budaatum:

God never asked Adam and Eve to worship Him, but specifically to Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

That is why I asked you what Worship means. Worship is obeying God. If Adam had remained Obedient to God by not taking it upon Him to infringe on the Sovereignty Of God, he would have done the Will of God including the Children that he later had from which we all find ourselves here.

Worship is not only singing and dancing and bowing down before Him. It is everything we do as commanded by God. Our relationship with others is worship to God. Our living in peace with each other, giving to each other and looking out for each other is worship.

budaatum:

God does not need your worship (singing praises) or serving (paying tithes) apart from as [url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+25%3A40-45&version=NIV;KJV]Christ said[/url] with his, "whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me."

God does not need my worship? Really? Are we talking about Jehovah here? because Jehovah demands our worship and frowns more than any thing if we worship other gods.

Why are we even created if not to worship and serve Him?

For forgive to mention that before you do to the least of Is brethren, you'd have to Love Him with all your Heart, Mind and might. and all of that is worship to Him.

budaatum:

You must know how difficult it is to serve the Lord by "doing for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine" and [url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+6%3A27-36&version=NIV]Loving your enemies[/url], doing good to those who hate you, blessing those who curse you, praying for those who mistreat you, turning the other cheek to those who slap you, giving your shirt to those who take your coat and to everyone who asks of you to not demand back and to do unto

If you obey God by doing all of these, Buda, this is worship. Worship does not take place exclusively inside a building called a Church.

budaatum:

It's to do with the meaning of words however. If you define worship as I have I have no problem. One can sing hosanna Aleluya amen all day long but if one does not "do my will" and "love your neighbour", one 'worships' in vain and will not dwell in the Tabernacle of the Lord but be told to "Depart from me, all you workers of iniquity."

I think you still need to really know what Worship means.

Emusan:


Then you don't understand the example.

What don't I understand?

JohnnyOhJohn:

Bro who needs dominion and power over the earth... I would prefer to be a slave in Heaven (if there is anything like that) than to have dominion, power and whatsoever over the earth

But, the opportunity is offered to you to be a prince in heaven, why do you want to be a slave though?

JohnnyOhJohn:

When God gave them the ability to chose between good and evil, was He really expecting them to choose "evil"... If you asked me, I would prefer that we are not giving a choice at all in the first place

In other Words, you prefer to be a robot?

Shepherd00:

Worship is not only singing and dancing and bowing down before Him. It is everything we do as commanded by God. Our relationship with others is worship to God. Our living in peace with each other, giving to each other and looking out for each other is worship.

Seems we are in agreement with what I've been saying all along!

Shepherd00:
God does not need my worship?

And then you go and ask this silly question Shepherd!

If God needs to be worshipped by you "Being fruitful and increasing in number, and filling the earth and subduing it, and ruling over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground, would you, Shepherd, if you have any sense, not even be begging God to please let you worship God?

Shepherd00:

In other Words, you prefer to be a robot?

As long as it makes me do the will of God without temptations. And you that Heaven is guaranteed this way and that's the most important thing...

Shepherd00:

But, the opportunity is offered to you to be a prince in heaven, why do you want to be a slave though?

Slave to God, isn't that normal

JohnnyOhJohn:
Slave to God, isn't that normal

You'd rather reign in hell? You believe that possibility?

JohnnyOhJohn:

As long as it makes me do the will of God without temptations. And you that Heaven is guaranteed this way and that's the most important thing...

What will you be doing in heaven as a robot?

JohnnyOhJohn:
Let me make use of an example first;
Is it right to judge my neighbor's children for the sins of their father... No right?

Really it depends. Like if they are in your school, and their parents misbehave or don't pay their fees. The children will likely be denied education. Love it or hate it, the REALITY is that we live in a world where people are connected. You may get favour because of your dad or even late relative, and vice versa. So, in life, it's not always a straightforward yes or no. There's that undeniable like father like child, "oga pikin" angle. Like someone already explained, the world is built in a way where we inherit somethings from our parents, eg money, looks, genes, traits, and sometimes problems. It's a reality you should not look away from simply because you think it's fair or unfair.

So why are we judged for the sins of Adam and Eve

We're not judged for anyone's sins but for our own. Someone already explained that on the thread, i think i read it while skimming the thread. Other people's careless and good behaviour can affect us e.g good or bad governance, that noisy classmate that gets the whole class in trouble, that careless neighbour that burnt the whole building including certificates. That's life. You can't say it's not right, therefore i don't believe God. That's senseless and unrealistic, typical of the foolish atheist. You deal with, adapt adjust, align, and maybe redirect reality.

I think we all deserve a chance to stay in the garden of eden too... And anyone that eats from the tree of knowledge should pay for it alone

We are all in our own garden and failing, for all have sinned and come short. Many of us have done and are doing worse than Adam. Sin is coming short of God's standard, and like Adam, we all come short. But we have people who have passed and done very well, outside Eden. We all can. God gives us the power of the sons of God.

To be honest.. I still don't know why we were created in the first place,,, as in can't we just stay up there in Heaven and worship God

The devil was in heaven before the fall. Jesus came on earth and pleased God. The heroes of faith and great cloud of witnesses please God here in earth. We're here to make His will done in earth as it is being done in Heaven.

And if it is true that God's creations are perfect, why wasn't Adam and Eve perfect?... Why did they fall for lucify that isn't perfect too... Why I'm I doubting the whole story if I'm perfect

Only God is perfect, you are not.

budaatum:

Seems we are in agreement with what I've been saying all along!


And then you go and ask this silly question Shepherd!

If God needs to be worshipped by you "Being fruitful and increasing in number, and filling the earth and subduing it, and ruling over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground, would you, Shepherd, if you have any sense, not even be begging God to please let you worship God?

Lolzzzzz. It seems we are talking about different gods here. Buda, increasing and multiplying, filling the earth with kids is not the only thing God created man to do.

Mainly, we are created for fellowship which is worship.

I feel stupid even talking about this. Buda, have it your way, you won't believe in God, you won't worship Him. Whatever you choose to do, go ahead Buda.

Shepherd00:

What will you be doing in heaven as a robot?

What are the angels in heaven doing? Aren't they like "robot".. They just worship God happily without the fear of going to hell

JohnnyOhJohn:

What are the angels in heaven doing? Aren't they like "robot".. They just worship God happily without the fear of going to hell

No they are not like robots, though they have passed our stage. There was a time a third of them also fell. We too are to overcome. Some have already, like the dead in Christ. It's another stage altogether, like growth. There was a stage we could not walk. As you grew up, you got to a stage where you just know that you will not suddenly forget how to walk tomorrow. It's not robotic, it's another level. Good things don't usually come easy.

Shepherd00:

Lolzzzzz. It seems we are talking about different gods here. Buda, increasing and multiplying, filling the earth with kids is not the only thing God created man to do.

Mainly, we are created for fellowship which is worship.

I feel stupid even talking about this. Buda, have it your way, you won't believe in God, you won't worship Him. Whatever you choose to do, go ahead Buda.

You know what Shepherd, you must feel stupid! What is wrong with you? If I don't fellowship with my neighbor can I love them? Or did I not add "love your neighbors", which is fellowship, and "do unto others" which is fellowship too? Yet, see you! Incapable of fellowshipping in civil conversation with your neighbor buda claiming I say what I do not say! Are we not meant to be fellowshipping here? Or are you one of those literalists perhaps I did not know?! You don't have to tell buda what to do or whom and how buda worships or not, God will not ask your opinion about buda on buda's judgement day! Where does what I wrote mean "filling the earth with kids"?

JohnnyOhJohn:

As long as it makes me do the will of God without temptations. And you that Heaven is guaranteed this way and that's the most important thing...

You didn't respond to my last post.

But on this, every child would want a school where they neither do TESTs nor EXAMs. If given a choice, I would pick a school where no one would ask you any questions.

Unfortunately, I cannot choose the kind of school I want to go for my parent. Secondly, the education system has tests and exams as part of the core of schooling.

God doesn't want Robots, He want free, independent and Loving Children. Temptations and Trials are means of filteration

If a man wouldn't want God in his life in his 70-100 years on earth. Is it fair for God to put the man in paradise with Himself for eternity?

So many conflicts, it's hard to keep up.

Some say we carry the sins of Adam and Eve, which is why infant baptism is necessary.

Others say no such thing exists.

The Bible says we were created in God's image.

Someone here said by eating the fruit, humanity was raised to the level of the gods.

I thought that already happened by being created in God's image. Besides, what separates humanity from gods in most cultures is not knowledge but extent i.e sure we have knowledge but the gods supposedly know all. We have short lives but the gods are eternal. We are present wherever we are but the gods can be everywhere at any time.

So. Many. Inconsistencies.

paraltero:
So many conflicts, it's hard to keep up.

Some say we carry the sins of Adam and Eve, which is why infant baptism is necessary.

Others say no such thing exists.

The Bible says we were created in God's image.

Someone here said by eating the fruit, humanity was raised to the level of the gods.

I thought that already happened by being created in God's image. Besides, what separates humanity from gods in most cultures is not knowledge but extent i.e sure we have knowledge but the gods supposedly know all. We have short lives but the gods are eternal. We are present wherever we are but the gods can be everywhere at any time.

So. Many. Inconsistencies.

Only Catholics believe in infant baptism. It doesn't have either scriptural or traditional Israeli baptism backing.

The fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil is symbolic (that is why it wasn't called a Apple tree). It is a means of Becoming Totally Independent from God. That's why on the day you partake of it you become dead (DISCONNECTED) from God.

paraltero:
So many conflicts, it's hard to keep up.

Some say we carry the sins of Adam and Eve, which is why infant baptism is necessary.

Others say no such thing exists.

The Bible says we were created in God's image.

Someone here said by eating the fruit, humanity was raised to the level of the gods.

Genesis 3:5,22

I thought that already happened by being created in God's image.

An offspring doesn't inherit all the traits and features of its parent.Dont be confused.

Besides, what separates humanity from gods in most cultures is not knowledge but extent i.e sure we have knowledge but the gods supposedly know all.

It's not the tree of knowledge but the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Read the verses I previously referred you to .

We have short lives but the gods are eternal. We are present wherever we are but the gods can be everywhere at any time.

You're incorporating the different versions of what gods should be like from different cultures into one. It's erroneous to do so given we are looking at it from the biblical perspective. I'll still refer you to the bible verses which would shed more light on what was needed to gain immortality. Please note that these words aren't facts and can be rendered invalid once a valid argument is made available.

So. Many. Inconsistencies.[/quote]

JohnnyOhJohn:
Let me make use of an example first;
Is it right to judge my neighbor's children for the sins of their father... No right?


So why are we judged for the sins of Adam and Eve

I think we all deserve a chance to stay in the garden of eden too... And anyone that eats from the tree of knowledge should pay for it alone

To be honest.. I still don't know why we were created in the first place,,, as in can't we just stay up there in Heaven and worship God


And if it is true that God's creations are perfect, why wasn't Adam and Eve perfect?... Why did they fall for lucify that isn't perfect too... Why I'm I doubting the whole story if I'm perfect

I need direct and logical answers please, don't beat around the bush... Thank you

Cc
Lalasticlala
Ishilove
Semid4lyfe
Obinoscopy

there is nowhere in the bible that says that we are judged for the sin of Adam. please quote where it is in the bible and dont pull baseless self made opinion from nowhere.


the bible never say we are judged for adams sin, no but rather through Adam sin came into the world.

Like I have said on this forum a million times, Christianity and Judaism are 2 different religions.. Two completely different belief.. The jews wrote and owns the Tanakh for their religion called Judaism... The Romans stole it, changed the name to the old testament and added their own fabricated writing at the end of it and called it the new testament... Together is what is called "the bible".....
The jews don't have the concept of original sin, it is a completely Christian/pagan doctrine.. They created it, so they can sell the idea of jesus as a saviour of man.. Which erstwhile lies with every individual.. What God desires from man is a complete and sincere repentance.. And he will forgive and remember your sins no more.... The idea that man can't redeem himself is a pagan/Christian belief...hence the idea of a human sacrifice which the God of Jews hates and detest.. Read ezekiel 18..

In the original babylonian tale the story of Adam and eve was adapted from, the serpent of the good tree was Ninghiszida and the serpent of the Evil tree was Inanna... She is the Goddess of death and destruction.. I think the purpose of the story is about life and death, and that death is an illusion.. Or deception....as both life and death are one and the same thing.. Read psalm 104 :29-31 or Ecclesiastes 12 :7...

The letter killeth.. Take note.

solite3:
there is nowhere in the bible that says that we are judged for the sin of Adam. please quote where it is in the bible and dont pull baseless self made opinion from nowhere.


the bible never say we are judged for adams sin, no but rather through Adam sin came into the world.

Romans 5

19 For just as by the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners

sonmvayina:
In the original babylonian tale the story of Adam and eve was adapted from, the serpent of the good tree was Ninghiszida and the serpent of the Evil tree was Inanna... She is the Goddess of death and destruction.. I think the purpose of the story is about life and death, and that death is an illusion.. Or deception....as both life and death are one and the same thing.. Read psalm 104 :29-31 or Ecclesiastes 12 :7...

The letter killeth.. Take note.

Interesting. I never thought to wonder why good fruits would yoke with evil fruits!

budaatum:

You know what Shepherd, you must feel stupid! What is wrong with you? If I don't fellowship with my neighbor can I love them? Or did I not add "love your neighbors", which is fellowship, and "do unto others" which is fellowship too? Yet, see you! Incapable of fellowshipping in civil conversation with your neighbor buda claiming I say what I do not say! Are we not meant to be fellowshipping here? Or are you one of those literalists perhaps I did not know?! You don't have to tell buda what to do or whom and how buda worships or not, God will not ask your opinion about buda on buda's judgement day! Where does what I wrote mean "filling the earth with kids"?

When the Lord was asked what the greatest commandment was, what was His response Buda?

How can I fellowship with you when we seem to be serving different gods? My God whose name is Jehovah created me to serve Him, which is also Worship. But, you say He is not to be worshipped. I believe in Him and His Words, but you say you don't believe in Him or His Words. How can I fellowship with someone who is contrary?

What did Jesus through Paul say? If any man, even an Angle preaches a different gospel from the one that was preached to you, believe him not, and let him be accursed.

With all you contrary gospel, have I cursed you No. Instead you call me stupid.

JohnnyOhJohn:

What are the angels in heaven doing? Aren't they like "robot".. They just worship God happily without the fear of going to hell

Angel's are not robots. If they were, there won't be a satan.

Shepherd00:

Angel's are not robots. If they were, there won't be a satan.

Show me one ancient text that says Satan is evil... Ecclesiaticus 21:20 says "he who causeth Satan causeth his own soul..."

Shepherd00:

When the Lord was asked what the greatest commandment was, what was His response Buda?

How can I fellowship with you when we seem to be serving different gods? My God whose name is Jehovah created me to serve Him, which is also Worship. But, you say He is not to be worshipped. I believe in Him and His Words, but you say you don't believe in Him or His Words. How can I fellowship with someone who is contrary?

What did Jesus through Paul say? If any man, even an Angle preaches a different gospel from the one that was preached to you, believe him not, and let him be accursed.

With all you contrary gospel, have I cursed you No. Instead you call me stupid.

Don't fellowship with me, it's not by force! You called yourself stupid. I just agreed with you!

budaatum:

Don't fellowship with me, it's not by force! You called yourself stupid. I just agreed with you!

Lol. Buda. You are forming anger because you are caught for what you really are. Whatever you call me doesn't change who I am.

Out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks. You are still who you were, if not worst. You have your own God you have created in your mind.

What kind of a Christian follows Jesus Without Believing in Him or worshiping Him? It's the kind that has his own gospel if you ask me.

This is the purpose of this thread, to know if indeed you have become a brethren, but alas, you are a shadow.

Shalom

sonmvayina:


Show me one ancient text that says Satan is evil... Ecclesiaticus 21:20 says "he who causeth Satan causeth his own soul..."

I am not interested in having a discussions with a satan sympathizer. Enjoy your short time on earth, it won't be long now, you'd find out if satan is evil or not.

sonmvayina:


Show me one ancient text that says Satan is evil... Ecclesiaticus 21:20 says "he who causeth Satan causeth his own soul..."

Can you lead me to this your 'ecclesiasticus 21:20?' because my Ecclesiastes doesn't have chapter 21:20.

u know the most interesting thing about christianity is the fact that everybody interpretes the bible texts the way he like,the most important thing is that the end of the day their explanation points to the direction that God is always right,it doesn't matter the inconsistencies in their explanations,it doesn't matter the contraductions,it doesn't matter if it us reasonable or not it doesn't matter if it is consistent with what we see in reality, as long as the end product is to confirm the bible as true.
Shadeyinka please is the word "DNA" in the bible,where did you get the notion that man had God's DNA ,does God even have a DNA to start with and while you are at that,please is the process of DNA replication in God's DNA the same as in humans,what is the source of the components of God's DNA,where does he get the folic acid,from diet ?

Hermes019:
u know the most interesting thing about christianity is the fact that everybody interpretes the bible texts the way he like,the most important thing is that the end of the day their explanation points to the direction that God is always right,it doesn't matter the inconsistencies in their explanations,it doesn't matter the contraductions,it doesn't matter if it us reasonable or not it doesn't matter if it is consistent with what we see in reality, as long as the end product is to confirm the bible as true.
Shadeyinka please is the word "DNA" in the bible,where did you get the notion that man had God's DNA ,does God even have a DNA to start with and while you are at that,please is the process of DNA replication in God's DNA the same as in humans,what is the source of the components of God's DNA,where does he get the folic acid,from diet ?

Can you see how Intelligent you just showed yourself to be?

Someone needed an explanation (a means of understanding Spiritual lingos). An explanation/illustration was provided, and you have no decency of keeping quiet over Something linguistically above you.

God created Adam and Eve, and gave them an instruction not to seek total independence from Him ( tree of knowledge of Good and Evil) for on the day they try it they shall die ( spiritually cut off from God). Now, when Adam was created, God put into Adam His Spirit (DNA) and Adam became super human (child of God). Now Adam and Eve broke the Spiritual Law and hence became Spiritually Disconnected (Spiritually died) from God. Instead, he caught a Virus ( Sin Nature).