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Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by leye4u: 7:48am On Apr 19, 2018 |
mmsen:One of the things my English teacher taught me while growing was "AS POOR AS A CHURCH RAT" and everyone was happy about it. Now the Church has come to maturity and poverty can no longer be used to describe the church, the prosperity seen so far is just a tip of the iceberg, a time is coming when the churches who be far richer than the governments of the world. Tithing is not a Nigerian thing ,it is a connection to a higher covenant. No devil,media or freezer can ever stop me and my generation from tithing.... We would tithe all that we have because God gave us all in the first place. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Nobody: 7:48am On Apr 19, 2018 |
Evince: 1.Missionaries did charge fees too. And they were heavily subsidsed by tithes and offerings from their parent churches in Europe.(And they were very selective in admitting students...you had to pass really comeptitive exams...) Also, most mission schools were primary or secondary schools...with a few teacher trainig colleges...missions did not get into university. 2.As you and I don't have access to church financial records...we cannot confidently say that tithes would pay salaries effectively. Keep in mind that most churches in Nigeria...especially the prosperity ones...have to pay pastors, church workers, tv station workers, church business workers, university stiaff, etc. And a university is not cheap to set up, and not cheap to maintain.(For istance, most privateunis now have to pay their light bills...which can be in the millions, and also pay for generating power too) Plus...thanks to ASUU strikes, you have to pay your lecturers, and other non acada staff salaries that are commensurate with what they pay them in govt universities...without government support. 3.And you threatened violence against me, when I did not do so to you. That is rather immature. 1 Like |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Guidette(f): 7:49am On Apr 19, 2018 |
Tithes is the least concerning thing compared to the damaged psyche of my brethren. One thing I know is certain. The black man has been cursed the moment he turned his back against the millions of his ancestors who were enslaved and killed in genocides all across Africa by white people in exchange for his culture, language and religion. These slave masters managed to kill you, take over your land, write your own history in a way that benefited them the most, battered you psychologically, stole your resources to develop their own barren lands and sell their finished goods from your own raw materials back to you at exorbitant prices. They told you you had no history, your culture was bad, your spiritual practices were evil, your language was backward, you had no civilization.... And we all stupidly believed they came to save us. How dumb can people be? The only people ho profit from Africa being the way it is now are the white men who need to continue pillaging our lands for resources they need to keep them on top as the status quo. Once we get sense, they will try to conquer us again, for real. In Nigeria, every street has either a mosque or church on it, which makes me realize that we have been hoodwinked and enslaved psychologically by books. The same books that even the white man who brought it doesn't follow. I have lived in the US and UK and they don't practice their religion they imposed on us. I can count how many times I saw churches during my stay there and it was very minute. Most of them see Sunday as a rest day, or day at the pub or day for football. Besides these books have been misinterpreted as a weapon of mass slavery. If one looks into the real meaning of these books, it will shock to the bone that it is a book of allegories. Liberate yourself. Stop taking information firsthand and research things for yourself. Always ask questions and don't be quick to believe anything you are told. If you do enough research, you will realize that most of everything you have been taught since you were a child are all lies. 1 Like |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by mmsen: 7:49am On Apr 19, 2018 |
AdaIhiala: If xtians sought truth they wouldn't be xtians. Truth can be verified by way of evidence. Xtianity has none. 1 Like |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Bostin(m): 7:50am On Apr 19, 2018 |
To my own little knowledge of Christianity I think malachi 8 v11 is wrong interpretation by our greedy pastors. What the malachi says was practically practised by Jesus gospel while on earth. When Jesus wanted to preach to his congregation he believe the congregation might be hungry and poor so he asked if anyone with food here and someone came up with 5loaf of bread and 2 fish. Let see the one who brought the food as the rich among congregation who can afford that he brought as TITHE, Jesus did not took the food and store in the store house of his gospel nor took it to resell and use to enrich his gospel but instead blessed it and share to the poor congregation. So therefore to my little knowledge that is malachi 8v11 real interpretation,to bring to my house so that will be surplus to share to the needy. Bible also said we shall take from the rich for the poor . My opinion. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by KENNSAMMY(m): 7:50am On Apr 19, 2018 |
The bible says you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free. on the day you search it out yourself you shall know what to do. just that past integration of ungodly doctrines into the most translations of the bible and our inherent laziness detar us from coming to know the truth especially in this part of the world. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by mmsen: 7:52am On Apr 19, 2018 |
leye4u: Catholic Church is already wealthier than most governments. So wealthy that they have their own country, yet they still claim to advocate for the poor. Meanwhile the policies that they push and those that they kick against (such as birth control) suggest otherwise. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Nobody: 7:53am On Apr 19, 2018 |
lexy2014: 1.I know about Edhi....(the late great pakistani philantrophist)...he certainly lived in poverty...because he used his money to help others. Our pastors could learn to do same. 2.At the same time, let's say that pastor X sells his private jet(which by the way, I THINK THEY SHOULD DO....) it would only privide some funding...for a few years.Especially when one has to expand the university's facilties. Keep in mind that running costs in Nigerian unviersites are higher than anywhere else. They often times have to pay for their power, their water, etc...because we don't have good supporting infrastructure. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by mmsen: 7:54am On Apr 19, 2018 |
AprilSmallWoman: Voting is one thing but choosing to follow fraudsters has nothing to do with voting - it's a direct result of how Nigerians raise their children to behave slavishly. Until that changes this will continue to be the norm and the rest of the world will be able to see and ridicule. 1 Like |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by KENNSAMMY(m): 7:56am On Apr 19, 2018 |
The bible says you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free. on the day you search it out yourself you shall know what to do. just that past integration of ungodly doctrines into the most translations of the bible and our inherent laziness detar us from coming to know the truth especially in this part of the world. if we keep arguing about tithes in our churches... Jehovahs witnesses people have never been heard taking tithes or preaching anything similar ever since! how are they building those simple simple churches , how are they helping the needy amidst them , how are they able to buy and develop those big convention grounds that i see all over the place? ? ? and yet they do not have one church boss like GO who's richer than a nation ? ? ? |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Nobody: 7:57am On Apr 19, 2018 |
AprilSmallWoman: So, what policy are you voting for exactly regarding prosperity gospel? So far, no candidate has advocated doing anything about it. If Buhari touches the thing...he would be labellled a anti-Christian bigot. 1 Like |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by hopefulLandlord: 8:04am On Apr 19, 2018 |
Guidette: True words, but I disagree with the second to last paragraph. There's nothing allegorical in the Hole-ly BuyBull's support of slavery |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by cana882(m): 8:06am On Apr 19, 2018 |
Cromcruach91:Some pastors own a minimum of two private jets. I can assume you know the cost of purchasing & maintaining a pv jet. Why can't such cornucopia amount be used to educate your members?? They move with security agents, live in the best areas with one of the best houses. My point is they can do more for their penurious members. 1 Like |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by dejavubobo1(m): 8:06am On Apr 19, 2018 |
mmsen:This is deep. I wish ppl can see this quote to its fullest Dept. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Grupo(m): 8:17am On Apr 19, 2018 |
Cromcruach91: You said old missionary schools were subsidized with foreign tithes. My question, why can't these naija pastors do the same now if they are not all for profit? Since they receive tithes every Sunday, can't they use the tithes to subsidize the school even if it is just for their poor church members. 2 Likes |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Acidosis(m): 8:19am On Apr 19, 2018 |
The only reward for tithing or any other form of giving is blessing. Aside being in the bible, it is basically a law of nature. You can't give without receiving. Problems entered into most churches the moment they saw university, real estate, hotels, etc as things they should venture into. Of course, some of them had the right motives, but hey, money won't fall from heaven. Attempts to keep up with business targets, expectations, etc., will ultimately mal the spiritual goal of the church. The church should stop mimicking the government. Play your spiritual role, which is reminding the people the essence of their existence, instilling godly and moral principles on the people and ensuring that the people are aware that beyond this earth, we all will be accountable to our maker. That's the only role of the church. The church has paid too much attention to critics and now wants to do everything the 'people' dictate. As soon as you're criticized for not copying the early missionaries, you go ahead to open universities knowing very well that universities don't run on water. When you call for seeds, offerings and tithes, the same people criticize you for preaching about money, yet they want the universities to offer more than an "advanced secondary school". Okay, when the wealthy church members offer to donate to the church, the critics again call them f00ls because the Bible didn't tell us to pay to the church. Pastor Adeboye and indeed many MOGs have derailed from the actual goal of the church. If I were Pastor Adeboye, I wouldn't allow the urge to satisfy the critics destroy over 40 years of labouring in the vineyard. Put Redeemers university up for sale alongside other Church assets, give the monies back to the same people who donated for that course, and focus on the spiritual goal of the people. You have no business opening universities, just tell the government what to do for your people, the government will listen! If the people are dying of hunger, just advise your members to give to the poor, they will listen. Stop trying to be everything - vice chancellor, philanthropist, MOG, proprietor, Chief Medical Officer, Chief donor, etc. You can't keep up without committing unpardonable atrocities. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by authority2006(m): 8:20am On Apr 19, 2018 |
Cromcruach91: The issue is: why taking money from the poor to build a university since their children wouldn't be able to afford the fees? In case you didn't know, those pastors actually encouraged their members to donate to the buildings of those universities. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by authority2006(m): 8:26am On Apr 19, 2018 |
Cromcruach91: He bought it from the tithe money, people who contributed that one are still contributing now. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by lorhema(f): 8:39am On Apr 19, 2018 |
ajbabs: Deut 14:22-27 is rarely ever preached about the tithe. Never heard it preached in the 34 years that have passed since Jesus became my Lord. I tithe because the church needs resources to function. Anyone who imagines that tithing will assure him/her of heaven is decieved. In this day and age we need to study our Bible and emulate the Berean Christians. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Guidette(f): 8:40am On Apr 19, 2018 |
hopefulLandlord: The Bible is a Masonic book used as code for Astrology and Human Anatomy. Don't take my word for it, but do your own research. Research the origins of the bible and the council of Nicaea in Rome where the first Bible was compiled by using ancient myths and books from the dead sea scrolls. The Roman Catholic Church was built based on pagan traditions and know that there are deeper meanings to the bible. They have one version for the masses and another for the elites. Check the similarities between Egyptian myths and the bible (especially Horus and Aset being the Jesus and Mary), also Krishna and Jesus in Hinduism, and other ancient cultural myths all over the world. Also look into the etymological meaning of the Holy Bible where Holy comes from Helios (greek) meaning Sun and Biblios (greek) meaning book. Look into the Gnostics, and their interpretation of the world as the original Christians long before the first Bible was ever written. Look into the other books that were deliberately not added into the bible like the book of Enoch, Mary, etc and read to know why they were omitted. There are so many similarities between religions and cultural beliefs all over the world and it would be in your interest to do some research into a lot of these things. 1 Like |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by kolawoleibukun: 8:41am On Apr 19, 2018 |
Oga, shut up! You all are hypocrites and we know right. What do you know abour Islam that you want to teach me? na me way don go Mecca before you won teach about Islam? I have lived in Saudi Arabia for 2 years and UAE for 6 months. Wetin you won teach me way I no go teach you about Islam? na illiterates like you you go fit threaten no be me. abi make I teach you how to read your own Koran in Arabic? Listen, many Muslims are fade up of islam. the only thing way hold them the repercussion of openly denouncing it because they do not live in a free country. come and see muslims in Canada living the life. they phork and party like hella watt. sneaking snakes na una be. who no no una miss road. why all muslims especially the arabs day fight to run comot for their countries? even the rich ones from Emirates and Qatar are jumping out of there like wild goose. they are tired of the islam. they want their freedom. who is dating Rihana now? una be fake. una intention na to spread islam to the world. that is what you want. sorry that the west shove it in to your gaymen arsssrss. gays way full middle east like say. The thing day pain una say America keeps decimating any of your strong hold. Even the Palestine sef una no fit hold am well. Very soon now US embassy go start for Jerusalem. Where una Imam when the boko haram day kill for north? Hypocrites! common get out from my face you smelling pig Spicycat: 1 Like |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by kolawoleibukun: 8:42am On Apr 19, 2018 |
yemaldo:but they do worse. they ask you to kill and suicide for 7 virgins. they are worse that 10% |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by hopefulLandlord: 8:48am On Apr 19, 2018 |
Guidette: interesting take but what's allegorical about the Bible's support of slavery? |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Water101(f): 8:49am On Apr 19, 2018 |
I belive tithe is meant to be paid if u have enough urself.at a point in our live we face unexpected challenges,dat we had to use the tithe and we feel we are owing and once anoda work comes we pay the previous tithe and the present tithe.Thing are hard our income is not a salary every month income it is not steady yet we have being paying tithe for years.As dat made things change? no! this year we hav stop paying tithe we felt we can't be in lack,struggling 2 meet ends meet & be paying.we felt we are part of those people that the church need to help,presently we have a good idea on what to do with money that will generate more but nothing to start this idea,the truth is the same church u pay tithe to u can't get help there,u are even called worst than an infidel if u can't meet up needs.imagine!we are free 4rm struggling to pay tithe or owing tithe and worring on how to pay tithe,if and when things move fine & beta we will start paying again,if nt we dnt want to be beggars or borrowers while tithing. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Tundeobama(m): 8:49am On Apr 19, 2018 |
All this rubbish analysis online RCCG members complain to you?or people who don't pay offering and tithe are told to stop coming to church?one thing about blackmail it won't change anything just free advert.Mention churches who does not collect tithe from free givers we have 100 plus church in Nigeria why Rccg and winners always?There is for university own my muslim mosque in West nobody ever talk about it charging same fee as counterparts.I only see this as jelousy |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by jayinfo2(m): 8:50am On Apr 19, 2018 |
When I'm praying to God day and night to give me a job so I can start paying my tithe |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Nobody: 8:53am On Apr 19, 2018 |
authority2006: That then leads to the argument over whether churches have any business setting up universites....OR whether richer church members or CAN can do something about funding indigent students. Or church unversites cut. fees...and by extension cut salaries of staff. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Nobody: 8:59am On Apr 19, 2018 |
Grupo: Because most mission schools were not universites, and because funding a university is different from funding a secondary school.University salaries for lecturers are far higher than teachers in pry and sec schools. One other thing...most Nigerian chruches set up by missions were expected to eventually become self funding. And that would have eventually meant increased fees, etc (which did not happen because govt took over most of them in the 1970's). Plus these schools were for the most part selective....very selective re admission. The concept of every Nigerian kid going to school did not really take off till the 1970's (UPE). Tithes, in my opinion (and in the abscence of available data on church finances)...cannot sponsor/subsidize educaiton at all. To do that...you would have to be colecting tithes in excess of N1 trillion per annum (all prosperity churches combined) AND I doubt they reach that much...and you would have to spend it all on universites...forget all the other branches of the church. Universites are severely serious cash drains. |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by topbollz(m): 9:09am On Apr 19, 2018 |
It is not compulsory you pay tithe. Neither is it compulsory to worship God. It is also not compulsory you give. But if you are a Christian live as one If fact how are you advancing the kingdom of God. How? Abraham was neither forced to pay tithe but he was wise in his deeds. He would not plant and go again to dig the ground to see if the seed his growing. He never gave tithe to go and ask what Melchizedek did with it. He gave and focused on God whom he served who is a rewarder of those that diligently seek him. Your tithe is not what made Adeboye rich. Those that are giving to appreciate him know why and would not question him, neither would they stop. It should not be your headache in anyway what he tells his children. Fast for 100 days and those that did saw the results those that never did saw that too. Its only those that have the understanding of Give and itvwill come back to you good measure pressed down shakened together and running over that do. Tithe is 10% and yet you are into analysis. If God has revealed to you not to pay tithe who am I to stop you are any other. Did Malachi 3:1-15 drop from Space of course not. With emphasis on 14 & 15 one needs to be more careful. Come to think of it if you are asked to follow the Acts of the Apostles you would have brought down the heavens. The time of Grace means you should sell all and give to the men of God. Acts 4:32-37 that is conscience. You can't afford to see any poor. If we are to follow it accordingly or literally. A lot don't pay yet the church is Marching on. A lot pay or give because they saw the respect people give to those that gave. Their reward there too in Acts 5:1-11 My Opinion is simple 10% is too small for me to be ranting about for what God has done for me and my family. God has used Pastor Adeboye to grow his kingdom from about 70 churches to thousands. Why won't he be blessed you think it a joke to pray and fast and lead just 5 people, something must be working for him and that I convet too. I trust Him for more and by his grace he will do above every thing I ask for. Nothing comes for nothing you have to pay a price. Salvation is free but yet the kingdom of God suffereth violence and only the violent take it by force. I see tithe as tapping into Gods greatness as in the Hebrews 7 you gave verse 4. Then read 4-7. If Christ is a priest according to order of Melchizedek verse 17 isn't it wise I emulate Abraham and give him my 10th. So that I can get blessed according to verse 6&7. Bro pay your tithe. Do your best and let God see your service is in spirit and in truth. You can also read 1 Corinth. 9:8-15. The Bible is an inspiration and that inspiration has not stopped reason why you might get confused if you do it without Gods guidance. The Pharisees that read it literally were chastised by Jesus. Worse of James 4:17 says: James 4:17 New International Version (NIV) 17 If anyone, then, knows the good they ought to do and doesn’t do it, it is sin for them. And no sinner shall go to heaven. You have no idea the lives these men of God are imparting financially, spiritually and in welfare. Scholarships, Pastors Salary, Mission Field, Welfare for less privilege members many of who come for it and run away when they get it. Endowment for Universities, free feeding at some quarters, free schools for less privileges. You can count on and on Reason why you need to do your homework before listening to myopic views of nay sayers who would not do and will not allow those that are doing be in peace. Be Guided Sir 2 Likes |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by AngelicBeing: 9:13am On Apr 19, 2018 |
Re: Who Really Benefits From Nigeria's 'prosperity Gospel'? (BBC News) by Guidette(f): 9:30am On Apr 19, 2018 |
hopefulLandlord: Remember this is a book written for white people, not blacks. I do not know if it has an allegory to it, but most quotes in the bible, quran and torah have many meanings. I am not religious nor do I follow cults. The only thing I look for is the truth and from my research, the book was compiled by a Roman emperor to further an agenda with one meaning for the masses and another for the elites. |
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