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Atheism. Define Please! by budaatum: 1:58am On Oct 13, 2017 |
Seems there are many definitions of atheism, so I am seeking clarification. Answer the questions below please. Hopefully, the non-atheists will hold themselves in check until some clarity appears. Please note, I am aware questions 1 and 2 may mean the same thing to some. You do not have to state how the world came into existence. If you respond to any comments not relevant to the topic at hand, or derail this thread in anyway or form, thunder thunder thunder! How do you define atheism? What do you mean when you claim you are an atheist? As an atheist, do you accept that there is a creator of the universe? |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by KingEbukasBlog(m): 2:10am On Oct 13, 2017 |
There are no gods to an atheist because no entity- abstract or concrete- is being elevated to a divine status (deity, deification) . So the atheist lacks the belief in deities simply because he is godless or without a deity (atheos) , nothing is a god or deity to an atheist . Simple . Atheism is therefore , the rejection of deification . Yes , there are atheists who acknowledge the existence of intelligent source(s) of life on earth (Raelism) and there are those who believe the universe is created (defence of this stance comes , as they say , from the first cause argument) but they don't take the First Cause as a deity . If you deify something or see it as a god , you are a theist ; if you don't see anything as a deity or god or deify something , you are an atheist . Example The pantheist sees the universe as a deity or a god , as an atheist you are not saying the universe does not exist because it is a deity , you simply reject deification . Use this simple logic to understand whatever I wrote above , it can be applied to just anything . 1 Like |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by JackBizzle: 5:38am On Oct 13, 2017 |
KingEbukasBlog: Ogbeni, no one asked you for your long story as you are not an atheist. SWERVE. |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by KingEbukasBlog(m): 8:44am On Oct 13, 2017 |
JackBizzle: I'm so happy you are an atheist . I mean so I can easily toss you around , show you how unintelligent your contributions are and how ignorant you are Now you refute my post Of course you can't 2 Likes |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by budaatum: 11:49am On Oct 13, 2017 |
KingEbukasBlog:Pity you had to butt in. |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by KingEbukasBlog(m): 12:11pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
budaatum: Pity you don't know what atheism is . |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by JackBizzle: 4:20pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
budaatum: Don't mind him. Kingebukasblog is a derailer. But bro, why are you asking for the definition of atheism? |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by budaatum: 4:38pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
budaatum: The religious background of most people defines their language. You would hence hear theists claim a belief in god, or atheists claim a lack of belief in gods. What an insult to the gods that you human beings subject them to your arbitrary held beliefs. If anything, does this not prove they are constructs of your minds? I find this funny, though acceptable. If I were in a room with no windows and know not what is going on outside the room, it is possible to say, "I believe it is raining", but I can step outside the room and check to see if it is raining or not, and if it is raining and pissing down on my head, I won't just believe it is raining, I'll know it is raining! Unless I wish to delude myself of course, in which case I can claim all sorts of things - an alien from the planet Zog is washing its phandikons after devouring a upigathon, for instance. But, I'll know I'm deluded. Unless I've lost the use of my faculties, in which case I'm just mad, to which I expect a wide berth to be taken. I have stepped out the room regarding religion and deification and it pissed on my head and I don't do phandikons! I am an atheist. I do not believe gods, spirits, angels, aliens, creators etc, exist or do not exist; I know that they do not exist. They are constructs, pretty good constructs at that, of humans, to explain the things we perceive. It stems from the desire to explain or find reasons for things. We just can't say, "we don't know" how certain things came into existence, so we come up with the best explanations we can within the limits of our existential time. This is the beginning of science in its most primitive form. The first scientific claim in Judaism is that God created the Heavens and the Earth. The Jews saw all that existed and could not fathom existence without a creator, so they imagined one. They didn't do this in isolation. They got ideas from surrounding tribes and made up their own. The bible shows how unsure they were in the early books of Genesis, with God creating in one way, and another in the very next chapter. A critical look at the text has even allowed some to dispute which god did the creating! It was a great observation for its time, but some societies knew better, even at the time the Jews were coming up with their observations. But you try giving the works of Plato to people and see how many get through the first book. Some have though, and they teach ot to others. We call them pastors, albeit a one eyed pastor teaching the blind. In Buddhism, the Bodhisattva remains on earth cultivating supreme moral and spiritual perfection to be placed in the service of others. He brings them to realisation. Knowledge of the process of development, or evolution, of Judaic Thought is what some great nations have built on to become what they are today. At one point they claimed the earth was flat, it was created on October 23, 4004 BC and God done it. But such beliefs have today been abandoned by many, and continuing to believe (as opposed to understandimg, or comprehending) what ancient Jews wrote is purely a misunderstanding, and a non acceptance of subsequent knowledge. Even the Jews don't believe their own myths anymore, so, to me, it is absurd that anyone does. However, I understand how people can believe these myths and know it is important that people know about these ancient believes. Someday understanding of them would come about, and believing would be abandoned. One day it would be understood that gods exist because human beings have deified things into gods. Its a pretty neat trick, one that more developed nations use to further develop their nations. As is written in the book of John, "In the beginning was the word". We Nigerians would one day learn to use the power of the word. Just imagine, the immense work required to electrify Nigeria! Let there be light, would be the words that would be uttered, and there would never be a power cut in Nigeria ever again! |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by Nobody: 5:18pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
budaatum: your post agrees with ebukas definition |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by KingEbukasBlog(m): 6:27pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
budaatum: Ignorance is really a disease. And to keep repeating this same garbage shows how close-minded you are . Blatantly unwilling to accept the truth in the face of evidence bespeaks of strong delusion. Your post has been countlessly refuted . Whether you accept creators or not has nothing to do with atheism , an atheist is open to acknowledging the existence of creators and extraterrestrial life (aliens ) . You are propagating mostly materialism and naturalism which have nothing to do with atheism . The acknowledgement of the existence of a cosmic designer comes from an understanding of logic, science , deep observation of nature , moral values and duties , mathematics , intentional states of consciousness etc . If you contravene this , challenge me to a debate - open a thread , just two of us and prove your atheism to be true . 3 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by budaatum: 7:29pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
KingEbukasBlog:Logic does not prove the existence of a designer! Neither does science, nor any observation of nature, or moral values and duties, mathematics, or consciousness. Believers take a leap of faith and insert a designer. They have not proven one actually exists. And atheist don't accept one exists. To be honest, I don't know what the terms of future argument would be. If you do, please let me know. I will consider. I am not out to convince you and I'm willing to accept what atheism means to you. At the very least, you know what I mean when I use the word and that's good enough for me. 3 Likes |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by budaatum: 7:30pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
Proudgorgeousga:Care to elaborate please? Perhaps you can open my eyes. |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by KingEbukasBlog(m): 7:50pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
budaatum: Mister , it is not by empty rants ; open a thread , engage me in a debate and show me why . For me , I can easily , very easily prove that . There are atheists who believe in the existence of a designer . I gave you links and showed you snapshots even from Pew Research , a very reputed organisation , yet you are still adamant they don't . You are just as close-minded as JackBizzle . In fact , both of you are seriously competing for the top spot in close-mindedness At the very least, you know what I mean when I use the word and that's good enough for me. You claimed atheists don't accept aliens exist . This is the first time of seeing that ever in my life . I don't even know what you are , but what I'm certain of is that you are conflating different philosophical positions in the name of atheism 1 Like |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by budaatum: 8:24pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
JackBizzle:Trying to clarify for understanding. Someone claims atheists believe a creator exists but don't accept it is a god. While I claim atheists don't believe in the existence of any supernatural being including a creator. I might have explained the person's position wrongly. Still trying to understand so, bear please if I am corrected here. |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by KingEbukasBlog(m): 8:33pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
budaatum: Not everyone sees God , the appellation of the First Cause , as a supernatural being . There are religions called Natural Religions that see the creator , souls etc as part of Nature but yet to be understood clearly . 'Supernatural' is ambiguous - does not mean the same thing to everyone . Atheism does not deny the 'supernatural' ; materialism , naturism , realism etc do that . 1 Like |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by Nobody: 8:35pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
budaatum: I'm not trying to get into an argument tho below is from your post budaatum: So since you believe humans diefy things into gods simply because they don't really understand them or they seem special. then It means you are an atheist because you reject deificatin of things into gods. anyway I disagree with his argument about a the existence of a designer being proven all we have is various versions and speculations i.e. African version, Jewish, Muslim or deist version. There is no verifiable evidence a designer exist especially the one that is three in one and sent himself as his son to die. |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by JackBizzle: 8:38pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
budaatum: Well, I believe that all atheist do not believe in god. There might be a creator but it might not be God. Many sci-fi movies hint that it is an alien race that seeded life on earth. Life comes from life, as we have seen. It is a possibility even though there is no proof behind it. |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by Nobody: 8:40pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
KingEbukasBlog: 1st time of seeing what bloody liar. Many atheists have had this same argument with you on nairaland. Many atheists might be open to the idea of extraterrestrial beings on other planets. but they do not believe they actually exist because there is no evidence. |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by Nobody: 8:41pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
JackBizzle: |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by budaatum: 8:47pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
Proudgorgeousga: No! No! No! People may do so. My position is that they do so in error! The fact that they deify things does not prove those things are supernatural or that they created anything. An example is Raelism, and FSM! And is what you would claim if I were to say "The stone statue in my garden is a deity because it created the universe"! Not only would you argue that it is a mere stone, but also that it did not create anything! Would it not be absurd of me to claim it is only the defication of the stone that you object to? |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by KingEbukasBlog(m): 8:49pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
Proudgorgeousga: Abeg relax jare . It has nothing to do with atheism . Everyone - theist and atheist- can be open to the idea of extraterrestrial life . 1 Like |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by JackBizzle: 8:50pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
KingEbukasBlog: If there is extraterrestrial life, then your bible is false. |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by budaatum: 8:55pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
JackBizzle:Thanks. It's a position. But why wouldn't a person who believed their god created the universe not claim any one with a different creator god is an atheist? It is the position being proposed! |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by KingEbukasBlog(m): 8:56pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
JackBizzle: Honestly , Ive had enough of your stupid talk . You claimed agnostics are atheists now this ? 1 Like |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by KingEbukasBlog(m): 9:05pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
Proudgorgeousga: Is this a world-wide consensus or what your imaginations reveal to you ? |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by Nobody: 9:08pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
budaatum: I get your point now. The problem is that the person you were replying argues more for deism instead of his Yahweh. So my question is if eventually an intelligent designer is proven to exist will you now call it god seeing as it actually created something as claimed. even if it is not interested in his creation? |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by budaatum: 9:09pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
Proudgorgeousga: Part of this response referred to a position taken by the person you say we are saying the same thing, sorry. I hope you can separate the chaff and wheat. I do not only reject defication, but know that the thing deified is not a deity and deified in error including the three in one, the stone in my garden and all other things that human beings have imagined through time to be gods. The stone is a stone and not a god, and believing it is one does not make it a god. Gods do not exist outside the imagination of those who create one in their heads! |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by Nobody: 9:09pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
KingEbukasBlog: what imaginations? The one that created a rib woman? |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by KingEbukasBlog(m): 9:12pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
Proudgorgeousga: Your imaginations The one that created a rib woman? Red herring . I know it is extremely difficult for an atheist(your type of atheists) to be logical but please I implore you to focus on the argument . The question again : Is this a world-wide consensus or what your imaginations reveal to you |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by hopefulLandlord: 9:13pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
KingEbukasBlog:Never knew argumentum ad populum is what we are to use here; let's even assume consensus shows says there's "evidence" for a designer, does that suddenly make it true? I mean there was a time consensus would show almost all humans on earth think the earth is flat, stationary and the sun moves over it, did that suddenly make it true? if no, why are you screaming consensus? 4 Likes 2 Shares |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by budaatum: 9:14pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
Proudgorgeousga:Now you see his error! It is the reason I set up this thread suspecting many atheist would not accept it! |
Re: Atheism. Define Please! by KingEbukasBlog(m): 9:15pm On Oct 13, 2017 |
budaatum: Now I'm certain you are confused .But I sense the serious battle within you , keep fighting and break free . The atheists who believe a creator of the universe exists do not take it as a deity or a god since atheism rejects deification . |
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