Christian apologist Frank Turek got hit with a powerful question-


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP3H6NSXgoI

God will not ask you to do such in this dispensation . Its that simple

KingEbukasBlog:
God will not ask you to do such in this dispensation . Its that simple

That is dodging the question.

What if God actually asked you to do so? Hypothetical question

Divine command theory

"Killing is wrong but becomes right when my god commands it"

"Genocide is wrong but becomes right when my god commands it"


ever wondered why suicide bombing is increasing?

hopefulLandlord:
Divine command theory

"Killing is wrong but becomes right when my god commands it"

"Genocide is wrong but becomes right when my god commands it"


ever wondered why suicide bombing is increasing?

Not surprised.


KingEbukasblog has no liver to answer the question.

JackBizzle:



Not surprised.


KingEbukasblog has no liver to answer the question.

of course he can't, he wouldn't want to go down the same route as William Lane Craig

Craig's best moment was his defense of the genocide and rape committed against the various Canaanite cities. While those of us with even a modicum of decency instantly recognize that genocide and rape can never be considered good and proper, Craig doesn't have that modicum of decency. The Bible clearly describes Yahweh calling for the Israelites to wipe out entire cities and to keep the virgin young women 'for your selves' (wink, wink, nudge, nudge). While there isn't a shred of compelling evidence for this Yahweh asshole, much less the destruction of those cities, to Craig, it's immaterial. His holy book says so and thus, how to rationalize what is so obviously monstrous and evil behavior. Not a problem!! Hesto-presto and it's called "Divine Command Theory"!!!! Here's how Craig rationalizes monstrous evil. God said, "do it". God cannot be wrong. God cannot be bad. God most certainly cannot be evil. Why? Because bronze age, middle eastern goat herders said so, that's why. So whatever God says or does is by definition, good. Therefore God commanding genocide and rape is good. Challenge Craig on this monstrous defense of monstrous evil and he simply doubles down. The people murdered deserved to be murdered so they were not harmed. The children murdered all went to heaven and so, were not harmed. The young women kept for sex slaves actually got themselves a swell Israelite soldier for a rapist (oops; 'husband') so they were not harmed. In fact, the only ones who could possibly be considered harmed were those poor Israelite soldiers who just might have been a bit upset at doing all that murdering and raping. Poor Israelite soldiers. Hand me a tissue (snort). That must be considered Craig's finest moment. After all, it takes a considerable amount of mental gymnastics and delusional self-deception for a 'Godly Christian' like Craig to rationalize genocide and rape.

KingEbukasBlog:
God will not ask you to do such in this dispensation . Its that simple

Hmm, I wonder why. Probably because in this dispensation, fellow humans would consider you mad. Even crazy folks like you have better sense than Abraham. One can only hope that another dispensation won't come where divine instructions to kill children will be followed. Hopefully, Jesus was the last child God killed.

KingEbukasBlog:
God will not ask you to do such in this dispensation . Its that simple

Lol...

Ya right God only asked Abraham to do it in the dispensation he actually thought his creations were worthless. I guess he loves us better now. HALLELUJAH!!

hopefulLandlord:


of course he can't, he wouldn't want to go down the same route as William Lane Craig

Craig's best moment was his defense of the genocide and rape committed against the various Canaanite cities. While those of us with even a modicum of decency instantly recognize that genocide and rape can never be considered good and proper, Craig doesn't have that modicum of decency. The Bible clearly describes Yahweh calling for the Israelites to wipe out entire cities and to keep the virgin young women 'for your selves' (wink, wink, nudge, nudge). While there isn't a shred of compelling evidence for this Yahweh asshole, much less the destruction of those cities, to Craig, it's immaterial. His holy book says so and thus, how to rationalize what is so obviously monstrous and evil behavior. Not a problem!! Hesto-presto and it's called "Divine Command Theory"!!!! Here's how Craig rationalizes monstrous evil. God said, "do it". God cannot be wrong. God cannot be bad. God most certainly cannot be evil. Why? Because bronze age, middle eastern goat herders said so, that's why. So whatever God says or does is by definition, good. Therefore God commanding genocide and rape is good. Challenge Craig on this monstrous defense of monstrous evil and he simply doubles down. The people murdered deserved to be murdered so they were not harmed. The children murdered all went to heaven and so, were not harmed. The young women kept for sex slaves actually got themselves a swell Israelite soldier for a rapist (oops; 'husband') so they were not harmed. In fact, the only ones who could possibly be considered harmed were those poor Israelite soldiers who just might have been a bit upset at doing all that murdering and raping. Poor Israelite soldiers. Hand me a tissue (snort). That must be considered Craig's finest moment. After all, it takes a considerable amount of mental gymnastics and delusional self-deception for a 'Godly Christian' like Craig to rationalize genocide and rape.

Funny how Craig Williams died down when his porous answers were even ridiculed by christians on youtube.

frank317:


Lol...

Ya right God only asked Abraham to do it in the dispensation he actually thought his creations were worthless. I guess he loves us better now. HALLELUJAH!!

Yahweh woke up one morning and decided to love for a change.

His love was limited to Abraham and whatever child produced from his semen. Then extends biologically to the offsprings of his offsprings. Umm... except Ismael and Esau... He loved all the decendants of Abraham specially.

He later decided to extend His love further to others who accepts the story his prophets and apostles wrote in a book about how he sacrificed himself, necessarily, to save us from his lake of fire prepared for those of us who dont accept the book as truly his own.

A book... containing his egoistic and twisted sense of judgement, his support for murder, genocide, slavery, blood sacrifice, human sacrifice, to mention a few.

In summary, Yahweh did all of this because he loves us...

I aint judging though, how can I?

It's just a myth afterall, an intelligent Designer/Creator cannot be so unreasonable.

Under no circumstances will he kill an innocent child, sounds like a lie - what if children were on a plane heading into to the twin towers? Pretty sure he' would try to stop that plane,even if it meant shooting it down, killing the children. Meaning that there are circumstances where an innocent life can be taken.

JackBizzle:



Not surprised.


KingEbukasblog has no liver to answer the question.

Johnnydon22 asked him this very question in another thread and he danced around it lol

The question is , did God let Abraham kill the child? No, He didn't do it then and He will not do it now.

God Cannot ask us to kill even a guilty person talk more the innocent. so the answer to your mischievous question is NO!

Amberon11:
The question is , did God let Abraham kill the child? No, He didn't do it then and He will not do it now.

God Cannot ask us to kill even a guilty person talk more the innocent. so the answer to your mischievous question is NO!

remind me how this theory of yours apply to the midianite and Canaanite infants

go on, don't dance around or attempt to change your post

Amberon11:
The question is , did God let Abraham kill the child? No, He didn't do it then and He will not do it now.

God Cannot ask us to kill even a guilty person talk more the innocent. so the answer to your mischievous question is NO!

You clearly havent read the old testament where god orders so many killings

Richirich713:
Under no circumstances will he kill an innocent child, sounds like a lie - what if children were on a plane heading into to the twin towers? Pretty sure he' would try to stop that plane,even if it meant shooting it down, killing the children.

If he's truly an omnipotent god, then he should be able to stop the plane without killing the children. That's the meaning of omnipotence

Amberon11:
The question is , did God let Abraham kill the child? No, He didn't do it then and He will not do it now.

God Cannot ask us to kill even a guilty person talk more the innocent. so the answer to your mischievous question is NO!

Yes, God (if he exists) can ask us to kill even an innocent child.

He actually asked Abraham to kill his own son for him just to determine how much Abraham loved him.

Yes he didn't allow Abraham to kill his son, but do u know the sick thing? ABRAHAM WAS ACTUALLY READY TO KILL HIS SON FOR YAHWEH. AND THAT INTENT MADE YAHWEH FELT HE WAS REALLY LOVED BY ABRAHAM.

Yahweh used the willingness​ of his follower to kill his own son to determine how much his follower loved him. What more can be more sick and disheartening than this?

Amberon11:
The question is , did God let Abraham kill the child? No, He didn't do it then and He will not do it now.

God Cannot ask us to kill even a guilty person talk more the innocent. so the answer to your mischievous question is NO!

The amalekites?

hopefulLandlord:


of course he can't, he wouldn't want to go down the same route as William Lane Craig

Craig's best moment was his defense of the genocide and rape committed against the various Canaanite cities. While those of us with even a modicum of decency instantly recognize that genocide and rape can never be considered good and proper, Craig doesn't have that modicum of decency. The Bible clearly describes Yahweh calling for the Israelites to wipe out entire cities and to keep the virgin young women 'for your selves' (wink, wink, nudge, nudge). While there isn't a shred of compelling evidence for this Yahweh asshole, much less the destruction of those cities, to Craig, it's immaterial. His holy book says so and thus, how to rationalize what is so obviously monstrous and evil behavior. Not a problem!! Hesto-presto and it's called "Divine Command Theory"!!!! Here's how Craig rationalizes monstrous evil. God said, "do it". God cannot be wrong. God cannot be bad. God most certainly cannot be evil. Why? Because bronze age, middle eastern goat herders said so, that's why. So whatever God says or does is by definition, good. Therefore God commanding genocide and rape is good. Challenge Craig on this monstrous defense of monstrous evil and he simply doubles down. The people murdered deserved to be murdered so they were not harmed. The children murdered all went to heaven and so, were not harmed. The young women kept for sex slaves actually got themselves a swell Israelite soldier for a rapist (oops; 'husband') so they were not harmed. In fact, the only ones who could possibly be considered harmed were those poor Israelite soldiers who just might have been a bit upset at doing all that murdering and raping. Poor Israelite soldiers. Hand me a tissue (snort). That must be considered Craig's finest moment. After all, it takes a considerable amount of mental gymnastics and delusional self-deception for a 'Godly Christian' like Craig to rationalize genocide and rape.

Wait!!! like seriously someone actually said something like that?.. ..
Help with a video link please....

JhyMedex:


Wait!!! like seriously someone actually said something like that?.. ..
Help with a video link please....

its on his website

http://www.reasonablefaith.org/slaughter-of-the-canaanites

In short, Craig says that the Israelites were right to completely destroy the Caananites, including the children, because God commanded it. This article by Craig, in defending such acts, defends genocide. Does genocide become acceptable if it occurred in ancient times? It seems to me that Craig is guilty of extreme moral relativism, to such an extent that any claim of his that Christianity provides an objective morality cannot be taken serious

So the problem with violent Jihad isn't that it involves killing people but because WLC thinks that they are serving the wrong God? Way to impale oneself on the horns of the Euthyphro dilemma. So the difference between a suicide bomber and WLC is what exactly?

frank317:


Yes, God (if he exists) can ask us to kill even an innocent child.

He actually asked Abraham to kill his own son for him just to determine how much Abraham loved him.

Yes he didn't allow Abraham to kill his son, but do u know the sick thing? ABRAHAM WAS ACTUALLY READY TO KILL HIS SON FOR YAHWEH. AND THAT INTENT MADE YAHWEH FELT HE WAS REALLY LOVED BY ABRAHAM.

Yahweh used the willingness​ of his follower to kill his own son to determine how much his follower loved him. What more can be more sick and disheartening than this?

Once you free your mind from seeing the Bible as the literal word of God, then you soon realize the Bible is just the Hebrews attempt to wrestle with the concept of God, theologically and culturally. Once your mind is free you are able to pursue a higher concept of deity, or you may decide there is no deity. Either way you are probably better off.

It boggles my mind why people don't see this. Religious texts CONTAIN spiritual truths but are not LITERALLY true. Mankind down through the ages has wrestled with their place in the cosmos and various traditions/cultures' scriptures are a representation of that struggle.

And so it is absurd that thousands of years later we still have people clinging to a their "favourite" interpretation of what's in the bible.

randomperson:

If he's truly an omnipotent god, then he should be able to stop the plane without killing the children. That's the meaning of omnipotence

That's moving the goal post, he never said anything about omnipotence, he said under no circumstances will he kill an innocent child - implying that it is always immoral to kill an innocent child regardless of the circumstances.

if you agree with me that in those circumstances it's OK to shoot that plane down then u agree with me that there are situations in which taking an innocent life is not immoral. Meaning that it's not always immoral to take an innocent life.

Plus if you want to include omnipotence, you also have to include omniscience and omnibenevolence. Meaning, if God commanded one to kill an innocent child - he'll always have sufficient reasons for doing so due to his omni attributes. He would also have the right to do so since he's the creator and sustainer of that life.

KingEbukasBlog:
God will not ask you to do such in this dispensation . Its that simple

Many people have killed and said God told them to do so in this dispensation. Any God that can tell you to kill your child before can always tell you to kill your child today. Remember the Lord changes not according to the bible. He is the same yesterday , today and forever.

hopefulLandlord:


of course he can't, he wouldn't want to go down the same route as William Lane Craig

Craig's best moment was his defense of the genocide and rape committed against the various Canaanite cities. While those of us with even a modicum of decency instantly recognize that genocide and rape can never be considered good and proper, Craig doesn't have that modicum of decency. The Bible clearly describes Yahweh calling for the Israelites to wipe out entire cities and to keep the virgin young women 'for your selves' (wink, wink, nudge, nudge). While there isn't a shred of compelling evidence for this Yahweh asshole, much less the destruction of those cities, to Craig, it's immaterial. His holy book says so and thus, how to rationalize what is so obviously monstrous and evil behavior. Not a problem!! Hesto-presto and it's called "Divine Command Theory"!!!! Here's how Craig rationalizes monstrous evil. God said, "do it". God cannot be wrong. God cannot be bad. God most certainly cannot be evil. Why? Because bronze age, middle eastern goat herders said so, that's why. So whatever God says or does is by definition, good. Therefore God commanding genocide and rape is good. Challenge Craig on this monstrous defense of monstrous evil and he simply doubles down. The people murdered deserved to be murdered so they were not harmed. The children murdered all went to heaven and so, were not harmed. The young women kept for sex slaves actually got themselves a swell Israelite soldier for a rapist (oops; 'husband') so they were not harmed. In fact, the only ones who could possibly be considered harmed were those poor Israelite soldiers who just might have been a bit upset at doing all that murdering and raping. Poor Israelite soldiers. Hand me a tissue (snort). That must be considered Craig's finest moment. After all, it takes a considerable amount of mental gymnastics and delusional self-deception for a 'Godly Christian' like Craig to rationalize genocide and rape.

William Craig has now discarded all this nonsense because he has realized it has made him sound evil. Now he runs away from the bible entirely by claiming that maybe the Jews that wrote the stories got it all wrong and God never told them to write down such horrible things. But most recently he just says he doesn't want to talk about OT morality because he knows it's indefensible honestly speaking. You can't defend the OT and not sound like Ibrahim Shekau or the leader of ISIS.

JackBizzle:



Funny how Craig Williams died down when his porous answers were even ridiculed by christians on youtube.

That's the main reason he stopped those nonsense, because even christians called him out on his madness.

Richirich713:

Meaning, if God commanded one to kill an innocent child - he'll always have sufficient reasons for doing so due to his omni attributes. He would also have the right to do so since he's the creator and sustainer of that life.

Brilliant. Now let's hop all you never hear that voice.

dalaman:


Many people have killed and said God told them to do so in this dispensation. Any God that can tell you to kill tour child before can always tell you to.kill your child today. Remember the Lord changes not according to the bible. He is the same yesterday , today and forever.

Andrea Yates comes to mind

andrea yates was doing the work of the Lord then just like she said when she drowned all her four children in the bathtub "God said I should do it to give them salvation"

the most interesting part is how eerily accurate that logic is, according to Christians dead infants automatically make heaven!!!!!

sonofluc1fer:

Brilliant. Now let's hop all you never hear that voice.

Why not? Isn't killing innocent children just an opinion on your point of view?

Richirich713:

Why not?

Pyschopath Richie.

Richirich713:

Isn't killing innocent children just an opinion on your point of view?

Classic misdirection. You've admitted to being a potential child killer. God just hasnt given the command yet.

You will do anything for God, whether innocent baby or jungle justice. You will kill for God. God created. God sustains. God has the power and authority to take life . And you will be his instrument when He commamds.

That's what matters, Richie. Not what you think I think of killing babies. Have a nice weekend, God's warrior.

Pastafarian:


its on his website

http://www.reasonablefaith.org/slaughter-of-the-canaanites

In short, Craig says that the Israelites were right to completely destroy the Caananites, including the children, because God commanded it. This article by Craig, in defending such acts, defends genocide. Does genocide become acceptable if it occurred in ancient times? It seems to me that Craig is guilty of extreme moral relativism, to such an extent that any claim of his that Christianity provides an objective morality cannot be taken serious

So the problem with violent Jihad isn't that it involves killing people but because WLC thinks that they are serving the wrong God? Way to impale oneself on the horns of the Euthyphro dilemma. So the difference between a suicide bomber and WLC is what exactly?

What the heck did I just read?!!!
I almost couldn't believe It... but there it was..right in front of me...
A human being justifying the massacre of innocent men, women and children whose only offence was not being Israeli....

An archetypal Product of obstinate belief and perpetuation of behaviors we know deep down is inhumane and callous for no moral reason other than that we were told so by the Bible ....

Funny part about the subject is that this man doesn't stand alone in his malevolent beliefs...
Billions of people around the world, some of them very close to you and I actually believe that absolutely nothing was wrong with the genocide carried out by the Israelites on innocent tribes and people...

This same people are quick the condemn the Hutu-Tsuti genocide in Rwanda ,the Cambodian genocides, Hitler's Jewish massacre ...

Why?.. painful but not surprising that one was supposedly endorsed by God...

We need to free ourselves from this magnitude of mental slavery ...Or I fear for the fate of the world!!...

Tanx for sharing HopefulLandlord

sonofluc1fer:

Pyschopath Richie.

sonofluc1fer:
Classic misdirection.

Classic dodge, the conversation can't just end there, u got to explain to me your views on the issue, not just assume killing innocent children is always wrong (I've already shown that to be false, there situations where it's not). From what I see, all you as an atheist can say is that killing innocent children it's just an rearrangement of molecules and the whole idea that it's wrong is just an subjective opinion.

sonofluc1fer:
You've admitted to being a potential child killer. God just hasnt given the command yet. You will do anything for God, whether innocent baby or jungle justice. You will kill for God. God created. God sustains. God has the power and authority to take life . And you will be his instrument when He commamds.

I've admitted that I'll trust a being that has perfect knowledge and that always has sufficient and good reasons for any command he gives due to his omnibenevolence and omniscience. I've not admitted that I'll do something evil just because God commanded since that command would be impossible due to God omnibenevolence.

sonofluc1fer:
That's what matters, Richie. Not what you think I think of killing babies. Have a nice weekend, God's warrior.

I'll like to know what u think, if you think your position is somehow superior to mine, let's hear it.