How come our so called youth can't read and understand. Those making silly comments up there, can't they see its on BOT basis?

Liberal soul maketh fat!

Those at the helm of affairs lack the guts/will to make things work,how can you have a $2.3bn project and your commitment is micro $500m ? Mortgaging our future with massive loans .
It’s a nice idea but the financing part is sluggish and seems unattainable.

Bolustical:
1)How come PDP, the dominant party in the SS & SE never thought of this?

2)How come it's the tyrant Buhari and 'mere commissioner' government that has this goodwill towards people who hate them the most?

3) How come GEJ, the Hero never did something like this?

Think am o!

Minister of Transportation, Rotimi Amaechi has said the current administration was implementing the masterplan introduced by former President, Olusegun Obasanjo for the development of Nigerian Railway Transport.

Amaechi while fielding questions from journalists yesterday in Abuja, said the federal government was currently working on Lagos-Ibadan rail project adding that the contract for Ibadan-Kaduna and Kaduna to Kano rail projects has been awarded. He said hopefully, the China Nexim Bank would approve the loan to commence construction adding that they are negotiating for the contract for Port Harcourt to Maiduguri, which is about 2,000km. Amaechi however debunked rumors that armed robbers attack Abuja-Kaduna rail at the Rijana Community, stating that there are armed policemen in all the coaches.

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://guardian.ng/news/we-are-using-obasanjos-masterplan-to-develop-railway-transport-says-amaechi/amp&ved=2ahUKEwjryfPlsrfiAhW4QxUIHVeVB1UQFjANegQIBxAB&usg=AOvVaw3q7x4RvEm4Xz3mBrU8cKZK&ampcf=1

So it means he may be retained.

anyimontana:
When you sell your soul to the devil..

China go buy us over sooner than we think

Wetin concern buhari,he knows he will be long dead and gone wen chinco will ask for repayment

Keep mortgaging our future via loans ,soon we’ll become citizens of China via virtue of series of agreements with the Chinese .
The idea is great but the collective bargaining and the ideas behind the financing is lurid.

Guestlander:


Look at the positive side. Americans are more indebted to the Chinese than any other country in the world. The Asians are far more likely to help Africa develop than the west.

The ancient narrow guage left by the British was only meant to convey raw materials from the hinterland for onward transportation to the UK.
As long as the loans are not taken in cash and then stolen. If they are tied to projects like power plants, railroads, steel and stuff like that we cannot lose.

Unfortunately, although the sentiment in the bolded is a nice one, it just isn't true. Ask Sri Lanka, which had to give China a 99-year lease on its Hambantota port after failing to meet the payment terms of its Chinese loans: note that this 99-year term was also the exact length of the Chinese lease to Britain of the port of Hong-Kong, which makes it perfectly reasonable to call it debt-based imperialism. A similar scenario is also currently unfolding with other "beneficiaries" of Chinese loans, including Kenya, Uganda, Zambia and other African countries, while it was for fear of this "debt trap" that Malaysia's Mahathir forced down the cost of China's proposed "East Coast Rail Link" project by threatening to cancel it outright.

As for those who claim Nigeria shouldn't worry because China is also the USA's biggest debtor, these apologists either do not know or simply do not care about important differences, such as
(1) The USA still being the world's largest economy, whose domestic currency is treated as the de-facto international standard.
(2) The USA having by far the world's most powerful military, with more aircraft carriers than everyone else combined, and over 5,000 nuclear warheads.
(3) The USA's debt being denominated in its own currency, which it can devalue at will should it ever choose to, turning Chinese debt holdings into worthless paper.

None of the above comes close to holding true for Nigeria, whose Chinese loans are most likely in USD or Chinese Renminbi, and which probably couldn't defeat even a small country like Belgium in a military contest, let alone a rising superpower like China. If Nigeria defaults on these Chinese loans, nothing and nobody could stop the Chinese from forcing us into a serious surrender of sovereignty in some form or other. Unfortunately, the usual Nigerian mismanagement is already in evidence with the Kaduna-Abuja rail link, so the risks of an eventual default are far from negligible.

omohayek:

Unfortunately, although the sentiment in the bolded is a nice one, it just isn't true. Ask Sri Lanka, which had to give China a 99-year lease on its Hambantota port after failing to meet the payment terms of its Chinese loans: note that this 99-year term was also the exact length of the Chinese lease to Britain of the port of Hong-Kong, which makes it perfectly reasonable to call it debt-based imperialism. A similar scenario is also currently unfolding with other "beneficiaries" of Chinese loans, including Kenya, Uganda, Zambia and other African countries, while it was for fear of this "debt trap" that Malaysia's Mahathir forced down the cost of China's proposed "East Coast Rail Link" project by threatening to cancel it outright.

As for those who claim Nigeria shouldn't worry because China is also the USA's biggest debtor, these apologists either do not know or simply do not care about important differences, such as
(1) The USA still being the world's largest economy, whose domestic currency is treated as the de-facto international standard.
(2) The USA having by far the world's most powerful military, with more aircraft carriers than everyone else combined, and over 5,000 nuclear warheads.
(3) The USA's debt being denominated in its own currency, which it can devalue at will should it ever choose to, turning Chinese debt holdings into worthless paper.

None of the above comes close to holding true for Nigeria, whose Chinese loans are most likely in USD or Chinese Renminbi, and which probably couldn't defeat even a small country like Belgium in a military contest, let alone a rising superpower like China. If Nigeria defaults on these Chinese loans, nothing and nobody could stop the Chinese from forcing us into a serious surrender of sovereignty in some form or other. Unfortunately, the usual Nigerian mismanagement is already in evidence with the Kaduna-Abuja rail link, so the risks of an eventual default are far from negligible.

How many years were the Dutch, the British and the Portuguese there with only poverty and underdevelopment to show for it?
China will force Nigeria to surrender her sovereignty? Calm down bro. Where have you seen that happen in the history of the world?
Just like personal finances, nations also should borrow what they can afford to pay, its common sense.
But trust me, most of the anti China write ups are based on hypocrisy of the western press.
They fear growing Chinese influence in various parts of the world, they talk of debt imperialism when they know this is how the west kept Africa down for so long.

if you did believe this...then you can believe anything in the world

Guestlander:


Calm down bro. Where have you seen that happen in the history of the world?

Um, I just gave you a link to an actual instance of exactly that happening with China and Sri Lanka, and even pointed out that this deal was exactly the same kind as the one the British used to force China to lease them Hong Kong for 99 years. I suggest you actually follow the link I provided, and then do a Google search on Zambia's ZEMCO, or Kenya's deal with China on port financing, or Myanmar's slashing of its Chinese loan from $7.5 billion to $1.3 billion, or Pakistan's decision to use less than half of the $62 billion it borrowed from China. Information on all of these issues is freely available from media across the world, even non-western ones like the affected countries' own news media.

Just like personal finances, nations also should borrow what they can afford to pay, its common sense.
But trust me, most of the anti China write ups are based on hypocrisy of the western press.
They fear growing Chinese influence in various parts of the world, they talk of debt imperialism when they know this is how the west kept Africa down for so long.

It was precisely to avoid this line of argument that I avoided linking to "Western" sources like the FT, the WSJ or the Economist, but you've gone ahead and made the argument anyway. Is Mahathir Mohammed part of this supposedly hypocritical "western press"? How do you know that Nigeria's Chinese loans were made at reasonable terms the country can afford to pay? Have you seen the related documents? Are they freely available anywhere for public perusal? Do Nigerian governments have a reputation for being thoughtful, well-prepared negotiators? Without good answers to all these questions, why should I believe that Nigeria's agreements are any better than those made by Malaysia, Pakistan, Kenya, Zambia or Djibouti, all of whose own political elites have had negative things to say?

All you've done here is basically waved away inconvenient facts using wishful thinking and conspiracy theorizing. Without access to the detailed financial agreements the Nigerian government signed with China, you have no evidence to support the idea that the loans were prudent, and this lack of opacity is the very problem with borrowing heavily from China - with "hypocritical" western countries, it is possible to use "Freedom of Information" acts to force such information out into the open, but no Chinese citizens dares to even try that with their totalitarian government.

omohayek:

Um, I just gave you a link to an actual instance of exactly that happening with China and Sri Lanka, and even pointed out that this deal was exactly the same kind as the one the British used to force China to lease them Hong Kong for 99 years. I suggest you actually follow the link I provided, and then do a Google search on Zambia's ZEMCO, or Kenya's deal with China on port financing.



It was precisely to avoid this line of argument that I avoided linking to "Western" sources like the FT or The Economist, but you've gone ahead and made the argument anyway. Is Mahathir Mohammed part of this supposedly hypocritical "western press"? How do you know that Nigeria's Chinese loans were made at reasonable terms the country can afford to pay? Have you seen the related documents? Are they freely available anywhere for public perusal? Do Nigerian governments have a reputation for being thoughtful, well-prepared negotiators? Without good answers to all these questions, why should I believe that Nigeria's agreements are any better than those made by Malaysia, Pakistan, Kenya, Zambia or Djibouti, all of whose own political elites have had negative things to say?

All you've done here is basically waved away inconvenient facts using wishful thinking and conspiracy theorizing. Without access to the detailed financial agreements the Nigerian government signed with China, you have no evidence to support the idea that the loans were prudent, and this lack of opacity is the very problem with borrowing heavily from China - with "hypocritical" western countries, it is possible to use "Freedom of Information" acts to force such information out into the open, but no Chinese citizens dares to even try that with their totalitarian government.

A port was leased out for 99 years, that is not exactly surrendering your sovereignty.
You mixed several things together. The British annexation of Hongkong was not restricted to the a port. It was total sovereignty over the island and it wasn't because the Chinese borrowed some money they couldn't repay.
The British control of Hongkong is not too different from how Lagos became a colony, through war or threats of war.
This was a different time and bears no resemblance to what is happening now.

Guestlander:


A port was leased out for 99 years, that is not exactly surrendering your sovereignty.
You mixed several things together. The British annexation of Hongkong was not restricted to the a port. It was total sovereignty over the island and it wasn't because the Chinese borrowed some money they couldn't repay.

If the territories "permanently" ceded by China to Britain had been able to stand on their own, do you think Britain would ever have handed them back along with the "leased" bits? As for the other bit of your argument, you should look at the history of the Suez canal if you think defaulting on foreign debt never has negative consequences.

The British control of Hongkong is not too different from how Lagos became a colony, through war or threats of war.
This was a different time and bears no resemblance to what is happening now.

Again, let me ask you: if Nigeria defaults on the Chinese loans, and the Chinese government then insists that all of these railroads be handed over to it for 99 years, along with sovereignty over the bordering lands for 5km on either side, and the "right" to extraterritoriality for all Chinese nationals in Nigeria, what would any Nigerian government be able to do about it? If China sends one of the 2 new aircraft carriers it is building to "secure" the safety of allegedly "threatened" Chinese nationals, what can you or anybody in Abuja do in response? Who would dare come to Nigeria's aid? Who would care enough to bother, when nobody dares for Ukraine or Venezuela?

You write as if we no longer lived in a world where might makes right, and superpowers no longer carry out "gunboat diplomacy"; all that has changed is that the gunboats have been replaced by carrier groups, and thanks to reckless borrowing by other delusional Third World countries, China now has ports in Djibouti and Sri Lanka to act as way-stations if it ever decides to send those carrier groups to Nigeria's shores.

omohayek:

If the territories "permanently" ceded by China to Britain had been able to stand on their own, do you think Britain would ever have handed them back along with the "leased" bits? As for the other bit of your argument, you should look at the history of the Suez canal if you think defaulting on foreign debt never has negative consequences.


Again, let me ask you: if Nigeria defaults on the Chinese loans, and the Chinese government then insists that all of these railroads be handed over to it for 99 years, along with sovereignty over the bordering lands for 5km on either side, and the "right" to extraterritoriality for all Chinese nationals in Nigeria, what would any Nigerian government be able to do about it? If China sends one of the 2 new aircraft carriers it is building to "secure" the safety of allegedly "threatened" Chinese nationals, what can you or anybody in Abuja do in response? Who would dare come to Nigeria's aid? Who would care enough to bother, when nobody dares for Ukraine or Venezuela?

You write as if we no longer lived in a world where might makes right, and superpowers no longer carry out "gunboat diplomacy"; all that has changed is that the gunboats have been replaced by carrier groups, and thanks to reckless borrowing by other delusional Third World countries, China now has ports in Djibouti and Sri Lanka to act as way-stations if it ever decides to send those carrier groups to Nigeria's shores.

There's something called precedence when it comes to issues like this. You are giving me some hypothetical scenarios without telling me if such things have ever happened anywhere.
Chinese government demanding territory from another country? Is this a kind of futuristic apocalyptic movie or something?
If China is going to invade your country and take over territories I doubt if they will need any port concessions. They will just take it, and you know what that means? War.

The one una build dey catch fire
Naija and fake everything
Even our president i hrd is fake

Finally,a train will reach cross river and akwa ibom in a few years.thank you buhari

Guestlander:


There's something called precedence when it comes to issues like this. You are giving me some hypothetical scenarios without telling me if such things have ever happened anywhere.

Ah yes, a particular sequence of events can never happen because the exact same sequence has never happened before with the exact same actors. Please feel free to keep pretending that I haven't cited actual historical examples to buttress my points, and that I haven't followed up said citations with actual links for you to further educate yourself. If you think simply asserting that bad things will never happen is all it takes to rule out the real-world events I've mentioned, you clearly won't be convinced by anything I could possibly write.

As for myself, I will continue to think it the height of fōolishness to act as an unpaid cheerleader for heavy foreign borrowing even while lacking the slightest idea about what the exact terms and conditions of the loans were. Nigerian governments have never been known for their concern for the long-term or their financial savvy, especially when headed by poorly-educated old men so economically illiterate they think they can simply order the Naira's market-value about like yet another one of their subordinates in the army.

Even if these loans were being made at the lowest possible market rates, they would never be repayable under the Nigerian government's typical mismanagement, already on full display with heavy subsidies of passengers at the expense of freight traffic. Bring in the Chinese record elsewhere of demanding its loans be used to make uncompetitive tenders to Chinese-owned businesses, and I predict that it is a certainty that Nigeria will eventually default on these loans at some point in the next 10-20 years, only at which point we will find out just what the bill is for all the Chinese loans Buhari is receiving praise for today. Of course, by then Buhari will in all likelihood be long dead, so it won't be his problem to worry about, just the young mugus singing his praises right now.

omohayek:

Ah yes, a particular sequence of events can never happen because the exact same sequence has never happened before with the exact same actors. Please feel free to keep pretending that I haven't cited actual historical examples to buttress my points, and that I haven't followed up said citations with actual links for you to further educate yourself. If you think simply asserting that bad things will never happen is all it takes to rule out the real-world events I've mentioned, you clearly won't be convinced by anything I could possibly write.

As for myself, I will continue to think it the height of fōolishness to act as an unpaid cheerleader for heavy foreign borrowing even while lacking the slightest idea about what the exact terms and conditions of the loans were. Nigerian governments have never been known for their concern for the long-term or their financial savvy, especially when headed by poorly-educated old men so economically illiterate they think they can simply order the Naira's market-value about like yet another one of their subordinates in the army.

Even if these loans were being made at the lowest possible market rates, they would never be repayable under the Nigerian government's typical mismanagement, already on full display with heavy subsidies of passengers at the expense of freight traffic. Bring in the Chinese record elsewhere of demanding its loans be used to make uncompetitive tenders to Chinese-owned businesses, and I predict that it is a certainty that Nigeria will eventually default on these loans at some point in the next 10-20 years, only at which point we will find out just what the bill is for all the Chinese loans Buhari is receiving praise for today. Of course, by then Buhari will in all likelihood be long dead, so it won't be his problem to worry about, just the young mugus singing his praises right now.

Where's is the heavy borrowing? In this particular case $2.3 billion. Are we still in the same country where a certain Dasuki went into the central bank and took out $1 billion to be squandered on frivolities?
2.3 billion to provide some needed infrastructures and you are writing pages of alarmist statements.
Let us wait for the Chinese invasion then.
In your wisdom the Nigerian government is signing agreements which they are not aware of the terms. You are either ignorant, arrogant or both.

I wonder why they're after Chinese loans instead of American. The US EXIM bank offered as well.

Bolustical:
1)How come PDP, the dominant party in the SS & SE never thought of this?

2)How come it's the tyrant Buhari and 'mere commissioner' government that has this goodwill towards people who hate them the most?

3) How come GEJ, the Hero never did something like this?

Think am o!

You raised some good points there.

AngelicBeing:
l agree with your post but my only concern is for contractors pocketing funds via greedy wicked politicians and not deliver the mandate of the FG

That kind of stuff simply does not happen under Buhari.

blackslayer:
The question i want to ask is this.....Do they have plans to service the loans in a timely fashion so as to minimize the amount of interest and overall cost? These bastards have no plans whatsoever....building infrastructure from loans is not something to blindly jubilate over.....With all the OIL wealth....what have they done with it They pay themselves with oil money and borrow to do what they were elected to do....Nigerians are dvmb as a rock i swear....Nigerians don't know what's best for them...they are like little children.....think about it!!!!

What ''OIL wealth''? Dude, Nigeria's oil reserves and daily output are about 1/4 those of countries like Saudi Arabia and UAE. Added to that, our population is 200 million compared to their 2 million here, 6 million there populations in the Gulf states. Our annual budget is only 22 billion USD. Compare that to South Africa's annual budget of 122 billion USD. They have a diversified economy, so they earn more money. We have an oil-dependent economy, although diversifying slowly. So we are really not a rich country despite the so called oil wealth.

Rossikk:


That kind of stuff simply does not happen under Buhari.

What happened to the N1.5 billion wasted on Nigeria Air consultation after everyone with at least half a brain had told them it was a stupid idea?

AZeD1:

What happened to the $1.5 billion wasted on Nigeria Air consultation after everyone with at least half a brain had told them it was a stupid idea?

You people sabi throw fake and made up numbers for real

plaindealer:



You people sabi throw fake and made up numbers for real

https://twitter.com/HEDankwambo/status/1042474087350714369


The Logo was designed in Bahrain
https://www.bellanaija.com/2018/07/nigeria-air-logo-bahrain/

AZeD1:


https://twitter.com/HEDankwambo/status/1042474087350714369


The Logo was designed in Bahrain
https://www.bellanaija.com/2018/07/nigeria-air-logo-bahrain/

Read the content of the twitter link you posted and change the $ sign in your post to Naira

plaindealer:




Read the content of the twitter link you posted and change the $ sign in your post to Naira

Done.

How come Ondo State is not mentioned amongst the coastal states that the rail line would pass through? Could this be an erroneous omission while reporting the news, or Ondo State is actually left out of the beneficiary states by the FG?

Could someone knowledgeable in this area kindly enlighten us?

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Guestlander:


Where's is the heavy borrowing? In this particular case $2.3 billion. Are we still in the same country where a certain Dasuki went into the central bank and took out $1 billion to be squandered on frivolities?
2.3 billion to provide some needed infrastructures and you are writing pages of alarmist statements.

Here you simply reveal your numerical illiteracy for the world to see. If you think the exact terms of the loans don't matter enough to need to know what they are, I'm sure you won't have any problem applying for a 5-year, $1.00 loan at a daily interest rate of just 1%. Hey, it's only a single dollar, and look how low the interest rate is!

As I said, it's mugus like you who will end up paying the price for today's fiscal recklessness, long after this and subsequent administrations have turned the new set of railways into worthless scrap through the usual "federal character", "man know man" and "you chop I chop" nonsense. Here's another educational link you're free to ignore in your determination to remain an uncritical supporter of this incompetent administration.

In your wisdom the Nigerian government is signing agreements which they are not aware of the terms. You are either ignorant, arrogant or both.

No, I am prudent, objective, and deeply concerned for the future of my country, while you are a mindless, carefree, partisan cheerleader for an administration that has shown no evidence of thoughtfulness or administrative capacity in any sphere to date, not even in the management of the already completed railways for which they went borrowing. That's why you haven't bothered to answer any of my questions and analogies - which I backed up with easily verifiable facts and links to relevant articles - with anything more than conspiracy-theorising and ad-hominems, i.e. a lot of hot air. You have no facts to share because the facts simply don't support you, so you think calling me names will somehow disguise the fact that you don't have a leg to stand on.

When I see people like you, who are so entranced by the immediate "goodies" being dangled before their eyes that they lose all power of critical thinking, I well understand how it is that the Europeans were able to trick so many Africans into handing over their patrimonies for a few worthless trinkets. Here's a newsflash for you: if the Europeans didn't come to Africa out of the goodness of their hearts, the Chinese certainly aren't doing so for charitable purposes either. If you think China now has the world's second-largest defense budget for nothing, or that it intends to keep all those aircraft carriers its constructing permanently sitting around at home, you are living in a dream world. A Chinese government that has no problem sending 1 million of its own citizens to concentration-camps will certainly have no qualms about doing far worse to foreigners half-way across the world, especially as it won't have the western problem of domestic criticism and political opposition to worry about.

omohayek:

Here you simply reveal your numerical illiteracy for the world to see. If you think the exact terms of the loans don't matter enough to need to know what they are, I'm sure you won't have any problem applying for a 5-year, $1.00 loan at a daily interest rate of just 1%. Hey, it's only a single dollar, and look how low the interest rate is!

As I said, it's mugus like you who will end up paying the price for today's fiscal recklessness, long after this and subsequent administrations have turned the new set of railways into worthless scrap through the usual "federal character", "man know man" and "you chop I chop" nonsense. Here's another educational link you're free to ignore in your determination to remain an uncritical supporter of this incompetent administration.

No, I am prudent, objective, and deeply concerned for the future of my country, while you are a mindless, carefree, partisan cheerleader for an administration that has shown no evidence of thoughtfulness or administrative capacity in any sphere to date, not even in the management of the already completed railways for which they went borrowing. That's why you haven't bothered to answer any of my questions and analogies - which I backed up with easily verifiable facts and links to relevant articles - with anything more than conspiracy-theorising and ad-hominems, i.e. a lot of hot air. You have no facts to share because the facts simply don't support you, so you think calling me names will somehow disguise the fact that you don't have a leg to stand on.

When I see people like you, who are so entranced by the immediate "goodies" being dangled before their eyes that they lose all power of critical thinking, I well understand how it is that the Europeans were able to trick so many Africans into handing over their patrimonies for a few worthless trinkets. Here's a newsflash for you: if the Europeans didn't come to Africa out of the goodness of their hearts, the Chinese certainly aren't doing so for charitable purposes either. If you think China now has the world's second-largest defense budget for nothing, or that it intends to keep all those aircraft carriers its constructing permanently sitting around at home, you are living in a dream world. A Chinese government that has no problem sending 1 million of its own citizens to concentration-camps will certainly have no qualms about doing far worse to foreigners half-way across the world, especially as it won't have the western problem of domestic criticism and political opposition to worry about.

Another verbose response that doesn't tell us anything new or sensible. You need to point out where I said the terms of the loans doesn't matter.
You also need to tell us why you are going on as if all loan documents are written in Chinese and the Nigerian people are just putting their signature on documents they don't understand.
I have no time for conspiracy theorists because they always have their heads up in the clouds. The Chinese are powerful for sure but how many countries do you think they can invade before they invite the whole world to their doorstep? Think my friend, think.

munex007:


You are right

We have governors, they go to China and spend one month on a tour and come back with MoU on debts.

“China will lend you $1.8b to build light rail. This light rail will be done by workers from China, the trains will come from China, the engines will come from China, the labor will come from China while the driver is Chinese. “At the end of the day, what do you benefit from them? Your citizens will ride on a train and when you ride on a train in northern Nigeria, in a state like Kano or Katsina, where are you going to? You are not going to industrial estate to work. You are not going to school. You are not going to the farm. You borrow money from China to invest in trains so that your citizens can ride on them to go for weddings and naming ceremonies.”


SLS

Very dumb, so farmers and produce dealers will see rail track and trains that are cheaper and insist on road transport because people are going to weddings? Or industrialist will ignore cheap rail transport to move their products to the hinterland and insist on more expensive road trucks?
I don't believe SLS made this very dumb statement