How To Understand John 5:19 - Religion - Nairaland
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| How To Understand John 5:19 by alBHAGDADI: 7:34am On Mar 19, 2017 |
John 5:19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise. Did you read the above verse? People often quote it to support their notion that Yahshua the Messiah was just a prophet and not God. One thing they fail to do is check what he's responding to which helps to clarify what he said in the above verse. In verse 17 of that chapter, he was working on a Sabbath, and so he was approached by the Jews who were looking for the slightest excuse to nail him. The Sabbath is a day during which no work is to be done by any ISRAELite, but God is the only One who can work on that day cos he has to keep the universe going. For Jesus to be working on that day, they found it offensive. John 5:16 And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day. When Yahshua noticed their mood towards him, he made it clear to them why he has the right to work on a Sabbath day unlike other men. John 5:17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work. This statement of his clearly made him equal with God even as understood by the Jews cos it made them angry and sought the more to kill him. They knew anyone who accords himself the right to work on a Sabbath is making himself equal with God. John 5:18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. You see, at this point, it gets interesting cos Yahshua made some statements that his persecutors of today have read wrong meanings into instead of allowing his words to read meanings to them. Pls, read the verse below. John 5:19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise. Whenever Christians say Christ is God, some people of some other religious belief usually think we are calling him a separate deity. They come against it by quoting the part where he says "of himself he can do nothing", so he's just a prophet relying on God. What Yahshua the Messiah meant by making that statement is that if he was a separate deity on his own, he won't be able to do anything. But since he's part of God Almighty, he's able to do those things he does. If you read that verse 19 carefully, you will see that he affirms that strongly when he said he does what He sees God doing. This means that if God has the ability to sustain the universe, he also has that ability. But if he wasn't part of God but a separate deity, he won't be able to do those things himself. If you read the succeeding verses, you will see how much of part of God Yahshua is when he speaks of how God loves him and shows him everything. John 5:20 For the Father loveth the Son, and sheweth him all things that himself doeth: and he will shew him greater works than these, that ye may marvel. He also spoke of how God gave him the same ability to raise the dead. John 5:21 For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will. He continued by stating how God put every judgment in his hands. John 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: He went further to speak on how God gives him the right to be honoured the same way God himself is honoured. John 5:23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him. Yahshua the Messiah says you have to honour him the same way you honour God. This is made possible by the fact stated above that he has the same attributes as God. Do you remember the words "The Son can do nothing of himself"? If he was a separate deity, he won't be able to do all this and would have a separate attribute. But since he's part of God with the same attribute, he can exercise the same power. aminusanti annunaki2 4everGod ilynem Iwant2knowGod plappville plapville friendchoice malvisguy212 true2god rilwayne001 33 Likes 3 Shares |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by veekid(m): 7:37am On Mar 19, 2017 |
I'll show this to our pastor 6 Likes 1 Share |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by Nobody: 7:39am On Mar 19, 2017 |
For unto us a child is born and a son is given ..............and you shall call his name Wonderful,Counsellor,The Mighty God,The Everlasting Father and The Prince of Peace. Isaiah 9:6 So we can call Jesus the everlasting Father. Some sects say Jesus is just a mighty god. Why would they ignore the grammatical importance of the definite article,"the" in the phrase "the mighty God"?Why do they shun the meaning of the capital "G" in "the mighty God"? They also claim He is just mighty and not almighty. Jesus says in Matthew 28:18 that ALL POWER on earth and heaven is his. All POWER means all MIGHT. The adjective of that is the ALMIGHTY JESUS. In the beginning,God created the heavens and the earth.Gen1:1. The word translated God in that text is ELOHIM which is a plural word of EL. And it means THE STRONG ONES. God in 3 persons,blessed trinity. 12 Likes 1 Share |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by Lildrizzle(m): 7:41am On Mar 19, 2017 |
gud mawnin .happy Sunday |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by ITbomb(m): 8:10am On Mar 19, 2017 |
Please answer this question Was Jesus raised up from the dead (Act 2:24) or did he arose (Matt 28:7) NB: raised = by another higher power risen or arose = by one's power 3 Likes |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by zionmade2: 8:20am On Mar 19, 2017 |
ITbomb:Jesus made it clear wen he said"I am d RESURRECTION AND THE LIFE", He also said "I HAVE THE POWER TO LAY DOWN MY LIFE AND I HAVE THE POWER TO TAKE IT UP" Jesus was raised by d Holy spirit which is embodied in d father and embodied in d son, so Jesus was raised by his own spirit meaning dat Jesus raised himself. because just as u are a human watever ur spirit does is assumed dat u wer d one dat did it 13 Likes 2 Shares |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by alBHAGDADI: 8:28am On Mar 19, 2017 |
ITbomb:Your first part seems to want to claim that since it was written that he was raised, definitely by God, then it means he couldn't raise himself but relied on God. You forgot that he and his Father are one, and whatever his father does is done by him too. John 10:30 The Father and I are one." The words used in the second passage you quoted does not in any way say he rose from the dead without God's power. Saying that will mean he's a separate deity that can do whatever he likes without God's approval. But since he is seen always saying that he and his Father are one and whatever he sees his father do, the same he does, that means that it was God's plan that he rose from the dead. Guess what? Christ is part of God, that's why it was written that he rose from the dead. John 5:19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise. 7 Likes 2 Shares |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by alBHAGDADI: 8:33am On Mar 19, 2017 |
zionmade2:To add to this, we all know that the word Temple is often referring to the human body e.g your body is the temple of the Lord. This makes to understand clearly what Yahshua was talking about in the below verse. John 2:19 Jesus answered them, "Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days." He was killed, and in 3 days he resurrected. 6 Likes 1 Share |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by funnynation(m): 8:39am On Mar 19, 2017 |
.....and the summary of bible is love your neigbour as you love urself 2 Likes 1 Share |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by theunnamed: 8:40am On Mar 19, 2017 |
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| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by kayc0(f): 8:41am On Mar 19, 2017 |
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| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by twinskenny(m): 8:42am On Mar 19, 2017 |
Nice one op.. Great analysis |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by jaymejate: 8:42am On Mar 19, 2017 |
"They" always use this scripture against Christians but will NEVER want to read through. They have forgotten that every verse of the Bible is not just a sentence |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by Nobody: 8:52am On Mar 19, 2017 |
God is not the only one to work on that day. You too can work, depending on the importance. On the day of creation, he rested on that day because he had nothing more important to accomplished. On this day, He worked because there was something important to accomplished. Following His above steps, we too can also work on same day especially for life-saving duties and helping of one another. Let's help make this world a better place. 1 Like |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by Jdougha(m): 8:55am On Mar 19, 2017 |
From your thread it is very evident that you're of those trinity people, however even when it's clear that Jesus kept emphasizing on the fact that he was the son of God... Even the very chapter of the scripture you quoted clearly shows that.. How he made himself equal to God from that is what I find amazing according to you.... God the Father in creation, God In Jesus in redemption, God giving the Holy Spirit to regenerate.... 2 Likes 1 Share |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by MuttleyLaff: 8:58am On Mar 19, 2017 |
alBHAGDADI: Is any thing too hard for the LORD? - Genesis 18:14a Jesus looked at them intently and said, "Humanly speaking, it is impossible. But with God everything is possible." - Matthew 19:26 "Look, I am Yahweh, the God of all flesh. Is anything too difficult for Me? - Jeremiah 32:27 The summation of OP's above is that: God existed simultaneously in Heaven as God the Father, as He simultaneously existed on Earth, as God the Son And so, no one can successfully contest, that this is an impossible act (i.e. an unable to be done venture for God) nor successfully argue, that it's beyond the bounds of possibility and God's ability to exist at the same time, in more than one place 3 Likes 1 Share |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by Shafiiimran99: 8:59am On Mar 19, 2017 |
If u read ur post with open (neutral) mind u will realize that ur re contradicting yourself because ur post say Jesus does not equal to God. Eg in it u said God give him power to judge, why does he need power from God if he is equal to God? or don't u know what EQUAL mean 5 Likes |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by EternalBeing: 9:12am On Mar 19, 2017 |
ITbomb:Holiness is the key for original Destiny fulfilment. The most important thing is that He rose. The most feared and dreaded enemy of Man is Death. Not less feared by the rich than the poor. Before JESUS came satan used fear of death to make many to submit, pretending that he'll protect their lives. They end up killing other men and being used to destroy other lives to appease these demons that are supposedly protecting them. Alas, after being used to destroy others, they die when they least expect it. JESUS showed us that if we Men do the will of our CREATOR, we'll live forever. satan wanted and coveted to be worshiped, YAHWEH elevated JESUS as GOD above all to show that there's no limit to what HE can do/share with any Being that wholly and eternally submit to HIS Will. Holiness is the key for original Destiny fulfilment. |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by alBHAGDADI: 9:14am On Mar 19, 2017 |
Shafiiimran99:If he wants to go judging on his own accord, then he can ask well call himself a separate deity. But since everything God can do are what God has made it possible for him to do, then it is clear that he is part of God. If God gave him the power to judge, it means God sees him as his true representation or more as himself. John 14:19 Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'? |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by Yusuf54: 9:16am On Mar 19, 2017 |
I will like you to answer the following Questions; 1. Who is Jesus Christ.? Cos he was called a Prophet of God in Luke 18: 14-18, A Servant of God in Acts 3: 22-26,Acts 3: 13, A Messenger of God in Malachi 3 :1, God in John 1:1,Human Being in 1Timothy 2:5,Son of God in Matthew 8:29 and Son of Man in Matthew 16:13 and Mark 2:10.......2. You said JESUS CHRIST DOES JUDGE according to John 5:22,27,30 BUT according to JOHN 8 : 15 AND JOHN 12 :47,JESUS CHRIST DOES NOT JUDGE.. |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by ademasta(m): 9:17am On Mar 19, 2017 |
Good |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by miraclea: 9:19am On Mar 19, 2017 |
JOHN 1, 1 . IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD AND THE WORD WAS WITH GOD AND THE WORD WAS GOD HE WAS IN THE BEGINNING WITH GOD ALL THINGS WERE MADE THROUGH HIM AND WITHOUT HIM NOTHING WAS MADE IN VERSE 10 HE WAS IN THE WORLD AND THE WORLD WAS MADE THROUGH HIM AND THE WORLD KNEW HIM NOT 2 Likes |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by Shafiiimran99: 9:25am On Mar 19, 2017 |
alBHAGDADI:Being part part of God does not mean equal to God and not everything that God can do that he allowed Jesus to do. If Jesus has power to do everything y did he ask for God's help on the cross according to Bible? 1 Like 1 Share |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by shadeyinka(m): 9:26am On Mar 19, 2017 |
Shafiiimran99: Duality or Trinity as the case may be doesn't refer to different identities but the same identity in TWO/THREE morphs. I assume you are a Muslim therefore, I will ask you this question (according to Islamic theology) When a person dies, two Angels will ask him three questions as to 1. Who was his Lord while on earth: 2. What was his religion: AND 3. Who was his prophet The answer he gives will determine whether the Angels will make the grave comfortable for him or not. Now, my question is: Suppose as an infidel, I command my people not to bury me but put me in a glass case and put a 24/7 video surveilence: would the Angels still ask me those questions? If they do, are they referring to my Physical Body or the invisible me inside ME? Can't you see Duality playing out not to talk about trinity. That invisible me is the real me while my body is also the real me. A human being is a Trinity just as God is a Trinity! 3 Likes |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by alBHAGDADI: 9:27am On Mar 19, 2017 |
Yusuf54:He is a those things people said about him and more. in John 8:15, he said he is not going to judge the people he was talking to cos they judged him using human minds. It in no way says he is not going to judge humans at all. Pls, read the previous verse and the following one to understand better. As for John 12:47, you need to read to understand better what context he was speaking in. His first coming was to save mankind and show them the way to God, not to judge them at that moment. But now that he has shown mankind the way, the next coming will be to judge the ones that disobeyed. 2 Likes 1 Share |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by alBHAGDADI: 9:31am On Mar 19, 2017 |
Shafiiimran99:That was the flesh asking for connection with the heavenly. When he was on earth, he had to be human on all ways. 3 Likes 1 Share |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by OgbeniSamm(m): 9:38am On Mar 19, 2017 |
Shafiiimran99: Buroda, please go back and re read. The best way to learn is to unlearn. 3 Likes 1 Share |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by Ajixegun: 9:42am On Mar 19, 2017 |
Some people will even be asking where has Jesus mentioned Trinity. Mean while Mathew 28:18&19 pointed at it clearly. "[18] And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. [19] Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by Shafiiimran99: 9:47am On Mar 19, 2017 |
shadeyinka:Ya, they do wherever dead is and nobody will know what is going on but this doesn't justify Trinity claim 1 Like |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by acc001(f): 9:50am On Mar 19, 2017 |
alBHAGDADI: |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by acc001(f): 9:50am On Mar 19, 2017 |
kayc0:Dts king James version 1 Like |
| Re: How To Understand John 5:19 by Ajixegun: 9:51am On Mar 19, 2017 |
Shafiiimran99:. My brother read the post before your last post |
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