Rashduct4luv:


How many People in the Bible made human sacrifices to God?

none

malvisguy212:
the black stone worship was practice in pre-islamic era, this hadith confirm it


Sahih Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 59, Number
661:
Narrated by Abu Raja Al-Utaridi:
We used to WORSHIP STONE, AND
WHEN WE FOUND A BETTER STONE THAN THE FIRST ONE we would
throw the first one and take the
latter, but if we could not get a
stone then we would collect
some earth (i.e. soil) and then
bring a sheep and milk that
sheep over it, and perform the
TAWAF(circumnavigation) around
it.

This hadith confirmed that the black stone worship and tawaf was practice by pagan before Muhammad bring Islam to them.
In his book, “The Life of Muhammad,” the Egyptian writer, Muhammad Husayn Haykal ,whose works are based on the scholarly manuscripts of Ibn Hisham , acknowledged the following facts regarding the worship of the Black Stone :

"In fact, the Arabs venerated
these stones so much that not
only did they worship the Black
Stone in the Ka’bah , but also
they would take one of the
stones of the Ka’bah as a holy
object in their travels, praying to
it and asking it to bless every
move they made. "

Al-Bukhārī reports that ʿUmar – Allāh be pleased with him – came to the Black Stone (performing ṭawāf, circumambulation), kissed it, and said, “I know that you are a stone, you do not cause benefit or harm; and if it were not that I had seen Allāh’s Messenger – peace and blessings of Allāh be upon him – kiss you, I would never have kissed you.”

Al-Bukhārī, Al-Ṣaḥīḥ, Chapter on what has been said about the Black Stone.

Points to note

· The illustrious Companion and Caliph ʿUmar reminded us in this narration of the pure belief that benefit and harm are not caused by created objects and thus should not be sought from them. Only Allāh has control over these things.

· We are reminded that acts of worship are taken from Allāh’s Messenger, and a person is not supposed to make up his own way of worship, he must follow the manner of worship that the Prophet taught and practiced.

· We also learn that once an action is confirmed in the Sunnah, the believer submits and complies and practices it because it is confirmed that Allāh’s Messenger did it, even if we don’t know the wisdom behind it.

· This narration is also an example of how a responsible person tries to clarify and do away with any misunderstandings that people may have about matters of faith. The people had recently left their unbelief and polytheism, so ʿUmar wanted to make it clear that kissing the Black Stone is by no means done as an act of devotion to it, as people used to do with their stone idols.

Adapted from Ibn Ḥajr, Fatḥ Al-Bārī, and other ḥadīth commentaries.

Please bring another lie!

Rashduct4luv:


Theological goof right! OK. Now lets see the real theological goofs!

Why are the Bible reports of Mathew, Mark, Luke & John all different in narrating the same story?

And the differences are big in most cases and i would mention instances.

Four people writing the same story in the company of the holy spirit....theological goof or blatant forgery?

Who forged who?

In every case of forgery, there is an original standard. Four people wrote the same story each from their own perspective.
They ALL agree on the:
Centrality and Divinity of Christ
Birth of Christ
Arrest of Christ
Crucifixion of Christ
Death and Resurrection of Christ

AND Islam come 600 years later to rewrite HISTORY!

For your Information and correction, the Bible was Inspired and not Dictated like the Qur'an!

Good morning

Rashduct4luv:


Theological goof right! OK. Now lets see the real theological goofs!

Why are the Bible reports of Mathew, Mark, Luke & John all different in narrating the same story?

And the differences are big in most cases and i would mention instances.

Four people writing the same story in the company of the holy spirit....theological goof or blatant forgery?

Who forged who?

In every case of forgery, there is an original standard. Four people wrote the same story each from their own perspective.
They ALL agree on the:
Centrality and Divinity of Christ
Birth of Christ
Arrest of Christ
Crucifixion of Christ
Death and Resurrection of Christ

AND Islam come 600 years later to rewrite HISTORY!

For your Information and correction, the Bible was Inspired and not Dictated like the Qur'an!

Rashduct4luv:



How many People in the Bible made human sacrifices to God?

I never mentioned human sacrifice!

Rashduct4luv:


Al-Bukhārī reports that ʿUmar – Allāh be pleased with him – came to the Black Stone (performing ṭawāf, circumambulation), kissed it, and said, “I know that you are a stone, you do not cause benefit or harm; and if it were not that I had seen Allāh’s Messenger – peace and blessings of Allāh be upon him – kiss you, I would never have kissed you.”

Al-Bukhārī, Al-Ṣaḥīḥ, Chapter on what has been said about the Black Stone.

Points to note

· The illustrious Companion and Caliph ʿUmar reminded us in this narration of the pure belief that benefit and harm are not caused by created objects and thus should not be sought from them. Only Allāh has control over these things.

· We are reminded that acts of worship are taken from Allāh’s Messenger, and a person is not supposed to make up his own way of worship, he must follow the manner of worship that the Prophet taught and practiced.

· We also learn that once an action is confirmed in the Sunnah, the believer submits and complies and practices it because it is confirmed that Allāh’s Messenger did it, even if we don’t know the wisdom behind it.

· This narration is also an example of how a responsible person tries to clarify and do away with any misunderstandings that people may have about matters of faith. The people had recently left their unbelief and polytheism, so ʿUmar wanted to make it clear that kissing the Black Stone is by no means done as an act of devotion to it, as people used to do with their stone idols.

Adapted from Ibn Ḥajr, Fatḥ Al-Bārī, and other ḥadīth commentaries.

Please bring another lie!

do you know that Muhammad say touching of the black stone is the purification of sins ?

Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 959:
The Messenger of Allah (peace
and blessings of Allah be upon
him) says: “Touching them both
(the Black Stone and al-Rukn al-
Yamani) is an expiation for
sins.”

is this not an act of worship ?


Sahih Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number
23:
Narrated By ‘Asim bin Sulaiman:
I asked Anas bin Malik about
Safa and Marwa (i.e. two
mountains at Mecca). Anas
replied, “We used to consider
( i.e. going around ) them a
custom of the Pre-Islamic period
of Ignorance, so when Islam
came, we gave up going around
them . Then Allah revealed,
‘Verily, Safa and Marwa ( i.e. two
mountains at Mecca) are among
the Symbols of Allah. So it is not
harmful of those who perform
the Hajj of the House of Allah or
perform the Umra to ambulate
(Tawaf) between them.’” (Surah
2:158)

how come what is sacrad to the pagan become the symbol of Allah ?

shadeyinka:

There are some "I don't know" that is sincerely NOT evasive and there are some "I don't know" that are EVASIVE!

Yours is a case of evasive answer: and the reason is simple.
There are just two possible answers to the Question.
1. Jesus was taken away in secret OR
2. Jesus was taken away in the presence of some Disciples

Unfortunately, either option is a serious INDICTMENT to Islam because neither of the two possible possibilities are defendable!

The best you can thus do is to maintain a NEUTRALITY from either what the almighty Allah did OR the statement of the Qur'an!

You have also seen the problems created by your fellow traditional Muslims who have attempted to clarify the event but ends up committing theological goofs!

Your position is understandable, it's the way any intelligent person would react.

But then, the Question is do we accept a scripture as valid just because we are told "it is scripture"?

There is no real bases to accept the Qur'ans version over that of the Bible UNLESS we are willing to ask the Critical Questions.

Come to think of it, how does one determine that a particular currency is FAKE!?

You see your life . You're still bragging over trivialities. You aren't looking for the truth but what you wanna here

sagenaija:

You're right.
None of these guys has answered any question on topic.

And interestingly after a few pages they'll claim "we have refuted you!" Or "your question has been answered way back, check"

Islam makes them not to think logically. That's one way Allah has succeeded with them. That is why they would rather choose a caravan raider, pedophile, muderer, wife snatched and psychopath over a sinless, righteous and benevolent one.

That is why the worst of sin in the life of their prophet is ok. His moral standards is no big deal. After all, he is a prophet. Thats all that matters. Allah even made sure the moral standards he required for Mohamed is lower than that for the ordinary Moslem. What an irony!

The prophet is always right. Some of them will even claim he never had any sin until you point to them portions calling for the forgiveness if his sins.

You'll be bedridden with hate and die a hater. It's this kind of silly disposition from you and your maladjusted brain that will make you die a hate-filled, contempt-ridden ignoramus.

malvisguy212:
so Allah waited 600years before sending Muhammad to correct their misconception ? Those who died Prior to the coming of muhammed to clear this out , who's gonna take the blame for their unbelief ? Allah for tricking the Jews or satan ?

The main problem you Christians have got is you actually do but know God. I doubt if there's a statement like "if you don't know me how I can you worship me". May be the biblical documentation passed to you is inadequate, or your money-driven pastors are riding like animals

shadeyinka:

You can't answer the question simply because it reveals the "illogicality" of your position.

You've been banding around the words illogicality, logic... And you still don't know what they mean . I pity you gan, Bros.

sagenaija:

Let's see who the olodo is. Answer this question: where did I infer ANY of the things you wrote up there? Show me. Or you'll again expose yourself as the dumb one.

If you actually knew you and your lot would not be here shamelessly asking ridiculous questions in the guise of vetting Allah's words. Awon olodo rapata

shadeyinka:

If their Allah can decieve Mary, the Apostles and the other Disciples of Jesus; you wonder if Allah deception of the Muslims have not been a total success!

It still baffles me how you deliberately choose to walk in ignorance. Aah!!

Rashduct4luv:


Al-Bukhārī reports that ʿUmar – Allāh be pleased with him – came to the Black Stone (performing ṭawāf, circumambulation), kissed it, and said, “I know that you are a stone, you do not cause benefit or harm; and if it were not that I had seen Allāh’s Messenger – peace and blessings of Allāh be upon him – kiss you, I would never have kissed you.”

Al-Bukhārī, Al-Ṣaḥīḥ, Chapter on what has been said about the Black Stone.

Points to note

· The illustrious Companion and Caliph ʿUmar reminded us in this narration of the pure belief that benefit and harm are not caused by created objects and thus should not be sought from them. Only Allāh has control over these things.

· We are reminded that acts of worship are taken from Allāh’s Messenger, and a person is not supposed to make up his own way of worship, he must follow the manner of worship that the Prophet taught and practiced.

· We also learn that once an action is confirmed in the Sunnah, the believer submits and complies and practices it because it is confirmed that Allāh’s Messenger did it, even if we don’t know the wisdom behind it.

· This narration is also an example of how a responsible person tries to clarify and do away with any misunderstandings that people may have about matters of faith. The people had recently left their unbelief and polytheism, so ʿUmar wanted to make it clear that kissing the Black Stone is by no means done as an act of devotion to it, as people used to do with their stone idols.

Adapted from Ibn Ḥajr, Fatḥ Al-Bārī, and other ḥadīth commentaries.

Please bring another lie!

Dem no go see the emboldened in their own Bukhari.

Rashduct4luv:


Al-Bukhārī reports that ʿUmar – Allāh be pleased with him – came to the Black Stone (performing ṭawāf, circumambulation), kissed it, and said, “I know that you are a stone, you do not cause benefit or harm; and if it were not that I had seen Allāh’s Messenger – peace and blessings of Allāh be upon him – kiss you, I would never have kissed you.”


Please bring another lie!

malvisguy212:
do you know that Muhammad say touching of the black stone is the purification of sins ?

Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 959:
The Messenger of Allah (peace
and blessings of Allah be upon
him) says: “Touching them both
(the Black Stone and al-Rukn al-
Yamani) is an expiation for
sins.”

is this not an act of worship ?


Sahih Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number
23:
Narrated By ‘Asim bin Sulaiman:
I asked Anas bin Malik about
Safa and Marwa (i.e. two
mountains at Mecca). Anas
replied, “We used to consider
( i.e. going around ) them a
custom of the Pre-Islamic period
of Ignorance, so when Islam
came, we gave up going around
them . Then Allah revealed,
‘Verily, Safa and Marwa ( i.e. two
mountains at Mecca) are among
the Symbols of Allah. So it is not
harmful of those who perform
the Hajj of the House of Allah or
perform the Umra to ambulate
(Tawaf) between them.’” (Surah
2:158)

how come what is sacrad to the pagan become the symbol of Allah ?

Why are you shifting goalpost again? Abi you no see the emboldened? At least now, you should see why I called you people olodo rapata

aadoiza:

You've been banding around the words illogicality, logic... And you still don't know what they mean . I pity you gan, Bros.

If you understand a little English language, you'll understand what the expression in the quotation mark " " mean!

aadoiza:

The main problem you Christians have got is you actually do but know God. I doubt if there's a statement like "if you don't know me how I can you worship me". May be the biblical documentation passed to you is inadequate, or your money-driven pastors are riding like animals

money driven pastor right? that's what I love to here. in few years to come Christianity will be involve in almost 70% of Nigeria employed youth , Christianity will put Nigeria in world map on a Good reason, look at cannan land (living faith) cannan land is like another country, 24 hour electricity and many more . do you know how many youth the church has taken of the street ? just like the book of Genesis say, we will have dominion over the Land, what TB Joshua has done to the poor, NONE of your imam can do it, only to benefit from the government.

aadoiza:



Why are you shifting goalpost again? Abi you no see the emboldened? At least now, you should see why I called you people olodo rapata

the simple question I ask is, how come what is sacred to the pagan has become the symbol of Allah ?

aadoiza:

You see your life . You're still bragging over trivialities. You aren't looking for the truth but what you wanna here

I knew. This is why I was reluctant in the beginning. Now that he has answer he's never satisfied. He lied that he wanted to convert to Islam at 200L but refused to because of his silly question and stupid behavior.

Evangelical CHRISTIANs lie a lot

aadoiza:

It still baffles me how you deliberately choose to walk in ignorance. Aah!!

Can you sincerely explain to my why You think that my statement was in ignorance?

The simple question I posted was:
When Allah took up Jesus to Himself, was in in secret or in the presence of at least one person.

Can't you see that Allah didn't leave a witness: the Qur'an says they follow a conjecture! It was Allah that caused them to ASSUME that it was Jesus that was Crucified and without any explanation!

aadoiza:

You see your life . You're still bragging over trivialities. You aren't looking for the truth but what you wanna here

I think you are the one IGNORING the truth!
FYI there is nothing to brag about.

If the truth is that Jesus wasn't killed, then you should be able to explain HOW?

If you can't explain how Jesus wasn't killed and you can't explain how Allah took him up to heaven (in the presence of the Disciples or in the presence of Nobody). Then, you probably have a lie you want to protect.

Empiree:
I knew. This is why I was reluctant in the beginning. Now that he has answer he's never satisfied. He lied that he wanted to convert to Islam at 200L but refused to because of his silly question and stupid behavior.

Evangelical CHRISTIANs lie a lot

I can only smile at you! How did you know it was a lie that I wanted to convert to Islam!??

Do I need to convince you!?
No! It's not necessary!

shadeyinka:
Good morning

Who forged who?

In every case of forgery, there is an original standard. Four people wrote the same story each from their own perspective.
They ALL agree on the:
Centrality and Divinity of Christ
Birth of Christ
Arrest of Christ
Crucifixion of Christ
Death and Resurrection of Christ

AND Islam come 600 years later to rewrite HISTORY!

For your Information and correction, the Bible was Inspired and not Dictated like the Qur'an!

How much agreement? 100%, 90%, 80%,.....30%, 20%, 10%, 0%.

I'd say 0%. There was no agreement at all. You may bring verses from the 4 books on each options you highlighted!

Rashduct4luv:


How much agreement? 100%, 90%, 80%,.....30%, 20%, 10%, 0%.

I'd say 0%. There was no agreement at all. You may bring verses from the 4 books on each options you highlighted!

LOL!
0% as in the difference between the Qur'an and Chemistry Textbook!
100% as in the difference between copies of the same Textbook!

You say 0%: and you are comfortable with Deliberate LIES!?

There is indeed no agreement at all: that's exactly how satan also want it to be!

shadeyinka:

I think you are the one IGNORING the truth!
FYI there is nothing to brag about.

If the truth is that Jesus wasn't killed, then you should be able to explain HOW?

If you can't explain how Jesus wasn't killed and you can't explain how Allah took him up to heaven (in the presence of the Disciples or in the presence of Nobody). Then, you probably have a lie you want to protect.

Jesus wasn't killed according to Allah SWT period. So if Allah did not explain how he took him up to himself I should go and protect abi?

shadeyinka:

Can you sincerely explain to my why You think that my statement was in ignorance?

The simple question I posted was:
When Allah took up Jesus to Himself, was in in secret or in the presence of at least one person.

Can't you see that Allah didn't leave a witness: the Qur'an says they follow a conjecture! It was Allah that caused them to ASSUME that it was Jesus that was Crucified and without any explanation!

Yes you have chosen to remain ignorant if not, why should you keep ignoring the already provided answers to your question.

Empiree:
I knew. This is why I was reluctant in the beginning. Now that he has answer he's never satisfied. He lied that he wanted to convert to Islam at 200L but refused to because of his silly question and stupid behavior.

Evangelical CHRISTIANs lie a lot

I knew that, for sure. You don ever see me quote any verse from the Quran for these people. I see it as a sheer waste of time for most of these people are deaf, dumb, and blind.

malvisguy212:
the simple question I ask is, how come what is sacred to the pagan has become the symbol of Allah ?

I will continue saying you be olodo, and you should not take it as an offence 'cos you really are. Shey na those your favoured pagans build the stone?

malvisguy212:
money driven pastor right? that's what I love to here. in few years to come Christianity will be involve in almost 70% of Nigeria employed youth , Christianity will put Nigeria in world map on a Good reason, look at cannan land (living faith) cannan land is like another country, 24 hour electricity and many more . do you know how many youth the church has taken of the street ? just like the book of Genesis say, we will have dominion over the Land, what TB Joshua has done to the poor, NONE of your imam can do it, only to benefit from the government.

I can be my life on it that Christianity will never trump the religion of Allah SWT in this country of ours. You don't even know that Christianity has already fallen tey tey, what you have now is a parody, a joke at best.

shadeyinka:

If you understand a little English language, you'll understand what the expression in the quotation mark " " mean!

So you know English but can't get the proper meaning of logic. SMH

aadoiza:

Jesus wasn't killed according to Allah SWT period. So if Allah did not explain how he took him up to himself I should go and protect abi?

aadoiza:

Yes you have chosen to remain ignorant if not, why should you keep ignoring the already provided answers to your question.

You know I have not disputed what the Qur'an said. I have only brought out the implication of the simple question I asked.

If I got you correctly, your answer is that YOU DO NOT KNOW how Allah Removed Jesus Bodily from the Earth. No problem:

But the implication of Allah's action still stand:
There are just two possible answers to the Question.
1. Jesus was taken away in secret OR
2. Jesus was taken away in the presence of some Disciples

Unfortunately, either option is not feasible and contradicts either logics or the nature of Allah and either option is a serious INDICTMENT to Islam because neither of the two possible possibilities are defendable!

The best you can thus do is to maintain a NEUTRALITY from either what the almighty Allah did OR the statement of the Qur'an!

If Jesus wasn't taken to heaven in secret, then some of the Disciples must be aware AND if Jesus was taken to heaven in secret, then non of the disciples are aware. I think this is simple enough, even when you refuse to take a position, it doesn't absolve you of the implication of the problem.

malvisguy212:
do you know that Muhammad say touching of the black stone is the purification of sins ?

Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 959:
The Messenger of Allah (peace
and blessings of Allah be upon
him) says: “Touching them both
(the Black Stone and al-Rukn al-
Yamani) is an expiation for
sins.”

is this not an act of worship ?


Sahih Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number
23:
Narrated By ‘Asim bin Sulaiman:
I asked Anas bin Malik about
Safa and Marwa (i.e. two
mountains at Mecca). Anas
replied, “We used to consider
( i.e. going around ) them a
custom of the Pre-Islamic period
of Ignorance, so when Islam
came, we gave up going around
them . Then Allah revealed,
‘Verily, Safa and Marwa ( i.e. two
mountains at Mecca) are among
the Symbols of Allah. So it is not
harmful of those who perform
the Hajj of the House of Allah or
perform the Umra to ambulate
(Tawaf) between them.’” (Surah
2:158)

how come what is sacrad to the pagan become the symbol of Allah ?

It is Sunnah for men to run between the two markers in sa‘i, because this is what was done by the Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) and the Sahaabah (may Allah be pleased with them) after him. The Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “Learn from me your rituals (of Hajj).” Narrated by Muslim (1297) from Jaabir. Women, however, do not run, because they are required to cover themselves and be modest, and running may expose their bodies and their charms.

The reason why men run between Safa and Marwa – as was mentioned by Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen (may Allah have mercy on him) – is that in this place there was a valley, i.e., a channel for rainwater, and a valley is usually steep and sandy, so it is difficult to walk normally in it, so one has to run. The purpose behind sa‘i is to remember the story of the mother of Ismaa‘eel: when Ibraaheem (peace be upon him) left her (may Allah be pleased with her) and her son in this place, and he left a skin of water and a bag of dates with her; the mother began to eat the dates and drink the water, and she breastfed her son. Then the water and dates ran out, so she became hungry and thirsty, and her milk dried up. The infant became hungry, and began to cry with hunger. She found herself in a difficult position. She saw that the nearest mountain to her was as-Safa, so she went to as-Safa and began to listen out in the hope that she would hear someone, but she heard no one. So she came and headed the other way, towards al-Marwah. When she came down to the bottom of the valley, she could no longer see her son, so she started running fast, until she climbed up so that she could see her son. She climbed up to listen out from al-Marwah, but she did not hear anything. She continued like this until she had done this seven times. Then she heard a sound, but she did not know what it was. Then she saw that Jibreel had come down by Allah’s command, and he struck the ground with his wing or his foot in the place where Zamzam is now…

End quote.

See: ash-Sharh al-Mumti‘ (7/269)

And Allah knows best.

So it is traced by to the Prophet Ibrahim and his family.

aadoiza:

So you know English but can't get the proper meaning of logic. SMH

Clarify please:
Logic or Logics?

English major!