aariwa:
If somebody invests for example 2m how much do you think the person will be getting monthly

2m @ 15 % for 364 days will yield 300k yearly and ie 25k monthly

Partnerbiz:


This is false.
Not possible to gain upto 460k based on the info above.

Sorry to butt in, this is not impossible.

The bank is selling his investment at the secondary market at a lower yield - 15.6% (because Tbill rates had fallen) compared to when he bought it - 17.388%, which means the holder to maturity will earn less than the initial yield on the bill.

So besides the interest accrued on his investment for the 63 days(?) he held it, he has also made some profit on sale arising from yields dropping by 1.788%.

This, I believe, is what his bank has used in calculating his payout.

opeyemmmy:


Sorry to butt in, this is not impossible.

The bank is selling his investment at the secondary market at a lower yield - 15.6% (because Tbill rates had fallen) compared to when he bought it - 17.388%, which means the holder to maturity will earn less than the initial yield on the bill.

So besides the interest accrued on his investment for the 63 days(?) he held it, he has also made some profit on sale arising from yields dropping by 1.788%.

This, I believe, is what his bank has used in calculating his payout.

.So can you tell me how 460k plus was made even from all you stated?

Partnerbiz:


This is false.
Not possible to gain upto 460k based on the info above.

My friend,
He has told you what he got at the end of the day as his profit and you're saying it's false because you have not taken the trouble to do a deligent calculation.

I will therefore prove to you now that it's not false:

He invested N10,000,000. @17.388% for 364days and got N1,738,800 as his upfront interest before other deductions. He was debited N8,265,963.8, meaning that he got a profit of N1,734,036.2 after deductions.

For terminating it after just 63days and with NO PENAL CHARGES BY STANBIC BANK, it means N1,738,800 ÷ 364days × (364-63)days =N1,437,853.9 was deducted from what he had collected as upfront interest, leaving him with N300,946.1.

Now, selling it @15.6% instead of the 17.388%he bought it because rates have come down now means he is selling it at a profit of 1.788%.

1.788% of N10,000,000 is N178,800.

Therefore his total gain is N300,946.1(for 63days)
+N178,800 (for selling at a profit)
=N479,746.

So my friend, for @whitechocolate to have told us that he made a profit of N460,063.56, he has told us NOTHING BUT THE ABSOLUTE TRUTH and the difference in my calculation and what he said he got MUST be the transaction costs and other sundry charges which is about N19,682.44.


In view of the trouble you have made me to go through to clinically prove that @whitechocolate NEVER LIED, and the fact that you cast aspersions on his person, I humbly demand that you apologise to him and just say thank you to me.

opeyemmmy:


Sorry to butt in, this is not impossible.

The bank is selling his investment at the secondary market at a lower yield - 15.6% (because Tbill rates had fallen) compared to when he bought it - 17.388%, which means the holder to maturity will earn less than the initial yield on the bill.

So besides the interest accrued on his investment for the 63 days(?) he held it, he has also made some profit on sale arising from yields dropping by 1.788%.

This, I believe, is what his bank has used in calculating his payout.

YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!!!

Happy Sunday everyone.

One of the main purposes of our interaction here would be to identify available opportunities for getting maximum returns on our investments.
Now for a while after we had the talk on true yield, there has been a number of people who now choose to reinvest their upfront interest.
But this WhiteChocolate's investment has brought something to my attention, and that is the fact that one can "SHORT SELL" this t-bills market to make some more bucks.

He got 460,000 on 8.265m in 63days. Guess what yield that represents a whopping 32.25% p.a. If in doubt, please do the math, and let's see what comes up.

Now, "short selling" in this market is only a once in a while thing, and it will only make sense to investors who do short term bills.

So whenever rates start taking a dip, and you're sure that over the next quarter, there could be up to a 2% cut in rates, then rather than buying a 91-day paper at 14%, you could buy a 364-day paper, and resell after 91 days at lower discount and thus push your returns to about 30% or more.

If any 91-day investor had tried this in q4'15, when rates dipped by about 7% The returns would have been about 40% p.a and peak discount for 91-day bills at that time was about 10.5%

perhaps this is one significant way banks make a portion of their t-bills profit.

So I hope we see the opportunity present in this strategy, and adopt it may be.

P.S By "short selling" I mean taking a bet that yield on t-bills will decline considerably in the near future.

Interesting comments... Between GTB and FBN, which one is more preferable for Treasury Bills? In terms of return on investment and the rates. Thanks.

FBN

Hi everyone, I observed that everybody on this forum purchases Tb from banks and no one has recommended the purchase of Tb from financial /discount houses like Afrinvest for instance. Is there any reason for this. Thanks

shogbenga:
Hi everyone, I observed that everybody on this forum purchases Tb from banks and no one has recommended the purchase of Tb from financial /discount houses like Afrinvest for instance. Is there any reason for this. Thanks

Instant bank alert without any procedure is key

Kennycyphers:
Interesting comments... Between GTB and FBN, which one is more preferable for Treasury Bills? In terms of return on investment and the rates. Thanks.

Why are you trying to compare "Sleep with death"?

The difference is clear -it's 7up!

FBN is FAR FAR BETTER!!!

awesomeJ:
Happy Sunday everyone.

One of the main purposes of our interaction here would be to identify available opportunities for getting maximum returns on our investments.
Now for a while after we had the talk on true yield, there has been a number of people who now choose to reinvest their upfront interest.
But this WhiteChocolate's investment has brought something to my attention, and that is the fact that one can "SHORT SELL" this t-bills market to make some more bucks.

He got 460,000 on 8.265m in 63days. Guess what yield that represents a whopping 32.25% p.a. If in doubt, please do the math, and let's see what comes up.

Now, "short selling" in this market is only a once in a while thing, and it will only make sense to investors who do short term bills.

So whenever rates start taking a dip, and you're sure that over the next quarter, there could be up to a 2% cut in rates, then rather than buying a 91-day paper at 14%, you could buy a 364-day paper, and resell after 91 days at lower discount and thus push your returns to about 30% or more.

If any 91-day investor had tried this in q4'15, when rates dipped by about 7% The returns would have been about 40% p.a and peak discount for 91-day bills at that time was about 10.5%

perhaps this is one significant way banks make a portion of their t-bills profit.

So I hope we see the opportunity present in this strategy, and adopt it may be.

P.S By "short selling" I mean taking a bet that yield on t-bills will decline considerably in the near future.

I agree with you but you should have done the Mathematics yourself to prove to the doubting Thomases.

TONY56
Hmmm lol You just adverted my mind to a lot of things now.
Thanks.

Partnerbiz:
TONY56

Hmmm lol
You just adverted my mind to a lot of things now.

Thanks.

You are welcome but remember to apologise to WhiteChocolate for being a doubting Thomas

TONY56:


You are welcome but remember to apologise to WhiteChocolate for being a doubting Thomas

TONY56:


You are welcome but remember to apologise to WhiteChocolate for being a doubting Thomas

jaychubi:


2m @ 15 % for 364 days will yield 300k yearly and ie 25k monthly

Thanks. Please can you guide me on how its done

Well done guys, thank you for all your information here. I have followed them and it has been enlightining as I don't know anything about TBills before.

Like many people, I want an investment for my small cash of about #200,000. I am thinking Treasury bills too.
Which bank do I approach, how do I go about it and what will be my own return if I invest about 200k.

2. Or is Fixed deposit going to yield better or any other OMO investments that is short term that is risk free and pays better?
Please I need clarity as I want to do it this week, once I understand what it entails better.
3. Also which one is the Primary and secondary market of Treasury bills. What is the difference between both?
Thank you Michael.

guys I finally got my alert of 21,153.22k . invested 670k for 91days. primary market with FBN. Hope I wasn't short paid?

freeman67:


Since you made your request on time and your account was deducted today.... Your interest should be dropped tomorrow.. Again try and check your account..they should drop it before the close of business day.

Gradually you will get to understand it more as continue to invest. Pls do find time to read this thread thoroughly to chech many useful details that have been discussed here already..

guys I finally got my alert of 21,153.22k . invested 670k for 91days. primary market with FBN. Hope I wasn't short paid?

Pharmtj:

guys I finally got my alert of 21,153.22k . invested 670k for 91days. primary market with FBN. Hope I wasn't short paid?

At what rate?

afroxyz:


At what rate?

i don't even know the rate since its primary market I opted for.

chukzyfcbb:

yes its a good rate indeed however, I got to the bank later in the day to find out that the deal didn't pull through. Complaints about poor network and stuff, so till Monday. Hopefully the rate can stay at 16% till then.

Follow up



it seems first bank don tire for me and my Tbills renewal. Another day, another disappointment. wanted something close to 180 days but was offered 284days at 15%, haba! such a poor rate to complement the tenor, I declined mbok!.

It seems they are giving me greenlight not to continue Tbills, even got one officer suggesting I part some of the cash and do F.deposit. I am getting pissed with my to and fro journey to the bank.

15% at 284days, haba that's abysmally poor![/quote]

Partnerbiz:

I now believe.

Where is my apology naaa??

opeyemmmy:


Sorry to butt in, this is not impossible.

The bank is selling his investment at the secondary market at a lower yield - 15.6% (because Tbill rates had fallen) compared to when he bought it - 17.388%, which means the holder to maturity will earn less than the initial yield on the bill.

So besides the interest accrued on his investment for the 63 days(?) he held it, he has also made some profit on sale arising from yields dropping by 1.788%.

This, I believe, is what his bank has used in calculating his payout.

I sold and made gain... Simple. Thank you ojare.

TONY56:


My friend,
He has told you what he got at the end of the day as his profit and you're saying it's false because you have not taken the trouble to do a deligent calculation.

I will therefore prove to you now that it's not false:

He invested N10,000,000. @17.388% for 364days and got N1,738,800 as his upfront interest before other deductions. He was debited N8,265,963.8, meaning that he got a profit of N1,734,036.2 after deductions.

For terminating it after just 63days and with NO PENAL CHARGES BY STANBIC BANK, it means N1,738,800 ÷ 364days × (364-63)days =N1,437,853.9 was deducted from what he had collected as upfront interest, leaving him with N300,946.1.

Now, selling it @15.6% instead of the 17.388%he bought it because rates have come down now means he is selling it at a profit of 1.788%.

1.788% of N10,000,000 is N178,800.

Therefore his total gain is N300,946.1(for 63days)
+N178,800 (for selling at a profit)
=N479,746.

So my friend, for @whitechocolate to have told us that he made a profit of N460,063.56, he has told us NOTHING BUT THE ABSOLUTE TRUTH and the difference in my calculation and what he said he got MUST be the transaction costs and other sundry charges which is about N19,682.44.


In view of the trouble you have made me to go through to clinically prove that @whitechocolate NEVER LIED, and the fact that you cast aspersions on his person, I humbly demand that you apologise to him and just say thank you to me.

Why would I even lie in the first place?? Lol. You did good. Thumbs up and cheers to my gain

awesomeJ:
Happy Sunday everyone.

One of the main purposes of our interaction here would be to identify available opportunities for getting maximum returns on our investments.
Now for a while after we had the talk on true yield, there has been a number of people who now choose to reinvest their upfront interest.
But this WhiteChocolate's investment has brought something to my attention, and that is the fact that one can "SHORT SELL" this t-bills market to make some more bucks.

He got 460,000 on 8.265m in 63days. Guess what yield that represents a whopping 32.25% p.a. If in doubt, please do the math, and let's see what comes up.

Now, "short selling" in this market is only a once in a while thing, and it will only make sense to investors who do short term bills.

So whenever rates start taking a dip, and you're sure that over the next quarter, there could be up to a 2% cut in rates, then rather than buying a 91-day paper at 14%, you could buy a 364-day paper, and resell after 91 days at lower discount and thus push your returns to about 30% or more.

If any 91-day investor had tried this in q4'15, when rates dipped by about 7% The returns would have been about 40% p.a and peak discount for 91-day bills at that time was about 10.5%

perhaps this is one significant way banks make a portion of their t-bills profit.

So I hope we see the opportunity present in this strategy, and adopt it may be.

P.S By "short selling" I mean taking a bet that yield on t-bills will decline considerably in the near future.

I didn't even know it will end like this. When the bank told me they were gonna sell for 15.6 or so I panicked but when alert came I discovered they sold it for me and gave me the excess also. To say I was elated is an understatement. 'Short-selling' is BAE!!!

N32.23b Treasury Bills Mature this Week
https://www.businesspost.ng/2017/12/04/n32-23b-treasury-bills-mature-week/

Last FGN Savings Bond for 2017 Begins Today
https://www.businesspost.ng/2017/12/04/last-fgn-savings-bond-2017-begins-today/

Pharmtj:
i don't even know the rate since its primary market I opted for.

Without the rate how did they arrive at the interest and how would we know you were cheated?

chukzyfcbb:

Follow up



it seems first bank don tire for me and my Tbills renewal. Another day, another disappointment. wanted something close to 180 days but was offered 284days at 15%, haba! such a poor rate to complement the tenor, I declined mbok!.

It seems they are giving me greenlight not to continue Tbills, even got one officer suggesting I part some of the cash and do F.deposit. I am getting pissed with my to and fro journey to the bank.

15% at 284days, haba that's abysmally poor!

Try a different branch

WhiteChocolate:
Where is my apology naaa??

Ok take schwarma.. lol