Theres still that 40 F-16s in Isreal looking for a buyer..

Henry240:

Do they mean utility helicopters, because i don't remember Britain building any Attack Helicopters apart from the AH-64 which is licence built.

best reply

Henry240:


Unfortunately i don't agree with this. In Africa, we have the regional powers and we also have France. France has militarily intervened in Africa more than 25 times since 1962. The country currently has 4,000 troops stationed in Africa with permanent bases in at least 5 African countries.

I have not seen an AH-64 exported by the UK government. It is not transferable, only Boeing has the right to sell the AH-64. The US government will reject any move to transfer excess Apaches to Nigeria. Sorry, these sorts of deals don't happen all the time.

Nigeria is asking for, it doesn't mean we are going to get them.

The Tucanos are sophisticated with an impressive plethora of munitions however they are quite limited in thier scope of use. None of the scenarios they are going to be employed in is a direct threat to France or French interests. This is why the US government will never sell the F-16, even the most basic model to Nigeria.

There is a possibility it could happen regarding the Apaches from the UK as several D models are in storage (others are going to be upgraded to the E model). It won't even alter the balance of power in the region as such because of the Mi-24/35s that Nigeria and other West/ Central African states operate. Even the Cameroonians operate night capable Z9s from China.

The most likely though would be retired Lynx MK9s.

lionel4power:
Theres still that 40 F-16s in Isreal looking for a buyer..

mig 29m2 or mig35 is a better choice, the F16 wouldn't favor us

Henry240:


Unfortunately i don't agree with this. In Africa, we have the regional powers and we also have France. France has militarily intervened in Africa more than 25 times since 1962. The country currently has 4,000 troops stationed in Africa with permanent bases in at least 5 African countries.

I have not seen an AH-64 exported by the UK government. It is not transferable, only Boeing has the right to sell the AH-64. The US government will reject any move to transfer excess Apaches to Nigeria. Sorry, these sorts of deals don't happen all the time.

Nigeria is asking for, it doesn't mean we are going to get them.

The Tucanos are sophisticated with an impressive plethora of munitions however they are quite limited in thier scope of use. None of the scenarios they are going to be employed in is a direct threat to France or French interests. This is why the US government will never sell the F-16, even the most basic model to Nigeria.

And exactly so that Nigeria is asking for it doesn't mean we are going to get them. But it's in the realm of possibility. You seem to harp on transfer and EDA which I don't envisage is the case here. No one knows exactly what's in the offing but clearly it's concrete the Nigerians made the request for attack helicopters from the British. It is the British and possibly the people asking them for it know who what kind of arrangement they have with the original manufacturer and how that can be sorted out. Having said that it is the US president that is the chief weapons salesman of the world with the approval of congress and if president Trump sees any win-win for the US you might just consider it a done deal with support from Congress. Still President Buhari has the option of approaching the US directly for sale of such capabilities.

Who is attacking who's interest in Africa? France against Nigeria in direct war is silly to contemplate. Which modern state fight such wars. States adopt contingency doctrines for:

1. Winnable Wars vis-a-vis the belligerent state in question.
2. Wars of Attrition of indefinite span to weaken, demoralize and ultimately force the more powerful or near equal belligerent adversary to withdraw and negotiate terms of peace.

Neither countries have the capacity for the first outcome save for a nuclear weapon and neither can afford the latter. A conflict is out of the question but economic co-operation for prosperity. The only other option is:

3. Proxy Wars to overtime wear out an enemy state and keep it in perpetual weakness.

Do you seriously think France with 4,000 troops and 5 bases in the region is a directed as a military threat to Nigeria? I think the French are better than that. The route open to the French is destabilizing antics and the last time we had such overt actions we trounced them. In fact Nigeria has trounced France every time it chose not to subtly show it's hand like the nuclear test in our backyard. There better means of retaliation against France and there's no military option. Right now except for the unknown fingers in boko haram the political and military balance is in Nigeria's Favour with the French as partners.

No gainsaying the Tucano is a dream to have with it's configurations but it in it self alone is limited in speed and range for strategic conventional effect. There are three regional powers in Africa: 1. Nigeria 2. South Africa 3. Egypt. Of the three Nigeria is the dominant power with the largest population by far, the largest economy by far and political heavyweight. The French deployment of 4,000 troops does not alter that balance of power. And if u insist I'll find vid of a French president talking about the merits of the Nigerian military and post it here. The 1st mechanized division Kaduna alone which is Nigeria's foremost fighting unit and never used in the Boko insurgency which experts questioned is larger than the entire French deployment in Africa.

If the US government will not sell us F-16s we can get that capability elsewhere and they know it. Already diplomats in Washington as we speak question the wisdom in continuing to deny Nigeria sale of certain capabilities with the purchase of the JF-17 thunders etc.

here we go again



. France will be looking at this guy like;

off topic
. French Navy Aircraft Carrier

lionel4power:
here we go again




.
France will be looking at this guy like;

Actually laughing at u. The French that could not keep the peace in Central African Republic. Did they tell you their soldiers were raping kids there. C'mon change your mindset and learn what you don't know.

lionel4power:
off topic

.
French Navy Aircraft Carrier

I remember what a Chinese General told the Americans before they developed Aircraft Carrier Killers. I think the French took note.

Adminisher:


They have Army Lynx helicopter , they have WildCat MK1, they are part of Eurocopter. Who told you they don't make choppers?
I don't think we even want to go for Apache. Upgraded Army Lynx or WildCat are enough.

With Brexit, the UK has stopped being slack with Nigeria. They are losing to the Chinese bigly and they will correct it.

Nigeria has in the past purchased the Naval Version of the Lynx.
IMHO.The Nigerians are asking for the Army's version of the Lynx to serve as an attack Helicopter.
France has a over a $1B of investments in Nigeria , the Oil Find by Total in the 2000s was one of the largest in the World.
France's investments in Nigeria dwarf those of it's former colonies.
France this year has pledged another $1B as in direct FDI to Nigeria.
France is currently building 3 x Naval Warships
and 3 Naval Helicopters for Nigeria.
Enough said.

Adminisher:


They have Army Lynx helicopter , they have WildCat MK1, they are part of Eurocopter. Who told you they don't make choppers?
I don't think we even want to go for Apache. Upgraded Army Lynx or WildCat are enough.

With Brexit, the UK has stopped being slack with Nigeria. They are losing to the Chinese bigly and they will correct it.

Did you read this part of my comment?

Henry240:

Do they mean utility helicopters, because i don't remember Britain building any Attack Helicopters apart from the AH-64 which is licence built.

giles14:
mig 29m2 or mig35 is a better choice, the F16 wouldn't favor us

all three you mentioned are in the medium weight category.


.
The Gripen, JF-17, Tejas, F-50 Golden Eagle and F-5 Tiger are all lightweights.



So it all depends on our overall objective.

rka2:


There is a possibility it could happen regarding the Apaches from the UK as several D models are in storage (others are going to be upgraded to the E model). It won't even alter the balance of power in the region as such because of the Mi-24/35s that Nigeria and other West/ Central African states operate. Even the Cameroonians operate night capable Z9s from China.

The most likely though would be retired Lynx MK9s.

The Apaches are not for the British to give away. For any sort of transfer to happen, the British would need US congressional approval.

The Apache would alter the balance of power because that would mean a threat to French interests in the region. MI-35m / Z-9 are Russian and Chinese assets, no worries with that because those birds come from a different political landscape.

Yes, i said most likely any sort of helicopters would be utility. However, even this is highly unlikely, as from the tone of Boris Johnson, he wasn't to inclined with the idea of selling/transferring offensive equipment.

LTGEN:

Nigeria has in the past purchased the Naval Version of the Lynx.
IMHO.The Nigerians are asking for the Army's version of the Lynx to serve as an attack Helicopter.
France has a over a $1B of investments in Nigeria , the Oil Find by Total in the 2000s was one of the largest in the World.
France's investments in Nigeria dwarf those of it's former colonies.
France this year has pledged another $1B as in direct FDI to Nigeria.
France is currently building 3 x Naval Warships
and 3 Naval Helicopters for Nigeria.
Enough said.

I dont really think it would be prudent to add another type of helicopter into the mix... we already operate a,wide range of utility helicopters with similar characteristics.

.
I would suggest we just standardizes the fleet instead.

LTGEN:

Nigeria has in the past purchased the Naval Version of the Lynx.
IMHO.The Nigerians are asking for the Army's version of the Lynx to serve as an attack Helicopter.
France has a over a $1B of investments in Nigeria , the Oil Find by Total in the 2000s was one of the largest in the World.
France's investments in Nigeria dwarf those of it's former colonies.
France this year has pledged another $1B as in direct FDI to Nigeria.
France is currently building 3 x Naval Warships
and 3 Naval Helicopters for Nigeria.
Enough said.

God Bless You LTGEN.

Enough Said.

Henry240:


Did you read this part of my comment?

Army Lynx and WildCat are not utility helicopters. The WildCat is equipped with advanced FLIR and effective l anti surface missiles. No cannons though.

Covert1:


And exactly so that Nigeria is asking for it doesn't mean we are going to get them. But it's in the realm of possibility. You seem to harp on transfer and EDA which I don't envisage is the case here. No one knows exactly what's in the offing but clearly it's concrete the Nigerians made the request for attack helicopters from the British. It is the British and possibly the people asking them for it know who what kind of arrangement they have with the original manufacturer and how that can be sorted out. Having said that it is the US president that is the chief weapons salesman of the world with the approval of congress and if president Trump sees any win-win for the US you might just consider it a done deal with support from Congress. Still President Buhari has the option of approaching the US directly for sale of such capabilities.

etc.

I'm happing on transfer and EDA as it is the best we can do at this time as we already have new attack helicopters, fighter planes and fighter jets on order. I simply don't see how we plan to fund an additional purchase of new attack helicopters from the UK.

I insist it is not in the realm of possibilities. The UK doesn't have the authority to export US equipment. Congress will not approve a purchase of the AH-64 to Nigeria as the politics of interest can and has been served with the sale of the Tucano.

The British do not have any AH of thier own.

Without the US Congress approving a sale, no country gets that equipment. Trump doesn't have the sole authority to approve any sale of defence equipment.

With each visit of a "foreign" high ranking political office holder, we ask for a sale or transfer of military equipment to deal with our insurgency. I don't know why this is even news.

We did same with Germany, France, China and very recently Russia. No biggie.

President Buhari has approached the US, and the US has approved a sale that is inline with the overall US interest, with consideration of US allies in the region. Hence the approval of the Tucano sale.

lionel4power:
all three you mentioned are in the medium weight category.


.
The Gripen, JF-17, Tejas, F-50 Golden Eagle and F-5 Tiger are all lightweights.



So it all depends on our overall objective.

Heavy weight fighter, I'll go for su 30 or J10

lionel4power:
here we go again



. France will be looking at this guy like;

d thing tire me

lionel4power:
all three you mentioned are in the medium weight category.


.
The Gripen, JF-17, Tejas, F-50 Golden Eagle and F-5 Tiger are all lightweights.



So it all depends on our overall objective.

I'm aware of the weight category,
was only saying because of the aircraft age,version and sanctions in the future (Jaguar jets n CH47)

Covert1:



Do you seriously think France with 4,000 troops and 5 bases in the region is a directed as a military threat to Nigeria? I think the French are better than that. The route open to the French is destabilizing antics and the last time we had such overt actions we trounced them. In fact Nigeria has trounced France every time it chose not to subtly show it's hand like the nuclear test in our backyard. There better means of retaliation against France and there's no military option. Right now except for the unknown fingers in boko haram the political and military balance is in Nigeria's Favour with the French as partners.

No gainsaying the Tucano is a dream to have with it's configurations but it in it self alone is limited in speed and range for strategic conventional effect. There are three regional powers in Africa: 1. Nigeria 2. South Africa 3. Egypt. Of the three Nigeria is the dominant power with the largest population by far, the largest economy by far and political heavyweight. The French deployment of 4,000 troops does not alter that balance of power. And if u insist I'll find vid of a French president talking about the merits of the Nigerian military and post it here. The 1st mechanized division Kaduna alone which is Nigeria's foremost fighting unit and never used in the Boko insurgency which experts questioned is larger than the entire French deployment in Africa.

If the US government will not sell us F-16s we can get that capability elsewhere and they know it. Already diplomats in Washington as we speak question the wisdom in continuing to deny Nigeria sale of certain capabilities with the purchase of the JF-17 thunders etc.

The fact the French already have 4,000 troops in Africa is a threat to Nigeria or any other regional power. It means the French can easily reinforce thier positions more rapidly in the event of a confrontation.

France is a dominant military figure in Africa. This has always been true, it is still true. The French are well entrenched in Mali, Chad, Ivory Coast CAR, Djibouti, Senegal, Burkina Faso, Cameroun, Niger and Gabon. Let us use out tongues to count our teeth.

The French are a significant power in Africa.

Anybody can talk about the merits of another, that's also not the issue here. The fact is the French have the capacity and infrastructure to support a large military build-up which is a significant military threat to Nigeria.

We are getting the capabilities of the F-16 in the JF-17, however the JF-17 is not an American fighter. Not something the US can control.

tdayof:



Heavy weight fighter, I'll go for su 30 or J10

I doubt if d J10 is in that category

Adminisher:


Army Lynx and WildCat are not utility helicopters. The WildCat is equipped with advanced FLIR and effective l anti surface missiles. No cannons though.

They are armed helicopters, not Attack Helicopters. Significant difference.

Same thing as the Bell UH-1Y Venom.

giles14:
I doubt if d J10 is in that category

True. Thanks. I'll go for the su 30 as an heavy weight fighter but the j10 is an aircraft I love.


The J10 is okay for us.

tdayof:



Heavy weight fighter, I'll go for su 30 or J10

j10 medium weight category

edit did not see the comments below sorry

Henry240:

Do they mean utility helicopters, because i don't remember Britain building any Attack Helicopters apart from the AH-64 which is licence built.

Bros, no much details was provided and that was why I didn't post it here. Its just like the Mig that we have no info about.

Covert1:


I remember what a Chinese General told the Americans before they developed Aircraft Carrier Killers. I think the French took note.

DF-21 "Carrier killers" are a fvcking meme.

Holy sh1t, bro. What is AEGIS and THAAD?

lionel4power:
all three you mentioned are in the medium weight category.


.
The Gripen, JF-17, Tejas, F-50 Golden Eagle and F-5 Tiger are all lightweights.



So it all depends on our overall objective.

wtf is this "weight" nonsense?

Thats not how you class them.

Also, you are grouping trainers with fighters.

tdayof:



Heavy weight fighter, I'll go for su 30 or J10

I think J-10 is medium weight fighter

patches689:


wtf is this "weight" nonsense?

Thats not how you class them.

Also, you are grouping trainers with fighters.

the F-50 golden eagle I mentioned has a light fighter version.

.
The Gripen is a light fighter same with Tejas.


Lightweight fighters has a disadvantage against medium or heavy weights in combat

Henry240:


The Apaches are not for the British to give away. For any sort of transfer to happen, the British would need US congressional approval.

The Apache would alter the balance of power because that would mean a threat to French interests in the region. MI-35m / Z-9 are Russian and Chinese assets, no worries with that because those birds come from a different political landscape.

Yes, i said most likely any sort of helicopters would be utility. However, even this is highly unlikely, as from the tone of Boris Johnson, he wasn't to inclined with the idea of selling/transferring offensive equipment.

I never said it was to give away by the British Government as the point about permission from the US has already been mentioned. You don't have to have a Western system in the region before the US will introduce a new weapon as long as they are not the first to do so.

BTW, the lynx was also regarded as an attack (tank killer) heli by the British Army as used in Iraq.