firstly: This is what you are trying to achieve, you have used these lines of reasoning before in my other post. 1. You want to me to go out to the public, probably the congregation, meet the elders face to face, argue with them. 2. Of course, you know too well that they will try to make me submit to watchtower reasoning, they will "try to readjust my thought" to align with the watchtower thinking 3. Of course, i will not accept it 4. Then, i will be charged with apostasy 5. Then Judicial committee (religious court) will be formed against me for not accept any of Watchtower's teaching (you know the greatest sin any JW can commit is disagree with watchtower teaching, i am assuming you are an elder, because it is the best kept secret) 6. Then I am disfellowship or disassociated 7. Then shunned OBJECTIVE ACHIEVED: This is the whole objective of all you argument. Because, you know too well that immediately I am disfellowship or disassociated, shunning kicks in. Then no one will hear what I have to say (whether i am right or not). No one will even say a greeting to me, they will simply pretend I am dead. This way, even if my information can prove life saving, no one pays attention. Thanks, but no thanks. I know you thought. Your thought are like that of the devil, cunning devising schemes. I am not falling for that trap. Secondly: My worship is between me and my God. In the Judgment, it will be between me and Jesus. You cannot mediate, neither will the watchtower organization. So allow God to judge my worship, for it is before his judgment sit I will stand, not yours or the organization. Thanks. Thirdly: The bolded statement is entirely yours and yours only. I never claimed nor made the allegation that Jehovah's Witnesses are a set of wrong people. If there is anywhere I have made such a post, I challenged you to show me. My believe is that Jehovah's Witnesses, "the rank and files", are sincere people, they want to do what the bible said (as interpreted by the watchtower). The same is true of many Christians in other religious organization. They are sincere people too. I bear them witness that Jehovah's Witnesses, like other Christians adherent, have a zeal for righteousness, but only according to what the watchtower says and teaches, not according to accurate knowledge. There is where the danger lies. The watchtower has been proven time again to be untruthful, dishonest and maintain a double standard, especially where money is involved. As a result, the watchtower has been providing a one sided, dishonest view of matters to Jehovah's Witnesses (the rank and files), thereby leading to imprisonment, hardship and in some cases dead of sincere people that trust their leaders with their lives. Most of the time, watchtower takes advantage of the trust the rank and files have for them to present information that is at best intellectually dishonest. Please, my problem is not with the rank and files (Jehovah's witnesses). My problem is only with the inaccurate, misleading information and sometimes, outright lies the watchtower teaches. You may what to check my profile picture.Thanks |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by olaolaking: 8:56pm On Jan 23, 2017 |
ChristianFreedo:Can you judge yourself? Just look at your argument. You don't want to be kicked out? So you prefer to play along? I am sure you always do what they prefer and always obey them. You also agree with them in all questionable matters you have raised. Now, how do you think God will feel about you. Give you a thumbs up? When you do according to Jehovah's witnesses doctrine which you see as falsehood but come at the back to discredit same doctrine? Explain yourself to sincere people who are not Jehovah's witnesses and see how they will feel about you 1 Like |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 10:33pm On Jan 23, 2017 |
olaolaking: My brother, that was my last response to you on that subject. If you do not nor like it that way. That's the way it is going to be. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by olaolaking: 11:32pm On Jan 23, 2017 |
ChristianFreedo:Keep deceiving yourself and continue to cry. Who wants to take you seriously? You can rant. But it is good for you that way because you will soon develop hypertension. Those people you are castigating are free with you, but you have a skeleton in your cupboard which will eventually do more harm to you. I am already following you here. LIER, PRETENDER, HYPOCRITE. People like you don't end well in life 1 Like |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by Hairyrapunzel: 9:25pm On Jan 24, 2017 |
olaolaking: Are you God? He doesn't agree with watchtower line of reasoning. Don't bully anybody here. People like him will end very well in life. His generation will be free of the cult you are in. Christians can celebrate birthdays Christmas and easter |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by olaolaking: 9:39pm On Jan 24, 2017 |
Hairyrapunzel: So what is he still doing in their midst? He still goes to the kingdom Hall and joins them in doing all those things that he detests. He only comes to Nairaland to complain. Yet he associates with them. And you think there is nothing wrong with him? why not pull out? Why still joining them to do those things? He has the right to oppose them. But you can be a member of PDP and continue to against the party that they are not good and yet you choose to remain with them and still follow them and participate in all the things you complain about. What do you call that? People that do that have no moral value and no one value them. They are cults, but he remains with them. ![]() 1 Like |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by Hairyrapunzel: 9:43pm On Jan 24, 2017 |
olaolaking: People who are not jehovah's witnesses don't see anything wrong with what he says. In fact the way you reason is what will make them shocked. You have not said if there is anything wrong in what he is saying. He is saying there is nothing wrong in christians celebrating birthdays Christmas and easter and he has his reasons don't try to bully the op. He is making people unaware of this you doctrine aware and that is a very good move he his reasoning is sound and authentic. He is trying to say that your doctrine about those celebrations aren't in the bible. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by Hairyrapunzel: 10:13pm On Jan 24, 2017 |
olaolaking: He has a reason for staying. He cannot loose his family and friends still in your cult. You know they will disfellowship him for oposing them. Don't use PDP bullshit here it is not the matter on ground. You know leaving your church breaks up families. God will spare him. The last time I checked you ain't God. You are not even God's mouthpiece. If this is only way he can make people aware of your doctrines then he is free people need to be educated about it. He is free to test anything. Acts 17: 11 1 thessalonians 5:21 Bible even encourages us to test and check scriptures if it is not there don't bother preaching it and forcing people to abide by what isn't in the bible |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by olaolaking: 11:08pm On Jan 24, 2017 |
Hairyrapunzel:We can not all agree on the same thing. That is normal. But it is abnormal if I agree with you and at the back detest it bitterly. Not even you will want someone to do it to you 1 Like |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by Hairyrapunzel: 11:19pm On Jan 24, 2017 |
olaolaking:It is not abnormal if I detest something at your back when I know you will kill me if I detest it at your front. I would not want to die. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by olaolaking: 11:22pm On Jan 24, 2017 |
Hairyrapunzel:Keep telling lies upon lies of what you don't know. Breaking families you mean? At least my own family didn't break. I never argued against his position to the doctrines. But he still practices the doctrines even when knows they are wrong and you said it is OK? I am just amazed. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by olaolaking: 11:33pm On Jan 24, 2017 |
Hairyrapunzel:Imagine! At least nobody killed me during my time though. I still don't understand how they do that. You can manufacture defense. But I have deep knowledge of what I am saying. So not what one person manufactured will shift me. But I still maintain it. I have so many things confusing and I distanced myself, my conscience will not even allow me to cover up not to his level. He is doing more damaging to himself because he would continue to do something that he himself against and that is enough punishment. 1 Like |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by Hairyrapunzel: 12:07am On Jan 25, 2017 |
olaolaking: The issue here is he doesn't want to loose his family and friends we all know how you people behave. So you are now God that will judge somebody abi? Everybody has unique and individual conscience. He is not you accept it. From what I see your religion is all about punishment. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by Hairyrapunzel: 12:23am On Jan 25, 2017 |
olaolaking: So he should be disfellowshipped and shunned right? So his family members will stop associating with him? That sounds like family breakup to me. That is your own family they still associated with you when you were disfellowshipped his own family may be different. He still attends the church. Is it not God he is serving? You can serve God anywhere. He still wants to be with his family. Family comes first. It is not wrong to do what he is doing if talking about the doubts he has about watchtower doctrines if talking about it will make them brand him as an apostate which will lead to disfellowshipping and subsequent shunning by family and friends still in the organisation thereby causing a family breakup friends can be replaced but you can never replace family. So let him be and let God judge him. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by LewsTherin: 1:34am On Jan 25, 2017 |
I was really hoping to read a debate on the points raised by the OP and then the whole thread just gets derailed. Unfortunately most debates by "Christians" on Nairaland end up as attacks on one person or another. Not a good impression we are making. Not a good impression at all. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by plus7(m): 3:35pm On Jan 29, 2017 |
olaolaking: olaolaking: @OP: I have only one question for you: If someone you meet while preaching asks you a question about birthday/christmas celebrations, what response will you give. Your own view or the watchtower's view? Kindly answer my question..... P.S. please check the bolded sentences above and think about them. |
Re: Should "True Christians" Celebrate Birthdays, Christmas by ChristianFreedo(m): 5:13am On Jan 31, 2017 |
plus7: The Scriptures at 2 Co 3:17 says: – “Now Jehovah is the Spirit, and where the spirit of Jehovah is, there is freedom". Such freedom doesn't not exist among the organisation of Jehovah's Witnesses. Where such freedom does not exist, dangers lurk and can lead to harm or hurt. I believe you know that is primarily the reason I'm behind the keyboard, in order to protect myself as best as I can. To your question, what will I do? I believe there is always a need for caution. Jesus was a prime example of one who was cautious when responding to the pharisees. So it depends on a lot of factors, which for sake of caution, I can't say them here. But I will say this...in a Christian life, what is primarily impotant is to allow God and his word be true, though everyman be found a liar(Ro 3:4). Jehovah examines the heart and he knows each circumstances a Christian is in. |
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