.

Pastor Lala your attention is needed here

JohnnyOhJohn:
Let me make use an example first;
Is it right to judge my neighbor's children for the sins of their father... No right?


So why are we judged for the sins Adam and Eve

I think we all deserve a chance to stay in the garden of eden too... And anyone that eats from the tree of knowledge should pay for it alone

To be honest.. I still don't know why we were created in the first place,,, as in can't we just stay up there in Heaven and worship God

I need direct and logical answers please, don't beat around the bush... Thank you

Cc. Ihedinobi3, NnennaG6, Shadeyinka, Jesusjnr et al

Come help this man out...

stay in heaven and worship God? That'll be very boring.

[img]https://media1./images/12ab723927bfb71ebd2b9a98f0694757/tenor.gif?itemid=11806135[/img]

alBHAGDADI show face abeg

That's why the Word of God which man disobeyed in the beginning became flesh and dwelt among us.

To give the children of Adam the opportunity to do what man didn't do in the beginning; make the right choice and obey it!

JohnnyOhJohn:
Let me make use an example first;
Is it right to judge my neighbor's children for the sins of their father... No right?


So why are we judged for the sins Adam and Eve

I think we all deserve a chance to stay in the garden of eden too... And anyone that eats from the tree of knowledge should pay for it alone

To be honest.. I still don't know why we were created in the first place,,, as in can't we just stay up there in Heaven and worship God

I need direct and logical answers please, don't beat around the bush... Thank you

Good question John though the Garden of Eden couldn't have been in heaven since they were told to "multiply and fill the earth" et al, and note that nowhere were Adam and Eve told to "worship God".

Also, think. How can it be bad to eat of the fruits of the tree of knowledge? Can a tree of knowledge be poisonous? Can a God really intend its creations not be nourished by the most important fruit in his garden?

I've not answered you, note. Just extremely delighted you created this thread asking Who wrote that story and what was their intention!

TVSA:
stay in heaven and worship God? That'll be very boring.

���
You think so?

jesusjnr:
That's why the Word of God which man disobeyed in the beginning became flesh and dwelt among us.

To give the children of Adam the opportunity to do what man didn't do in the beginning; make the right choice and obey it!

I don't think your answer was straight forward but thanks anyway

JohnnyOhJohn:


I don't think your answer was straight forward but thanks anyway

You're welcomed bro.

Well it depends on the kind of answer that you seek, for Adam and Eve were yet seeking for (other) answers despite that God had giving them the true answer.

And they got the kind of answer they were seeking and today we're here still suffering from the consequences of the answers that they chose to believe at the expense of that which God had given them, that you had to ask for an answer in that respect.

So it depends on the kind of answer you seek, but if the truth, I believe that's what I had given you.

God bless.

Let me park here, lol.

JohnnyOhJohn:
Let me make use of an example first;
Is it right to judge my neighbor's children for the sins of their father... No right?


So why are we judged for the sins of Adam and Eve

I think we all deserve a chance to stay in the garden of eden too... And anyone that eats from the tree of knowledge should pay for it alone

To be honest.. I still don't know why we were created in the first place,,, as in can't we just stay up there in Heaven and worship God


And if it is true that God's creations are perfect, why wasn't Adam and Eve perfect?... Why did they fall for lucify that isn't perfect too... Why I'm I doubting the whole story if I'm perfect


I need direct and logical answers please, don't beat around the bush... Thank you

Do you know that if you died a toddler, before the age of accountability, the sins of Eden won't condemn you? Why?

a).because Children are born blank, they don't know who they are until they are told.

b) They can't believe. they wouldn't know what to believe.

c). They don't understand the mystery of redemption

D). because, no one is born a Christian. You grow up, get taught, understand and then choose. From your choices you get to answer.

Do you know that you stand to answer for the things YOU did with your body here on earth, not even what another person made you do?

Do you know that what gets you rejected at heavens gate is your rejection of Jesus' gift of eternal life, not even the lying, stealing, fornication and the people you kill everyday both physically and in your intentions?

Do you also know that this your complaining is very unnecessary because the gift of life is still stretched out before your face now?

budaatum:

Good question John though the Garden of Eden couldn't have been in heaven since they were told to "multiply and fill the earth" et al, and note that nowhere were Adam and Eve told to "worship God".

Also, think. How can it be bad to eat of the fruits of the tree of knowledge? Can a tree of knowledge be poisonous? Can a God really intend its creations not be nourished by the most important fruit in his garden?

I've not answered you, note. Just extremely delighted you created this thread asking Who wrote that story and what was their intention!

Budaatum, what is worship?

JohnnyOhJohn:

���
You think so?

I'm only joking. But, did we come from heaven? is there a baby factory in heaven where God distribute babies to people?

JohnnyOhJohn:
Let me make use of an example first;
Is it right to judge my neighbor's children for the sins of their father... No right?

Since you need ONLY answers. I will give you as long as it wouldn't result into endless arguments. I'm busy now: towards evening.

Very good questions.

Shepherd00:

Budaatum, what is worship?

Worship, for me, is doing the will of my Father in heaven, which is loving you as much as I love myself, and multiplying and filling the earth et al.

JohnnyOhJohn:
Let me make use of an example first;
Is it right to judge my neighbor's children for the sins of their father... No right?

Your example is faulty.

It should be this way,
If your neighbor has a cloth soaked with a blood of human and your neighbor's children keep putting on the cloth, will you arrest them?

Majority of you don't even know the meaning of Adam's fall and why we share in his sin.

So why are we judged for the sins of Adam and Eve

because they gave us the soak blood of cloth we put on

I think we all deserve a chance to stay in the garden of eden too... And anyone that eats from the tree of knowledge should pay for it alone

Yes! But only if our soak blood of cloth can be removed.

Which is either God destroyed all of us and create another set of people or we have privilege to remove our soak blood of cloth.

To be honest.. I still don't know why we were created in the first place,,, as in can't we just stay up there in Heaven and worship God

We were created to have dominion over the earth

And if it is true that God's creations are perfect, why wasn't Adam and Eve perfect?... Why did they fall for lucify that isn't perfect too... Why I'm I doubting the whole story if I'm perfect

Save for another time

Emusan:



We were created to have dominion over the earth

Bro who needs dominion and power over the earth... I would prefer to be a slave in Heaven (if there is anything like that) than to have dominion, power and whatsoever over the earth

Emusan:





because they gave us the soak blood of cloth we put on



Yes! But only if our soak blood of cloth can be removed.

Again I'm begging for clear answers, not parables or idioms

JohnnyOhJohn:
Let me make use of an example first;
Is it right to judge my neighbor's children for the sins of their father... No right?

I'd like to admit I may sound ludicrous or unreasonable but it's just a shot at giving answers to the trickiest chapters in the bible.
I'd like to state that I personally feel that the chapters in genesis before the introduction of Abram lacked careful and intelligent writing which had to be compensated for in later books.

So why are we judged for the sins of Adam and Eve

According to genesis eating of tree of the knowledge of good and evil promoted man to the level of a god. Therefore being able to consciously differentiate between good and evil which is a trait that could be passed on to future generations is what makes man sinful. Now God doesn't like acts that are sinful. This got man and lucifer kicked out of their comfort zones. Adam and eve becoming aware of their unclothedness shows the limitations man had before eating said fruit. Defining these limitations would be the key to understanding why eve ate the fruit knowing fully well she wasn't supposed to.

I think we all deserve a chance to stay in the garden of eden too... And anyone that eats from the tree of knowledge should pay for it alone

Not quite. Now God wasn't planning on creating what he's created all over again. That's why he made them male and female for reproduction. So any other humans that could have existed had to come from the first man and woman.

To be honest.. I still don't know why we were created in the first place,,, as in can't we just stay up there in Heaven and worship God

Man wasn't created to worship God in the garden of eden but to manage it. You should see the garden of eden as an expression of God's creativity.

And if it is true that God's creations are perfect, why wasn't Adam and Eve perfect?...

Measuring perfection requires the ability to,which i think wasn't part of man in the beginning.

budaatum:

Worship, for me, is doing the will of my Father in heaven, which is loving you as much as I love myself, and multiplying and filling the earth et al.

Okay, why then did you say God never asked Adam and Eve to worship Him?

Why were we created if not to worship and serve Jehovah?

JohnnyOhJohn:

Again I'm begging for clear answers, not parables or idioms

That's the problem with you people...

If your neighbor killed and his clothes was soaked with blood, and your neighbor's children put on the cloth, will you arrest them or not?

This is to buttress the example you gave, nothing is parable or idiomatic here.

Shepherd00:

Okay, why then did you say God never asked Adam and Eve to worship Him?

Why were we created if not to worship and serve Jehovah?

God never asked Adam and Eve to worship Him, but specifically to “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

God does not need your worship (singing praises) or serving (paying tithes) apart from as [url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+25%3A40-45&version=NIV;KJV]Christ said[/url] with his, "whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me."

You must know how difficult it is to serve the Lord by "doing for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine" and [url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+6%3A27-36&version=NIV]Loving your enemies[/url], doing good to those who hate you, blessing those who curse you, praying for those who mistreat you, turning the other cheek to those who slap you, giving your shirt to those who take your coat and to everyone who asks of you to not demand back and to do unto them as you would have them do unto to you.

It's to do with the meaning of words however. If you define worship as I have I have no problem. One can sing hosanna Aleluya amen all day long but if one does not "do my will" and "love your neighbour", one 'worships' in vain and will not dwell in the Tabernacle of the Lord but be told to "Depart from me, all you workers of iniquity."

XxSabrinaxX:

Cc. Ihedinobi3, NnennaG6, Shadeyinka, Jesusjnr et al

Come help this man out...

JohnnyOhJohn:
Let me make use of an example first;
Is it right to judge my neighbor's children for the sins of their father... No right?


So why are we judged for the sins of Adam and Eve

I think we all deserve a chance to stay in the garden of eden too... And anyone that eats from the tree of knowledge should pay for it alone

To be honest.. I still don't know why we were created in the first place,,, as in can't we just stay up there in Heaven and worship God


And if it is true that God's creations are perfect, why wasn't Adam and Eve perfect?... Why did they fall for lucify that isn't perfect too... Why I'm I doubting the whole story if I'm perfect

I need direct and logical answers please, don't beat around the bush... Thank you

Cc
Lalasticlala
Ishilove
Semid4lyfe
Obinoscopy

Is it right to judge my neighbor's children for the sins of their father... No right?
God made everything and established laws on which things operate. Without the laws, everything will be a mess. There are physical laws: gravity, reflection, action and reaction, conservation of energy etc. There are chemical laws: entropy, chemical bonding, etc, there are biological laws and there are Spiritual Laws.

If a woman caught HIV or had rubella, can her children suffer for the sins of the mother? If a mother care about not infecting her unborn child, then she would do her best not to even get infected in the first place.

God created Adam and Eve, and gave them an instruction not to seek total independence from Him ( tree of knowledge of Good and Evil) for on the day they try it they shall die ( spiritually cut off from God). Now, when Adam was created, God put into Adam His Spirit (DNA) and Adam became super human (child of God). Now Adam and Eve broke the Spiritual Law and hence became Spiritually Disconnected (Spiritually died) from God. Instead, he caught a Virus ( Sin Nature).

God chased them out of Eden. And the Virus infested Adam and Eve gave birth to children who inherited the virus of sin that produced Sin Nature.

There are consequences for breaking any laws of creation.


Is it right to judge my neighbor's children for the sins of their father... No right?

No children in hell even though they have the virus but due to their age, it has not yet started to produce Sin. Everyone will face the consequence of their Sin.

So why are we judged for the sins of Adam and Eve
No one judges you for the sin of Adam and Eve. You are judged for your sin.

Even as a child you are given a conscience to guide you until you by yourself kill/silence your conscience.

I think we all deserve a chance to stay in the garden of eden too... And anyone that eats from the tree of knowledge should pay for it alone

The tree of the Knowledge of Good an Evil was a necessary seed planted by God Himself to FILTER out of His human creation those who in spite of great odds CHOOSE to live their lives to Honour God and be Help and source of Love to their generation.


To be honest.. I still don't know why we were created in the first place,,, as in can't we just stay up there in Heaven and worship God

God doesn't need your worship.!
God created the world as a park (a place to enjoy himself) with human being whom He had elevated to be "mini gods" like He is God. The universe was created for God's pleasure and Nothing else.

Why are you created?
To be Gods representative with free will to serve or not to serve.
Those who would Love God and serve Him are separated from those who wouldn't. Our principal duty on earth is to Love God and Man, Multiply Godly People on earth (preaching/teaching) and serve the other Children of God.


And if it is true that God's creations are perfect, why wasn't Adam and Eve perfect?... Why did they fall for lucify that isn't perfect too... Why I'm I doubting the whole story if I'm perfect
Adam and Eve were perfect (pure, sinless). They even reflected Gods glory as their covering.

BUT

They were also created as free beings with independent Volition. Man had a WILL and ability to CHOOSE or not.


They fell because they believed Lucifer more than God.
They were swindled of their estate through greed.. To be like God, knowing everything to be independent of God. The only thing is that Lucifer did not tell them that they would become his SUBJECT (Slave). He didn't tell them that they would be owned by him.

You want direct, logical answers, here they are!

shadeyinka:





They were also created as free beings with independent Volition. Man had a WILL and ability to CHOOSE or not.



You want direct, logical answers, here they are!

When God gave them the ability to chose between good and evil, was He really expecting them to choose "evil"... If you asked me, I would prefer that we are not giving a choice at all in the first place

shadeyinka:




They fell because they believed Lucifer more than God.
They were swindled of their estate through greed.. To be like God, knowing everything to be independent of God. The only thing is that Lucifer did not tell them that they would become his SUBJECT (Slave). He didn't tell them that they would be owned by him.

You want direct, logical answers, here they are!

What was the devil doing in the garden of eden in the first place... Where we created to cohabit with the devil? I guess your answer would be no, so why are was the devil sent to the same place that God put Adam and Eve, something was surely going to happen with that

Emusan:


That's the problem with you people...

If your neighbor killed and his clothes was soaked with blood, and your neighbor's children put on the cloth, will you arrest them or not?

This is to buttress the example you gave, nothing is parable or idiomatic here.

Why will you arrest children for wearing bloody clothes? Instead you'll first check if the blood is theirs or not, before investigating where it came from. This your example simply doesn't work.

JohnnyOhJohn:

What was the devil doing in the garden of eden in the first place... Where we created to cohabit with the devil? I guess your answer would be no, so why are was the devil sent to the same place that God put Adam and Eve, something was surely going to happen with that

The devil is a free being just like Adam and Eve. He was thrown out of Heaven when he declared his independence ( knowledge of everything,) from God. And he came to wreck havoc on the creations who God loves so much that He put His Spirit into them.

An angel is a spirit being who can be anywhere he chooses to be in the physical realm. Lucifer came to the earth To own man. Like a 419 person to decieve and Rob man of their glory.

Your next question:
Could God not have prevented Lucifer from deciever mam?
Yes but God didn't. Because the ultimate aim of God is that man's free will and Volition be tested AND that a selection be made of the trait of man God want.

God doesn't want Robots: God want free Loving and Loyal beings

JohnnyOhJohn:

When God gave them the ability to chose between good and evil, was He really expecting them to choose "evil"... If you asked me, I would prefer that we are not giving a choice at all in the first place

But God doesn't want Zombies or Robots: God want independent and free beings who would be called His children

LordReed:


Why will you arrest children for wearing bloody clothes? Instead you'll first check if the blood is theirs or not, before investigating where it came from. This your example simply doesn't work.

Then you don't understand the example.

Let me give you an illustration:
You are an inventor and you invent cars. Now, there are two kinds cars you can invent
1. The manual car:
It has no say, you drive it to wherever you want. It has no choice but to obey you.
2. The Intelligent Autonomous Car:
This car is built to converse intelligently with you, have its own independent mind but still serve you.

Which of this car will give you more JOY!

Suppose this Intelligent Autonomous car refuses to carry you around and Declares it's independence from you, would you keep on filling it's fuel tank with fuel?

So it mean one day, this Intelligent Autonomous car will stop functioning (Dead). Would it matter to you if this useless but expensive car be thrown into the scrap yard?

JohnnyOhJohn:

When God gave them the ability to chose between good and evil, was He really expecting them to choose "evil"... If you asked me, I would prefer that we are not giving a choice at all in the first place

JohnnyOhJohn:

When God gave them the ability to chose between good and evil, was He really expecting them to choose "evil"... If you asked me, I would prefer that we are not giving a choice at all in the first place

I hope this analogy will help you see that we were created to serve God willingly. We are to be like Intelligent and autonomous Children of God who makes Him happy. We could choose to be dependent on Him or to be independent from Him. God respects our choices.

There is however a consequence of our actions and activities!