Stats: 3,192,092 members, 7,946,699 topics. Date: Thursday, 12 September 2024 at 03:27 AM |
Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Who Created God? (27672 Views)
If Nothing Can Exist Without A Creator, So What Created God? / What created God ? A Response To Atheist Question / Who Created God? - An Invalid Question (2) (3) (4)
(1) (2) (3) ... (9) (10) (11) (12) (13) (14) (15) ... (19) (Reply) (Go Down)
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 11:20am On Oct 05, 2019 |
tintingz:We can certainly rule out the possibility of an infinite regression of cause an effect because of Entropy. Entropy will ALWAYS increase in the universe unless there is an external Energy/Force to constrain the system/universe. Projecting to the future, an infinite regress of cause and effect would terminate at maximum entropy where it is assumed that every energy/mass is distributed uniformly through out the universe. If infinite regress of cause and effect has a terminal date, surely it cannot at the same time accommodate the nature of an infinite regression. This surely means that there must have been an Uncaused First cause of everything. It's mind bugling but logic give us no alternative answer tintingz:Yes, logically nothing can cause itself to exist except if that "Thing" had always existed . We can attest to this because we and the Physical Universe we see are evidence of a "caused existence". For the only other logical position to take (without violating logic) is that "Nothing Exist" and that wouldn't be true. That "Thing" can then logicaly be the "Uncaused First Cause" without violating the logic. The second logical premise would be true only if and only if the First Cause isn't really a "THING" (energy occupying a space) but a "NOUN". By "noun", I mean "a non material description" or better still at a dimension of a higher order to the trio of Energy, Space and Time. tintingz:Your reference has described the nature of the gravitational singleton without bothering on whether it had always existed or it spontaneously formed itself. I think we have discussed both cases in my last post and the conclusion was that the gravitational singleton had to be externaly caused either way. If the gravitational singleton had always existed (with the quantum fluctuations) , then it must be very stable (constant) and it would require and external force to make it undergo the sudden expansion called the Big Bang. If the gravitational singleton was transient, it should require a large external force to form it into a gravitational singleton. Quantum fluctuations are called such because they are random states and as such theoretically (my take/understanding) should have maximum entropy within itself. The source/origin of the high temperature of the singleton is debatable and maybe theoretical physicists would be able to give a perfect answer the question. In summary, can we agree that: "It seems an Immaterial Force/Energy/Influence which could be called the "Uncaused First Cause" initiated the formation of the Universe." The perfect answer to comprehending such immaterial NOUN would thus be outside the capacity of SCIENCE! |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 11:36am On Oct 05, 2019 |
Ihedinobi3:I love this your post. Almost nothing else to add. Like Paul, we become Gentile to the Gentiles, Jew to the Jew and Roman to the Romans. Here, we become "Scientific" to the Atheists BUT In all, not trusting the Arm of Flesh and Intellect but depending upon Him knowing that we could have been worse than them (it's only by grace we have been saved through faith in His Atonement purchased by His blood). Finally, Paul Plants and Apollo waters but it is God who gives the increase Shalom |
Re: Who Created God? by Ihedinobi3: 11:58am On Oct 05, 2019 |
shadeyinka:Indeed. It is good to remember too that Paul insisted on knowing "nothing except Christ and Him crucified" among the Corinthians who had the same tendency like their fellow Greeks to seek after philosophy. We help everyone to learn the Truth if they want to learn. If not, we simply refuse to yield to their lies. Grace be with you, brother. |
Re: Who Created God? by tintingz(m): 12:46pm On Oct 05, 2019 |
shadeyinka:I disagree, it will violate the logic. Again, if there is an uncaused first cause then something can exist without a cause, you are just being partial and bias here. If something must have a cause to exist how then did you made up same argument there is an uncaused cause? Are you not contradicting? If something can't cause itself to exist but must require a cause then infinite regress is necessary! For what we also know, the universe can be infinite itself. The same argument that apply to an uncaused first cause also apply to the universe, this uncaused first cause is just an assumption to end the infinite regress thing. The second logical premise would be true only if and only if the First Cause isn't really a "THING" (energy occupying a space) but a "NOUN". What?! Even if we assume an uncaused first cause it must be natural since it properties are natural or can this first cause create from nothing? Enough of fantasies please. Your reference has described the nature of the gravitational singleton without bothering on whether it had always existed or it spontaneously formed itself. I think we have discussed both cases in my last post and the conclusion was that the gravitational singleton had to be externaly caused either way.That's because they are assumptions! For what the hypothesis said, the gravitational singularity is infinite, it has always existed, for the fact that energy cannot be created nor destroyed then It has always existed. If the gravitational singleton had always existed (with the quantum fluctuations) , then it must be very stable (constant) and it would require and external force to make it undergo the sudden expansion called the Big Bang.Why must there be an external force? What's this external force? Quantum fluctuations are called such because they are random states and as such theoretically (my take/understanding) should have maximum entropy within itself. The source/origin of the high temperature of the singleton is debatable and maybe theoretical physicists would be able to give a perfect answer the question. Can you define quantum fluctuations? In summary, can we agree that:Then you should agree something can exist without a cause, yes? The perfect answer to comprehending such immaterial NOUN would thus be outside the capacity of SCIENCE! How can an immaterial force have material properties? What's this immaterial thing and how did it came into existence? |
Re: Who Created God? by peggywebbs(f): 4:48pm On Oct 05, 2019 |
I can see you obviously love to hear yourself talk. This science you so claim to lay all your concerns on. Do you realize that the purpose of science is not to dispute the existence of the supernatural but to also find logic and reason to how some of these things exist. Science is just a set of theories which means that these theories are based on confirming things that already are. There is no superior intelligence outside responsible for creating man. The existence of the universe is not by some aliens � in space. Do you think man just appeared on earth or animals just started creeping about the earth. Where do you think the first seed of plant came from. It was definitely not a testube. How were the rocks and universe before your so called big bang theory. You can study science for all you can and all you will still be left with is questions. People who lived millions of years before our generation confirm the existence of God and you that were born in what century are claiming science. When was science invented? How can science dispute thousands of scrolls and scholarly manuscripts of ages...even when pen and paper had not been discovered. There are drawings on mountains of ancient cultures that speak of God and yet you are looking at science. Science can't even explain the reason for your existence. Or do you think it's aliens that help you get ejaculation or release sperm for reproduction. Why can't science invent all these things. Why is it that science can't trace the higher intelligence responsible for the earth or where you formed from a chemical big bang? You know deep down in your heart that God exists. Why do you fight it. You think those people of ancient times had no knowledge or that you are more intelligent than them? I hope you find out who created God eventually with your science. TheArranger: |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 9:19pm On Oct 05, 2019 |
tintingz:I think this thing is far much simpler than you are making it. 1. In this universe everything has a property of cause and effect. 2. An infinite regression of cause and effect violates the law of entropy 3. There must this be an Uncaused First Cause that initiated the formation of the universe. Which of this three do you really disagree with? tintingz:I think I've explained why the gravitational singleton couldn't have existed forever except you have a counter justification. If the gravitational singleton had always existed (with the quantum fluctuations) , then it must be very stable (constant) and it would require and external force to make it undergo the sudden expansion called the Big Bang. If the gravitational singleton was transient, it should require a large external force to form it into a gravitational singleton. Back to your views: The Uncaused First Cause cannot be natural (made of Energy, time and Space). If it is, then such is a "Thing" that is caused and must obey the laws of physics and chemistry. tintingz:For now, let's treat this external force as a "NOUN". This external force (to the gravitational singleton) is external to Energy, Time and Space. tintingz: A quantum fluctuation is the temporary change in the amount of energy in a point in space, tintingz: No! Matter has to exist through a cause. Energy change can occur through a cause. If it's a thing, it is matter. If it's an Uncaused First Cause, it cannot be matter without violating logic. tintingz:I did t say that the Immaterial Force have material properties. Such immaterial force must not be made of Energy, Space and Time. It is sufficient for now to say that the immaterial force OR the Uncaused First Cause is a NOUN! |
Re: Who Created God? by tintingz(m): 10:22pm On Oct 05, 2019 |
shadeyinka:You still don't see the paradox? You said there's cause and effect in the universe (which makes infinite regress necessary) then again you said it is not possible because of law of entropy so therefore there must be a cause that's not cause(not affected by cause and effect). In conclusion here to your paradoxical argument you committed: Something can't cause itself to exist then again there's something that exist without a cause. Instead of admitting we don't know, you keep fantasizing by saying there's an uncaused first cause, doesn't this uncaused first cause beg questions how it's uncaused and violated cause and effect and it logic? This is just a special pleading fallacy from you. Read premises again and see the paradox I've pointed out. I'm tired of this back and forth argument. I think I've explained why the gravitational singleton couldn't have existed forever except you have a counter justification. Gravitational singularity is not big bang, you're trying to mix them up. My goodness. It's an initial infinite state of the universe suggested to be before the big bang. Can you state again how gravitational singularity cannot be?, maybe I didn't see that part. Back to your views:Why so? This uncaused first cause does it consists of natural properties? If yes, is it natural? If no, how did natural properties like energy created out of this first cause? A quantum fluctuation is the temporary change in the amount of energy in a point in space,Is it caused or it's "nothing" and "random"? No! This uncaused first cause is not a thing? I did t say that the Immaterial Force have material properties. Such immaterial force must not be made of Energy, Space and Time. What do you by noun? Is it not part of existing THING? |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 6:36am On Oct 06, 2019 |
tintingz:I think it's you who suddenly shut down going through the logic maze and You suddenly pulled out of following the logic because of a simple paradox. Don't forget that paradoxes in logic either negate the initial set of premise OR modify the input variables. Again: 1. In this universe everything has a property of cause and effect. 2. An infinite regression of cause and effect violates the law of entropy 3. There must this be an Uncaused First Cause that initiated the formation of the universe. I asked the question that: Which one of these three do you disagree with? Why? A wrong logic premise will lead to a wrong conclusion. If nothing is wrong with the premise, a set of conclusions would be obtained i. The universe doesn't exist OR ii. The Uncaused First Cause is not a THING! Note But: 1. Things in the universe obviously exist 2. The universe hadn't always been existing 3. The universe was caused This leaves no other choice than to accept that there must have been an "Uncaused First Cause" which isn't a THING! The nature of the Uncaused First Cause could be debated but that's where the Rabbit hole leads. We don't know as an answer is an escapist way: don't forget that we are leaning more towards LOGIC than SCIENCE. The answer for both will be different. Science may conclude "we don't know yet!" But it is NOT a permitted outcome from Logical deductions! tintingz:I've never insinuated that the gravitational singleton is Big Bang. Big bang is a theory to explain the formation of the universe by the sudden expansion of the pin point hot dense gravitational singleton. The bold in your quote is actually what needs explanation for the singleton is virtually a pin point hot dense description and NOT "infinite state of the universe" tintingz:Can't be what? tintingz:This uncaused first cause does it consists of natural properties? The Uncaused First Cause could not have natural properties of Energy, Time and Space! If yes, is it natural? The Uncaused First Cause is Unnatural! How can the natural properties proceed from an unnatural entity? No one can logicaly or Scientifically know: for the nature "self existence" is a paradox by itself. Is it caused or it's "nothing" and "random"? 1. If the Uncaused First Cause is caused, it leads to the impossibility of an infinite regression. No, it's not caused! 2. If the Uncaused First Cause is Nothing, it violates the rule that something cannot come out of nothing 3. If the Uncaused First Cause is Random, maximum entropy is attained and energy/force from somewhere else has to cause changes in states. Again, the Uncaused First Cause cannot logically be a THING! tintingz:A Noun by definition is "an IDENTITY!" Or a Name (conventionally of a person, animal, place or thing) |
Re: Who Created God? by tintingz(m): 11:12am On Oct 06, 2019 |
shadeyinka: All what you post here are irrelevant and special pleading fallacy if you can't explain what this uncaused first cause is, why is it uncaused?. If the premise begin with everything that exist must have a cause, why is an uncaused first cause excluded from everything? Again and again the universe can be infinite and always exist. I've never insinuated that the gravitational singleton is Big Bang.Gravitational singularity is another state itself and it's infinite, why it can't be infinite you haven't given any reason. You're mixing it up with change of state that brought out the expansion. The bold in your quote is actually what needs explanation for the singleton is virtually a pin point hot dense description and NOT "infinite state of the universe"It seems you don't even understand these things. Here, The initial singularity was a gravitational singularity of seemingly infinite density thought to have contained all the mass and space-time of the Universe before quantum fluctuations caused it to rapidly expand in the Big Bang and subsequent inflation, creating the present-day Universe. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Initial_singularity If you think the gravitational singularity has always been in a hot dense state, you have been missing the point. Can't be what? Explain why gravitational singularity can't be infinite? This uncaused first cause does it consists of natural properties?Lol, How did it cause them to exist? Magic? If yes, is it natural?The uncaused first cause is unnatural and it beget natural. Wow. How can the natural properties proceed from an unnatural entity?Is this your fantasy and contradictory? You started your argument with scientific and logical argument then suddenly logic and science cannot apply again. You came up that there is an uncaused first cause and this entity is unnatural that we can't possibly know scientifically and logically, so how come you conclude there is something unnatural or that the uncaused first cause must be unnatural? At this stage if you can't see your fallacies, I'm sorry I can't help. Is it caused or it's "nothing" and "random"?Oga, I'm talking about quantum fluctuation, is it caused or nothing/random? Again, the Uncaused First Cause cannot logically be a THING!Ooh so logic doesn't apply here anymore. ![]() Can you tell us how it's "illogically a thing"? A Noun by definition is "an IDENTITY!" Or a Name (conventionally of a person, animal, place or thing)Are these not properties of a thing or physical things? Mention a NOUN property or identity that's not a thing? 1 Like |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 5:37pm On Oct 06, 2019 |
tintingz:You amaze me! Why are you afraid of the truth? Go down the rabbit hole of logic. Let me simplify it for you: Paradoxes in logic either negate the initial set of premise OR modify the input variables. 1. In this universe everything has a property of cause and effect. 2. An infinite regression of cause and effect violates the law of entropy These individually are truths but together, leads to a paradox. The paradox can be solved iff 3. There is an Uncaused First Cause that initiated the formation of the universe. Do you disagree with 1, 2 or 3 and why? We'll take the other issues after 1 Like |
Re: Who Created God? by tintingz(m): 8:36pm On Oct 06, 2019 |
shadeyinka: So to end the paradox in the premise you had to propose an uncaused first cause not knowing the uncaused first cause is also paradoxical. Again and I will say it an infinite universe is also as valid as any infinite entity. You brought another posit that the uncaused first cause is not logical, not scientific and not a thing just to escape. The is a special pleading fallacy! I've asked you to tell us why the uncaused first cause cannot be caused, what's this uncaused first cause, you keep on giving ridiculous fallacies. If you can't argue logically please don't start with a logical argument and end up illogical. |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 9:03pm On Oct 06, 2019 |
tintingz:You see that you can't deny proposition 1 and 2. Yo can't also deny that they lead to a paradox. i. So, what's your own Proposition 3 to resolve the paradox? ii. Can you logicaly show that the universe has always existed? |
Re: Who Created God? by tintingz(m): 10:03pm On Oct 06, 2019 |
shadeyinka:Lol, who denied the universe having cause and effect? And again if there is cause and effect then infinite regress is necessary. Then in logic as you posit nothing can cause itself, again Infinite regress is necessary. Is Infinite regress possible or not, I don't know, we haven't fully understood the universe. Now for you to end the infinite regress, you brought up a cause that's not caused(uncaused first cause) from nowhere, now if we agree to an uncaused first cause, we will still go back to the logical question, why is it uncaused, where did it come from, what's the nature of this uncaused first cause? At the end of the argument we're left with gaps and fallacies. Now, the logical posit that the universe as always exist is base on something cannot come out of nothing, if we assume there's an higher entity that create, it must create the universe from a pre-existing-material not from nothing! |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 10:49pm On Oct 06, 2019 |
tintingz:So, your problem is that you believe that infinite regress of cause and effect is possible! 1. If that's the case why is the entropy of the universe increasing and never decreasing? 2. Would you agree that at maximum entropy of the universe, no further cause and effect is possible? 3. If cause and effect will terminate in some future time, does it not imply that infinite regress is impossible? |
Re: Who Created God? by budaatum: 10:58pm On Oct 06, 2019 |
shadeyinka:I don't agree. I'm not arguing God here, but why is an "infinite regression of cause and effect impossible? |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 11:41pm On Oct 06, 2019 |
budaatum:Increasing entropy. At maximum entropy, energy and matter is evenly distributed throughout the universe. Therefore, energy interchange which should either lead to a cause or an effect is impossible as there isn't energy difference everywhere in the universe. If max entropy of the universe is predicted, there is a termination of cause and effect in the universe and thus infinite regress is impossible |
Re: Who Created God? by budaatum: 11:54pm On Oct 06, 2019 |
shadeyinka:You are making an unfound proposal of the universe being a system, which I assume you think is closed. Does your knowledge reach so far that it knows the limits of God? |
Re: Who Created God? by TheArranger(m): 12:00am On Oct 07, 2019 |
peggywebbs:Biitch stop ranting, sit your ass down and let me educate you. Science cannot provide complete answers to all questions. There are many matters that cannot usefully be examined in a scientific way. For instance, there are beliefs that by their very nature cannot be proven or disproven. They are unfalsifiable. Examples are your god as well as other supernatural deities. The god hypothesis is an unfalsifiable hypothesis. It is an assertion, not a fact. The only way it can become a fact is if it can be observed and tested empirically under a controlled setting using the scientific method. Also, while it may not be a fact, we also cannot yet disprove it because of our (possibly) limited senses. Admitting ignorance, thus, is the only answer. So here's a challenge for you, miss peggy, why don't you demonstrate with empirical and objective proof, the existence of Yahweh? Keep in mind that deities are supposed to be immaterial. |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 12:28am On Oct 07, 2019 |
budaatum:Scientifically, as far as we know, the boundaries of the universe is infinity. An "open universe" can be either a closed or open manifold. For example, in the Friedmann–Lemaître–Robertson–Walker (FLRW) model the universe is considered to be without boundaries, in which case "compact universe" could describe a universe that is a closed manifold. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shape_of_the_universe It actually doesn't matter if the universe is opened or closed as long as 1. There is no observable boundaries of the universe 2. Within what can be observed, entropy is increasing and not decreasing 3. There seem not to be an increase of the total energy of the observed universe. Let's not violate the principle of Science by assuming something not yet seen/observed is out there (is that not the same rule Atheists use to rule out God?) Within the observable universe, entropy increases showing that infinite regression is impossible (until we can actually show the boundary of our universe) |
Re: Who Created God? by budaatum: 12:50am On Oct 07, 2019 |
shadeyinka:So why assume it isn't? Is there evidence anywhere that suggests the boundaries of the universe is limited? 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Who Created God? by tintingz(m): 12:50am On Oct 07, 2019 |
shadeyinka:Again, As long as the assertion of cause and effect comes in Infinite regress is necessary and possible. 1. If that's the case why is the entropy of the universe increasing and never decreasing? These are assumptions and no sort of evidence to prove this claim. We haven't fully understand the universe. As far as there is cause and effect, infinite regress is necessary and possible, whether there is entropy or not it doesn't negate possiblity of infinite regress. The question you're yet to answer is, why is the uncaused first cause not caused, why is it exempted from the logical premise of causations, what is this uncaused first cause? I'm tired of back and forth argument. 1 Like |
Re: Who Created God? by budaatum: 1:46am On Oct 07, 2019 |
shadeyinka:Yes, let's not. And well done for seeing the trap you set for yourself and almost fell in to. We have not seen/observed some of the things we assert and are asking the atheist to take our word for it. Why should they? Are we so authoritative and trustful individuals ourselves that they must trust us or do we have some ulterior motive we perhaps ought to consider especially if our argument is based on inflating how little we know. Here's a link to my position on the subject from when I was an atheist. It was not evidence or proof for no gods then and is neither for God now, as it is simply a replacement for God by the assumed knowledge in the mind of its user who denys the existence of the observable for the belief in that which they themself assume. Infinite regressions are mathematically possible, though not many see Mathematics as the Word of God, there at the beginning and through which all was created, though not exclusively even though it is all the way through and in creation. They should exist logically too, except it seems most would not push logic so far and stop where their mind does. And they do exist in Scripture, or at least a time we know not much of does. Or did God just awaken one day and say, "Let us work for six days", with no time before then? Why argue there can not then have been a time before "God said", or times before that of which nothing is known of? To wit I say, one needs Christ in one's life. |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 6:10am On Oct 07, 2019 |
budaatum:1. For now, it is the best Scientific assumption. 2. There is actually no evidence yet that the universe is bounded in any way. 3. The Friedmann–Lemaître–Robertson–Walker (FLRW) model (one of the most recent model of the universe) assume that the universe is unbounded. So, why should I take otherwise in me trying to prove that there must exist an "Uncaused First Cause?". That would be like negating a known to satisfy an unknown |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 6:56am On Oct 07, 2019 |
tintingz:You have not shown how an infinite regression of cause and effect is possible. This your NEW theory violates many known laws of nature. 1. Infinite regress of cause an effect assumes the possibility of perpetual machines existing. Take the universe as a Thermodynamic system it's obvious to see the violation Note: Q=U+W Can you show that the universe as a Thermodynamic system exceed the Carnot Efficiency? 2. Infinite regress actually still prove unequivocally that the universe is bounded on all sides by "an unknown kind of constraining Force " which in turn is surrounded by another constraining force which in turn is surrounded by another constraining force.... Do you know the number of assumptions you have inserted? Would you agree that the fewer the number of assumptions to a theory, the more plausible that theory? 3. There is supposed to be an equivalence of matter and energy. E=mc^2 How come we can "break" mass into energy but can Energy be converted to mass? And you still feel that an infinite regression of cause and effect is possible? In respect of this, what happens at the Heat Death of the universe, how do you propose that mass can be regenerated from Energy? Rather than just asserting a repetition of "infinite regression of cause and effect" is possible, negate the three points above and show the contrary. tintingz:I don't know how you feel this your question make any sense. 1. I am a product of cause and effect! 2. Every knowledge of Science is about cause and effect! And you want me to explain how/why i. The Uncaused First Cause was not caused ii. Why it is exempted from the logical premise of cause and effect With what Scientific tool? iii. Your third question of what is this first cause had been answered....it's a NOUN! (A Name!, An Identity, A description) To help you out: A shadow isn't a person, nor an animal, nor a thing , nor place but yet is a noun. |
Re: Who Created God? by TheArranger(m): 7:08am On Oct 07, 2019 |
SHADEYINKA TINTINGZ BUDAATUM LORDREED XXSABRINAXX Check this out and let me hear your thoughts https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2dYW1pSQy8 3 Likes 2 Shares |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 9:24am On Oct 07, 2019 |
budaatum:It must be cleared that it is impossible to prove God using any known means. Scientists are allowed to make assumptions when propounding a theory. One of the assumptions of creation is that the universe emanated from an infinitely dense small gravitational singleton. This gravitational singleton has never been demonstrated or seen but accepted based on the logical premise of "the universe is expanding and cooling in the process". This is allowed! Unfortunately, when assumptions become too many, it makes a caricature of whatever theory obtained from such. In my case, only one assumption (there is an Uncaused First Cause). But an infinite regress of cause and effect actually really consists of infinite number of assumptions of one system layered on another which is in turn layered on another and so on. Check my argument for the impossibility of an infinite regression here. Here's a link to my position on the subject Now, Let's even assume the Universe was caused by something/some force outside this universe. It doesn't change anything because such a Force is Unknown for now AND outside our time and probably operates with a law different from the normal laws of physics and chemistry. This can easily be proved: Mass can be converted to energy but whatever the last cause that initiated the Universe has the capacity to create atoms from energy. My take is not to prove God as that is impossible. My aim is to show that their is "something" massive beyond the rules of physics and chemistry that intiated the formation of our universe. If the rules of physics and chemistry are broken, why should it then look amazing that an Uncaused First Cause can exist. Infinite regression is only possible in mathematics and computer. In real life, an infinite regress of cause and effect has not been shown or demonstrable |
Re: Who Created God? by shadeyinka(m): 9:36am On Oct 07, 2019 |
TheArranger:The first proponents of Argument from ignorance are the Atheists. Because we have not been able to see nor demonstrate the spiritual realm/God, therefore, they do not exist. |
Re: Who Created God? by tintingz(m): 9:55am On Oct 07, 2019 |
shadeyinka: Oga, have you been to the beginning of the universe to conclude infinite regress is impossible? Is the universe a close or open or isolated system? As long as there's a deterministic of causations, Logically infinite regress is possible. Cosmologically infinite regress is possible. Even when you insert an imaginary first cause, infinite regress is still possible and necessary. What do you say about the cyclic universe model? I don't know how you feel this your question make any sense.Lmao!!! A shadow is NOTHING then. ![]() Mister man, a shadow is a reflection of a thing, it's a THING! Please, how did you know there is an uncaused first cause, why is it not caused, if it can't be scientifically and logically explain, can you tell us the other way it can be explain? 1 Like |
Re: Who Created God? by LordReed(m): 9:59am On Oct 07, 2019 |
. |
Re: Who Created God? by tintingz(m): 10:04am On Oct 07, 2019 |
TheArranger: Lol, typical of Shadeyinka argument and other theists argument. They don't know when to stop their fallacies. Like his unscientific and illogical imaginary uncaused first cause. ![]() What are your nipples for? I don't know. = It must be caused by an uncaused first cause. ![]() 3 Likes |
Re: Who Created God? by LordReed(m): 10:31am On Oct 07, 2019 |
tintingz: Magically, you need your magic eyes to be opened. 1 Like |
(1) (2) (3) ... (9) (10) (11) (12) (13) (14) (15) ... (19) (Reply)
How Nigerian Prophets Gave 15 Fake Prophecies – Report / Reason Why Our Prayer Is Not Being Answer And The Solution!!! Pleased Read / Download Tope Alabi's Songs Here For Free
(Go Up)
Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 211 |