QuietMynd:

In summary, with usa support israel will win while without usa support, egypt will bring her to its kneel. Israel cant fund that kind of war.

Egypt receives a huge amount of aid from the USA as well!!! If both had 0 Aid from the US, Israel would come out tops thanks to their much larger and more advanced defence industry....and their larger economy.

harjorlarh:



very true,i know for a fact a country like ghana or a Cameroon would like see Nigeria fall,but they Wil be shooting themselves in the leg if they ignore an do nothing imagine if Nigeria is invaded and 20 million Nigeria enters ghana or 15 million enters Niger or 3 million enters Togo,moreover if Nigeria falls,west Africa would be destabilized

Sometimes I laugh at what people say in the forum.Why would cameroon wish for nigeria to fall.INstability in Nigeria means instability in the region which won't benefit any country sharing borders with nigeria. It took time for Cameroonian authorities to learn that during the peak of BH by not sitting down, folding their arms and fueling BH with ransom money from kidnapping. We saw waht it means for nigeria and cameroon to walk together and thing more can be done with such collaboration cause both countries have alot to benefit from this. Therefore I don't see why would cameroon benefit with instability in NIgeria .

fabselad:

LOL so egypt won't recieve help it's muslim brothers such as Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and others. BIG LIE.Who provides the funds for Egypt to equip it's self like that, SAUDI ARABIA. Without them Egypt would still be flying F-16s and Mirage-2000s. Yes the US provides funds to Israel but know this with or without Us aid, Israel is still a force to reckon with. You can have sophisticated weaponry but if yoy don't have the know how to use it its as useless as not having it.Why has Egypt not been able to deal with insurgency in the Sinai with all those sophisticated weaponry? When you see the training schemes of the Egyptian military, seriously you have the impression it is a mirror image of the soviet military in the 70s.Heavy, Static, with Officers who can't take initiatives and are not flexible. The Egyptian military still functions with soviet doctorine and know that such doctrine isn't valid in this period. I on't say the Israeli Military is the best but lets be sincere, they have the best Officer corps in the region, well trained and drilled, able to adapt to the battlefield, flexibility and above all battled hardened troops.. One also has to take the other aspects such as forces multipliers like secret gathering. We know the Mossad and the SinBet are the one of the best HUMIT AND SIGNIT organizations in the world and I bet you they have already infiltrated the Egyptian High command and other command and control centers. The Israeli Airforce is second to known in the region and you won't argue that, both in areial warefare and ground support. We saw the what the Egyptian Airforce can do when they attacked Isis in Lybia, they didn't even cause any major damages with their attacks.
Yes war won't be easy to win but lets be sincere Israel would come out Winner though shaken, the Egyptian Military has progressed but they still use doctorines of other generation.Equipments isn't everything in WAREFARE

1. Wealth: The muslim brotherhood are no match to a single usa in term of wealth, if u re opportuned to select an ally out of the two, which one will u choose ? Usa right. Israel have an edge

2. Loyalty: who even see saudi as a loyal ally, those guys re back stabbers, i can remember vivdly when that saudi prince invite the Israel leader Netanyahu to riyadh at a time when the conflict between israel and Palestinian state are at all time high and Palestine badly needs every support it can get from the muslim world. Now, tell me which type of politics is saudi trying to play.
I will rather have a loyal Lesotho as a ally than have a saudi as an ally. Israel have an edge

3. Technology: dnt let me go into details in this part. We already knws the outcome. Now imagine having the usa as an ally, this gives u an abundant technology transfer from the world power and As we already knw that technology is a very important factor in deciding who wins wars. So israel have an edge.

On the issue of doctrine, that have been proved on this platform countless times even by Israel itself that training and experience re different things, u can have the best training in the world and still flop on the battlefield. If it is that easy israel wont suffer massive casualty from hamas when he trys invading them back then which makes her result to air strikes.

ugo4u:

Smiles, in America the Jews have one of the highest number of billionaires not to talk of Europe. Within months their secret agency can raise any amount needed to prosecute a war with her neighbours.

agreed, thats what am trying to prove to the other guy

jln115:
Egypt receives a huge amount of aid from the USA as well!!! If both had 0 Aid from the US, Israel would come out tops thanks to their much larger and more advanced defence industry....and their larger economy.

Comparing the amount of aid egypt received from the usa with that of Israel is like comparing apples to lemon

QuietMynd:


1. Wealth: The muslim brotherhood are no match to a single usa in term of wealth, if u re opportuned to select an ally out of the two, which one will u choose ? Usa right. Israel have an edge

2. Loyalty: who even see saudi as a loyal ally, those guys re back stabbers, i can remember vivdly when that saudi prince invite the Israel leader Netanyahu to riyadh at a time when the conflict between israel and Palestinian state are at all time high and Palestine badly needs every support it can get from the muslim world. Now, tell me which type of politics is saudi trying to play.
I will rather have a loyal Lesotho as a ally than have a saudi as an ally. Israel have an edge

3. Technology: dnt let me go into details in this part. We already knws the outcome. Now imagine having the usa as an ally, this gives u an abundant technology transfer from the world power and As we already knw that technology is a very important factor in deciding who wins wars. So israel have an edge.

On the issue of doctrine, that have been proved on this platform countless times even by Israel itself that training and experience re different things, u can have the best training in the world and still flop on the battlefield. If it is that easy israel wont suffer massive casualty from hamas when he trys invading them back then which makes her result to air strikes.

You said it all

SLBMS:


Oh dear. How is my post off topic?

Read the thread topic again

fabselad:


You said it all

Which still re-enforce my opinion that "with usa support israel will win nd without her support her faith will be determined by egypt.

#COIN

fabselad:


Sometimes I laugh at what people say in the forum.Why would cameroon wish for nigeria to fall.INstability in Nigeria means instability in the region which won't benefit any country sharing borders with nigeria. It took time for Cameroonian authorities to learn that during the peak of BH by not sitting down, folding their arms and fueling BH with ransom money from kidnapping. We saw waht it means for nigeria and cameroon to walk together and thing more can be done with such collaboration cause both countries have alot to benefit from this. Therefore I don't see why would cameroon benefit with instability in NIgeria .

you are forgetting that Cameroon is a French colony,and most of their decisions would be based on the interest of France,France doesn't really give a shit about Nigeria and so Cameroon may not really support us

harjorlarh:


you are forgetting that Cameroon is a French colony,and most of their decisions would be based on the interest of France,France doesn't really give a shit about Nigeria and so Cameroon may not really support us

Seriously, am a cameroonian and when i listen to such it irritates me.President Biya(whom i don't really have any esteem for) is a masterpiece when it comes to politics.Gone are the days he took instructions from France. The presidential and the BIR which are the shield of the presidency are both trained and equiped by the israeli, the secret services are trained by the Russians and Israeli, the military is trained by Cameroonians trained by the Russians or Israeli. The equipemts used by the Cameroonian military are from diverse sources. So please don't think france has any leverage on cameroon again.It might still have some stings it can pull but things have changed.

leave them, all Egypt has to do is offer them something, and these are countries who might harbor ill will against Nigeria anyways.
And like i said before, my scenario doesn't account for geographical distance, so let's say we share borders with Egypt. No such thing as us winning a war against them. Anyways, just a fun discussion, now we move on

bidexiii:




Trust me.they would fold there hands and be watching.....

The moment that man stop being useful to France, his downfall will begin. So as much as i respect what you said, i still think France has massive influence in that Country.

fabselad:


Seriously, am a cameroonian and when i listen to such it irritates me.President Biya(whom i don't really have any esteem for) is a masterpiece when it comes to politics.Gone are the days he took instructions from France. The presidential and the BIR which are the shield of the presidency are both trained and equiped by the israeli, the secret services are trained by the Russians and Israeli, the military is trained by Cameroonians trained by the Russians or Israeli. The equipemts used by the Cameroonian military are from diverse sources. So please don't think france has any leverage on cameroon again.It might still have some stings it can pull but things have changed.

fabselad:


Seriously, am a cameroonian and when i listen to such it irritates me.President Biya(whom i don't really have any esteem for) is a masterpiece when it comes to politics.Gone are the days he took instructions from France. The presidential and the BIR which are the shield of the presidency are both trained and equiped by the israeli, the secret services are trained by the Russians and Israeli, the military is trained by Cameroonians trained by the Russians or Israeli. The equipemts used by the Cameroonian military are from diverse sources. So please don't think france has any leverage on cameroon again.It might still have some stings it can pull but things have changed.

Wow.... so you're a Cameroonian that's interesting.
I respect your opinion a lot but France still has a strong influence in Cameroon and other French speaking states with there military base spread all around these region.
Take it or not? You can't just say there presence means nothing politically/economically and security wise.

#NA

Sizzorkay:
lol, please speak your mind, this i wanna hear lol.
Unless every xxxxxxx have to enlist in the military at a certain age, i think like they do in Israel and South Korea etc, our huge population isn't that much of an advantage lol, unless you want to tie ropes around our necks and force us to fight, most xxxxxxx will bolt, just saying

Let's start with your statement

For any country

If every citizen of a country of a certain age were to enlist how would it help the war effort meaningfully ?

Without a domestic civil military industrial complex is it possible to arm to the new recruits with appropriate weapons of war ?

Even if basic rifles and bullets r provided , is it going to make any substantial impact ?

Given that a enemy possessing land based armour and air based assets will turn it into a turkey shoot or not ?


If I were to persue a conventional conflict , then my first priority vis a vis the civilian population ( which supports the military ) will be to

1. Deny or control food resources
2. Deny or control transport and transportation
3. Deny or control basic life critical support like hospitals etc
4. Deny or control any local industrial capabilities
5. Deny or control active national institutions which can rally the population
6. Deny or control any means of communication / media
7. Deny or control the access to the nation's intelligencia.

Etc

Any country with a huge population will then end up having its huge population as a liability.

I haven't even touched the more relevant points which touch on how to win a fight with fighting a war ( with minimal effort ) as propounded by Chanakya.

The basic essence is to use the population of the country against the very same country. I will keep it short and very basic.

Note : almost all modern day conflicts were basically foreign interventions citing local dissent or facilitated by dissenting locals etc

Chanakya said " whores don't live in the company of poor men , citizens never support a weak king , birds dont built nests on a tree that don't bear fruit. "

The 2nd line is important , not necessarily limited to strong or weak governance but much broader in scope of issues. why did Syria Iraq Libya Pakistan ( 1971 ) etc crumble so fast ?

A nation divided among itself ain't strong. We as general public might put a brave face and proclaim ourselves as patriots and pretend everything is good but only very few have the pragmatism to see the fault lines in our countries as the case maybe.

As far as i can understand , in present day context nationalism is a poor mirror of propaganda and show biz. Unless every citizen has a personal stake in the survivability of his or country, expecting a strong defence is doubtful. It cannot be taken for granted ( as is usually the case ), expecting every citizen to identify with the cause of defending his country unless he has the motivation and reasons to ensure the continuity of the nation in the present state.

I kept it short as promised , atleast it seems to me

There r many ways to break a nation ( or occupy ) preferably by outsourcing and I have not alluded to not even one of them. Every individual country will need a individual case study.

QuietMynd:

Comparing the amount of aid egypt received from the usa with that of Israel is like comparing apples to lemon

not if you compare it as a percentage of what each country spends on defence.

GeneralFarouq:

Pls oo spare the us long reading... U write it scenario they write theirs to make rubbish of urs... Then it goes on ad ifinitum

Sir u will be pleased to note that I kept it short

We are pretty much saying similar things chief.
In my past comment i mentioned how most Nigerians won't even enlist to fight, it was someone else making a point about our huge population being an asset during a war, while i was saying, unless those 200 million Nigerians already have military training, it amounts to nothing.
And you need more than a huge population to fight a war.... Too many complexities
So we might have framed things differently, but that was similar point i was trying to make.

nemesis8u:


Let's start with your statement

For any country

If every citizen of a country of a certain age were to enlist how would it help the war effort meaningfully ?

Without a domestic civil military industrial complex is it possible to arm to the new recruits with appropriate weapons of war ?

Even if basic rifles and bullets r provided , is it going to make any substantial impact ?

Given that a enemy possessing land based armour and air based assets will turn it into a turkey shoot or not ?


If I were to persue a conventional conflict , then my first priority vis a vis the civilian population ( which supports the military ) will be to

1. Deny or control food resources
2. Deny or control transport and transportation
3. Deny or control basic life critical support like hospitals etc
4. Deny or control any local industrial capabilities
5. Deny or control active national institutions which can rally the population
6. Deny or control any means of communication / media
7. Deny or control the access to the nation's intelligencia.

Etc

Any country with a huge population will then end up having its huge population as a liability.

I haven't even touched the more relevant points which touch on how to win a fight with fighting a war ( with minimal effort ) as propounded by Chanakya.

The basic essence is to use the population of the country against the very same country. I will keep it short and very basic.

Note : almost all modern day conflicts were basically foreign interventions citing local dissent or facilitated by dissenting locals etc

Chanakya said " whores don't live in the company of poor men , citizens never support a weak king , birds dont built nests on a tree that don't bear fruit. "

The 2nd line is important , not necessarily limited to strong or weak governance but much broader in scope of issues. why did Syria Iraq Libya Pakistan ( 1971 ) etc crumble so fast ?

A nation divided among itself ain't strong. We as general public might put a brave face and proclaim ourselves as patriots and pretend everything is good but only very few have the pragmatism to see the fault lines in our countries as the case maybe.

As far as i can understand , in present day context nationalism is a poor mirror of propaganda and show biz. Unless every citizen has a personal stake in the survivability of his or country, expecting a strong defence is doubtful. It cannot be taken for granted ( as is usually the case ), expecting every citizen to identify with the cause of defending his country unless he has the motivation and reasons to ensure the continuity of the nation in the present state.

I kept it short as promised , atleast it seems to me

There r many ways to break a nation ( or occupy ) preferably by outsourcing and I have not alluded to not even one of them. Every individual country will need a individual case study.

Sizzorkay:
The moment that man stop being useful to France, his downfall will begin. So as much as i respect what you said, i still think France has massive influence in that Country.

seems like you guys don't know who is Biya lol. that guy knows his game. no french military base is in cameroon, the petroleum sector is no longer in french hands but the israeli this guy told Holland in public "gone are the days we listened to the french and obey". LOL i am no longer in cameroon but sincerely i won't lie the french don't have any leverage in cameroon.

okay, no point debating it, na your country, I suppose you know more than i do

fabselad:
seems like you guys don't know who is Biya lol. that guy knows his game. no french military base is in cameroon, the petroleum sector is no longer in french hands but the israeli this guy told Holland in public "gone are the days we listened to the french and obey". LOL i am no longer in cameroon but sincerely i won't lie the french don't have any leverage in cameroon.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hisDR3D1qgU
out of topic but this guys know their stuff.

Sizzorkay:
okay, no point debating it, na your country, I suppose you know more than i do

LOL i don't like that man but when i think about the gambling he does to remain in power. It amazes me

Sizzorkay:
We are pretty much saying similar things chief.
In my past comment i mentioned how most Nigerians won't even enlist to fight, it was someone else making a point about our huge population being an asset during a war, while i was saying, unless those 200 million Nigerians already have military training, it amounts to nothing.
And you need more than a huge population to fight a war.... Too many complexities
So we might have framed things differently, but that was similar point i was trying to make.

Then no wahala

Also clarification, I wasn't refering to any particular country , my answer was generalized applicable to any country with their own constraints.

If anybody wants a good read , here try this

https://muse.jhu.edu/article/40432

How ancient minds worked on Geo politics , political intrigues and subversion etc

jln115:
Egypt receives a huge amount of aid from the USA as well!!! If both had 0 Aid from the US, Israel would come out tops thanks to their much larger and more advanced defence industry....and their larger economy.

No of PhDs per 1000 , Israel is the highest I think.

fabselad:


Sometimes I laugh at what people say in the forum.Why would cameroon wish for nigeria to fall.INstability in Nigeria means instability in the region which won't benefit any country sharing borders with nigeria. It took time for Cameroonian authorities to learn that during the peak of BH by not sitting down, folding their arms and fueling BH with ransom money from kidnapping. We saw waht it means for nigeria and cameroon to walk together and thing more can be done with such collaboration cause both countries have alot to benefit from this. Therefore I don't see why would cameroon benefit with instability in NIgeria .

I’m sure the following is on many minds here but I’ll declare it anyway: it would make more sense to suppose that mutually assuerd destruction should have militated against Russia pressing ahead with Nuclear weapons manufacture after America demonstrated hers. Or even both sides maintaining stockpiles given that this imperil world existence. And don’t think for one minute that should one side slip defences and achieve first strike that the other side would capitulate in order to forestall the end of the world.

fabselad:


Seriously, am a cameroonian and when i listen to such it irritates me.President Biya(whom i don't really have any esteem for) is a masterpiece when it comes to politics.Gone are the days he took instructions from France. The presidential and the BIR which are the shield of the presidency are both trained and equiped by the israeli, the secret services are trained by the Russians and Israeli, the military is trained by Cameroonians trained by the Russians or Israeli. The equipemts used by the Cameroonian military are from diverse sources. So please don't think france has any leverage on cameroon again.It might still have some stings it can pull but things have changed.

OK let's agree to disagree

jln115:
not if you compare it as a percentage of what each country spends on defence.

I dont remember egypt pegging the amount they must spend on their military.
Let war comes first nd see whether those figures wont inflate.

QuietMynd:

I dont remember egypt pegging the amount they must spend on their military.
Let war comes first nd see whether those figures wont exacerbate.

in that case Israel as the advantage since it has a bigger economy and bigger more advanced defence industry.... With or without the USA Israel is still on top... Although only marginally.

Israel has a bigger economy? Than Egypt? Lol, since when, Israel is like number 51 or 50, globally, while Nigeria is about 22 and Egypt 21.
Unless i searched wrong. So no, they don't have a bigger economy, not even close
Edit*
GDP per capital, yes Israel is up.
GDP based on PPP, Israel is way down

jln115:
in that case Israel as the advantage since it has a bigger economy and bigger more advanced defence industry.... With or without the USA Israel is still on top... Although only marginally.

PRESS RELEASE

SOLDIERS RAID BANDITS HIDEOUT, Kill two, Recover 2 AK 47 Rifles & Ammunition

Following credible intelligence from a good Samaritan, a patrol team of 1 Division Nigerian Army (NA), at about 0430 hours (am) of today, Wednesday the 8th of May 2019, raided a bandits' den at Gonan Bature East of Rijana and Kasarami farm house in Chikun Local Government Area of Kaduna State. The abondoned Kasarami farm house was reportedly forcefully occupied by criminals and had been used as a shelter and a place where victims of kidnapping were kept.

During the raid operation, contact was made with the hoodlums with fierce exchange of fire that led to the extermination of two bandits and the recovery of the following items:
a. 2 x AK 47 Rifles
b. 2 x AK 47 Magazines
c. 51 rounds of 7.62 mm Special ammunition
d. 2 x techno cell phone

The Nigerian Army is committed and determined to protecting life and property of all Nigerians, use this medium to thank the good Samaritan for providing the information that resulted in the successful raid operation. NA will continue to sensitize and also request members of the public to support it and other security agencies in their efforts to checkmate terrorism, banditry and other assorted crimes in Nigeria, by providing credible information about the hideouts and movements of suspicious persons in their respective communities.

SAGIR MUSA
Colonel
Acting Director Army Public Relations
8 May 2019

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