LordReed:


If ever I make a straw man feel free to point it out, as I am sure you will.

Ah ok sorry, I thought you were addressing atheists however it still doesn't make it an atheistic position because the only position addressed by atheism is the one about gods, nothing else.

Expansions are not always preceded by an explosion. Take a balloon for example, you can rapidly expand it without any explosion. That should be the idea that is conveyed but because the word bang is used the explosion idea is what people think of instead.

Ihedinobi3:

The reason I qualified it that way is that it is a popular position among atheists. The other two popular ones are:

1. Aliens/extradimensional material beings (whatever those are)

2. An eternal Universe that self-exists.

I think you know what explosions mean. It is rapid expansion. There really is nothing to argue here.

frosbel2:



Correction - I should have read what you wrote slowly , instead of replying hastily .

Still , Jesus is not the way to salvation and nothing will happen to those who do not believe in him.

Ihedinobi3:

First of all, it is not my position that God ever came from nothing. He didn't "come". He always was, always is and always will be. That is the meaning of God as a term.

Second, you are telling me that after years of research, I should be content to hear that nothing exploded into everything. Do you even understand what you are asking me to do? I would be throwing good money after bad. Better to stick with something that makes more sense even if I didn't have to build miles of colliders to prove it, no?

Third, why on earth are you making these assumptions about people you never met or knew in any way? You have no clue what they knew. That we have technology these days that were not even imagined two thousand years ago does not really mean that we are smarter. It just means that we know different things than the people of that time knew. Much knowledge is lost over time, Oga. You have no idea what those people knew. And that makes your claim an argument from silence.

Fourth, no, He didn't. It just exploded into existence all by itself. Why are you arguing like this? Of course, He created it along with the rest of the Universe. And I don't know why beyond that He decided to. Is that a problem for you?

LordReed:


Its you doing the usual quibbling over definitions, even when the idea is clear. The thought isn't that there was an explosion but sure keep being obstinate when you are being corrected.

Still all of that has nothing to do with atheism.

Horiolah:
which one is nothing exploded to something.

Ihedinobi3:

Okay. So you want to go with the singularity theory?

Fine. If you can believe that an eternal singularity can explode into everything, exactly how is that a more sensible explanation than a self-existing God Who made everything?

Ihedinobi3:

What?! What are you talking about? You said rapid expansion. That is exactly what an explosion is. Am I misrepresenting it just because I used one word instead of two?

You were the one who ran into the conversation to complain about atheism. I said nothing about it. But I understand why you feel the way you do. Obviously, atheists are the chief mockers of Christianity. So, you would feel too close to the heat if any mock-worthy thing can be associated with atheism. As it is, there is no explanation that atheists have to offer in place of God that is not hilarious. Not one. And you cannot avoid having to offer an alternative for God since creation demands an explanation for its existence.

If God didn't make it, then it has always been here. And if you can believe that, you have no right to complain that the existence of a self-existing personal God can be believed by Christians.

If you believe that some extra-dimensional alien race made the universe, that is even worse. If the alien is not a material entity since the universe is the full set of all material things, then it is necessarily supernatural just like God must of necessity be.

Then, the Big Bang. Whether you think it started with a loud sound or with a hiss, it started apparently from nothing prior. If you believe that insanity, you are not even qualified to have an opinion about anything much less laugh at Christians.

But there is the cop-out as well, the "nobody knows" excuse. The Bible makes a claim and you reject it in favor of "nobody knows"? That is an idiocy in itself. The first thing that is reasonable to do is to ask if it is beyond reason to believe that if a God exists who made the Universe, He would also tell the human race about Himself and provide all the information they need to understand their existence and what they ought to do with themselves.

Obviously, it is not. So, "nobody knows" is nothing more than a lazy excuse.

Horiolah:


bro if you read diz things with open mind, you'll find it more sensible to creationism, i cant come and die convincing u.

Nobody knw for sure which one is right, but if u think you're right then you need to prove it.

LordReed:


LMFAO! You are a piece of work. What is bringing on this rant? I said sorry but apparently the bitterness has overfilled your mind LoL. Keep being obstinate and saying atheism says nothing exploded into something so that we'll know new information doesn't penetrate the walls your christian indoctrination has set up. LMFAO!

Ihedinobi3:

Now it is a rant, isn't it?

You are quick to divorce atheism from impossible positions when their impossibility becomes apparent but after cutting off the ground from under yourself, you attack Christianity for having a position that is no more ridiculous than all the others you are forced to run from.

That is something you should deal with. It's not my problem. It's yours.

Ihedinobi3:

Exactly. If you read the Bible with an open mind, you will find it more sensible than the explosions of nothing.

As for nobody knowing which one is right, please see my most recent response to LordReed on this thread. I have no problems proving what I claim. Not that I could possibly be bothered to do so for someone who believes something as insane as the Big Bang and who will not prove it even if mountains of currency were riding on it.

HappyPagan:

What is freedom?

Reality is a virgin in Israel gave birth to a man who died for me. Lol. What a weird reality for you.

LordReed:


Of course I'll divorce it because it wasn't tied to them in the first place but your indoctrination will not let new information penetrate so it really is your problem not mine. LMFAO!

Horiolah:


my mama raised me nt to hate someone irrespective of their belief,race or whatever is used to divide we humans, so i can't read a book that promote that twice. been there, not anymore.

Horiolah:
guy stop saying diz BS, no prove of the Big Bang ?? but you think you have already proved yours. smh

Ihedinobi3:

It isn't?

Atheism claims that God doesn't exist. Proof? That there is no proof that He does.

Okay then. So how does the Universe exists if there wasn't a God to make it?

Please tell me that Atheism has not offered alternatives, LordReed, and name yourself for me.

Horiolah:
ihedino3 i knw say u dey fear hell, but bro take your time and research. i personally think their is a higher power not 'god' as in being. but i'm nt sure abt dat cuz no prove.

LordReed:


Atheism has proposed no alternatives, cosmology on the other hand has. And the oft quoted Big Bang cosmology doesn't say something came from nothing.

Ihedinobi3:

Mine is simple enough. The Universe exists. And it looks exactly like what my God would make.

Ihedinobi3:

Liar, liar, pants on fire.

Why do we have an anti-God cosmology, LordReed? Did it fall out of the sky?

Look, if you prefer a self-existing singularity to a "nothing", you are only in a slightly better situation.

Ihedinobi3:

More lies about the Bible.



LOL. You have proof of the self-existence of a singularity? Or of that special nothing that exploded into the whole Universe?

Mine is simple enough. The Universe exists. And it looks exactly like what my God would make.

Ihedinobi3:

More lies about the Bible.



LOL. You have proof of the self-existence of a singularity? Or of that special nothing that exploded into the whole Universe?

Mine is simple enough. The Universe exists. And it looks exactly like what my God would make.

LordReed:


Do you know how the universe that your god didn't make looks like? Can you show us?

LordReed:


LMFAO! Gosh you have become unhinged. Anti-god cosmology, is that what they teach you in apologetics ministry school? LMFAO!

I prefer nothing because the theories are incomplete, rather I like that people are using their brains and tools to figure out stuff instead of believing stories and myths.

Ihedinobi3:

What?

Horiolah:


lies, really?? I'm done arguing with u.

Horiolah:
did you say no prove?? great
lol until an asteroid hit our asses before you knw u aren't special so do ur god.

LordReed:


"The Universe exists. And it looks exactly like what my God would make."

How are you able to know this? You have a non-god created universe to compare it with? Can you show us what that looks like?

Ihedinobi3:

Yeah, today, I just decided to play insane just for you and your ilk.

So, what's wrong with my "anti-God cosmology" question?

You made a confused statement here. If you like people using their brains and tools to figure out stuff, how do you then not prefer the Big Bang theory which is, after all, the product of feverish "scientific" imagination and very expensive equipment too, mm? What tools again are you waiting for? Or not enough brains?

Be lying for atheism, I nugo?

Ihedinobi3:

See question!

So, let's see. If a crime were committed and you were a detective investigating it, you would need other MO's to compare the crime against to know whether the criminal whose MO you actually have was the perp?

Ihedinobi3:

I fear hell? The Lord Jesus died for me. So I no longer fear hell. It's God I fear displeasing because He's been enormously good to me. He deserves the very best I have to give and I don't want to disappoint Him. His displeasure is not what I like to be the cause of.

You are welcome to believe what you will, Horiolah. I'm sure you have your reasons for it. For myself, however, the choice is sealed. It is the Lord Jesus Christ, the God Who loved me enough to humble Himself and become human too so that He could die for my very many sins and make me, a mad rebel, a true child of God and give me a real chance at winning eternal rewards that all the world's riches cannot even dream of equalling.