Joebie:
"Not all" for a country that is blessed with so many good players.. You and I know that even Dessers and co have not even earned their first cap for SE. so what are we talking about? They are neither tested nor proven.

When you tested and proved people like Martins where did they carry you to? That's why I ask is Martins Rashidi Yekini?

safarigirl:
no, we don't do well because we pack a bunch of old legs and expect them to perform magic.

Rufai, Yekini, Ameobi, Yobo, and God knows which other grandpa we will be taking next year.....

Y'all keep messing up the team's chemistry in your quest to find an individually good player forgetting that football is a TEAM sport, not an individual one and being great individually, does not make one great for a team.

If you must fortify this team, do so with players that will blend in seamlessly, not some grand dads that will struggle to find their place in the current set up

This is a very different case because those players you listed above were not performing as at the time they went to the world Cup.

Rufai and Yekini in 1998. Yobo and Ameobi in 2010.


Besides, how many games did Ighalo played before he was called for the match against Cameroon?

How do you know he will not blend if given the chance?

safarigirl:
all this long epistle and still nothing meaningful..

Time that you would have used to juxtapose what Martins offers in comparison to what the other four or so guys jostling for his position have to offer, you use am write epistle wey most people no go finish.

Martins was mercurial when? Is it not the same jam body football Martins plays? Is it not the same gra gra that Victor does on the pitch that Martins does? They will probably break his leg before they can break Mikel's, that is if he doesn't collect one card before then.

You people have started with clamours for all these "seeking final glory" footballers that just want to score one World Cup goal and retire. Four years ago, it was Osaze in an admittedly depleted team, now, it is Martins in a fortified team?

Tell us what Martins can offer that the likes of Onyekuru, Dessers, Onuachu cannot offer...bearing in mind they are playing in better leagues.

BTW, "he played at the top flight" does not count.

Omoge, take am easy!!! Your blood too dey hot. I never said he is taking someone's slot did i? If you are talking based on your feeling for other strikers chances especially the untested ones, then well, you are right. Its your feeling and I will not castigate you for that. But please try respect other people's point of view and perspective and not rubbish it. If you disagree with my points, you can politely advance your reasons.

I have elaborated on the things Martins brings to the table. Too bad you dont wanna hear the mention of Martins but frankly, I wasnt even comparing him at the expense of Dessers, or Onyekuru or onuachu. Its all about objective analysis. If he is good and can help in a way or the other, so be it. Forget about this he is too old or he wants to retire. Here is Mikel Obi that said he will not retire he still wants to be playing till he is 40. I dont see anybody telling him to shut up. If he has it then, why not? Who is to determine if he can play or not?

forgiveness:


This is a very different case because those players you listed above were not performing as at the time they went to the world Cup.

Rufai and Yekini in 1998. Yobo and Ameobi in 2010.


Besides, how many games did Ighalo played before he was called for the match against Cameroon?

How do you know he will not blend if given the chance?

he will not blend. I know because I know.

Like I said, most of you only concern yourselves with whatever happens on pitch, I connect based on their off pitch personalities. Everybody has someone or people they link with and Martins will not fit into any group.

Na to follow Mikel and Rohr dey waka e go dey do?

One recurring sentiment I think has been a serious setback for african teams over the years, has been this clamour for "new players" at every turn. Keshi was the coach for 3-4 years and up until he left, we still had a feeling that we were "building a team". I can assure you all that going by what I am reading on this thread and past trendss, these same players we are tagging as "fresh" and claiming to raise for 2022 will quickly be discarded and classified as "tired legs" by 2021. It's a cycle that never ends and I have been seeing this in play since our past golden generation of players. We have always been rebuilding and discarding players not based on what they do or do not offer but on perceived need to "inject new blood"...

Onigbinde did it, same with Christian Chukwu, Eguavoen, Siasia, Keshi and Oliseh.

I simply don't understand why the first hurdle for player invitation is age as opposed to performance. It's the National team and not an age-restricted competition! No team gets remembered for how young they are but rather what results they can produce at the time.Aime Jacquet didn't drop Ginola and Co because of their ages. He simply chose players that fit into his game plan.

Whether Martins receives an invitation or not is not my issue (I don't think he has anything better to offer than what we have). However, rejecting the idea of extending an invitation to him based on age alone is what I find puzzling.

Could the reason for this hot talk about martins be because he is seemingly a threat to our preferred candidates? Guys please enlighten me o!
Cos frankly i dont gerrit! Well sha i no be Gernot Rohr. World cup is 8months away. We will be here. I just hope our eye no go clear too late

kennysville:


Omoge, take am easy!!! Your blood too dey hot. I never said he is taking someone's slot did i? If you are talking based on your feeling for other strikers chances especially the untested ones, then well, you are right. Its your feeling and I will not castigate you for that. But please try respect other people's point of view and perspective and not rubbish it. If you disagree with my points, you can politely advance your reasons.

I have elaborated on the things Martins brings to the table. Too bad you dont wanna hear the mention of Martins but frankly, I wasnt even comparing him at the expense of Dessers, or Onyekuru or onuachu. Its all about objective analysis. If he is good and can help in a way or the other, so be it. Forget about this he is too old or he wants to retire. Here is Mikel Obi that said he will not retire he still wants to be playing till he is 40. I dont see anybody telling him to shut up. If he has it then, why not? Who is to determine if he can play or not?

please how good is this Martins that you guys are clamouring for?
or does Martins now have agents here on nairaland...

same Martins that ighalo is currently ahead of in far away China in top scorers charts
and some persons are clamouring for his recall....
what is he going to offer the SE?
playing in China and you wanna refuse young lads the exposure they deserve....
you know what....let the SE highest goal scorers and league quality be used to pick players....

to be honest those clamouring for the call of these old legs think no good for the SE....
I have begin to see some as some of these players relatives and agents....

kennysville:


Omoge, take am easy!!! Your blood too dey hot. I never said he is taking someone's slot did i? If you are talking based on your feeling for other strikers chances especially the untested ones, then well, you are right. Its your feeling and I will not castigate you for that. But please try respect other people's point of view and perspective and not rubbish it. If you disagree with my points, you can politely advance your reasons.

I have elaborated on the things Martins brings to the table. Too bad you dont wanna hear the mention of Martins but frankly, I wasnt even comparing him at the expense of Dessers, or Onyekuru or onuachu. Its all about objective analysis. If he is good and can help in a way or the other, so be it. Forget about this he is too old or he wants to retire. Here is Mikel Obi that said he will not retire he still wants to be playing till he is 40. I dont see anybody telling him to shut up. If he has it then, why not? Who is to determine if he can play or not?

objective analysis would involve you placing each player side by side, mentioning their advantages and disadvantages without furthering the cause of any player.

There is nothing objective when you are just talking about one player and making mostly speculative comments.

Mikel is still in the fold and is relevant to us for now, and he is nowhere near 40, so why don't we wait till then to judge his comment? Or do you genuinely think Mikel will be playing with us till he is 40?


Compare Martins with the other players whose shirts he is going for and leave Mikel out of it, last I checked, I is not Mikel's shirt Martins is being considered for.

BTW, the third CF position is going to anyone who is comfortable chilling on the bench and Martins is not your guy

tglobal:
One recurring sentiment I think has been a serious setback for african teams over the years, has been this clamour for "new players" at every turn. Keshi was the coach for 3-4 years and up until he left, we still had a feeling that we were "building a team". I can assure you all that going by what I am reading on this thread and past trendss, these same players we are tagging as "fresh" and claiming to raise for 2022 will quickly be discarded and classified as "tired legs" by 2021. It's a cycle that never ends and I have been seeing this in play since our past golden generation of players. We have always been rebuilding and discarding players not based on what they do or do not offer but on perceived need to "inject new blood"...

Onigbinde did it, same with Christian Chukwu, Eguavoen, Siasia, Keshi and Oliseh.

I simply don't understand why the first hurdle for player invitation is age as opposed to performance. It's the National team and not an age-restricted competition! No team gets remembered for how young they are but rather what results they can produce at the time.Aime Jacquet didn't drop Ginola and Co because of their ages. He simply chose players that fit into his game plan.

Whether Martins receives an invitation or not is not my issue (I don't think he has anything better to offer than what we have). However, rejecting the idea of extending an invitation to him based on age alone is what I find puzzling.

God bless you front, back left, right and center. May you live long long long beyond the days of your fore fathers

kennysville:
Could the reason for this hot talk about martins be because he is seemingly a threat to our preferred candidates? Guys please enlighten me o!
Cos frankly i dont gerrit! Well sha i no be Gernot Rohr. World cup is 8months away. We will be here. I just hope our eye no go clear too late

Martins is not better than any of the current players.....okay...he is not a threat not at all because he is not better than those in Belgium or Denmark or even England...

even ighalo is doing better this season

safarigirl:
objective analysis would involve you placing each player side by side, mentioning their advantages and disadvantages without furthering the cause of any player.

There is nothing objective when you are just talking about one player and making mostly speculative comments.

Mikel is still in the fold and is relevant to us for now, and he is nowhere near 40, so why don't we wait till then to judge his comment? Or do you genuinely think Mikel will be playing with us till he is 40?


Compare Martins with the other players whose shirts he is going for and leave Mikel out of it, last I checked, I is not Mikel's shirt Martins is being considered for.

BTW, the third CF position is going to anyone who is comfortable chilling on the bench and Martins is not your guy

Well he was played from the bench against tanzania so ur point is?

safarigirl:
objective analysis would involve you placing each player side by side, mentioning their advantages and disadvantages without furthering the cause of any player.

There is nothing objective when you are just talking about one player and making mostly speculative comments.

Mikel is still in the fold and is relevant to us for now, and he is nowhere near 40, so why don't we wait till then to judge his comment? Or do you genuinely think Mikel will be playing with us till he is 40?


Compare Martins with the other players whose shirts he is going for and leave Mikel out of it, last I checked, I is not Mikel's shirt Martins is being considered for.

BTW, the third CF position is going to anyone who is comfortable chilling on the bench and Martins is not your guy

Dear...your last paragraph comes with so much wisdom....
bless you.......

kennysville:


Well he was played from the bench against tanzania so ur point is?

then oliseh was in charge....
now players are picked base on merits not because he was groomed in the coach brother's academy...you get?


that spot is going to......Paul even kayode is there
we need someone of his kind for the world cup....
a player we can offer something different...

Humility017:

Martins is not better than any of the current players.....okay...he is not a threat not at all because he is not better than those in Belgium or Denmark or even England...

even ighalo is doing better this season

Yall keep forgetting one thing. Towards world cup, so many names start to spring up. Names you never heard before. Because theynstarted banging in goals left right and center.

If memory serves me right on this thread, there was a time when yall said Ighalo was finished. The same ighalo was invited against cameroon and he delivered because we placed a level of faith in him. If Kelechi was doing the business, many of you here will not make peem! about ighalo. Na end be that. Suddenly now, Ighalo is scoring again and he is the darling abi? No be una fault na. If to say una neva qualify yet, you will see that if they offered you Okocha, una go accept

forgiveness:


Na wa ooooooo. So, if these two players doesn't perform (God forbids) this season, they have automatic shirt, ba!?

guy relax......you should tell what performance your Martins has made thus far...that makes him ahead of the two above...including kayode and Paul...

you guys clamour for players sometimes that are of no use to the SE

Humility017:

then oliseh was in charge....
now players are picked base on merits not because he was groomed in the coach brother's academy...you get?


that spot is going to......Paul even kayode is there
we need someone of his kind for the world cup....
a player we can offer something different...

No wahala.... we dey here on this thread. Just pray all your boys that are still there deliver. Better yet Rohr gets his tactics right.

If I were the coach, no player who didn't participate in the qualifier would make the squad to the world cup.
I believe in justice not equity and fairness.

Besides, between now and the time of the world cup some players would just put extra effort in the respective club just to make the squad not because they have much to offer nor are committed to the team.

Again, football is more a team sport than individual play. A top goal scorer in a club may struggle for country.

What if Martins got invited and on merit was found better than Kayode or Onuachu or Dessers? Have you thought of that as a possibility?

Humility017:

please how good is this Martins that you guys are clamouring for?
or does Martins now have agents here on nairaland...

same Martins that ighalo is currently ahead of in far away China in top scorers charts
and some persons are clamouring for his recall....
what is he going to offer the SE?
playing in China and you wanna refuse young lads the exposure they deserve....
you know what....let the SE highest goal scorers and league quality be used to pick players....

to be honest those clamouring for the call of these old legs think no good for the SE....
I have begin to see some as some of these players relatives and agents....

my dear thank you for this.

Some people are just here repeating "Martins is a threat to yoir favourite" upandan as if it will make the clamour seem legit...

Martins is not a threat to any of the core fourteen, he is a surplus to requirement.

This guy has not been in the fold since 2015 abi when? He has never played under Rohr, he is not used to Rohr's philosophy and he certainly will not get it before the World Cup simply because it is harder to teach an old dog new tricks than to teach a puppy.

I don't even know who brought up this nonsense Martins argument. I will rather we snatch Tammy Abraham from England and take him to the World Cup than Martins, that is how much I don't want to see Martins in this team.

Tammy will blend, Tammy will find a group to join and he will click with them off the pitch which will resonate on the pitch.

I am concerned with Team Chemistry and some people here just want some bull dozer that will play gragra football without any concern for the rest of the team

His age is not the problem, it is his ability to blend that I have issues with.

Humility017:

please how good is this Martins that you guys are clamouring for?
or does Martins now have agents here on nairaland...

same Martins that ighalo is currently ahead of in far away China in top scorers charts
and some persons are clamouring for his recall....
what is he going to offer the SE?
playing in China and you wanna refuse young lads the exposure they deserve....
you know what....let the SE highest goal scorers and league quality be used to pick players....

to be honest those clamouring for the call of these old legs think no good for the SE....
I have begin to see some as some of these players relatives and agents....

Objectivity.... not sentiments. If he gets to camp and is found to be better, so be it. Forget player relative thingy or agent. I am far from all that. I am just like you, a mere mortal Super Eagles fan. No more no less

We should brace up....

If its cos of age Obagoal musnt go to Russia, thats unfair. Any other reason is welcome. Osaze was practically our best attacker in Brazil and he was locked out 2years prior to the World cup. He was 'old' yet he performed better than even Vicmo. What are we saying?

As much as i want a young squad, we musnt clamor for it too much, else we're suffering from wenger syndrome.

daveP:
We should brace up....

If its cos of age Obagoal musnt go to Russia, thats unfair. Any other reason is welcome. Osaze was practically our best attacker in Brazil and he was locked out 2years prior to the World cup. He was 'old' yet he performed better than even Vicmo. What are we saying?

As much as i want a young squad, we musnt clamor for it too much, else we're suffering from wenger syndrome.

World cup is almost here bro. The same people singing youth youth , balance balance , chance chance will still come and sing something else. Have we really answered the question what happened against South Africa? Or we are just deluding ourselves. Will we say we ddnt have quality on the pitch? How did we fall like a pack of cards?.... Exactly!

kennysville:


Well he was played from the bench against tanzania so ur point is?

you will not understand my point because you can't even get the argument

You just think I'm worried Martins will 'take my favourite's position'....your angle is myopic, mine is deeper than your football statistics and club performance

Mujtahida:

I watched clips of Onuachu and Denis Bonaventure. Onuachu looks like he has that thing(you know na, that thing)

The 1st time I saw him play was 2015 when he played against ManUtd in the Europa League. He had a goal in the 1st leg.


He's scored 50 goals thus far.


I wonder why he couldn't secure a move out of Denmark, that dude is more than the league he's playing.(Him agent no sabi work abeg) Even his former teammate - Sisto now plays in the LaLiga for Celta da Vigo.


For Denis, I also watched him play that same season then in Ukraine, he just came into the game against Manutd and was lively all through. From then, I knew we have a star in our hands.

safarigirl:
my dear thank you for this.

Some people are just here repeating "Martins is a threat to yoir favourite" upandan as if it will make the clamour seem legit...

Martins is not a threat to any of the core fourteen, he is a surplus to requirement.

This guy has not been in the fold since 2015 abi when? He has never played under Rohr, he is not used to Rohr's philosophy and he certainly will not get it before the World Cup simply because it is harder to teach an old dog new tricks than to teach a puppy.

I don't even know who brought up this nonsense Martins argument. I will rather we snatch Tammy Abraham from England and take him to the World Cup than Martins, that is how much I don't want to see Martins in this team.

Tammy will blend, Tammy will find a group to join and he will click with them off the pitch which will resonate on the pitch.

I am concerned with Team Chemistry and some people here just want some bull dozer that will play gragra football without any concern for the rest of the team

His age is not the problem, it is his ability to blend that I have issues with.

See where you are contradicting urself? It still boils down to feelings, my dear lady. You are just being sentimental. Thats all. Which of the other guys from onuachu to dessers have played under Rohr?

Objectivity..... skip sentiments. We are talking about professionals here. Not age grade soccer

Mujtahida:

You don't get it. Ronaldo had not played football for two years. Romario was in form (plus remember he was already a World Cup winner) yet the coach dropped him. If it were you plus your obsession with stats you'd have pulled out Romario's stats for the last season and pit it against Ronaldo's own which was zero and you would have gone with Romario. My emphasis is as a coach you will just have to leave out some players. And I'm hoping Rohr leaves out Martins and Osaze and who else Okocha abi

Ronaldo had won the world best player of year twice prior to that world cup. He was a tested, tried, trusted and experienced player.

With the little matches he played before chosen, he showed class.

That's what I am talking about. Performance, experience and talent. You can not buy those in the market.

Then, Ronaldo was better than Romario.

Who is better than Martins in our team currently?

daveP:
We should brace up....

If its cos of age Obagoal musnt go to Russia, thats unfair. Any other reason is welcome. Osaze was practically our best attacker in Brazil and he was locked out 2years prior to the World cup. He was 'old' yet he performed better than even Vicmo. What are we saying?

As much as i want a young squad, we musnt clamor for it too much, else we're suffering from wenger syndrome.

it is not age that is the issue

Team Spirit is the issue here and everybody is waving that aside as if the Osaze we carried in 2014 was able to lead us to a Quarter Finals in the World Cup

The team that led Ghana to their Q/finals position in 2010, did it not have a sizeable number of youth? Did Ghana have to bring in a player that had been exiled for two years to get there? Was it a team of exceptional talents or top scorers in various leagues?

Some are asking what happens against SA...lack of a leader was what happened. We did not lose because it was a youthful team, we lost because there was no leader on and off the pitch.

safarigirl:
you will not understand my point because you can't even get the argument

You just think I'm worried Martins will 'take my favourite's position'....your angle is myopic, mine is deeper than your football statistics and club performance

Team chemistry is your angle. I think he'l blend. He may have much respect and isolation cos half of the current squad watched him play from their homes(not yet professional). Will he cause kasala? Compare who would between him and Enyeama? Im seeing both angles here.

kennysville:



See where you are contradicting urself? It still boils down to feelings, my dear lady. You are just being sentimental. Thats all. Which of the other guys from onuachu to dessers have played under Rohr?

Objectivity..... skip sentiments. We are talking about professionals here. Not age grade soccer

"it is much more difficult to teach an old dog new tricks than to teach a new one"

I like how you conveniently skipped every other thing I mentioned, even down to team chemistry and picked that particular one because that is what you thought you could pick on....maybe if you had read it better, you would have noticed that quote.



Nothing you have said so far is objective. What makes Martins better than Dessers, Onuachu or even Tammy? When you bring me this, you can now talk about objectivity.

kennysville:


World cup is almost here bro. The same people singing youth youth , balance balance , chance chance will still come and sing something else. Have we really answered the question what happened against South Africa? Or we are just deluding ourselves. Will we say we ddnt have quality on the pitch? How did we fall like a pack of cards?.... Exactly!

Thats why im on team 'a lot can happen in 8months'!!

Humility017:

guy relax......you should tell what performance your Martins has made thus far...that makes him ahead of the two above...including kayode and Paul...

you guys clamour for players sometimes that are of no use to the SE

they have not said what makes Martins better than the other guys in his position, but they just want us to accept Martins "based on who he be..."

This argument could end quickly, but no, let us drag it till enternity and nobody will have an objective post to support their argument

safarigirl:
he will not blend. I know because I know.

Like I said, most of you only concern yourselves with whatever happens on pitch, I connect based on their off pitch personalities. Everybody has someone or people they link with and Martins will not fit into any group.

Na to follow Mikel and Rohr dey waka e go dey do?

What do you know about Martins off pitch personality?

He will blend wella because wherever he went he did. Why not now?

Now, be aware that Martins and Mikel Obi blended wella when they played together. Mikel knows how to give Martins pass to score. Watch the 2010 WC qualifiers then you will know better.