MZLady39:



Hi Bro. Enshy,
Just for clarification purposes, (and not to be rude), but please address Bro. Splinz' post separately from mine cause the way you addressed us made it seem like we are the same person.
We are not. I am a female...he is a male.
I use only 1 activated moniker on this site.
Okay..now back to the post. Brother, you know I love you...but there's a way to address situations. This is where the balance comes in. We have to be careful not to err on the side of fanaticism...nor be too nonchalant. Examples: The Pharisees and Saducees.
I answered the OP's question believing that he was sincere and I still feel that way.
Now who decides to post on the thread...I can't control that. We have to truly use discernment on who's being deliberately false (to only cause confusion) and who's sincerely searching but is in error. We have to be very careful "dismissing" people as lost hopes.
Some brethren use more scriptures (which is the way to go) than others...but it's okay to have a decent discussion (without name-calling, ridicule and ignorant remarks) to get a point across. Lots of information is put out. People have to pray fervently so that the Holy Spirit will convict and guide into all truth. I'm not ready to give up on folks completely...cause there are some sincere and searching folks out there.
Now if discussions start getting messy and vile, I move on. I'm not for the argumentation.

enshy:

...Splinz, remember we have been warned in scriptures not to give heed to every wind of doctrine.
My dears, you have the truth, dont give thoughts to false preachers!
The Bible commands that we confront and shut them up!
If any man or an angel from heaven teaches any other gospel other than these you have both posted, let him be accursed! Amen!!

Splinz:


Thanks bro. Yes, it is indeed true that a curse is placed on those who pervert the gospel of Christ (Galatians 1:. But saddening enough, people wouldn't stop peddling every wind of inconsistent doctrines.

The Bible is our ultimate authority (though to some, it isn't), and in it, we've seen that salvation is not automatic, that one can lost it!

MZLady39:



Welll......ummmm.....I've gotta disagree with you on all points (except the Nigerian part--which I'm sure you would know since you are, I'm presuming a citizen). But we'll take it up later I guess...not right now.

ichuka:

Ok
Till then
Cheers

MZLady39:


Hi Sir,
Honestly, I have a headache....so I just want easy reading right now. Don't want to go into a deep discussion today. But you have an interesting interpretation.....

akin33:
I was under a particular bible study when a pastor asked a question " can a Christian lose his salvation?" I said yes. But pastors said NO. In Psalm 51;1-19, Especially;

10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.

11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.

12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit. This verses and many in the Bible made it clear that man can actually lose his salvation.

My fellow Christians, kindly throw more light to this

MZLady39:
Yes...a Christian can lose his/her salvation.
It's popoularly preached, "once saved, always saved".
That is lie from the enemy...and is deceiving many Christians.
The price of salvation has been paid through Jesus' blood on the cross. He has redeemed mankind and that cannot be reversed.
However, if one decides to continue deliberately living a sinful life, then he/she should not expect to enter the eternal Kingdom (Romans 6:1, Gal. 6:7, 1 Cor 6:9).
If it were as simple as accepting Christ with no conditions, then why did He die? We have to be obedient to His standards.

ichuka:

My dear Sis,
Presumed the ache has gone by now.if not it will leave soonest.
Do try and take some drugs or better still rest abit.
Cheers

Junia:


If one delibrately live in sin he wasn't even a Christian. No Christian delibrately live in sin.
Salvation cannot be lost.
If you are saved, you are for Christ. Thus, you don't live for yourself. If you start living your old sinful lifestyle, then it is clear that you didn't know what you were doing when you were receiving Christ. You didn't become a Christian at all. You were just a wolf in a sheep cloth.

JideAmuGiaka:


The counsel of Paul was to remind them of the impending danger of losing the Holly spirit. Paul knew that it is only sin that will make the Holy spirit to depart from them. One cannot be an armed robber and claim to posses the Holy spirit in him. Jesus told His disciples that it is expedient that He goes so that Holy spirit will come and teach and guide them in all things. The Holy spirit is a Teacher and a Guider.

MZLady39:



Ok brother....well I certainly see what you are saying. But the problem is a vast majority of Christians are engaged in some form of sin. It's a fact. We all have experienced that or are currently struggling with something.
Perhaps the pastors need to preach Christ' righteousness & victory over sin more so than prosperity.

Junia:

Yes. We all have one or two weaknesses and we have accepted it but it shouldn't be so. The Bible teaches that we have power over sin. This is because of the indwelling of The Holy Spirit. One way or the other we may sin, but it shouldn't be a consious sin. Eg; Someone lusting after you though you have dressed decently.
1 John 3:9
No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.


From this scripture, you can clearly see that anyone who claima to be a Christian and continues to live in sin is actually not born of God. He or she is just claiming to be what he is not. Following Christ demands total surrendering of our will and do what actually pleases Him.

MZLady39:


You are correct.

MZLady39:


You are correct.

Junia:

Okay.
So salvation cannot be lost.
John 10:27-29
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Okay.
So salvation cannot be lost.
John 10:27-29
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Okay.
So salvation cannot be lost.
John 10:27-29
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

MZLady39:


So it's moreso about "wording". The point is a person who surrenders to Christ must be an overcomer or he/she will not enter the kingdom. One cannot continue sinning, claim Christ & expect to enter the kingdom. Salvation for a sincere follower of Christ cannot be lost.

MZLady39:


Thanks....what I was trying to do was let it wear off without any medication...and it has. I appreciate your concern. So you do believe that salvation can be lost? Or should the wording be different?

ichuka:

Thank God you are ok now.
It's not possible for a true believer to lose his/her Salvation.
Roms8:28And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, whoi have been called according to his purpose. 29For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers and sisters. 30And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.
Go through the above verses in Roman and tell me how someone called into Gods Devine purpose can be lost.
That's someone He FOREKNEW,PREDESTINED,CALLED,JUSTIFIED and GLORIFIED can lose his/her Salvation.
Let's start there.

MZLady39:


Thanks brother. Sorry but we have a 6 hrs. difference so I might not be on at the time you are...hence the later responses. The time on NL is Nigeria's time. Just wanted to make you aware...if you weren't.
I'm on now....will leave and then come back later.
But you can begin.

ichuka:

Ok,
Romans 8:29 says, "Those whom He foreknew, He also predestinated to be conformed to the image of His Son." Verse 30, a parenthetical word, says, "And those whom He predestinated, these He also called; and those whom He called, these He also justified; and those whom He justified, these He also glorified." The salvation that we are talking about involves all the things covered in verses 29 and 30. The history of our salvation began with justification in verse 30. We were saved at the time that we were justified. We only know that we have believed in Jesus and that we have been saved and justified. We think that justification is our first encounter with God. We think that the first time we touched God in our life was when we were justified. But the Bible says that God touched us long ago. He knew us long ago.Our justification came afterwards.God's knowledge of us came first.Some have said that Romans 8:29-30 is the only chain in the entire Bible. It is a chain of different rings linked together. This is a most precious and complete chain. The first ring of this chain is God's foreknowledge of man. The second ring is our predestination to be conformed to the image of His Son. The third ring is the calling of those who have been predestinated. The fourth ring is the justification of those who have been called. The fifth ring is the glorification of those who have been justified. It is a series of rings linked to one another. We think that we first knew God when we were saved and justified. But the Bible says that before we were saved and justified, God knew us already. Those whom God knew long ago, He marked out. To be marked out means to have a check mark put by our name, indicating that He has claimed us for Himself. For what purpose were we marked out? It is so that we would be like His unique Son, Jesus Christ. He not only wants one Son, Jesus Christ; He came to mark us out so that we would be identical to His Son. Those who were marked out are called. The ones who are called are known by Him. He called the ones whom He knew and marked out. After He called them, He justified them.
we have to know that the history of our relationship with God does not start from justification and salvation. Rather, it starts from God's foreknowledge. God's foreknowledge is the beginning of everything. To be marked out is the second step. To be called is the third step. Only after the third step do we have justification. If we were to lose our justification and become sinners again, we would put a question mark on God's omniscience. Since God foreknew us and marked us out, how can we still perish after we are saved? A person predestinated by God can never be thrown into hell and burned like a piece of wood.In addition, there is another item. The Lord says, "Those whom He justified, these He also glorified" (v. 30). Unless God brings those whom He justified into glory, His work is not complete.If we cannot get into the new heaven and the new earth, and if we cannot enter into eternal glory, God's work is not complete. The last ring of God's work is glory. Until we are inglory, God's work is notcomplete. This is God's Word. What are we going to do with it? We cannot set it aside. God says that those whom He justified will enter into glory unconditionally. He does not say that those who are justified will enter into glory if they have good works. He does not say that only those whose works are approved can enter into glory. Neither does God say that those whom He justified must also be considered saved by man before they can enter into glory. There are no such conditions. All of the things that are mentioned here are related to God. It is God who foreknew. It is God who predestinated. It is God who destined us to be like His Son and to be conformed to the image of the Son of God. It is God who has called us and justified us. It is God who will bring us, the justified ones, into glory. It is also God who will bring us into the new heaven and the new earth to inherit the eternal glory.

MZLady39:


Ok...I read it once. I'll need to re-read it though...cause there's lot of info here.

MZLady39:


Ok...I read it once. I'll need to re-read it though...cause there's lot of info here.

ichuka:

Also in Philippians 1:6New International Version (NIV)
6 being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.

Philippians 1:6 says that God has begun a good work in us. Since God has started it and has given us salvation Himself, He must complete this work until the day of Christ Jesus. We must remember that the work of God never stops halfway. He will complete this work until the day of Christ Jesus, that is, until God glorifies us. We can see how far-reaching is God's Word, how wide its scope, how long it lasts, and how deep its roots. Verse 6 says, "Being confident of this very thing, that He who has begun in you a good work will complete it until the day of Christ Jesus." Either God will not start, or He will have to finish what He has started. If God was not willing to save us, that would be the end of the story. But if God's desire is to save us, there will be no way for us not to be saved. Therefore, we can say, "God, we thank and praise You, because our salvation is eternally secure." If it were up to us to follow up, we would fail. The work of following up is accomplished by Him; the work of preservation is also accomplished by Him. We can never follow up what He has started.

MZLady39:


Yes...He will complete that good work...but we must continue abiding in Him and allowing Him to do so. He is not a God of force.

ichuka:

My Sis,
There's nothing like force here.we died in Christ remember?
The Holy Spirit is suppose to be in charge of our life's now,so there's no need of force or our own will and thoughts.

MZLady39:


I understand you. Some people think God is a God of force. They feel like he forces worship of Him through fear.

akin33:
MZLady39, ok. am expecting it soon

Steep:
Don't confuse assurance of salvation with salvation itself, while it is necessary for all who claim that christ is their Lord or think they stand to make sure they are really standing or they are really in the faith, there is huge evidence in the bible that those who are truly saved will never lose their salvation.