dejidotun2000:
One foolish question house: do agm/smf batteries benefit from desulfation?

dejidotun2000:
One foolish question house: do agm/smf batteries benefit from desulfation?

kiekie1:


Its not really a "foolish question" as we learn daily . I will strictly advice you equalize agm batteries under close observation and safe voltage range as they are not flooded lead acid ... A slight mistake might lead to battery loss or explosion ! Cheers

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NiyiOmoIyunade:
All lead acid batteries benefit from desulfation because inherent to their design, they will always suffer from positive grid/plate corrosion and sulfation during the discharge and recharge process - in fact the very act of recharging a depleted lead acid battey implies desulfation.

The question then is how to do it right for an AGM/SMF battery since you cannot afford an overcharge (controlled or otherwise) leading to gassing and the battery drying up inside - for flooded/wet-cell batteries you would have simply replaced any lost fluids with distilled water after your equalization/controlled overcharge.

First things first you want to make sure your batteries get a full charge daily/regularly and are never left depleted for more than a week to get maximum mileage from them.

To desulfate/recover an AGM/SMF battery, first eliminate the misconception that you can do it with the battery bank hooked up in series e.g 24v,36v,48v and so on - each individual 12v battery (rarely you could have 6v AGM/SMF batteries in this part of the world) must be isolated and recharged to full charge individually > then load tested to ascertain capacity and > then recharged again to full charge > then you select batteries with similar capacity and hook them back up in series and connect to your inverter again and enjoy renewed performance

You could take a shortcut and buy a 12v inverter - e.g IcellPower (JUO) or Mustpower (Zeestone/KieKie) or any solid brand of your choice and hookup your batteries in parallel and charge fully - this method ensures you still get inverter backup/uniterrupted service while you are performing the full charge/desulfation process - you will need access to uninterrupted power during the period till you complete the charge cycle - yet, the best method is to isolate each individual battery and give it the treatment - full charge - load test - full recharge - group similar capacity batteries and put them back in service.

There is one last method where you can keep your series configuration and clap on a 12v charger to each individual battery and charge fully turn by turn given you have uninterrupted access to power to complete the charging process - needless to say you need to know what you are doing in this scenario and I will not dwell on it further.

To safely equalize/desulfate AGM/SMFs, you will need a smart charger capable of cutting off at 14.8volts (maximum safe upper limit) or lower as per manufacturer specs for the battery - anything over 14.8v per 12v battery you will likely gas the battery with no easy way to replace lost fluids in the AGM/SMF battery. I use a cheapo chinese charger called 'Suoer' for this purpose - it sells under 20k and cuts off reliably at 14.8volts.

You can also buy a battery desulfator e.g PowerPulse or BLS (Battery Life Saver) to assist in keeping your batteries healthy. I warrant to you though that in 8 years of using these desulfator devices I AM STILL UNDECIDED if they actually work!!! Sometimes they seem to perform a miracle and sometimes they appear useless - I know though that I will not buy any new ones apart from the ones I already have.

All in all, a very long reply to a very short question - I hope it is of help

JohnKester:


I am having similar experience with 7.5KVA Prag. It was running normally and the both the DC and AC fans were running intermittently as needed according to the specified temperature. However, for a while now the fans have been running simultaneously at the highest speeds. At such times, the consumption would increase dramatically up to 3 or 4KW when actual load is less than 1KW, without there being any additional loads. The load can only be eliminated when the inverter is switched off and back on. Once the fans start running, the charging from the PV also drops, I guess because of the gigantic self-consumption of the inverter!

I have a 48V Desulfator (Battery Life Saver) connected to the battery bank. However, my inverter does not charge my battery bank at all, as the charging function is actually turned off since I am completely off grid and does not even charge with generator, but only PV arrays.

Could the Desulfator be the problem, because come to think of it, I noticed this mode of operation only after installing the desulfator.

Anyone with ideas what can be wrong and the possible solution would be appreciated.

Cheers

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NiyiOmoIyunade:
Two separate issues bros.


For the fan always on or off setting, I suspect Saipro has made good use of the Install CD bundled with his Mustpower and has found a way to make the inverter talk to his PC and thereby effect custom settings - I am waiting for him to give the house the low down if this be the case.

earthrealm:
A PALS 24V 4KVA PRAG INVERTER NO LONGER CHARGES, who can recommend a good place to repair it?

kiekie1:


Is the location within Lagos state?... Simply dial: 081-350-319-51

ATH:

This could be due to dust accumulation in the Inverter. You may open it up and blow/vacuum clean the dust away. Kindly do this before considering other suggested remedies by the professionals here.

Removing dust from inverter is a recommended periodic maintenance task to be regularly carried-out on Inverters.

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NiyiOmoIyunade:
Two separate issues bros.
.....

For the fan always on or off setting, I suspect Saipro has made good use of the Install CD bundled with his Mustpower and has found a way to make the inverter talk to his PC and thereby effect custom settings - I am waiting for him to give the house the low down if this be the case.

Ativ:
If one uses the LVD to simply disconnect loads, the inverter continues running but self-consumption of the inverter may continuously discharge the battery below safe levels.
If one uses a device such as this, https://www.victronenergy.com/battery_protect/battery-protect , the battery connection to the inverter is opened and the inverter stops work. However, I don't know how safe it is to disconnect the battery while the inverter is working.

Like Pranil stated, it is probably easier to replace with an inverter with an inbuilt adjustable LVD.

JohnKester:


I am having similar experience with 7.5KVA Prag. It was running normally and the both the DC and AC fans were running intermittently as needed according to the specified temperature. However, for a while now the fans have been running simultaneously at the highest speeds. At such times, the consumption would increase dramatically up to 3 or 4KW when actual load is less than 1KW, without there being any additional loads. The load can only be eliminated when the inverter is switched off and back on. Once the fans start running, the charging from the PV also drops, I guess because of the gigantic self-consumption of the inverter!
Cheers

Saipro:


Try everything thus far advised on the forum. All are safe and easy to do. The three times I've had such issues were each time
(1) a 48V MustPower inverter. Your Prag has inner workings very similar and I suspect (know) is 48V
(2) a cross-talk between earth and live or earth and neutral lines in the home wiring

Three out of three times.

Saipro:


Try everything thus far advised on the forum. All are safe and easy to do. The three times I've had such issues were each time
(1) a 48V MustPower inverter. Your Prag has inner workings very similar and I suspect (know) is 48V
(2) a cross-talk between earth and live or earth and neutral lines in the home wiring

Three out of three times.

kiekie1:


I guess his system is above 3000w ratings. He can simply contact me for a prag engineer mobile number for guidelines on how to trouble shoot as DIY has its limitations ...

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foonshur:
@all... found this after searching further. https://www.victronenergy.com/blog/2016/08/15/batteryprotect-new-instructional-videos/
but this has opened the door to a whole new question now... is it safe to install something like this between the battery and the inverter, where the supply will be cut off to the inverter while it is working??

foonshur:
@all... found this after searching further. https://www.victronenergy.com/blog/2016/08/15/batteryprotect-new-instructional-videos/
but this has opened the door to a whole new question now... is it safe to install something like this between the battery and the inverter, where the supply will be cut off to the inverter while it is working??

foonshur:
@all... found this after searching further. https://www.victronenergy.com/blog/2016/08/15/batteryprotect-new-instructional-videos/
but this has opened the door to a whole new question now... is it safe to install something like this between the battery and the inverter, where the supply will be cut off to the inverter while it is working??

makavele:


It is rather not healthy cutting off power abruptly. But heck, it's not a new phenomenon . . .
How many times have you experienced watching TV and NEPA just goes like that?
Everything turns off abruptly ... TV, fridge, lights, everything ..
it's not a new thing to behold; if you grew up in Nigeria

NiyiOmoIyunade:
All lead acid batteries benefit from desulfation because inherent to their design, they will always suffer from positive grid/plate corrosion and sulfation during the discharge and recharge process - in fact the very act of recharging a depleted lead acid battey implies desulfation.

......

You can also buy a battery desulfator e.g PowerPulse or BLS (Battery Life Saver) to assist in keeping your batteries healthy. I warrant to you though that in 8 years of using these desulfator devices I AM STILL UNDECIDED if they actually work!!! Sometimes they seem to perform a miracle and sometimes they appear useless - I know though that I will not buy any new ones apart from the ones I already have.

All in all, a very long reply to a very short question - I hope it is of help

Saipro:


Battery desulphators are like snake oil; at times, they're the best thing since manna from heaven. At other times, they seem pointless. They've worked wonders for most of my dying batteries but for some others, no benefit. I guess that could be attributed to a lot more giong wrong with batteries than mere sulphation issues (mossing, bulged/dead plates, bridges and short circuits, outright expiry, etc.)

Saipro:


My backup home inverter with specs 24V 1.5kVA (980W) with good overload and surge handling capabilities and reasonably low idle consumption has a 40A DC breaker fitted into the the input circuitry. The breaker doesn't trip with surge loads like compressors and motors but will do so with irons and heating elements. Instant cut-off. Occurs before the inbuilt overload circuitry trip-off has a chance to activate. Happens once or twice a week when someone forgets we're on "night mode". Reset the breaker and life continues.

I don't know of any brand which currently suffers due to DC input interruption. Inverters are buit rugged like that.

Saipro:


My backup home inverter with specs 24V 1.5kVA (980W) with good overload and surge handling capabilities and reasonably low idle consumption has a 40A DC breaker fitted into the the input circuitry. The breaker doesn't trip with surge loads like compressors and motors but will do so with irons and heating elements. Instant cut-off. Occurs before the inbuilt overload circuitry trip-off has a chance to activate. Happens once or twice a week when someone forgets we're on "night mode". Reset the breaker and life continues.

I don't know of any brand which currently suffers due to DC input interruption. Inverters are buit rugged like that.