earthrealm:


Ahhha the hybrids...its this issue of resistive loads..that people hv varying opinions.
Lemme research more

pranil:

I have a different opinion. It may be cheaper and more efficient and definitely more reliable in the long run to directly run the PUMP from Panels ( DC models)

https://www.dayusolar.cn/product/4sp8-solar-dc-water-pump-for-8m3-h-flow-rate-with-max-head-220m/

or use a special pump inverter running from panels ( no battery) - AC models

https://www.mppsolar.com/v3/sp-series-3-phase/

https://www.grundfos.com/market-areas/water/solar-water-solutions/solar-water-solutions-systems.html

Saipro:

I think he mentioned unattended during the problem description. Your first suggestion seems to be the one prime for his needs.

Adding more equipment introduces more points of tending to, thus more entry points for failure.

PV panels -> DC pump -> water level in the tank triggers an automatic float switch -> happy nonoski.

Not sure it can get any simpler.

earthrealm:


Ahhha the hybrids...its this issue of resistive loads..that people hv varying opinions.
Lemme research more

earthrealm:
anyone knows a budget 5kva/4kva inverter that has a charging current in excess of 40amps?.not usa or german
mustpower,highpower etc all clock in at 31amps max, so those running 8x200ah batts on these devices are you not bothered as the charging rate isnt upto c/10,

chris81964:
Growatt:
They promised an update by weekend and this morning they did an update over the air. The max battery cut off is now 60 V.
The bulk and absorb can go from 48 - 59V and the low battery cut off can be set up from 40 - 50 V.
Enjoy your Growatt. They are quiet and a work horse. I have run a 2 hp water pump, refrigerator, freezer, fans and lights all at the same time with nary a whimper from the unit.

nonoski:

Yes this seems to be the simplest solution.
But my tot has been why use the panels only for pumping of water for a few hours.
When the same panels + a few more can be effectively put to use and eliminate Generator entirely in the village house since it's hardly occupied (less than 35days the entire year)

chris81964:

I have a Growatt SPF5000 and it runs my 1.5 hp water pump, refrigerator and freezer all at the same time with no problems

Saipro:
For the record, all batteries fail eventually including flooded lead acid chemistry cells.

My experience with US batteries has been a bit different with 2 sets on 2 sites not requiring watering in 12 & 15 months respectively despite heavy use (35 - 50% drain almost daily). Both were 24V setups, had a VIL inverter and used 6V XC L16 batteries each. ePsolar 60A iTracer with no temperature compensation, no equalization and absorb set to 28.8V, float at 26.4V. I have a similar setup running in my dad's place, thoroughly abused (routine 80% drain) yet they're alive and fairly strong after 3 years (I'd say they're down to about 50 - 70% capacity now).

I did my research before choosing USB L16 and global end user reports generally rate them better than their Trojan counterparts. Trojan 6V L16 batteries rock too but are less tolerant of abuse. The 12V versions for both of them require serious minding. I can as well attest to that.

Having said that, for the small home user, little else beats the Trojan T105-RE. They're literally indestructible. Something I can attest to again. It just so happens those of us who bought from these shores a few years back got lemons. Asides the few odd ones which failed, the others are living up to their reputation.

My recommendation for FLA:
- starter batteries should be Trojan T105 (the plain cheap ones). They'll serve while providing the learning experience.
- small systems should use Trojan T105-RE up to a max of 3 strings in any config (12V, 24V, 36V or 48V). Suitable alternatives would be any L16 (except the 6V RE USB and the 12V non-RE Trojan)
- larger systems should get either L16 USB (also sold as Penn, Deka and a few other brand names) or go for small industrial Trojans

bigrovar:

I will also like to recommend Luminous Indian Tubular batteries. Honestly Tubular batteries have one advantage over the US flooded batteries. They are designed for tropical environments i.e higher humidity and temperature and unreliable charge supply. They can take massive amount of abuse, rarely ever gets warm, and experience minimum water loss. The 2 powering my system have refused to die which I find bothersome. Oga pranil even confirm to me backstage that the lead plates are actually made in the USA. It seems they took the best of tubular technology usually found in single cell high capacity batteries and applied it to a 6 cell battery form factor. Trojan recently collaborated with sukam to make trojan batteries for the Indian Market while French company Schneider Electric snapped up Luminous all together. The level of RnD that has gone into the Indian tubular battery especially their use in an environment like Nigeria with unreliable power supply and hot weather..in addition to often overlooked practical features like electrolyte level indicator flooters are just some of the reason I highly rate the tubular batteries. A company like luminous gets my nod for their presence in Nigeria and wide reach across the country. This makes warranty issues much easier to resolve.

Ativ:


Thanks for the update as well as your experience with USBattery.
So, is the Growatt inverter now recommended for flooded batteries? How does one carry out an equalization charge using the Growatt SPF5000? Can the new voltage setpoints affect the durability of the inverter? I read some time ago of old axpert inverters that were prone to failure when exposed to the higher voltages of CCs.
Is the Growatt lithium battery available in Nigeria? Is it stackable and can it function perfectly well with the higher temperatures in our environment? I read of your travails with Victron lithium battery.
In view of your poor experience with USBattery flooded batteries, do you still recommend flooded batteries? Trojan flooded batteries were out of stock for a long time and Coscharis stopped importing tubular batteries. Are there other factors that may have been responsible for the unavailability of these flooded batteries including poor suitability for our environment?

Ativ:
Thanks for your submissions and adding to this body of knowledge.
I have always wondered why Trojan and USBattery did not see it fit to add an electrolyte level indicator to their flooded batteries.

chris81964:


Good morning. These are very serious questions. I will charge you for each. Let me answer Fangpusen FM and the best I saw from my 4 panels was less than 200 watts. I replaced them with 4 good 250 watt panels from Renesola and I saw a marked improvement. So now I was charging my 8 batteries with 1 kw in panels using a Yiyen inverter that had a DOD set at below 0%
The rest is history. I have 3.5 kw in panels now and I intend to add more in addition to a generator. I don't want to lose batteries again due to my poor knowledge of what is involved in purchasing components or designing a system.

kiekie1:

.........

NB: Mr Niyi has also joined us in large battery bank designs(38400wh) if I remembered correctly , am sure his can outlast 2 weeks of bad weather without AC , microwave, water heater usage to fiddle around 50-60% DOD .. Cheer's

earthrealm:

@bolded, is it yiyen inverter sold under the highpower inverter trade name?. i have 1 unit of such, not too pleased with the inverter,

https://www.yiyen.com/product/hp-pure-sine-wave-invertercharger/

cons.
1. doesnt display charging current.
2. doesnt display battery life remaining.
3. screen is always on/lit and scrolling data.
4. doesnt have an easy 13amp socket easy outputat the rear.

NiyiOmoIyunade:
Lolz. My max daily usage without ACs is ~8kwh. This covers daily ironing for 30 mins for me and my madam as we prepare to go to work, daily hot water dispenser for about an hour to make coffee, microwave for breakfast and some elements of dinner, always on mid size fridge and water dispenser (timer is on permanent ON in the presence of so much power), always on security lights and a few other household appliances that never go off.

With zero sun and even if I put off the PV array breaker, I have 5 days of backup with no load rationing .

With my total PV array at 7.6kwh, I am sure to generate at least 7 to 11kwh daily even on a bad day - I average between 23kwh to 32kwh on a good solar day if I run two inverter ACs and one non-inverter AC all through the day.

Essentially I have a virtual perpetual motion system going on there - grid use is now discretionary and Gen has rusted up where it sits yet I remain unconcerned

chris81964:


Good morning. These are very serious questions. I will charge you for each. Let me answer as well as I can.
1. No I don't recommend them for flooded batteries. No EQ function yet.
2. I don't think durability is affected. The failures of the Voltronics units had nothing to do with high voltage it was a quality of components issue. At least that is what I was told. The 5 kva units were the units that were prone to failure
3. I have not imported their Lithium batteries. Yes it is stackable 2 units. The Victron experience is unique to that manufacturer
4. Yes I still believe that flooded batteries are an incredible value should you want something that would give you a lengthy service life
5. I can't answer. Each importer / manufacturer has their reasons. The failure with the flooded batteries are in large part due to the user. Ours ran dry and could not recover. The Trojans were more forgiving. They all need to be properly charged. You can get away with infrequent improper charges but when it is continuous for months coupled with deep depths of discharge they will always fail.A generator is a must if you are off grid completely. I counted on the grid to be my gen but we went many months with no grid power and the batteries could not recover.
When I started with my flooded batteries I had some very bad solar panels. They were sold to me as 250 watt panels. I finally purchased a Fangpusen FM and the best I saw from my 4 panels was less than 200 watts. I replaced them with 4 good 250 watt panels from Renesola and I saw a marked improvement. So now I was charging my 8 batteries with 1 kw in panels using a Yiyen inverter that had a DOD set at below 0%
The rest is history. I have 3.5 kw in panels now and I intend to add more in addition to a generator. I don't want to lose batteries again due to my poor knowledge of what is involved in purchasing components or designing a system.

chris81964:

That is it.

NiyiOmoIyunade:
Lolz. My max daily usage without ACs is ~8kwh. This covers daily ironing for 30 mins for me and my madam as we prepare to go to work, daily hot water dispenser for about an hour to make coffee, microwave for breakfast and some elements of dinner, always on mid size fridge and water dispenser (timer is on permanent ON in the presence of so much power), always on security lights and a few other household appliances that never go off.

With zero sun and even if I put off the PV array breaker, I have 5 days of backup with no load rationing .

With my total PV array at 7.6kwh, I am sure to generate at least 7 to 11kwh daily even on a bad day - I average between 23kwh to 32kwh on a good solar day if I run two inverter ACs and one non-inverter AC all through the day.

Essentially I have a virtual perpetual motion system going on there - grid use is now discretionary and Gen has rusted up where it sits yet I remain unconcerned

Saipro:

At less than half your PV array size, I can boast similar performance. My essential daily consumption though is less than 3kW, largely in part to a recently acquired Victron Phoenix inverter with idle consumption of about 10W (thanks to Pranil for showing me the way).

My point? Your array size is sufficient to run a block of offices during the day, disregarding your equally oversized battery bank. I hope those batteries don't croak from shelf life expiry long before you've used up half their useful capacity.

Barezzi:
Saipro, You got me thinking...
When I started this solar journey several moons ago, the goal was to power my WHOLE house via solar.
Huge battery bank, several stacked inverters and a massive pv array to cater to present and future power needs.

My daily Essential loads consumption is also about 8kwh. It's the non-essential loads that rack up the numbers.
So much money spent to cater to non-essential loads
I can getaway with a smaller inverter by replacing several non-essential appliances with their dc equivalent.
(dc booster pump, dc submersible pump, dc water heater) but the Induction cooker, ACs, electric kettles?

I am always interested in any opportunity to automate and optimise my setup.

Saipro:

With a 3kW PV array, my daily consumption rivals yours buy on days I can afford those massive opportunistic loads.

Enlightenment came when I realised the primary aim of RE is energy conservation not energy production. Changed all but one of my bulbs to LED including floodlights. TVs are LED (one remains LCD) and fridge + freezer are A-rated. AC is not inverter type but consumes lesser than expected (an LG). And so on and so forth.

I'd love to have your bank and array though. That's what I call a largesse.

Saipro:

I intended to include tubular at the mid-level but felt it would expand the scope of comparison beyond USB and Trojan. Having said that, I wholly agree with your submission.

PS: Can I have your WhatsApp number? We need to have some backstage chats

NiyiOmoIyunade:
Lolz. My max daily usage without ACs is ~8kwh. This covers daily ironing for 30 mins for me and my madam as we prepare to go to work, daily hot water dispenser for about an hour to make coffee, microwave for breakfast and some elements of dinner, always on mid size fridge and water dispenser (timer is on permanent ON in the presence of so much power), always on security lights and a few other household appliances that never go off.

With zero sun and even if I put off the PV array breaker, I have 5 days of backup with no load rationing .

With my total PV array at 7.6kwh, I am sure to generate at least 7 to 11kwh daily even on a bad day - I average between 23kwh to 32kwh on a good solar day if I run two inverter ACs and one non-inverter AC all through the day.

Essentially I have a virtual perpetual motion system going on there - grid use is now discretionary and Gen has rusted up where it sits yet I remain unconcerned

earthrealm:


WOW, WHAT YOU GOT THERE CAN BUY more than 2 units 100kva diesel generator!!!

earthrealm:


OOH NICE, SO what work around did you use to have the info i outlined in the cons at your finger tips.
i dislike having to whip out my clamp meter when i want to confirm the charging current, or the screen being constantly lit, and batt life/percentage not being displayed