The Advent Of Allah

When God declared His name as "I am", "Yahweh" and "Jehovah" to the Israelites and was leading them out of Egypt, who was God to the Arabs at that time, and how were they worshiping him?

Allah has other names and none of them relates to Yahweh or Jehovah. In fact, allah's names do not have the same meaning as God's name in the Bible, even if interpreted in Arabic, why did his names change completely in islam as if he is a completely different God of the Bible?

Is it not reasonable to assume that islamic worship should be the religion both in Israel and Mecca at that time if truly Abraham actually established islam? But it is discovered that was not the case, why?

truthmans2012:
The Advent Of Allah

When God declared His name as "I am", "Yahweh" and "Jehovah" to the Israelites and was leading them out of Egypt, who was God to the Arabs at that time, and how were they worshiping him?

Allah has other names and none of them relates to Yahweh or Jehovah. In fact, allah's names do not have the same meaning as God's name in the Bible, even if interpreted in Arabic, why did his names change completely in islam as if he is a completely different God?

Is it not reasonable to assume that islamic worship should be ongoing both in Israel and Mecca at that time if truly Abraham actually established islam? But it is discovered that was not the case, why?

I think you're making a category mistake. The name Allah is the Arabic name for the Almighty God juts as Olohun in Yoruba and Chineke in ibo all means God.

Iamdrahj:
I think you're making a category mistake. The name Allah is the Arabic name for the Almighty God juts as Olohun in pYoruba and Chineke in ibo all means God.

No, you didn't get the point.

The word "God is a generic name. I'm talking of a personal names.here.

Why did you decide to attempt only one question?

truthmans2012:
The Advent Of Allah

When God declared His name as "I am", "Yahweh" and "Jehovah" to the Israelites and was leading them out of Egypt, who was God to the Arabs at that time, and how were they worshiping him?

Allah has other names and none of them relates to Yahweh or Jehovah. In fact, allah's names do not have the same meaning as God's name in the Bible, even if interpreted in Arabic, why did his names change completely in islam as if he is a completely different God in the Bible?

Is it not reasonable to assume that islamic worship should be the religion both in Israel and Mecca at that time if truly Abraham actually established islam? But it is discovered that was not the case, why?

Even their al taquiya Allah cannot answer the questions.

My God, see finishing.. Truthmans2012 don finish Mohammed, Islam and Quran. I have never thought of this all the while. But somehow, it has dropped inside of me but the op has made it clear to me. If I am a Muslim, I will quickly run to my alfa or imam to ask him this question. It is a question that will get a Muslim confused forever. In fact, they will not like to answer it rather they will dodge it or parry it over the bar.

All they keep shouting is Allah, Allah, Allah. As if it is not the same thing as God. Ask them the true name(s) of Allah, they will start reigning curses that does not exist on earth on you.

That's exactly my problem with Muslims. Pls can any Muslim tell me the name of their God. If they don't know it or cant ascertain it, it means it is Satan.

annunaki2:


Even their al taquiya Allah cannot answer the question.

First of all Allah, is derived from "al" meaning "THE" and "Ilah" translated as God in english.

The Arabs and Isrealis are descended from Ismail (Ishmael) son and Ishaqs' (Isaac) son Yaquub (Jacob) respectively, their father was Ibrahim (Abraham) who was was born in Mesopotamia and spoke Aramaic not Hebrew.

The arabs are descended from Ismail in the sense that he married into their tribes and as he and his brother Ishaq (peace be upon them all) were granted prophethood and lived in different locations (Ishaq lived in Palestine while Ismail lived in Makkah). He had a position of rank amongst the people, also he Ismail and his father Abraham were the first to build the Ka'bah and Ismail was a prophet sent to the Arabs. Now if you say Islam is something new or invented by the Arab people why would Ibrahim peace be upon him help him by building the Ka'bah the first Masjid to be built. Does that not show that even though the messengers were sent to different communities their message was the same and they all worshipped the same God.

You say Allahs name changed in the Bible even though I would be honest with you i dont know the meaning of "Yahweh or Jehovah" I would tell you this, all of Allahs names are descriptions of his attributes like "the​ most merciful" or "Allah meaning The God in English or more suitably The Object Of Worship". it is not impossible for Allah to call himself by another name. if Allah were to call himself "The Most Merciful does he stop being Allah??. If he were to call himself "The lord of Israel does he stop being the Lord of Makkah" I hope you get the point.


Now you claim that Islam is an anomaly from Abraham's teachings (even though you presented no points to buttress your claim). And no authentic preserved copy of Abrahams scripture is known to me and in my little knowledge of Islamic sources none is in existence. So you should present the fact​s.

I just understood the point you were making on the name of Allah better.

Allahs names are whatever he chooses to call himself. Since he has no beginning and has no ending and was not born, nobody was there to name him. He is addressed by whatever name he in his infinite wisdom chooses to address himself.

Eno38151:
First of all Allah, is derived from "al" meaning "THE" and "Ilah" translated as God in english.

The Arabs and Isrealis are descended from Ismail (Ishmael) son and Ishaqs' (Isaac) son Yaquub (Jacob) respectively, their father was Ibrahim (Abraham) who was was born in Mesopotamia and spoke Aramaic not Hebrew.

The arabs are descended from Ismail in the sense that he married into their tribes and as he and his brother Ishaq (peace be upon them all) were granted prophethood and lived in different locations (Ishaq lived in Palestine while Ismail lived in Makkah). He had a position of rank amongst the people, also he Ismail and his father Abraham were the first to build the Ka'bah and Ismail was a prophet sent to the Arabs. Now if you say Islam is something new or invented by the Arab people why would Ibrahim peace be upon him help him by building the Ka'bah the first Masjid to be built. Does that not show that even though the messengers were sent to different communities their message was the same and they all worshipped the same God.

You say Allahs name changed in the Bible even though I would be honest with you i dont know the meaning of "Yahweh or Jehovah" I would tell you this, all of Allahs names are descriptions of his attributes like "the​ most merciful" or "Allah meaning The God in English or more suitably The Object Of Worship". it is not impossible for Allah to call himself by another name. if Allah were to call himself "The Most Merciful does he stop being Allah??. If he were to call himself "The lord of Israel does he stop being the Lord of Makkah" I hope you get the point.


Now you claim that Islam is an anomaly from Abraham's teachings (even though you presented no points to buttress your claim). And no authentic preserved copy of Abrahams scripture is known to me and in my little knowledge of Islamic sources none is in existence. So you should present the fact​s.

You don't seem to understand my questions.

I repeat:

Who was God to the Arabs and how were they worshiping him at the time Yahweh was leading the Israelites out of Egypt?

If Abraham truly established islam, one expects the Israelites to practice it at the time of Moses till the time of Jesus but it was not the case, why?

Why would God abandon his names in the Bible and adopt names totally different from what he was known before and no reference is made to his Biblical names in islam?

1) --- Who was God to the Arabs and how were they worshiping him at the time Yahweh was leading the Israelites out of Egypt?


During the time of moses, Ismail and his father had already built the Ka'bah in Makkah. Also bear in mind that even the pagan Arabs called God "Allah", some of them bore names like Abdullah (The servant of Allah).

As for how they prayed some of them were following the religion of Ibrahim (which was affirmed by his son Ismail and all messengers right down from Adam to Muhammad (Peace be upon them all). The exact manner of their prayer is not known to me, but it is clear that they would supplicate to Allah and the Ka'bah was of great significance​ to them and was revered even by the pagan arabs.

Also bear in mind that Islam, Judaism and Christianity all originated in the Middle East and it is known that some of the Arabs deviated from the guidance of messengers and followed some false religions.


2) --- If Abraham truly established islam, one expects the Israelites to practice it at the time of Moses till the time of Jesus but it was not the case, why?

Islam started from Adam and ended with the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon them). Nobody that has an inkling of knowledge about Islam would deny this. As to why they did not follow the guidance of the messengers is something that I cannot answer. It is like saying if "Abraham was a messenger of god why did Pharoah disbelieve in Moses who was also a messenger of god" there are always people that will not submit to the laws of Allah. And they will be brought to account for their actions. I cannot speak for them.

Even the Quran mentions how many nations disbelieved in their lord and how some of the Israelites in particular, disobeyed their messengers, changed the word of God and even killed some messengers.

3) ---. Why would God abandon his names in the Bible and adopt names totally different from what he was known before and no reference is made to his Biblical names in islam?

The Bible is not the book revealed to Jesus (peace be upon him) the gospel was what was revealed to Jesus and I know of no preseved complete copy of the original gospel revealed unto jesus (peace be upon him). The Bible is a compilation of accounts and ancient scrolls which are subject to textual criticism, but still no one in all honesty can say they have a copy of the original Gospel as revealed to Jesus (peace be upon him).

If you say the names of God in the Bible are not reflected in the Quran, the answer is simple the bible is not revelation. What was revealed is the Gospel and no pristine copy of that is known to me.

Even if we presume for argument sake that the Bible is in the pristine condition that it was revealed unto Jesus (peace be upon him). I want you to understand that the names of Allah are discriptions of his attributes, a clear example is "the lord of Israel" the lord would not have a name like John, Jacob or anything similar to human names cause he was not named by anybody, he names himself as he wishes.

If the point you are trying to make is that he was called "Yahweh and Jehovah" and these names are not reflected in the Quran tell me the meaning of these names and I will check whether it is mentioned in Islam.

On that same point dont you think that a prophet like Abraham who spoke Aramaic would have called Allah by a name in his native tongue, but would that mean that if another prophets scripture did not address Allah in the same name would that make the message false??

By the way even Christian​ Arabs call god Allah, in hebrew the original language of the Gospel of Jesus and the Torah of Moses Allah is translated as Elohim. The pronounciation as similar as the languages have many similarities. Note that Christianity and Judaism have their origins in Arab lands.

Eno38151

During the time of moses, Ismail and his father had already built the Ka'bah in Makkah. Also bear in mind that even the pagan Arabs called God "Allah", some of them bore names like Abdullah (The servant of Allah).

False !!!

If Abraham and Ishmael had built Kaaba in Makkah for worship by all mankind before the time of Moses, why didn't the Jews go there to worship at that time?

The Jews under Moses had nothing to do with Kaaba in Mecca because it was the house of various idols including Allah. Allah at that time was known as "al-illah and was one of the idols inside Kaaba. The Jews didn't recognize Kaaba and no Bible prophets visited there or performed Islamic rituals. No Bible prophets talked about Kaaba, thereby making the claim that Kaaba was built by Abraham a satanic falsehood to deceive mankind.

Please note that God could not be leading the Israelites out of Egypt under a rule and sets of law and at the same time be in Arab under a different name, a different rule, different laws and different way of worship. This shows that the Arabs were idolaters and their idol worship was converted to islam.

The bitter truth is: Abraham could never be in Mecca to build Kaaba or establish islam there, while the other members of his family were in Israel not under islam. I mean, if he found islam in Mecca he would have carried the other members of his family along: Sarah, Isaac and Jacob. Islam is about Ishmael and his mother, Hagai. Sarah, Isaac, Jacob and other Bible prophets had no roles they played in islam. This is a proof that islam is not from the same God of the Bible.

Yahweh is not the same as Jehovah pls who is this Jehovah?

Moses was sent to Israel, Abraham was sent to his People Who were Aramaic and lived in Mesopotamia, Ismail was sent to the arab people he grew up with in the Arab Peninsula.

While they were all messengers of god they were sent to specific people if i remember clearly from the Bible as you have it it says "Jesus was sent to the lost sheep of Israel" Moses was "sent to deliver israel". All these show you that they were sent to a specific tribe or people. The nation of Israel had their separate prophets/messengers and the Arabs had theirs, only the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) was sent to the whole world.

Now if Allah commanded Abraham to take his wife Hajar to Makkah (and later build the Ka'bah) and Sarah and her son to Palestine that is Allahs choosing. The whole point of Allah sending messengers is that the religion of Islam be spread to all nations. I dont understand why you insist that the Isrealites and their messengers should have moved to Makkah and be worshipping at the Ka'bah. Abraham himself who was commanded to build the Ka'bah was not living in Makkah, rather he would visit.

The Whole earth is suitable for worshipping Allah. The Isrealites had their separate messengers and their separate commands just like the Arabs had theirs. Again I repeat only the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) was sent to humanity in general. For example when Joseph was in Israel and his father was elsewhere does that nullify Josephs message.

You also seem confused Moses did not preach Judaism (not from the Islamic or Christian point of view) Moses was sent to the people of Israel not Jews (they are not the same thing). You mention Jews and Bible as if they are synonymous. The belief of Judaism excludes belief in the Bible or Jesus (peace be upon him)

The Isrealites under moses had nothing to do with Ka'bah because Allah sent him to deliver Israel to the promised land of Palestine.

Allah was always Allah, bear in mind that Ismael when his father took him to Makkah met the Arab people there so that means that Arabs where already established and living in that area and the Islamic traditions mention that 4 prophets were Arab excluding Ismail.

You say that Allah (Glorified be he above all imperfection) was something else and there was an idol of him in the Ka'bah at the time of Moses. First of all I am very sure you don't understand modern day Arabic not to talk of the the classical arabic of those days in question so let me assure you that Allah is derived from two arabic words "AL" meaning "THE" and "ILAH" roughly translated as "GOD".

Allah (Glorified and exalted be he) was never an idol worshipped by any muslim. It is well known that as the Arabs drifted away from the message of Abraham and Ismael and their other messengers. They fell into idol worship thereby leaving the guidance of their messengers​. So what people do is not islam but what the messengers preached is Islam.

It would interest you to know that even statues and animate drawings are prohibited in Islam. Infact the very reason Ibrahim (peace be upon him) left his homeland was because he destroyed the peoples idols and they sought to kill him. So if pagan arabs worshipped idols that is there action it has nothing to do with the muslims. And it seems that you are intent on painting all Arabs as muslims who all happen to be idol worshippers. Kinship does not make them the same Lots wife did not follow her husband, Abraham's father was an idol-maker, and Noahs son disbelieved in his father. So just because people share the same blood doesn't make them the same.

Have you ever seen a sculpture or image of any living object in any mosque? So how can you accuse muslims of being idol worshippers. But if you will be honest how many churches​ have no graven images or sculptures of people?

You say the jews didn't recognise ka'bah and the Bible prophets didnt visit it. I Already mentioned that Ismail and Abraham built it so i fail to understand your insistance on the messengers of isreal leaving their own nations to come to the Ka'bah are their prayers not acceped in their own lands?. It is Allah that chooses where they propagate their message just as Moses was commanded to take his people to the promised land, Abraham was commanded to take his second wife to Makkah.

You say the bible prophets never talk about kabah and Abraham never built the Kabah. Why do you use the Bible to speak about Abraham, if the Quran (preserved in its pristine original form & language) revealed to his descendant can not speak about him why should the Bible that is a collection of scrolls and accounts by unverifiable people that have never seen Jesus (peace be upon him) be presented as the Gospel that Allah revealed to Jesus speak about him?

Most of the scrolls are in "Konos greek" (i hope i got the name right) not the original Hebrew that Jesus and his people spoke. Furthermore Abraham was not an Isrealite nor could he be Christian or Jewish. As all these religions came into being after him, or is there any account of him speaking thr Hebrew that the Isrealites spoke? If he didn't speak their language would they have called god by the same name??

You say God couldn't be guiding the Isrealites out of Egypt under a different rule from the one the Arabs were under. Is there no account in the Bible of prophets living in different locations at the same time. If there is no such, well in the Quran Ibrahim, his brothers son Lot and his children Ismail and Ishaq lived in the same time. Jesus and Yahya (John) also lived in the same time .

You keep bringing up the name issue, do you think jesus who spoke Hebrew called God "God" he spoke Hebrew so he would say "Elohim", do you expect an Arab to call Allah "God", do you expect Abraham who spoke Aramaic to call God "Elohim". To make it simple Allah revealed to every messenger his scripture in his language and they all had a way of calling God in their languages. Or do you expect them all to speak the same language?

If they had different laws that was what Allah deemed fit and revealed unto his messengers and none of them broke the commands of their Lord, if the people after them distorted their teachings that is something else.


If you claim they had different ways of worship do you know of any messenger that was sent to the Arabs the same time that Moses was sent to the Israelites because in all honesty I don't know. And how did you deduce that their mode of worship was different?? Please elaborate.

You keep mentioning the Bible i have highlighted to you that the Bible is not revelation, the Gospel is revelation of which no pristine original copy can be found​ in the language it was revealed.

Only God nose

Eno38151

Moses was sent to Israel, Abraham was sent to his People Who were Aramaic and lived in Mesopotamia, Ismail was sent to the arab people he grew up with in the Arab Peninsula.

Errors !!!

Abraham was not sent to his people, he was actually sent out from his people. Prove from a source where he was sent to his people.

Ishmael was not sent to the Arabs, he was actually sent away from Israel due to his mother's disrespect for her master, Sarah.

While they were all messengers of god they were sent to specific people if i remember clearly from the Bible as you have it it says "Jesus was sent to the lost sheep of Israel" Moses was "sent to deliver israel". All these show you that they were sent to a specific tribe or people. The nation of Israel had their separate prophets/messengers and the Arabs had theirs, only the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) was sent to the whole world.

That is a lie !!!

Now, who was the prophet of islam in Arab at the time of Moses? Remember Abraham and Ishmael had died before Moses.

God could not have double standard. He could not be dealing with Israel with different rules and way of worship and Arabs with different rules and way of worship. That is not the character of God.

Islam is the revival of idol worship that have been going in Mecca. Muhammad was from idolatrous family. He only came to revive idol worship but in the name of God. Jubril was the spirit of his father's idol. They had been worshiping Allah as an idol in Muhammad's family before he was born, hence you find name like Abdullai (his father's name), meaning servant of Allah. Mutaleb, an idol worshiper named Muhammad's father Abdullai.He named his son Abdullai after his idol. That shows Allah was an idol and the head of all the 360 idols inside Kaaba.

In fact, the Quran confirms that islamic worship is the custom of pagans:

[Quran 2:158] Pickthal Lo! (the mountains) As-Safa and Al-Marwah are among the indications of Allah. It is therefore no sin for him who is on pilgrimage to the House (of Allah) or visiteth it, to go around them (as the pagan custom is). And he who doeth good of his own accord, (for him) lo! Allah is Responsive, Aware (Quran 2:158)

The Qur'an doesn't say as custom of Abraham and Ishmael is.

Now if Allah commanded Abraham to take his wife Hajar to Makkah (and later build the Ka'bah) and Sarah and her son to Palestine that is Allahs choosing. The whole point of Allah sending messengers is that the religion of Islam be spread to all nations. I dont understand why you insist that the Isrealites and their messengers should have moved to Makkah and be worshipping at the Ka'bah. Abraham himself who was commanded to build the Ka'bah was not living in Makkah, rather he would visit.

Was Sarah and her children in Israel to spread islam? There is no islam without Kaaba. Did Sarah and her children visit Kaaba to worship? The fact that they did not recognize Kaaba shows Abraham was not the builder.

You also seem confused Moses did not preach Judaism (not from the Islamic or Christian point of view) Moses was sent to the people of Israel not Jews (they are not the same thing). You mention Jews and Bible as if they are synonymous. The belief of Judaism excludes belief in the Bible or Jesus (peace be upon him)

Was Moses not a Jew?

Were the Israelites Moses led not Jews?

Friend, you are not displaying good knowledge.

The Isrealites under moses had nothing to do with Ka'bah because Allah sent him to deliver Israel to the promised land of Palestine.

So you mean Yahweh was ruling in Israel and Allah was ruling in Arab simultaneously with different religious practices?

Allah was always Allah, bear in mind that Ismael when his father took him to Makkah met the Arab people there so that means that Arabs where already established and living in that area and the Islamic traditions mention that 4 prophets were Arab excluding Ismail.

Allah is not always Allah. He is allah among the Arabs. God is known to Israel as Yahweh, not Allah.

That Ishmael met some people in Makkah is a contradiction in islam. Many islamic scholars say Abraham and Ishmael found it. In fact, there is a hadith that says when they got to Makkah it was a vast bush with no inhabitants.

It would interest you to know that even statues and animate drawings are prohibited in Islam. Infact the very reason Ibrahim (peace be upon him) left his homeland was because he destroyed the peoples idols and they sought to kill him. So if pagan arabs worshipped idols that is there action it has nothing to do with the muslims. And it seems that you are intent on painting all Arabs as muslims who all happen to be idol worshippers. Kinship does not make them the same Lots wife did not follow her husband, Abraham's father was an idol-maker, and Noahs son disbelieved in his father. So just because people share the same blood doesn't make them the same.

What is the moon doing in the mosques as islamic symbol? Please note that moon symbol had been in use by pagans long before islam.

Why was a pagan symbol adopted by Muslims?

Have you ever seen a sculpture or image of any living object in any mosque? So how can you accuse muslims of being idol worshippers. But if you will be honest how many churches​ have no graven images or sculptures of people

?

Yes, the moon symbol.

You say the jews didn't recognise ka'bah and the Bible prophets didnt visit it. I Already mentioned that Ismail and Abraham built it so i fail to understand your insistance on the messengers of isreal leaving their own nations to come to the Ka'bah are their prayers not acceped in their own lands?. It is Allah that chooses where they propagate their message just as Moses was commanded to take his people to the promised land, Abraham was commanded to take his second wife to Makkah.

Kaaba is believed by Muslims as the sanctuary and resort for all mankind and that is why they go there from all the parts of the world. Why wouldn't the Bible prophets visit it the same way if it was truly built by Abraham for all mankind? Why do you go there to pray, is your prayer not accepted in your country?

Do you remember going to Makkah is one of the pillars of islam? If so, why none of the Bible prophets talked about it or visited it? That shows islam didn't exist before Muhammad.

You say the bible prophets never talk about kabah and Abraham never built the Kabah. Why do you use the Bible to speak about Abraham, if the Quran (preserved in its pristine original form & language) revealed to his descendant can not speak about him why should the Bible that is a collection of scrolls and accounts by unverifiable people that have never seen Jesus (peace be upon him) be presented as the Gospel that Allah revealed to Jesus speak about him?

Muslims recognize Torah and Injil as the words of God. Even though some islamists do not believe Torah is the Old Testament and Injil the New Testament in the Bible. Unfortunately, they could not produce the original Torah and Injil.

It was not God that produced the Quran as God by His Being could not be speaking from both sides of his mouth. Quran was produced to counter the existing words of God, which had been in use thousands of years before Muhammad.

Most of the scrolls are in "Konos greek" (i hope i got the name right) not the original Hebrew that Jesus and his people spoke. Furthermore Abraham was not an Isrealite nor could he be Christian or Jewish. As all these religions came into being after him, or is there any account of him speaking thr Hebrew that the Isrealites spoke? If he didn't speak their language would they have called god by the same name??

Trash !!!

If Abraham was not a Jew, why about his descendants?

Who are the Israelites?

Yahweh = The Canaanite pagan god.
Allah = The head of the 360 Arab pagan gods.
Conclusion = Both religions are worshipping gods created by pagans ergo, none is true.

1 --- You say Abraham was not sent to his people, but he was sent out from his people.

Q - How could he be sent out in the first place if he was not there??

The Quran states that:

“And (remember) Ibraaheem (Abraham) when he said to his people: ‘Worship Allaah (Alone), and fear Him: that is better for you if you did but know.

You worship besides Allaah only idols, and you only invent falsehood. Verily, those whom you worship besides Allaah have no power to give you provision, so seek your provision from Allaah (Alone), and worship Him (Alone), and be grateful to Him. To Him (Alone) you will be brought back’”[al-‘Ankaboot 29:16-17]

After this they sought to kill him but Allah saved him:

After saving Ibraaheem from the fire, Allaah commanded him to leave Mesopotamia and migrate to the Holy Land in Palestine. He married his cousin (the daughter of his paternal uncle) – Saarah – and set out with her and his brother’s son Loot for Syria, as Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And We rescued him and Loot (Lot) to the land which We have blessed for the ‘Aalameen (mankind and jinn)[al-Anbiyaa’ 21:71]

Then great hardship befell the land of Syria, so Ibraaheem moved to Egypt with his wife, then he came back to Palestine, bringing his wife and a slave woman of hers called Haajar. Ibraaheem longed to have children, but his wife was barren and had grown old. When she saw how much her husband longed to have a child, she gave her slave woman, Haajar, to him. So he married her and was blessed with his son Ismaa’eel from her:

After Haajar gave birth to Ismaa’eel, Saarah began to feel jealous, so she asked Ibraaheem to send them away from her. Allaah revealed to Ibraaheem that he should take Haajar and the infant Ismaa’eel and take them to Makkah. So he took them and left Haajar and her child Ismaa’eel in an bleak, isolated place in which there was no water, then he left them and went back to Palestine. Haajar said to him, “For whom are you leaving us in this forsaken valley?” But Ibraaheem went and left her, and she said, “Has Allaah commanded you to do this?” He said, “Yes.” She said, “Then Allaah will not cause us to be lost.”

Ibraaheem submitted to the command of his Lord and patiently bore the separation from his wife and child. Then he turned towards where they were at the Sacred House and prayed for them in the following words (interpretation of the meaning):

“O our Lord! I have made some of my offspring to dwell in an uncultivable valley by Your Sacred House (the Ka‘bah at Makkah) in order, O our Lord, that they may perform As-Salaah (Iqaamat-as-Salaah). So fill some hearts among men with love towards them, and (O Allaah) provide them with fruits so that they may give thanks”[Ibraaheem 14:37]

Haajar stayed in Makkah, eating the food and drinking the water that Ibraaheem had left for her and her son. When that ran out, she and her son became thirsty. She looked for water, and climbed the hill of al-Safaa but she did not see anything. Then she climbed the hill of al-Marwah but she did not see anything. She did that seven times, then she turned towards Ismaa’eel and saw water gushing from beneath his feet. She rejoiced and drank some, and gave some to her son to drink. Then a tribe – Jurham – came to Haajar and asked her permission to settle by the water. She gave them permission and they settled beside her. When Ismaa’eel grew up, he married one of their women and learned Arabic from them.

During this period, Ibraaheem used to visit his son from time to time. On one of these visits, Ibraaheem saw in a dream that Allaah was commanding him to sacrifice his son Ismaa’eel. The dreams of the Prophets are true, so Ibraaheem resolved to obey the command of Allaah, even though he was old and Ismaa’eel was his only son. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“So We gave him the glad tidings of a forbearing boy.

And, when he (his son) was old enough to walk with him, he said: ‘O my son! I have seen in a dream that I am slaughtering you (offering you in sacrifice to Allaah). So look what you think!’ He said: ‘O my father! Do that which you are commanded, In sha’ Allaah (if Allaah wills), you shall find me of As-Saabiroon (the patient).’

Then, when they had both submitted themselves (to the Will of Allaah), and he had laid him prostrate on his forehead (or on the side of his forehead for slaughtering);

We called out to him: ‘O Ibraaheem!

You have fulfilled the dream!’ Verily, thus do We reward the Muhsinoon (good-doers).

Verily, that indeed was a manifest trial.

And We ransomed him with a great sacrifice (i.e. a ram)”

[al-Saffaat 37:101-107]

Then Allaah gave him the glad tidings of another son, who was Ishaaq, and then Ibraaheem returned to Palestine:

“And We gave him the glad tidings of Ishaaq (Isaac) a Prophet from the righteous[al-Saaffaat 37:112 – interpretation of the meaning]

Ishaaq was born to him from his wife Saarah:

“And his wife was standing (there), and she laughed [either, because the messengers did not eat their food or for being glad for the destruction of the people of Loot (Lot)]. But We gave her glad tidings of Ishaaq (Isaac), and after Ishaaq, of Ya‘qoob (Jacob)”

[Hood 11:71 – interpretation of the meaning]

Then Ibraaheem stayed in Palestine for a while, then he returned to Makkah for an important reason. Allaah had commanded him to build in Makkah the first House to be built for the worship of Allaah. So Ibraaheem undertook this task of construction, and his son Ismaa’eel was lifting up the stones to him. When the walls grew higher, Ibraaheem stood on a rock, and this is the Station of Ibraaheem (Maqaam Ibraaheem) which is to be found in the vicinity of the Ka’bah. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And (remember) when Ibraaheem (Abraham) and (his son) Ismaaee‘eel (Ishmael) were raising the foundations of the House (the Ka‘bah at Makkah), (saying), ‘Our Lord! Accept (this service) from us. Verily, You are the All-Hearer, the All-Knower’”

[al-Baqarah 2:127]

Allaah commanded Ibraaheem and Ismaa’eel to cleanse the House of idols and other impurities so that it would be pure for those who would circumambulate it and stand and bow and prostrate (in prayer). When Ibraaheem built the House, Allaah commanded him to call mankind to perform the Hajj, as He says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And proclaim to mankind the Hajj (pilgrimage). They will come to you on foot and on every lean camel, they will come from every deep and distant (wide) mountain highway (to perform Hajj)”

[al-Hajj 22:27]

Then Ibraaheem offered this great supplication for Makkah and for those who live in it:

“And (remember) when Ibraaheem (Abraham) said, ‘My Lord, make this city (Makkah) a place of security and provide its people with fruits, such of them as believe in Allaah and the Last Day.’ He (Allaah) answered: ‘As for him who disbelieves, I shall leave him in contentment for a while, then I shall compel him to the torment of the Fire, and worst indeed is that destination!’”

[al-Baqarah 2:126 – interpretation of the meaning]

Then he prayed for himself and his descendents, saying:

“Our Lord! Accept (this service) from us. Verily, You are the All-Hearer, the All-Knower.

Our Lord! And make us submissive unto You and of our offspring a nation submissive unto You, and show us our Manaasik (all the ceremonies of pilgrimage — Hajj and ‘Umrah), and accept our repentance. Truly, You are the One Who accepts repentance, the Most Merciful”[al-Baqarah 2:127-128 – interpretation of the meaning]

Then he prayed for the people of the sanctuary, that Allaah would send to them a Messenger from amongst them, who would call them to worship Allaah Alone. He said:

“Our Lord! Send amongst them a Messenger of their own, who shall recite unto them Your Verses and instruct them in the Book (this Qur’aan) and Al-Hikmah (full knowledge of the Islamic laws and jurisprudence or wisdom or Prophethood), and purify them. Verily, You are the All-Mighty, the All-Wise”

[al-Baqarah 1:129 – interpretation of the meaning]

Allaah responded to the prayer of His Prophet Ibraaheem. He made Makkah a place of security, He blessed its people with fruits and sent to them a Messenger from amongst themselves, who was the Seal of the Prophets and Messengers, Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). All praise and thanks be to Allaah.

After Ibraaheem, Prophethood remained with the Children of Israel for a long time, until Allaah sent Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) from among the descendents of Ismaa’eel as a Messenger to all of mankind, and commanded him as He said (interpretation of the meaning):

“Say (O Muhammad): ‘O mankind! Verily, I am sent to you all as the Messenger of Allaah…’”[al-A’raaf 7:158]

Allaah commanded Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) to follow the religion of Ibraaheem, as He said (interpretation of the meaning):

“Then, We have sent the Revelation to you (O Muhammad saying): ‘Follow the religion of Ibraaheem (Abraham) Haneef (Islamic Monotheism — to worship none but Allaah) and he was not of the Mushrikoon (polytheists, idolaters, disbelievers)”[al-Nahl 16:123]

Ibraaheem’s advice to his children was to adhere to the religion of Islam and follow its commands until they died. Allaah said (interpretation of the meaning):

“And this (submission to Allaah, Islam) was enjoined by Ibraaheem (Abraham) upon his sons and by Ya‘qoob (Jacob) (saying), ‘O my sons! Allaah has chosen for you the (true) religion, then die not except in the Faith of Islam (as Muslims — Islamic Monotheism)’” [al-Baqarah 2:132]

O Allaah, send blessings upon Ibraaheem and upon the family of Ibraaheem, for You are Praiseworthy, Most Glorious.

Other Prophets who were alive at the time of Ibraaheem (peace be upon him) were Loot, Ismaa’eel, Ishaaq, and Ya’qoob. Then came Yoosuf, then Shu’ayb, then Ayyoob, then Dhu’l-Kifl. Then Allaah sent Moosa and Haaroon (peace be upon them and may the best of blessings and peace be upon all the Prophets).

You asked who was the prophet of the Arabs during the time of Moses. This was a question i asked you earlier that you ignored/forgot and are presenting it to me. The reason I asked you this was because you stated that when Moses and the Israelites were leaving Egypt how did the Arabs pray, you even stated that their mode of worship was different from Moses so you call the idol worshippers/pagans more or less. So please answer my question that I asked as regards this point:

Who was the messenger of the Arabs at that that time, and how did they pray for you to determine that it was different from the way Moses did. Please cite your sources.

You then started hurling insults and slurs about the prophet, with no citation from any authentic source and just made claims. please present your sources. If this kind of language is going to continue from you Mr. Truthman i wold leave you to your post because it would no longer be an intellectual argument aimed at finding truths but just verbal match.

In fact, the Quran confirms that islamic worship is the custom of pagans:

[Quran 2:158] Pickthal Lo! (the mountains) As-Safa and Al-Marwah are among the indications of Allah. It is therefore no sin for him who is on pilgrimage to the House (of Allah) or visiteth it, to go around them (as the pagan custom is). And he who doeth good of his own accord, (for him) lo! Allah is Responsive, Aware (Quran 2:158)

The Qur'an doesn't say as custom of Abraham and Ishmael is.

First of all an authentic Hadith states that 70 prophets performed Hajj including Musa(moses).

This verse that you mention:
1 --- The bracket is an addition by the translator not a verse of the Quran.
2 --- The verse was revealed to inform them that they should go round the two mountains as part of their pilgrimage. Because after
they forgot the message of their prophets some of them fell into idol worship and there was an idol placed on each mountain
so after the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) came and renewed the message of the previous prophets they hesitated
to go round the mountains even though the idols were all destroyed as they didnt want to fall back into paganism. This verse
commands them to go round the mountains as there are no longer any pagan idols on them.

You said "Was Sarah and her children in Israel to spread islam? There is no islam without Kaaba. Did Sarah and her children visit Kaaba to worship? The fact that they did not recognize Kaaba shows Abraham was not the builder."

Sarah was not a prophet. Pilgrimage round the ka'bah was not made compulsory on the people (as i had already mentioned 70 prophets have been reported to have visited the Ka'bah) until the 22nd year of the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him message).


Moses was Israelite not Jewish, Judaism is a belief that rejects any prophet after Moses (Peace be upon him) and claims that Jesus (peace be upon him) was illegitimate, Isrealites are a tribe/nation. So you should look deeply into this.

Every language addresses god in their own language. I dont know why you insist that they should all speak the same language??
If the isrealites said Yahweh and the Arabs said Allah how is that a contradiction. I already explained to you Abraham spoke Aramaic if he didnt address god as Yahweh does that mean he is not a messenger??

I already explained the point about Ismail earlier.

Can you point to any Islamic teaching that shows that the crescent/moon is a part of islam Please present your sources.

Explain to me why sculptures of human beings (supposedly mary/jesus/or other people) are common occurences in churces?

You said "Muslims recognize Torah and Injil as the words of God. Even though some islamists do not believe Torah is the Old Testament and Injil the New Testament in the Bible. Unfortunately, they could not produce the original Torah and Injil."

No muslim believes that the original revelations of the Torah and Injil are what is being presented today, The original scriptures are lost hence Allah revealed the Quran. You said the muslims cant produce the original Torah or Injil we already know they are lost the onus is on the people who claim to have it to produce it.


If Abraham was not a Jew, why about his descendants?

By their own accounts (The jewish people) "Our history begins with Israa’eel (Israel) – namely Ya‘qoob ibn Is-haaq ibn Ibraaheem al-Khaleel (Jacob son of Isaac son of Abraham the Close Friend of Allah – peace be upon them all) – who grew up and lived in the land of the Canaanites (Palestine), who had twelve sons from four wives, as follows:

Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Judah, Issachar and Zebulun – their mother was Leah

Joseph (Yoosuf – peace be upon him) and Benjamin (Binyameen) – their mother was Rachel (Raaheel)

Dan and Naphtali – their mother was Bilhah, the handmaid of Rachel

Gad and Asher – their mother was Zilpah, the handmaid of Leah

The twelve sons were the origin of the Israelite tribes.

Then comes the famous story of Joseph (Yoosuf – peace be upon him) with his brothers and their father Jacob (Ya‘qoob – peace be upon him), and how Israel (Jacob) and his sons moved to live in the land of Egypt, where they were honoured and respected under the auspices of Joseph (peace be upon him).

After the deaths of Jacob and Joseph (peace be upon them), with the passage of time and the succession of kings, the situation of the Children of Israel in Egypt changed from one of honour and respect to one of humiliation and ignominy, because the Pharaoh of Egypt persecuted and enslaved the Israelites

jimmyjenseng:
Yahweh = The Canaanite pagan god.
Allah = The head of the 360 Arab pagan gods.
Conclusion = Both religions are worshipping gods created by pagans ergo, none is true.

Good afternoon, Mr Jimmyjenseng I would advise you to look into Islam from its authentic sources.

Eno38151:
1 --- You say Abraham was not sent to his people, but he was sent out from his people.

Q - How could he be sent out in the first place if he was not there??

The Quran states that:

“And (remember) Ibraaheem (Abraham) when he said to his people: ‘Worship Allaah (Alone), and fear Him: that is better for you if you did but know.

You worship besides Allaah only idols, and you only invent falsehood. Verily, those whom you worship besides Allaah have no power to give you provision, so seek your provision from Allaah (Alone), and worship Him (Alone), and be grateful to Him. To Him (Alone) you will be brought back’”[al-‘Ankaboot 29:16-17]

After this they sought to kill him but Allah saved him:

After saving Ibraaheem from the fire, Allaah commanded him to leave Mesopotamia and migrate to the Holy Land in Palestine. He married his cousin (the daughter of his paternal uncle) – Saarah – and set out with her and his brother’s son Loot for Syria, as Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And We rescued him and Loot (Lot) to the land which We have blessed for the ‘Aalameen (mankind and jinn)[al-Anbiyaa’ 21:71]

Then great hardship befell the land of Syria, so Ibraaheem moved to Egypt with his wife, then he came back to Palestine, bringing his wife and a slave woman of hers called Haajar. Ibraaheem longed to have children, but his wife was barren and had grown old. When she saw how much her husband longed to have a child, she gave her slave woman, Haajar, to him. So he married her and was blessed with his son Ismaa’eel from her:

After Haajar gave birth to Ismaa’eel, Saarah began to feel jealous, so she asked Ibraaheem to send them away from her. Allaah revealed to Ibraaheem that he should take Haajar and the infant Ismaa’eel and take them to Makkah. So he took them and left Haajar and her child Ismaa’eel in an bleak, isolated place in which there was no water, then he left them and went back to Palestine. Haajar said to him, “For whom are you leaving us in this forsaken valley?” But Ibraaheem went and left her, and she said, “Has Allaah commanded you to do this?” He said, “Yes.” She said, “Then Allaah will not cause us to be lost.”

Ibraaheem submitted to the command of his Lord and patiently bore the separation from his wife and child. Then he turned towards where they were at the Sacred House and prayed for them in the following words (interpretation of the meaning):

“O our Lord! I have made some of my offspring to dwell in an uncultivable valley by Your Sacred House (the Ka‘bah at Makkah) in order, O our Lord, that they may perform As-Salaah (Iqaamat-as-Salaah). So fill some hearts among men with love towards them, and (O Allaah) provide them with fruits so that they may give thanks”[Ibraaheem 14:37]

Haajar stayed in Makkah, eating the food and drinking the water that Ibraaheem had left for her and her son. When that ran out, she and her son became thirsty. She looked for water, and climbed the hill of al-Safaa but she did not see anything. Then she climbed the hill of al-Marwah but she did not see anything. She did that seven times, then she turned towards Ismaa’eel and saw water gushing from beneath his feet. She rejoiced and drank some, and gave some to her son to drink. Then a tribe – Jurham – came to Haajar and asked her permission to settle by the water. She gave them permission and they settled beside her. When Ismaa’eel grew up, he married one of their women and learned Arabic from them.

During this period, Ibraaheem used to visit his son from time to time. On one of these visits, Ibraaheem saw in a dream that Allaah was commanding him to sacrifice his son Ismaa’eel. The dreams of the Prophets are true, so Ibraaheem resolved to obey the command of Allaah, even though he was old and Ismaa’eel was his only son. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“So We gave him the glad tidings of a forbearing boy.

And, when he (his son) was old enough to walk with him, he said: ‘O my son! I have seen in a dream that I am slaughtering you (offering you in sacrifice to Allaah). So look what you think!’ He said: ‘O my father! Do that which you are commanded, In sha’ Allaah (if Allaah wills), you shall find me of As-Saabiroon (the patient).’

Then, when they had both submitted themselves (to the Will of Allaah), and he had laid him prostrate on his forehead (or on the side of his forehead for slaughtering);

We called out to him: ‘O Ibraaheem!

You have fulfilled the dream!’ Verily, thus do We reward the Muhsinoon (good-doers).

Verily, that indeed was a manifest trial.

And We ransomed him with a great sacrifice (i.e. a ram)”

[al-Saffaat 37:101-107]

Then Allaah gave him the glad tidings of another son, who was Ishaaq, and then Ibraaheem returned to Palestine:

“And We gave him the glad tidings of Ishaaq (Isaac) a Prophet from the righteous[al-Saaffaat 37:112 – interpretation of the meaning]

Ishaaq was born to him from his wife Saarah:

“And his wife was standing (there), and she laughed [either, because the messengers did not eat their food or for being glad for the destruction of the people of Loot (Lot)]. But We gave her glad tidings of Ishaaq (Isaac), and after Ishaaq, of Ya‘qoob (Jacob)”

[Hood 11:71 – interpretation of the meaning]

Then Ibraaheem stayed in Palestine for a while, then he returned to Makkah for an important reason. Allaah had commanded him to build in Makkah the first House to be built for the worship of Allaah. So Ibraaheem undertook this task of construction, and his son Ismaa’eel was lifting up the stones to him. When the walls grew higher, Ibraaheem stood on a rock, and this is the Station of Ibraaheem (Maqaam Ibraaheem) which is to be found in the vicinity of the Ka’bah. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And (remember) when Ibraaheem (Abraham) and (his son) Ismaaee‘eel (Ishmael) were raising the foundations of the House (the Ka‘bah at Makkah), (saying), ‘Our Lord! Accept (this service) from us. Verily, You are the All-Hearer, the All-Knower’”

[al-Baqarah 2:127]

Allaah commanded Ibraaheem and Ismaa’eel to cleanse the House of idols and other impurities so that it would be pure for those who would circumambulate it and stand and bow and prostrate (in prayer). When Ibraaheem built the House, Allaah commanded him to call mankind to perform the Hajj, as He says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And proclaim to mankind the Hajj (pilgrimage). They will come to you on foot and on every lean camel, they will come from every deep and distant (wide) mountain highway (to perform Hajj)”

[al-Hajj 22:27]

Then Ibraaheem offered this great supplication for Makkah and for those who live in it:

“And (remember) when Ibraaheem (Abraham) said, ‘My Lord, make this city (Makkah) a place of security and provide its people with fruits, such of them as believe in Allaah and the Last Day.’ He (Allaah) answered: ‘As for him who disbelieves, I shall leave him in contentment for a while, then I shall compel him to the torment of the Fire, and worst indeed is that destination!’”

[al-Baqarah 2:126 – interpretation of the meaning]

Then he prayed for himself and his descendents, saying:

“Our Lord! Accept (this service) from us. Verily, You are the All-Hearer, the All-Knower.

Our Lord! And make us submissive unto You and of our offspring a nation submissive unto You, and show us our Manaasik (all the ceremonies of pilgrimage — Hajj and ‘Umrah), and accept our repentance. Truly, You are the One Who accepts repentance, the Most Merciful”[al-Baqarah 2:127-128 – interpretation of the meaning]

Then he prayed for the people of the sanctuary, that Allaah would send to them a Messenger from amongst them, who would call them to worship Allaah Alone. He said:

“Our Lord! Send amongst them a Messenger of their own, who shall recite unto them Your Verses and instruct them in the Book (this Qur’aan) and Al-Hikmah (full knowledge of the Islamic laws and jurisprudence or wisdom or Prophethood), and purify them. Verily, You are the All-Mighty, the All-Wise”

[al-Baqarah 1:129 – interpretation of the meaning]

Allaah responded to the prayer of His Prophet Ibraaheem. He made Makkah a place of security, He blessed its people with fruits and sent to them a Messenger from amongst themselves, who was the Seal of the Prophets and Messengers, Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). All praise and thanks be to Allaah.

After Ibraaheem, Prophethood remained with the Children of Israel for a long time, until Allaah sent Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) from among the descendents of Ismaa’eel as a Messenger to all of mankind, and commanded him as He said (interpretation of the meaning):

“Say (O Muhammad): ‘O mankind! Verily, I am sent to you all as the Messenger of Allaah…’”[al-A’raaf 7:158]

Allaah commanded Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) to follow the religion of Ibraaheem, as He said (interpretation of the meaning):

“Then, We have sent the Revelation to you (O Muhammad saying): ‘Follow the religion of Ibraaheem (Abraham) Haneef (Islamic Monotheism — to worship none but Allaah) and he was not of the Mushrikoon (polytheists, idolaters, disbelievers)”[al-Nahl 16:123]

Ibraaheem’s advice to his children was to adhere to the religion of Islam and follow its commands until they died. Allaah said (interpretation of the meaning):

“And this (submission to Allaah, Islam) was enjoined by Ibraaheem (Abraham) upon his sons and by Ya‘qoob (Jacob) (saying), ‘O my sons! Allaah has chosen for you the (true) religion, then die not except in the Faith of Islam (as Muslims — Islamic Monotheism)’” [al-Baqarah 2:132]

O Allaah, send blessings upon Ibraaheem and upon the family of Ibraaheem, for You are Praiseworthy, Most Glorious.

Other Prophets who were alive at the time of Ibraaheem (peace be upon him) were Loot, Ismaa’eel, Ishaaq, and Ya’qoob. Then came Yoosuf, then Shu’ayb, then Ayyoob, then Dhu’l-Kifl. Then Allaah sent Moosa and Haaroon (peace be upon them and may the best of blessings and peace be upon all the Prophets).

You asked who was the prophet of the Arabs during the time of Moses. This was a question i asked you earlier that you ignored/forgot and are presenting it to me. The reason I asked you this was because you stated that when Moses and the Israelites were leaving Egypt how did the Arabs pray, you even stated that their mode of worship was different from Moses so you call the idol worshippers/pagans more or less. So please answer my question that I asked as regards this point:

Who was the messenger of the Arabs at that that time, and how did they pray for you to determine that it was different from the way Moses did. Please cite your sources.

You then started hurling insults and slurs about the prophet, with no citation from any authentic source and just made claims. please present your sources. If this kind of language is going to continue from you Mr. Truthman i wold leave you to your post because it would no longer be an intellectual argument aimed at finding truths but just verbal match.

In fact, the Quran confirms that islamic worship is the custom of pagans:

[Quran 2:158] Pickthal Lo! (the mountains) As-Safa and Al-Marwah are among the indications of Allah. It is therefore no sin for him who is on pilgrimage to the House (of Allah) or visiteth it, to go around them (as the pagan custom is). And he who doeth good of his own accord, (for him) lo! Allah is Responsive, Aware (Quran 2:158)

The Qur'an doesn't say as custom of Abraham and Ishmael is.

First of all an authentic Hadith states that 70 prophets performed Hajj including Musa(moses).

This verse that you mention:
1 --- The bracket is an addition by the translator not a verse of the Quran.
2 --- The verse was revealed to inform them that they should go round the two mountains as part of their pilgrimage. Because after
they forgot the message of their prophets some of them fell into idol worship and there was an idol placed on each mountain
so after the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) came and renewed the message of the previous prophets they hesitated
to go round the mountains even though the idols were all destroyed as they didnt want to fall back into paganism. This verse
commands them to go round the mountains as there are no longer any pagan idols on them.

You said "Was Sarah and her children in Israel to spread islam? There is no islam without Kaaba. Did Sarah and her children visit Kaaba to worship? The fact that they did not recognize Kaaba shows Abraham was not the builder."

Sarah was not a prophet. Pilgrimage round the ka'bah was not made compulsory on the people (as i had already mentioned 70 prophets have been reported to have visited the Ka'bah) until the 22nd year of the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him message).


Moses was Israelite not Jewish, Judaism is a belief that rejects any prophet after Moses (Peace be upon him) and claims that Jesus (peace be upon him) was illegitimate, Isrealites are a tribe/nation. So you should look deeply into this.

Every language addresses god in their own language. I dont know why you insist that they should all speak the same language??
If the isrealites said Yahweh and the Arabs said Allah how is that a contradiction. I already explained to you Abraham spoke Aramaic if he didnt address god as Yahweh does that mean he is not a messenger??

I already explained the point about Ismail earlier.

Can you point to any Islamic teaching that shows that the crescent/moon is a part of islam Please present your sources.

Explain to me why sculptures of human beings (supposedly mary/jesus/or other people) are common occurences in churces?

You said "Muslims recognize Torah and Injil as the words of God. Even though some islamists do not believe Torah is the Old Testament and Injil the New Testament in the Bible. Unfortunately, they could not produce the original Torah and Injil."

No muslim believes that the original revelations of the Torah and Injil are what is being presented today, The original scriptures are lost hence Allah revealed the Quran. You said the muslims cant produce the original Torah or Injil we already know they are lost the onus is on the people who claim to have it to produce it.


If Abraham was not a Jew, why about his descendants?

By their own accounts (The jewish people) "Our history begins with Israa’eel (Israel) – namely Ya‘qoob ibn Is-haaq ibn Ibraaheem al-Khaleel (Jacob son of Isaac son of Abraham the Close Friend of Allah – peace be upon them all) – who grew up and lived in the land of the Canaanites (Palestine), who had twelve sons from four wives, as follows:

Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Judah, Issachar and Zebulun – their mother was Leah

Joseph (Yoosuf – peace be upon him) and Benjamin (Binyameen) – their mother was Rachel (Raaheel)

Dan and Naphtali – their mother was Bilhah, the handmaid of Rachel

Gad and Asher – their mother was Zilpah, the handmaid of Leah

The twelve sons were the origin of the Israelite tribes.

Then comes the famous story of Joseph (Yoosuf – peace be upon him) with his brothers and their father Jacob (Ya‘qoob – peace be upon him), and how Israel (Jacob) and his sons moved to live in the land of Egypt, where they were honoured and respected under the auspices of Joseph (peace be upon him).

After the deaths of Jacob and Joseph (peace be upon them), with the passage of time and the succession of kings, the situation of the Children of Israel in Egypt changed from one of honour and respect to one of humiliation and ignominy, because the Pharaoh of Egypt persecuted and enslaved the Israelites

The truth has been made known to you. You can twist it to suit yourself.

The word of God had been in use thousands of years before Muhammad's quran to counter it through the spirit of his father's idol, allah.

Eno38151:
First of all Allah, is derived from "al" meaning "THE" and "Ilah" translated as God in english.

The Arabs and Isrealis are descended from Ismail (Ishmael) son and Ishaqs' (Isaac) son Yaquub (Jacob) respectively, their father was Ibrahim (Abraham) who was was born in Mesopotamia and spoke Aramaic not Hebrew.

The arabs are descended from Ismail in the sense that he married into their tribes and as he and his brother Ishaq (peace be upon them all) were granted prophethood and lived in different locations (Ishaq lived in Palestine while Ismail lived in Makkah). He had a position of rank amongst the people, also he Ismail and his father Abraham were the first to build the Ka'bah and Ismail was a prophet sent to the Arabs. Now if you say Islam is something new or invented by the Arab people why would Ibrahim peace be upon him help him by building the Ka'bah the first Masjid to be built. Does that not show that even though the messengers were sent to different communities their message was the same and they all worshipped the same God.

You say Allahs name changed in the Bible even though I would be honest with you i dont know the meaning of "Yahweh or Jehovah" I would tell you this, all of Allahs names are descriptions of his attributes like "the​ most merciful" or "Allah meaning The God in English or more suitably The Object Of Worship". it is not impossible for Allah to call himself by another name. if Allah were to call himself "The Most Merciful does he stop being Allah??. If he were to call himself "The lord of Israel does he stop being the Lord of Makkah" I hope you get the point.


Now you claim that Islam is an anomaly from Abraham's teachings (even though you presented no points to buttress your claim). And no authentic preserved copy of Abrahams scripture is known to me and in my little knowledge of Islamic sources none is in existence. So you should present the fact​s.

oga.Abram did not speak Aramaic,Jesus spoke aramaic not Abraham,issac or Jacob.



Aramaic was the language Isrealite came with from babylonia after the 2nd exodus,it was the lingua franca of the empire,the isrealite still kept their hebrew language for worship,just like english french catholics still use latin for worship,
Abraham never got to canan/palestine/Isreal

There is no known record of the city of mekkah until the time of mohammed,not the greeks,romans,assyrians,none till date that refer to mecca as a city,the isrealite learned to write from Egypt,they took that to canaan,and kept records over the millenial,none by them or other knoen empires mentioned mecca,not even once,Egyptians,assryians,persians,nubian are not arabs,thats a name for prople on the arabian desert,its.a generic name for everyone in the middle east,palestinians are not arabs ""