Olu317:


This is how you missed it because you thought ancestors were a form of angel but of course not because the ancestors who became deified.

I havent missed anything here, there is a common saying that goes as thus:

"There are Orisa and there are Orisa"

There are those of them that are akin to heroes, sages and prophetssic, whilst there are those that are said to have been in existence prior to the creation of the planet Earth.

To me, my grand father is an Orisa; yet for the sake of an accurate translation my grand father is a demadeity.

Orunmila is a premodial Orisa and his embodiment on planet Earth is known as one of the greatest philosophers the world has even seen https://www.nairaland.com/5258769/greatest-philosopher-all-time#79560051.

Orisa are NOT "Idols" or "lesser gods", as Abrahamic religion will have you believe, as in, the term "lesser gods" is readily reserved for Arabian, Greek, Persian and Roman mythology.

In all reality, the Visiers of Olodumare are divine representatives of the Almighty God on planet Earth.

Normally, Ancestor veneration can be an altogether seperate African concept and experience.

.....

MorataFC:
... is an idol

Olu317:
perpetual ignorance on your path

I agree.

Ifa does not support idol worshiping.

Ifa supports the feeling of deep respect and admiration towards all the Orisa.

'Idol worship' is an ancient Asian and ancient Eurocentric Crusader's terminology that they use to discriminate against anyone that does not belong to their religious sect.

The Africa pyche does not recognise such terminology as "Idol worship", as it does not translate correctly.

The people that history records as being Idol worshipers are found in ancient Arabia, ancient Greece, Persia and ancient Roman communities.

Amujale:




I agree.

Ifa does not support idol worshiping.

Ifa supports the feeling of deep respect and admiration towards all the Orisa.

'Idol worship' is an ancient Asian and ancient Eurocentric Crusader's terminology that they use to discriminate against anyone that does not belong to their religious sect.

The Africa pyche does not recognise such terminology as "Idol worship", as it does not translate correctly.

The people that history records as being Idol worshipers are found in ancient Arabia, ancient Greece, Persia and ancient Roman communities.

Awesome! Pardon my slight harsh word because I wish you knew what I know ,perhaps you will vent your anger like Èlù tiko so(sango Àjákutá ). Truthfully, I can see you that you are actually a true son of omoluabi. Respect to you.

Let me clearly inform you that idol worship isn't limited to the mentioned of yours but also found in Yoruba panegyric in which the past prophets were turned into
God. So Eleda is the only worthy to worshiped.

Advice: streamline your perspective or narrative to a group or ethnicity because Africa culture differs from one to another. Else your effort will be in vain because even the European you seemingly assumed they are together arent they understand their differences but manage one another.

Amujale:


I havent missed anything here, there is a common saying that goes as thus:

"There are Orisa and there are Orisa"

There are those of them that are akin to heroes, sages and prophetssic, whilst there are those that are said to have been in existence prior to the creation of the planet Earth.

To me, my grand father is an Orisa; yet for the sake of an accurate translation my grand father is a demadeity.

Orunmila is a premodial Orisa and his embodiment on planet Earth is known as one of the greatest philosophers the world has even seen https://www.nairaland.com/5258769/greatest-philosopher-all-time#79560051.

Orisa are NOT "Idols" or "lesser gods", as Abrahamic religion will have you believe, as in, the term "lesser gods" is readily reserved for Arabian, Greek, Persian and Roman mythology.

In all reality, the Visiers of Olodumare are divine representatives of the Almighty God on planet Earth.

Normally, Ancestor veneration can be an altogether seperate African concept and experience.

Clearly, you havent moved from the knowledge of some people that placed gods and God on the same platform i.e the men and Eleda~ Eledumare. Plainly, the Yoruba ancestors who you classified today knew themselves as not SLAVES BUT gods; image of or creation of Orunmila.

As it has been said by people that thought Orunmila was a philosopher on planet earth missssed it all because tbey didnt do anything much to investigate reason Yoruba cosmology is akin to Near East. In actual fact Orunmila is the same as Eledumare ~ because Or(o)ún mí è á àlá
means:
1.voice brought forth light

2.word spoke and light appeared

3. Word break forth light

4.gruntle to break forth light

5. light break forth from the sound

From the above definition of Orunmila,did testify to a people that the world adore. Mind you, I have seen a yoruba christain 1913 dictionary that gave a wrong definition of the actual interpretation by a zealous Christian group in the era that begun with Rev. Samuel Ajayi Crowther which was 1843 upward till today because Onifa~Olifa~Adifà voices aren't heard and voiceless as compared to Yoruba christains school of thought. Anyway God of all time will reveal the mysterious things to the world

On the veneration, we the present day people are the same as the past ancestors because human are humans . And the only necessary things the prophets or the gods need do is to developed the inner power of authority known as Àshé in self to be able to relate with God. So develop yourself if you are a chosen one.

Amujale:


Why would any African want to know about the Hebrew language?

The Hebrew language is a made up one and is connected to ficticious characters and manufactured religions.

According to Abrahamic text, the Hebrew language is claimed to have derived from the region of modern day Palestine.

How does that benefit the African?

How does that lead to progress in our world?

How does a language that originated in Asia help Africans to defeat colonisation and opression?

How?

The less we know about that fake language in the context of religion the better.

All i can gather from your investigations are that the people that invented that language did so by copying from the Yoruba language, apart from that, there are no other positive implications to derive thereafter.

I emplore you to continue with your robust investigations on an academic level rather than trying to use it to justify Christianity.

Nobody can successfully justify the horific crimes perpetuated by the ancient adherents of these Abrahamic religions.

Plainly, you missed the point because the spoken language in the presennt day Israel isnt Abrahamic language but Aramaic influence languagee.

On the reason for the study,will make you know that all you have been typing about Abrahamic's religion are basically incoherent with the reality of the language. It wil shock the actual Abrahamic religion is the Yoruba's.

Obviously, you will disagree with me at this moment but once you pick the interest in it ,you will understand what the point is. Take for example: eyphod is ifaodu

How true is it possible? Read this person of the bible and after going through it then ask one or two questions

1 Samuel 30:7 
And David said to Abiathar the priest, Ahimelech's son, I pray you, bring me here the ephod. And Abiathar brought thither the ephod to David.


New International Version
Then David said to Abiathar the priest, the son of Ahimelek, "Bring me the ephod." Abiathar brought it to him



Cheers

Olu317:

Awesome! Pardon my slight harsh word because I wish you knew what I know ,perhaps you will vent your anger like Èlù tiko so(sango Àjákutá ). Truthfully, I can see you that you are actually a true son of omoluabi.  Respect to you.

The feeling is mutual. My respect to you aswell.

Olu317:

Let me clearly inform you that idol worship isn't limited to the mentioned of yours  but also found in Yoruba panegyric in which the past prophets were turned into God. So Eleda is the only worthy to worshiped.

African religious concepts cannot be explained by ways of a Eurocentric mindset. Infact it ought to be the other way round, due to the mere fact that Africans history spans throughout the Ages. As in, Africans own the richest history people present in the world of today.

Therefore, its advisable for us to all part with all and every foreign nartative that arent original to the continent.

Once we have been able to re-invent our history, link it to the present, then our future will always be brighter.

The reason one reads into my generalisation is due to the fact that we are the oldest group in living history.

We, Africans, shared the good times aswell as the not so good times, in the light of past events,  it will be counter productive to try and single ourselves out without first acknowleging the fact that we are all one big family with similar aims and objectives.

The aim is to acknowledge, determine and re-affirm our own identity(ies) and never to accept a foreign narrative.

Let me put it into perspective, the present stock of Asians and Europeans missed out on 50% of world history. Meaning that whilst Africans are living in their glourious communities for thousands upon thoousands of years, there was no people living in Asia or Europe.

That is to say, with respect to the African Ancestry, the current stock of Asians and Europeans are relatively new comers on planet Earth.

Olu317:

Advice: streamline your perspective or narrative to a group or ethnicity because Africa culture differs from one to another. Else your effort will be in vain because even the European you seemingly assumed they are together arent they understand their differences but manage one another.

I agree with much of what you say here except for the fact that the term "Idol" in the context of Abrahamic religion is always meant to be derogatory.

Its intriguing to learn the close relationship the Yoruba language has with other languages that are out there.

Thank you for sharing your research with us.

There is also the understanding that the English language is a derivative of the Yoruba language.

Therefore, it doesnt suprise me when you are able to determine that the Hebrew language derives from Yoruba language.

As a matter of fact, i apreciate the great amount of effort you put into your research.

Eventhough i consider myself an African historian, my research and study is based on world history from the bronze age to the present times.

The amount of proof and corroborative material leaves me without the slightest doubt that all Abrahamic religions have infact be manufactured by unscrupulous individials from the first century.

There is no doubting the versatility of the Yoruba, Nigerian languages.

Similar to you, there are studies out there that have found the connection to the Nile Valley.

Again, that is plausible given that its my understanding that West Africans are amongst the people that found the Nile Valley civilisation.

Africans are the first humans to arrive on planet Earth therefore, our language(s) predates anything out of either Asia or Europe.

Olu317:

Let me clearly inform you that idol worship isn't limited to the mentioned of yours  but also found in Yoruba panegyric in which the past prophets were turned into God. So Eleda is the only worthy to worshiped.

That isnt correct, kindly learn from my expertise on this subject.

The term "Idol" or "Idol worship" is derogatory and does not translate correctly.

That terminology is reserved for Asian and European mythology.

The issue is that one should not, and cannot expect to use derogatory terms to define sacred entities.

African divinities are not on the same level as Asian or European ones.

Why?

African divinities are real and have a real history behind them whilst Asian and European are adaptations of our divinities.

Africans are the first people in human history capable enough to perceive the Almighty God.

Olu317:

past prophets were turned into God

Here you refer to deifying heroes, prophets and VIP's, yet there are African divinities that are said to have been in existence before Earth itself.

Amujale:


"There are Orisa and there are Orisa"

There are those of them that are akin to heroes, sages and prophetssic, whilst there are those that are said to have been in existence prior to the creation of the planet Earth.

Orisa are NOT "Idols" or "lesser gods", as Abrahamic religion will have you believe, as in, the term "lesser gods" is readily reserved for Arabian, Greek, Persian and Roman mythology.

In all reality, the Visiers of Olodumare are divine representatives of the Almighty God on planet Earth.

Use the correct terminology instead of making use of derogatory terms.

The correct term is Orisa.

The incorrect term is "Idol"

Another incorrect term is "lesser gods:

In the specified context, both "Idol" and "lesser gods" are exclusively Abrahamic religious terminologies.

They have no real meaning outside of Abrahamic religious circles.

Amujale:


African religious concepts cannot be explained by ways of a Eurocentric mindset. Infact it ought to be the other way round, due to the mere fact that Africans history spans throughout the Ages. As in, Africans own the richest history people present in the world of today.

Therefore, its advisable for us to all part with all and every foreign nartative that arent original to the continent.

Once we have been able to re-invent our history, link it to the present, then our future will always be brighter.

The reason one reads into my generalisation is due to the fact that we are the oldest group in living history.

We, Africans, shared the good times aswell as the not so good times, in the light of past events,  it will be counter productive to try and single ourselves out without first acknowleging the fact that we are all one big family with similar aims and objectives.

The aim is to acknowledge, determine and re-affirm our own identity(ies) and never to accept a foreign narrative.

Let me put it into perspective, the present stock of Asians and Europeans missed out on 50% of world history. Meaning that whilst Africans are living in their glourious communities for thousands upon thoousands of years, there was no people living in Asia or Europe.

That is to say, with respect to the African Ancestry, the current stock of Asians and Europeans are relatively new comers on planet Earth.

Yes, Africa has a Long history but to lump everyone together as unified people is a big mistake. In Africa's history, there were acknowledgment of Ethiopia, Nubia, Moor~Maghreb , Bantu etc but yoruba wasnt part of these groups etc because

1. the Yoruba land of the ancient time were in Near East in the land called Oru(heat land /sun land )~Or ~ mountain morem etc and not in Africa.


2. This is the reason yoruba had aan ancstor who was known as Oram'fe ~ Aram land in Near East

3.Migration brought yoruba to Africa. This is the reason there are duplicity of names in Yoruba land and in Middle East~Egypt. Doubt these ? kindly verify these names above and compare

Amujale:


Here you refer to deifying heroes, prophets and VIP's, yet there are African divinities that are said to have been in existence before Earth itself.



Use the correct terminology instead of making use of derogatory terms.

The correct term is Orisa.

The incorrect term is "Idol"

Another incorrect term is "lesser gods:

In the specified context, both "Idol" and "lesser gods" are exclusively Abrahamic religious terminologies.

They have no real meaning outside of Abrahamic religious circles.

Your opinion are based on your English language's perspective. So, let me posit these three answers

1. The Yoruba God is basically known as ‘Light' or purity or White. So therefore, this concept isn't with Kemet~Egypt

.2. Lesser gods simply mean less than Almighty God!

3. Idol isn't in the same context as you understand in Engliah language,which is different from the meaning in Abrahamic religion. Thus, idol worship is giving absolute adoration to anything in one's life ,apart from the creator in Abrahamic religion. Unfortunately for someone like you,that hasn't given attention to the meaning of the name,‘Abraham'. Perhaps you need a deeper knowledge of the man known as Abraham because from the personality,you wil be exposed to many other things about the Hebrew people

4. The Yoruba spirit is basically divided into two the functional and dysfunctional ~ positive and negative.

Olu317:
Yes, Africa has a Long history but to lump everyone together as unified people is a big mistake ....

That's not what is meant, i think anyone reading my post could easily identify my understanding of the qualities in our great continent.

Olu317:


1.In Africa's history, there were acknowledgment of Ethiopia, Nubia, Moor~Maghreb , Bantu etc yoruba wasnt part of these groups...

2..the Yoruba land of the ancient time were in Near East in the land called Oru(heat land /sun land )~Or ~ mountain morem etc and not in Africa...

That is royally incorrect, the view that suggest Yoruba originates from outside West Africa is implausible and wholly inaccurate.


I have no intention of turning into a discussion about the specifics of Yoruba history as much of the unclad truth are privy to the scholars and specialist.

Studies into African history brings me accross historians and academics that have already proven beyond any reasonable doubt that the people of the present day Nigeria's  history predates Asian history in years that amount in their hundreds and thousands. That is to say, when ancient Nigerianssic roamed the continent, there are no people living in Asia.

In one of his books on World history, the historian, archaeoligist and physicist Dr Cheikh Anta Diop acknowlege the Yoruba as to have originate from West Africa. Similar to Diop,  i travelled different countries accross the continent and learnt about various cultures, and it quickly becomes clear that Africans are uniquely linked in various different ways.

Yet, after accurate analyses of all the facts and numerical data, Yoruba has their origin on the African continent.

Olu317:
Your opinion are based on your English language's perspective. So, let me posit these three answers

1. The Yoruba God is basically known as ‘Light' or purity or White. So therefore, this concept isn't with Kemet~Egypt

I have no intention of turning into a discussion about the specifics of Yoruba history as much of the unclad truth are privy to the scholars and specialist.

However, given the length and depth of my study into African history, based on various analytical and scie tific investigations, there is no doubt in my mind that back in the ancient times, Yoruba travelled to KM.T from West Africa; are said to be amongst the earlier settlement in the Nile Valley region.

Olu317:


2. Lesser gods simply mean less than Almighty God!
[/quot

The term "lesser gods" is always meant as to project derogatory qualification(s).

The early Crusaders used these terms both as a way to try degrade aswell as an attempt to deauthorise the relevance of true history.

Abrahamic religious text only significant achievement is its partial replacing of real history with fiction commonly known as "brain washing".

The history of these terms derives from within Asia and Europe. Go and research everything you are reading and get back to me with what you find.

They used it to degrade their own people so as to impose the same Abrahamic religions on themselves.

The history of Abrahamic text is riddled with greed, deceit and unbelievable violence.


[quote author=Olu317 post=802360103]. Idol isn't in the same context as you understand in Engliah language,which is different from the meaning in Abrahamic religion.

That's a bit rich, No?

It seems you have gotten it wrong about Abrahamic religions and the bad terminology they use.

Let me explain what seems unclear to you about these constructs.

The term "Idol" in the specified context derives from the term "Idolatry" and both these terms are inventions of the Abrahamic religions.

That is to say, they have no real meaning outside of Abrahamic religious circles.

Olu317:
Thus, idol worship is giving absolute adoration to anything in one's life ,apart from the creator in Abrahamic religion

According to history, the main reason the Early crusaders invented such terminology was so as to try degrade all other religious concepts from all accross the globe.

Nobody needs to care what Abrahamic religion thinks about anything because its all a great con and they have zero real authority on matters that relate to goodness, and or virtuousness. Everything about their history excludes them from making any such claims.

All Abrahamic religions are fake, false and of no proper relevance to the African.

Olu317:

Unfortunately for someone like you,that hasn't given attention to the meaning of the name,‘Abraham'. Perhaps you need a deeper knowledge of the man known as Abraham because from the personality,you wil be exposed to many other things about the Hebrew people

Abraham is a ficticious character that the authors of Abrahamic text fabricated out of various ancient Palestinian folklore.

Everything surrounding the history of Abrahamic text is a sham.

There is not one story out of Abrahamic text that can claim to being original, if it wasnt stolen, it was copied, plagerized or simply fabricated.

There is so much to learn about ourselves and surroundings yet we are being taught not to think.

There's no philosophy that can compete with the yearn for an individual and collective experience of realtime progress.

We dont need to be saved by anyone or anything because God has already given that to us countless times and i dont see that stopping anytime soon.

We dont need to repent because we are NOT a guilty people.

Stop the wait on a European or Asian super human that is to come an eliviate US from suffering because that's just not plausible, if a European or Asian man was going to descend from the skies to eliviate anyone, the first people on the list would be those that look like HIM.

We dont need to face anywhere during petition but our immediate solvable problems.

We dont need salvation because we are saved the day we are allowed into the world.

All the ethics and moral guidelines we need to navigate the planet Earth is already present in our upbringing.

Our ancestors, heroes and saviours deserve nothing less than the best reception and admiration possible.

What is the point in living for somebody elses objectives.

There is so much work to be done, and yet little effort awarded to a cause.

Let us invoke the spirit of our local heroes, in everything that we partake.

There's the need to operate as if our world has been stolen and our aim is always to re-take it.

Hun

Amujale:



I have no intention of turning into a discussion about the specifics of Yoruba history as much of the unclad truth are privy to the scholars and specialist.

However, given the length and depth of my study into African history, based on various analytical and scie tific investigations, there is no doubt in my mind that back in the ancient times, Yoruba travelled to KM.T from West Africa; are said to be amongst the earlier settlement in the Nile Valley region.

I don't intend to over stretch this issue with you but you actually got it wrong of yoruba migration because Yoruba went through west Africa to Kmt , instead from Middle East,which is where her language begun. And thus the language is found in both Arabic ~Hebrew ~Aramaic~Ugaric~etc

Olu317:

I don't intend to over stretch this issue with you but you actually got it wrong of yoruba migration because Yoruba went through west Africa to Kmt , instead from Middle East,which is where her language begun. And thus the language is found in both Arabic ~Hebrew ~Aramaic~Ugaric~etc

Yoruba originate from Africa. Any connection can only be seen in those terms.

All the evidence points to the fact that Yoruba language predates all Asian languages and the notion that has it originating in Asia is not plausible.

During the times when Yoruba are enjoying their civilization, there are no people living in Asia.

The kind of study into languages that you embark on is of high importance, yet, its imperative to have an accurate starting position.

Theres so much now known about African history than ever before, thanks to the enthusiasm of great African historians, scholars and academics.

We know the specific periods when every ethnic group moved out of Africa.

For instance, are able to determine when the current stock of Asians and Australasians left the continent and their state of mind at the time.

The evidence suggest that Yoruba and their neighbours have been living and existing in Africa hundred of thousands years before people began to occupy the Asian continent.

MorataFC:
Let it be known to you if you have not know before, all the religions on earth stole their story line from Bible, copied their belief from from the original HOLY book

ScotMisile:
The Bible does not ever mention Anything Islam or ifa, but these pipu keep involving our Bible.. .... because they know they are fake. . The truth is strong enough to stand on its own without referrals.

.

validstar1:
Most religions copy, edit and paste from the bible

The today's Bible is never an accurate book.
Over the millennia, several authors have edited, modified and altered the original Bible that was never even a complete or organised book.
THIS IS THE MAJOR REASON THERE'S NO UNITY IN CHRISTIANITY UNLIKE MANY OTHER RELIGIONS.
e.g, it will be a Taboo for a deeper lifer to go to cele or olumba etc
Yet, they all claimed to be Christians...
One of the popular author is king James.
Today, we have hundreds of Bibles. The very different Bible is even Ethiopia Bible etc .
And the Christian religion stole it's religious book (Bible) from Torah... That's why the Jews will never take you people seriously.

Dafemich:
The Bible cannot be in the same comparison with ifa or quran. I can never read a book that birthed through blood shed

This one is fooling himself...


And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence and the violent take it by force. For all the prophets a the law prophesied until John.

philkamby:


Please do not say what you dont know. The bible was completed in AD 90, while Mohammed(who started Islam) was born around AD 630.

So there is no comparism.

Then, the Bible is just a mere story book from different authors .
Just like a textbook with different editions...
If it was truly from God, it won't be written and compiled by different men as we have it.

QueenSekxy:
[s][/s]

You must be really pained. . The truth is bitter

QueenSekxy:

Shut up oga. I have those verses with me here. Just cos some of you moon worshippers and atheist have access to bible, you think you have the right to spew balderdash.
Your own contradiction of your koran by Sunnis, shites and many terrorist organisation ascribed to the moon god should be something you need to get worried about.

Oxford ko

Dear m0 run,
The Sunni and the Shi'a use the same quran unlike Christians...

Hum

BigBrother9ja:


.
The today's Bible is never an accurate book.
Over the millennia, several authors have edited, modified and altered the original Bible that was never even a complete or organised book.
THIS IS THE MAJOR REASON THERE'S NO UNITY IN CHRISTIANITY UNLIKE MANY OTHER RELIGIONS.
e.g, it will be a Taboo for a deeper lifer to go to cele or olumba etc
Yet, they all claimed to be Christians...
One of the popular author is king James.
Today, we have hundreds of Bibles. The very different Bible is even Ethiopia Bible etc .
And the Christian religion stole it's religious book (Bible) from Torah... That's why the Jews will never take you people seriously.

Plssss, stop embarrassing yourself on this forum... If you have questions ask.... And stop taking pride in ignorance

ScotMisile:


Plssss, stop embarrassing yourself on this forum... If you have questions ask.... And stop taking pride in ignorance

You're the one in delusion and stupídity.
You folks claimed that other religions copied your story book (Bible).
But common sense should tell you that even the Ifa they are talking about existed long before Christianity. It was the religion that was practised long before colonial masters brought Christianity.
So now, use your brain. Who copied who?

BigBrother9ja:

You're the one in delusion and stupídity.
You folks claimed that other religions copied your story book (Bible).
But common sense should tell you that even the Ifa they are talking about existed long before Christianity. It was the religion that was practised long before colonial masters brought Christianity.
So now, use your brain. Who copied who?

You type stuff and expect me to take it as truth.. ok ooo... .I lived before 1960.. hope you believe that too.. if you don't then you are ignorant

BigBrother9ja:
...
You folks claimed that other religions copied your story book (Bible).
But common sense should tell you that even the Ifa they are talking about existed long before Christianity. It was the religion that was practised long before colonial masters brought Christianity...

Totally agree with you here.

Furthermore, Africans have been in existence for millions of years, some migrated to Europe 100,000 to 200,000 years ago as the first people to inhabit those regions.

According to Europes own records, the current stock of Europeans appear in that region approximately 40,000 years ago.

The Christian Bible is a compilation of various religious text from all accross the globe, the contents of which have been copied, plagerized, sexed-up or outrightly fabricated.