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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Investment / Treasury Bills In Nigeria (4681126 Views)
Fixed Deposits Or Treasury Bills, Which Is Better? / Fixed Deposit And Treasury Bill Investments From Abroad / I Need Information On Treasury Bills In Nigeria (2) (3) (4)
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Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by Nnamz(m): 8:40am On Nov 13, 2018 |
I think I get what this guy has been trying to say and I'm sure I'm not the only one he has made to seriously consider the benefits of tbills. At first I was very skeptical about him like "what is this ode coming here to say na" but now I'm even thankful to him. A user here ^ ^ just shared his experience of "investing" 15mN, which later grew to 31mN. Funny thing is that even with the over 16mN interest, he still lost about 12,500 Dollars. Now keep in mind that he would have been better off if he had kept his 15mN in a dorm account. But he didn't cause the 15-18% interest rate at that time was sweeting his body. This guy has brought up a very thought provoking valid solid point and if you're wise, you would see reason with him. Treasury Bills WILL MAKE YOU POOR. As for me, I won't cancel any of my current tbills. But moving on, no more tbills of 675,000 Naira every two weeks. I will save my money in a dorm account. And in 5 years time when the US-Naira exchange rate is at say 600 to the dollar, those of you doing tbills, let me know if you are richer than me. A WORD IS ENOUGH FOR THE WISE. And thanks to that guy who opened some eyes on this forum. You sir are the real MVP 4 Likes 2 Shares |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by Agbaletu: 8:42am On Nov 13, 2018 |
[quote author=zamirikpo post=72923700][/quote] Thanks, zamirikpo. |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by ahiboilandgas: 8:53am On Nov 13, 2018 |
Nnamz:i have been investing in the money market for 10 years ,experience is the best teacher ...smart people learn from other people expirence... 3 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by hias2012(m): 8:56am On Nov 13, 2018 |
ahiboilandgas: Good analogy. Good to diversify,and well done folks. But what none has hinted is at what "time" one converts his/her dollars to Naira in order to make profit. In 2016 when the exchange rate skyrocketed was partly because of scarcity of dollars. Banks put a cap on how much dollars you could spend off your dorm account whilst abroad. For the most part, withdrawing in Nigeria wasn't even as easy as the banks cried they didn't have dollars to issue out. I guess this was the case whether you wanted to buy off the counter or withdraw from your dorm account. Hence the black market rate headed far North. And this is the reason people matained warehouses and Ikoyi flats as their dorm account for easy access.When we analyse it's good we highlight the pros and cons. The reason majority invest in TB is because they are sure of their rates, interest and capital and the "time". If you stack your dorm account, which is good, but who says or knows when exchange rate would go again far up and juicy enough at which point you decide to sell? This is not known by anyone. We've probably had like the 2016 experience twice since 1999 or thereabout. Many people died while waiting. That said the second issue is that everybody is not the same. Some are more risk adverse than others. Some would dare the risk with the hopes of higher returns, and we know that only a percentage of this actually make their money - make it big while others lose evrything or die due to hypertension. But those who like it small, and are careful investing in zero-risk ventures are free from the above hassles, they ALL make their money albeith surely and steadily. The third is that it is not TB rate that determines inflation rate but the reverse. Hence the fluctuation. So those praying for higher TB rate should know. Higher inflation, higher TB rate and we actually don't pray for this. We pray intlation rates keep going down. So if you have money and you don't know the sure profitable business or venture to invest in, keep investing in TB. However, make sure you don't eat all the interest, make sure part of it is reinvested otherwise with rising inflation the actual worth of your money is reducing over time if you EAT all the interest. So far all the analysis make a good read for me, and this forum has to be lively to educate and as well to thrill. 20 Likes 5 Shares |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by ahiboilandgas: 9:00am On Nov 13, 2018 |
My second expirence is land was bought for 750000 naira in 2004 that 7500 dollars I sold for 12,000,000 in 2017 ....govt approved layout with c.of.o meaning 33,300 dollars ...profit 25000 dollars ...if i kept the 7500 dollars in my dorm since 2004 and change to naira now it will be 2.7m I for lost 9.5m for refusing to invest..if I bought tb in 2004 for 75000 and hold for 14 years it would have been around 5 million by now......am a veteran investor.... 4 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by Nnamz(m): 9:06am On Nov 13, 2018 |
And to those saying "but you're better off than those people whose money are sitting idle in their bank account ", or "if not tbills what would we invest in na". Let me correct that analogy. You're only better off than those whose money are sitting idle in their Naira account. Emphasis, on Naira. You're not, I repeat, NOT better off than folks whose money are sitting idle in their domiciliary account. If you think I'm lying, ask that guy whose 15mN increased to 31mN in 5 years (2012-2017). His now 31mN is worth 87,500 USD. But if he had left that 15mN in a dorm account in 2012, which was 100k USD then, my guy's money would have been worth 36,000,000mN now (Jesuuuuu). So what are we saying? Leave your money in Dollars. This 15%, even if it goes up to 20%, ain't as sweet a deal as most people think. Like someone here said 2 previous pages ago, [/b]THERE IS A REASON WHY NIGERIA TBILLS IS 15% WHILE U.S. IS 2%[b] . I have said my own and probably the last time I will comment on this. Let me leave those who wants to enjoy their 15% tbills to do so in peace 4 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by ahiboilandgas: 9:08am On Nov 13, 2018 |
hias2012:tb has a risk too we call it foreign exchange risk...that why investor put their money at 2 percent in America against 18 percent in nigeria or 43 percent in Argentina ...other risk is default risk as seen in Argentina,Syria ,Greece Venezuela,Zimbabwe. Other risk are hyper inflation like seen in Zimbabwe,ghana,Venezuela and Iran.. 2 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by Acidosis(m): 9:30am On Nov 13, 2018 |
Agbaletu: First Bank, someone also mentioned Diamond bank. I also have the interest rate guide for Anchoria Asset Mgt (a subsidiary of vfd group). These guys currently offer the best rates I've seen anywhere both on local and foreign currencies, but of course not everyone would be comfortable with a non-banking financial institution, especially one that is not so popular. You're likely going to get very ridiculous rates from FirstBank though. They offer rates as low as 2% on fixed deposits (local currencies) for 30 days. So on foreign currencies, expect even lower rates. 2 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by jidobaba(m): 10:23am On Nov 13, 2018 |
You people have effectively discouraged people from investing in this week's TBills auction! Some people already wrote and scanned instructions waiting to send to their banks but are now instead looking for land to buy in developing areas... 4 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by Infinitisi(m): 10:53am On Nov 13, 2018 |
jidobaba: |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by Infinitisi(m): 11:02am On Nov 13, 2018 |
Bottom line for everyone I think should be it is important to invest your time and money in financial and economic education. There are many online courses on investing and portfolio management which will teach you the different asset classes, interest rates, inflation, currency devaluation and how all these factors affect investment decisions and how to properly allocate your funds among different asset classes. More often than not what separates the successful investors from the rest are education and experience. At least you have control over how much education you get. 6 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by zamirikpo(m): 11:47am On Nov 13, 2018 |
jidobaba: Nooo...... that means they don't get the gist. I will invest in December sef.... no one is saying don't invest in tb ,we are only saying TB is a means to an end not the end in itself. 3 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by Infinitisi(m): 12:01pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
zamirikpo: In other words use the funds generated from TBills to invest in other asset classes, buy and hold dollars or do a business. |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by damurphy: 12:05pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
Mfunkynation:What percentage did they offer ? |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by jpphilips(m): 12:26pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
GonFreecss1: I have no interest in discussing the rudiments but dynamics, high interest rate means higher risk of default, that is a valid economic theory, however, when you domesticate it, you will realize it is not as straight forward as you think. High interest rate means future expenditure for the state, if the state's earnings increase within the period (always does except for few years ago), that risk becomes inconsequential, the only down side is that it robs the government the liquidity for capital projects and creates other budgetary pressures, default doesn't come in. The state has a way of creating equilibrium in those things, increase taxation, dispose assets, shrink budget like we just saw in the 2019 budget etc. its all about earning, once you earn enough, you can always repay your debts. Lastly, some debts are left in a cycle that never ends, that's the reality of running a nation, a state doesn't run like a company where economic indices are cast in stone, just follow the dynamics. 6 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by jpphilips(m): 12:28pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
zamirikpo: I understand your view, is Nigeria going Bankrupt? if No, then Greece has no bearing in the discourse. 1 Like |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by hias2012(m): 1:01pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
jpphilips: Thank you for this. 2 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by ahiboilandgas: 1:09pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
jpphilips:imf already warning Nigeria 50 percent income used to pay up debt 3 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by Anatech(m): 1:26pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
GonFreecss1: So what so you advice us to do? 1 Like |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by freeman67: 1:30pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
Most times people's comparison comes only from where they see gain forgetting that irrespective of the fact that everybody interest is to make gain, sometime you loose too... Also gain and loss is dependent on when you are no longer holding the investment again ie when disposed off.. Why some people may see TB as the only form of investment there know, I believe majority here does it just to keep money above inflation. Also some do it to in place of something better than savings or fixed deposit. That said, we have heard from the man who exchanged Dollar and invested in NTB when the exchange rate was low and now could not get back the same sum if exchanged back to Dollar even when he had made a significant gain in Naira. Has anybody heard from those who bought Dollar in 2015 at the rate of N480- N500 believing it was going to N900-N1,000? What will be their fate if they need money now and want to convert? Yes some bought land and it appreciated, have you thought about those that bought in some place based on particular news anticipating it was going to get high and people are still pricing below the cost price..? In stock market back then some people bought GTB share and some bought intercontinental bank shares.. There was a time when intercontinental bank shareholders think they had something valuable but now the thinking is not same whereas the GTB shareholders are still enjoying their investment. So there is always two ways to it. Its not always a one smooth way. Even for the Bitcoin Advocates I believe there were some people who bought when it skyrocketed back then thinking it was always going higher before it came down.. Lots of those are sitting on losses now... If there are to convert it now. For those wanting to invest in Diamond Bank should watch it ooo even though the CBN guarantees depositors funds.. I personally do not fancy doing business with mismanaged company. 9 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by Anatech(m): 1:30pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
hias2012: Thanks Boss, people read one small thing and think they know it all |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by Nobody: 1:41pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
Anatech: Tb rates is always higher by at least 2 percent if you factor in inflation and compounded your interest. If you don't have any other thriving business that can guarantee similar returns.after inflation. you will be mad not to do tb. Whatever businesses you do will also be affected by inflation. That's why real investors always compound. During periods of stability in currency rates.. use some of your gains for forex, land or other stuff.. Lastly inflation is not only a Nigerian thing, it can affect foreign currency as well, anyone who didn't convert their forex in the last one year have lost significant value in the event that they wanted to convert it to naira.. Timing is the best strategy.. not the fear of inflation/ forex risk. 1 Like |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by dotcomnamename: 2:02pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
hias2012: Yepahhhhh see knowledge... No issue based conversations with single narrative replaced with emotions and personal opinion. Honestly we need people like you here and on MF's thread. Mama Nkechi, please give this man two cold bottles of Big Stout and a plate of Nkwobi. God bless you jare.. That's it but watch the indomie generations masturbating on this again. Just watch. 9 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by NL1960: 2:29pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
dotcomnamename: I hope you are not using your TB interest to pay for this?. 3 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by Yem0350: 3:12pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
freeman67:You have said it all |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by zinaunreal(m): 4:09pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
Every investment has a margin of risk, nobody should come here and act like a sooth sayer. Even some of the best brains who have risen to greats heights have lost it all due to miscalculation or over sabi. Just dont invest what you cant afford to loose. Thats my candid advice 1 Like |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by donshady(m): 4:25pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
freeman67: I need to buy you one crate of Guinness!!!! You said it all. Nice one. 2 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by jpphilips(m): 4:41pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
ahiboilandgas: Does a 50:50 debt to income ratio mean default? what do you think will happen when income increases? |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by ahiboilandgas: 5:12pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
jpphilips:what will happen if income decrease...crude becoming irrelevant like coal... |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by jpphilips(m): 5:30pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
ahiboilandgas: Though you didn't answer my question, I will answer yours, if income decreases, the state will dispose off its assets to raise money, next will be to cut budgets and subsidies eventually increasing taxes, all cards are on the table. About crude becoming irrelevant like coal, that must be a joke in this particular scenario, have you wondered how Nigeria made the paradigm shift from coal to crude? now answer my question, what happens when income increases? 6 Likes |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by zamirikpo(m): 6:03pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
zinaunreal:[right][/right][font=Lucida Sans Unicode][/font] U r entitled to ur opinion but I totally disagree. Not everyone falls.....some of us have been rising and will continue infinitely. |
Re: Treasury Bills In Nigeria by ahiboilandgas: 6:43pm On Nov 13, 2018 |
jpphilips:if income increase(dollars )and tax collection mean lower tb rates ,less attractive bond rate and less deflaut risk ..currently we have 70 bn dollars debt |
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