@Laduna1,

I understand where you are coming from in regards to falling into shirk.

Mind you i‘ll never be discussing esoterics with a “common“ muslim literalist who‘s got no idea of what willayah is, in the first place.

The problem with such people as i‘ve come to realize is - IGNORANCE coupled with HYPOCRISY.

I mean, why are they always selective when labeling acts as shirk ?

For example, they consider seeking assistance from human as fine but getting one from the jinn, angel e.t.c as shirk, are humans, jinns & angels not all creatures ?

Its proper to run to the hospital when you are sick, for treatment but you cant run to the coven for assistance lols, it‘ll amount to shirk, like seriously? Is‘nt the scale of sharia what matters in weighing acts ?

I was with some1 with such rustic mentality sometime in the past during an accident & i was like “YA SOMEBODY!!!“ (laughs), he had to stop what he was doing to give me a 101 on who to call during duress, how calling on someone other than God translates to shirk, as they are just creatures like me & him, what the hadith has taught to be recited bla bla bla...

I was like, really ? Now tell me mr. ahl-sunnah...

#The mechanic you call for help whenever your vehicle breaks down, is he God ? NO!

#The 911 you call for help during violence, is that God‘s hotline ? NO!

#The lawyers you call during legal battles, the doctor who‘s instructions you follow so religiously, are they God? NO!

#So why cant i call onto my YA SOMEBODY! Abi are they not all creatures ni?

#Is not who one has @ the backdrop of ones mind as the real LORD of the acts that matters ?

#Like the example you gave on occasionalism, that fire not by necessity the burner, but God...Once one can see past the immediate agency to realize the real GOD of ritual, one is save. The loser in that hadith failed that realization.

#This your recount of anecdotes, shey na just the heading be that ni abi full story...b‘cos i‘m not understandin the economics.

Slm

ikupakuti:
@Laduna1,

I understand where you are coming from in regards to falling into shirk.

Mind you i‘ll never be discussing esoterics with a “common“ muslim literalist who‘s got no idea of what willayah is, in the first place.

The problem with such people as i‘ve come to realize is - IGNORANCE coupled with HYPOCRISY.

I mean, why are they always selective when labeling acts as shirk ?

For example, they consider seeking assistance from human as fine but getting one from the jinn, angel e.t.c as shirk, are humans, jinns & angels not all creatures ?

Its proper to run to the hospital when you are sick, for treatment but you cant run to the coven for assistance lols, it‘ll amount to shirk, like seriously? Is‘nt the scale of sharia what matters in weighing acts ?

I was with some1 with such rustic mentality sometime in the past during an accident & i was like “YA SOMEBODY!!!“ (laughs), he had to stop what he was doing to give me a 101 on who to call during duress, how calling on someone other than God translates to shirk, as they are just creatures like me & him, what the hadith has taught to be recited bla bla bla...

I was like, really ? Now tell me mr. ahl-sunnah...

#The mechanic you call for help whenever your vehicle breaks down, is he God ? NO!

#The 911 you call for help during violence, is that God‘s hotline ? NO!

#The lawyers you call during legal battles, the doctor who‘s instructions you follow so religiously, are they God? NO!

#So why cant i call onto my YA SOMEBODY! Abi are they not all creatures ni?

#Is not who one has @ the backdrop of ones mind as the real LORD of the acts that matters ?

#Like the example you gave on occasionalism, that fire not by necessity the burner, but God...Once one can see past the immediate agency to realize the real GOD of ritual, one is save. The loser in that hadith failed that realization.

#This your recount of anecdotes, shey na just the heading be that ni abi full story...b‘cos i‘m not understandin the economics.

Slm

Loools...I am laughing in 3D the way you let loose everything. I don't think there's necessity to go to that area or extent, because, you see, a diametrically opposite view on certain issue doesn't necessarily has to be generalized.

The hadith I quoted as to be taking from the context I used it i.e. my reservation for study of Astrology and an ability not be able to see "past" the agency as you rightly put, that's a failure. Mor

Moreover, discussing "Wilayah" from your understanding will go along way of further explaining what as already been said by the prophet (saw) in this hadith;

"On the authority of Abu Hurayrah (may Allah be pleased with him), who said that the Messenger of Allah (ﷺ) said:

Allah (mighty and sublime be He) said: Whosoever shows enmity to someone devoted to Me, I shall be at war with him.

My servant draws not near to Me with anything more loved by Me than the religious duties I have enjoined upon him, and My servant continues to draw near to Me with supererogatory works so that I shall love him. When I love him I am his hearing with which he hears, his seeing with which he sees, his hand with which he strikes and his foot with which he walks. Were he to ask [something] of Me, I would surely give it to him, and were he to ask Me for refuge, I would surely grant him it. I do not hesitate about anything as much as I hesitate about [seizing] the soul of My faithful servant: he hates death and I hate hurting him. It was related by al-Bukhari."

I love the deduction of Imam IBN ARABI types of Wilayah in this hadith: Tawliyah and Tawaliy. Do u have anything to share in this regard. No literalist here bro! Lols

It really elevating and gratifying sharing things bro.

Thanks.

LadunaI:


You welcome back @empiree. I hope Se.un hasn't send @emekaraj to same solitary confinement. Lols

what's your take? you've been silent lately.

I have to keep reading and learning for now. Seu.n's robot blocked me again 2days ago. Just being bailed out few minutes ago NL lawyer. Make i keep my eyes open for now to avoid ban. This is some deep stuff you people are writing. Make I keep learning.

ikupakuti:
@Laduna1,

I understand where you are coming from in regards to falling into shirk.

Mind you i‘ll never be discussing esoterics with a “common“ muslim literalist who‘s got no idea of what willayah is, in the first place.

The problem with such people as i‘ve come to realize is - IGNORANCE coupled with HYPOCRISY.

I mean, why are they always selective when labeling acts as shirk ?

For example, they consider seeking assistance from human as fine but getting one from the jinn, angel e.t.c as shirk, are humans, jinns & angels not all creatures ?

I can relate to this actually. I understand. It is indeed hypocrisy. Same with bidah stuff. See the bold they dont understand.

@Laduna1,

Lols,

I‘ve never come across ibn. Al-arabi‘s exegesis of that hadith before. Did he write a book on those terms ?

But in regards to the quoted hadith, the class of wilayya described by the holy Prophet (s.a.w) there in, is the superior class (wilayyatul kubra), which comes after the completion of ma‘arifa & after individuality has been attained, @least from fardaniyya to qutbaniyyatul uzma.

Those are the ones who have access to محبة الذات , the unique divine love he‘s refering to.

The actual state he‘s refering to in which the individual self through self oblitration gets totaly absorbed in the “universal soul“ and exists no more in actuality, where & when there is “nothing“ left & that “nothing“ is God, then.

That state is momentarily accessible (hal) for the floor members of wilayyatul kubra but a permanent state (maqam) for the al-qutbul al-jami‘. Those qualities mentioned are strictly qutbaniyya‘s affair.

It was during a momentary seizure by that state, al-hallaj made that his “infamous“ declearation.

Empiree:
I can relate to this actually. I understand. It is indeed hypocrisy. Same with bidah stuff. See the bold they dont understand.

Sure. They are so illogical & unreasonable to deal with.

Thats why i dont like engaging them on here.

Wlcm back bro.

ikupakuti:




Sure. They are so illogical & unreasonable to deal with.

Thats why i dont like engaging them on here.

Wlcm back bro.

Right. I dont care engaging them for as long as i am in mood. I see holes in their ideology

ikupakuti:
@Laduna1,

Lols,

I‘ve never come across ibn. Al-arabi‘s exegesis of that hadith before. Did he write a book on those terms ?

But in regards to the quoted hadith, the class of wilayya described by the holy Prophet (s.a.w) there in, is the superior class (wilayyatul kubra), which comes after the completion of ma‘arifa & after individuality has been attained, @least from fardaniyya to qutbaniyyatul uzma.

Those are the ones who have access to محبة الذات , the unique divine love he‘s refering to.

The actual state he‘s refering to in which the individual self through self oblitration gets totaly absorbed in the “universal soul“ and exists no more in actuality, where & when there is “nothing“ left & that “nothing“ is God, then.

That state is momentarily accessible (hal) for the floor members of wilayyatul kubra but a permanent state (maqam) for the al-qutbul al-jami‘. Those qualities mentioned are strictly qutbaniyya‘s affair.

It was during a momentary seizure by that state, al-hallaj made that his “infamous“ declearation.

OK...understood.

No, is not that Ibn arabi wrote a book on that, but it was an extract from his various discourses. As for the commentary on that hadith, yes he did made that when treating the subject. I will check for reference or soft copy of it in my archive.

Interesting to know about fardinayyah to Qutbaniyyah in wiliyah kubra. From Ibn Arabi write up regarding that hadith, he said tha, there some individual (waliy) which are more "favour" than the others in terms of THEOPHANY experience and capacity.

Are you describing Fana-fi-fana in that your paragraph where individual with complete effacement total absorbed? By the way who are the floor member of Wilayah kubra? Is it those that don't have complete characteristics describe in the hadith I.e their ears, eyes, hand and feet completely transformed?

@ al hallaj, I thought is one of those Ibn arabi said they do not return (fanau), while other return with authority (baqau).

Thanks

Empiree:
I have to keep reading and learning for now. Seu.n's robot blocked me again 2days ago. Just being bailed out few minutes ago NL lawyer. Make i keep my eyes open for now to avoid ban. This is some deep stuff you people are writing. Make I keep learning.

@NL lawyer ...lols

That anti-spam boot na wah oo, but hopefully henceforth nothing of sort will happen again.

You're most welcome back.

@Laduna1,

#Yes, basically maqam determines level of influx, theophany & capacity. Until one exceeds alamal khalq, his theophany would be confined to what is obtainable within that capacity (theophany behind act, veil, fana while still concious of self in the state of fana etc).

#Yes, thats fana-fi-fana, like a dream within a dream, where only one wakefullness is possible lols...that bye bye to “reality“ for life, because if you should wake up, your conciousness will be trapped in the state of the first dream, with chances of you regaining your “real“ conciousness totally sealed off.

#The floor members are the aspirants of alamal amr while still based @ jabarut, those whose ruhs (a native of jabarut) have attained total purification just the way it was before being infused into the body which is the fullness of ma‘arifatul sugra. Those at that level are the fardaniyya aspirants.

#Yes, even those @ alamal amr do not possess those full characteristics described, they still have 2 more realm to transcend ahead of them.

#Yes, al-hallaj did not return from the seizure & kept reiterating the ineffable until he got struck by the “reflex current“ .

#Ibn haneef as-sheerazy recounted that, he slept and dreamt of al-qiyyamat after the demise of al-hallaj, men were assembled for reckoning, that he said to God “ my God, indeed al-hallaj is a walliy from your awliyyah but you instigate your creatures againt him“ & God replied “I taught him a secret from among my secrets & he divulged same before my creatures, so I instigated them against him“.

افشاء سر الربوبية كفر

Heebah:
I totally agree with u. @ emekaraj,my husband wants to get in touch with u. How can he do that. Jazakallahu khairan

Really for what purpose? Hope u know am nt a mallam, am trying to find Anna's my self

LadunaI:


Ehhh bro @emekaraj, where are thou ? I'm a bit curious when I was going thru the above post again.

If I may ask, which language are you conversing with, with those jinns?

You should be updating us steadily now, so that we can be having active and roboust discussions, as @ikupakuti and @empiree are there for us to moderate effectively.

Thanks

Am quite busy dats problem, an am nt much an internet person, am just trying my best, but I promised wenever i have time I will continue Sharin my experience and responding to mention, As for ur question in all my meeting with them we use my language, I dnt remember using English but I do recite Quran dat I dnt remember memorizing sometimes.

emekaRaj:


Really for what purpose? Hope u know am nt a mallam, am trying to find Anna's my self

Lol! I know u r not a mallam,he is also a spiritualist. I guess he wants to learn one or two things from u. But if u feel otherwise,no wahala. Thanks

LadunaI:


Lols...its kinda funny, but honestly I just feel like try to know more because a really that experience @emekaraj describing somehow "unique".

Why? because, unlike vision or dream in which there is partial suspension of five sense, this seems to me, he was active both with his spiritual and physical senses.

Of course one communicate in ones native language must time in dream or vision.

That experience he was describing is more than 'shell' were ruh leaves the body temporarily.

Well according to my wife dat was holding me through out an reciting, she said my lips was moving but no sound, meanwhile they told me to tell my wife to reduce d recitation as she was screaming an they couldn't hear me.

They escort me an my wife home dat was d day I know dat dogs can see jinn, a dog came out from a Conner saw them an stoped, so dey wave the dog to get out d way. D dog run to d other side but didn't Berk tho.

Heebah:
Please where is d op @emekaraj?? I mentioned u in a post,please can u get back to me? Thanks

Am sorry sister I have replied you, I have been quite busy

Heebah:
Lol! I know u r not a mallam,he is also a spiritualist. I guess he wants to learn one or two things from u. But if u feel otherwise,no wahala. Thanks

Sorry but I have been warned not to got to just any spiritualist, my mallam is my relation he warned me everyday. So I dnt go to anyone except my mallam .

I dnt know if you understand but I will share my experience on the reason.

In response to heeba

The reason why I don't goto any spiritualist is I once went to see one, and he gave me something to use. I kept the thing at home an forget to use it that night I had a dream dat d mallam brought the stuff for me to drink, and I told him to keep dat I was still going to drink it. And he started insisting dat I drink, an I said is it by force? D next tin I saw another man came an d two of them were trying to force me to drink it. I escaped an he started chasing me. He chased me till I met one one old woman who hid me from him, d nxt day I dreamt dat he was chasing me again it repeated till d 3rd day.

The fourth day I went to my mallam an he shouted dat I should never goto any mallam again except him, that wen something happened dat I dnt understand I should come to him alone. He told me to go an throw dat thing he gave me away.

emekaRaj:


Sorry but I have been warned not to got to just any spiritualist, my mallam is my relation he warned me everyday. So I dnt go to anyone except my mallam .

I dnt know if you understand but I will share my experience on the reason.

Am sorry I didn't come clear to u,when I say spiritualist,I don't mean mallam or a soothsayer. What I mean is dat he is so interested in this type of ur gift and would love to tap from ur experience cos he has some of ur traits too. I think he was interested wen I told him about what I read in ur post. He is not a nairalander though,dats y he can't get in touch with u himself. Hope u understand now

Last week Friday I went to d market to buy something, upon coming out of the market, a man was calling me I tot he was a beger an I said I dnt have changed pls. D man insist dat he wanted to see me. I stoped an he came to meet me.

Our conversation.

Man; do you remember me?

Me: surely NO

Man: What are u holding.
Me: ha! I can't tell u now
Man: I know anyway

He started mentioning everything in the leather I was holding, I tot may be he must hav seen me buying them

Then he ask if I always have vision of going to help save people.

I was like ha what's that, I dnt know Wat u r talking about oo. I denied.

He laughed an said its OK am like you only dat am in higher rank Dan he is. I was like pls I want to go am in hase,

Then he started telling me all the vision I have been having even the one I narrated above about meeting jinn, he narrated it in details an I was shocked

He told me dat d vision of saving helpless pple is real an dat dats exactly the purpose God has brought me to achieve even tho I dnt like it I must achieve it. I told him I hav been thinking lately bcoz of financial problems an i haven't been having visions lately.
He laughed an said weather am seeing vision now or not my spirit is always out their working dat dats why I feel tired sometimes , dat even now dat he is talking to me iam somewhere else doing my job, I shout he said dnt be scared wen am ready I will know everything an it will be come normal

I told him am tired sef I dnt want to be seeing anything again, am owin alot of pple an I can't help my self so WATS d use, he laff an said am just a kid I dnt know who Iam, dat time is coming Wen I will be so strong dat I can be a spiritualist an make money from it, I said i dnt want I just want a good paying job, He said If he ask me to leave my job now I will think he is crazy, dat am going to be very rich an well know for having money but this my job is not for me. I ask what is? He said he won't tell me, but I while find out soon.

Well so many things he told me but it will sound somehow saying it here, well i dnt even know if to believe anyway but he did say he dnt want to tell me something dat will make me feel too big to worship Allah. He said continue ur prayers an continue been the good person u hav always been, if only u know how much it's helping u.

He warned me nt to go to any spiritualist, dat I dnt want to become incomplete.

So I ask where he is leaving so I can Meet him cos I hav more questions.

He said I won't know d address I said there's no where I Dnt know in Dis town.

He ask if I have ever gone back to the same exact place in my vision twice ,I said no, he said that's why I can't see him again

Imeditely I left him I turned an he is no where to be found, I turn to see if ppl notice Wat just happened but everybody where just going about their business like nothing happened

It was wen I got home I remember seeing the man wen I was a kid I was in primary dnt remember my age. He was sitting on a passage to my house ,a similar conversation took place, he told me about who iam but as a kid I tot it was just an old man telling me fairy tales. Same thing happened I turned an he is gone.

Pls Hope it doesn't sound like bragging.... This is no joke, bcoz d pain I go through just to see a vision an subsequent headache dat follows is terrible is nt easy. Nobody would wish for this, just want a normal life like my friends

Heebah:
Am sorry I didn't come clear to u,when I say spiritualist,I don't mean mallam or a soothsayer. What I mean is dat he is so interested in this type of ur gift and would love to tap from ur experience cos he has some of ur traits too. I think he was interested wen I told him about what I read in ur post. He is not a nairalander though,dats y he can't get in touch with u himself. Hope u understand now

OK I understand I will send my email to ur box an take it from their

ikupakuti:
@Laduna1,

#Yes, basically maqam determines level of influx, theophany & capacity. Until one exceeds alamal khalq, his theophany would be confined to what is obtainable within that capacity (theophany behind act, veil, fana while still concious of self in the state of fana etc).

#Yes, thats fana-fi-fana, like a dream within a dream, where only one wakefullness is possible lols...that bye bye to “reality“ for life, because if you should wake up, your conciousness will be trapped in the state of the first dream, with chances of you regaining your “real“ conciousness totally sealed off.

#The floor members are the aspirants of alamal amr while still based @ jabarut, those whose ruhs (a native of jabarut) have attained total purification just the way it was before being infused into the body which is the fullness of ma‘arifatul sugra. Those at that level are the fardaniyya aspirants.

#Yes, even those @ alamal amr do not possess those full characteristics described, they still have 2 more realm to transcend ahead of them.

#Yes, al-hallaj did not return from the seizure & kept reiterating the ineffable until he got struck by the “reflex current“ .

#Ibn haneef as-sheerazy recounted that, he slept and dreamt of al-qiyyamat after the demise of al-hallaj, men were assembled for reckoning, that he said to God “ my God, indeed al-hallaj is a walliy from your awliyyah but you instigate your creatures againt him“ & God replied “I taught him a secret from among my secrets & he divulged same before my creatures, so I instigated them against him“.

افشاء سر الربوبية كفر

Excellent!!! I duff my hat... I will need more time to meditate so as to seriously assimilate the details you have just wrote up there. You've stretch my spiritual horizons with these descriptions bro, thanks.

However, dream within dream has to be further expansiated. From experience, though the sub dream consciousness is fully awake consciousness as you described, and what transpired then can be fully grasped, and simultaneously with consciousness that is NOT normal activities but "active dream".

Moreover, the re- entry to normal "dream land" usher in lost of consciousness of knowing the dichotomy, hence once think is normal day to day activities whereas it indeed dream, then there after come the normal waking up.

Is it that the more deep and gravity theophany experience in sub dream , the more its highly getting trapped? I just need some little more clarification there.

Thanks

emekaRaj:



Well according to my wife dat was holding me through out an reciting, she said my lips was moving but no sound, meanwhile they told me to tell my wife to reduce d recitation as she was screaming an they couldn't hear me.

They escort me an my wife home dat was d day I know dat dogs can see jinn, a dog came out from a Conner saw them an stoped, so dey wave the dog to get out d way. D dog run to d other side but didn't Berk tho.

Thanks bro, you're most welcome back.

OK...we'll always understand the reason for your absence now.

All the best. Thanks

emekaRaj:
Last week Friday I went to d market to buy something, upon coming out of the market, a man was calling me I tot he was a beger an I said I dnt have changed pls. D man insist dat he wanted to see me. I stoped an he came to meet me.

Our conversation.

Man; do you remember me?

Me: surely NO

Man: What are u holding.
Me: ha! I can't tell u now
Man: I know anyway

He started mentioning everything in the leather I was holding, I tot may be he must hav seen me buying them

Then he ask if I always have vision of going to help save people.

I was like ha what's that, I dnt know Wat u r talking about oo. I denied.

He laughed an said its OK am like you only dat am in higher rank Dan he is. I was like pls I want to go am in hase,

Then he started telling me all the vision I have been having even the one I narrated above about meeting jinn, he narrated it in details an I was shocked

He told me dat d vision of saving helpless pple is real an dat dats exactly the purpose God has brought me to achieve even tho I dnt like it I must achieve it. I told him I hav been thinking lately bcoz of financial problems an i haven't been having visions lately.
He laughed an said weather am seeing vision now or not my spirit is always out their working dat dats why I feel tired sometimes , dat even now dat he is talking to me iam somewhere else doing my job, I shout he said dnt be scared wen am ready I will know everything an it will be come normal

I told him am tired sef I dnt want to be seeing anything again, am owin alot of pple an I can't help my self so WATS d use, he laff an said am just a kid I dnt know who Iam, dat time is coming Wen I will be so strong dat I can be a spiritualist an make money from it, I said i dnt want I just want a good paying job, He said If he ask me to leave my job now I will think he is crazy, dat am going to be very rich an well know for having money but this my job is not for me. I ask what is? He said he won't tell me, but I while find out soon.

Well so many things he told me but it will sound somehow saying it here, well i dnt even know if to believe anyway but he did say he dnt want to tell me something dat will make me feel too big to worship Allah. He said continue ur prayers an continue been the good person u hav always been, if only u know how much it's helping u.

He warned me nt to go to any spiritualist, dat I dnt want to become incomplete.

So I ask where he is leaving so I can Meet him cos I hav more questions.

He said I won't know d address I said there's no where I Dnt know in Dis town.

He ask if I have ever gone back to the same exact place in my vision twice ,I said no, he said that's why I can't see him again

Imeditely I left him I turned an he is no where to be found, I turn to see if ppl notice Wat just happened but everybody where just going about their business like nothing happened

It was wen I got home I remember seeing the man wen I was a kid I was in primary dnt remember my age. He was sitting on a passage to my house ,a similar conversation took place, he told me about who iam but as a kid I tot it was just an old man telling me fairy tales. Same thing happened I turned an he is gone.

Pls Hope it doesn't sound like bragging.... This is no joke, bcoz d pain I go through just to see a vision an subsequent headache dat follows is terrible is nt easy. Nobody would wish for this, just want a normal life like my friends

Thanks for sharing. I pray good things come your way. As always, TAQWA should be your watch word.

All the best bro.

Heebah:
Am sorry I didn't come clear to u,when I say spiritualist,I don't mean mallam or a soothsayer. What I mean is dat he is so interested in this type of ur gift and would love to tap from ur experience cos he has some of ur traits too. I think he was interested wen I told him about what I read in ur post. He is not a nairalander though,dats y he can't get in touch with u himself. Hope u understand now

It will be nice if you can persuade your hubby to be part of discussion in any little way he deem fit. That is going to be helpful for others also, as he is trying to tap from @emakaraj experience.

All the best sister and to your hubby!

@Laduna1,

#Thank you too, actually its being pleasure discussing with your eloquent self, I commend!

#I only tried to make an analogy by relating fana with dream, thats fana-fi-fana ~ dream within a dream vis-a-vis.

#Yes, the deeper one progresses on the ladder of gnosis the more the individual self gets trapped in absentness (fana).

#The glory of wilayya which is maarifa is classified into 2 - the inferior for the “choosen“ & the superior for the “choosen“ of the “choosen“

#The theophany of the choosen (they are comprised of natives of wilayyatul sugra & kubra with the exception of the fard-l-jaami ) constitutes the partial or total effacement (fana) of the individual self but with the awareness of that fana still retained in the subconcious of the faani. So whatever the level of fana whether in acts or attributes or in essence it self so far the awareness of such still remains while in that state, such is still within the inferior class of theophany.

#Then the theophany of the choosen of the choosens is literarily the total effacement of the individual self while trapped in the state of the previous fana (thats what i was alluding to as “dream within a dream“).

#Those occupying the acme of the previous class do experience this unique state momentarily...it doesnt endure for them (as i earlier stated in previous post) but a permanent condition for the choosen of the choosen (al-qutb al-jaami).

Thanks.

@Emekaraj, you wlcm back...loool @ being afraid.

This whole stuff seem like meditation.

Raintaker:
This whole stuff seem like meditation.

Welcome To The World Of Islamic Spirituality

ikupakuti:
@Laduna1,

#Thank you too, actually its being pleasure discussing with your eloquent self, I commend!

#I only tried to make an analogy by relating fana with dream, thats fana-fi-fana ~ dream within a dream vis-a-vis.

#Yes, the deeper one progresses on the ladder of gnosis the more the individual self gets trapped in absentness (fana).

#The glory of wilayya which is maarifa is classified into 2 - the inferior for the “choosen“ & the superior for the “choosen“ of the “choosen“

#The theophany of the choosen (they are comprised of natives of wilayyatul sugra & kubra with the exception of the fard-l-jaami ) constitutes the partial or total effacement (fana) of the individual self but with the awareness of that fana still retained in the subconcious of the faani. So whatever the level of fana whether in acts or attributes or in essence it self so far the awareness of such still remains while in that state, such is still within the inferior class of theophany.

#Then the theophany of the choosen of the choosens is literarily the total effacement of the individual self while trapped in the state of the previous fana (thats what i was alluding to as “dream within a dream“).

#Those occupying the acme of the previous class do experience this unique state momentarily...it doesnt endure for them (as i earlier stated in previous post) but a permanent condition for the choosen of the choosen (al-qutb al-jaami).

Thanks.

@Emekaraj, you wlcm back...loool @ being afraid.

U wan kill person with English, tone am down small for us wey no Sabi science

LadunaI:


It will be nice if you can persuade your hubby to be part of discussion in any little way he deem fit. That is going to be helpful for others also, as he is trying to tap from @emakaraj experience.

All the best sister and to your hubby!

Quite right, after all that's the whole essence of starting the thread, I need to see more pple with similar experience share them, so it can educate others spiritually, let's all grow spiritually

ikupakuti:
@Laduna1,

#Thank you too, actually its being pleasure discussing with your eloquent self, I commend!

#I only tried to make an analogy by relating fana with dream, thats fana-fi-fana ~ dream within a dream vis-a-vis.

#Yes, the deeper one progresses on the ladder of gnosis the more the individual self gets trapped in absentness (fana).

#The glory of wilayya which is maarifa is classified into 2 - the inferior for the “choosen“ & the superior for the “choosen“ of the “choosen“

#The theophany of the choosen (they are comprised of natives of wilayyatul sugra & kubra with the exception of the fard-l-jaami ) constitutes the partial or total effacement (fana) of the individual self but with the awareness of that fana still retained in the subconcious of the faani. So whatever the level of fana whether in acts or attributes or in essence it self so far the awareness of such still remains while in that state, such is still within the inferior class of theophany.

#Then the theophany of the choosen of the choosens is literarily the total effacement of the individual self while trapped in the state of the previous fana (thats what i was alluding to as “dream within a dream“).

#Those occupying the acme of the previous class do experience this unique state momentarily...it doesnt endure for them (as i earlier stated in previous post) but a permanent condition for the choosen of the choosen (al-qutb al-jaami).

Thanks.

@Emekaraj, you wlcm back...loool @ being afraid.

All right bro. I see, what separate them in nutshell is degree of their effacement, total/ partial.

Definitely, it been really nice engaging you bro on this topic. hopefully, we share more on this forum to make us all a better person.

Thanks. I want to meditate on these concepts before delving into another one.

emekaRaj:


U wan kill person with English, tone am down small for us wey no Sabi science

Lols....such is his manner of eloquence. Really, very awe-inspiring.

emekaRaj:


U wan kill person with English, tone am down small for us wey no Sabi science

Lols....


I can relate to your last update!

فاصبر لحكم ربك و ﻻتكن كصاحب الحوت إذ نادى و هو مكظوم